General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Brooke on August 25, 2015, 02:29:38 AM
Title: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Brooke on August 25, 2015, 02:29:38 AM
I haven't owned a shotgun before.
I'm thinking about an inexpensive one for home that I can have fun with at a range for shooting skeet and targets. It doesn't have to be the best gun for skeet.
Also, I want a 20 gauge (in case that makes any difference).
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: BuckShot on August 25, 2015, 06:40:09 AM
I like the build and feel of the 870 better, but the location of the safety on the Mossberg is real nice. As I'm sure you seen, the Mossbergs generally cost less than the Rems.
I have an 870 3.5" super mag and have never had problems with it. There are more barrel options for the 3" mag chamber, so I'd buy that one of I were to do it again.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: branch37 on August 25, 2015, 07:07:24 AM
I like the 870s myself, but I have heard some negative things concerning the ones you get from big chain stores like Academy or Wal Mart. They put some kind of coating on the inside of the barrel and after a handful of rounds it gets hot and causes the gun to jam. You have to forcefully eject the empty shell. That's just what they guys at the gun store told me. They said Remington does it to cut corners on bulk orders to save money. If you go with one from a smaller gun store that doesn't order in bulk, you're probably fine. Mine works wonderfully. Again, just what I heard.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: TequilaChaser on August 25, 2015, 07:16:45 AM
I would go with the Mossberg
Is only shotgun to pass the requirements/qualifications of the USMC/USNAVY for many years now...
Hope this helps
Edit: you did not specify whether you wanted single shot/double barrel (side-by-side or over-under), semi-auto, pump, or selective semi-auto/pump ..... Still, Mossberg 500 series has a good selection of different types
TC
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Spikes on August 25, 2015, 08:59:19 AM
I like the 870s myself, but I have heard some negative things concerning the ones you get from big chain stores like Academy or Wal Mart. They put some kind of coating on the inside of the barrel and after a handful of rounds it gets hot and causes the gun to jam. You have to forcefully eject the empty shell. That's just what they guys at the gun store told me. They said Remington does it to cut corners on bulk orders to save money. If you go with one from a smaller gun store that doesn't order in bulk, you're probably fine. Mine works wonderfully. Again, just what I heard.
I'm not sure they would change the way they make guns for particular stores. Unfortunately they started cutting corners when they were bought by the Spanish and got rid of all the good QC employees. I've toured the factory in Ilion, NY (about 30 mins from me)...pretty cool stuff to see.
I have an old 870 Wingmaster and a newer (maybe 6 years old) 870 that my father bought me and the quality is like night and day.
I'm thinking about an inexpensive one for home that I can have fun with at a range for shooting skeet and targets. It doesn't have to be the best gun for skeet.
Also, I want a 20 gauge (in case that makes any difference).
The thing with these basic shotguns is that there are a lot of options such as wood or synthetic, barrel length (you said you wanted it for the home as well as range, defense guns are generally 18.5" barrels while skeet barrels are a lot longer (26-28"). A 20 gauge may cost you a bit more than a 12 just because they are slightly less popular and mass produced.
Here are a couple links: http://www.mossberg.com/product/500-all-purpose-field-50136/ http://www.mossberg.com/product/500-all-purpose-field-56436/
The wood gun will have a nice blued barrel finish and will look more aesthetically pleasing at the range, but the synthetic will be less prone to dings and scratches and also has a matte-blued finished barrel.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Maverick on August 25, 2015, 10:17:48 AM
When it comes down to it, the ammo for a 20 is almost always quite a bit more expensive than the 12 gauge. The felt recoil difference isn't all that significant either to justify the expense of the ammo. 12 Gauge is also far easier to find in the store.
If you are going to have a pump shotgun try to get one with a screw in choke system. That way it has more flexibility in the field or range than a single fixed choke tube does and it is cheaper to swap out chokes than barrels.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: SysError on August 25, 2015, 10:44:39 AM
I once saw an hour long show on Purdey. I could not find the show I saw, however, I came across this:
James Purdey and Sons: How to Make a Handcrafted Gun
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSKBPBTnmIM
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Aspen on August 25, 2015, 10:47:38 AM
Either should give you years of service. The 870 off the shelf points better for me but that can be different from one shooter to the next. I've owned a bunch of both over the years and they all functioned and shot well. 870's have changed and on new ones its not uncommon for them to have minor issues with rough edges or little things that make them run less smooth. A Wingmaster from the 80's would usually cycle like butter right off the bat.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Brooke on August 25, 2015, 11:07:04 AM
Is only shotgun to pass the requirements/qualifications of the USMC/USNAVY for many years now...
Hope this helps
Edit: you did not specify whether you wanted single shot/double barrel (side-by-side or over-under), semi-auto, pump, or selective semi-auto/pump ..... Still, Mossberg 500 series has a good selection of different types
TC
I would like to get a pump.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: TequilaChaser on August 25, 2015, 11:18:59 AM
Then I truly recommend getting a Mossberg, I'll grab my 2015 Gun bible and send you some different models to checkout after I get back from taking Dad to his eye doctor for his checkup, he had surgery on both eyes last week
TC
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Brooke on August 25, 2015, 01:12:56 PM
Best wishes for your Dad.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Rich46yo on August 25, 2015, 02:10:38 PM
Tough call. For a hunter/clays gun I'd go 870. For a defense/fighting gun I'd go mossie. Mostly because it has an ambidextrous safety.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Aspen on August 25, 2015, 02:16:24 PM
I love pump guns but if the main purpose will be trap, skeet, sporting clays stuff, I really prefer an over/under or an auto. Pumps absolutely can be effective but for skeet or clays where you have doubles, they aren't as popular.
In the lower price range, a Stoeger or TriStar will do the job for a casual shooter.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: zack1234 on August 25, 2015, 03:32:48 PM
I have reported Brooke to the authorties stating he is obssessed with japanese bombers in secs :old:
He is not fit to own a firearm or a wooden spoon :old:
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Nefarious on August 25, 2015, 03:35:33 PM
Saiga 12 :)
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Brooke on August 25, 2015, 04:05:32 PM
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: morfiend on August 25, 2015, 06:26:28 PM
Brooke,
If I had your coin I wouldnt cheap out and I'd get a Krieghoff!
If you are interested I can get you intouch with a friend who could get you 1 for the"right" price.... :devil
:salute
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: mbailey on August 25, 2015, 07:36:53 PM
Mossberg all the way. I have a 500 that I've had since I was 13yrs old. I've hunted with it every year since I've had it. The thing is indestructible....it just goes and goes and goes and goes. I own quite a few very high end firearms and my 500 is by far my favorite. The 870 is fine, but the reliability of the Mossberg is amazing
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Widewing on August 25, 2015, 08:06:27 PM
I own an 870 and a 500 Mossberg, so lets talk about pump guns.
Each has certain advantages.
Both are reliable like a brick wall.
I find the 870 is better balanced and the action is the slicker of the two.
I also prefer the 870's safety, being more tactile.
Mossberg's have dual extractors rather than the 870's one. While both guns extract reliably, the Mossberg's redundancy could save your bacon one day. Moreover, the extractor on the 870 is brazed to the inside of the receiver. If it ever breaks, it means a trip to the gunsmith and no small amount of $$ to fix it. Mossberg's extractors are retained by screws. If one breaks you can change it at your kitchen table for a few bucks and 10 minutes of your time.
So, if reliability is a prime consideration, I'd select the Mossberg. If smooth function and great balance are a big factor, go with the 870.
Both manufacturers have budget shotgun lines that cost less, but are no less reliable. Maverick is Mossberg's budget brand, while Harrington & Richardson (H&R) is Remington's low cost entry shotgun.
I owned a Maverick years ago and it was a great home security shotgun. I gave it to my sister's husband and replaced it with an H&R Pardner Protector. This is a dedicated security shotgun, that is a literal clone of the 870 action, with a slightly re-shaped receiver. All 870 accessories fit it. Barrels, however, are NOT interchangeable. Around $200. It weighs about 1/2 pound more than the 870 as it has a beefier action and thicker-walled receiver. 18.5" barrel, black nylon furniture with sling swivels. Holds 5 in the magazine, plus 1 in the chamber. Parkerized finish.
Ultimately, all the above will do what you need. There are no bad choices here.
Edit to add photo of my H&R.... (https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/ab/4f/c7/ab4fc799e43d136aaa7e5b941d579eed.jpg)
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: SIK1 on August 25, 2015, 08:34:20 PM
I have a Mossberg 500A. I've had it for years. I bought it used from a friend who bought it new in the 80's. It has never not worked for me.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Widewing on August 25, 2015, 11:14:58 PM
Mossberg's have dual extractors rather than the 870's one. While both guns extract reliably, the Mossberg's redundancy could save your bacon one day. Moreover, the ejector on the 870 is brazed to the inside of the receiver. If it ever breaks, it means a trip to the gunsmith and no small amount of $$ to fix it. Mossberg's extractors are retained by screws. If one breaks you can change it at your kitchen table for a few bucks and 10 minutes of your time.
I noticed a typo... Fixed.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Brooke on August 26, 2015, 02:05:05 AM
Excellent.
I'm interested in the H&R or the Maverick. :aok
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: mbailey on August 26, 2015, 05:44:40 AM
Good write up Widewing.
Don't get me wrong I really like the 870..my sons first shotgun was an 870 youth model, and I own an 870 slug gun. Reliable as heck and neither have ever failed us. The biggest reason I went for the 500 was the location of the safety. Being that we hunt, and use bolt action rifles, I chose the 500 as the safety's are in the same place and wanted my boy to develop muscle memory when it came to disengaging the safety as both are relatively in the same place. That said Mossberg now makes the safety switch out of plastic which I don't like. My lifelong hunting buddy had his break and had to replace it. That said you can go on eBay and find the metal replacement ones... They are dirt cheap under $20, and it takes more time to order it than it does to physically replace it....heck I think I have one laying around here Brooke if u want it, I'll put it in an envelope and send it to you.
Oh forgot to add to my first post, I got it when I was 13...I'm 44 now and have abused that gun in the woods for 31 yrs....and while she's not pretty anymore, I'm fairly certain that it will be there and working 31 yrs from now.
Morf, I live down the road from Kreighoff and know Dieter personally.... He makes one hell of a piece of artwork....to call it a gun would be like standing in a hurricane and saying its a bit breezy :D
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: DaveBB on August 26, 2015, 05:57:40 AM
I have the 870 express from Walmart. It is a cheaply made gun. Lots of plastic parts. Have to forcefully expel the spent shells. And here's the dangerous part, I can never remember which way the safety is supposed to go.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: branch37 on August 26, 2015, 06:33:09 AM
I have the 870 express from Walmart. It is a cheaply made gun. Lots of plastic parts. Have to forcefully expel the spent shells. And here's the dangerous part, I can never remember which way the safety is supposed to go.
There's some kind of coating on the inside of the barrel that causes spent rounds to get stuck when the barrel heats up. You can have a gunsmith (or probably do it yourself) polish the chamber to remove the coating and it will solve your sticking problem. Or so i'm told.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Rich46yo on August 26, 2015, 07:46:26 AM
Safety is easy. If you see red the gun will shoot. I like the ambidextrous safety of the Mossie for defense cause Im an ambidextrous shooter. Its no great skill. I am right handed with a dominant left eye so I shoot rifles, bows, slug guns, lefty which has left me with the ability to shoot anything lefty.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Oyabun on August 26, 2015, 08:03:40 AM
Not a mention of Benelli :headscratch:
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: DubiousKB on August 26, 2015, 11:46:29 AM
Can't go wrong with an 870, it's what I grew up with... I graduated to a real gun only a few years ago...
Where are the places to get the best price on the H&R Pardner and Maverick 88?
I'd just shop around some sporting goods stores or local gun shops...Dicks, Gander Mtn, Bass Pro, Cabelas. Now is a great time to buy since most stores will be running all sorts of deals for the fall hunting seasons. My store sells the Maverick for I want to say $250-300 or so IIRC.
Recently Remington has stopped production of the Handi rifles and shotguns (H&R brand), so I'm not sure if that also includes their pumps.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: FLS on August 26, 2015, 07:57:54 PM
I'd just shop around some sporting goods stores or local gun shops...Dicks, Gander Mtn, Bass Pro, Cabelas. Now is a great time to buy since most stores will be running all sorts of deals for the fall hunting seasons. My store sells the Maverick for I want to say $250-300 or so IIRC.
Recently Remington has stopped production of the Handi rifles and shotguns (H&R brand), so I'm not sure if that also includes their pumps.
I believe that Remington sold H&R to Marlin.....
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: 68ZooM on August 26, 2015, 10:17:11 PM
For hunting and sporting clays I use an 870 it was my grandfather's, for home defense I got the Mossberg 500a holds 9 rounds O/O buck,strobe flashlight and a holographic sight, 6 position stock. Nothing scares the heck out of intruder more than the sound of a pump shotgun cycling.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: mbailey on August 27, 2015, 06:12:27 AM
Nice furniture on that shotgun. I had a Merkel that I loved but sold it to get a Kreighoff K-80 with a reverse trigger and an Umberger stock....needless to say it kills the Clays beautifully
Funny tho my Mossberg is still my favorite (dad bought it for me on my 13th bday)
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Changeup on August 28, 2015, 02:09:07 PM
Amen. I've got a Benelli SBE II and for a 20g, their Montefeltro (Walnut). The SBE comes with 6 factory chokes and fires 2 3/4, 3 and 3 1/2 shells for all of your bird and critter needs. Plus, it's Italian and everyone knows Italians know guns and cars. :neener:
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: mbailey on August 28, 2015, 02:21:43 PM
Amen. I've got a Benelli SBE II and for a 20g, their Montefeltro (Walnut). The SBE comes with 6 factory chokes and fires 2 3/4, 3 and 3 1/2 shells for all of your bird and critter needs. Plus, it's Italian and everyone knows Italians know guns and cars. :neener:
Just bought my son the SBE in camo turkey model (steady grip) great guns.....he plastered his turkey this year from 45yrds with Winchester Long Beard rounds....
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: FX1 on August 29, 2015, 01:04:56 PM
I have a Benelli SBE, M1, and also a 20 Nova. The others in my safe are two 870, 500, Winchester defender, Beretta 28ga and a couple side by side.
Cant go wrong with the 870. Smooth action and the older ones are built to last. Mossberg isn't even close to the 870 for balance and overall quality. I have older 870 and i haven't shot a new one so my experience might be different than others.
The best all around pump shotgun is the benelli nova.
My favorite truck shot gun is the Winchester Defender.
The 870 with a extension and 21 inch barrel is a great all around gun. Cant go wrong!
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Getback on August 30, 2015, 04:27:35 AM
When it comes down to it, the ammo for a 20 is almost always quite a bit more expensive than the 12 gauge. The felt recoil difference isn't all that significant either to justify the expense of the ammo. 12 Gauge is also far easier to find in the store.
If you are going to have a pump shotgun try to get one with a screw in choke system. That way it has more flexibility in the field or range than a single fixed choke tube does and it is cheaper to swap out chokes than barrels.
I bought a 100 rounds of 20 gauge for less than $30. I'm not sure what 12 gauge cost.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Spikes on August 30, 2015, 08:29:20 AM
Well, Marlin bought H&R about 15 years ago, then Remington bought Marlin and H&R came with that package in 2007ish. All owned by Freedom Group anyway so one big happy family. :cheers:
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Nefarious on August 30, 2015, 10:56:52 AM
I'd still take Saiga 12 or Vepr 12 over anything else (standard shotgun wise) for home defense.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Widewing on August 30, 2015, 01:38:01 PM
Moreover, I prefer the reliability of a pump gun over any semi-auto, even that Franchi LAW-12. Home defense is last ditch and last ditch must be as simple and reliable as humanly possible. The one shotgun always loaded in my home is a pump gun.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: fbEagle on August 30, 2015, 02:56:43 PM
My 870 magnum (12ga.) is one of the best guns I own. Never shot a mossberg so my opinion is moot lol
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Shuffler on August 30, 2015, 03:14:24 PM
I have the Moss 500 with 18.5 barrel and pistol grip. I keep one at home and one in my truck. I also have the standard barrels, dowels, and stocks should I want to hunt.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Changeup on August 30, 2015, 07:16:24 PM
I have the Moss 500 with 18.5 barrel and pistol grip. I keep one at home and one in my truck. I also have the standard barrels, dowels, and stocks should I want to hunt.
Whats with the shotguns in the trucks? lol.
A Beretta 92FS or HK USP will keep them far enough away that their body wont hit your truck and get blood all over when they fall. I mean, really. Why the need to wash your truck after you've saved the wife or beautiful girlfriend?
Unless ofcourse, you've mastered pistol grip slug shootin which is Purdy good
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Shuffler on August 30, 2015, 08:34:49 PM
A Beretta 92FS or HK USP will keep them far enough away that their body wont hit your truck and get blood all over when they fall. I mean, really. Why the need to wash your truck after you've saved the wife or beautiful girlfriend?
Unless ofcourse, you've mastered pistol grip slug shootin which is Purdy good
I will not be the guy short handed. I carry a 45 and a 22 on my person. The shotgun is if needed. I'll go as far as to say that most folks I know have a scatter gun in their truck.
We were on vacation just a few weeks back. While out at a restaurant with friends there we got to talking about guns... turns out that of the 5 couples there, every man was carrying and two of the women were. Really not unusual here.
The ideal situation is when you have them and never need them.
Just the other night, right over in Houston, we had some turd walk up behind a Sheriff Deputy and shoot him down execution style....... you just never know.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Changeup on August 30, 2015, 08:55:41 PM
I will not be the guy short handed. I carry a 45 and a 22 on my person. The shotgun is if needed. I'll go as far as to say that most folks I know have a scatter gun in their truck.
We were on vacation just a few weeks back. While out at a restaurant with friends there we got to talking about guns... turns out that of the 5 couples there, every man was carrying and two of the women were. Really not unusual here.
The ideal situation is when you have them and never need them.
Just the other night, right over in Houston, we had some turd walk up behind a Sheriff Deputy and shoot him down execution style....... you just never know.
Unusual here? You mean Texas where I live or a special scatter gun part o Texas? Lol.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Shuffler on August 30, 2015, 08:58:56 PM
I'd still take Saiga 12 or Vepr 12 over anything else (standard shotgun wise) for home defense.
I bet you can shoot a 870 better than a ak style shot gun. I went dove hunting with a saiga 12 and didn't have much luck. A straight stock 12ga is hard to beat for pointing..
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Nefarious on August 31, 2015, 08:36:38 AM
I bet you can shoot a 870 better than a ak style shot gun. I went dove hunting with a saiga 12 and didn't have much luck. A straight stock 12ga is hard to beat for pointing..
I don't doubt it, im talking a sporterized Saiga with a pistol grip. Im an AK fan boi, so my opinion is sort of biased. I would never bird hunt with an AK style shotgun.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: SilverZ06 on August 31, 2015, 12:51:18 PM
Keep in mind for self defense in he home you want a short barrel for maneuverability, however on a sporting clay course you generally want a longer barrel. I would never consider my 32" Browning 725 as a self defense gun. It's way to long to get around a corner. It will tear a clay up though (assuming the idiot behind the stock points it in the right direction and doesn't shoot behind the bird :bhead.) I would get a short barrel 500 for Home defense and another shotgun for clay duty. My first clay gun was a $400 28" barrel "remington" from walmart. I say "remington" because it was actually a russian made Baikai or something like that. I shot fine with that for a while before moving to an over/under.
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Changeup on August 31, 2015, 01:42:50 PM
Texas! I used to carry a couple of rifles in the back gun rack but turds todays will steal them.
Ha! I've got an AR15 on mounts under my F150's back seat with 3 mag holders. It just never occurred to me to have a spraygun in truck...unless you can think of a reason I'd need a door-breacher lol!!!
Title: Re: Mossberg 500 or Remington 870, which to get?
Post by: Aspen on August 31, 2015, 05:15:44 PM
I only shoot clays a couple times year but I figured I should look the part and get an o/u. I just picked up a Golden Eagle 5000 o/u 12g. These were made by the same folks in Japan that made the Winchester 101s in the late 70's. Basically the same gun with the addition of a big, gaudy gold eagle on the side :D