Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Butcher on August 21, 2013, 11:29:00 AM
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I've been out of aces high for a while now, I just now got to sit back down and recreate my account. I read before about the new tanks, which is nice and the Yak. I am glad the Yak got an update, hopefully this interests HTC to add more soviet planes in the future.
I wanted to take a look at war thunder to get an idea of what competition Aces has. I just started playing it for two days, and my opinion is nothing more then an opinion. I unlocked the ability to fly Hurricanes (Level two or so for the british?) The gameplay is pretty simple - you have so many targets to destroy in arcade mode before time runs out and your score is added up for points. This is nothing more then what we have in the Main arena. The biggest difference is we can fly all planes except for perked without the need to unlock them. I did jump into a BoB Mission (Historical event) and it was disappointing. The gameplay is extremely arcade like which I can see would appeal to arcade gamers who can fly with a mouse and do just fine. A little symbol that shows you where to lead your bullets to score hits every time. In fact my first sortie with a Hurricane I managed to shoot down 7. Using Third Party view, the game was far to easy.
The graphics are stellar, however when I compare them to Aces High - I realized something, I focused less on the Graphics themselves then the gameplay. I never really seen Aces high at max graphics until last year, it blew me away when I could go from 15 fps to 50 and have max graphics.
The graphics really just didn't appeal to me in war thunder, although they are quite nice - it doesn't make up for the game play difference. FSO's, Scenarios, Dueling Arena and Main Arena is where I find home. If I am lucky, someone puts up a bombing mission in the Main arena and I have Scenarios more then once a week.
I am not bashing War Thunder, I think it appeals to players who don't want the learning curve, Aces does require a serious learning curve vs a game thats based on arcade. Its been fun tinkering with it, but I honestly doubt I will open war thunder again.
Anyhow, I hope to be flying soon again - a few months ago I boxed up my thrustmaster and haven't even touched it since, not that I didn't want too - I just lost all hope and heart. Things are better now, hopefully I can push myself a little and get my butt back in the Main arena.
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Secretly you just missed the tanks
:banana:
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I'm glad you will be returning Butcher, I missed you. Thank you very much for the write-up on the competition, I've always found you to be a fair and intelligent guy and appreciate your opinion on this. AH really has everything I want, but you know how it is, ya just never know what else is out there untill you try it. You have saved me the time and trouble to go check it out myself.
Butcher is my friend :)
BTW after 20 years, through AW, WB, and now AH I have changed my name. You will now find me flying as Hartmann with JG11 buddy.
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The game mechanics of Aces High are very good. At least for what I expect in a flight game.
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Tried all the others. Aces high truly rocks. Long live aces high !
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Aces High is my favorite ww2 sim of all time.
the only thing War thunder has that is decent is their full realism mode which has only a handful of people and is an orphan that is basically unsupported by the developers. hell it was added by player request only lol.
full realism mode has everything I want in the way its setup... historic matchups, rapid action, no icons, great graphics that make no icons realistic and close to real world aircraft spotting, smooth fluid head tracking, decent flight model (its early Il2 FM quirky not so great at below stall speed modelling but close enough to be called usable). clouds, love them just wish long range dots were not visible through clouds though. (why am I the only plane thats VFR on top through a thick overcast layer? lol IFR currency is another big advantage when having to use these partial panel ww2 planes in thick clouds with no autopilot :) )
in such a scenario the more realism you add in the more you exclude regular players who havent had years of real world flight experience (or lots of flight sim experience is just as good perhaps but lots of experience using real world spotting techniques in the real world REALLY DO MAKE full realism spotting easy) to the point that they are just cannon fodder for players like me and they find it too difficult to learn or bother with and go back to Arcade or historical arcade modes and let the ai fly the plane for them while they point it at the nearest big neon billboard they want to shoot at.
when you think about leveling up mechanics in War Thunder and grinding and putting in the time in the game the irony that the more realism added to a game with a good setup could keep people hooked for a decade the way Aces High has because its so difficult may be lost on the masses and Gaijin War Thunders developers too. not just grinding stats to give yourself an advantage but getting better at flying and air combat maneuvers and spotting enemy aircraft and developing those skills through actual practice takes a long time for some. many are naturals, some will never get it. thats what has made Aces High continue for over a decade. it has become a form of golf with all the addictions and frustrations that that entails.
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Welcome back Butcher, just in time for a Real BoB scenario! :)
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<snip>
Sometimes it's best to take a break or to make a radical shift in your play style (compfort zone). IE: Last night I upped a KI84 for the first time in I'm guessing 2+ years..... :joystick: :airplane: :neener: :x :devil :banana: :ahand :rock be afraid, be very afraid.
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Sometimes it's best to take a break or to make a radical shift in your play style (compfort zone). IE: Last night I upped a KI84 for the first time in I'm guessing 2+ years..... :joystick: :airplane: :neener: :x :devil :banana: :ahand :rock be afraid, be very afraid.
:rofl
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Sometimes it's best to take a break or to make a radical shift in your play style (compfort zone). IE: Last night I upped a KI84 for the first time in I'm guessing 2+ years..... :joystick: :airplane: :neener: :x :devil :banana: :ahand :rock be afraid, be very afraid.
Ki84's are awesome! remember what happened to your 190D? :D
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Oh noooo Butchers coming back?....well there goes the neighborhood. :bolt:
Welcome back Butchtard!!!!...btw we switched to Rooks bout a month ago...stop by and
fly one or two with ur old squad mates!!
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Ouch before I posted I didn't realize there was a post in the officers club about War thunder, sorry Skuzzy.
Oh noooo Butchers coming back?....well there goes the neighborhood. :bolt:
Welcome back Butchtard!!!!...btw we switched to Rooks bout a month ago...stop by and
fly one or two with ur old squad mates!!
You know I miss you and that guy who I randomly call drunk at 2 in the morning..hmm whats his name... DH367th yeah that guy.... Was trying to call a buddy of mine so I can hail a taxi in st. paul, I end up calling DH wondering if the "cab company" can send me a damn cab.
DH on the other end like WTF?? butcher
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Warthunder sux. I don't know what full realism battles are like because after waiting 6 minutes for a "session" to start I gave up.
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Wait until I drag ya to CrabbyLand :cheers: :devil :cheers:
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Thanks for the write up Butcher, Its nice to break now and then but home is home welcome back :salute
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Ki84's are awesome! remember what happened to your 190D? :D
How long did you survive Dora vs Dora the other night Zach? I should of gone for the HO and saved myself one merge. :ahand
I'm still flying it, and the Dora is very capable of beating KI84s if you're careful.
What I'm actually having trouble with is my stick lately imho, I think it's getting too old and very bouncy with the inputs (and I'm toying with scaleing trying my best to get it worked out but to no avail the last couple weeks).
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How long did you survive Dora vs Dora the other night Zach? I should of gone for the HO and saved myself one merge. :asshand:
I'm still flying it, and the Dora is very capable of beating KI84s if you're careful.
What I'm actually having trouble with is my stick lately imho, I think it's getting too old and very bouncy with the inputs (and I'm toying with scaleing trying my best to get it worked out but to no avail the last couple weeks).
care to put that to the test?
equal E,...... Equal pilots......the dora, if he fights...will lose every time....if the Ki stick is a fighter with lots of experience the Dora will die very quickly.
of course thats my opinion, I am very willing to put it to the test........
oh wait......... I have, many times over....
we can test it if ya like?
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care to put that to the test?
equal E,...... Equal pilots......the dora, if he fights...will lose every time....if the Ki stick is a fighter with lots of experience the Dora will die very quickly.
of course thats my opinion, I am very willing to put it to the test........
oh wait......... I have, many times over....
we can test it if ya like?
"if he fights the way I want him to fight me" you mean. :rofl The Dora can handle dives and extreme speeds better, and also has better top speed once ya get there, but if you try turning with a plane that can out-turn you and then also out-accelerate you, you're doing it wrong. The KI is also one of the few planes in this game that has a superior WEP to the Dora, so that's another ace for the KI.
What I'm trying to figure out is how you guys get those lazer-beam shots beyond 500 that rip chunks off your enemie's ac like they do to mine.
But yes, a Dora is quite capable of BnZing an 84 to death, I have, many times over. Since the only thing the Dora does worse than sustaining a turn is bleeding off the E/speed when you force it to, the BnZ is kinda it's SOP against most aircraft.
The KI-84 is fun and can beat most planes in a knife fight or if they try to run away useing pure acceleration. I'm also use to receiving plenty from enemies BnZing me while in a Dora, so it's nothing new to me in the KI to keep an eye open and just sit around and wait for them to come down and make a mistake.... only difference is when they do it and I'm in a KI84, it gets over with a lot quicker since very quickly I can outmaneuver them and then if they try to run I can also usually overtake them.
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"if he fights the way I want him to fight me" you mean. :rofl The Dora can handle dives and extreme speeds better, and also has better top speed once ya get there, but if you try turning with a plane that can out-turn you and then also out-accelerate you, you're doing it wrong. The KI is also one of the few planes in this game that has a superior WEP to the Dora, so that's another ace for the KI.
What I'm trying to figure out is how you guys get those lazer-beam shots beyond 500 that rip chunks off your enemie's ac like they do to mine.
But yes, a Dora is quite capable of BnZing an 84 to death, I have, many times over. Since the only thing the Dora does worse than sustaining a turn is bleeding off the E/speed when you force it to, the BnZ is kinda it's SOP against most aircraft.
The KI-84 is fun and can beat most planes in a knife fight or if they try to run away useing pure acceleration. I'm also use to receiving plenty from enemies BnZing me while in a Dora, so it's nothing new to me in the KI to keep an eye open and just sit around and wait for them to come down and make a mistake.... only difference is when they do it and I'm in a KI84, it gets over with a lot quicker since very quickly I can outmaneuver them and then if they try to run I can also usually overtake them.
Listen you forget one major thing...I am not talking about the MA....I am talking about an even E even ALT fight...you summing up something that can be done in the MA is pointless and meaningless to the actual topic....you will never get a chance to "BnZ" a competent Ki in a even fight.....
like I said....wanna test it out?
I don't want to read anther wall of text.....just yes or no....wanna test it out?
DA is that way-------------------->
give me a couple hrs or say when you can be sure there...and we will put your theory to the test.
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And you're not listening either. Yes but why? I come and fight you in the DA on your terms in a Dora... What purpose? You need practice? More flouting? I need to learn something I know already?
We start even and the second you force my Dora to turn and commit to the knife-fight (not argueing against DA style combat, but it kicks the Dora in the nutz before the fight begins) you bleed away speed hideously quicker than a KI (or most ac) hamming on the elevator. I will then never regain that speed or E quicker than the KI who will now not only retain its advantage, but increase it the further the Dora is forced to give it up in turns and the turn fight. Very quickly the KI should saddle the Dora and then it's die or dive. Maybe I'll get lucky and we can have a few fun verticle fighting maneuvers and stalls before your KI gains and climbs into the Dora's cockpit with me.
I have fought this same (repetitive) fight hundreds of times.
At work now, plan is to tinker in the TA with stick scaleing for half an hour again before playing tonight like I've been regularly needing to lately. I'm game for a couple goes in the DA, but when it's just winning or looseing the same fight it gets too repetitive quickly in there for me.
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And you're not listening either. Yes but why? I come and fight you in the DA on your terms in a Dora... What purpose? You need practice? More flouting? I need to learn something I know already?
We start even and the second you force my Dora to turn and commit to the knife-fight (not argueing against DA style combat, but it kicks the Dora in the nutz before the fight begins) you bleed away speed hideously quicker than a KI (or most ac) hamming on the elevator. I will then never regain that speed or E quicker than the KI who will now not only retain its advantage, but increase it the further the Dora is forced to give it up in turns and the turn fight. Very quickly the KI should saddle the Dora and then it's die or dive. Maybe I'll get lucky and we can have a few fun verticle fighting maneuvers and stalls before your KI gains and climbs into the Dora's cockpit with me.
I have fought this same (repetitive) fight hundreds of times.
At work now, plan is to tinker in the TA with stick scaleing for half an hour again before playing tonight like I've been regularly needing to lately. I'm game for a couple goes in the DA, but when it's just winning or looseing the same fight it gets too repetitive quickly in there for me.
"flouting"......
pfft
an equal E and ALT fight is "my way".......... :headscratch:
hahahahaha you are to funny....
so I take the excuses you already came up with for losing as a sign of your true thoughts that you know you stand NO chance against a KI in a even fight.
and obviously you have no clue how to fight if you think every fight is the same.
that is the exact opposite of the truth......truth is NO 2 fights are the same, as a matter of fact no fight is the same...thats why dog fighting so awesome...
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Butcher coming back to GV ? Dayum and I was just working at getting my M4 K/D up too.
(hurry back Butcher, always a good tank battle with you in there)
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Butcher coming back to GV ? Dayum and I was just working at getting my M4 K/D up too.
(hurry back Butcher, always a good tank battle with you in there)
Nah man, I never was tanker, I only did it because Hooter in 367th taught me to tank, in 10 years I maybe touched vehicles 15 times total? After one or two roudns with LTAR I stuck to fighters.
I doubt I will ever get my tanking back, ill stick to what I know I can't forget - how to fly. Unfortunately tanking I can't simply dial in someone at 2k and hit them on the move anymore, I doubt I will ever get myself back up there either.
Its more fun to "point and click" but it will take me to long to get there again.
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"flouting"......
pfft
an equal E and ALT fight is "my way".......... :headscratch:
hahahahaha you are to funny....
so I take the excuses you already came up with for losing as a sign of your true thoughts that you know you stand NO chance against a KI in a even fight.
and obviously you have no clue how to fight if you think every fight is the same.
that is the exact opposite of the truth......truth is NO 2 fights are the same, as a matter of fact no fight is the same...thats why dog fighting so awesome...
Pffft
now where did I put my Lala?
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Pffft
now where did I put my Lala?
:D
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The ki84 is a definite top tier and qualifies as 'easy mode' to me, just as the spit16.
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KI is great, my favorite plane. But, for all its ability, something seems to keep it from being used as often as I would expect it to be.
Dive?
Top speed?
I use to think it was because we grow up knowing about Mustangs, Spitfires, Zeros, etc but I'm guessing many had never heard of the KI84 'til playing this game. Same goes for the LA but it gets used a ton which sorta blows that theory.
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Hey you ki84 dweebins stop hijacking the thread
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Hey you ki84 dweebins stop hijacking the thread
Because of Inks skin I elarned to fly a Ki84 :)
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If Butcher comes back i will leave :old:
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The ki84 is a definite top tier and qualifies as 'easy mode' to me, just as the spit16.
You aren't serious?
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"flouting"......
pfft
an equal E and ALT fight is "my way".......... :headscratch:
hahahahaha you are to funny....
so I take the excuses you already came up with for losing as a sign of your true thoughts that you know you stand NO chance against a KI in a even fight.
and obviously you have no clue how to fight if you think every fight is the same.
that is the exact opposite of the truth......truth is NO 2 fights are the same, as a matter of fact no fight is the same...thats why dog fighting so awesome...
Im sure I would learn something (you tend to learn more when ya loose than win imho :D ) but it would be boreing as hell to me. There's only so many ways in a little amount of time to dodge a KI84's bullets while in a Dora. And if I fight to the Dora's strengths I abuse your time, running and extending are fair game in the MA but not what the DA is about.
Now, if we instead both dueled in KIs then we're talkign a different ball game, and indeed it get a lot less boreing and more entertaining as I can be agressive and CC (without bleedign away speed or giving you a greater advantage everytime I kiss the elevators a little, like with the Dora vs your KI in a knife fight).
I had time last night to adjust my stick scaleing (best one I've come up with all week too) and then do a couple afk bomber sorties while getting laundry done, I'm heading outa town tonight and tomorrow (also found out wend I'll most likely be in Reno next month and Texas in October). Look for me late tomorrow night or Sunday and we can pick this up.
The ki84 is a definite top tier and qualifies as 'easy mode' to me, just as the spit16.
The KI is a strong fighter, it's only glaring weakness is it can't take a beating as well as it can give it (absorb damage). It's not easy-mode though to fight and kill in, although it is definetley not hard to fly. It stiffens up pretty good at high speeds. It is not as well balanced as other jap fighters and can "stick" in stalls for a bit. A god pilot in one is a very scary thing, but it is not immune to pilot error (or clumbsyness) in combat.
PS - epic thread hijack
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Im sure I would learn something (you tend to learn more when ya loose than win imho :D ) but it would be boreing as hell to me. There's only so many ways in a little amount of time to dodge a KI84's bullets while in a Dora. And if I fight to the Dora's strengths I abuse your time, running and extending are fair game in the MA but not what the DA is about.
Now, if we instead both dueled in KIs then we're talkign a different ball game, and indeed it get a lot less boreing and more entertaining as I can be agressive and CC (without bleedign away speed or giving you a greater advantage everytime I kiss the elevators a little, like with the Dora vs your KI in a knife fight).
I had time last night to adjust my stick scaleing (best one I've come up with all week too) and then do a couple afk bomber sorties while getting laundry done, I'm heading outa town tonight and tomorrow (also found out wend I'll most likely be in Reno next month and Texas in October). Look for me late tomorrow night or Sunday and we can pick this up.
IMO Ki vs Ki you would be fighting Ink's fight. A lot of people fly them, but aren't a lot who fly them really well. Several of the CH guys fly them well, especially LoedeCH. Never dueled him, but have had a ton of good MA fights with him. Ink and Slash I have dueled a lot in their Ki's. Anyway those are my top 3 Ki84 pilots.
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The ki84 is a definite top tier and qualifies as 'easy mode' to me, just as the spit16.
the Ki84 is the TOP tier plane :D just not as easy mode as the spits....I would fly the spits more if they could take more punishment, but they are very fragile compared to the KI.
only the spits and LA7 give it a good fight....I would include the K4 but it takes an exceptional K4 stick whereas the spits and LA a mediocre stick can give it a fight....well The LA needs a better stick also...but very few fly the LA the way it should be flown...Dedalos comes to mind....he knows that LA and he understands E and angles....he is a hard fight in the LA.
Im sure I would learn something (you tend to learn more when ya loose than win imho :D ) but it would be boreing as hell to me. There's only so many ways in a little amount of time to dodge a KI84's bullets while in a Dora. And if I fight to the Dora's strengths I abuse your time, running and extending are fair game in the MA but not what the DA is about.
Now, if we instead both dueled in KIs then we're talkign a different ball game, and indeed it get a lot less boreing and more entertaining as I can be agressive and CC (without bleedign away speed or giving you a greater advantage everytime I kiss the elevators a little, like with the Dora vs your KI in a knife fight).
I had time last night to adjust my stick scaleing (best one I've come up with all week too) and then do a couple afk bomber sorties while getting laundry done, I'm heading outa town tonight and tomorrow (also found out wend I'll most likely be in Reno next month and Texas in October). Look for me late tomorrow night or Sunday and we can pick this up.
The KI is a strong fighter, it's only glaring weakness is it can't take a beating as well as it can give it (absorb damage). It's not easy-mode though to fight and kill in, although it is definetley not hard to fly. It stiffens up pretty good at high speeds. It is not as well balanced as other jap fighters and can "stick" in stalls for a bit. A god pilot in one is a very scary thing, but it is not immune to pilot error (or clumbsyness) in combat.
PS - epic thread hijack
this tells me you have very little time in the Ki.....
it is one of the toughest fighters ingame...I am talking in the ability to absorb damage.....it is second only to the 47's and maybe the hellcats....but I think it can take more then a hell cat....and sometimes I think it can take more then the 47's.