Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Hajo on July 02, 2014, 06:29:08 PM
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Car and driver tested and drove Hellcat Challenger.
The Hellcat is now the most powerful and fastest muscle car in our muscle car history.
Hellcat rated at 707 HP from factory with supercharged 6.2 litre engine.
Simply WOW.
http://challengerforumz.com/showthread.php?t=104271
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Do they still weight 4,100 lbs? :lol
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Do they still weight 4,100 lbs? :lol
Frenchy.....at 707 HP it doesn't matter now does it? It still is the fastest. :aok
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Ye gods.
:O
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Middle aged men at the peak of their crysis don't, they indeed speak horsepower. The rest of us talk laptimes :ahand still has the aerodynamic of a brick and the weight of CV's anchor. It's nice to have one from the factory with a waranty, 700HP is nothing crazy in the aftermarket crowd. :airplane:
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Middle aged men at the peak of their crysis don't, they indeed speak horsepower. The rest of us talk laptimes :ahand still has the aerodynamic of a brick and the weight of CV's anchor. It's nice to have one from the factory with a waranty, 700HP is nothing crazy in the aftermarket crowd. :airplane:
Since the 60s I've done my driving 1/4 or 1/8 mile at a time......who turns? It ain't midlife but a lifetime. I ran Quaker City in the late 60s. Had to stop when I got married....BORING LOL :aok
Frenchy I did have a BMW Z3 roadster that I did use in timed pylon racing back in the early 2000's. It was a blast.
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Mopar :D :aok
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:rock :rock
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Considering how crazy the new Z06 is supposed to be next year, it makes me wonder if we'll see a 720hp or greater ZR1 to respond to this car. Crazy stuff, I saw some stuff on it yesterday, be interesting to see what kind of numbers it'll put down, and how it'll drive day to day. We were thinking of waiting for the Z06, after almost selling our GTR and buying a new C7 Stingray, we decided to wait. Now I'll have to have a look at Mopar stuff as well I guess. I do love the GTR though, it's almost 5 years old now, and has rarely given us problems, and is such a great all round performer. You just get bored of stuff though, and it's the longest I've ever kept a car, so it's getting time for more changes to keep life interesting.
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Considering how crazy the new Z06 is supposed to be next year, it makes me wonder if we'll see a 720hp or greater ZR1 to respond to this car. Crazy stuff, I saw some stuff on it yesterday, be interesting to see what kind of numbers it'll put down, and how it'll drive day to day. We were thinking of waiting for the Z06, after almost selling our GTR and buying a new C7 Stingray, we decided to wait. Now I'll have to have a look at Mopar stuff as well I guess. I do love the GTR though, it's almost 5 years old now, and has rarely given us problems, and is such a great all round performer. You just get bored of stuff though, and it's the longest I've ever kept a car, so it's getting time for more changes to keep life interesting.
No matter what, something eventually will come faster from the factory. It's the way it has always been. Hence " for the time being" in title of my post.
Drive what you like. I've always been a Mopar guy and got ragged by Camaro and Mustang guys who had supercharged cars while Challengers were just normally aspirated.
Chrysler who we all know had the technology to blow their doors off finally did so. They dumped a supercharger on a 6.2 Hemi. Now Mustang and Camaro are gonna have to
come up with an additional 150HP to compete with the Hellcat. Vicious cycle that has been here since the mid 60s. Always fun to banter :aok
Oh and btw a Corvette is not a muscle car. It's a sports car same as the Viper.
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Gman, the Z06 doesnt need to respond to this car, it's already runing circles around it. They are not in the same cathegory though. ZL1 would be, but ZL1 can carve the road moderately well.
Hajo, even at the drag strip its about putting it down. Case and point the GT500s in regular forms. The Hellcat is just an another overpriced car for peeps that like to talk loud and fall for commercials and review where some clown goes sideway around curves in a cloud of smoke. :old:
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i. Now Mustang and Camaro are gonna have to
come up with an additional 150HP to compete with the Hellcat. Vicious cycle that has been here since the mid 60s. Always fun to banter :aok
:huh The GT500 is 662HP and the ZL1 is 580 but its more of a track car.
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Frenchy we're talking apples to oranges here. Muscle cars weren't made from factory to road race.
In the 60s they were actually made to run from light to light and on the quarter mile.
Win on Sunday sell on Monday was the creedo. NASCAR and drag racing were the biggest influences on car sales.
Who could afford an open wheel racer or an F1 racer' Porsche or Ferrari? At that time one could go to the showroom, purchase
what you wanted and with little or no alteration race the car on weekends and be competitive, then drive the car to work on Monday.
We did that quite regularly then........you're from a different era, much younger. A lot of us were there and participating.
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Stoplight to stoplight is the most, most men of today will ever measure the performance of a performance car, yes, put two bends in the road and it's slow and can't turn short of a train , but at 700 hp, it's still gonna be fun, I'm a Z-28 guy but the big Mopers always had a hold on my fantasy garage!
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Frenchy we're talking apples to oranges here. Muscle cars weren't made from factory to road race.
In the 60s they were actually made to run from light to light and on the quarter mile.
Win on Sunday sell on Monday was the creedo. NASCAR and drag racing were the biggest influences on car sales.
Who could afford an open wheel racer or an F1 racer' Porsche or Ferrari? At that time one could go to the showroom, purchase
what you wanted and with little or no alteration race the car on weekends and be competitive, then drive the car to work on Monday.
We did that quite regularly then........you're from a different era, much younger. A lot of us were there and participating.
"Muscle" cars were not.... but the Challengers and Cuda's (which are most definitely Muscle cars)....were specifically made for the road racing courses in the All American Racing league.
people always underestimate the handling of the Challengers and Cuda's
even had the guy who went with me when I took out a new Challenger....try to tell me they were made for the quarter mile track.... :rolleyes:
no..... they are no Subaru STi but they handle road racing quite well. :t
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"Muscle" cars were not.... but the Challengers and Cuda's (which are most definitely Muscle cars)....were specifically made for the road racing courses in the All American Racing league.
people always underestimate the handling of the Challengers and Cuda's
even had the guy who went with me when I took out a new Challenger....try to tell me they were made for the quarter mile track.... :rolleyes:
no..... they are no Subaru STi but they handle road racing quite well. :t
Well said Ink......Dan Gurney and Posey drove them in Trans Am series. Gurney even owns the rights to the name Cuda. Chrysler can't use the name without his permission
or lease on the rights.
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King Richard made them old cars turn left well,, Mopers anyway!
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To bad GM put Pontiac down would like to have got a new transam.
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Well said Ink......Dan Gurney and Posey drove them in Trans Am series. Gurney even owns the rights to the name Cuda. Chrysler can't use the name without his permission
or lease on the rights.
:aok
nice I didn't know that :salute
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If you are going for pure horsepower on that statement ...
Bugatti Veyron 1,001 hp and thats from the factory.. granted the ...ewwww... I cant say it ...Dodge is a lot cheaper but hey a person can dream.
LawnDart
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Frenchy we're talking apples to oranges here. Muscle cars weren't made from factory to road race.
In the 60s they were actually made to run from light to light and on the quarter mile.
Win on Sunday sell on Monday was the creedo. NASCAR and drag racing were the biggest influences on car sales.
Who could afford an open wheel racer or an F1 racer' Porsche or Ferrari? At that time one could go to the showroom, purchase
what you wanted and with little or no alteration race the car on weekends and be competitive, then drive the car to work on Monday.
We did that quite regularly then........you're from a different era, much younger. A lot of us were there and participating.
Indeed, and it's exactly the point I'm making, it's a gimmic car targeting you, the middle life or young geriatric :devil trying to re-infuse a breath of viagra via hardware. Or the 20 year old bodybuilder type that thinks he's a bad arse. What good is this car nowdays?
Red light to red light, we all know any mildly modified AWD will leave you frustrated. 180 MPH highway stint? The laws of aerodynamics on a brick will start to bite you back at 130+ and that sportcar with 200-250HP less will give you a run. Sunday canyon war, too heavy you'll get humiliated by Nipon incorporated. Your hunting ground will be freeway '70 MPH - 130' pedal mashing.
Anyway, car guys know that HP numbers mean nothing, the car needs to be ballanced. Nakamura got it right, he designed the GTR starting with the tyres contact patch. Why 480HP only he said? Because it's all what the tyres could effectively handle and yet he created a UFO, granted you are just one of the input to the computer that drives the car :joystick:
Please don't take my comments the wrong way, I love you guys but I can't help smiling when I read Frank feels he's driving a UFO because he pushed 160, INK thinks his old Challenger was a supercar and his 340 could be reved @ 8K old day long. Cars are made to be enjoyed and we like different things and purposes, none of us should lose track of what our cars can really do.
Otherwise we fall into that pompous maskarade poluting car shows. One of my past time is to drive around and stop at people's house and say :' Hey sorry to bother you, I'm a car guy and noticed your ____, would you mind telling me about it?'. When the first thing I hear is :'It's got XXX HP', I know I made a mistake. :( True car guys can be marvelled at a 20HP Fiat 500 as well as a Muscle car or the markmanship of a Rat Rod. The engineering, the how did they did it, the tricks and inovations is the kicker. But I disgress :uhoh
Oh and ... a 707HP factory car IS cool :aok probably looking at $70K with ADM and some options. :(
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Indeed, and it's exactly the point I'm making, it's a gimmic car targeting you, the middle life or young geriatric :devil trying to re-infuse a breath of viagra via hardware. Or the 20 year old bodybuilder type that thinks he's a bad arse. What good is this car nowdays?
Red light to red light, we all know any mildly modified AWD will leave you frustrated. 180 MPH highway stint? The laws of aerodynamics on a brick will start to bite you back at 130+ and that sportcar with 200-250HP less will give you a run. Sunday canyon war, too heavy you'll get humiliated by Nipon incorporated. Your hunting ground will be freeway '70 MPH - 130' pedal mashing.
Anyway, car guys know that HP numbers mean nothing, the car needs to be ballanced. Nakamura got it right, he designed the GTR starting with the tyres contact patch. Why 480HP only he said? Because it's all what the tyres could effectively handle and yet he created a UFO, granted you are just one of the input to the computer that drives the car :joystick:
Please don't take my comments the wrong way, I love you guys but I can't help smiling when I read Frank feels he's driving a UFO because he pushed 160, INK thinks his old Challenger was a supercar and his 340 could be reved @ 8K old day long. Cars are made to be enjoyed and we like different things and purposes, none of us should lose track of what our cars can really do.
Otherwise we fall into that pompous maskarade poluting car shows. One of my past time is to drive around and stop at people's house and say :' Hey sorry to bother you, I'm a car guy and noticed your ____, would you mind telling me about it?'. When the first thing I hear is :'It's got XXX HP', I know I made a mistake. :( True car guys can be marvelled at a 20HP Fiat 500 as well as a Muscle car or the markmanship of a Rat Rod. The engineering, the how did they did it, the tricks and inovations is the kicker. But I disgress :uhoh
Oh and ... a 707HP factory car IS cool :aok probably looking at $70K with ADM and some options. :(
Car guy here to Frenchy. I recently purchased an 89 corvette. Why? Was a nice car just sitting in a heated garage for the last 5 and a half years.
I am not a Corvette guy, but I like the cars and this one was pristine and needed to be driven. It's a 6 speed car also.
Unfortunately the owner passed, and before he did he couldn't drive it. Cancer. Frame is like new, 78K miles, new exhaust and fuel pump.
Ordered a kit for the leather seats and installed, flushed and drained all the fluids and the gas tank. Runs nice and got it for 7300 dollars
what it actually is worth. Now my Brother owns it and he and his wife are having a blast with it. Just wanted to see it back on the road.
Yep I'm car crazy, always have, always will.
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Indeed, and it's exactly the point I'm making, it's a gimmic car targeting you, the middle life or young geriatric :devil trying to re-infuse a breath of viagra via hardware. Or the 20 year old bodybuilder type that thinks he's a bad arse. What good is this car nowdays?
Red light to red light, we all know any mildly modified AWD will leave you frustrated. 180 MPH highway stint? The laws of aerodynamics on a brick will start to bite you back at 130+ and that sportcar with 200-250HP less will give you a run. Sunday canyon war, too heavy you'll get humiliated by Nipon incorporated. Your hunting ground will be freeway '70 MPH - 130' pedal mashing.
Anyway, car guys know that HP numbers mean nothing, the car needs to be ballanced. Nakamura got it right, he designed the GTR starting with the tyres contact patch. Why 480HP only he said? Because it's all what the tyres could effectively handle and yet he created a UFO, granted you are just one of the input to the computer that drives the car :joystick:
Please don't take my comments the wrong way, I love you guys but I can't help smiling when I read Frank feels he's driving a UFO because he pushed 160, INK thinks his old Challenger was a supercar and his 340 could be reved @ 8K old day long. Cars are made to be enjoyed and we like different things and purposes, none of us should lose track of what our cars can really do.
Otherwise we fall into that pompous maskarade poluting car shows. One of my past time is to drive around and stop at people's house and say :' Hey sorry to bother you, I'm a car guy and noticed your ____, would you mind telling me about it?'. When the first thing I hear is :'It's got XXX HP', I know I made a mistake. :( True car guys can be marvelled at a 20HP Fiat 500 as well as a Muscle car or the markmanship of a Rat Rod. The engineering, the how did they did it, the tricks and inovations is the kicker. But I disgress :uhoh
Oh and ... a 707HP factory car IS cool :aok probably looking at $70K with ADM and some options. :(
I would really love for you to quote me where I said it would hit 8K....all day...let alone hit it period.
seriously....a bit of an exaggeration wouldn't you say :headscratch:
what I did say is.... I have never seen a car take the abuse I gave it and still go strong the day I sold it.
I am not "guessing" that it took abuse...... I gave it.....
trust me after driving back and forth from NH to California and then from NH to Florida and back....6 plus years of beating on that car......
NO one can tell me those Challengers were anything but awesome. ;)
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In terms of reliable, tough engines.
Circa 1969, or so, Chrysler engines had a reputation for being some of the toughest engines built. Ford small blocks were next. Chevrolet engines were last.
I cannot count how many spun inserts I saw in Chevrolet engines when I was racing.
The drive line abuse I doled out to my Road Runner and how it continued to just run, was nothing short of amazing. My Mustang was pretty tough, once I dropped in the 9 inch rear end, 4 speed top loader, and restricted the oil fed to the lifter galley.
All that said. Today's engines are better. Better materials, better tolerances, better designs, all conspire to make them just as tough and reliable, if not more so than those old engines. BUT, that is a large part of what made racing so much fun. Building that old engine into something which could stand the abuse was more of a challenge than today's engine builders have.
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At 64 I'd give my left testicle for my old 65 Plymouth Sport Fury 383, 4 speed, 4.33 rear end.
I'd give my right one for my old 69 Roadrunner, again 383 4 speed.
Heck, I've been married 3 times I have none anyway. They got them in settlement.
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I did love that old 69 Road Runner 383/4 speed. It was a sweet car.
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I did love that old 69 Road Runner 383/4 speed. It was a sweet car.
At 64 I'd give my left testicle for my old 65 Plymouth Sport Fury 383, 4 speed, 4.33 rear end.
I'd give my right one for my old 69 Roadrunner, again 383 4 speed.
Heck, I've been married 3 times I have none anyway. They got them in settlement.
I took a 383 Road Runner for a test drive a long time ago...after an hour I didn't want to give it back :rofl
plus the old man owned a 69 Charger 383(thats most likely where my love of mopars comes from even though I hate to admit it)
tough.... yup the 340 I had was extremely tough
289 gears.... so a smoke show was not an option unless I did a roll back....
and boy did I do many of those....and that 340 -727 combo never wavered..
I beat that Challenger hard for 6 plus years....
haha I remember a 80 Monti Carlo 350.....
all I did was put on an Aluminum Manifold and a Holly 600...took it up on the highway......spun a main bearing....at 115
took another Monti this time a 79 with a 350 and tried to go from Nashua NH to Manchester which is not very far at all....at about 120 I shattered the Crankshaft.....
a few other non mopars many broke....
:rofl :rofl :rofl
damn those where the days....that Challenger made them all look foolish
no it was not the fastest car.....140 is more than fast enough.(for me anyways)
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I would really love for you to quote me where I said it would hit 8K....all day...let alone hit it period.
seriously....a bit of an exaggeration wouldn't you say :headscratch:
Oh hey you are catching up quick :lol. ... and no Frank doesn't think his vette is a UFO and Hajo is not chasing fleeding memories of coolness. We all nevertheless have a tendancy of embelishing the actual potential of the cars we love, especially whenthey live in some obscure corner of our memories. Hell I used to own an Opel Manta as my first car and that beast would punk everything. I got to drive one again a couple of years ago and wondered 'what s wrong with the engine?!' ... hahaha nothing was wrong with the engine :lol
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I actually raced my cars Frenchy. High 9's to high 10's in the quarter is still pretty quick, even by today's standards. Isn't it?
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Oh hey you are catching up quick :lol. ... and no Frank doesn't think his vette is a UFO and Hajo is not chasing fleeding memories of coolness. We all nevertheless have a tendancy of embelishing the actual potential of the cars we love, especially whenthey live in some obscure corner of our memories. Hell I used to own an Opel Manta as my first car and that beast would punk everything. I got to drive one again a couple of years ago and wondered 'what s wrong with the engine?!' ... hahaha nothing was wrong with the engine :lol
ok man....whatever......the sarcasm is reeking....
I cant talk with people who are like that...who have snide remarks....put words into others mouths and are just generally......
or speak out the side of their mouth as I call it.
ehh...... good day....add one more to the ignore list....that sucker is growing.
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Car guy here to Frenchy. I recently purchased an 89 corvette.
If you got rid of your Mopar to buy this Corvette.....im grabbing INK .......and were comming to your house to toilet paper all your landscaping :furious
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Indeed, and it's exactly the point I'm making, it's a gimmic car targeting you, the middle life or young geriatric :devil trying to re-infuse a breath of viagra via hardware. Or the 20 year old bodybuilder type that thinks he's a bad arse. What good is this car nowdays?
Red light to red light, we all know any mildly modified AWD will leave you frustrated. 180 MPH highway stint? The laws of aerodynamics on a brick will start to bite you back at 130+ and that sportcar with 200-250HP less will give you a run. Sunday canyon war, too heavy you'll get humiliated by Nipon incorporated. Your hunting ground will be freeway '70 MPH - 130' pedal mashing.
Anyway, car guys know that HP numbers mean nothing, the car needs to be ballanced. Nakamura got it right, he designed the GTR starting with the tyres contact patch. Why 480HP only he said? Because it's all what the tyres could effectively handle and yet he created a UFO, granted you are just one of the input to the computer that drives the car :joystick:
Please don't take my comments the wrong way, I love you guys but I can't help smiling when I read Frank feels he's driving a UFO because he pushed 160, INK thinks his old Challenger was a supercar and his 340 could be reved @ 8K old day long. Cars are made to be enjoyed and we like different things and purposes, none of us should lose track of what our cars can really do.
Otherwise we fall into that pompous maskarade poluting car shows. One of my past time is to drive around and stop at people's house and say :' Hey sorry to bother you, I'm a car guy and noticed your ____, would you mind telling me about it?'. When the first thing I hear is :'It's got XXX HP', I know I made a mistake. :( True car guys can be marvelled at a 20HP Fiat 500 as well as a Muscle car or the markmanship of a Rat Rod. The engineering, the how did they did it, the tricks and inovations is the kicker. But I disgress :uhoh
Oh and ... a 707HP factory car IS cool :aok probably looking at $70K with ADM and some options. :(
This is a good summary. Good post Frenchy. :rock
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If you got rid of your Mopar to buy this Corvette.....im grabbing INK .......and were comming to your house to toilet paper all your landscaping :furious
we should do that...just for the fun of it :devil
but the TP has to say..."I am a girly man" in a fancy script.... :D
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If you got rid of your Mopar to buy this Corvette.....im grabbing INK .......and were comming to your house to toilet paper all your landscaping :furious
LOL nope! Are you kidding? The SRT is my car and still in the garage covered. I just bought the Vette so someone else can drive it.
My Brother is a Chevy guy (no accounting for taste) so I sold it to him. I just rescued it from complete disaster. Wasn't being driven or started.
I hate to see any nice car just sit and go to waste. As I said before he and his wife are enjoying it. That's all that matters to me.
Me......always was always will be Mopar.
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This is a good summary. Good post Frenchy. :rock
You younguns' just don't understand. We're from a different time. You never experienced what we did in the 60s.
Our car experiences were completely different. So was the culture. It was shaped then and a part of us Old Coots.
Some like Ink understand. You have your likes and dislikes.....we have ours. :cheers:
You just don't get it. And you never will. We loved to work on cars then and we still do now. We just bring
more years of living at a different time. Tastes are different. One thing in common though we all like cars.
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I am a car guy and can hang with any person on a car discussion and experienced a lot of stuff as a Lead Test Driver for Roush. But I guess I don't know anything......
I am also that guy nitpicking incorrect things on any car at car shows..... I even got to make Boyd Coddington feel a foot tall in front of Chip Foose at the Mother's Car Show in Columbus, OH in September of 2006. An event I recalled when having Ian talk with Chip at the 2008 Autorama before the Riddler Award was handed out. I think you took my comment and read too much into it. But there are embellishments and Frenchy nailed it.
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I actually raced my cars Frenchy. High 9's to high 10's in the quarter is still pretty quick, even by today's standards. Isn't it?
You younguns' just don't understand. We're from a different time. You never experienced what we did in the 60s.
Our car experiences were completely different. So was the culture. It was shaped then and a part of us Old Coots.
Some like Ink understand. You have your likes and dislikes.....we have ours. :cheers:
You just don't get it. And you never will. We loved to work on cars then and we still do now. We just bring
more years of living at a different time. Tastes are different. One thing in common though we all like cars.
Yes it is Skuzz. Hajo I'm not coming from the same background either, in Europe it's about the first one at the top of the hill. I still don't see what is so special about what you did? You bolt stuffs on your car, you drive it to the dragstrip, race it, drive it home and try an another speed mod right?
Well, the principle hasn't changed all other the world. I myself is just done rebuilding my Firebird engine to barely better than factory. I'm just done removing the body from the frame on my GT6 to try to bring the engine/trany back 7 inches to gain in weight distribution. Every months I put a couple of $ to be able to build my 600HP pump gas poncho mill. So what is it I'm not getting?
Drag racing? Indeed I trully have no interest in a car ingeneered only to launch and fly down a 1/4 mile in 10 sec. But even then, it's the name of the game and the genesys of the muscle car putting the biggest engine into the smallest frame? It's it what Shelby is crowned for? Back to my original comment, what good is the Hellcat with 4,100lbs and the aerodynamic of a brick? As a drag racer, is it your weapon of choice? It surely isn't for road racing. Now if the Hellcat was 3,400 lbs you'd get my attention.
I understand I'm not getting it, but except nostalgia factor and braging rights, I still think you'll have to be very cautious picking your battles in the streets.
Ink, dude, so young and so hangry. Forget about yourself for a minute and only focus on what I was trying to say. I own a 455 that knew only two throttle positions for 5 years till she had enough. I drove from L.A. to Houston to Denver to Salt Lake. Drove on snow, in 100 degrees weather and raced my share of 'guys on the other lane'. My point is, that despite how much we love our cars and how bad bellybutton they were in the days, they are not much compared by today's cars. My 7.5L is a model of inefficiency and I never know when something with a 3L something V6 will blow my doors off. Doesn't even have to be a V6, last guy that smoked me at the red light had a Neon SRT. Even when I get to build my 600HP motor, some descent suspensions and 6 pistons brakes she ain't going to be no GT500 or Hellcat. And for Christ's sake buy a Challenger already, they are still out there for 5K-ish if you are willing to cut the rust and rebuild the mill. Your 'I used to' is painfull to listen to for a car guy ... here :
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dodge-Challenger-Standard-Black-with-Bucket-seats-1970-Dodge-Challenger-318-3-speed-in-floor-bucket-/171368847672?forcerrptr=true&hash=item27e6611938&item=171368847672&pt=US_Cars_Trucks (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dodge-Challenger-Standard-Black-with-Bucket-seats-1970-Dodge-Challenger-318-3-speed-in-floor-bucket-/171368847672?forcerrptr=true&hash=item27e6611938&item=171368847672&pt=US_Cars_Trucks)
Ship it to my shop, I'll put her back together for free, buy the parts.
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Yes it is Skuzz. Hajo I'm not coming from the same background either, in Europe it's about the first one at the top of the hill. I still don't see what is so special about what you did? You bolt stuffs on your car, you drive it to the dragstrip, race it, drive it home and try an another speed mod right?
Well, the principle hasn't changed all other the world. I myself is just done rebuilding my Firebird engine to barely better than factory. I'm just done removing the body from the frame on my GT6 to try to bring the engine/trany back 7 inches to gain in weight distribution. Every months I put a couple of $ to be able to build my 600HP pump gas poncho mill. So what is it I'm not getting?
Drag racing? Indeed I trully have no interest in a car ingeneered only to launch and fly down a 1/4 mile in 10 sec. But even then, it's the name of the game and the genesys of the muscle car putting the biggest engine into the smallest frame? It's it what Shelby is crowned for? Back to my original comment, what good is the Hellcat with 4,100lbs and the aerodynamic of a brick? As a drag racer, is it your weapon of choice? It surely isn't for road racing. Now if the Hellcat was 3,400 lbs you'd get my attention.
I understand I'm not getting it, but except nostalgia factor and braging rights, I still think you'll have to be very cautious picking your battles in the streets.
Ink, dude, so young and so hangry. Forget about yourself for a minute and only focus on what I was trying to say. I own a 455 that knew only two throttle positions for 5 years till she had enough. I drove from L.A. to Houston to Denver to Salt Lake. Drove on snow, in 100 degrees weather and raced my share of 'guys on the other lane'. My point is, that despite how much we love our cars and how bad bellybutton they were in the days, they are not much compared by today's cars. My 7.5L is a model of inefficiency and I never know when something with a 3L something V6 will blow my doors off. Doesn't even have to be a V6, last guy that smoked me at the red light had a Neon SRT. Even when I get to build my 600HP motor, some descent suspensions and 6 pistons brakes she ain't going to be no GT500 or Hellcat. And for Christ's sake buy a Challenger already, they are still out there for 5K-ish if you are willing to cut the rust and rebuild the mill. Your 'I used to' is painfull to listen to for a car guy ... here :
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dodge-Challenger-Standard-Black-with-Bucket-seats-1970-Dodge-Challenger-318-3-speed-in-floor-bucket-/171368847672?forcerrptr=true&hash=item27e6611938&item=171368847672&pt=US_Cars_Trucks (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dodge-Challenger-Standard-Black-with-Bucket-seats-1970-Dodge-Challenger-318-3-speed-in-floor-bucket-/171368847672?forcerrptr=true&hash=item27e6611938&item=171368847672&pt=US_Cars_Trucks)
Ship it to my shop, I'll put her back together for free, buy the parts.
Ink now theres' an offer! Frenchy knows automobiles he can do it.
Frenchy you are correct in saying I'm only interested putting the HP to the ground and launching at the light.
That's what most of us did in that era. If we didn't do the strip we had someone to flag the start on a back road.
I'm still a huge fan of drag racing. Go to the track when I can and watch it on ESPN when I can.
The vapor of gas fumes tearing my eyes while trying to get the dual carb Hemi running right etc. That was a chore.
No carbs today unfortunately only throttle bodies on the newer cars. Miss it and the places we used to hang like the AW etc.
Us old car guys from that era are still tight. We go to shows, the Detroit Autorama, have breakfast together one day a week, and
take our cars to cruises. What we did together in the 60s is still going on now. I guess we wouldn't have it any other way.
To old to change.
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Ink now theres' an offer! Frenchy knows automobiles he can do it.
Frenchy you are correct in saying I'm only interested putting the HP to the ground and launching at the light.
That's what most of us did in that era. If we didn't do the strip we had someone to flag the start on a back road.
I'm still a huge fan of drag racing. Go to the track when I can and watch it on ESPN when I can.
The vapor of gas fumes tearing my eyes while trying to get the dual carb Hemi running right etc. That was a chore.
No carbs today unfortunately only throttle bodies on the newer cars. Miss it and the places we used to hang like the AW etc.
Us old car guys from that era are still tight. We go to shows, the Detroit Autorama, have breakfast together one day a week, and
take our cars to cruises. What we did together in the 60s is still going on now. I guess we wouldn't have it any other way.
To old to change.
an offer I would never take up.....
:salute
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Has anyone even heard of the Mustang Shelby GT1000?
It's already got more HP than any other car out there at 950 in street legal form, and 1200 with it being strictly track only.
Just sayin' that there's already a street legal "modernized muscle" car out there that's got more power than the rest. However this doesn't discount the fact that the Hellcat Challenger is badass.
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The GT1000 is not a 'factory' car, same for the SS or the KRs. The Hellcat is 100% Dodge.
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an offer I would never take up.....
:salute
If we all pitch in $50, we can pull off an INK trustfund- Get his Mopar back! :banana:
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Ship it to my shop, I'll put her back together for free, buy the parts.
After seeing the Torino, I might take you up on this within 5 years. I am not kidding either.
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Jay....Frenchy posted pics of my all time favorite race car the Shelby Daytona.
Rumor has it he's building one IIRC.
Dream car........one of mine anyway.
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You guys have me wrong, Im only an amateur and I do 20 footers. If you want a show car find a proper shop. But if you want a DD I dont mind resurecting one from the junkyard. :angel:
Hajo, I like Daytonas over the Cobras. Cobras are 'everywhere' like those overplayed rock songs that lost their flavors. I was considering buying F5 kit but RL got in the way. Im hoping in about 2 years when my wife is out of school and the GT6 is done to get a RaceCarReplica 330P4 to build or get an E type with an alluminun lowdrag from England $25K last I checked.
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I'm waiting to see the 2016 Camaro. With the A-body being used, we should finally see a true light weight Camaro.
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Car and driver tested and drove Hellcat Challenger.
The Hellcat is now the most powerful and fastest muscle car in our muscle car history.
Hellcat rated at 707 HP from factory with supercharged 6.2 litre engine.
Simply WOW.
http://challengerforumz.com/showthread.php?t=104271
what're they claiming for top speed? what has been shown as top speed so far?
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Frenchy we're talking apples to oranges here. Muscle cars weren't made from factory to road race.
In the 60s they were actually made to run from light to light and on the quarter mile.
Win on Sunday sell on Monday was the creedo. NASCAR and drag racing were the biggest influences on car sales.
Who could afford an open wheel racer or an F1 racer' Porsche or Ferrari? At that time one could go to the showroom, purchase
what you wanted and with little or no alteration race the car on weekends and be competitive, then drive the car to work on Monday.
We did that quite regularly then........you're from a different era, much younger. A lot of us were there and participating.
bos302 and z28's were intended as road racers. :aok
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Has anyone even heard of the Mustang Shelby GT1000?
It's already got more HP than any other car out there at 950 in street legal form, and 1200 with it being strictly track only.
Just sayin' that there's already a street legal "modernized muscle" car out there that's got more power than the rest. However this doesn't discount the fact that the Hellcat Challenger is badass.
technically speaking, the gt1000 isn't factory.
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technically speaking, the gt1000 isn't factory.
I wasn't exactly speaking factory terms.
I know the GT1000 isn't factory, but there's cars out there that are already loaded with horsepower. 707 HP from the factory is nothing compared to what Koenigsegg and McLaren are doing, and yet by technicalities those are "factory" made cars.
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I wasn't exactly speaking factory terms.
I know the GT1000 isn't factory, but there's cars out there that are already loaded with horsepower. 707 HP from the factory is nothing compared to what Koenigsegg and McLaren are doing, and yet by technicalities those are "factory" made cars.
show me where you can buy one of those for 60-70k?
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Frenchy that is prolly the most generous offer I've ever seen on this board or any board as far as I remember.. I can't imagine a more true car guy gesture and really shines a nice light on you.. :salute
I agree with all you wrote.. I'm not a big 1/4mile guy either and have purpose built my car for better track day action.. But even the new Z28, which is prolly the biggest bang for buck in a track car, is a purpose built ride..
I'll be surprised if the new hellcat only weights in at 4100lbs.. But that is certainly impressive numbers..
Still can't put this dodge in the same category as a ZR1.. Not even close..
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show me where you can buy one of those for 60-70k?
If you wanted cheap you're not in the right area. When we talk in technicalities anything goes, including 100k+ cars that technically are factory produced cars.
However if you're looking for 60-70k then try an older/used SL500.
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<sigh> Dodge manufactures the most powerful car from the factory for the public and Ford and Chevy guys try to find something to pick on.
BTW as I stated before the Corvette never was or ever will be a muscle car. It is advertised as "Americas Sports car" and it competes with the Viper.
Cap1 as to top speed of the Hellcat. My SRT is guaranteed to do at least 182 from the factory and has no rev limiter, it's 470 HP and 470 Torque.
One test pass was run on the Hellcat with factory tires. Time 10.9. Consensus from Dodge it will do better. I assume since my SRT will do at least 182 with 470HP/TQ.
the Hellcat with at least 240 more HP and 650lbs of torque reported will do a tad better. And various Car magazines, not me, have written that Camaro is now in 3rd place
behind the Challenger and Mustang in that order. I didn't say that, independent auto mags have done so after comparing the 3.
BTW the new Hellcat comes with two key fobs. One black one red. The black limits the Hellcat to 500 HP (limit?) The red one unchains the beast.
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<sigh> Dodge manufactures the most powerful car from the factory for the public and Ford and Chevy guys try to find something to pick on.
BTW as I stated before the Corvette never was or ever will be a muscle car. It is advertised as "Americas Sports car" and it competes with the Viper.
Cap1 as to top speed of the Hellcat. My SRT is guaranteed to do at least 182 from the factory and has no rev limiter, it's 470 HP and 470 Torque.
One test pass was run on the Hellcat with factory tires. Time 10.9. Consensus from Dodge it will do better. I assume since my SRT will do at least 182 with 470HP/TQ.
the Hellcat with at least 240 more HP and 650lbs of torque reported will do a tad better. And various Car magazines, not me, have written that Camaro is now in 3rd place
behind the Challenger and Mustang in that order. I didn't say that, independent auto mags have done so after comparing the 3.
BTW the new Hellcat comes with two key fobs. One black one red. The black limits the Hellcat to 500 HP (limit?) The red one unchains the beast.
Hajo, If you meant me, I don't meant to sound picking like.. I think it's awesome and just meant its a purpose built car just like the Camaro Z cars..
We live in a pretty awesome time for cars imho..
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Hajo, If you meant me, I don't meant to sound picking like.. I think it's awesome and just meant its a purpose built car just like the Camaro Z cars..
We live in a pretty awesome time for cars imho..
kappa we are again living in an amazing time. I much preferred the sixties but hey.....I get what I can LOL.
If it weren't for Ford reintroducing the Mustang, there would be no Camaro or Challenger being made today.
I like all three. The challenger is just more practical for size, comfort, and speed. But the two most fun purchases until now were a 65 Sport Fury 4 speed 383 and a new 69 Roadrunner.
Having driven them new and worked on them in the 60s and driving the newer ones now. The newer ones blow the old ones away in many areas including speed, handling and braking.
especially braking............drum brakes were killers.
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Truly it is exciting times for muscle car enthusiasts. Its like 1969 all over again except horsepower levels and gas prices are exponentially higher.
I am eager to see one of the new Hellcats in person. Even moreso, I am excited about what Ford and the SVT team will release for the new S550 Mustang.
I lost my Mustang in a collision on May 1; lots of blood, sweat and money pissed away. The little mustang was producing 547 horsepower at the wheels and stuck to the road pretty well. It cost me a lot of money in suspension parts to get it to do that BTW.
Since I didn't want to go back and do that all over again, I just bought a 2014 GT500. I will take delivery NLT 16 July and damn I am excited about that! The car is loaded on the Hoegh Beijing 22 which is currently steaming across the North Atlantic; destination Bremerhaven. Pictures to follow.
Ink, you got Frenchy wrong man. He is not poking you in the eye at all. He is a skilled mechanic who likes to create silk out of a sow's ear. He KNOWs cars and simply has a different outlook.
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Ammo.....best post pics when ya get the Mustang. I'm holding you to it :aok
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Ink, you got Frenchy wrong man. He is not poking you in the eye at all. He is a skilled mechanic who likes to create silk out of a sow's ear. He KNOWs cars and simply has a different outlook.
I do believe that offer was genuine...and like Kappa said...that speaks volumes.
I have seen pics of what looked like beautiful work from him.
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<sigh> Dodge manufactures the most powerful car from the factory for the public and Ford and Chevy guys try to find something to pick on.
BTW as I stated before the Corvette never was or ever will be a muscle car. It is advertised as "Americas Sports car" and it competes with the Viper.
Cap1 as to top speed of the Hellcat. My SRT is guaranteed to do at least 182 from the factory and has no rev limiter, it's 470 HP and 470 Torque.
One test pass was run on the Hellcat with factory tires. Time 10.9. Consensus from Dodge it will do better. I assume since my SRT will do at least 182 with 470HP/TQ.
the Hellcat with at least 240 more HP and 650lbs of torque reported will do a tad better. And various Car magazines, not me, have written that Camaro is now in 3rd place
behind the Challenger and Mustang in that order. I didn't say that, independent auto mags have done so after comparing the 3.
BTW the new Hellcat comes with two key fobs. One black one red. The black limits the Hellcat to 500 HP (limit?) The red one unchains the beast.
well, as mentioned, it'll have to top 202-205mph. 10.9 is awesome.ki hadn't found anything stating an et. i googled it beforei made that post. what was the speed? i'm curious where it's making that time at. the shelby was only doing 11.7's. on street tires. launch control is amazing. hell.....they oughta just work on this one a bit more, and replace the dragpack with this, as the dragpack's not very much quicker than the time you stated :)
BTW.....are these keeping the same underpinnings as the normal challengers? still a mercedes underneath?
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kappa we are again living in an amazing time. I much preferred the sixties but hey.....I get what I can LOL.
If it weren't for Ford continuing the Mustang, there would be no Camaro or Challenger being made today.
I like all three. The challenger is just more practical for size, comfort, and speed. But the two most fun purchases until now were a 65 Sport Fury 4 speed 383 and a new 69 Roadrunner.
Having driven them new and worked on them in the 60s and driving the newer ones now. The newer ones blow the old ones away in many areas including speed, handling and braking.
especially braking............drum brakes were killers.
i fixed that for ya, as the mustang was never discontinued...thus not able to be reintroduced. :aok
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i fixed that for ya, as the mustang was never discontinued...thus not able to be reintroduced. :aok
Cap.......both you and I know what I meant. The retro. I don't know what Ford did to the Mustang in 1974.
I thought they ruined it, but that's just me. My Son had a nice little 5.0. I liked the Steve McQueen version A body fast back :rock
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well, as mentioned, it'll have to top 202-205mph. 10.9 is awesome.ki hadn't found anything stating an et. i googled it beforei made that post. what was the speed? i'm curious where it's making that time at. the shelby was only doing 11.7's. on street tires. launch control is amazing. hell.....they oughta just work on this one a bit more, and replace the dragpack with this, as the dragpack's not very much quicker than the time you stated :)
BTW.....are these keeping the same underpinnings as the normal challengers? still a mercedes underneath?
Cap....what makes them go from what I understand is an 8 speed Auto transmission. A good friend of mine purchased a new RAM1500 with a 5.7 Hemi and 8 speed trans.
It's not the regular model and I can't recall it's name atm. The 8 speed is nice and the shifting can be programed to be "tighter"'. I can't recall while writing this but
the underpinings are different. Now they did some minor work on it's appearance. Taillights more retro and true to the original Challenger, and the front has minor changes also.
I'm fine with the rear end look, but not a fan of the look of the front. I'm wondering if I'm speaking blasphemy on my Chrysler heritage there. Just think the front of the car
went away from the original Challenger as opposed to the 2014 and down Challengers. Sides have the same basic lines. I do know the underpinnings were beefed and altered.
My 12 SRT has a Bilstein suspension set up underneath from the factory.
With a push of a button I can lock down the suspension for performance. I would imagine the Hellcat would have something substantially tougher. I can't tell you what that is at the
moment. I can tell you they (autos) have launch control and have for the last few years. How well that works I can't say. I've never driven the auto, just the manual.
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Cap....what makes them go from what I understand is an 8 speed Auto transmission. A good friend of mine purchased a new RAM1500 with a 5.7 Hemi and 8 speed trans.
It's not the regular model and I can't recall it's name atm. The 8 speed is nice and the shifting can be programed to be "tighter"'. I can't recall while writing this but
the underpinings are different. Now they did some minor work on it's appearance. Taillights more retro and true to the original Challenger, and the front has minor changes also.
I'm fine with the rear end look, but not a fan of the look of the front. I'm wondering if I'm speaking blasphemy on my Chrysler heritage there. Just think the front of the car
went away from the original Challenger as opposed to the 2014 and down Challengers. Sides have the same basic lines. I do know the underpinnings were beefed and altered.
My 12 SRT has a Bilstein suspension set up underneath from the factory.
With a push of a button I can lock down the suspension for performance. I would imagine the Hellcat would have something substantially tougher. I can't tell you what that is at the
moment. I can tell you they (autos) have launch control and have for the last few years. How well that works I can't say. I've never driven the auto, just the manual.
i didn't mean bilstien or koni when i asked abotu the underpinnings. i meant the entire suspension system. the normal challengers, chargers, 300's, etc are riding on mercedes 2 series i believe suspension. i was curious if they're still on mercedes underneath, or went and did something new on their own.
launch control should work wonders on them. it does on the shelbys....but they only come with manuals. i can't recall if the zl comes with launch control or not.
earlier you mentioned about the 2 keys......i'd forgotten to mention that ford did that with the boss302 in 012. i think.....not sure.....but i think they're still doing it.
i gotta go look at a pic of the front end of a brand new one. to my eye, of the three retrorods(is that a word?), the challenger is the best looking. whoops....make it four. the charger........that name should never have been put on the #$% that they put it on. they've done a great disservice to the charger name there. the mustang/camaro run neck n neck in the looks dept to me, and we all know i'm ford biased, thus choose the mustang. the camaro is kinda hard to see out of though.
side note.....customer with a 2013 v6 challenger.....drove through a really deep puddle during a storm. hydrolocked the engine. the air intake's low on them from the factory. i noted when i've worked on his car that i can see perfectly out of it from my 3/9 forward, but felt like more blind spots than i remember from the original challengers.
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i gotta go look at a pic of the front end of a brand new one. to my eye, of the three retrorods(is that a word?), the challenger is the best looking.
Definitely agree with this. I've gotten a LOT of compliments on 2013 SXT (you know you hit the drive-thru too often when the girl at the cashier window asks if you've gotten a new car...) and while I still dream of a 65 Mustang some day, whenever I'm in the position to upgrade what I've got now I'm strongly considering staying with the Challenger over the Mustang (just not really a fan of the 2015, it's starting to look too much like everything else now). Probably one of the R/Ts, as I don't race and it would be a daily driver, but I'd still love the V8.
Of course a lot depends on what's available when I'm able to even consider trading in. AFAIK there's been no announcement whether the Challenger will be continuing past 2016 (Wiki only says "two more years," and isn't clear whether that's 2014 and 2015, or 2015 and 2016).
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You guys have me wrong, Im only an amateur and I do 20 footers. If you want a show car find a proper shop. But if you want a DD I dont mind resurecting one from the junkyard. :angel:
Hajo, I like Daytonas over the Cobras. Cobras are 'everywhere' like those overplayed rock songs that lost their flavors. I was considering buying F5 kit but RL got in the way. Im hoping in about 2 years when my wife is out of school and the GT6 is done to get a RaceCarReplica 330P4 to build or get an E type with an alluminun lowdrag from England $25K last I checked.
Screw trailer queens. I will never understand the thought process of caging something that cannot be truly appreciated. :cheers:
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Definitely agree with this. I've gotten a LOT of compliments on 2013 SXT (you know you hit the drive-thru too often when the girl at the cashier window asks if you've gotten a new car...) and while I still dream of a 65 Mustang some day, whenever I'm in the position to upgrade what I've got now I'm strongly considering staying with the Challenger over the Mustang (just not really a fan of the 2015, it's starting to look too much like everything else now). Probably one of the R/Ts, as I don't race and it would be a daily driver, but I'd still love the V8.
Of course a lot depends on what's available when I'm able to even consider trading in. AFAIK there's been no announcement whether the Challenger will be continuing past 2016 (Wiki only says "two more years," and isn't clear whether that's 2014 and 2015, or 2015 and 2016).
i've got a 66 in the bay that i hafta pull the tranny out of on monday. looks like leaking rear main seal......and the owner put a 90-something mk7lsc 5 liter engine in it. thing looks/sounds sweet though.
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i've got a 66 in the bay that i hafta pull the tranny out of on monday. looks like leaking rear main seal......and the owner put a 90-something mk7lsc 5 liter engine in it. thing looks/sounds sweet though.
I'd thought about getting one of those repro bodies and having one built, but obviously I'd prefer a vintage.
I was thinking earlier I'd kind of like to see Ford offer a notchback option on the Mustang again. The convertibles sort of had that look to them, but it'd be nice to see it in a hardtop. That could help the 2015 stand out a bit more and not look so generic.
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I wished they fidnt choose that ford fusion front end on the new mustang, dam you laws of aerodynamics! :furious
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I'd thought about getting one of those repro bodies and having one built, but obviously I'd prefer a vintage.
I was thinking earlier I'd kind of like to see Ford offer a notchback option on the Mustang again. The convertibles sort of had that look to them, but it'd be nice to see it in a hardtop. That could help the 2015 stand out a bit more and not look so generic.
Ya Frenchy.....and they put a Dodge dart looking front end on the new Chargers. Guess I'm a dinosaur as regards to styling.
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I wished they fidnt choose that ford fusion front end on the new mustang, dam you laws of aerodynamics! :furious
TBH, I'd rather the car be less aerodynamic. To me the pony car ought to have a particular look; there should be a hint of unsophistication and an almost brutish character compared to the sleeker true sports cars like the Vettes and Porsches, using raw muscle and power for performance when hot rodded up.
That's what the Challenger got right.
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Cap.......both you and I know what I meant. The retro. I don't know what Ford did to the Mustang in 1974.
I thought they ruined it, but that's just me. My Son had a nice little 5.0. I liked the Steve McQueen version A body fast back :rock
they did what they had to do to keep it going. my mom had a 74 2.3 4 speed. not really a bad little car to be honest. agonizingly slow with the 4 banger, but it did handle much better than one would've expected from those pos's..........
and yea....i knew whatcha meant....but i'd venture that there's plenty here that didn't. :devil
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Hajo, Saxman ... +1000. Since I own a 2012 Dodge Charger I was looking forward to the new one. Oh my :confused: since I can't stand the Dart look, I drop a WTF :furious Oh well...and Like Saxman said, I expect that muscle car look, I was a fan of the outgoing Mustang front facia, they made it better every year. I dig the B pilar delete on the new one.
CAP, you guys seen it before but I can't hold myself from posting it again.
Here's my daughter's Mustang II with a 2.3L :lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lL7nzQpifRg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lL7nzQpifRg)