Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: Coalcat1 on May 04, 2014, 07:28:17 AM
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The HE 162 was a late war German jet, first seeing action in April 1945. In the short time it operated, it scored quite a few kills, including at least one tempest if I remember correctly(could have been a spit 16). It was operated on a squadron level within JG1. The losses of 162s within JG1 where fairly low, 13 AC lost with 10 pilots killed, many lost due to engine failure or the 162 running out of fuel. The 162 could go 470mph on the deck, and weighed less than 4,410lbs. If added to the game, maybe perk it between the Tempest and 262. And ofcourse, here's a picture of this pretty bird.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c8/He162_color010.jpg)
Taken post war of a captured 162 in the US.
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+1
I'd like to see it added, but not before some non-perked and more needed aircraft :aok
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I agree, it's not that high on the list of AC to be added, but it would make a good addition.
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Oh, I forgot to mention the two armerment packages, 2 mk108s with 50 rounds per gun and 2 mg151 20mms with 100 rounds each.
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Oh, I forgot to mention the two armerment packages, 2 mk108s with 5 rounds per gun and 2 mg151 20mms with 100 rounds each.
I believe you meant 50rpg on the Mk108. AFAIK only the prototypes carried the Mk108, being replaced in the production version A-2 with Mg-151/20 with 120rpg. The Mk108 was too much for the wooden fuselage!
It'd really be an interesting addition. The Mg-151/20 wouldn't give a huge volume of fire at the approach speeds it would reach, so it would be quite challenging to fly. It's a really, really light aircraft with amazing climb but short range. As you said, I could see it perked between the Tempest and the 262.
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It's a really, really light aircraft with amazing climb but short range.
In the MA, endurance would be about 15 minutes...
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In the MA, endurance would be about 15 minutes...
You're right, it couldn't be much more than a point defence interceptor like the Komet, but with worse climb and armament. I know the Jumo 004 is quite economic when throttled back and you can cruise at high alt a bit, but I don't know about the fuel consumption of the BMW 003 at low throttle settings.
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In the MA, endurance would be about 15 minutes...
Yes I know, but look at the 262, has "21min" of fuel for 5 min...
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I think we have too many jets as it is.
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I think we have too many jets as it is.
We only have the 262, we need the meteor MkIII and the 162 to have a compleat set of WW2 jets.
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Ar234 is also a jet.
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Also a German jet. I'd hold off adding more unless Dale decides to add a 1946 arena.
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We only have the 262, we need the meteor MkIII and the 162 to have a compleat set of WW2 jets.
And that one is too many.
The only thing a jet is used for is picking. I'd rather my fights end because one guy out fought the other not because some bozo was buzzing around in a jet. Bring a jet to fight the pickers and they all run. They just are not worth the time and effort to add to the game.
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It would be a nice addition, but not as effective as a 262, F4U4 or tempest.
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And that one is too many.
The only thing a jet is used for is picking. I'd rather my fights end because one guy out fought the other not because some bozo was buzzing around in a jet. Bring a jet to fight the pickers and they all run. They just are not worth the time and effort to add to the game.
No, 262s are with the 3 best bomber killers, the 152 at 1, the 163 at 2, and the 262 at 3
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Ar234 is also a jet.
Meant jet fighters...
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Also a German jet. I'd hold off adding more unless Dale decides to add a 1946 arena.
How is the He-162 a 1946 fighter? It was in service in 1945.
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It's not like I'm asking for the F86 or MiG15...
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It's not like I'm asking for the F86 or MiG15...
You're becoming unglued Coalcat1 :old:
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How is the He-162 a 1946 fighter? It was in service in 1945.
How's the B-17 a 1945 bomber? It was in service in 1941.
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It's not like I'm asking for the F86 or MiG15...
Which would be cool if Dale had a Korean arena. :)
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Which would be cool if Dale had a Korean arena. :)
He'll yea, that would be awesome :D
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He'll yea, that would be awesome :D
Panthers off of CVs.
The uphill battle a Korean arena would face is the UN side having lots of jets to model (even though the Mig is arguably the best piece of equipment).
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Which would be cool if Dale had a Korean arena. :)
They already have an F86 modelled
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If I was asking for a 1946 AC, I would ask for the HE-162D, with forward swept wings and a "V" tail that would be able to kill Korean War fighters, due to a speed nearly the same as the F86. Or better yet, the FW-183 high alt. jet that was designed to kill B29s and B32s with the X2 wire guided A to A missile. Or my HO-229 flying wing :D But am I asking for these, no. So can we please get back on topic?
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Which would be cool if Dale had a Korean arena. :)
Yes I agree, this would be great in about 5 years or so, but I would rather have them finish WW2 first. I think in about 5 years HTC could start to creat this, by then being able to have modeled a few new planes and updateing the ones that need them.
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Yes I agree, this would be great in about 5 years or so, but I would rather have them finish WW2 first. I think in about 5 years HTC could start to creat this, by then being able to have modeled a few new planes and updateing the ones that need them.
<Boing!> Wish granted. They should complete the entire WWII plane and vehicle sets, just a few decades from now.
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-1, The last thing we need are more late war german uber planes.
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-1, The last thing we need are more late war german uber planes.
162 is seriously not uber.
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162 is seriously not uber.
491 mph on the deck and 3,300 to 4,600 ft/min ... seems indeed quite average for the MA.
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Wonder how well the glue will hold is parts inplace
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Wonder how well the glue will hold is parts inplace
Built quality ain't really modeled in AH. We also don't have late war 109's of varying (degraded) build quality.
It may be somewhat more susceptible to combat damage (and the engine as vulnerable as the Me 262's one), but that's about it.
To prevent any misunderstanding, this is not a plea for the inclusion of the 162 ;)
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Well, it did reach squadron service so why not? With only 2 MG151s and single engine would be a challenge to be successful with it.
+1
<S> - Hetz
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Built quality ain't really modeled in AH. We also don't have late war 109's of varying (degraded) build quality.
It may be somewhat more susceptible to combat damage (and the engine as vulnerable as the Me 262's one), but that's about it.
As an experienced AH Ki-84 pilot I beg to differ.
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As an experienced AH Ki-84 pilot I beg to differ.
The King Tiger we have, is flawless - unlike what was coming out of the factories in late 1944/1945. Shady welding, cracks in the armor - Engines that simply couldn't put out enough horsepower to keep King Tigers going for 10 miles straight without breaking down, yet in Aces we have a Tiger with perfect armor, can drive across any terrain without breaking down.
As for the HE-162, it shoudl be made the same way - I can see the durability being quite good, mostly made of wood. However the biggest problem is the engine being mounted so obvious, it wouldn't take much to put a He-162 out of action, think of how easy an Me-262 gets an oil leak, imagine having that engine mounted on the top rear where most deflection shots are going to hit?
HE-162 will make a nice boom and zoom fighter, if you get caught its going to be easy to shoot down. Thus being said, it depends again on the pilot - used correctly its 15 minute "Fuel" timer in the Main arena would be extended to 25-30 minutes climbing to alt and using cruise speed.
The only question I have is, there were only 1-2 kills with the HE-162, The squadron in service - did not have any gas to fly any combat sorties, does it make the cut to being added to Aces? no more then the Pershing tank does, but both can still be added.
It would get added in my opinion, however its so down on the list, I would put the Panzer II above it.
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... however its so down on the list, I would put the Panzer II above it.
And I'd put M3 Stuart before the Panzer II (we could go on and on). Which is why this project could wait until Dale decides to work on a '1946/SWOTL' arena. :D
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And I'd put M3 Stuart before the Panzer II (we could go on and on). Which is why this project could wait until Dale decides to work on a '1946/SWOTL' arena. :D
Problem is Arlo, the He-162 flew in combat in World war two and in squadron strength. I believe if you look 6 years back I posted the info on the He-162 back then, maybe even 8 years ago.
Its not a 1946 fighter sorry, it flew in combat during WW2 - different then a 1946 arena.
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Problem is Arlo, the He-162 flew in combat in World war two and in squadron strength. I believe if you look 6 years back I posted the info on the He-162 back then, maybe even 8 years ago.
Its not a 1946 fighter sorry, it flew in combat during WW2 - different th(a)n a 1946 arena.
Problem?
Butcher, `ol boy, I haven't once claimed that there wasn't a 162 squadron in 1945. What I'm saying, again, is that it's a waste of time to model .... unless HTC decides to feature a 1946 arena. In other words, there's over a decade worth of work concerning other toys that actually played more of a significant role in the real war than the 162 (this includes other aircraft, ground vehicles, ships). I played SWOTL years ago. If HT ever wants to feature that environment as an arena then the 162 might be a worthy project, though it would still be overshadowed in such a fantasy/what if environment by other German (and Allied) jets. Heck, Dale could even populate hangars with other 1945 (`44 or `43 for that matter) non-jet aircraft that are already modeled. :)
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They already have an F86 modelled
Why stop there? We all know damn well that next up would be phantom versus mig-21, 19, and 17 while thuds fire bull pups on some facsimile of the Dragon's Jaw... I'll take a nice F-5e, thank you, or perhaps an A-4 Skyhawk.
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Why stop there? We all know damn well that next up would be phantom versus mig-21, 19, and 17 while thuds fire bull pups on some facsimile of the Dragon's Jaw... I'll take a nice F-5e, thank you, or perhaps an A-4 Skyhawk.
Hey, there ain't no good nam sims out there +1!
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Ok,let's get back on topic before skuzzy decides to lock the thread due to us getting off topic...
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Problem?
Dale could even populate hangars with other 1945 (`44 or `43 for that matter) non-jet aircraft that are already modeled. :)
Just pointing out the He-162 served in WWII not 1946, requirements for Aces high is to of been in combat service. We wouldn't need a 1946 Arena for it. And I agree - many other aircraft need to come first, however we don't have to rule out the He-162 :)
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You're becoming unglued Coalcat1 :old:
Wonder how well the glue will hold is parts inplace
Bit too subtle was I? :lol
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I think we have too many jets as it is.
Hear, hear!
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I don't understand how two jets it "too many". :old:
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are*
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I don't understand how two jets it "too many". :old:
Jet fighters ruin furballs when they show up.
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Jet fighters ruin furballs when they show up.
Ok, as Fugitive said, I'm assuming you think this because they pick fighters in the mix.
Well, sure, they do…but listen, are 262's expected to get into complex ACM maneuvers with fighters in the area? Isn't that the last thing a 262 pilot would want to do? They were built to attack bombers and escape allied escorts using speed, they weren't built to fight. So what a 262 pilot wants to do, is speed in, kill, and get the hell out as fast as possible. AKA picking to get kills, and running to live.
Besides this, about 3/4ths of the people who enter the cockpit don't know how to fly the aircraft correctly or just can't hit squat, and will kill maybe only 2 people in 30mins. And because of this, it's got more bark than bite, and people on those furballs just freak out and all eyes go on the 262. Then ya have people leaving the fight to pursue, and ppl lose their SA to HO.
Overall, what I'm trying to say, saying jets "ruin" furballs isn't a valid reason to not add anymore jet fighters in the game.
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What furballs?
The age of the furball is long gone. These days it's just a derogative term for a base capture attempt that doesn't succeeed within 5 minutes or a desperate base defense ("you guys are just furballing over there, worthless")
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What furballs?
The age of the furball is long gone. These days it's just a derogative term for a base capture attempt that doesn't succeeed within 5 minutes or a desperate base defense ("you guys are just furballing over there, worthless")
And it makes some of us sick
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Why stop there? We all know damn well that next up would be phantom versus mig-21, 19, and 17 while thuds fire bull pups on some facsimile of the Dragon's Jaw... I'll take a nice F-5e, thank you, or perhaps an A-4 Skyhawk.
(http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww247/Glendinho/f86_2_zpse27ba6df.jpg) (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/Glendinho/media/f86_2_zpse27ba6df.jpg.html)
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And that one is too many.
The only thing a jet is used for is picking. I'd rather my fights end because one guy out fought the other not because some bozo was buzzing around in a jet. Bring a jet to fight the pickers and they all run. They just are not worth the time and effort to add to the game.
How do you separate who is a "fighter" and who is a "picker" in a giant furball? Do all the planes square off and fight individual duels to the finish? Is the separation by proximity, I.E. the first planes to come within 2K of each other lock into the dogfight? Or is it by plane type, all the Spits at the fight square off with Spits, all the Ponies at the fight square off with other Mustangs, Corsairs, 109s etc, the guy who brought a Ki-61 sits in the corner because he can't find a dance partner? I'm trying to understand the etiquette, help me out here.
How does one avoid picking? I haven't been able to find the check6 button for enemies. I've looked and looked through the key commands and still can't locate it.
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Jet fighters ruin furballs when they show up.
Jet fighters make everybody pay closer attention to their six o clock, and otherwise do little at furballs. Occasionally they pick someone off, unless it is some artist like Grizz flying them. The 262 is over-priced relative to what most can actually get out of it.
Now, bombers ACTUALLY ruin furballs, by ending every single one of them when some mug decides to toolshed the "pointless furball" or sink the carrier, but you scream anytime I suggest making them less powerful. In that regard, some hovering 262s could actually help extend the furball by picking off the buff formation, albeit many are understandably leery of risking over 100 perks with bomber laser-ack. Another reason to perk them a little lower.
And if adding late-war whizz bangs attracts more players, I'm all for it.
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BnZs, I love buff hunting near furballs in a 262 for just that reason. Fun police must die.
It really is an art form, an art I yet have to a satisfactory standard which lead me to land a 262 twice in an hour on 1 engine and with a wingtip missing.
150 perks is worth the risk, I love an unbalanced arena.
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BnZs, I love buff hunting near furballs in a 262 for just that reason. Fun police must die.
It really is an art form, an art I yet have to a satisfactory standard which lead me to land a 262 twice in an hour on 1 engine and with a wingtip missing.
:aok
150 perks is worth the risk, I love an unbalanced arena.
Is it? Almost anyone can up a C-Hog in the right spot and get a half dozen kills more easily while risking ~25, IMO. The 262's super power is that it can fly into any number of enemy and probably come out again, but it's not very lethal for most while doing so. I think ~100 might be more appropriate.
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I'll help.
The "etiquette" is subjective. People who play need to realize that this is a realistic game and that, much like chess, it doesn't exactly fit everyone's idea of fairness. Consider, for example, the fact that I'm a renaissance man and Zack is an hydrocephalic (kidding, Zack, you know I'm a flamer for you). Is that fair?No. You kill the enemy utilizing every advantage at your disposal. That IS the game. Also note: anyone who flies a ki-61 is well used to playing with themselves- GUARANTEED.
As for the laser ack:
The "right thing" to do, given tha strategic market position of the game as the most realistic/highest fidelity is to model the platform stability as accurately as possible. If that causes a game imbalance (eg, nobody wants to fly bombers any more because they can't enjoy unrealistic laser accuracy)you address that game imbalance by other means (eg, incentives) rather than by cutting the branch on which the game stands (realism).
This last point brings me to my favorite new evasive: the porpoise. If it is unsustainable for a human pilot, then that limit needs to be built into the game. Consider, for example, that we've got a built in red-out/black-out.
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:aok
Is it? Almost anyone can up a C-Hog in the right spot and get a half dozen kills more easily while risking ~25, IMO. The 262's super power is that it can fly into any number of enemy and probably come out again, but it's not very lethal for most while doing so. I think ~100 might be more appropriate.
200 as standard iust right, 100 and they'd be everywhere and much too numerous affecting gameplay too heavily.
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Allies used very well working tactics against them during WWII (ie diving on them at very high speed with the Mustang).
Those tactics also work fine in Aces High II : Use them (as i'm doing) and they're toasted... :cheers:
Jet fighters ruin furballs when they show up.
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(http://i724.photobucket.com/albums/ww247/Glendinho/f86_2_zpse27ba6df.jpg) (http://s724.photobucket.com/user/Glendinho/media/f86_2_zpse27ba6df.jpg.html)
That's beautiful Dolby :D
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Now, bombers ACTUALLY ruin furballs, by ending every single one of them when some mug decides to toolshed the "pointless furball" or sink the carrier, but you scream anytime I suggest making them less powerful. In that regard, some hovering 262s could actually help extend the furball by picking off the buff formation, albeit many are understandably leery of risking over 100 perks with bomber laser-ack. Another reason to perk them a little lower.
Lol, you really think any of that would increase furballs? Have we been playing the same game?
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Lol, you really think any of that would increase furballs? Have we been playing the same game?
I have been playing the game "Aces High II". Despite complaints to the contrary, fights exist whenever the population is large enough to support them. I have yet to see 262s "ruin" any furball, mostly they are a semi-non factor. I have seen many cases where an individual or several from one side ended a furball essentially "griefed" all the people who want to fight on BOTH sides by taking out the FHs or CV with bombers. More 262s in the air could substantially reduce the chances of doing this successfully.
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Really buffs need something important to do in the game besides toolshed. That would help a lot.
I'll help.
The "etiquette" is subjective. People who play need to realize that this is a realistic game and that, much like chess, it doesn't exactly fit everyone's idea of fairness. Consider, for example, the fact that I'm a renaissance man and Zack is an hydrocephalic (kidding, Zack, you know I'm a flamer for you). Is that fair?No. You kill the enemy utilizing every advantage at your disposal. That IS the game. Also note: anyone who flies a ki-61 is well used to playing with themselves- GUARANTEED.
As for the laser ack:
The "right thing" to do, given tha strategic market position of the game as the most realistic/highest fidelity is to model the platform stability as accurately as possible. If that causes a game imbalance (eg, nobody wants to fly bombers any more because they can't enjoy unrealistic laser accuracy)you address that game imbalance by other means (eg, incentives) rather than by cutting the branch on which the game stands (realism).
This last point brings me to my favorite new evasive: the porpoise. If it is unsustainable for a human pilot, then that limit needs to be built into the game. Consider, for example, that we've got a built in red-out/black-out.
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Anyway, back to the HE-162. Looks neat. A lighter wingloading than some prop planes. The two 20mm would be to the advantage of most pilots. Lack of a rear view and range would seem to be it's downfall. Maybe the fuel burn could hard-coded like that of the Me-163?
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If people continue to whine the 262 is only a bnz or picking aircraft, have never actually seen someone dogfight in one.
I know a few pilots that would agree, including one who lost an F4u-4 trying to dogfight my 262. Not saying Its a good idea, but when you know there are no planes coming in over 10k, an Me-262 can do a very nice job furballing at 375+.
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If people continue to whine the 262 is only a bnz or picking aircraft, have never actually seen someone dogfight in one.
I know a few pilots that would agree, including one who lost an F4u-4 trying to dogfight my 262. Not saying Its a good idea, but when you know there are no planes coming in over 10k, an Me-262 can do a very nice job furballing at 375+.
Somebody must be paying attention to that crazy older gent and his energy-maneuverability diagrams.