Aces High Bulletin Board
Special Events Forums => Friday Squad Operations => Topic started by: funkedup on December 01, 2001, 12:09:00 AM
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Obviously there is a numbers imbalance so far in Clearing the Philippines. I am wondering what is the cause of this imbalance?
1. Is Clearing the Philippines designed to have a large numerical advantage for the Allies?
2. Are Allied squads exceeding their registered quotas?
3. Are Axis squads not meeting their registered quotas?
I think the morale of the Japanese pilots has been strong enough to weather the storm but it's obviously not an ideal situation. Is it 1, 2, or 3, or some combination of these factors causing the imbalance? Depending on this answer, can we do anything to prevent it from happening in the future?
[ 12-01-2001: Message edited by: funkedup ]
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I think its the fact that allied squad are hitting their max register quotas. While the squads flying for the IJN have been turning out much smaller numbers.
I did an analysis of this over the last four frames (not counting tonight). You will note the average attendence over the last four frames and the max number denotes the max players the squad has ever put up for one frame.
The allied squads for this TOD definitely have a better track history of putting out pilots. MAG-33 I think put up 15, Nightmares put up 16, Rogue I think put up 4, 412th put up 8 I believe, and I know Arabian and Assassins put up around 8+ each. And I think 332nd mongrels put up 8 each. No idea what 416th put up.
Then again I have been nagging the COs of these squads for something like 3 weeks now to work on turning out their max amount of pilots.
JAPANESE
AVG MAX SQUAD FRAME ATTENDENCES
3.25 / 4 = 13th TAS - 3 - 4 - 4 - 2
6.00 / 6 = 308th RAF - 6 -N/A -N/A -N/A
6.75 / 8 = 332nd Vikings - 6 - 8 - 7 - 6
12.50 / 17 = 56th FG - 7 - 17 - 13 - 13
6.25 / 9 = FDBs - 6 - 7 - 3 - 9
6.50 / 8 = JV44 - 6 - 8 - 7 - 5
7.50 / 9 = SBM - 6 - 7 - 9 - 8
5.00 / 5 = JG2 - 5 -N/A -N/A -N/A
Average = 53.75
Max = 66
USN
AVG MAX SQUAD FRAME ATTENDENCES
10.00 / 15 = Nightmares - 15 - 9 - 6 - N/A
6.00 / 6 = 332nd Mongrels - 9 - 9 - 10 - 9
6.75 / 8 = 412th - 8 - 9 - 6 - 7
12.50 / 17 = Arabian - 11 - 13 - 14 - 15
6.25 / 9 = Rogue - 3 - 4 - 2 - 4
6.50 / 8 = 416th - 2 - 4 - 6 - 5
7.50 / 9 = Assassins - 7 - 9 - 8 - 8
7.50 / 9 = MAG-33 - 9 - 8 - 9 - 10
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Probably the best thing to do is to add this frames turnout and next frames turnout to the stats I compiled and take a look at what each squad averages on putting up pilots over the last 6 frames.
And then making sure some of the big squads are shifted about to balance things out.
Without adding in this frames turnout you have the Nightmares VMF-101, Arabian Knights, and 56th FG turning out the most pilots on a consistent basis.
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Hey GhstDncr you mean "WE" don't you :D
"sigh" sorry I couldn't make it guys! Sounds like you all had alot of fun! <S>
(http://www.whidbeynet.net/wagmen/aceshigh/pics/PilotPics/pyrotag.jpg)
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Funked...when I picked sides for this TOD I went off of the registered suads and their PAST numbers.
It is VERY IMPORTANT to check to see how many pilots you have registered and update them at least every TOD.
I had the 8th Armored on the Axi side and they were registered for 15 pilots. Unfortunately the squad C.O. wasn't understanding the amount of commitment it takes and we dropped them. Right off the bat the Axis are down 10 - 15 from the Allied.
We did add JG2 and Blue Thunder to the Axis to try and help the balance. I can only asume that several Axis squads flew shorthanded last night and there was a lack of guest pilots.
I will check the logs and look at attendance to see if that sheds some light on the issue.
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Thx guys, looks like it's just "tolerance stacking" as GhostDancer describes, and the effect of losing 8th Armored. I think it falls under the category of "shit happens". Carry on. :)
PS Nice analysis GhostDancer. :)
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The 8th hurt for sure. You might be surprised how many squad sign up and then don't respond to my e-mails so they never get added. It is a screening process to add the squads that are more serious and have a solid understanding of the TOD. Even after that process we still have problems, (the 8th for example).
In TOD 2 the Mongrels switched sides to balance that TOD after the same thing happened. It is possible to do that again, but not something I like to ask of squads.
I have two other squads that could be added this week to the IJN side, but only time will tell. Just depends on the C.O. and if they reply to my e-mails.
In time I am confident we will have the same kind of committed squads the S3's enjoy, but it will take some time to filter out those less serious.
<S>
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Originally posted by daddog:
I have two other squads that could be added this week to the IJN side, but only time will tell. Just depends on the C.O. and if they reply to my e-mails.
<S>
I am the IJN sucker...I mean IJN CO next frame :) Please send the 2 squads and threaten them with deleted accounts if they do not show....
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I would have been interested in being a guest for the axis side had I known you were short :( I have no carrier experience and short AH experience but I make a good target :) If I can make it this Friday how early in the evening would i have to let someone know? Could I just show up in the SEA 1/2 hour before the event and sign up?
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Des go here: http://events.simladder.com/tod_guests.php (http://events.simladder.com/tod_guests.php)
Axis squads are:
13th TAS
308th RAF
332nd Vikings
56th FG
FDBs
JV44
SBM
JG2
The sooner you sign up, the better.
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Ammo,
I am waiting to hear from
kratzer - Luftjagerkorps 4-6 pilots
robes - 1/4 Gav Esquadrau 11-15 pilots
drill - 457th BG 7-10 pilots
joecrip - 51 Molders 4-6 pilots
Those certaily would help the IJN for frame 6. ;) Kratzer and drill will be good for this Friday I am sure. Not heard from the others.
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RGR DD, I am gonna have to lower my numbers (committed) for the 56th. I am having a hard time getting guys to show up myself. I hope that those new guys contacft you soon.
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Will go post in the 13th BBS next and try to whip up a little enthusiasm for the next frame.
It's fun, even when outnumbered. Be more fun if about 6-8 TAS were around to "welcome" our uninvited USN guests instead of just the 3 of us. <EG>
I'll go try to embarass a few into showing.
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onething I contact my guys (guest and members) when i recieve the orders once I find out exactly how many guys will be there
I then spend the rest of the week posting and punting fer guests till I get some answers. I will say this though the majority of guest that have flown with jv44 have went back and got their squad signed up.
I'm sure this is caused by the fun they've had but it could be that flying with jv44 has left a bad taste in their mouths and they cant stomach 1 more frame as a guest with us,,,,,,dunno
but if you keep looking folks eventually request guest status.
When tod 1st started we on the axis side had a lot of problems with folks showing up then. I believe in the second frame I had only 9 pilots to cover 100 miles of the french.
I have a feeling tho that when a euro friendly tod starts we will lose even more on the friday tod. I have 3 euro guys that fly with us and they have made every frame but would most likely decide to participate in the "euro" tod and I cant blame umm.......
oh well I'll find replacements.......
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What would be beneficial to ALL involved is to have some sort of point modifier if the balanc sways more than, say 10%, then the modifier add's 10% increments to the under-handed side.
Food for thought, I feel Funks pain.
MAG-33 had about 7-10 for last frame, and this frame we've had consistent 12-15.
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Ain't it amazing the number of people that squeak about a Historical Arena, and the number of AWers who waltezed into the BBS and proclaimed their greatness and how they'd show us its done.
Yet when it comes to the crunch the HA junkies don't show up en masse to the ToD, and very few of the AW guys have come to ToD.
My god ToD is what you practise in the MA for.
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Yep it's true Vulcan, and sad. I can only guess that they have trouble with the day/time of the event? For example, I have trouble getting 3-4 guys for the current time. For Saturday afternoon I could get 10-12.
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Actually Vulcan you already do have a bunch of AW guys in TOD ... the Nightmares VMF-101. About half of my guys that fly in TOD are from our now defunct AW branch (VMF-898). :)
But truthfully you are right there are a bunch of AW guys who spouted off who have yet to make it over here. But don't judge all the AW refugees by that I know several other squads who are interested in TOD but just don't feel comfortable enough yet in AH to commit to it. They are buys learning the ropes, finishing transitioning their memembers over here, and settling in.
Once that is done I expect to see more over here.
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hell, I think most of AH is some sort of AW refugee, whether is be Genie from 1990, or lately... :)
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I am not worried about numbers, but I know balance can be difficult when squads don't show up. Also we have lost a couple of squads, but by far we have seen growth since the first months of sign up's. Take a peek. :)
July - 11 Squads
Aug - 2 Squads
Sept - 0 Squads
Oct - 2 Squads
Nov - 4 Squads
I already know of one more we will add for Dec. That will bring us to 20 squads in the TOD. Doubled our size in 4/5 months. We will lose some to the Saturday TOD, but honestly I think both events will just keep growing in squads and numbers.
Off to work...
<S>
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Originally posted by Vulcan:
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.....and the number of AWers who waltezed into the BBS and proclaimed their greatness and how they'd show us its done.
Yet when it comes to the crunch the HA junkies don't show up en masse to the ToD, and very few of the AW guys have come to ToD.
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I agree :/
FWIW, I've been posting in Bigweek (the newsgroup) about the ToDs semi-regularly, trying to drum up some interest, and have gotten very little response. :(
~sigh~
anRky
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BTW, Ghost Dancer, I meant to reply to you 'over there', but I lost the post. Anyway, I'm pretty sure it was you in that pic.
(http://www.eurekaspringsart.com/anrky/tod4frm2-1.jpg)
I still don't know how the three of us kept from shooting *each other* down. :)
anRky
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"FWIW, I've been posting in Bigweek (the newsgroup) about the ToDs semi-regularly, trying to drum up some interest, and have gotten very little response. "
And yet WW and BW (the scenario) *have* got good responses.
Why the difference? (honest question)
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Seeker:
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And yet WW and BW (the scenario) *have* got good responses.
Why the difference? (honest question)
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Ok, what's different about the events?
Euro friendly:
TOD isn't.
WW isn't.
BW is.
Historic:
TOD is.
WW isn't.
BW is.
Signup:
TOD - Squad signup, no walkons, anyone can fly if they simply send and e-mail or two.
WW - No signup, anyone can fly.
BW - Individual signup, walkon signup, can only fly if you're signed up.
Frame duration:
TOD - 1 1/2 or 2 hours (not sure, lol)
WW - 1 1/2 hours.
BW - 4 hours (two 2-hour frames, back to back)
Any others?
anRky
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From your analysys it's niether the timing not the historical aspect.
Maybe it's the squad thing?
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Friday Night
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Seeker, while the TOD is set up to be a squad event, it does not require you to be "in" a squad in the MA to fly in it. Just about every squad in the TOD accepts guest and will allow you to fly with them and it wont affect your MA squad affiliation, or lack thereof.
I have seen several posts that mentioned the fact that the TOD does not allow for individuals to fly and in that way it is too exclusive, but that is simply not the case. I wish more people would realize this fact and at least try flying in it once.
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Thanks, Sling, I'm quite unclear about this squad guest buisness.
Could perhaps a short explanation of how some goes about it be put on the TOD website? It may be what's holding some people back?
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At the bottom of the main TOD page you will find this.
Though individuals are welcome, walkons are not allowed until they sign up with a squad as a guest whose C.O. must approve. Once we have the initial list of participating squads, individuals will be directed to a page listing the Squads, C.O.'s, and a way to contact them requesting a guest status.
Just to the left of that is a list of all the squads in the TOD. http://events.simladder.com/tod.php (http://events.simladder.com/tod.php)
Per your request I will change the wording and make it more clear, but it has been on the page all along. Inherent with events like the TOD there is a lot material to read and most don't read it cover to cover.
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To be quite honest I'm a bit concerned about BW. There isn't the same level of organisation that there is with ToD. IMHO comparing scenario experience with ToD... all scenario's should be modelled on the ToD with regard to squad organisation.
Hell I haven't even heard from my BW CO yet :(
And the AW thing was a generalisation, note that I also included the squeakin-AH-HA mob with that crowd of no shows.
Kudos to the ToD organisers, its the MOST fun I've had in AH including Afrika Korps and Hostile Shores. I believe its because the squad structure results in a more organised chaos. PLUS the rotation between aircraft (ie fighters, bombers, fighters) gives everyone a fair crack.
ToD is what BW should be.
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Exactly Sling, look at me... when was the last time I was in a MA Squad!
Originally posted by sling322:
Seeker, while the TOD is set up to be a squad event, it does not require you to be "in" a squad in the MA to fly in it. Just about every squad in the TOD accepts guest and will allow you to fly with them and it wont affect your MA squad affiliation, or lack thereof.
I have seen several posts that mentioned the fact that the TOD does not allow for individuals to fly and in that way it is too exclusive, but that is simply not the case. I wish more people would realize this fact and at least try flying in it once.