Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Hardware and Software => Topic started by: LCADolby on July 05, 2016, 07:22:41 AM
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Before it was the gfx, and now the boot SSD died last night, a Corsair Neutron XT series... Only been in use since October 2015.
A complete fail only allowing access to the bios, even with SMART off..
:bhead
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I don't see a question in your post, so . . . maybe this post will help?
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,380014.msg5060608.html#msg5060608
:grin:
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What is the make and model power supply in that computer?
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Corsair CX 750
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Corsair products considered good, but my corsair ram experience taught me to stay away. They will replace the hardware np but its annoying as hell, with a boot drive arghhhh.
Can you fac reset it? I have a piece of software that allows me to facset my ssd's, from manufacture. Maybe a bios flash will do this, my drives do a destructive flash when bios updated........just thoughts.
Its not a port issue or bad cable........................ ...
That is a short life span.
:O
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Your SSD has something like a 25% failure rate within the first year. It's more money, but I have had excellent experience with the Mushkin Reactor.
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Channel Well makes that power supply. Not bad supplies, but they are mostly known for making adequate supplies to keep costs down. The use of lower costs capacitors helps keep the cost down, but hurts the longevity of the supply. Over time, they drift, but worse, the voltage regulation suffers and causes a lot of drift.
Not a power supply I would consider for use in my computers. This one is pretty sloppy. It may have contributed to the death of your components.
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I don't know where you find information like that Skuzzy. I tried looking it up and come away with nothing.
That being the case Dolby you can't go wrong buying a Seasonic X750 Gold. I've had one out of 27 fail, and it was just age that caused that problem.
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I don't know where you find information like that Skuzzy. I tried looking it up and come away with nothing.
That being the case Dolby you can't go wrong buying a Seasonic X750 Gold. I've had one out of 27 fail, and it was just age that caused that problem.
Over the years I have accumulated quite a bit of data on power supplies. When Antec's power supply quality went downhill, they were using Channel Well for their supplier. I got a lot of data during that period as we were using Antec, at the time.
Here is a recent review by HardOCP (http://www.hardocp.com/article/2015/01/21/corsair_cx750_750w_power_supply_review/1). Goes into more detail. I think it corroborates what I said.
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Over the years I have accumulated quite a bit of data on power supplies. When Antec's power supply quality went downhill, they were using Channel Well for their supplier. I got a lot of data during that period as we were using Antec, at the time.
Here is a recent review by HardOCP (http://www.hardocp.com/article/2015/01/21/corsair_cx750_750w_power_supply_review/1). Goes into more detail. I think it corroborates what I said.
IIRC, it was you who pointed out my antec PSU might be the problem,and it sure was! Saddly it cost me a MB,cpu and ram.
I changed to an early corsair TX and it's been running my old desktop since 06!
:salute
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I know Challenge, I tried before to try and find out which specific Corsair PSUs were of Seasonic origin and which weren't, without much success - obviously this isn't something they are advertising. Skuzzy has been right though on the cases he's commented on regarding this. It would be nice if there were an easy to access place to find out which exact models of various brands are Seasonic manufactured and just rebranded. You would think with Seasonic's reputation that companies like Corsair would be happy to have that info out there, but perhaps they feel it would hurt sales of their non Seasonic made stuff too much...
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Like in the closing notes of Skuzzy's link, I was one of those buying on the reputation of the name... I got it wrong in my initial build putting that in, I believed my components were sound choices :confused:
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I somehow think that having the knowledge and stats on something does not mean as much as we might think. For the most part, all my choices are still working as pc's. I only knew enough to match components, much less know about manufacturing and such. I choose to over build for my use, using server grade hardwares for mere desktop usage. All tho they crapped out, I used to have all PC's on UPS's that cleaned/conditioned the power.
really like OCZ SSD. Kingston ram works great, makes me wonder about their SSD's. Not like all the different companies use different nand.....
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Well, SSDs tend to be sensitive to electrostatics, but a failing power supply can take anything down. Probably the higher failure rate of the Neutron XT is caused by people choosing a PSU like the one Dolby chose. The Corsair RMx series of PSUs is made of much better stuff (the RM850X for instance). I would stick to the Seasonic PSUs myself, because there is no mystery as to who made them.
It's not always about the NAND. Design, controllers, and other considerations play into it also.
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Cheaper made power supplies lack fine regulation, for the most part. An easy way to tell if you have a cheap power supply is to go into the BIOS of any recent motherboard, and look at the voltage monitor in the BIOS.
If the voltage levels are changing, at all (for any of the voltages), then you have a cheap power supply that will end up taking out sensitive components, or giving you grief in other ways (i.e. lockups, overheating, noise...).
Granted, that is not the only thing indicating a cheap supply, but it is the only metric most people will have direct access to.
As far as a quality 750W supply goes. I recently had a Seasonic 750W (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151087) supply on my bench, and it was an outstanding supply. Rock solid and clean power. Reasonably priced as well, I think.
If you do not have access to an oscilloscope, then I would suggest sticking with Seasonic power supplies. They are always a known quantity. Sure, you can get a bad one, but it is not a design issue which causes that.
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By the way, Corsair uses three different companies to make their supplies. Seasonic, Channel Well, and Flextronics. The problem is they are interspersed within the same family line (i.e. TX, GS...).
I can track down who made each model. It does change from time to time. You really never know what you are getting with a Corsair supply, if you do not check first.
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Here's the list of brands and their manufacturers from 2013 - although already three years old, many models still are available or at least in use: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/power-supply-oem-manufacturer,2913.html (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/power-supply-oem-manufacturer,2913.html)
More on the subject for those who like reading:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/power-supplies-101,4193.html (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/power-supplies-101,4193.html)
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/psu-buying-guide,2916.html (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/psu-buying-guide,2916.html)
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/best-psus,4229.html (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/best-psus,4229.html)
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Is anyone familiar with FSP PSUs? I have a 700W Aurum series 80+Gold. The original review several years ago was quite good. I looked at voltages in the BIOS as Skuzzy suggested. Just to be sure I checked the right values they were for Vcore, DDR15V, +12V, Vcc3, Vcc, and Vtt. I watched them for 5-10 min and could see that they updated (flashed) several times but the values never changed, They were the same out to 3 decimal places for the entire time. I assume that's good.
I suspect many of us don't give much thought to power supplies. Obviously that's a mistake. What's a reasonable life span for a good PSU? I've always thou ht of them as lasting forever.
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FSP does quite good PSU's. They both design and build them, as well as build for other brands. Way back in history they were known for having the smallest RMA percentage in the lists of French insurance companies (Take the source with a grain of salt, my memory may fail since it was a decade ago). A friend who's an electrician used to say they don't usually fail and when they do, they don't break anything else.
A good PSU should last as long as the entire computer. Then again PSU's are what I have to replace most often because of failure. But that's not because of the nature of the beast, it's because many cheap computers have poor power supplies. I also have a pile of fully working used PSU's salvaged from long abandoned (read XP) computers.
You're right in that people should give more thought to PSU's. An extra $30 or so shouldn't break the budget, at least not in a dedicated build.
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Power supplies have gotten more critical due to the shrinking of the silicon which has occurred. The smaller the transistor, the more susceptible to transient/noise they become.
Many high end motherboards incorporate additional power filtering to deal with the lower quality power supplies available on the market, but filtering does not help bad regulation. It only helps remove noise from the power.
Think if it this way. If we took a transistor from 15 years ago, and scaled it to the size of a diesel rig. Take a transient spike the transistor could deal with and scaled it using the same value. It would be about the size of a Smart car. Well, a Smart car hitting a diesel rig will be not more than a shudder to the diesel rig.
Now, take that scale value and apply it to the transistors available today. Suddenly that diesel rig becomes a roller skate. Now the Smart car transient which would not be noticed by the older transistor, takes a major hit. Possibly damaging the transistor.
Hope that puts things in perspective and helps people to understand why power supplies have gotten so critical.
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Do PSU's do any ac conditioning? or are they at the whim of basic power delivered.
If the voltage levels are changing, at all (for any of the voltages), then you have a cheap power supply that will end up taking out sensitive components, or giving you grief in other ways (i.e. lockups, overheating, noise...).
Skuzzy, how much to you consider fluctuation? 100th of volt or 10ths or whole numbers.
http://whirlpool.net.au/wiki/psu_manufacturers
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Ideally, the outputs never change, once they are up.
That is something I should mention. If a power supply output is overloaded, it could cause drift.
No power supply, I am aware of, does input AC line conditioning.
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I think you should do line conditioning from the power line to your house, and again just before the UPS. It can get rather crazy how much equipment you use in the end, but it's the best way to save your PC. Once you've seen how much should go into protecting your equipment you will look at the 'plug-and-play' computers in a completely different way.
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being an apt dweller, I can only condition what comes out me walls. I know for a fact that it fluctuates. The pisser was every one of my UPS's died, like clock work, all having the same appx life span. My elec bill dropped $80/mth. So to clean the power was costly, the UPS's are costly, I turn pc off when not home so I am trying to convince myself not to go there, but.
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Anyway got the SSD back from the rapair shop and it's a total loss. They couldn't recover anything. So I have lost all my unreleased training films and the scenario guncam film I was doing. I've lost 9 months of work... :bhead
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Ouch! :(
That's a good reminder to all of us to do some backing up. My photos are mainly only on the computer, only the oldest are duplicated on an external disk.
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I find the complete failure of the SSD to be odd and intriguing. Theoretically, as long as the storage chips are not physically damaged, they should retain their data.
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Anyway got the SSD back from the rapair shop and it's a total loss. They couldn't recover anything. So I have lost all my unreleased training films and the scenario guncam film I was doing. I've lost 9 months of work... :bhead
that bites.
NAS is the wtg.
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I find the complete failure of the SSD to be odd and intriguing. Theoretically, as long as the storage chips are not physically damaged, they should retain their data.
Supposedly, if the failure is in the circuit board, not many repair shops have the equipment to detach the storage chips and attach them to a working board. It might be even more difficult than swapping a hard disk platter.
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Well that is unfortunate, as it is not really that difficult to remove chips from an SMT board. A decent heat gun, an Exacto knife and BINGO! Pop those chips right off.
Use a board with sockets for the chips and get busy reading the data. Or put them through another solder wave bath and get the data that way.
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Sounds like I'd have to go check whether our local build/repair shops know about this. I doubt, but you never know. They don't do hdd repairs either, as far as I know only one or two firms in the entire country do that and if my information is correct even they are subsidiaries of larger international companies. And they're expensive, far beyond the budget of an average Joe who's lost his photos.