Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: tom666 on January 27, 2001, 05:40:00 AM
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Well I can`t help it but I have to drag it on.
I was a committed Fighter Ace pilot for about a year.That was the first ,only multiplayer sim i found that could fit my budget.At that time all other games of that sort charged an hourly price,what i could never afford.I flew in AH beta,for a while,and did a free trial when it was 1.1 or so,but the price scared me away.
After a while I got sick of the way FA was run ,and gave AH another chance(I`m glad I did).I decided to move on,and pay the extra 20 bucks a month.The hardest part of it all was leaving my squad in FA.I tryed to bring them over,or even start a AH division of the squad,but they all told me they couldn`t afford to pay triple the price,and obviously they won`t even give it a chance,even they loved the screenshots I sent them.I could have brought a squad of 30 people in.
My point is,I was ,and I know many people are discouraged to even try out AH ,when they find out it cost $30 a month.If it was at least half that price,they`d be pouring in,because this game has so much more to offer than FA ,or any other game of this kind at this moment.i`m not trying to get it cheaper for myself,but to help to get more people ,since that`s what makes this game more fun for all of us.(more drones the better (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) )
just my 2 cents worth.
Tom666 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
BTW collision modelling still sucks prettythang (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/mad.gif)
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People are discouraged by the price tag on a Dodge Viper.
Some buy it anyway, and have fun with it.
AH is a sport car in a world full of Fiat Punto's.
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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
(http://us.st5.yimg.com/store4.yimg.com/I/demotivators_1619_4916770)
"I don't necessarily agree with everything I think." - A. Eldritch
[This message has been edited by StSanta (edited 01-27-2001).]
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"After a while I got sick of the way FA was run "
Then why would you wish the same on AH? Don't you think the miniscule $10/mo price for FA (and AW) have something to do with how those games are? You'd have to be blind to think other wise.
-Westy
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well if the price was 15 to 20$ a month i think the rest of the air squad woulda been here too. There are about 10 of them flying active in FA based on the price difference.
They all tried and liked AH but think its to much to pay.
But if 30$ a month is what we have to pay for getting regular udates and bug fixes, and for not saying new versions as often as we do then its worth it (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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(http://www.geocities.com/gaamund/grapus.gif)
(had a good kill today)
[This message has been edited by air_guard (edited 01-27-2001).]
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htc keep claiming they want as many as possible and $30 is still too much to attract the crowds i think....several of my friends have tried ah(about 6 and only 2 are prepared to pay the sub!) the rest like it but dont want to pay that much.
Anyone here who keeps claiming that $30 is the perfect price:
WHAT ARE YOU MAD??????????
any reduction would be appreciated...some are still paying $20 and ive heard some get it for $10.This is where i have a problem with the pricing.
This is fundamentally WRONG.
hazed
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Originally posted by hazed-:
any reduction would be appreciated...some are still paying $20 and ive heard some get it for $10.This is where i have a problem with the pricing.
This is fundamentally WRONG.
hazed
you heard well. I know 4 guys paying 9.95$month, and quite many paying 15$/month.
and there is still no new on a new price... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/rolleyes.gif)
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You get what you pay for...as a Santa example, when I go to buy a car, and compare prices for quality, I know that I'm not going to get a Mecedes Benz for the price of the Ford Tauras on the lot next to it.
Being a small company of only 6 employees, I think $30 a month is a fair price for the enjoyment I get in return.
I can remember buying every new boxed game that came out, an avg. of about $100 a month, on top of my WB's bill which ran an avg. of about $80 a month.
I can sympathize with those who are tight on budget...I can only wish you good fortune for a better job or better life, but in the meantime, if you can't afford to the payments of a Mercedes Benz, then you better drive the Ford Tauras until a day when you can afford it.
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I'm paying 360$/Year while some others are paying 120$/Year. That sure wont make me too happy about it.
Some could think I'm stupid (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/confused.gif)
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Comparing this game to an automobole is pointless. AH is a bunch of code on a computer, nothing more.
With a Mercedes, you are largely paying for the name and prestiege. I don't think think it's possible to say the same about AH.
I don't blame HTC for charging $30 per month--they charge what the economist among them thinks they ought. They are a business, and the goal of a business is to make largest profit possible. However, they are NOT charging that amount because it is a "superior product". They are charging it because that price is where they make the most money.
I feel certain that HTC thinks that if they reduce the price, they will end up making less money. And, if they think that, they're probably right. This game is their livelihood, and I can't blame them for not wanting to take a pay cut. Once they think they will make more money with a lower price, then they will reduce the price.
Saying "Ah is a superior product, like a Mercedes" is a good rationalization to pay for the game--but that isn't why the price is set at what it is.
Until I can afford this game, I will be content to participate in these forums.
J_A_B
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It IS a superior product. Like Rip, I spent a good deal of money on boxed game, games I got sick of in a month or less.
Then came AH. Not sick of it yet; addiction is growing.
What can upset me is what staga mentioned - I pay $360 a year and some other guys pay $120. Sort of sad, since I dinnae quit - the other dudes did.
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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
(http://store4.yimg.com/I/demotivators_1619_3845234)
"I don't necessarily agree with everything I think." - A. Eldritch
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<Lephturn, the grizzled vereran virtual aviator, looks on with mild amusement as a groups of young pilots take turn pounding on the bloated body of a long deceased horse.>
Tom666 wrote:
BTW collision modelling still sucks prettythang
Tom, there is no other reasonable way to do it. Why don't you make a suggestion as to how it should be done, and I will explain why it won't work. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Lephturn - Chief Trainer
A member of The Flying Pigs http://www.flyingpigs.com (http://www.flyingpigs.com)
"A pig is a jolly companion, Boar, sow, barrow, or gilt --
A pig is a pal, who'll boost your morale, Though mountains may topple and tilt.
When they've blackballed, bamboozled, and burned you, When they've turned on you, Tory and Whig,
Though you may be thrown over by Tabby and Rover, You'll never go wrong with a pig, a pig,
You'll never go wrong with a pig!" -- Thomas Pynchon, "Gravity's Rainbow"
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Outside PERK POINTS and the not redone B17 engine fairings the "Some Get It Cheaper" deal is one of my pet peeves with AH.
I considered that deal a HUGE kick in the balls to the guys who signed up day one of 1.0 and still do.
That said, until or if WBIII and WWII Online actually become reality forget an across the board reduction.
The resident "bean counter", and rest assured even with only 6 on the payroll they got one, would not be doing his/her job if they let it happen.
Barring an exodus of "30 Buckers" to another sim forget cheaper across the boards rates.
I would love to be 100% wrong on this one.
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When did they put this thing in here and WTF is it for?
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$20.00 .... $30.00 .... heck I spend more than that in the snack/soda machines at work each month... sometimes each week!
They don't call me "Big T" for nuthin! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
T
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Tom.
Give it a rest, if the talk that HT gave you in the MA last night while you droned on ad nausuim for an hour about this isnt enought then what is. I want to pay less too, you got your answer. What the hell is anyone here going to add that the man himself didnt say.
Your just going to give yourself a fit.
The question who want to pay less is silly. All but the most ardent chear leaders will say they would rather play and have a new DVD player, then just play for the same price.
The real question is who is willing to quite unless they lower the prices.
I suspect that is answered every month and that HTC is happy with the answer.
I had a freind that was offered the 10 dollar account and imediantly quit again. So the effect of lowering the price is not neccessarily clean cut. Chevy overprices on the Suburban just to keep it exclusive. Is it worth 25000 more then the same frame and engine in a truck? nope. But they want it exclusive. The buyers do too.
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er.....yeah but we dont want it exclusive.
I have no problem with $whatever because I think Aces High is better than WB/FA. But plenty of my mates simply cant afford it. I'd love to see loadsa more people in here.
Now just for us who weren't in the MA when this went off.......what did HT say?
Swoop
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I started playing Warbirds when it came out and was playing up a $200 dollar a month bill on my credit card every month.
30 dollars (buck a day) sounds WONDERFUL to me still to play a game actually better than Warbirds!
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you frikken babies, come up to Canada and you can pay over 50 bucks a month!!!! That is exactly what ive been doing for the last 10 months or so. Yes its quite a slice of cash but who cares, it's worth it. WHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAA 30 BUCKS A MONTH WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! (btw i know how exchange system works so dont say "you dont understand")
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Originally posted by UZZI:
I started playing Warbirds when it came out and was playing up a $200 dollar a month bill on my credit card every month.
30 dollars (buck a day) sounds WONDERFUL to me still to play a game actually better than Warbirds!
Highest I ever spent in Warbirds was $160, but I thought it was worth it then. Average monthly WB bill for me was around $80. $30 flat rate in Aces High is a relative bargain. I'll play forever at this rate. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
(http://www.jump.net/~cs3/sigs/uns_sig.jpg) (http://www.jump.net/~cs3)
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Awww... how stupid can it be. $30 a month is $1 per day. Tell your whining friends to forfeit one can of pop per day and then they will be able to "afford" AH So sick of hearing the whiners acting like $30 a month is something they can't "afford". Hogwash... They paying $10 a month now, you can't tell me they couldn't afford an extra 66 cents per day to fly AH. What hogwash... so sick of hearing it.
HT keep the price at $30 a month. Perhaps this will help keep the lowlifes away.
fscott
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Tom, there is no other reasonable way to do it. Why don't you make a suggestion as to how it should be done, and I will explain why it won't work. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
[/B][/QUOTE]
Well,when I crash into another plane I`d like to see the other guy go down too.
Plain and simple.There is no way ,any of those WWII planes could have survived head on collisions,or collisions of any kind for that matter.
I`m not trying to get my kills with ramming in AH,but when i collide ,and I see the dude just fly on from my broken plane ,well that just pisses me off.
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Originally posted by Lephturn:
<Lephturn, the grizzled vereran virtual aviator, looks on with mild amusement as a groups of young pilots take turn pounding on the bloated body of a long deceased horse.>
Tom666 wrote:
Tom, there is no other reasonable way to do it. Why don't you make a suggestion as to how it should be done, and I will explain why it won't work. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Hehehe Lep I wonder if you are the same guy back in the AW DOS days who explained why hourly pricing would never go away and why hugh graphics engines required for the likes of WB's and AH wouldn't work (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
BigJim
P.S. I remember those days
[This message has been edited by BigJim (edited 01-27-2001).]
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"Well,when I crash into another plane I`d like to see the other guy go down too."
Oh I'm sure. And if we had a universal $10/mo flat rate here I'm sure we'd have a new version of the FighterAce "Rocketeers" here in no time. Sorry. That is not a very well thought out proposition. If I collide I deserve to blow up. Not the other guy and even more so had I intended to collide. Enable it your way and kamikaze attacks will happen ALOT. After all some will say to themselves, "I'm out of ammo, out of fuel and there are alot who say I'll keep that guy from my buddies six, or knock that bomber over my base, by ramming them. After all I can just get a new plane and be go right back up!"
Why don't you learn to fly better instead of asking for a crutch to compensate for your lack of ability to avoid debri or another persons plane.
Online flying doesn't have a 1/100th the realism of actual flying, let alone aircombat. Bring on a permanent "death" if you really want to allow collisions like you advocate. Then modell mutual destruction when there is a collision. We'll see how many folks collide, on purpose or accidentally, then.
Of all the things asked for to be modelled why does someone - usually a newby to collisions - always ask for this?
-Westy
[This message has been edited by Westy (edited 01-27-2001).]
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WTF?
I did not say I wanna be colliding all over the MA!!!!!!
But when it happens,I want to see both planes go down.That`s it.
BTW them rockets were one of the main reason
I left FA.
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I might buy the "its just code in a computer" thing. If they just left it alone. Like WB. But its upgraded all the time. mmm.... lets see. When was the last time we had an upgrade? Its been so long I cant remember. I think it was yesterday.
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Figure out the per hour cost of the entertainment you get. Heck, if you fly very little at all it is way less than $1/hour. It is very cheap form of entertainment & much superior to some other games priced at $10.
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Tom has a point that people seem to have missed. $30 a month IS a high price in TODAY's internet games. Almost all internet games today are 10 a month or 15 a month. WB and AW are games that are going down really quick today. Why? Because games like AH and WWIIOL, FA and others are offering much cheaper prices and/or are approaching or surpassing AW & WB's quality.
Then we have the problem of numbers. How many people have been scared away from AH just by its price? Would it be fair to say more than 6 times the number of current subscribers? Tom's squad is about 30 people, I know in my own neighborhood about 12 people who would sign up on a snap if AH wasnt so high priced, and god knows how many people they know that would also like to sign up.
I aint no math person, but if with just 2 people here, Tom and I, HTC has already lost 42 costumers due to AH's price... how much money are they losing vs. what they would be gaining? Not to mention that I am not a full-year subscriber.. I cant afford to pay 30 a month every month.. I am in for 2 months, out for 2 months, etc.
So thats... 60 bucks per month from Tom and I... compared to the 630 bucks they would be getting from tom's squad and my friends (priced at $15). Count in how many squads are in AH that have dozens upon dozens of squaddies that would be in AH if it wasnt for the price tag...
I dont see any merits to some people saying that the price tag keeps the riff raff away.. remember, YOU were riff raff once. HTC is not in bussiness to uphold your elitist ego, they are here to make money. In my view, a price reduction would bring HTC a lot of income..but also some more expenses. However, there are hundreds of sponsors out there that could be giving HTC cash to advertise in the HTC website, or something like that.
I love this game. The 30 a month is a real sting in my wallet, but I can afford to scratch every 2 months. Not everyone has a $25 per hour job and no debts to pay you know (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Think about it this way Sam's the walmart subsidary is a Wholesale(i mean true wholesale) supplier but it ahs a store. My point is that there are so many people who buy stuff there its profitable to sell things at low prices. As the AH planeset and quality groes the number people wiling to pay 30 dollars(i do not use the term for male deer to mean dollars) will grow with the quality and as more join the price will go down be cause HTC will hit a point where they can make the amount of money they want while lowering prices the people who are scraed to go in at 30 will go in at say 20. or they coulkd sell a discounted per year basis.
Get what im saying?
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I have no problem with $30 a month. Compared to what we paid for WB, it is a bargain.
One big problem with a lower price is all the jerky dweebs will play it. Those who cant afford $30 should get a job, or a second job so they are not so cash strapped, and not be spending their spare time playing online games anyway! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Seriously, HTC needs to operate at a profit, they are not a non-profit company like IEN has been.
This game could be considered a premium online game in my opinion, and if someone wants to play it, they will have to pay the price.
Dago
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"Awww... how stupid can it be. $30 a month is $1 per day. Tell your whining friends to forfeit one can of pop per day and then they will be able to "afford" AH So sick of hearing the whiners acting like $30 a month is something they can't "afford". Hogwash... They paying $10 a month now, you can't tell me they couldn't afford an extra 66 cents per day to fly AH. What hogwash... so sick of hearing it. "
Apparently you have never been a college student working a full-time job on the side to pay for it. Apparently you have never had to worry about making ends meet, where $30 a month DOES make a difference. There have been plenty of times for me that $30 meant the difference between having my electric shut off.
If you have the money, I am glad for you. But don't forget that not everybody is equally well off. For a lot of people, $30 is a signifigant sum. For the Canadians, $50 is even more of a burden.
You should put yourself in the other guy's shoes before needlessly flaming someone.
J_A_B
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Originally posted by Westy:
Why don't you learn to fly better instead of asking for a crutch to compensate for your lack of ability to avoid debri or another persons plane.
Online flying doesn't have a 1/100th the realism of actual flying, let alone aircombat. Bring on a permanent "death" if you really want to allow collisions like you advocate. Then modell mutual destruction when there is a collision. We'll see how many folks collide, on purpose or accidentally, then.
Of all the things asked for to be modelled why does someone - usually a newby to collisions - always ask for this?
-Westy
[This message has been edited by Westy (edited 01-27-2001).]
LOL Westy you mean this is just a "GAME" (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
while I agree with you on that point I don't agree that you can always avoid some of the "lag induced" things that happen in this "game" just because you are a great virtual pilot. I missed Dales explanation of the "great pricing debacule" so won't go into that fax paus.
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Can any of you Canadians give me the current price of a six pack of LaBatt's Blue or a six of Moosehead?
[This message has been edited by Toad (edited 01-27-2001).]
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Tom666,
Read this thread about collisions. It will explain why they HAVE to be done the way that they are done in AH.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum8/HTML/001047.html (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum8/HTML/001047.html)
Both die in a collision sounds good and fair until you realize that there are certain technological issues preventing it from being fair.
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We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother
Sisu
-Karnak
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Tom66, go read this (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum8/HTML/001047.html) thread about collisions. There is much more to it than just wanting both planes to 'splode! on impact. There's this lil thing called *gameplay* to keep in mind. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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I dont know why people keep saying that if they lower the price all these idiots will come in.?? I wasnt aware that your ablilty to pay 30 bucks a month made you intelectually superior to someone who can only afford 20 a month...
"When was the last time we had an upgrade? Its been so long I cant remember. I think it was yesterday"
ya an "upgrade" that makes it possible to sink CV's with 2 rockets, and no "ship sunk" messages...
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The old discount with increased time subscription would be fairer I think. You know-$30 for the first month, $50 for two months-that type of thing. Potential players could select a block of time in accord to their budgets.
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Originally posted by J_A_B:
"Awww... how stupid can it be. $30 a month is $1 per day. Tell your whining friends to forfeit one can of pop per day and then they will be able to "afford" AH So sick of hearing the whiners acting like $30 a month is something they can't "afford". Hogwash... They paying $10 a month now, you can't tell me they couldn't afford an extra 66 cents per day to fly AH. What hogwash... so sick of hearing it. "
Apparently you have never been a college student working a full-time job on the side to pay for it. Apparently you have never had to worry about making ends meet, where $30 a month DOES make a difference. There have been plenty of times for me that $30 meant the difference between having my electric shut off.
If you have the money, I am glad for you. But don't forget that not everybody is equally well off. For a lot of people, $30 is a signifigant sum. For the Canadians, $50 is even more of a burden.
You should put yourself in the other guy's shoes before needlessly flaming someone.
J_A_B
People have to make the decision as to whether or not they can afford it or if it is worth it. If $30 makes the diff whether you pay utilities, I would advise this game or any other game which costs money is not a good Idea. I am sure HTC is not trying to appeal the this part of the market. As a consumer you have a choice to either buy or not to buy. If you choice to Buy the service, don't whine about it.
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The "it's only 1 can of pop a day" argument is BS. If they lowered the price, they could double or triple the subscribers from our squad. These aren't poor people, I had a fellow squaddie tell me "I make six figures, and I won't pay $30 a month just on the principle that it's too high in today's market."
Someday, competition will force the price lower, and that will be a good day for AH.
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LJK_Raubvogel
LuftJägerKorps (http://www.luftjagerkorps.com)
(http://raubvogel.tripod.com/signew.gif)
[This message has been edited by LJK Raubvogel (edited 01-27-2001).]
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Toad a dozen beer,Labatts/ Molson run s approx $14.99 here in the Province of Alberta not including the refund you get from recycle
Moosehead is slightly more expensive.
Bare in mind that Alberta's beer prices are among the lowest in Canada.
Drink more beer get more empties, return empties for refund ,use money to pay for AH (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Didn't say "always" Bigjim.
As for Wobble's post about intellect? Your being here is proof of your own point. But @ $10/mo only early grade school kids have a hard time coming up with that fee. And I can imagine thier quandry when they have to decide between a choice of Pokemon chips or flying AW/FA...
-Westy
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i could afford the $30 a month but like many others I just feel it is a very inflated price given todays market. Westy, I see yer point...i think, are what you are saying is that the $30 a month keeps less serious players out of the game? I can see that line of thinking..and it does make sense. I fly H2H with a BUNCH of others that to say the least are VERY serious, and they are not paying $30 a month for the same reason im not, its not that they arent serious its that they cannot justify paying $30 a month for it, also you have to take into consideration the folks with families who dont have just load of free time to play, they cant sit for hours every night and get their money's worth ($30)
BTW I think $10 is too cheap, I was thinking around $20
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Baddawg,
Thanks!
Using this page: http://www.xe.net/ucc/convert.cgi (http://www.xe.net/ucc/convert.cgi)
I converted $30 USD, the price of a month of AH, into $45.14 Canadian.
You're getting each Blue for $2.50 ($15/6) Canadian, so $45.14 of AH is costing you 18.05 Blues.
I'm getting a six of Blue here in Kansas for @ $6.00 USD, or a dollar each. Therefore, $30 of AH is costing me 30 Blues.
This just doesn't seem fair; any suggestions?
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
All in good fun, eh? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
[This message has been edited by Toad (edited 01-27-2001).]
[This message has been edited by Toad (edited 01-27-2001).]
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shrug
I honestly do not understand what you are talking about. If $20 could be more profitable to HTC do any of you think that they would keep it at $30? I live in a country of 2.5 world, where average monthly salary is around $100, but I still think that game worth every single cent in that prise. AH just rocks, the game is unbelievable good, especially considering the size of the team that produce it.
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I pay 29.95 some pay less and if another sim comes out that competes with the price and/or performance that I get, I will give them my money and leave.
Competition, it's a wonderfull thing in tearms of cost and quality for the consumer, apples and oranges not required.
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Originally posted by BigGun:
People have to make the decision as to whether or not they can afford it or if it is worth it. If $30 makes the diff whether you pay utilities, I would advise this game or any other game which costs money is not a good Idea. I am sure HTC is not trying to appeal the this part of the market. As a consumer you have a choice to either buy or not to buy. If you choice to Buy the service, don't whine about it.
I agree. Completely. At 100%. But the problem here is that HTC chose to give people who had left accounts for 10,15,20 and 25 bucks.
And me, who has been paying for 12 months now (360$), who has been supporting AH since day 1 of 1.0, with only a break of 30 days, I am still paying 30bucks.
SO your argumentation has no sense. There are people flying for 10 bucks out there. I dont see why do I have to pay 3 times that money.
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He heeeeee, SOS, different thread!!!
Ok, look at the number of ppl in the MA now as compared to pre 1.05!!! I guess there are more ppl who think $29.95 is a good deal (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
HT, raise the price!!! I bet they will pay it (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) I look post 1.06 to having to stand in line to get into the MA at the current low price structure!!!
Ya just gotta love America (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) Ya just gotta love our sprit of Capitalism!!! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
My US $.02 or Canadian $.25 or European $2.50 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
(http://cwm.ragesofsanity.com/s/ruinkai/biggrininvasion.gif)
[This message has been edited by 1776 (edited 01-27-2001).]
[This message has been edited by 1776 (edited 01-27-2001).]
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Everybody who plays it once wanna play it forever. It means EVERY virtual pilot wanna play Aces High!
It means if AH has a bit lower price it will have many more players! No?
Also, is hard to make easiest prices for ppl who isnt from USA?? US dollars here makes 2 of our money and im sure this kind of thing happens in other countries. The final AH price here is too high! Dont u see?
Aces High is a international game! Everyone loves it and wanna play.
Warbirds has lots of brazilians and most of them wanna come to AH but cant...
Just a observation, dont shoot at me pls. Im not good at game market, money strategy, and
ok
forgive me, couldnt resist...
Dont shoot!
Peerado
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I think the idea HTC has in developing and maintaining this game is not to get everyone to play, but rather to make a profit.
If they cut the price in half, but the player base doubled, the cash flow would stay the same, while alot of the problems would double. They would have more difficulty I would expect with server overload, double the billings to handle each month, more calls for help and more complaints to deal with. Why if the money is the same, would they do that?
I think they are looking for a balance of cash billings versus the support required. Just my thoughts tho.
Dago
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<ding> You hear that sound? I heard it.. Dago hit the nail right on the head.
-SW
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I aggree with dago 100%.
But i`m an idealist I guess,I know that there are people in some countrys where the average monthly income is $150,and would love to join this community.But giving up one fifth of their salary for a cool game is out of the question.Even americans that raise families,might have trouble justifying the 30 bucks ,added to $20 for ISP and an other 20 for secound phoneline ,and we are closing on the 100 dollar barrier.Just add buying a decent joystick,and the memory upgrade You may need ,and it gets to the point where the John Smith has no chance talking he`s wife into letting him play the game,and he`ll be gone after the 2 week trial,no matter how much he loves AH.
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Toad-San, it is 15$c for 12 Molsons. 15/12=buck and a quarter, Canadian=45/1.25=36 brews per month Canadian, as opposed to my 12.00$us for a twelve pack of Bud, a buck a pop=30/1=30 beers a month.
As you can see, using the beer quotient, They are truly paying more. I'll stick with the warmer regions of the continent myself, thank you very much, regardless of the cost.
Edit-AND I can just throw the damn cans away instead of saving them up.
[This message has been edited by Gadfly (edited 01-27-2001).]
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Kinda makes the $29.95 a small portion of running a home computer,doesn't it?
Wonder what it costs just to support this sim in equipment and lines?
Just think only 6 ppl are doing more then any other sim on the web!!!
Have you seen any promise they haven't delivered on?? What other sim has upgrades as fast as this sim??
No, your money, no matter how much you pay, is getting you the cutting edge of flight sims!!!
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Doesn't anyone hear think that the people at HT have enough brains in their head to have a good handle on what pricing strategy is/isn't will/won't work?
As I recall the reason they did the "discount" subscriptions was to see if there was a significant increase in people who decided against $30/month.
Its been a few months now, and so Im sure the data is in, and HT will do what is best for them, which normaly corelates directly to whats best for us IN THE LONG RUN.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Sorry...I asked about a 6-pack and didn't notice the 12 pack answer. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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what you want to bet it drops SOON after ww2 onling comes out hehe. assuming it ever does.
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Originally posted by RAM:
I agree. Completely. At 100%. But the problem here is that HTC chose to give people who had left accounts for 10,15,20 and 25 bucks.
And me, who has been paying for 12 months now (360$), who has been supporting AH since day 1 of 1.0, with only a break of 30 days, I am still paying 30bucks.
SO your argumentation has no sense. There are people flying for 10 bucks out there. I dont see why do I have to pay 3 times that money.
So, are you going to be beating the corpse of this poor horse for much longer? HTC has already made it abundantly clear what their reasoning was behind that. You've already made it abundantly clear why you don't like it. I'm pretty sure everybody gets it now.
Not that I'm tired of hearing about it for the millionth time, I'm just trying to help save your fingers from having to type so much is all. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
SOB
...oh, and to sum up (just in case you've missed it before) - The world isn't always fair & life sometimes sucks. That is why you have to pay $30/mo when some are only paying $10/mo.
[This message has been edited by SOB (edited 01-27-2001).]
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Originally posted by TheWobble:
i could afford the $30 a month but like many others I just feel it is a very inflated price given todays market....
Can you give examples of games simular or as good as Aces High, as example of that market your talking about? I'd say it's in a class by it's self at the moment wouldn't you?
I say to play a classic and pay 30 bucks a month is cheap...
But of course I agree $20 would be nicer even!
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heh.....my cat pounced at your signature airguard...
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(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) yep mine did too .
30 or 10 , lots don't come but don't stay cause it's far harder here than say FA medium . They won't pay 20 more to get their bellybutton shot off over and over . Then tell their friends and squadmates it all about PRICE (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
30 cheap if you are having fun , 10 would suck a big one if your not (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif) think this is what HT was looking for in the price survey . The won't stay even with the lower price cause it just wasn't fun for them ????
I didn't have that much fun here till I got it in my head that I had to be REALLY close to get a good kill , and BEHIND (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) I believe lots coming from full HUD games having the same problems too .
cheers spro
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air_rules = Play fair ....Don't worry about points......Keep a sense of humor......Drink Jim Beam......and don't let the fediddlein cat walk on the keyboard.......!!!
(http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Track/1589/temp/airsprogif.gif)
[This message has been edited by airspro (edited 01-28-2001).]
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AH need to be $50.00 a month plain and simple.
RAM, Hazed and the rest of ya can head over to AW3 or FA for a $10.00 a month Game. Its that simple, you get what you pay for.
AW3 & FA are worth about $3.99 a month if that. AH is worth well over $30.00 a month.
Now lets drop these pricing threads cause it aint gona get ya no where fast.
Dog out.....
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Sometimes they ask $30/month is too much for a 'game'. Then I say,
"Pass/Ticket for swimming(one month) costs twice of AH price. My last Bowling lesson took more than twice of AH price. Needless to say about tennis club membership(per month) that I once had. We spend our money on those hobbies without thinking 'expensive'. but, hey, You mean Those hobbies are far better than AH? What AH lack of than?
AH is something comparable with those experience. maybe you can call it Sports."
(But I must confess, that they could understand my point of view, but no matter how I tried to drag in to AH, most of them tends to stay in H2H :)
tailight
-lyun-
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Originally posted by Wardog:
RAM, Hazed and the rest of ya can head over to AW3 or FA for a $10.00 a month Game. Its that simple, you get what you pay for.
.
lol, wardog -once again- demonstrates us that he is unable to write a post without naming the word RAM
Wardog, seek for help, your brain needs it (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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I will probably start paying as soon as I move here in about a month, however I still fail to see how someone who cannot afford the $30 a month to play for whatever reason is deemed a sub-par player. If ya wanna look at it that way, why not be able to pay $50 a month and have planes shot down for You, seeing as how the people who will spend more money are better pilots and those who cannot spare $30 a month must be "dweebs"
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You guys out there on a severely limited budget have my sympathy. As a out of work (physically disabled) plumber I know where your comeing from.
However, even with zero dollars comeing in (and lots of bills to pay) we always found the 30$ a month for AH (and another 30$ for the DSL line). Yes I'm currently on a comped acct as an AH trainer. (Thank YOU HTC!) I like to think that I earn that most days.
But free acct or not, I'd still come up with the scratch every month. If I had to sell my books, rent out the attic, or mortgage the house.
It's either worth it to you or it isn't. Period.
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I've heard these price threads since Day One, and they never change. Some ask for comparisons with other games, others say they'll bail when a better/cheaper game comes out. Then you get a few people who say "You just watch; when xxxxxx comes out the price here WILL drop!". I don't pay one red cent for AH; I occasionally raid a H2H game but nothing more. Once in a Blue Moon, like when I was writing my article, I get let in the arenas.
If AH was cheaper would I pay? Nope. The MA is a 24 hour Quakefest, with better players actually looking for a test of skill and not a huge kill score. Even when I had arena access I didn't show up very often. I just don't like the atmosphere. I stuck mostly to the TA just to get away from the main. People in there are generally more civilized, with a distinct lack of tension present. I'm here to enjoy AH, albeit mostly offline. I come here to put my thoughts in about various subjects.
But like my experience with WBs; when the community and developers go to crap I leave. I doubt HTC will head for the toilet within the next year or so, but this community might. I'm going to stick around until I get annoyed or bored with AH; and the latter isn't going to happen soon. No matter the price, I won't pay for access to the MA in it's current state. The SEA and TA aren't worth it to me either, so I'll stick to H2H. Granted, the hosts might suck and you'll get far MORE annoying people in them. But there's less chance of getting 8 people on a host that are ALL that bad. A lot better odds than the MA.
I completely agree with Dago. A small tight-nit community causes less trouble for a developer than a large one filled with Arm-chair experts and weekend wonder warriors. I'll take the small player base over a large one any day.
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Flakbait [Delta6]
Delta 6's Flight School (http://www.worldaccessnet.com/~delta6)
Put the P-61B in Aces High
"With all due respect Chaplian, I don't think God wants to hear from me right now.
I'm gonna go out there and remove one of His creations from this universe.
And when I get back I'm gonna drink a bottle of Scotch like it was Chiggy von Richthofen's blood and celebrate his death."
Col. McQueen, Space: Above and Beyond
(http://www.worldaccessnet.com/~delta6/htbin/custom1.jpg)
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Okay,
I was here from the beginning of the open beta. I think it was October I canceled my account because I couldn't justify the $29.95 a month especially with Christmas comming. So I don't currently have an AH account.
Shortly after I closed my account, I heard the hubbub about the pricing "Survey."
HTC never offered me a $9.95 or $14.95 account, and rest assured if they had, I would be back.
That doen't mean in a month or two I won't be back at $29.95 a month either. I am currently working at the DaimlerChrysler Toledo Plant, and sometime after April the Launch of the liberty will be complete. So maybe in May I will have free time to fly online. Perhaps I shall be back then. If the price hasn't dropped I will have a $29.95 account.
So, not everyone who left was offered a cheaper account. If you miss your fighter ace buddies I am sorry, but ultimately it is a personal issue about cost. I don't know what if anything HTC learned about the pricing survey, except that when Badger shared the info, it angered many individuals in the community.
Currently, because of time constraints I don't feel Aces High is $30 a month, in May (I think) when I will have more free time, Aces High may be worth $30 a month.
Sorry that your friends don't feel it is worth the cost, HTC seems to think it is.
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"Looks Mean as Hell! Clare Lee Chenault.
(http://www.tir.com/~lkbrown1/06212.gif)
When?
"Downtown" Lincoln Brown.
[This message has been edited by Downtown (edited 01-28-2001).]
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Two ideas:
Most the people who feel that the current price is "fair" fall into two categories:
1. Ex WB's players who used to pay hundreds of dollars per month (are you guys rich or something? how could you afford that?).
2. People (myself included) who have a firm grasp of economics. I don't like the current price, but I fully understand why its set at what it is. I still hope it becomes cheaper in the future, though.
Second, I don't see how it is productive to complain about "price whiners" After all, I see PLENTY of whines from people who DO pay for the game--here's a small list:
HO whines, ramming whines, killsteal whines, ack whines, carrier ack whines, LW whines, RAF whines, runner whines, F4Uc whines, N1K whines, P38 whines, bomber tuffness whines, lethality whines, hispano whines, mauser whines, ostie whines, bomb damage whines, furball whines, landgrab whines, "you killed me" whines, and that's just the tip of the iceberg.
Even IF this thread started as a whine (which it didn't; it was a legit statement), I don't see how any person on a BB so whine-filled as this one could possibly complain about a whine. Besided, whines are a good thing, they highlight problems.
I suspect it's only a matter of time until HTC lowers their price somewhat, but I doubt if anyone--including HTC--knows exactly when that will be. Not in the near future is a safe bet. When they DO lower it, I also suspect it will be at a level slightly below that of WarBirds, but above AW/FA.
J_A_B
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HTC explained the pricing situation long ago. It's kinda a dead horse.
However, if $30/month makes any diffrence to you and your budget at all, it's time to take a good look at your current situation.
Maybe, just maybe, you ought not to be sitting in front of a computer squeaking about it to flightsim enthusiasts, and get your broke bellybutton into work for some over time, or to a local community college to aquire skills for a better paying job.
Pretty simple actually.
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Originally posted by Dago:
One big problem with a lower price is all the jerky dweebs will play it. Those who cant afford $30 should get a job, or a second job so they are not so cash strapped, and not be spending their spare time playing online games anyway! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Nice to see it's so cut and dried for everyone. Smilie or no smilie I find that statement verra insulting. While it may apply to some, I'd wager it dinnae apply to most. Or are you lumping everyone who thinks it's not worth $30 into this as well?
My only problem with $30/mo is when it comes down to AH or what 3 kids need, the kids' need win hands down. As for another job you try holding one with a wife in the Navy at what has to be the most FUBAR'ed command in all of the USN and has her schedule change at the whim of her Dept Head or DO. Matter of fact my last few months have been thanks to the graciousness of a few of the players here. And though I may get mouthy with'em on chan 1 (when we're opposing each other (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) ) they have my deepest gratitude for thier gifts.
I'm just hoping we can get our tax refund before my time runs out so I can pay for a whole year and not to have worry about it until next tax season (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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If it's not worth the 30$ to you, then don't play. In WB I played when I had the money, and I left when I didn't and I would come back when I did. This was at 2$/hr and this was when ISPs charged you for the time too.
It's really simple, really..... HTC charges a set fee. You either pay it or you don't, but they run their own business and they won't change their pay plan until they feel that the newer pay plan will still allow them to keep up their servers, pay for the bandwidth they need(more players=more bandwidth, so you see where this is heading), and most importantly, they still need to make enough money to pay for their own lives. This is their living, you don't go to a tax accountant and say "40$/hr for you to do my taxes is outrageous, I'll pay you 1$/hr to do my taxes." The accountant will look at you all googly eyed then throw your bellybutton out.
It's a business, they run it their way and they will lower prices when they can be assured that they'll get enough new players to pay for a new server, more bandwidth and still be able to live.
For anyone doesn't understand the way an online game works.. here ya go:
HTC runs a server that has r amount of RAM, h amount of HDD space and a fast connection. The connection has x amount of bandwidth which allows for y amount of players. Each player pays z dollars for their account to keep the server running and their own bandwidth. There are w amount of players paying for the game...
r+h=c or cost of upgrading
x+y+c<z*w
In other words, unless they are making more money than it costs to pay for the bandwidth and upgrading then they don't get paid for their great work.
The pricing scheme is set so that they can continue to produce this game and pay for the very good connection.
So, stop with the "in my country", "in my life..." stuff about how you can't currently pay for it. It doesn't matter if HTC can't pay for themselves and pay for keeping enough bandwidth to keep players satisfied and to pay to upgrade the server.
-SW
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Creamo, who was that post directed at?
J_A_B
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To anyone that didn't read the lengthy responses Pyro had made regarding the price structure, and marketing of new accounts at a reduced price j_a_b.
The broke bellybutton part was for whoever can't scrape $1 per day for a hobby such as AH.
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Originally posted by Creamo:
The broke bellybutton part was for whoever can't scrape $1 per day for a hobby such as AH.
Heh.. You know coke fiends and crack addicts suck d*ck to get their fix?
If you are addicted to this enough to complain about the price I can think of a part time job for you.....
hehe(not directed at you Creamo ;-)
-SW
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Hmmm, it seems this thread comes back every few weeks, in one form or another.
For what its worth, I have never seen the posts Pyro or anyone else made at HTC about the pricing structure. If its available, I would sure like to see it.
I think J_A_B said it best in how the crowd is divided. Those of you that paid big bucks in the old days amaze me. For that kind of money, I rent the local Cessna. At least I can log the time (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
But what can't be ignored is the *rumor* of others able to pay less. I have no real problem paying my $29.95 if that is the rate for **everyone**. But I'll also go one step further and say that I do not like this whole Perk Point BS. If its what we truly have to go through to fly the fun airplanes like the upcoming Blitz and other super weapons, I would really like to see some way for us to be able to fly them without having to play 400 hours a month. I don't have the time to play as much as I would like yet the times I do play, I'd like to play *all* the aircraft available.
I understand the compromises that would have to be made, since the idea is to *earn* points to fly super weapons. But that's another topic all together. I just do not admire this bait-and-fly approach to getting into the neat aircraft.
And honestly, I can't even begin to tell you how many times my friends have tried Aces High and loved it. But for $30 a month, the same thing they pay for their cable/DSL connections, they balk. Sure, you guys can quote the $1 a day company line or shout and cheer like many HTC cheerleaders do (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) But I honestly beleive if the price was a bit lower, they'd lure more people into paying. By doing so would mean more people in the arenas and more income for HTC.
I just hate seeing threads like these where people are effectively being told they are whining by stating their opinion on the cost to play. I enjoy the game and its disappointing to know there are many really good players on the sidelines that would play, if the cost to do so was brought down to earth a bit.
Just my 2 cents.
Paul Bussiere
www.checksix.net (http://www.checksix.net)
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Here ya go LePaul. http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum1/HTML/006267.html (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum1/HTML/006267.html)
Read the most important post, the first one by Pyro. Read it thoroughly. I'm not an AH cheerleader, I just know business and how it works.
-SW
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"Topic: To HiThech about price issue"
HiThech? hehe (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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===>Frosty
====>Exposure2k.com
=====>Frosty@exposure2k.com
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Seems simple to me.
If you cant afford the price of $30, then dont play it. If my situation was such that this puta strain on my budget, then I wouldnt play.
If you dont think AH is worth $30, then dont play. It's worth it to me, I think its a bargain. One day on the golf course cost as much as a month of AH, and for $30 I get a month of fun, not just one afternoon of sunburn and frustration.
The fact is that this game was probably not envisioned to allow everyone who would like to play to be able to play. I would like to buy and drive a Porsche, but I cant afford one. I dont complain that Porsche should drop the price for me.
I dont go to football, basketball or baseball games. I dont think they are worth the price.
Why would anyone play if it is not worth the price to them?
This game exists to make money. Without a decent return on the investment at some point, it would cease to exist.
It would be great if Bill Gates put out a free sim, let all who want to play have somewhere to fly. But HT and Pyro are not multibillionaires that I know of.
I do kinda wonder, how is it someone can afford a very good computer (required for AH), pay for an ISP, have the free time to play, and yet not have one dollar a day to play the game?
Would I like them to drop the price, sure.
Do I think they should? No, not if it endangers the long term viability of HTC.
Enough rambling
Dago
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Damn Dago, that's just about right. Spring is coming, here comes the golf, jetski, and 3D Bow shooting seasons, not to mention going to Nascar Races. As if upgrading the computer every January isnt enough!
Sure, you guys can quote the $1 a day company line...
There aint no AH pom poms shredding in my beer. AH is a stable huge multiplayer WWII combat sim for dirt cheap, that's just a fact. No matter how you slice it up, it's $1 per day to keep a account. They make the game, promote it the best they know how, and provide a server I can play on. I give em $30/month in return. Peroid.
Anything else regarding the pay options are covered in the link to pyro's explanation, specifically the argument that more people = equally more profit.(heh, I forgot all about Badger btw... )
Also Lepaul, no one that "loves" AH will balk at paying for it. No way. (unless in fact they have absolutley no liquid entertainment assets, and that's possible I guess. That's to say I love playing Aces High 200 hours/ month for $15, but will not play it at all for $30? Hmmmm.
I've also shown AH to plenty of people and although they thought it was really neat, they hadn't a clue what a hardcore sim was and wouldn't pay if even it was $7 a month. They were happy as hell playing Diablo, CFS2, and Crimsons Skies all day long though. Now how HTC attracts these customers, I don't know. Pricing options perhaps. Gameplay additions like Autotakeoff, Combat Trim, padlock etc..?
I must say I don't know crap about marketing or the software business or any of that, but you gotta realise your arguing just that with HTC. The very company that has built this whole deal, and I think even had alot to do with another successful sim, WBS.
Ya might want to put a little more faith in their decison making, that's all.
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Ditto. I think it's too high. I'm paying more for the game per month than for my month Internet provider! That just seems out of whack. The code is done, it's just support now. I was very hestitant to pay $30/mo and still am thinking of bailing out. I think it should be comparable with an internet provider. That's what most people are use to paying for something online. And, it's more expensive than almost all online games. There's a simple business model. Lower the price and you make up the difference by selling MORE of the product. They might even make more money by bringing on new players which exceed the difference lost from paying a higher price. At least, OFFER a lower rate of say $15/mo for 20 hrs online and $1.50 for each hour there after. Then the choice is up to you if you want to pay more.
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(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
$30bux is just about where one can brake even and be able to support this type of project with set number people. You have to factor the cost of development, network connection and servers. Now if they were to lower their price they would get more people in, that is correct but $10bux-$15bux a month would not even come close to cover the cost of support and network connection per user. So in turn they would have to bleed the companies fund or give you guy’s lower support and bad connections.
Plus the way one should look at this is you are basically paying for box game that is on sale at best buys every month. Rather then taking the chance on some new single player or limited user network player game, which now days lots of times turn out to be crappy, and buggy cause they had to push it out the door. You are buying a game you like and you enjoy every month. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) Plus the price tag tends to keep general cheap A**holes (pardon my French) away! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
The resaon FA can give it away for 10bux a month has nothing to do with making a profit. They really don’t have too, the network they are on is owned by MSN. So they don’t have to worry about paying for there connection. If they were to split that up and make zone its own company and have them pay for there connection and support you would be see much bigger price tag of there games! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Ali "AliWooD" Bokaiyan
President, CEO of HotRodsystem.com
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AKA StäRmäN
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I don't want all of the world just your half :)
www.hotrodsystem.com
www.games2.com
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Dago, Creamo and Starman covered it oh so very well.
<S> to you all who know WTF your talking about. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
-Westy
(even at $10/mo at FA, AW and also in the WWII Online web boadrs there are hordes of "poepl" who squeak and moan that they have to pay anything at all)
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SpitLead said:"The code is done"
Evidently you do not know HiTech and Company very well....the code is never done, and they continue to give us upgrades, a fair price IMO for the excellent customer service alone, let alone the continuous upgrades.
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HTC dont lower the price too much!
AH is infested with too much low class riff raff as it is.
Hell! Raise the price to to $2 an hour to get rid of some of these smelly punk dweebs! Send em packin back to AW and FA where they can piss and swim in their own water.
Thnx,
Yeager (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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I guess I am the riff raff.. I'd also be here if the price didn't work out to over $50 CDN per month.
(nose pressed against the glass)
TS
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Aw jeez, Not the old "the price will keep all the dweebs out"
Look at all the fuggheads who are here, I think you could raise the price to $100/hr, and we would still see DipS**ts flying.
Elitist my hairy Houdini! I think HTC should give people a discount for having to put up with some of ya.
Oh, and for the cunning rebuttal to be,
Bite me
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I pay 21 english pounds a months to stay up and till silly times in the morning to play this game with my squad mates i am happy as toejam. Tired all the time but happy. Lower it keep it the same who gives a toejam. If you can't afford to play it. Stop whining and look for a cheaper imitation of AH and BUG them with you moans and groans about prices and this plane that plane this gun and that. You are like old moaning women.
[This message has been edited by NHMadmax (edited 02-07-2001).]