Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Custom Skins => Topic started by: tmetal on July 23, 2014, 07:04:06 PM
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I know we already have many mustang skins but is there any way I could convince one of you gents to skin a P51D flown by Lt. William Eddins (a distant cousin of mine) during the final years of the war?
Bill posing with his plane
(http://i1164.photobucket.com/albums/q569/bryguyw/378671_292056957496280_2137982615_n_zps5c174c5b.jpg) (http://s1164.photobucket.com/user/bryguyw/media/378671_292056957496280_2137982615_n_zps5c174c5b.jpg.html)
A good shot of Bill and the script style text on the canopy frame
(http://i1164.photobucket.com/albums/q569/bryguyw/530093_345790715456237_1899558149_n_zps58adc233.jpg) (http://s1164.photobucket.com/user/bryguyw/media/530093_345790715456237_1899558149_n_zps58adc233.jpg.html)
A shot of Bill and his crew chief with a good view of the "Wee Willie" lettering on the nose
(http://i1164.photobucket.com/albums/q569/bryguyw/35075_134028809965763_5156233_n_zps324f119e.jpg) (http://s1164.photobucket.com/user/bryguyw/media/35075_134028809965763_5156233_n_zps324f119e.jpg.html)
here is the best shot we have of the entire plane, the picture doesn't appear to show the entire tail number but we are fairly certain this is his plane
(http://i1164.photobucket.com/albums/q569/bryguyw/563807_345790782122897_2039809715_n_zpseb11f8ee.jpg) (http://s1164.photobucket.com/user/bryguyw/media/563807_345790782122897_2039809715_n_zpseb11f8ee.jpg.html)
A color photo not of Bill's plane but of a plane with the same nose and tail colors for reference.
(http://i1164.photobucket.com/albums/q569/bryguyw/539746_345790912122884_844682243_n_zps4c829ac5.jpg) (http://s1164.photobucket.com/user/bryguyw/media/539746_345790912122884_844682243_n_zps4c829ac5.jpg.html)
I wish I had more photos to post but unfortunately this is all we have. :(
Much appreciation and heartfelt thanks to anybody who would be willing to take this one on.
:salute AH skinner's and cheers :cheers:
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I don't mind doing it. I already have a yellow tail in the game as is.
If you get a better offer take it but I am willing to give it a shot. I realize my style may not be what you are after.
Do you know the tail code and or serial number?
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I'll see if I can turn up more info Vraciu, but for now what you see is what I have. :salute
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I'll see if I can turn up more info Vraciu, but for now what you see is what I have. :salute
I will do some looking myself. Either of the above items will reveal the rest.
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So, can anyone tell me if WEE WILLLIE has the yellow wing stripe or not in the pictures with its pilot? It seems to be on the wing in the first photo but I can't be sure.
I should be able to have something to show you in a week.
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So, can anyone tell me if WEE WILLLIE has the yellow wing stripe or not in the pictures with its pilot? It seems to be on the wing in the first photo but I can't be sure.
I should be able to have something to show you in a week.
That's the beauty of machines from the same squadron/fighter group. Or at least those babied ETO planes. Change the numbers, slap the new nose art on there, and ta da!
Try doing that with the battered and oily messes that are Marine Corsairs. :D
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That's the beauty of machines from the same squadron/fighter group. Or at least those babied ETO planes. Change the numbers, slap the new nose art on there, and ta da!
Try doing that with the battered and oily messes that are Marine Corsairs. :D
LOL
:cheers:
You are forgetting that my original skin was a single layer. I have pushed that to nine layers for MOLLY. WEE WILLIE will probably wind up around 11 or 12 layers.
I have had to go back and make all the panel lines and rivets all over again. Thankfully I did manage to figure out the benefits of motion blur for flap and aileron gaps. Still, I have put in enough hours to have done 45 skins on just two. LOL
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here is the best shot we have of the entire plane, the picture doesn't appear to show the entire tail number but we are fairly certain this is his plane
(http://i1164.photobucket.com/albums/q569/bryguyw/563807_345790782122897_2039809715_n_zpseb11f8ee.jpg) (http://s1164.photobucket.com/user/bryguyw/media/563807_345790782122897_2039809715_n_zpseb11f8ee.jpg.html)
The only thing that throws me here is that a prior shot shows his airplane with a tiny bit of the QP code. It appears to be the hashed version as opposed to the solid.
Do you have any records regarding the squadron he flew with? We can perhaps narrow down his airplane by eliminating all those we know to find his if there are no pictures of his plane available. Otherwise this is a shot in the dark/best guess kinda' thing.
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I didn't notice the discrepancy with the QP code until you pointed it out. This leads one to believe that the plane in the foreground of picture 4 isn't the same plane as the other pictures but instead it may be the next plane back with the engine cowlings removed. hmmmmm, I'm gonna have to talk some more with the relatives. Interesting to also note the second plane in picture 4 has the black band of paint separating the yellow tail paint from the forward bare aluminum and the first plane in picture 4 doesn't.
Good eye Vraciu :aok
PS. it appears that the yellow wing strip is there and is on the bottom of the wing as well as the top. I can just barely see it in the photo with Bill sitting on the wing, and it is fairly easy to pick out what might be the stripe under the left arm of the crew chief in picture 3. If I stare at picture 1 long enough I can just make out a change in the grey scale of the photo where the yellow stripe should be. It's fairly easy to see on the first plane in picture 4, but then again it appears that plane is most likely not Bill's.
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It is time to call in the lyric1. :D
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I didn't notice the discrepancy with the QP code until you pointed it out. This leads one to believe that the plane in the foreground of picture 4 isn't the same plane as the other pictures but instead it may be the next plane back with the engine cowlings removed. hmmmmm, I'm gonna have to talk some more with the relatives. Interesting to also note the second plane in picture 4 has the black band of paint separating the yellow tail paint from the forward bare aluminum and the first plane in picture 4 doesn't.
Good eye Vraciu :aok
PS. it appears that the yellow wing strip is there and is on the bottom of the wing as well as the top. I can just barely see it in the photo with Bill sitting on the wing, and it is fairly easy to pick out what might be the stripe under the left arm of the crew chief in picture 3. If I stare at picture 1 long enough I can just make out a change in the grey scale of the photo where the yellow stripe should be. It's fairly easy to see on the first plane in picture 4, but then again it appears that plane is most likely not Bill's.
My first skin also had the black band on the tail. I haven't found an explanation for why it is there on some and not others.
Do some digging. I can add the tail code last.
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First day of work on Wee Willie.
- The W on the nose art is going to be a tough nut to crack but we will get there. For now I just have a place holder (I am assuming the lettering should be red) to give an idea what it will look like.
- I need to adjust the size of Bill's name on the canopy and repaint the latch.
- Working my way through the layers. Hope to have something presentable in a week.
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looks great vraciu! my attempts to find a tail number have come up empty so far and the family member that would be most likely to know is on vacation until next week. If I find anything I'll be sure to post it asap. :salute
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looks great vraciu! my attempts to find a tail number have come up empty so far and the family member that would be most likely to know is on vacation until next week. If I find anything I'll be sure to post it asap. :salute
No problem, bud. It will look better as I get into it more. Tailcodes and numbers can be added later. Now that I am working in layers we can mess with that stuff to our hearts' content until we get it right.
Just wanted to give you something to visualize while I work on it....
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It is time to call in the lyric1. :D
:aok
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Can't seem to leave this skin alone. I am only updating the progress for the OP. Don't judge it just yet. (No true spec or bump maps in these shots so apologies for that.) I have learned a thing or two since I put JO-BABY out there. Working on MOLLY as a follow-up to JB taught me a lot. JO-BABY was/is my pride and joy but this skin will wind up being way better than her or MOLLY. What I learned doing those I will apply now, then I will make MOLLY and JO-BABY better with what I have learned HERE. Pretty crazy how it works.
Any way...
Will clean up the name on the canopy later. Just trying to get the size right.
The upper wing skin looks choppy in parts. I will fix that. Ignore it. (I am trying to make the flaps appear different from the wing itself. I haven't blended everything as yet. It will look okay when I am done.)
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The progress looks great vraciu :aok I recieved a picture of his full plane whoo hoo :D The large letter on the tail is a "C" and the number is "463490". I'll try to post the picture on Monday
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The progress looks great vraciu :aok I recieved a picture of his full plane whoo hoo :D The large letter on the tail is a "C" and the number is "463490". I'll try to post the picture on Monday
Great news. I look forward to seeing it. Figured the number would be 43 or 44 to start. Italian Theater Groups did strange stuff though, markings-wise.
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as promised:
(http://i1164.photobucket.com/albums/q569/bryguyw/IMG_0160_zpsc1012750.jpg) (http://s1164.photobucket.com/user/bryguyw/media/IMG_0160_zpsc1012750.jpg.html)
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Terrific. Very helpful.
Now we need to determine what colors the letters are...
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Probably either black or dark blue, comparing to the other markings.
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I think they are black, but it is anybodies guess as to what color the cut in parts of the stencils are. They seem to be a lighter color than the yellow of the tail.
Also, I don't want to seem ungrateful here but it appears to me that your placement of the "wee willie" on the nose is too far aft. "wee" seems centered under the exhaust stack and the first half of "willie" is also under the exhaust as well. If it is too much trouble to move it then no worries. Thanks again Vraciu. :cheers:
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I think they are black, but it is anybodies guess as to what color the cut in parts of the stencils are. They seem to be a lighter color than the yellow of the tail.
Also, I don't want to seem ungrateful here but it appears to me that your placement of the "wee willie" on the nose is too far aft. "wee" seems centered under the exhaust stack and the first half of "willie" is also under the exhaust as well. If it is too much trouble to move it then no worries. Thanks again Vraciu. :cheers:
Agreed that the nose art is too far back. It also looks like it should be black while the insignia and it's lettering should be insignia blue semi gloss.
As for the spacing between the numbers on the tail, I don't think they are painted. It is a different color but I think it might be bare metal instead of the yellow that would have been there. If it's not, it's possibly a shade of white.
As for the glare shield, it looks too black. I would try changing it to a more olive color. It looks to be a lighter shade so try RGB: 95/94/78. I would also put a black mark around the prop spindle near the back to simulate a gap there. This will keep the spindle from looking like it's fused with the rest of the aircraft.
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Also, I don't want to seem ungrateful here but it appears to me that your placement of the "wee willie" on the nose is too far aft. "wee" seems centered under the exhaust stack and the first half of "willie" is also under the exhaust as well. If it is too much trouble to move it then no worries. Thanks again Vraciu. :cheers:
It is not in the right place. Just a temp placeholder while I get the scripting down. I will move it around to where it is supposed to be once I get the color and the font correct.
Constructive criticism is always welcomed. :salute
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Agreed that the nose art is too far back. It also looks like it should be black while the insignia and it's lettering should be insignia blue semi gloss.
As for the spacing between the numbers on the tail, I don't think they are painted. It is a different color but I think it might be bare metal instead of the yellow that would have been there. If it's not, it's possibly a shade of white.
As for the glare shield, it looks too black. I would try changing it to a more olive color. It looks to be a lighter shade so try RGB: 95/94/78. I would also put a black mark around the prop spindle near the back to simulate a gap there. This will keep the spindle from looking like it's fused with the rest of the aircraft.
To me the WEE WILLIE looks like it is the same color as the spinner. What say you?
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Probably either black or dark blue, comparing to the other markings.
Insignia Blue was suggested. You agree?
What squadron was this? This group had black and red tail codes that I know of for sure.
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Insignia Blue was suggested. You agree?
What squadron was this? This group had black and red tail codes that I know of for sure.
Could be, it's hard to tell. The black and insignia blue markings look very similar here.
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To me the WEE WILLIE looks like it is the same color as the spinner. What say you?
The problem is that the none of the colors appear to match in the photo. If we look at the tail, we know that it's supposed to be a yellow, but it's a dark color so it's probably a flat yellow instead of gloss. This makes it look in the photo like it's actually a shade of orange or possibly a light shade of red. This makes it hard to tell but I'm certain that the nose is red. I'm going to say that the "WEE WILLY" is a shade of black simply because that was the most common color used when just painting letters on the nose. Even when there is more complex art the letters are usually black. It's too hard to tell if it's a gloss or flat black so I'll leave that decision to you.
Edit: I made this quick reference with the colors that I usually use. The OD colors on the right were flat so they would appear much darker than what is actually shown.
(http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad258/DragonTamer1X/desaturate.png)
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Well, what about a black QP and a blue or red C ?
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The C looks red to me, especially when compared to the tail letters of the planes behind it. :headscratch:
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The C looks red to me, especially when compared to the tail letters of the planes behind it. :headscratch:
That would match "MARIE" which exists in a color photo.
Here is blue and black to compare.
- The Q is not the right size or shape. Presented here for color comparison only.
- The C is half BLUE and half BLACK for comparison. I think it should probably be red. Knowing the squadron Bill was in would likely solve that riddle.
- 'WEE WILLIE' is moved but is too small. Again, will get to that later on.
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Another shot without the proper spec or bump maps to compare black to blue for the letter codes. THE Q IS UNDER CONSTRUCTION.
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Defiantly black, though the black you have looks a bit dark. USAAF standard black was RGB: 44/41/38. It's a lighter shade of black and has a bit of gloss to it.
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Defiantly black, though the black you have looks a bit dark. USAAF standard black was RGB: 44/41/38. It's a lighter shade of black and has a bit of gloss to it.
The QP *AND* the C?
It does have some gloss to it but straight on like that it isn't showing. Will lighten it to the 44/41/38.
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I would stick with red for the "C", we know that it was used in the squad so it was probably a standardized thing. Though in the photo it does look like it's faded a bit, was it sent on missions by itself or as part of a small group I wonder?
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2nd FS 52nd FG, I believe
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2nd FS 52nd FG, I believe
If that is the case then it is likely all the letter codes are RED.
http://www.ww2incolor.com/us-air-force/P51-MARIE.html
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I think the red lettering rings true.
- I forgot the bottom (asymmetrical) hash lines on the Q. Will fix that.
EDIT IN: Fixed in the third picture. Also shows new nose art. Needs to be darkened, sharpened, and rotated.
- The bottom yellow stripe is in the wrong place. I am moving it from the BASE to the MARKINGS layer later.
As you can guess, this is a process and you work your way through it. I am not as fast as the experten like Greebo, Saxman, Devil505, etc.
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Just got confirmation from Bill's son (the real wee willie) that he was in the 2nd Fighter Squadron 52nd Fighter Group known as the "american beagle squadron" a parody of the famous "american eagle squadron"
Thanks a bunch Vraciu and everybody else who also weighed in. My dad and I are really looking forward to blazing around digital skys in a family warbird. :salute
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Just got confirmation from Bill's son (the real wee willie) that he was in the 2nd Fighter Squadron 52nd Fighter Group known as the "american beagle squadron" a parody of the famous "american eagle squadron"
Thanks a bunch Vraciu and everybody else who also weighed in. My dad and I are really looking forward to blazing around digital skys in a family warbird. :salute
That would make the red lettering plausible. I will stick with that barring evidence to the contrary. It also differentiates it from the other 52nd FG skin I already have in the game (different squadron).
Will try to make the next release, if not, should be no problem for the September update. No sense rushing if the time can be used to improve the skin. I can send you the files once I am done to fly it offline if we miss the coming release.
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The problem is that the none of the colors appear to match in the photo. If we look at the tail, we know that it's supposed to be a yellow, but it's a dark color so it's probably a flat yellow instead of gloss. This makes it look in the photo like it's actually a shade of orange or possibly a light shade of red. This makes it hard to tell but I'm certain that the nose is red. I'm going to say that the "WEE WILLY" is a shade of black simply because that was the most common color used when just painting letters on the nose. Even when there is more complex art the letters are usually black. It's too hard to tell if it's a gloss or flat black so I'll leave that decision to you.
Edit: I made this quick reference with the colors that I usually use. The OD colors on the right were flat so they would appear much darker than what is actually shown.
(http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad258/DragonTamer1X/desaturate.png)
Dragon, which Green/OD for the glareshield? To me it looks very dark even in the pictures.
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RGB 85/79/68 was the darker of the OD colors used for glare shields with 95/94/78 being the lighter.
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I would also put a black mark around the prop spindle near the back to simulate a gap there. This will keep the spindle from looking like it's fused with the rest of the aircraft.
I tried this and I can't get the effect right. The offset (wobble) of the prop spinner is making it look bad. Are you talking about a continuous line on the spinner base or just a black mark in a random spot?
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Here is a screen shot of one of my 51B skins. The spinner for the 51 textures are not straight for some reason so it was a bit challenging to get it right.
(http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad258/DragonTamer1X/Planes/section51B.png)
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Here is a screen shot of one of my 51B skins. The spinner for the 51 textures are not straight for some reason so it was a bit challenging to get it right.
(http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad258/DragonTamer1X/Planes/section51B.png)
Bless you, sir. (They're not straight on the D Pony either.) I will try to implement this. :salute
Hopefully I didn't miss any other critiques.... Gonna' try to get this in before the update. Will need to post some shots for a final review from the gang before I do though, so this will probably be a bridge too far this go...
(Looking forward to flying in formation with the OP in "Jo-Baby" -- two yellowtails in formation... Should be a nice picture) :)
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Here is a screen shot of one of my 51B skins. The spinner for the 51 textures are not straight for some reason so it was a bit challenging to get it right.
(http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad258/DragonTamer1X/Planes/section51B.png)
This is why I wish we could get skin templates that show the actual mesh rather than having to go by the default skin.
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This is why I wish we could get skin templates that show the actual mesh rather than having to go by the default skin.
That would definitely be helpful.
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Anyone know a trick to make the "WEE WILLIE" noseart look solid without bing pixelated? When I make it more solid it screws up the lines on the lettering. But when I get the lines correct it looks to opaque/faded.
Any suggestions are appreciated.
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I toned down the exhaust stain. It is still way heavier than anything in the photos we see. OP, you want it barely visible or take some artistic license?
Still working on the nose art. I am experimenting with the spec map to determine the best reflectivity for the yellow, particularly the tail. Flatter seems to look better so may press that direction (as someone mentioned the yellow on the tail looks flat in the photos).
What else? A little cleanup on the base layer to correct color errors.... A final run through on the spec and bump maps after I fix the nose art, exhaust, and the tail and we will be good to go. The data under the windshield may also need to be increased in size. Hard to be sure though...
(OH! Gotta' work on the spinner per Dragon Tamer's suggestion.)
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artistic license on the exhaust stain is good with me and I would lean more towards flat finish on the yellow tail.
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artistic license on the exhaust stain is good with me and I would lean more towards flat finish on the yellow tail.
Roger that. Should be done with it this weekend.
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Here is a screen shot of one of my 51B skins. The spinner for the 51 textures are not straight for some reason so it was a bit challenging to get it right.
(http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad258/DragonTamer1X/Planes/section51B.png)
As my bud Pipz would say, "HUZZAH!!!!!"
Works great. I need to tweak it a little for ENGINE OFF applications (my issue not yours--I implemented it wrong by a tad and will fix it). GREAT GREAT GREAT suggestion.
<S> :salute
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The problem is that the none of the colors appear to match in the photo. If we look at the tail, we know that it's supposed to be a yellow, but it's a dark color so it's probably a flat yellow instead of gloss. This makes it look in the photo like it's actually a shade of orange or possibly a light shade of red. This makes it hard to tell but I'm certain that the nose is red. I'm going to say that the "WEE WILLY" is a shade of black simply because that was the most common color used when just painting letters on the nose. Even when there is more complex art the letters are usually black. It's too hard to tell if it's a gloss or flat black so I'll leave that decision to you.
Edit: I made this quick reference with the colors that I usually use. The OD colors on the right were flat so they would appear much darker than what is actually shown.
(http://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad258/DragonTamer1X/desaturate.png)
Any idea why the yellow wing stripe does not look as dark as the tail? If both are yellow shouldn't they appear the same way? The picture of QP*V definitely looks like they are the same color. Must just be the way the camera picked up the lighting.
I am basically done. Just poring over every inch of the photos we have looking for missed details before finalizing everything.
There is another small set of lettering aft of the left side exhaust stack. Any ideas what this may be?
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Im new at the skin thing, how do you create your own new skins? Is it a download or something? I just want to learn how to do it. Thanks.
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Im new at the skin thing, how do you create your own new skins? Is it a download or something? I just want to learn how to do it. Thanks.
Visit Simmers Paint Shop, it has a lot of great tutorials. That is where I started and to this day I still use that site.
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Ok thanks Ill check it out! :aok
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Im new at the skin thing, how do you create your own new skins? Is it a download or something? I just want to learn how to do it. Thanks.
Heres a great why to see how to get started.
Krusty's skinning tutorial (http://www.nakatomitower.com/skins/)
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Heres a great why to see how to get started.
Krusty's skinning tutorial (http://www.nakatomitower.com/skins/)
That is a great tutorial but needs to be updated.
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That is a great tutorial but needs to be updated.
True, but it does cover the basics to get you started with the right files and such. After that, the skies the limit with how fast things change and people come up with new ways to make exciting additions to the already great skins these guys put out, yourself included.
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Im new at the skin thing, how do you create your own new skins? Is it a download or something? I just want to learn how to do it. Thanks.
Agree with everything said above.
You can get far with a program like PaintShop Pro. I have version 5. It does everything I need. I am still learning new techniques so any flaws in my skins are my fault and not the software's.
My number one piece of advice: learn to work in layers.
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Nice work Vraciu. Good to see somebody is going to get to fly a family plane. :aok :cheers:
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Nice work Vraciu. Good to see somebody is going to get to fly a family plane. :aok :cheers:
Glad to do it. Just hope Skuzzy approves it.
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Submitted.
I think all will be pleased with the result. It is a striking scheme, especially with the red letter codes.
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Bill Eddins Jr. AKA WEE WILLIE is working up a bio on his dad to go with the skin. He is also working up info on Fred Orre using info his dad had about Orre. V I can't express enough thanks for all the work you have put into this. The best I can do is a heart felt Thank you! :salute
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Bill Eddins Jr. AKA WEE WILLIE is working up a bio on his dad to go with the skin. He is also working up info on Fred Orre using info his dad had about Orre. V I can't express enough thanks for all the work you have put into this. The best I can do is a heart felt Thank you! :salute
Very happy to have done it. Up to Skuzzy now.
Will add the bio elements later when the skin update function comes online.
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Skuzzy okayed it. It is in the game now. Congrats, Tmetal, and all the fans of the Yellow Tails.
I have discovered some mistakes and areas that need improving. Will get to them and await the skin update tool. Enjoy it for now. I flew it a lot tonight. <S> to Lt. Eddins.
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frickin awesome! thanks vraciu :salute
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frickin awesome! thanks vraciu :salute
Glad to do it. <S>
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Got to fly the skin last night and rediscovered my complete lack of ability to fight in the mustang. It was all made better knowing I was attaining such remarkable levels of suckage while flying a plane with a family name stenciled onto the canopy frame.
Thanks again Vraciu and thanks Skuzzy for the skin approval/inclusion :salute
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Got to fly the skin last night and rediscovered my complete lack of ability to fight in the mustang. It was all made better knowing I was attaining such remarkable levels of suckage while flying a plane with a family name stenciled onto the canopy frame.
Thanks again Vraciu and thanks Skuzzy for the skin approval/inclusion :salute
Well, fwiw, it is my favorite skin to fly. Wish I had caught the mistakes before I submitted, but after awhile one gets cross eyed and has to take a break. Lol
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I realize this thread has been dormant but didn't want to start a new one.
Since the D Pony slots are full I have decided to try and do some major improvements on my existing skins.
One of the toughest things has been nose art lettering. Thanks to Greebo, Devil, etc. etc. I have discovered the magic of the GAUSSIAN BLUR technique. With that knowledge I tackled what was my biggest disappointment in "WEE WILLIE" of the 52FG, 2FS.
I have to say it looks dramatically different--better, more accurate to the original aircraft. You be the judge. (Page one of the thread has pics of the real airplane.)
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The lettering is much improved.
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Thank you, Sensai.
:)
I should have uploaded this to give more context...
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For those following this thread here is a link to the updated airplane.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,387322.msg5147557.html#msg5147557