Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: curry1 on April 03, 2014, 10:21:27 PM
-
Does anyone know what that is on the rear canopy of the Phantom? I've never seen it before and would be interested if anyone had any knowledge on what it might be.
(http://i.imgur.com/9DSCtWp.jpg)
-
Does anyone know what that is on the rear canopy of the Phantom? I've never seen it before and would be interested if anyone had any knowledge on what it might be.
(http://i.imgur.com/9DSCtWp.jpg)
Explosive cord to shatter the canopy upon ejection initiation?
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5b/Red.arrows.closeup.arp.jpg/800px-Red.arrows.closeup.arp.jpg)
-
That's what is, explosive to break the canopy, otherwise you would seriously injure the pilot and REO (and I doubt their helmets would be able to break the canopy, likely they would break their cervical spines and end up dead).
-
Explosive cord to shatter the canopy upon ejection initiation?
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5b/Red.arrows.closeup.arp.jpg/800px-Red.arrows.closeup.arp.jpg)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ejection_seat (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ejection_seat) Aircraft designed for low-level use sometimes have ejection seats which fire through the canopy, as waiting for the canopy to be ejected is too slow. Many aircraft types (e.g., the BAE Hawk and the Harrier line of aircraft) use Canopy Destruct systems, which have an explosive cord (MDC - Miniature Detonation Cord or FLSC - Flexible Linear Shaped Charge) embedded within the acrylic plastic of the canopy. The MDC is initiated when the eject handle is pulled, and shatters the canopy over the seat a few milliseconds before the seat is launched. This system was developed for the Hawker Siddeley Harrier family of VTOL aircraft as ejection may be necessary while the aircraft was in the hover, and jettisoning the canopy might result in the pilot and seat striking it. This system is also used in the T-6 Texan II.
-
I've never seen an F-4 with that det cord system and can't find another pic with it on an F-4. Not to mention it isn't on the pilot's canopy. Also it seems to be tinted inside the area. I don't think it is what it is even though it was at first my original thought as well.
-
That's what is, explosive to break the canopy, otherwise you would seriously injure the pilot and REO (and I doubt their helmets would be able to break the canopy, likely they would break their cervical spines and end up dead).
GOOOOOOSSSSEEEE!!!!! :uhoh
-
I've had a good look and cannot find another picture of this in a rear canopy, except in other Thunderbirds F4's.
I was wondering whether it was some for of sun screen or maybe a form of visual reference for use in formation flying :headscratch:
-
I've had a good look and cannot find another picture of this in a rear canopy, except in other Thunderbirds F4's.
I was wondering whether it was some for of sun screen or maybe a form of visual reference for use in formation flying :headscratch:
I had the same experience trying to look for info on it as well.
-
Actually just found out what it was from a Facebook group apparently it is an ADF antenna used for getting music and radio on long cross country flights. The Blue Angels had them installed on their Phantoms as well.
-
Would've loved to have seen the Blue Angels or Thunderbirds when they flew F-4's.
-
Would've loved to have seen the Blue Angels or Thunderbirds when they flew F-4's.
Or even better the Thud.
(http://i.imgur.com/FDY7a9M.jpg)
-
Or even better the Thud.
I was fortunate to see them flying the 105s, back in my ute.
It was impressive.
- oldman
-
I saw, and heard, F4s till I was almost sick of seeing them. They were still the primary Jabo in USAF/NATO in my day. Tho we were getting F15s I never saw one in my service. The Turks flew a lot of F-104s around, now that was a cool airplane.
-
Or even better the Thud.
(http://i.imgur.com/FDY7a9M.jpg)
I do love the Thud.... I spent years flying off of carriers and land bases. No jet engine I ever heard came close to the J-75 in the F-105. Sounded much less impressive in the F-106. Beats me as to why...
Watch and listen for yourselves....
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=756207857737358&set=o.57289657667&type=2&theater (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=756207857737358&set=o.57289657667&type=2&theater)
-
I saw and heard a lot of F-4's in my day as well. Serviced, launched, recovered and turned a lot of wrenches on them too, so I have a bit of a soft spot for the Phantom. I was a jet engine mechanic and we would do ground maintenance engine runs pretty regularly. Will never ever forget having to get up close and personal to leak check something on the engine with the afterburner engaged. Loud is not the word and the ground literally shakes. Was lucky enough to get to do the engine runs too.
Never had the pleasure of seeing or hearing a 105, but I was stationed on a base that had a squadron of 106's. Beautiful airplane.
-
I saw and heard a lot of F-4's in my day as well. Serviced, launched, recovered and turned a lot of wrenches on them too, so I have a bit of a soft spot for the Phantom. I was a jet engine mechanic and we would do ground maintenance engine runs pretty regularly. Will never ever forget having to get up close and personal to leak check something on the engine with the afterburner engaged. Loud is not the word and the ground literally shakes. Was lucky enough to get to do the engine runs too.
Never had the pleasure of seeing or hearing a 105, but I was stationed on a base that had a squadron of 106's. Beautiful airplane.
The F-105 was and still is one of the most amazing fighter/bombers ever flown. During the Vietnam war, 75% of bombing missions over the north were flown by the F-105. The roughly 730 Thuds deployed flew over 260,000 sorties, and dropped 2.3 million tons of bombs and rockets. That's more than the entire USAAF dropped in the whole of WWII. They shot down 28 MiGs, 25 of them with guns. The Navy's claim that the F-8E was the "last of the gunfighters" was baloney. F-8s shot down just 3 MiGs with guns. One F-105 was credited with 3 kills. The one in the USAF museum today, shot down 2.
-
I do love the Thud.... I spent years flying off of carriers and land bases. No jet engine I ever heard came close to the J-75 in the F-105. Sounded much less impressive in the F-106. Beats me as to why...
Watch and listen for yourselves....
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=756207857737358&set=o.57289657667&type=2&theater (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=756207857737358&set=o.57289657667&type=2&theater)
That's a great sound. I bet that cool whistling has something to do with their unique shape of their intakes.
-
The Navy's claim that the F-8E was the "last of the gunfighters" was baloney. F-8s shot down just 3 MiGs with guns.
In all fairness it was the last of the Navy's gun fighters, because it's replacement, the F-4B and J had no internal gun. :)
-
Would've loved to have seen the Blue Angels or Thunderbirds when they flew F-4's.
It was awesome. :D
-
Indeed!
-
I do love the Thud.... I spent years flying off of carriers and land bases. No jet engine I ever heard came close to the J-75 in the F-105. Sounded much less impressive in the F-106. Beats me as to why...
Watch and listen for yourselves....
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=756207857737358&set=o.57289657667&type=2&theater (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=756207857737358&set=o.57289657667&type=2&theater)
Ah, but a flight of four "Sixes" coming up initial at 500kts plus had a sound that made everyone on base turn and see what was coming. :salute
(http://i906.photobucket.com/albums/ac270/puma44/39b6e753e2037bfe9a44ec1a94a0ac8a_zpsabd41b1d.jpg)
(http://i906.photobucket.com/albums/ac270/puma44/028f73f9efbee778a8a16d0e1eba537f_zps2f5095cf.jpg)
or maybe a form of visual reference for use in formation flying :headscratch:
The reference in the F-4 was "wingtip in the star". In clear air the forward wing tip was the point. In thick clouds, the rear wing tip was uses to assure additional nose tail clearance if it got bumpy, spatial D set in, or a combination of all the above.
-
Ah, but a flight of four "Sixes" coming up initial at 500kts plus had a sound that made everyone on base turn and see what was coming. :salute
(http://i906.photobucket.com/albums/ac270/puma44/39b6e753e2037bfe9a44ec1a94a0ac8a_zpsabd41b1d.jpg)
(http://i906.photobucket.com/albums/ac270/puma44/028f73f9efbee778a8a16d0e1eba537f_zps2f5095cf.jpg)
The reference in the F-4 was "wingtip in the star". In clear air the forward wing tip was the point. In thick clouds, the rear wing tip was uses to assure additional nose tail clearance if it got bumpy, spatial D set in, or a combination of all the above.
Good info, Thanks :salute
-
Any time. Glad to help. :salute
-
If anybody is interested in F-105 history I can recommend Ed Rasimus' When Thunder Rolled: An F-105 Pilot Over North Vietnam - ISBN 978-0-89141-854-2 - Presidio Press (September 28, 2004) (Hardcover edition, January 2003, Smithsonian Institution Press).
I even stumbled upon a Youtube video showing him returning from his first tour's last mission which was a huge event for him. I hope he saw it somewhere.
He passed away last year.
-C+
-
Here's a Thunderbird F-105 performing the "dead ant maneuver".... This never made it into the show....
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/t31.0-8/1898475_10203726188583773_30032526_o.jpg)
-
(http://www.fighterpilotuniversity.com/files/6313/0591/0036/FU105DMichaelFreer.jpg)
Thud driver music....
http://www.fighterpilotuniversity.com/music-and-theater/songs/i-m-a-thud-pilot/ (http://www.fighterpilotuniversity.com/music-and-theater/songs/i-m-a-thud-pilot/)
-
Didn't an F-105 break up catastrophically at an airshow, and that put an end to the F-105 being the plane of choice for the Thunderbirds?
-
Didn't an F-105 break up catastrophically at an airshow, and that put an end to the F-105 being the plane of choice for the Thunderbirds?
"Thunderbird Two, Air Force serial number 57-5801, had been involved in an air-refueling incident. During an aborted hook-up attempt, turbulence dragged and pounded a drogue basket into the fuselage, damaging the aircraft's spine. The damage to the spine was repaired, but no direct evidence was uncovered that this incident caused a defect or weakness in the fuselage. But the suspicion remains that there may have been some connection between this, and the untimely destruction of Thunderbird Two."
No other Thud suffered a similar failure, even after being severely damaged in combat....
-
(http://www.f-16.net/forum/download/file.php?id=9747&mode=view)
-
(http://www.f-16.net/forum/download/file.php?id=9747&mode=view)
Great photo,
but I must be getting old. All I can think of is how did he take that at the most critical point of a planes takeoff. The preceived immortality of youth I guess
or was it a twin seat plane?
-
Great photo,
but I must be getting old. All I can think of is how did he take that at the most critical point of a planes takeoff. The preceived immortality of youth I guess
or was it a twin seat plane?
It was most likely taken by the back seater in the Wild Weasel lead jet. There's no way the pilot would have been taking pictures during a formation takeoff. His priority is flying a smooth, stable platform for the wingman. :salute
-
Looks like an RTB to me. No AB on and bomb rack attached without ordnance. The picture is likely taken from a F-100 WW because the landing incidence is smaller and there does not seem to be wing slats.
-C+
Ed. Two seat F-100F does have wing slats...
-
Thanks Puma, Charge.
-
Looks like an RTB to me. No AB on and bomb rack attached without ordnance. The picture is likely taken from a F-100 WW because the landing incidence is smaller and there does not seem to be wing slats.
-C+
Ed. Two seat F-100F does have wing slats...
More than likely not an F-100 of any type. The USAF was adamant about NOT flying dissimilar formations under any but the most dire emergency, especially a dissimilar formation takeoff or landing. From the photo, it's hard to tell if flaps are extended indicating a landing. Not sure if the THUD used any flap extension for takeoff. The lack of visible AB is insignificant. Maybe it's not visible from the viewing angle or they were light enough weight to not need it. Anyone with actual Thud time that can elaborate?
-
In my book recommendation Rasimus tells about his F-105 flights with F-100 WWs because it took some time to get F-105 WWs.
I recall that it was not too easy as the cruise speed of WW loaded F-100 is lower than that of loaded F-105 so the F-105 had to constantly throttle to keep in formation.
Of course they did not need operate from the same fields and I cannot say why they did such a formation landing, if it even is an F-100, that is.
-C+
-
In my book recommendation Rasimus tells about his F-105 flights with F-100 WWs because it took some time to get F-105 WWs.
I recall that it was not too easy as the cruise speed of WW loaded F-100 is lower than that of loaded F-105 so the F-105 had to constantly throttle to keep in formation.
Of course they did not need operate from the same fields and I cannot say why they did such a formation landing, if it even is an F-100, that is.
-C+
F-100F Weasels were the first Weasels. Four initially deployed and final total of 7 were converted and deployed. 5 were lost. Because the F-100F was too slow to keep up with the F-105s, it was decided to convert F-105F two-seaters to WW platforms. Those converted were later redesignated as the F-105G. There were no new G models built, all were converted F models.
Wild Weasel YGBSM (You Gotta Be Sh##tting Me).
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/66/Wild_Weasels_patch.jpg/465px-Wild_Weasels_patch.jpg)
F-100 Wild Weasel video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUW9_RWqsWk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUW9_RWqsWk)
F-100 and F-105 Wild Weasel videos
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TBpswks2f8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TBpswks2f8)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWGvHe-1aHc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWGvHe-1aHc)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUW9_RWqsWk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUW9_RWqsWk)
-
In my book recommendation Rasimus tells about his F-105 flights with F-100 WWs because it took some time to get F-105 WWs.
I recall that it was not too easy as the cruise speed of WW loaded F-100 is lower than that of loaded F-105 so the F-105 had to constantly throttle to keep in formation.
Of course they did not need operate from the same fields and I cannot say why they did such a formation landing, if it even is an F-100, that is.
-C+
Regardless, TAC would not allow dissimilar take offs or landings. There was/is no tactical advantage to it in addition to differences in performance speeds, wing loading, etc. It's a matter of risk vs benefit. No TAC commander could justify it in the event of an accident.
-
It's a take off run, photo shot from the backseat of an F-105G....
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/t31.0-8/901269_10201036565430418_3182255680236645961_o.jpg)
-
Good reference Widewing. :aok. Where did you find the article?
-
Good reference Widewing. :aok. Where did you find the article?
The author... Via Facebook.
That's a 12,000 ft runway at Hill AFB. Note the tire marks, meaning they used all of the runway. Author said, AB with water was needed on a hot day at 4,900 feet ASL....
-
The author... Via Facebook.
That's a 12,000 ft runway at Hill AFB. Note the tire marks, meaning they used all of the runway. Author said, AB with water was needed on a hot day at 4,900 feet ASL....
Good stuff, thanks! Years ago, a Thud passed thru Holloman AFB for a fuel stop. The fueler, obviously unfamiliar with the Thud, filled the water reservoir with JP-4. Wait for it.........when the pilot selected water on takeoff the resulting explosion blew the tail off the jet.
-
Good stuff, thanks! Years ago, a Thud passed thru Holloman AFB for a fuel stop. The fueler, obviously unfamiliar with the Thud, filled the water reservoir with JP-4. Wait for it.........when the pilot selected water on takeoff the resulting explosion blew the tail off the jet.
:rofl
Not that it's funny but it sort of is! Reminds me of the time my Dad put gas in his diesel benz...... :bhead
:salute
-
Nothing sounds like the J-75 in a Thud. Unless it's 24 of them....
A Facebook link... Turn up the volume.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=767806776577466&set=o.57289657667&type=3&theater (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=767806776577466&set=o.57289657667&type=3&theater)
-
Now that was a beautiful sight and sound. Too bad they couldn't have been cooking along another 100 knots faster. :D. :salute
:airplane:
-
Good stuff, thanks! Years ago, a Thud passed thru Holloman AFB for a fuel stop. The fueler, obviously unfamiliar with the Thud, filled the water reservoir with JP-4. Wait for it.........when the pilot selected water on takeoff the resulting explosion blew the tail off the jet.
That would of been a surprised pilot
-
What exactly was the purpose for the water injection? Was it also used on the F-106?
-
What exactly was the purpose for the water injection? Was it also used on the F-106?
Water injection provided more thrust. The "Six" didn't have water injection. It did have a hard burner light off. There was no doubt that a 106 was taking off when the burner lit. It was a very robust explosive sound that rattled windows all over base.
(http://i906.photobucket.com/albums/ac270/puma44/1602a03c08a1440b2a9a166eabc128d6_zps74cf471e.jpg)
-
It did have a hard burner light off.
Other than some sort of preverted party idea....WTF is a hard burner light off?
- oldman
-
Other than some sort of preverted party idea....WTF is a hard burner light off?
- oldman
The six AB lit off all at once kinda like tossing a bucket of gas on your campfire.....WHOOSHBANG all at once vs most other AB equiped jets that lit off in a graduated manner. Still very noisy when lit off, just not the intial BANG. Otherwise know as a soft lite vs a hard lite. Note the burner shrouds on this F-4. In MIL power they would be closed down making the exhaust opening smaller in diameter. With the burner lit, the shrouds would modulate as the pilot selected a range of power between MIN and MAX AB.
(http://i906.photobucket.com/albums/ac270/puma44/2cc9aaf510dd21cbbb3ccfc669a97a8b_zpsa101cc5a.jpg) (http://s906.photobucket.com/user/puma44/media/2cc9aaf510dd21cbbb3ccfc669a97a8b_zpsa101cc5a.jpg.html)