General Forums => Hardware and Software => Topic started by: JimmyD3 on May 07, 2015, 10:30:24 PM
Title: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyD3 on May 07, 2015, 10:30:24 PM
Any suggestions on a good MOB and CPU, along with a Case. I have saved several threads of recent builds, just wanted to know some additional opinions. Looking to build a strong new system in the not to distant future, for a budget of around $1200 to $1500. :rock
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Gman on May 08, 2015, 07:23:06 AM
Skylake is due out in the next quarter, if you can hang on just a little, that should drop the prices on everything else that's current now - ie you don't need to build a SL based platform, but it'll make building an 1150 platform cheaper most likely.
Most folks agree that the i5 4690k is the best performance to price ratio CPU out there. That combined with any reasonably decent mother board, 8 to 16 gig of ram, an SSD boot drive with a 1 or 2gb 7200 rpm drive, and a decent vid card, either a 970, 980, or one of the new AMD cards due out soon depending on hey the perform for the price, will land you right around your budget max. So far as brand names, case types, whatever, there are lots of good options, usually 3 or 4 builders/makers that are superior to all the others. The only place where everyone seems to agree that there is a single "best" option is PSU in my experience - Seasonic, or a Seasonic built Corsair or other manufacturer PSU is worth whatever few extra $ it might cost based on every factor out there.
Adding a sound card if you're into sound or have higher end headphones/set is one of the few other options that is debatable among many, I like the Creative Labs Z, but there are a couple others for 100$ or less that will improve audio for gaming or most anything else, so if you have $ left over in your build budget, this is a good place to drop it IMO if you're a gamer.
As Skuzzy just said in another thread here, most gaming companies games rely on GPU power more so than CPU, so if you need to cut costs in the build, the LAST place to do it is with the GPU, pick one of the faster cards as stated like the 970/980 and so on, and keep it in place in your build regardless of whatever else. Price may come down on those too soon, as the 980ti and some other new stuff is due out soon (not counting the Titan, as it's a category all its own at over 1000$).
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Bizman on May 08, 2015, 08:59:40 AM
Gman pretty much nailed it except for the case.
There's plenty of them to choose from and even the cheapest ones may be excellent. As I'm not a fan of water cooling, a well breathing case is what I'd look for. I'm not a fan of cases with front doors either, sooner or later you'd forget the door is open and you break the hinges. So here's my idea of a good case:
All mesh front for good air intake. Usually with places for one or more large fans and easily cleanable filters to avoid dust.
More than 5 inches wide for cable management behind the motherboard plate. That means an inch or so on both sides of the optical player. This can easily be seen even in a small photo.
At least 12 inches space between the backplate and hard disk for even the longest video cards. Notice that if the HDD's are mounted lengthwise, you'd have to count some extra space after the mounting rack for the protruding HDD and its cables.
A sturdy enough construction even with the sides detached. The weight can be used as an indicator, a 10 lbs case seldom is a s robust as a 30 lbs one.
Plenty of places for large exhaust fans.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Gman on May 08, 2015, 09:22:04 AM
Heh, I actually deleted/edited my blurb about cases, as it's so easy to get carried away with so many options.
One thing I would add, and this is just personal pref, is to consider a case with handles on the top. It makes moving it around so much easier, especially if you have a large case with lots in it, or if you need to move it often for various reasons like frequent upgrades, cleaning, whatever. I agree with all of Biz's points, very important stuff that's easy to overlook. Corsair makes a decent case with rubber spring loaded collapsing handles on top, and Cooler Master makes one with fixed tubular handles that run the entire length of the top of that case. Both good options if this feature interests at all.
Corsair C70, Cooler Master Storm Scout 2, or for a little more $ the Cosmos SE, all have great handles built in, and fit into most if not all of the criteria Biz spelled out very well. I have a Corsair 780T for my 5960x built, it's full size, while the others I mention that I have (The Cosmos and C70) are more larger mid sized cases, the Cosmos being a bit taller than the C70, which is fairly large for a mid sized on its own. If you really need/want a full size, for the $ it's hard to go wrong with the 780T if you ask me, while not having dedicated handles, the top cover overlaps and makes it real easy to grab and heft about, even though it's larger and heavier than typical cases (mid sized). Very well built and designed. As Biz mentioned, you can often tell by weight how solid the build of the case is, and the 780T empty is nearing 30lbs, and full is well, well over that, and feels as solid as a tank. (Snatch Quote - Weight is sign of reliability...I always go with reliability...and if it doesn't work, you can heeet him with eet).
I've had excellent luck with both of these companies, but cases are easily the most subjective thing out there, even with all the good points Biz has made, there are dozens if not hundreds of options out there that meet those requirements IMO.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: ebfd11 on May 08, 2015, 09:30:04 AM
On my recent build I used a Corsair H540 case... (http://www.corsair.com/~/media/Corsair/Product-Photo-Root/A/air540_hero_up_1.png)
Its a dual chamber case with lots of room for upgrading to water cooling and awesome airflow... separate hot docking for your HDs and for its size... you can get a Extended ATX Mb in there..
Just a thought ...
LawnDart
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Gman on May 08, 2015, 09:35:54 AM
Nice option Lawndart, I know a lot of H20 custom guys use that case, I've seen it in dozens of youtube vids, that's a good point to bring up as well, as using custom h20 is much easier these days than before, with so much pre fab kit around, and vids showing how simple it is to set up and maintain.
That Jayztwocents guy used a similar case to that Corsair you have LD (it's a custom copy pretty much) for a recent water cool build - I really like the dimensions of these types of cases, and likely will use a similar one or that very Corsair for one of my newer upgrade builds once Skylake is out.
O/T if you want to see a crazy custom h20 build, check out his Skunkworks box he built, 3 Titans, insane drives/cooling...10 thousand dollars easily.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEO1ZZTA0d4
Back on topic, one thing I would suggest to the OP is also strongly, strongly consider setting some budget $ aside for a VR headset. It's likely these things in the next year may become...not necessary, but very important to the gaming experience with upcoming games. Perhaps it won't be necessary for another year or so, but after that...just something to consider. As is the LCD you choose to run, for bang/$, personally I would get a 144hz 24 or 27" 1080p from Asus/Benq/Etc. I spent over 2$K on the latest 144hz 1440P and 4k Gsync options, and find it to be not that worth the expense, nor was the 4k 27" Asus Gsync...I still find 1080p 144hz to be the most useful way to game, as 4k just isn't "there" yet with most mainstream game options in terms of performance and what not. Just my opinion. Doing it over I would save $ for VR upcoming headsets, and spend 300$ or so, even less, on a good 1080p 144hz monitor of some kind, as I haven't noticed much improvement really moving from those to the Gsync 4k and 1440p lcds I went to.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: MrRiplEy[H] on May 08, 2015, 09:44:43 AM
For any sort of sims VR is going to be the thing. As soon as they get rid of the bulkyness and improve the resolution, it'll be golden.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyD3 on May 08, 2015, 10:14:34 AM
Thanks for the feedback guys, trying to soak it all up :aok
Keep it coming, any suggestions are appreciated.
what about different motherboards, are there different models or setups that are better than others?
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Bizman on May 08, 2015, 10:33:47 AM
One simple rule for motherboards: Don't pay for features you won't need. Of course you'd like a board which allows for fine tuning and overclocking, featuring the fastest chipset of the time. What I mean, many boards come in multiple variations with the same basic circuitry. The different models of the series may include Raid, Wlan, multiple Pci-e slots etc, the actual speed remaining exactly the same. The extra features may easily triplicate the price of the board.
So if your aim is to build a basic gaming rig with a single video card, don't pay for SLI/Crossfire, Raid or Wlan. Save that money for a better video card.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: shppr01 on May 08, 2015, 10:37:26 AM
I did my build about a yearand a half ago , and love it .. I used an AMD A10-6800K APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics (4 CPUs), ~4.1GHz. I have a Geoforce GTX 650 Card and run about 60 - 80 FPS with all the bells and whistles on . My case is a Roswell Mid tower I picked up on AMazon for around 60.00 . All in all , I spent what I could afford which isn't much ! Total for my build was around 600.00 .
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: shppr01 on May 08, 2015, 10:40:30 AM
Bizman is right .. Think aboutwhat you want as far as fans (how many ) and how many Extra slots you want . Mine was middle of the road but had the right fan slots and extras I wanted ..
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: ebfd11 on May 08, 2015, 10:52:06 AM
I have an ASUS Z97 Pro http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=8992452&CatId=8586
An I7 4970k CPU http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=9085222&Sku=GNT-102501225
Corsair H110 cooling for the CPU http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835181035&nm_mc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC&cm_mmc=KNC-GoogleAdwords-PC-_-pla-_-Water+%2f+Liquid+Cooling-_-N82E16835181035&gclid=CjwKEAjwvbGqBRCs3eH4o5C74CYSJAB3TODsHGeMZTLpj_hqA6wml8o2OeOg9CklS-L8Hf8NNXQy-BoCvb7w_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds Of course i have a 1 TB WD Black hard drive..
The PSU I have is a Corsair 850 watt http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=9160999&CatId=2533
all stuffed neatly into my little case... I have dual cards due to the fact I am running triple monitors.. with Trac IR ...
If you want I can post some pics if you need to see how clean everything looks..
LawnDart
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Dark on May 08, 2015, 12:24:28 PM
One thing about cases that I wish I had learned before hand. Is how easy is it to clean the mesh and fan. I have a antec 1200 and to take apart the fans and clean them is a real pain.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: MrRiplEy[H] on May 08, 2015, 01:45:05 PM
One thing about cases that I wish I had learned before hand. Is how easy is it to clean the mesh and fan. I have a antec 1200 and to take apart the fans and clean them is a real pain.
Try the Fractal Design case... super easy filter removal and overall assembly. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRZIdbdcIiU
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyD3 on May 08, 2015, 04:06:56 PM
On my recent build I used a Corsair H540 case... (http://www.corsair.com/~/media/Corsair/Product-Photo-Root/A/air540_hero_up_1.png)
Its a dual chamber case with lots of room for upgrading to water cooling and awesome airflow... separate hot docking for your HDs and for its size... you can get a Extended ATX Mb in there..
Just a thought ...
LawnDart
LD that is the case I got today, along with a Corsair HX850i power supply. Just picking up parts as my pocket book allows . :D
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Gman on May 08, 2015, 06:41:26 PM
Good stuff Jimmy. I'll keep my eyes open for sales/deals on other components as well. Picking stuff up as you go along as you're doing is a great option, you can find some really good deals and save a surprising amount of $ with a bit of patience.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: ebfd11 on May 08, 2015, 08:55:00 PM
Jimmy you will love the flat cables for the PSu makes wire management allot easier and they look sweeter too, and that case has ALOT of room for cable management.
Good choice on the case, I have the white one with black accents, which did you get.
LawnDart
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyD3 on May 09, 2015, 08:41:15 PM
I got the Black one, :aok
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyD3 on May 10, 2015, 09:48:23 PM
Ok, next what would be a good CPU and Mother Board?
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: ebfd11 on May 11, 2015, 09:59:59 AM
Here is a good combo... decent CPU and great motherboard with room for upgrading in the future and relatively priced
Here is one from Tiger Direct ... use the parts to fill your rig and save the other things for back ups or transfer to make a second rig..
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=9559206&CatId=31 Just some things to look at
LawnDart
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: ebfd11 on May 14, 2015, 10:28:54 AM
Jimmy any new updates sir???
LawnDart
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyD3 on May 14, 2015, 05:19:16 PM
Lawn Dart, None yet been busy at work last few days. I like the i7 4790k at 4.0Ghz CPU & the EVGA 04G-P4-3975-KR GeForce GTX 970 SSC ACX 2.0+ 4GB 256-Bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 SLI Support Graphics Card .
I was wondering though, should I get a GPU that is UHD compatible, (this may be a silly question I am NOT a computer tech lol)?
I think the above gives me the best long term performance options. Let me know what you think or any suggestions you may have. :salute
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Bizman on May 15, 2015, 04:10:00 AM
Think about the UHD compatibility this way: Are you going to get a 4K monitor in the near future? If not, UHD compatibility would not be an issue.
As you may have noticed, there's two separate paths to follow concerning high end monitors. Some like the lightning fast frame rates of a 144 Hz monitor while others like the razor sharp details of 4k. Most likely these paths will unite someday, making a 144 MHz 4k monitor the best choice. 2560x1440 27" 144 Hz monitors are already available making a reasonable compromise of both worlds.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyD3 on May 15, 2015, 10:23:18 AM
Thanks for the feedback Bizman, my eyes are not what they used to be ;) so a large monitor, in the future is likely. Will the UHD compatible cards declare that in the specifications?
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Bizman on May 15, 2015, 11:29:15 AM
For aging eyes another thing to take into consideration is, that a high resolution on a small -ish screen may result very small text. A 15" laptop with a 1080p screen running default settings is unreadable to me. Windows 8 does a little better job than its predecessors in scaling, simply because it was built at the time when higher resolutions started to be mainstream. No wonder that many of my friends have rather chosen a 27" instead of a 24" with the same resolution.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyD3 on May 16, 2015, 11:01:53 AM
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Bizman on May 16, 2015, 11:21:45 AM
Beautiful! I know I'm a little old fashioned here, but I've never been short of time - at least not short of a single minute or two. I must admit, I've missed a bus sometimes, seeing its rear lights, but that hasn't been due to a slow computer.
What I'm trying to say is that instead of the SSD get a GTX980, it'll improve your gaming much more than the SSD. Agreed, it'd raise your budget by a hundred, but if that's an issue you could lower your PSU wattage or "metal" value a little, something like a Gold rated SeaSonic SS-750KM3 would not be a bad alternative at all.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Pudgie on May 16, 2015, 01:53:20 PM
Beautiful! I know I'm a little old fashioned here, but I've never been short of time - at least not short of a single minute or two. I must admit, I've missed a bus sometimes, seeing its rear lights, but that hasn't been due to a slow computer.
What I'm trying to say is that instead of the SSD get a GTX980, it'll improve your gaming much more than the SSD. Agreed, it'd raise your budget by a hundred, but if that's an issue you could lower your PSU wattage or "metal" value a little, something like a Gold rated SeaSonic SS-750KM3 would not be a bad alternative at all.
Made the changes Bizman, I think I can live with the cost increase. :t
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyD3 on May 19, 2015, 05:32:01 PM
Picked up the Motherboard, CPU and Memory today. Hope to get everything else in a couple of weeks. :D
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyD3 on May 27, 2015, 12:50:53 AM
Picked up the last of my items today, now on to the build!! :x
Any suggestions on the actual installation or precautions let me know. :rock
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: MrRiplEy[H] on May 27, 2015, 03:39:34 AM
Picked up the last of my items today, now on to the build!! :x
Any suggestions on the actual installation or precautions let me know. :rock
Check the ripleys build replay thread for pointers.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyD3 on May 27, 2015, 11:30:08 PM
Got it up and running, installing software now. Didn't remember it taking this long :old: Had a little bit of a problem with the HD, discovered I hadn't seated it properly, got that fixed and every thing is going good. Trying to find some software that will allow me to copy my existing HD and move it all over.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: MrRiplEy[H] on May 28, 2015, 12:03:50 AM
Got it up and running, installing software now. Didn't remember it taking this long :old: Had a little bit of a problem with the HD, discovered I hadn't seated it properly, got that fixed and every thing is going good. Trying to find some software that will allow me to copy my existing HD and move it all over.
Why don't you just plug your existing hd to the new computer? If you're planning to clone the operating system, don't. Do a clean install.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Bizman on May 28, 2015, 01:01:34 AM
Got it up and running, installing software now. Didn't remember it taking this long :old: Had a little bit of a problem with the HD, discovered I hadn't seated it properly, got that fixed and every thing is going good. Trying to find some software that will allow me to copy my existing HD and move it all over.
As MrRipley said, cloning your operating system would be a bad idea. I assume, though, that you've already installed the OS since you say you're installing software now. There's programs for transferring installed software, but I'd prefer installing every program from scratch, too.
As for copying your files from the old disk to the new one, Rip's idea of plugging the old hdd to the new computer is the easiest solution. No need to seat it properly, a "hanging mount" as they called it at nerd school will do.
Hint: Do the copying in Safe Mode, there'd be less hassle with ownership and other processes.
Hint2: Before removing the old hdd from the old computer, remove your login password and make your files visible for all users if you have them protected. Otherwise you might see your profile folder showing as empty in the new rig. A bootable Linux CD/DVD can also be used for copying without NTFS protection interfering the process.
A good program to ensure everything gets copied is Unstoppable Copier by Roadkil (http://www.roadkil.net/program.php?ProgramID=29), available both as standalone and install version. In case something is broken and thus can't be copied, the program simply informs about it and continues with the next file until the batch is done. Especially with XP and older OS'es a corrupted file was a PITA, it would simply end the copy process in the middle of nowhere, without no idea what has been copied and what not, not even telling which file caused the stop. 7 and 8 do a little better job, allowing to bypass a problematic file. Yet I still rely more on the Unstoppable Copier.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyD3 on May 29, 2015, 01:31:40 AM
Thanks guys, just have some emails and bookmarks I don' want to loose also have some old Quick Books files I want to keep. So far been moving things across on our local LAN and being somewhat successful. :cheers:
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Bizman on May 29, 2015, 02:08:40 PM
For small amounts like that I usually use a memory stick. None of my customers seem to have a home network, so building it for a one-time purpose would be overkill. In an existing network that's a viable solution, though.
As for bookmarks, IE saves them in your profile, easy to copy from there. Other browsers let you backup them into a desired location like Desktop or even a USB stick, allowing you to restore them into your new computer as one batch.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyD3 on May 30, 2015, 10:42:56 PM
Thanks Bizman, I'm getting there slowly but surely. :rock
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyC on June 22, 2015, 05:50:10 AM
Wow..this has been a great read as I am prepping to build a rig ..first time..and it's been a help to read for sure.. My pc died a couple of days ago..5 yrs old xp..hd won't be recognized so..I'm stuffed Os gone and almost all my day to day stuff.. 1tb external HD holds my music photos and movies though.. Now to build a new rig that will last another 5 yrs.. I want it as a gamer but office/home too... this thee ad has a Lotta good Intel Thanks JimmyC
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: MrRiplEy[H] on June 22, 2015, 09:01:40 AM
Wow..this has been a great read as I am prepping to build a rig ..first time..and it's been a help to read for sure.. My pc died a couple of days ago..5 yrs old xp..hd won't be recognized so..I'm stuffed Os gone and almost all my day to day stuff.. 1tb external HD holds my music photos and movies though.. Now to build a new rig that will last another 5 yrs.. I want it as a gamer but office/home too... this thee ad has a Lotta good Intel Thanks JimmyC
What did you test the hdd with? Computer not booting up is not the same as the hdd not being recognized. Try booting the computer with a linux live cd and see if you can read the drive using it.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: JimmyC on June 22, 2015, 02:24:48 PM
I have 2 hdd.. 1 was my old one from last pc..have it as extra storage and old info.. when I go into bios at start up my main hdd is not there but my second one is..I've changed the power over and sat a leads to see if it's cables..does not seem to be..
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: Bizman on June 23, 2015, 09:33:56 AM
Swap the cables to see if it's cable/connector related. If the currently showing hdd continues to show and the main refuses to show it's in the disk.
Title: Re: Good Strong Build
Post by: MrRiplEy[H] on June 23, 2015, 10:40:52 AM
Swap the cables to see if it's cable/connector related. If the currently showing hdd continues to show and the main refuses to show it's in the disk.
Even then many times only the control board is damaged, swapping it may enable restoring the data. If only he can find a second hand duplicate of his old drive.