Help and Support Forums => Aces High Bug Reports => Topic started by: Blade on September 22, 2016, 08:53:54 PM
Title: Petit Freeze
Post by: Blade on September 22, 2016, 08:53:54 PM
I think AH3 still petit freeze sometimes.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on September 22, 2016, 08:58:55 PM
I'm getting them too. The longer I stay online the more I see. Smooth at first, but then petit (micro) freezes, or sticky frames.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Condor on September 22, 2016, 09:11:01 PM
Interesting. I was getting them until Monday or Tuesday. Then they stopped. I t could have been an update to my sound card driver or the new patch or ...... :headscratch: Anyway, I'm glad there gone.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on September 22, 2016, 09:35:30 PM
It could be Windows update running on my network. I still have machines that are not completely update. Microsoft's favor to us all.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Dobs on September 23, 2016, 08:55:30 AM
My network is all of ONE computer.
I have deferred upgrades selected, and I'm seeing freezes again after not seeing them right after patch and server reset.
Since it is across multiple players, maybe its not "us"....right after server reset it seemed fine....after 24 hours plus, it seems to have started back again.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Skuzzy on September 23, 2016, 09:06:45 AM
The "deferred upgrade" option only stops the installation of "upgrades", it does not stop security updates from being installed. That option is only available in Windows 10 Pro and Windows 10 Enterprise.
You can always alt-tab from the game, pull up the task manager and see if updates are being installed.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on September 23, 2016, 09:25:02 AM
Well, there is also an alt-tab CTD issue right now. Windows key too for that matter.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Skuzzy on September 23, 2016, 10:11:25 AM
Again, not happening to everyone. The inconsistency, plus the lack of people actually giving us information about the crash is stalling any effort to track it down. We have had zero luck duplicating these issues. Without being able to duplicate them, it is virtually impossible to fix.
We need information. We need the offset shown in the Windows crash dialog. Make no mistake about it, we want to fix these issues, but we cannot do much when we have no way to reproduce the problem.
Try taking your car to a mechanic, tossing him the keys and saying, "Fix it!". Then walk away.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: JimmyD3 on September 23, 2016, 10:17:50 AM
I have been getting the momentary freezes as well, they also show a spike on Net Status. Been trying to narrow down which process is doing it on my system, but nothing definitive yet. With my Logitech, Saitek and CH hardware, I have a lot more than just 35 to 40 process running. More like 90 to 98.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on September 23, 2016, 10:21:19 AM
Again, not happening to everyone. The inconsistency, plus the lack of people actually giving us information about the crash is stalling any effort to track it down. We have had zero luck duplicating these issues. Without being able to duplicate them, it is virtually impossible to fix.
We need information. We need the offset shown in the Windows crash dialog. Make no mistake about it, we want to fix these issues, but we cannot do much when we have no way to reproduce the problem.
Try taking your car to a mechanic, tossing him the keys and saying, "Fix it!". Then walk away.
That's just it. Windows 10 is not throwing an error. It just closes the game and shunts it off to processes. If I knew how to trap it I would have submitted it long ago.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Skuzzy on September 23, 2016, 10:39:40 AM
That is not a CTD (crash to desktop). That seems to have something to do with DX11. The DX9 version does not do it (at least not that we are aware of). Still trying to duplicate that one.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Bizman on September 23, 2016, 02:22:14 PM
I still get the micro freezes, too. And it definitely isn't anything updating in the background.
Also, especially at the early stage of a gaming session, toggling the zoom causes a micro freeze.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Skuzzy on September 23, 2016, 03:29:45 PM
The minimizing issue with the DX11 version may be corrected with Patch 2. We have one person, so far, saying it did.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: steely07 on September 25, 2016, 07:03:47 PM
If film will help with the freeze and the app disappearing (not crashing, the process just disappears, no crash log, no "Aces High has stopped responding" ) I have film of both from FSO the last couple of weeks.
Let me know and I'll post then here.
Steely
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Skuzzy on September 26, 2016, 10:11:52 AM
The "app disappearing" should be fixed in Patch 2. If anyone still gets it, then we need to know, but we believe that issue is corrected.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: FBScud on September 26, 2016, 01:58:12 PM
Was up for around 90 minutes or so last night in the main arena. Using the DX 11 version. While I no longer completely alt tabbed to desk top, several times my desk top would momentarily flash on the screen, as if I were about to experience the alt tab minimization, then almost immediately resume the game in progress. No action was required of me. In fact, it happened so fast I couldn't have acted anyway. Definitely an improvement if a bit disconcerting. Love the new build! Excellent job!!! Although why you didn't code it so my gunnery and dive bombing improved, I'll never know.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: ccvi on September 27, 2016, 05:06:46 PM
Got some small freezes, too. Losing a few frames. Somewhat reproducible: When starting and (especially) stopping a voice transmission.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Mano on September 27, 2016, 06:37:13 PM
If I have been logged into Aces High for 30 min or more I start to see mini freezes. I experience them more when I am zoomed in mode than unzoomed. They seem random and do not occur with any frequency that I am aware of.
I am running the Dx11 version and I have Win 8.1. I can post the DxDiag if necessary. If I have been in the game for an hour or more they are more frequent.
Last night AH3 jumped into a reduced Window. That has never happened before and there was no error message to note. I tried going to desktop by using the MS button and coming back but the window remained. I exited to tower and relaunched my gv and everything was back to normal.
:salute
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Scca on October 04, 2016, 08:16:41 AM
Been running DX9 and am still getting micro freezes...
Skuzzy, what can I do to help, what do you need?
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: JimmyD3 on October 04, 2016, 11:56:12 AM
I'm running DX11 but am getting the micro freezes as well.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Skuzzy on October 04, 2016, 12:28:04 PM
What might be helpful is if we could get our hands on both an AH film and a Fraps (or whatever you use to capture video) capture of the stutters happening. We need both because the film viewer may not show the problem, or it might show the problem.
Pairing it with a video capture could help with understanding the circumstances of the stutters.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Scca on October 04, 2016, 12:31:31 PM
What might be helpful is if we could get our hands on both an AH film and a Fraps (or whatever you use to capture video) capture of the stutters happening. We need both because the film viewer may not show the problem, or it might show the problem.
Pairing it with a video capture could help with understanding the circumstances of the stutters.
I'll do that. Thanks.
Once they start, it happens pretty regularly.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on October 04, 2016, 12:33:07 PM
I had this today while resupplying a factory with an M3. It's a long drive. As I got closer to the factory the freezes got to be longer, from petit size to maybe 1/3 second. I believe it was as the factories were rebuilding. I was not running a capture, but I do have AHfilm.
Next time I do the same thing I will capture it.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Skuzzy on October 04, 2016, 12:38:18 PM
I had this today while resupplying a factory with an M3. It's a long drive. As I got closer to the factory the freezes got to be longer, from petit size to maybe 1/3 second. I believe it was as the factories were rebuilding. I was not running a capture, but I do have AHfilm.
Next time I do the same thing I will capture it.
Do both, if your system has enough overhead to it. It would be nice for us to have a side-by-side capture/ah film.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on October 04, 2016, 01:25:17 PM
Yeah, I have a second computer for just that purpose. :salute
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Rich46yo on October 04, 2016, 01:32:19 PM
I have windows update turned off. I found a way to do it in 10. I had stutters yesterday and it looked like connection stutters. I did a reboot of everything, including modem, and they seemed to go away. These were stutters that had no connection to frame rates, which stayed 55 to 59. When that happens I assume it to be computer/connection issues.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on October 04, 2016, 01:50:03 PM
MS promised yesterday that no insider builds would be sent out, so we have that going for us.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on October 04, 2016, 02:32:57 PM
I did three sorties. Two of them were smooth as silk in a congested area, and since they were smooth I have not included them here. The third had short pauses, so I will attach that film, and email you the link to the video once it is up on YouTube (as unlisted). I can go through the video and find the times for the pauses, also.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on October 04, 2016, 04:25:23 PM
Well, it was a nice idea. YouTube is in a high volume usage time right now, so the upload will take more than 3 hours even with the audio stripped out. The AH film I attached will have pause events occurring at about 5:41, and 10:42.
You will probably be relaxing at home when I email over the link to the YT video.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Skuzzy on October 04, 2016, 04:36:43 PM
If the pauses show up in the film, that may be enough to get us pointed in the right direction.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on October 04, 2016, 04:45:24 PM
I do not think the pauses are in the AHF file, but they are obvious in the video. The AHF file may be three seconds shorter, so the pauses would be at 5:38, and 10:39 there.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: aaronr on October 04, 2016, 04:46:00 PM
The one I watch the attachment in film viewer looked smooth at those points noted.
OK I looked again at those new points very carefuly with film viewer it looks as smooth as butter.
AS you said the film on Utube should be good to do a side by side look.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on October 04, 2016, 04:49:27 PM
Yes, aaron, HiTech and Skuzzy can see details in the films that we are not aware of. The video I am uploading will allow them to see the severity, for instance. The AHF file allows them to see if there were any events that may be causing it in the game, or whether they need to consider something else.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: aaronr on October 04, 2016, 04:53:04 PM
I assumed as much they should have some interface that allows real time data to be read as it's happening. I just found it interesting that it appeared to be smooth. :aok
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on October 04, 2016, 04:57:43 PM
I trimmed up the video hoping to speed it up, but it didn't help.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: ccvi on October 04, 2016, 05:16:16 PM
Micro-freezes reguarly reproducible when releasing the voice transmit key. Film attached, but it doesn't show them as they look in game.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on October 04, 2016, 05:37:33 PM
I never get them using vox. I do not see them in busy areas of the arena where lots of users are. The pauses I recorded were out in the middle of nowhere between an airfield and the AAA factory, southern country, SFMA map. It should be a pretty good indication of what is really causing the problem, but the situation could be made worse on some systems when vox is used at the same time the problem occurs. Either way, I think they will figure it out.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: 1stpar3 on October 05, 2016, 12:59:07 AM
Would higher temperatures of Graph cards or just higher in general, cause these sticky frame problems? Seem most of the post/ replies are saying after a while? In game a bit then it starts up? I am no pc expert but do know that heat can do some funky stuff with precision nescessary aplications
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Randy1 on October 05, 2016, 05:31:27 AM
. . . The inconsistency, plus the lack of people actually giving us information about the crash is stalling any effort to track it down.
. . .Try taking your car to a mechanic, tossing him the keys and saying, "Fix it!". Then walk away.
Skuzzy, I think you can lay the lack of feedback at HTC's feet. Please note that a lot of players never come to this forum. Point two, you need to dumb down your PC talk. A good, simple example is CTD. What the heck is a CTD asked on vox last night. It is always good to type that Crash To Desk Top (CTD) or you will have people guessing or just ignore the message.
Not sure why HTC does not use the arena message as a way of telling people how to recover and send in the information you want.
Help us, help you.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: LCADolby on October 05, 2016, 06:24:33 AM
I get these mini pauses but it is usually followed by a notification that a skin has downloaded.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Rich46yo on October 05, 2016, 08:20:38 AM
Would higher temperatures of Graph cards or just higher in general, cause these sticky frame problems? Seem most of the post/ replies are saying after a while? In game a bit then it starts up? I am no pc expert but do know that heat can do some funky stuff with precision nescessary aplications
Heat would cause more serious stuff then that. Like Blue screen crashes. Most frame rate problems Ive seen come from over taxed hard ware per the application or connection problems.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on October 05, 2016, 09:12:59 AM
I have all of the skins, and it is not a heat issue. I did remove the audio track to make the file transfer smaller, but it wouldn't have made a difference anyway. I drove into a congested area with about twenty users and lots of vox chatter and there wasn't even a drop in frames. I'm out in the middle of nowhere and at random intervals get 'pauses' like this.
If you are seeing something different then please post up your video. The only reason my video is 'unlisted' is so it isn't seen as a published video on my channel and as a courtesy to HTC.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on October 05, 2016, 02:20:23 PM
Could this be related to the text buffer somehow?
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: 38ruk on October 05, 2016, 08:02:54 PM
I have been getting the momentary freezes as well, they also show a spike on Net Status. Been trying to narrow down which process is doing it on my system, but nothing definitive yet. With my Logitech, Saitek and CH hardware, I have a lot more than just 35 to 40 process running. More like 90 to 98.
Same exact issue ... screen freeze and net stat spike . I'm not running anything in background and bare bones win7 with 22 processes including AH.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Dobs on October 06, 2016, 07:17:05 AM
Micro-freezes reguarly reproducible when releasing the voice transmit key. Film attached, but it doesn't show them as they look in game.
Same..pressing and releasing key for both ingame and Teamspeak. (Nothing mapped to teamspeak key).
Also getting the freezes periodically again (noticed it yesterday...and they are bigger than before).
Software or server?
Observable via film here-- (5:00 mark if time marked link does not work).
You can see it in the attached AHF file at 14:21 mark...it "hitches" but the pause in film is nowhere as severe as the pause on video (and video matches what I see).
Dobs
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: popeye on October 06, 2016, 09:37:51 PM
I have no film or hard data, but tonight I was seeing the 1-2 sec freezes just as I was about to engage an enemy. Happened at least 4 times. Seemed like it was at about 400 yds separation and closing fast in a turn. Of course it completely ruins the attack.
No significant background processes running. Wasn't seeing warping. DX11.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Bizman on October 07, 2016, 02:18:35 PM
Repeating my comment from Tech Support:
Noticed some freezes today. Voice didn't seem to affect, but one lengthy freeze occurred just after the "Your field is under attack!" warning. Coincidental, maybe. Also, there was a spike in Variance in Delay each time the freeze occurred.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Dobs on October 07, 2016, 04:00:22 PM
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: caldera on October 07, 2016, 04:16:52 PM
Multiple freezes last night but no freezes during the previous patch.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Flavel on October 08, 2016, 03:35:03 PM
I'll add to it. Multiple micro freezes. Extremely annoying.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Condor on October 08, 2016, 11:18:14 PM
I haven't had any freezes for about a week although before that I did. Just upgraded from HD 6950 to a GTX 1060 today and freezes are back. one every 5 min or so.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: rpm on October 09, 2016, 07:15:21 AM
I'll add to it. Multiple micro freezes. Extremely annoying.
Put me on the list. Been getting constant micro freezes. Starting to get perma freezes, too. If I Alt-Tab out I get white screen. In either case I have to reboot.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: oboe on October 09, 2016, 08:52:14 AM
Same here. No changes in my configuration, but micro freezes have become a fairly regular occurence, starting noticing this in the past week or so...
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Condor on October 12, 2016, 11:13:57 PM
I'm still getting them after the latest patch. They seem to last a little longer.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: JimmyD3 on October 13, 2016, 11:51:21 AM
I'm still getting them as well.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: hitech on October 13, 2016, 01:27:04 PM
Same..pressing and releasing key for both ingame and Teamspeak. (Nothing mapped to teamspeak key).
Also getting the freezes periodically again (noticed it yesterday...and they are bigger than before).
Software or server?
Observable via film here-- (5:00 mark if time marked link does not work).
You can see it in the attached AHF file at 14:21 mark...it "hitches" but the pause in film is nowhere as severe as the pause on video (and video matches what I see).
Dobs
The ahf is do to a texture load, the film viewer loads textures in the main thread unlike the game which loads them in a separate thread.
Not sure yes what it is in your you tube video.
HiTech
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: hitech on October 13, 2016, 01:28:24 PM
We both videos being recorded at the same time, if so what time was the youtube pause in the ahf?
HiTech
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Dobs on October 14, 2016, 08:15:12 AM
HiTech--AHF file at 14:21 mark.
Dobs
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: popeye on October 14, 2016, 09:08:37 AM
Every time there is a "freeze" there is a spike in "Variance in Delay". What is "Variance in Delay"? Is the spike a cause or symptom of the freeze?
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: oboe on October 14, 2016, 09:32:29 AM
Every time there is a "freeze" there is a spike in "Variance in Delay". What is "Variance in Delay"? Is the spike a cause or symptom of the freeze?
I noticed this as well, and have the same question....
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: aaronr on October 14, 2016, 11:53:56 AM
Hi this doesn't answer the cause or symptom but it answered what it is for me I didn't know what it meant.
Quote
"The terms "jitter" and "delay variance" are often used synonymously. The best definition of the jitter is the amount of variation in the end-to-end packet transit time. For applications such as audio and video transmission, it does not matter much if the packets take 20 ms or 30 msec to be delivered, as long as the transit time is constant. Having some packets taking 20 msec and others taking 30 msec will give an uneven quality to sound or image." The most current measuring system is explained in the following paragraph:
So P51 is plane #1, as the first ever plane modeled in AH? I recall seeing the numbering somewhere but since this is no major issue I won't search for it. Thanks.
Title: Re: Petit Freeze
Post by: Chalenge on October 23, 2016, 06:29:44 AM
Well, it is, but that's as far as I have tracked it. I made a list by using the dot commands and it extends to 125 airplanes or vehicles, but with a lot of empty spaces remaining open.