Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Sky Viper on October 24, 2001, 11:05:00 AM
-
Very odd the way some people think.
Last night a guy attempted to pass ops info to his country by changing to Rooks and then passing what he saw on the Rooks Country Buffer.
Obviously not a smart feller, since he didn't remove himself from his squad and gave away his origins.
I first learned of his activities from a true Gentleman who must have trusted me to do what was right. This Gent (which shall remain nameless) was good enough to point out on private comms that he was receiving info on Rook ops. He was a Knight. He also told me where the info was coming from and confirmed that is was passed to the general Knight community.
The cheater/spy logged after I had a private chat with him, and no discernable damage was done as a result of his efforts.
Later, I chatted in private with the spy's CO. The CO expressed that he didn't feel that it was "Cheating," and that spies are a part of life. He also made the point that it is, "Just a game."
I think they got the point. (I hope)
My oppinion, and I hope others will express their's as well.
Yes, this is JUST A GAME! So, why spy? You would probably accomplish more by just flying with your squad.
Viper
-
because everyones a 'tard.
-
There are many with duel accounts in AH too. Whats to stop them? Nothing except counter-intelligence, many of my missions state one thing, but once airborne, the target in the mission is not necessarily the target we opt for.
-
OFF WITH HIS HEAD!!!!!!
[ 10-24-2001: Message edited by: Swager ]
-
It was a knight.
Man Im glad I missed that. Im not a good enought sport for that kind of thing.
:mad:
-
I wish people would stop this baloney with "hiding identities to protect the morons". While yes, this is a just an online game, what he/she did is ridiculous and it could have unnecesarily ruined someone elses online enjoyment last night. I personally would like to know who it was so that when I able to enjoy my infrequent, but very valuable online time, I do not waste any of it by associating with this person(s). At least I can be on guard and know before hand who not to include in any online plans.
Westy
[ 10-24-2001: Message edited by: Westy MOL ]
-
Some well known Bish/Rook/Knits would share info about CV's being placed way off map to hide them, I thought this 'network' was a very good thing to prevent folks like Fester from hiding CV's.
-
If the "OPS INFO" mentioned being passed in the first post was about CV's being stashed off map then I concur this was not a jeuvinile "spy" type of thing but a good move to help counter "absolute" dweebery.
Westy
[ 10-24-2001: Message edited by: Westy MOL ]
-
It was mrfish, and you changed the countries to protect the innocent?
-
Originally posted by Ripsnort:
Some well known Bish/Rook/Knits would share info about CV's being placed way off map to hide them, I thought this 'network' was a very good thing to prevent folks like Fester from hiding CV's.
One of the verra few things we agree on Rip
The other being:
BRING THE BLACKWIDOW TO AH!!!!!
-
Nah Westy, I was online at the time, the ops info was not about CV locations but more along the lines of "They're upping from Base X to hit Base Y".
-
Originally posted by Westy MOL:
If the "OPS INFO" mentioned being passed in the first post was about CV's being stashed off map then I concur this was not a jeuvinile "spy" type of thing but a good move to help counter "absolute" dweebery.
Westy
[ 10-24-2001: Message edited by: Westy MOL ]
This was not the case.
This feller was passing launch activity and targets as discussed on Ch2.
:(
Viper
-
Who fricking cares?
If you were worth your salt, you'd keep anything you deemed "critical information" on private/squad comms. Worry about you and yours... not the rest.
AKDejaVu
-
Well that sukks.
Anyone have a film made during this time in case they don't want to name anyone?
I think this is the kind of thing HTC would rather we (the community) handle than get them involved. And to handle it we need to know the who's. :)
"Who fricking cares?"
I for one do. That behavior and it's condolence by some is detrimental to AH imo. I'd prefer AH had a 'mature' and "simulation bent" image to the online public versus one that reflects dweebery like this. I would rather spend my online time "flying and fighting" with people who are out to have fun versus trying to ruin others enjoyment.
Westy
[ 10-24-2001: Message edited by: Westy MOL ]
-
I'm confused here. Who did what? Some guy switched countries to give info to the other side? What info and who did it?
I confess that I have gotten fellas from other countires to .wingman somebody I wanna kill, and give me vectors on private channel. I don't consider this cheating since I wasn't giving away country info.
Spying and giving vital country info away is pretty sorry, and I wouldn't consider it funny if I was the guy who's mission was getting screwed up.
-
someone is cheating to beat us Rooks ? LOL
that's sad considering we are usually outnumbered and out fielded at least 2 to 1 by any other country.
as someone else said "what a tard"
-
"Who fricking cares?"
I for one do. That behavior and it's condolence by some is detrimental to AH imo.
Your worried about what is detrimental to AH and you still participate in this thread? Something of a paradox.
I'd prefer AH had a 'mature' and "simulation bent" image to the online public versus one that reflects dweebery like this
Please... offer your definition of mature so that everyone knows how to behave.
Here's my definition: Maturity is not worrying about what everyone else is doing.
as I'd rathe "fly and fight" with people who are out to have fun versus trying to ruin others enjoyment.
Wait... I thought you were looking for something "simulation bent"? You mean espionage is not realistic? You mean taking precautions against it is not realistic?
People will act like tards no matter where you go. It is unrealistic to think that AH should be some kind of safehaven from them. This place is not in existance on the web.
It then becomes a matter of the maturity level being defined by how the community acts towards such events/dweebs. I'm sorry, but "WITCH HUNT!" does not fall in that category. "YOU'RE RUINING OUR FUN!!!" doesn't either. I fail to see how it is mature to be so easily manipulated by a moron.
You want maturity? Learn to ignore these people. Learn to work around them. Learn to cope. Until then, you fall into a different category... its just not a category that is more mature... it only involves more whining.
AKDejaVu
-
"People will act like tards no matter where
you go"
That's what your post boiled down to. You want to play semantics with the rest of my post have fun. I'm not interested.
OF course people will act like tards. However it's up to the players to help define what is acceptable and not. I feel that what you're saying is that you think "anything goes" is fine. It's ok. You had a problem with HTC's "potty werd" filter too did you not? I take it from you that you believe the recipient of these unwelcome and undesirable actions is supposed to do nothing about what they feel is wrong? To just ignore it. Well, that doesn't work as this is the internet. Unsavory behavior multiplies with the lack of action and a will by players to be part of something that's they'd like to be more than a shallow kiddie pool.
What do you stand to lose if assinine behavior like this is resisted and players work to decrease it? Why participate in this topic yourself if behavior such as this means nothing to you and you can easily ignore it?
Westy
-
"People will act like tards no matter where
you go"
That's what your post boiled down to.
You missed the other part of it. People will also act like hollier-than-thou salamanders no matter where you go. One begets the other.
You feel that it is better to be in one of these two camps than the other. I'd personally rather see neither.
Basically... without one, there is no vindication for the other.. they die out. You promote each other's existance.
AKDejaVu
-
"I'd personally rather see neither"
Impossible. But only we can decide how much of either is wanted and allowed to exist.
I'm not holier than thou even though you can try and label me as such. I'm pretty darn liberal in fact (imo anyway). How about you call me elitist or a snob if anything? I just prefer an entertainment environment free of foul mouthed little nitts (cough) like JoeDirt or Gunman26, a game/sim where cheating is not tolerated and a place where the online community doesn't resemble a kids game of hide and seek with little Johnny AK shouting "here he is, here he is!" and giving someones hiding spot away.
Westy
-
If you use the term "ruin my fun" you are a hollier-than-thou salamander. Only one person ruins your fun.
As for wether or not it is possible... sure it is. Without one, the other disappears. Will they rear their ugly heads from time to time? Yep. Of course, it will simply be a polarity test to check for the opositely charged knob. No response... no need to stay. Of course, neither side can accept this because it would mean nullifying their justification for their actions.
AKDejaVu
-
No. I think you're wrong.
Just as when in a movie theatre, a restaraunt or a pub I should not be expected to put up with unwanted behavior. there is an expected code of conduct no matter where you go. Some places have none and other are more stringent. If the clientelle and managment of those places condone such activity by being complacent and turngin a blind eye to it then they deserve the rep the places get. Some customers (such as I) may wish for it not to be that way and will try to help things out.
Whats your excuse and position?
I'll be clearer and more to the point for you.
In AH I hope that such community bonding things such as respect, decencty and couresy flourish. In an anarchy, which is essentially what you espouse, none of them exist.
Basically to me these three things mean ("you" and "yours" mean to any arena player, not you particularly),
respect: I fly my way, you fly yours. Don't tell me how to fly in the
arena nor tell me what I should be doing while in there. And definately
don't rat out on what I may be doing as far as ops against other
non-friendly players.
courtesy: just say nothing or at most give a <S> "nice fight" when
you're shot down. Can it with the "you'd not gotten me if you hadn't
warped" crap or "fediddleing warp on demand cheater assh0le!!" baloney.
And if you get shot down in a chute who cares. Don't bail next time.
Got vulched? Take smart pills and go use another field. No other
fields? Then swap countries for the time being.
and
decency: who cares if you hit a fediddleing tree that was in your way
when you took off and you're such a toejamty pilot you couldn't get airborne
before hitting it. Or your fediddleing dumb bellybutton wings ripped off because
you dove too fast. Or some fediddleing warping bastard shot you down. Or that
you feel it is your duty to inform the arena that AH suxors big camel
units and you think brand XXX is the best sim online. Take your lumps and
learn. To many have spent far too much time getting the "whine" down pretty
good while lacking in actual onlin fighting/combat skills.
To me ratting out other players intentions, cheating to compensate for
being endowed with "little ones" and being unable to control ones impulse
to type out swears online violate all three of thoise.
Again this is all IMO. I just wonder why you feel the need constanlty take a civil disobedient stance and once again back the negative, non productive position?
Westy
[ 10-24-2001: Message edited by: Westy MOL ]
-
respect: I fly my way, you fly yours. Don't tell me how to fly in the
arena nor tell me what I should be doing while in there.
Great idea... but...
And definately
don't rat out on what I may be doing as far as ops against other
non-friendly players.
For that second part, don't you mean "excuse me while I tell you exactly what you can or cannot do."?
As for your movie example... you seem to be the type that would go to a porno and complain that the guy 3 rows over was jerking off.
Or.. how about this.. is it bad that someone is being disturbing in the theater? Is it worse when someone gets up and confronts them about it? Please... tell me how the latter eases the situation or helps in the slightest.
To me ratting out other players intentions, cheating to compensate for
being endowed with "little ones" and being unable to control ones impulse
to type out swears online violate all three of thoise.
Wow.. hard to argue with that one westy. Dare I say.. there is no need to argue with it. You prove my point ever so eloquently. Let's put quotes around all "insert dirty word here" statements and then follow it with condemnation of swearing.
The word has meaning? What is more important.. the word or the meaning? Please... stick to your "you can say anything as aweful as you want as long as you don't use dirty words" argument as long as you want. Just don't try to argue for a more mature audience at the same time.
And please, stick to "don't dell me what to do" while defining "what is acceptable" argument too.
They are both peaches!
Done with this one.. the horse done died.
AKDejaVu
-
Deja at his worst.
-
I guess if you swap sides to give info, its worse than PAYING for a second account so that you can fly for the other team and give info?
A guy who has two accounts helps you and AH, he pays for 2 accounts yet only uses the same bandwidth as single account players +) therefor taking nothing away from the rest of us.
SKurj
-
he's just pissed because:
A)Oregon had the the longest running home win streak as of last friday...had...
B) it rains alot in Oregon, depression starts to set in right about now.
-
Originally posted by Pongo:
Deja at his worst.
I think he's upset because someone complained about him at the movies :)
-
Originally posted by AKDejaVu:
Wait... I thought you were looking for something "simulation bent"? You mean espionage is not realistic? You mean taking precautions against it is not realistic?
People will act like tards no matter where you go. It is unrealistic to think that AH should be some kind of safehaven from them. This place is not in existance on the web.
It then becomes a matter of the maturity level being defined by how the community acts towards such events/dweebs. I'm sorry, but "WITCH HUNT!" does not fall in that category. "YOU'RE RUINING OUR FUN!!!" doesn't either. I fail to see how it is mature to be so easily manipulated by a moron.
You want maturity? Learn to ignore these people. Learn to work around them. Learn to cope. Until then, you fall into a different category... its just not a category that is more mature... it only involves more whining.
AKDejaVu
.....shuddup Deja, sheesh.
Tumor
-
Hello guys!
Ah come one, cool down....
We here in germany still know that companys from US collect information about us factorys and development, and still some company fires americans here in germany after find out they give secrets to Us-Companys....
And Im also sure our companies will do exactly the same with US-Companys....
But, so what? Thats the game... And we are still allied and still be friends... :D
I get shoot down 5 times before I get a kill but everybody who kills me get some friendly words on open channel, because its a game :D
So if some of you abuse about spying its ok, but no one in germany would declare war to US because your country try to get informations about german science and factorys.... And also you do not start a war because Daimler Benz buy Chrysler ;)
Lets have some fun and meet mostly nice poeple in AH, ok?
:D
JV44 (Andreas)
-
Originally posted by Eagler:
I think he's upset because someone complained about him at the movies :)
hehehe Eagler. He shoulda been further than 3 rows away, huh?
-
he's just pissed because:
A)Oregon had the the longest running home win streak as of last friday...had...
I have one word for you. Mariners. Suck it up buddy! :)
B) it rains alot in Oregon, depression starts to set in right about now.
That's like someone in hell commenting that it gets hot in Texas! :D
SOB
-
:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
(Looks for Con 2000 photos of SOB to doctor up!) ;)
-
Originally posted by AKDejaVu:
Who fricking cares?
If you were worth your salt, you'd keep anything you deemed "critical information" on private/squad comms. Worry about you and yours... not the rest.
AKDejaVu
Deja, put your bellybutton back in your pants.
Let's see: Not everyone fly's with a 20 member squad of guys that can make it up in large groups.
Not everyone can get together more than once a month.
Some guys don't even fly with a squad.
Q. What does that leave?
A. Your fellow countrymen.
I know this is generaly irrelevant to the AK's (Not all AK's :) ) since you guys jump from home to home like a bunch of nomads, but the rest of us depend on each other and other squads.
That is the reason why Ch. 2 & 3 are kept to their own country.
Sharing, planning, and coordinating are what makes things work. When things work, they are fun.
I wish you could learn some team friendship skills from some of the guys in your Squad. Perhaps AKLarry would be a good person to ask for guidance. ;)
Viper
-
Originally posted by SKurj:
I guess if you swap sides to give info, its worse than PAYING for a second account so that you can fly for the other team and give info?
A guy who has two accounts helps you and AH, he pays for 2 accounts yet only uses the same bandwidth as single account players +) therefor taking nothing away from the rest of us.
SKurj
How twisted your logic is!
So, you might apply this logic to say voting for president?
If we can get the government to let us pay twice as much tax, then we would in turn get the right to cast 2 votes?
It's a damn game! For fun!
Perhaps cheating is ok? Would it be cool for the Chinese using a hacksaw on the Gymnastics Bars at the Olympics? I mean, if the rest of the competitors were worth their salt, they would see the cuts before they compete right?
Maybe, the Bulls could shrink the hoop at one end of their court!
No, it's not ok. But then they have regulations because people actually try stuff like this.
Our community has the chance to be different.
We can accept the idea that it unfair to cheat. We don't need regulations to tell us that we can't pass info that hinders a country from having fun.
We are gentlemen, we just do it.
Viper
-
Ahem, AKDeja,
You might want to take your own advice, lest you seem like a hyopocrite.
You want maturity? Learn to ignore these people.
and
You missed the other part of it. People will also act like hollier-than-thou salamanders no matter where you go. One begets the other
Seems a shame to me that guys cant post their feelings like Westy has done without having someone try to put them down for it. Its this type of behavior that really degrades the BBS and the community.
If the cheating doesnt bother you, say so and leave it at that. It really isnt necessary to try to insult or belittle someone because they happen to feel differantly.
I agree with Westy in that this cheating/spying has no place in the game.
dago
[ 10-24-2001: Message edited by: Dago ]
-
"...Here's my definition: Maturity is not worrying about what everyone else is doing...".
Just about the dumbest thing I've read in quite awhile.
bowser
-
Originally posted by AKDejaVu:
"...Here's my definition: Maturity is not worrying about what everyone else is doing...".
Funny Bowser, I was just thinking:
Odd definition. I mean, I havn't worried about what anyone else is doing from the very first moment I poked my head out and thought 'Christ it's bright out here'.
Aw heck, I could pick at DJV all day.....I'm just happy he's enabled ratings and I got to give him a 1.
(http://www.swoop.com/images/logo_small.jpg)
-
SKVP..
HT isn't going to tell ppl "no you can't give me more money for a 2nd account."
All you can do is deal with it. Hey If we all bought 2 accounts HT would have more than double the development $$ so things would maybe happen sooner +)
SKurj
-
I think I'll hack AH and increase speed etc for my plane.
After all, it's only holier than thou people who'll disagree with this. And I won't be told how to fly or what to do.
Sorry Dejavu, not with ya on this one :D.
Westy put it quite clearly IMHO :)
-
Cheating is cheating, pure and simple. It means you are a bad sport and that is not welcome in any game, especially one you have to pay to play.
There is a grey area where people are "gaming the game" but when it comes to sending information from one team to another (for the other teams advantage) that is definitely cheating.
How would a professional sportsman be treated if he was giving info on all their plays to the other team? Why should it be different here?
My $0.02.
-
Not the first time, and won't be the last. We have many three year olds in the game and that will never change. You can expect it to get worse, too, as more AW'ers and WB'ers move over here.
We need a permanent squelch list/config file, and we need to forbid country-country comms for recently defected individuals.
-
let me see this from another point of view: theres someone who pays $ for AH and spends his time watching what others countries do and report it, instead of flying and enjoy the fight??
Bahhh.... such a deviated behaviour, is he a kind of voyeur?
Has HT to take care of his mind status and give him a chat with a good psychanalist?
Can the whole community of AH do something for this poor wretched suffering from mind aberrations? :D :rolleyes:
Give us the name plz :p
-
The so called "grey area" of gaming the game is big. I dont think it is cheating since the program allows it. Are those using two Hispanos to kill heavy tanks cheating? Are those scissoring and rolling B-17s at 30K cheating? Were those M16 tank killers cheaters? Were carbombers cheater? I dont think so. Honour? Sportmanship? C'mon, this is a game so relax.
However, I think that HTC should stop these things *ASAP* with game fixes. When I say *ASAP* I dont mean the time it took to fix carbombs, weak-tracks and offmap flying
:mad: ;)
[ 10-25-2001: Message edited by: gatt ]
-
Santa do not think plz..... did you saw AH memory dump ?
Flying 190 is better fun that traceing vars
:cool:
-
A player spends his online time going to another country.
Waits for a very rare massive bomber mission 30 minutes away from any green interception to come over channel...
(How long could this take? Hours? Days? Tours?)
He then relays the massive blob of radar dots to everyone that can see them from his country as he killshooters himself on the force.
This MUST be stopped and posted everytime!
HTC, please help.
-
Originally posted by CavemanJ:
One of the verra few things we agree on Rip
The other being:
BRING THE BLACKWIDOW TO AH!!!!!
yes yes YES!!!!!!!
:D <<< buy's beer for the house
-
Someone pointed out: "espionage is a part of war..." or something to that effect.
Its also a part of war to hang the bellybutton hole when you catch him commiting such crimes. So lets linch the bastard.
"its not cheating"
correct no its not, its exploiting a obvious flaw in the game.
-
my personal opinion is this is sad behaviour.
Its a game.The idea is to play with equal peices to see who is better on the day.
We dont play card games and send a friend behind the oponent and tell us what they have.well i guess some people would but I certainly wouldnt want to.Where is the sense of acheivement when there was no skill involved?
I make missions in this game for ALL of our enjoyment.So now we have to be carefull of WHO we let in to them???
Its hard enough to get people IN let alone make sure they are not spying and telling the enemy where you are attacking.
I can see to a certain extent that in war there were spies and so if its possible in this game it is part of the game BUT consider the fact we have no 'counter intelligence' no organisation working in the background stopping spies like they did in the war.Spies in the real world risk death generally as when caught they have no rights.In AH all we can to is CHAT to them and try to appeal to their sense of fair play.(LOL).
Well countries killed spies, can we have the same??????
lets just execute the spies :D.When we catch them we can vote and agree to BAN them from our county, better yet, banned from the game for a few days.
You people that spy in this 'game' want your kicks for giving away positions and ruining that players day can have your fun.
But when we catch you it should be time for OUR fun.As the game is..Where is the challenge or risk for spying? where is the 'gaming' challenge? HELL, wheres the REWARD?
I cant remember the word now but its a german word for someone who gets pleasure out of other peoples misfortune(and i dare not attempt to spell it :D) and that is the type of person who gains any pleasure out of sitting in an aircraft and just watching as his info is used to kill other anaware gamers trying to have fun and win.
NAME the spy.
NAME the squad.
thats what i say, and HTC give us somthing we can do to them when we find them.sorry for this long post but I really dont appreciate this sort of crap going on.I didnt like the CV hiding either.Off mapping is also a form of cheating if you ask me.
its all BS gaming the game.
-
"To me ratting out other players intentions, cheating to compensate for
being endowed with "little ones" and being unable to control ones impulse
to type out swears online violate all three of thoise.
"
No shat.Unfortunatly we have to many people that are in this for points and the macho dick thing.They change countries as solo or squads to find better pickings.No attempt at loyalty,no attempt at Dignity.But the problem as stated is we have no recorse to deal with this kind of problem.The only thing we can do is put them on channel 1 and 2 and show what there doing.Let the arena decide how its accepted because most dont read the boards.Put it out in the daylight online.Let everyone know.It bull and should be stopped but the majority doesnt even know about it.We had these asswhipes in AW too.
-
well im lost there is to much to read ;) BUT i was there when the knights were cheating. 8thpapppy had some "inside" info with the "spys" witch almost every knight made fun of him them becuase half the time they got the wrong info. so of corse if some of u know me well enough :p i started making fun of the "spy" make the negative into a posative :) flame and BURN the "spy" :D
-
Cheaters have small stones and even smaller minds.