Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Hardware and Software => Topic started by: 1Cane on May 12, 2014, 11:58:59 AM
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I have a Samsung Sa350 that has quit working. It is a little over 3 1/2 years old. I've tried different cable connections , mini dvi ,hdmi and power supplies with no result. The best I can get the screen to do is say signal has been lost. I even hooked it up to the video player with no result. My other two screens are still working fine and I used their outlets on the troubled screen with no results. So my question is 3 1/2 years normal for a monitor?
The other problems I have been having with them is after six or 8 hours the Power Supply shuts off it is not really a big problem because all you have to do is turn it back on and it's good for another six or eight hours.
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There has been capacitor issues in the built-in power supplies of monitors. A qualified technician can easily fix it but he will charge one hour for it. The caps are relatively inexpensive.
There's other possible reasons, too. And yes, with bad luck 3 1/2 years may be normal for a monitor. Some of them have to be built on a Monday...
Bad caps can also be the reason behind your power supply issue.
WARNING! Don't open any power supply unless you're qualified. There can easily be lethal currencies inside!
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Which power supply is failing after 6-8 hours?
Bizman is correct about the caps and it can happen 3-4 years into the life of the hardware. Generally there will be 3-6 caps on the power section of the monitor that have swollen and failed. This happens often enough that it is actually an advantage to buy a quality soldering iron and replace the caps yourself, unless you have five thumbs on your hand. There will also be a larger capacitor on the same board that can bite pretty good, so you have to learn to either drain it, or avoid touching it because the discharge can be really painful. Draining one is basically attaching two probes with heavy gauge wire attached to a high voltage resistor. I would research it on the net rather than take advice off of a BBS< but it's not hard to do.
Total cost will be $12-20 if you buy over-priced parts. Economically you could do it for a few dollars by looking for caps at the wholesale houses online.
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Which power supply is failing after 6-8 hours?
Bizman is correct about the caps and it can happen 3-4 years into the life of the hardware. Generally there will be 3-6 caps on the power section of the monitor that have swollen and failed. This happens often enough that it is actually an advantage to buy a quality soldering iron and replace the caps yourself, unless you have five thumbs on your hand. There will also be a larger capacitor on the same board that can bite pretty good, so you have to learn to either drain it, or avoid touching it because the discharge can be really painful. Draining one is basically attaching two probes with heavy gauge wire attached to a high voltage resistor. I would research it on the net rather than take advice off of a BBS< but it's not hard to do.
Total cost will be $12-20 if you buy over-priced parts. Economically you could do it for a few dollars by looking for caps at the wholesale houses online.
I don't know about your country but it's illegal to give advice like that to anyone who is not a qualified electrician in many countries. DIY hobby like that can potentially get them killed, or their families killed.
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Its not illegal here.
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It's also not likely to get anyone killed.
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It's also not likely to get anyone killed.
Messing with power supply caps not likely to get a totally clueless amateur killed? :rofl There's very few things that could be more dangerous that you find in your own home.
Besides the risk of an instant electrocution that can happen through the remaining power charge in the capacitors even if you have unplugged the monitor, the home repair guy can botch up the repair so that the monitor catches fire quietly at 3am when people are sleeping.
Yeah, definately a safe thing.
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You're speaking straight out of a strong desire to be right, but you're wrong. The power side of a monitor is really not very dangerous, unless you're foolish enough to work on it while it is plugged in. Botching a job and causing a fire? Now that's paranoid delusion right there. We have discussed this very topic many times on the bbs here Ripley. There was even a tutorial written about it at one point. Try to keep up.
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By the way. . .
Here is an instructable on how to do this (don't try this if you live in Ripley's country):
http://www.instructables.com/id/Fix-Your-Monitor-Replacing-Capacitors/
A tutorial on overclockers on the same subject:
http://www.overclock.net/t/967253/monitor-repair-capacitor-replacement-tutorial
A shaky video on youtube where you can see exactly how things look inside during the operation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02uLSu1Jj5M
And there are thousands more sites with the same sort of thing out there.
Now if you find a capacitor marked 400V then I wouldn't touch it. 400V and 4700µF delivers 370 joules (this is from defibrillators) and can start or stop your heart. Is there one of those in your monitor? No. Probably you are in more danger of reacting to the shock of a capacitor and flinging the screwdriver in your hand at your pet dog and killing him.
Like I said, do some research about it and learn how it's done and if you don't feel comfortable doing it then just don't do it. But don't run around screaming the sky is falling and telling everyone how dangerous caps are. That's just goofy.
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You're speaking straight out of a strong desire to be right, but you're wrong. The power side of a monitor is really not very dangerous, unless you're foolish enough to work on it while it is plugged in. Botching a job and causing a fire? Now that's paranoid delusion right there. We have discussed this very topic many times on the bbs here Ripley. There was even a tutorial written about it at one point. Try to keep up.
As I said the caps can store a lethal current which can kill a person if he touches the mains side with both hands, enabling the current to pass through his heart. 0.1-0.2 milliamps is the most dangerous level.
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A lamp can also be used to discharge capacitors.
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can't use a lamp, if you use a lamp the power goes out. if the power goes out we have zombies on the streets.
but seriously if you live near Los Angeles I have 3 used monitors.
semp
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By the way. . .
Here is an instructable on how to do this (don't try this if you live in Ripley's country):
http://www.instructables.com/id/Fix-Your-Monitor-Replacing-Capacitors/
A tutorial on overclockers on the same subject:
http://www.overclock.net/t/967253/monitor-repair-capacitor-replacement-tutorial
A shaky video on youtube where you can see exactly how things look inside during the operation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02uLSu1Jj5M
And there are thousands more sites with the same sort of thing out there.
Now if you find a capacitor marked 400V then I wouldn't touch it. 400V and 4700µF delivers 370 joules (this is from defibrillators) and can start or stop your heart. Is there one of those in your monitor? No. Probably you are in more danger of reacting to the shock of a capacitor and flinging the screwdriver in your hand at your pet dog and killing him.
Like I said, do some research about it and learn how it's done and if you don't feel comfortable doing it then just don't do it. But don't run around screaming the sky is falling and telling everyone how dangerous caps are. That's just goofy.
I have done research and know for a fact that a layman should never attempt to fix an electrical device. The voltage rating of the capacitor for example tells absolutely nothing of the actual voltage it stores. Also you don't need a single 4700uF cap, power supplys have many smaller ones. If the monitor is non-led, it also has high voltage supply for the cold cathode lamp inside. Also it seems you never heard of electrical fires caused by bad soldering jobs or using wrong components in the wrong place?
The internet is full of instructions on how to blow fireworks in your ass, I guess that validates the stuff in your expert opinion :rofl
Oh, and btw if you manage to burn your house down make sure to send the claim to Chalenge because when the insurance inspector finds out the cause of the fire that burned down your house, they're going to refuse paying before you can say hello.
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I just put you on my squelch list Ripley, because I am now convinced you have nothing of substance to add to any thread. The history of my squelch list includes quite a few people that without exception inevitably met with PNG status. Good luck.
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While I was in tech school we studied electricity. I don't know how many micro frauds (I think I spelled it right uF is the symbol on a volt meter) but caps as you are talking about is capacitors I assume right? If so yes they can kill you. In bigger appliances absolutely. In a monitor I'm sure they are very small I wouldn't know. Nonetheless, the smallest amount of electricity can stop your heart though it's unlikely.
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can't use a lamp, if you use a lamp the power goes out. if the power goes out we have zombies on the streets.
but seriously if you live near Los Angeles I have 3 used monitors.
I have more than a dozen monitors in the house that have been upgraded with improved capacitors after the originals failed in the first three years. If you read through the articles online you will discover that there is a method to improve not only the quality but the lifespan of the caps, so your repair will not have to repeated for quite awhile. I use a Hakko soldering station with temperature control that cost something like $150. If all that I ever did was fix two monitors then it would have already paid for itself.
It's not voodoo or deadly dangerous as Ripley suggests. Humans have got a very solid handle on electrons and the basics are very easy to understand. I must give people more credit than some, because I believe anyone can do this type of fix. So, if anyone has a house that burns down I would scan the neighborhood for Ripley.
@Ace, it's obvious you have discovered that you are one of those people that should never try to do this yourself. Well done!
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Chalenge can accept the law suits then later when people get hurt by his advice :D
Untrained people have just no business even opening the power supply housing by themselves. If you don't know exactly what you're doing you can get in serious trouble. Chalenges advice is down right hazardous considering he just tells people to do stuff and then fails to tell about the risks and how to prepare for them, such as draining the capacitors before touching anything in the power supply.
If there are more of you like Chalenge, no wonder you make such hilarious home videos! :devil
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While I was in tech school we studied electricity. I don't know how many micro frauds (I think I spelled it right uF is the symbol on a volt meter) but caps as you are talking about is capacitors I assume right? If so yes they can kill you. In bigger appliances absolutely. In a monitor I'm sure they are very small I wouldn't know. Nonetheless, the smallest amount of electricity can stop your heart though it's unlikely.
Yes exactly, Chalenge is just plain dumb. He thinks because he learned to replace a couple of caps by reading teh internets he's a certified electrician now. A professional would never give advice like he does.
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I remember the old days when they used to say that if you build you own computer you ran the risk of burning your own house, building computers should be left to the professionals.
not saying changing capacitors is right or wrong. but learning is always good.
btw most of the house fires that were started by electronics were caused by electronics that were built by professionals. main thing is do your homework and understand the risks.
semp
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I remember the old days when they used to say that if you build you own computer you ran the risk of burning your own house, building computers should be left to the professionals.
not saying changing capacitors is right or wrong. but learning is always good.
btw most of the house fires that were started by electronics were caused by electronics that were built by professionals. main thing is do your homework and understand the risks.
semp
Building computers is not regulated and limited to professionals, electrical installations are. There's a defined difference between inserting standardized components into slots and replacing soldered components into a power supply. The first can at most damage the hardware, the latter can pose a life threat to the person and a fire hazard. A badly made solder can overheat and light the device on fire for example. I'm not saying it's very likely or that it happens every time even when you botch up a solder, but it has happened. And this is why you should leave this kind of stuff for professionals unless you get trained by someone who knows his stuff. And even then any work you do on an electric repair is at your own risk. You'll be responsible for any personal injury or property damage that results from it.
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I rewired a large portion of my house 20 years ago after reading books and building codes, never got any formal training, still waiting for the place to burn down.
shamus
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I rewired a large portion of my house 20 years ago after reading books and building codes, never got any formal training, still waiting for the place to burn down.
shamus
Heh, good luck with that. You're not the only one - but you void your insurance by doing so. Don't you have building codes where you live? No building inspections and stuff?
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Naw you don't void your insurance coverage. I also replace the brakes on my car and installed a new water heater not long ago, all without being licensed. Now if I do that kind of work for others, I have a problem.
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Naw you don't void your insurance coverage. I also replace the brakes on my car and installed a new water heater not long ago, all without being licensed. Now if I do that kind of work for others, I have a problem.
It seems that some states actually permit DIy electrical work, very surprising. In most countries they're totally illegal. http://charmeck.org/mecklenburg/county/CodeEnforcement/HomeownerElectrical/Pages/default.aspx But remember that the insurance companies will not leave a rock turned to be able to deny any claims.
Even the Mecklenburg county issues a warning though:
(http://charmeck.org/mecklenburg/county/CodeEnforcement/HomeownerElectrical/PublishingImages/attention.gif)
In the U.S., anyone, including the city issuing building permits, may face a civil liability lawsuit (be sued) for negligently creating a situation that results in loss of life or property. Those who fail to adhere to well known best practices for safety have been held negligent. This means that the city should adopt and enforce building codes that specify standards and practices for electrical systems (as well as other departments such as water and fuel-gas systems). This creates a system whereby a city can best avoid lawsuits by adopting a single, standard set of building code laws. This has led to the NEC becoming the de facto standard set of electrical requirements. A licensed electrician will have spent years of apprenticeship studying and practicing the NEC requirements prior to obtaining his or her license.
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rippley here in the USA you are allowed to build your own house even if you have no experience but it still gets inspected. just the same as if it built by a licensed contractor. and you have to meet the same codes.
you made a good point that you should think twice before working with electricity but you sometimes push it a bit to hard specially when it comes to laws in a country you don't live in.
semp
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For my fathers business we work on a lot of commercial equipment for restaurants. We are not licenses by the state. We don't have to be either. Our job involves a lot of electrical work. Granted, we are not working on wiring the building or touching anything from the breaker box to the road.
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rippley here in the USA you are allowed to build your own house even if you have no experience but it still gets inspected. just the same as if it built by a licensed contractor. and you have to meet the same codes.
you made a good point that you should think twice before working with electricity but you sometimes push it a bit to hard specially when it comes to laws in a country you don't live in.
semp
I agree. I just wanted to point out that it's not necessarily a smart idea to start fixing your electrical appliances if you lack even the basic knowledge of electronics.
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I'm calling horse hockey. There is no such law in your country.
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I saw a guy arc a 240VAC 35uf cap in class. I wasn't even looking his way and I still saw the big blue flash.
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I saw a guy arc a 240VAC 35uf cap in class. I wasn't even looking his way and I still saw the big blue flash.
Yup the charge in a cap can kill. Most people do not realize this, they think the appliance is safe once you unplug it. A potentially mortal mistake.
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Yeah. It stores electricity. The ones we mess with sometimes hold enough electricity to help start a 4,000 volt magnetron for a microwave at Mcdonalds. A man was killed at the factory class a long time ago.
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See Rules #2, #4
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Instead of relying on Chalenges Youtube certification videos:
http://www.physics.ohio-state.edu/~p616/safety/fatal_current.html
Leathal current is 0.1 - 0.2 amps. A cap can give easily a short burst of that.
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See Rule #2
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See Rule #2
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See Rules #2, #4
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See Rules #2, #4
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See Rules #2, #4
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Need capacitors in an emergency and you live in Finland? No problem! Digi-Key can help! Always helpful and available with friendly, courteous advice!
http://www.digikey.fi/
They also have a wide assortment of Uninterruptable Power Supplies to make sure your computing pleasure is non-stop!
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See Rule #2
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Need capacitors in an emergency and you live in Finland? No problem! Digi-Key can help! Always helpful and available with friendly, courteous advice!
http://www.digikey.fi/
Just to clarify one thing: Tinkering with electronics is fully legal for everyone here if the voltages are low enough: 50V AC or 120 V DC. Basically that allows repairing gadgets which are connected to a transformer such as a power supply. It is allowed to do minor mains powered electricity jobs, though, for example connecting a lamp to a screw terminal or replacing a broken wall outlet cover. Extreme caution is required by the law. Building and repairing hobby level electric devices is also allowed, but replacing caps inside a power unit doesn't fit into any of those categories. But as has been said, what is illegal here may be legal elsewhere. BTW I found an interesting site about dumb laws, both American and International: http://www.dumblaws.com/laws/united-states/texas (http://www.dumblaws.com/laws/united-states/texas). Good stuff for those who'd like to mock a foreigner.
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See Rule #2
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My personal saying is... If I don't know I will go to someone who does and ask their advice. Ripley does make a good point on allot of things here. There is a reason why I wont try to repair a PSU in a computer or a monitor. I don't know the difference between a capacitor and a rheostat.. electronics like that are beyond my capabilities.
Best advice I can give ... you take your own life into your own hands when messing with electronics if you don't know what you are doing.
LawnDaart
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I still chuckle at my inferior PSU, being anything but inferior. :airplane: