Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: nugetx on August 23, 2018, 12:48:45 PM
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ENY is penalising people for playing the game, if there are more people playing (on one side) the planes get locked.
If people would be unlocking the planes for points it would be the opposite (they would be rewarded for playing).
So instead of locking planes with ENY, just perk the top rides (yak 3, p51, 190d, la7 etc you know the drill).
and if 2 sides will be made, the game instantly will be more enjoyable. (as with 2 sides there will not be a 20 vs 20 vs 8 scenario)
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You are only penalized if you have not learned to fly a lesser plane.
I rarely notice ENY.
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You are only penalized if you have not learned to fly a lesser plane.
I rarely notice ENY.
Right now on arena ENY penalizes people because there are 20 on a side, and other side is 8....... so people should log out and not play so remaining 5 can fly the top planes? :headscratch:
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Right now on arena ENY penalizes people because there are 20 on a side, and other side is 8....... so people should log out and not play so remaining 5 can fly the top planes? :headscratch:
Look up top and try the search feature. Lot of information on how it works there.
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Look up top and try the search feature. Lot of information on how it works there.
I've just seen how it works in the game, the planes get locked out and are not flyable, like I said, it penalizes people for actualy playing the game.
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It only impacts a player who has chosen to be impacted by it.
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It only impacts a player who has chosen to be impacted by it.
Why not reward players instead of impacting them?
I'd rather find it more enjoyable, if I could purchase for the points i earned through playing, a better plane, then i have to fly an inferior one all the time because other people are also playing.....
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It is your choice to be impacted.
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This is a twist on one of your old wishes we have seen in multiple forms before. Nope. -1. Huh uh. Not interested. No way. Dead horse. Gong. Three strikes. Never gonna happen. Put a fork in your done. :aok
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I give it a +1
The current system shuts the ENY affected plane out of the game and by extension affects people who like to fly that particular plane.
You can state the premise that they choose to be affected however it is not a choice, it has been imposed. They can choose to fly another plane or to go do something else. I can say at times I have chosen to log out and go do other things.
Had I been able to ‘buy’ the ride I would have stayed in game.
There is of course a balance to be had as the impact of people buying late war rides may be worse for the game than the odd person logging out.
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There is of course a balance to be had as the impact of people buying late war rides may be worse for the game than the odd person logging out.
And there you have it. Getting swarmed by a horde is always unpleasant. Getting swarmed by a horde of late-war monsters is worse. That was the reason for implementation of ENY in the first place. Inasmuch as this issue is raised on the BBS virtually every week, we probably should assume that HTC continues to assess this balance, and has not concluded that ENY should be changed.
- oldman
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Never assume oldman.
30 rooks, 15 bish, 15 knights. Rooks going to get hit with ENY.
Both bish and knights are hitting rooks....hmm now numbers are effectively even but rooks have eny.
Ip at a base to defend. Local numbers 7 of them 2 of us. Now we are outnumbered over 2 to 1 yet we are the ENY affected.
This does happen quite often. I logged out on my last break at home because of it.
Just because it worked before does not mean it is working now or could not be improved.
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The only people who whine about ENY are not capable of getting kills in planes that require skill to fly. -100
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Never assume oldman.
30 rooks, 15 bish, 15 knights. Rooks going to get hit with ENY.
Both bish and knights are hitting rooks....hmm now numbers are effectively even but rooks have eny.
Ip at a base to defend. Local numbers 7 of them 2 of us. Now we are outnumbered over 2 to 1 yet we are the ENY affected.
This does happen quite often. I logged out on my last break at home because of it.
Just because it worked before does not mean it is working now or could not be improved.
Well you know 15 yrs ago it worked. They say we are beating a dead horse wanting two countries with one front and no eny. I guess they can’t see the forest for the trees. When all the trees are gone it’s harder to see
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It is your choice to be impacted.
Change the eny formula to corulate with lower numbers or lower the side switch time or change it to a two country war and we would have more interest in changing side to not be impacted. As it’s set now it sucks and like fess I will now log instead of trying to make your game work the way you want it to.
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The only people who whine about ENY are not capable of getting kills in planes that require skill to fly. -100
What a beautifully constructed argument. You know debating a point also requires some skills, go on, try it.
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Right now on arena ENY penalizes people because there are 20 on a side, and other side is 8....... so people should log out and not play so remaining 5 can fly the top planes? :headscratch:
No, people should change countries. The problem is 6 hours before you can switch again. That is the only thing that keeps me from switching usually.
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No, people should change countries. The problem is 6 hours before you can switch again. That is the only thing that keeps me from switching usually.
that's correct. then what if you change and the fights fizzle quickly and you changed to side b and now side a and b having a raging 3 hr fight. you are stuck twiddling your thumbs. I have more luck logging. now again if it was a two country war there would be no need for the side switch time as it set up now
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What a beautifully constructed argument. You know debating a point also requires some skills, go on, try it.
So, just out of curiosity, what plane is it that you insist on flying?
AH has all of these different planes. People constantly demand new planes. And yet, it seems that many people refuse to get out of their favorite rides.
There's a whole world out there, just waiting to be discovered.
- oldman
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I prefer the P51D. I get a lot of fun out of it although I have started to mess about in P38s.
The key here though is the fun I get from the 51D simply is not there for me in the other planes. That is my choice and on occasion if that choice is removed as an option I log out rather than fly other planes.
Worth noting as well that I get to fly maybe 2 sessions a month due to other commitments. Not being able to choose my ride hurts even more because I look forward to the session when I fly home
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Well you could always change sides if your low ENY plane is locked out. :old:
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Let me refer you to the other posts in the thread that tell us if you do that you often get stuck on the other side for hours.
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I am in favour of shorter switch timers. 1 hour maybe 1.5 hours.
I have no opinion on the other points..
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Let me refer you to the other posts in the thread that tell us if you do that you often get stuck on the other side for hours.
Yep.
High ENY and a player imbalance encourages side switching. The consequences of the six hour timer discourages switching, leaving the alternatives of putting up with the horde groupie/horde victim scenario or logging off.
A one hour switch timer should be more than enough to prevent any shenanigans, since we all know players don't already use second and/or third accounts for ill-gotten gains.
If you believe that, then there is no reason to believe people not spending an extra $15 or $30 per month would do so either. Consider the "spiez" excuse for long switch times officially blown to bits.
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Yep.
High ENY and a player imbalance encourages side switching. The consequences of the six hour timer discourages switching, leaving the alternatives of putting up with the horde groupie/horde victim scenario or logging off.
A one hour switch timer should be more than enough to prevent any shenanigans, since we all know players don't already use second and/or third accounts for ill-gotten gains.
If you believe that, then there is no reason to believe people not spending an extra $15 or $30 per month would do so either. Consider the "spiez" excuse for long switch times officially blown to bits.
Which has nothing to do with HT's reasons for doing it. Here's a thread where he talked a bit about it.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,383603.msg5115414.html#msg5115414 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,383603.msg5115414.html#msg5115414)
Wiley.
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Which has nothing to do with HT's reasons for doing it. Here's a thread where he talked a bit about it.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,383603.msg5115414.html#msg5115414 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,383603.msg5115414.html#msg5115414)
Wiley.
Point 1..To encourage SWAPPING SIDES....Yes eny has its purposes..the 6 hour swap limit voids point 1 out. As is now, ENY only HELPS OR HURTS those players who refuse to swap countries or refuse to stop BASHING those that would change countries. :uhoh
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Hitech, Skuzzy, and other players, would you guys agree to test this for a week or two.... ?
1) Drop the ENY lock
2) Perk the top rides
3) Make 2 sides
Just test it and let's see...... if it will impact negatively the game, just change it back.
You cannot lose anything on the test, you can only gain.
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Hitech, Skuzzy, and other players, would you guys agree to test this for a week or two.... ?
1) Drop the ENY lock
2) Perk the top rides
3) Make 2 sides
Just test it and let's see...... if it will impact negatively the game, just change it back.
You cannot lose anything on the test, you can only gain.
1) ENY is there for a reason. Hitech remembers why he put ENY in the game, so he will not take it out because he know that it WILL negatively impact the game. I hate ENY, but I understand why it is here and why it needs to stay.
2) No more perk planes. One of the things that makes this game great is that I don't have to earn a bunch of points to fly the plane I want to fly. All you have to do is look at other games that use such an advancement system to see why it should not be done here.
3) 2 sides has been tried, and it didn't work very well. History shows that 3 sides works best in the Melee arena. Hitech doesn't have to try it, because he already has.
You keep trying to make this game something it isn't and shouldn't be. Everything you have suggested has been considered and rejected, or already been tried.
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It only impacts a player who has chosen to be impacted by it.
It's still annoying.
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I give it a +1
The current system shuts the ENY affected plane out of the game and by extension affects people who like to fly that particular plane.
You can state the premise that they choose to be affected however it is not a choice, it has been imposed. They can choose to fly another plane or to go do something else. I can say at times I have chosen to log out and go do other things.
Had I been able to ‘buy’ the ride I would have stayed in game.
There is of course a balance to be had as the impact of people buying late war rides may be worse for the game than the odd person logging out.
Same here. I log most of the time. This seems to be a counter productive consequence.
Something needs tweaking.
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The only people who whine about ENY are not capable of getting kills in planes that require skill to fly. -100
Nonsense. See the post before yours.
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1) ENY is there for a reason. Hitech remembers why he put ENY in the game, so he will not take it out because he know that it WILL negatively impact the game. I hate ENY, but I understand why it is here and why it needs to stay.
2) No more perk planes. One of the things that makes this game great is that I don't have to earn a bunch of points to fly the plane I want to fly. All you have to do is look at other games that use such an advancement system to see why it should not be done here.
3) 2 sides has been tried, and it didn't work very well. History shows that 3 sides works best in the Melee arena. Hitech doesn't have to try it, because he already has.
You keep trying to make this game something it isn't and shouldn't be. Everything you have suggested has been considered and rejected, or already been tried.
When you have 400 players in the arena you may have a point but with 40...not so much.
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When you have 400 players in the arena you may have a point but with 40...not so much.
Let's say, just for the sake of argument that you are right. You don't always have 40 players in the arena. Right now, Saturday, 8/25/2018, 6:12 Pacific, there are 115. History has shown that ENY is needed, and that three sides works better than two. You can't argue with history, and you aren't trying to argue with history. You are saying that things are different now, and we don't need ENY and two sides would work better. But what happens when things stop being different?
What happens when you hit that threshold where you need ENY and three sides?
DING! "OK, everyone. We are switching back to three sides and switching ENY back on."
All you have done is make like more complicated and confusing. History says that ENY solves a bigger problem. History says that three sides works better than two. History says this is true with the numbers that we have in the arena right now as I am typing this.
The statement from NugetX went like this, "Just test it and let's see...... if it will impact negatively the game, just change it back." We don't have to test it to see if it will have a negative impact on the game, history shows that it does.
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History is an excuse.
What works with 400 doesn't work with 100. Fess explained it quite well.
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History is a snapshot in time and should be studied and analysed so we can learn from it. History is not a barometer for the present or the future.
History is littered with events where people have said xyz should not be done and then someone else proves them wrong.
Just because something was right or wrong in times gone by does not mean it is right or wrong now.
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The bottom line is that two sides may stem the bleeding. We will never know unless we try.
Lazer had a great take on this. Wish I could find it.
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History is an excuse.
What works with 400 doesn't work with 100. Fess explained it quite well.
It did in Air Warrior.
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1) ENY is there for a reason. Hitech remembers why he put ENY in the game, so he will not take it out because he know that it WILL negatively impact the game. I hate ENY, but I understand why it is here and why it needs to stay.
For a reason of big player numbers 400+, but not with 50 players, not even with 100 players.
2) No more perk planes. One of the things that makes this game great is that I don't have to earn a bunch of points to fly the plane I want to fly. All you have to do is look at other games that use such an advancement system to see why it should not be done here.
Perk planes is like ENY lock, but instead of 'impacting' people, they get 'rewarded'.
So you don't want 'perk' planes, but want ENY lock, which is the same..... but ENY lock makes people log out of the game.
3) 2 sides has been tried, and it didn't work very well. History shows that 3 sides works best in the Melee arena. Hitech doesn't have to try it, because he already has.
You keep trying to make this game something it isn't and shouldn't be. Everything you have suggested has been considered and rejected, or already been tried.
And history shows that Air Warrior and Warbirds died because there were no adjustments that were needed to keep the game alive.
When history repeats itself, do we notice?
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I would pay lots of perks to fly the plane that I want when ENY lock is on. I don't care, I have bazillion fighter perk points.
The catch is this:
I have never been ENY locked in anything but a 262. My main ride is ENY30, my other rides are in the 20--35 range. This is also why I swim in useless perk points.
Any La7, Spit16, 109K, P51D pilot that cannot successfully fly an La5, Spit9, 109G14, P51B should seek out a trainer.
Any "dedicated" La7, Spit16, 109K, P51D pilot that flat out refuse to fly an La5, Spit9, 109G14, P51B, because "it is a completely different plane :cry" is an idiot.
To the OP suggestion - this has been suggested before. I wouldn't mind it provided that the perk tags are high enough to be meaningful barrier. I would easily pay 1000 perks for a 262 just to hunt down that annoying enemy 262 NOW.
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I would pay lots of perks to fly the plane that I want when ENY lock is on. I don't care, I have bazillion fighter perk points..
This is also an idea.
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Just saying maybe Nutgut is just polishing one of his old turds here cleverly disguised as an ENY complaint. I do not buy it. -1
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And history shows that Air Warrior and Warbirds died because there were no adjustments that were needed to keep the game alive.
When history repeats itself, do we notice?
Part of this statement is NOT TRUE Air Warrior died because EA Sports bought the rights to the game and cancelled it. At the time it had a large following. With the demise of Air Warrior on AOL the search was on for a replacement game the two choices at the time were Warbirds or Aces High. My choice was here, and the reason that even now I will NEVER buy a game from EA Sports. Air Warrior was Aces High lite many hours of fun in that game I still miss it.
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Yeah EA acquiring AW was an example of "catch and kill". They had absolutely no intention to develope or improve the game at all. Their sole intention was to remove it from the marketplace as it was a competitor to whatever they were at least planning to do at the time. It was 2001 and online gaming wasn't then what it was now. Easy to control the much smaller space things were at the time and that's pretty much what happened to AW. Nothing wrong with the game at all as it was. It certainly could have followed a similar development curve near what we have but that wasn't the idea for EA. They caught it and killed it plain and simple.
I knew bad things were happening as a pseudo employee (staffer EAGURUDrano). I bailed for AH just before the doors closed.
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It did in Air Warrior.
Different circus. Different monkeys.
Three-sided war and ramped ENY at our current level is sub-optimal. Maybe the radar update will mitigate that. We will see.
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And history shows that Air Warrior and Warbirds died because there were no adjustments that were needed to keep the game alive.
When history repeats itself, do we notice?
You are wrong about the reason why AW shut down. Yet another game you didn't play. When EA pulled the plug on AW, it wasn't due to lack of players. At the time only Ultima Online had more subscribing players. AW had over 30k players when it shut down.
It was very common to be placed into a queue until space opened up in one of the arenas.
The arenas in AW were also capped. At first the arenas were capped at 100 and later increased to 150 players (AW4W) and the three sided set up worked well. The arena that had a 2 sided set up (AvA) was almost always empty.
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And the caps were only because of the constraints of the servers/internet of the times. That's about all ya could get!
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Different circus. Different monkeys.
Nope. You and others have claimed that a 3 sided war will not work in an arena with low numbers. I pointed out that AW, that had low number arenas (arenas were capped due to server limitations), the 3 sides did work rather well. Even when the caps were raised in AW3 to 300 per arena, the 3 sided system was still the best option.
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Nope. You and others have claimed that a 3 sided war will not work in an arena with low numbers. I pointed out that AW, that had low number arenas (arenas were capped due to server limitations), the 3 sides did work rather well. Even when the caps were raised in AW3 to 300 per arena, the 3 sided system was still the best option.
I think there is another factor here though and that is population density. My memory is fuzzy but didn’t each side have something in the region of 5 fields each? And I do not remember them being as physically separated as they are in many of the AH maps
I think this is very much a large part of the problem with AH. 100 players and 150 fields.
Even if we were to go to 2 sides unless population density was addressed the underlying problem would still exist.
It took bustr 2 years to produce the new map and it is buggy. If it takes that much effort to create a map then we are going to be restricted to whatever tweaks can be made within the current ones and unless they can shut down bases to create ‘active’ front lines then 100 players is always going to feel like an empty arena.
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My recollection was they killed AW to clear the market for Battlefield 1942. I tried it, then WW2OL then AW then here.
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Nope. You and others have claimed that a 3 sided war will not work in an arena with low numbers. I pointed out that AW, that had low number arenas (arenas were capped due to server limitations), the 3 sides did work rather well. Even when the caps were raised in AW3 to 300 per arena, the 3 sided system was still the best option.
I have said that three sides does not work in ACES HIGH with low numbers. We’ve provided ample evidence to make the case. Unless changes are made to settings it will remain sub-optimal. The radar experiment may be a big help. We will see.
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I think there is another factor here though and that is population density. My memory is fuzzy but didn’t each side have something in the region of 5 fields each? And I do not remember them being as physically separated as they are in many of the AH maps
I think this is very much a large part of the problem with AH. 100 players and 150 fields.
Even if we were to go to 2 sides unless population density was addressed the underlying problem would still exist.
It took bustr 2 years to produce the new map and it is buggy. If it takes that much effort to create a map then we are going to be restricted to whatever tweaks can be made within the current ones and unless they can shut down bases to create ‘active’ front lines then 100 players is always going to feel like an empty arena.
This.
When you have 55 players and 150 bases split three ways you are going to wind up with a whole lot of people with nothing to do. We see this repeatedly.
Maybe the new radar setup will help fix this...
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I have said that three sides does not work in ACES HIGH with low numbers. We’ve provided ample evidence to make the case.
No, you haven't provided any evidence at all. All you have done is state your personal beliefs masked as evidence/data.
None of us are privy to the metrics for AH to state conclusively that a 3 sided system doesn't work. However, people can state that a 3 sided system does work over a 2 sided system based on historic evidence.
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I think there is another factor here though and that is population density. My memory is fuzzy but didn’t each side have something in the region of 5 fields each? And I do not remember them being as physically separated as they are in many of the AH maps
I think this is very much a large part of the problem with AH. 100 players and 150 fields.
Even if we were to go to 2 sides unless population density was addressed the underlying problem would still exist.
It took bustr 2 years to produce the new map and it is buggy. If it takes that much effort to create a map then we are going to be restricted to whatever tweaks can be made within the current ones and unless they can shut down bases to create ‘active’ front lines then 100 players is always going to feel like an empty arena.
Before the jump from DOS to Windows, AW maps did have a small number of fields, think 10 for each side. When AW made the jump to Windows and AOL, the number of fields doubled with visible bases and secret bases that weren't visible on the map.
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No, you haven't provided any evidence at all. All you have done is state your personal beliefs masked as evidence/data.
None of us are privy to the metrics for AH to state conclusively that a 3 sided system doesn't work. However, people can state that a 3 sided system does work over a 2 sided system based on historic evidence.
But we are privy to our experience as players.
We’ve made the case. You are biased against it so your mind is made up.
/Discussion
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My recollection was they killed AW to clear the market for Battlefield 1942. I tried it, then WW2OL then AW then here.
From what I was told by a couple of the higher up who were friends with squad members at the time EA wanted the code that AW was using to run the games servers for both AW and Mech Warriors. They were only looking to put their games on line and buying a working system was cheaper than building their own.
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So what happened to the thousands of players Ack-Ack says were in AW? Where did they go? Did most simply quit playing fighter games?
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My recollection was they killed AW to clear the market for Battlefield 1942. I tried it, then WW2OL then AW then here.
EA really didn't have any intention of developing AW any further than AW3MV. EA didn't feel online combat flight sims had any future, despite AW being the second most popular game on EA.com. EA decided to go ahead and put all development in OU, Motor City Online and MPBT 3025 but more importantly, EA wanted the Aries Network code to power MCO and MPBT. So as a result EA finally pulled the plug on AW and killed development of AW4.
EA's decision ultimately led to the demise of EA.com game portal as MCO ended up to be a financial failure and Microsoft forced EA to stop development of MPBT.
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So what happened to the thousands of players Ack-Ack says were in AW? Where did they go? Did most simply quit playing fighter games?
The vast majority came to AH, with a smaller number migrating to WW2OL or Fighter Ace.
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When Air Warrior was moving off of AOL the squad ask me to try and find another game to play. First I tried Warbirds and did not like it at all. Also for a time I did try WW2online. I had tried to get the rest of the squad from Air Warrior to move here also but they hated the flight model. Their response was I want to play a game and have fun I do not want to have to learn to fly a real plane to do it. As a result only 2 others came with me during the move but have since moved on.
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Yeah we had the very same issue when we moved here from Fighter Ace. Nose bounce was the biggest problem for them.
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You are wrong about the reason why AW shut down.
lol ack-ack, do you know we have this wonderful tool called internet in this day and age? I can go back in time to 2001 (on this board) and I will give you a quote.
'Not quite. AW was one of the oldest games around of the "$9.95 all you can eat" type. AW's problemwas that besides the AW3 graphics change, it just .....never changed. All the features promised for AW II never made it into AW III either. The final AW slide to this point has been in the making for over 4 years IMO when they failed to do anything with the program the last time they had a chance..
You can only rest on your laurels for so long before community innovation and veteran interest starts to wane. 'Maintenance Mode" = online death. Especially when competition arrives on the scene as WB's did, then Fighter Ace and now AH.
I've yet to see any threat of AH settling for "status quo" or heading for "maintenance mode."'
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,15603.0.html
Air warrior and Warbirds were both in 'maintenance mode'.
Lucky for Aces High there is no competition in form of online ww2 flight simulator.
Back in time tere were 3 sims Air Warrior, Warbirds, AH, now there is only 1.
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Why did EA shut down AW?
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Why did EA shut down AW?
because they don't like good games
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It is what EA does to games below is a link to a forbes story on their practice.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/kevinmurnane/2017/10/24/electronic-arts-where-video-game-development-studios-go-to-die/#2af69c606462 (https://www.forbes.com/sites/kevinmurnane/2017/10/24/electronic-arts-where-video-game-development-studios-go-to-die/#2af69c606462)
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Like I said, catch and kill.
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Why did EA shut down AW?
EA wanted the source code for the portal that AW used for the game. They bought the game and grabbed the code and closed up AW.