Rgr. so you are obviously not willing to engage in discussion. After all you were 7 and you saw what you saw right?
This is a tribute thread to one of the most amazing moments in history. You don't have to believe it but it wasn't an invite for you to come show your backside. Your post has been reported and hopefully your hijack will be addressed.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: FESS67 on July 21, 2019, 12:56:14 AM
This is a tribute thread to one of the most amazing moments in history. You don't have to believe it but it wasn't an invite for you to come show your backside. Your post has been reported and hopefully your hijack will be addressed.
How was that a hijack? I simply said I was on the fence. Man you have to understand there are other opinions out there.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: Chalenge on July 21, 2019, 03:44:28 AM
Fess, if America had not done it then Russia would still be trying to, so that they could install doomsday weapons on the moon. Every argument that it didn't happen, is based on nonsense.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: Shuffler on July 21, 2019, 06:09:50 AM
Simply look at what is left on the moon. Nothing more to be said.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: Chalenge on July 21, 2019, 07:24:54 AM
Well, there is the problem of not being able to see it with the optics limitations and all. You have to be an expert at microwaves to bounce radio off of the landers, which has been done. Otherwise you have to spend a lot of money just to prove there are things there, and then it would still be denied.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: Arlo on July 21, 2019, 08:33:24 AM
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: bozon on July 21, 2019, 08:33:44 AM
There are still people who believe the earth is flat and all the evidence against it is a conspiracy.
50 years ago the US has pull off perhaps the greatest feat in human history - for all the wrong reasons. I am not talking about the moon landing itself - that is just the tip of it, and frankly, placing a man on the moon had nealy zero scientific meaning.
First, the feat. What the US achieved is an awe inspiring demonstration of what happens when all the shackles and restraints come off and scientists and engineers are allowed to go all out bonkers. The goal that president Kennedy has set (man on the moon before the end of the decade) was like Columbus pitching the idea to sail around the world before the invention of sails and ocean navigation. This was completely crazy.
Amazingly it worked! When science was unleashed science-fiction became exact science. When Niel and Buzz were hopping on the moon it was an engineering victory above all else. This is the kind if event that sends ripples through history and across the globe. I forgot which one of them said it, but he said he was amazed when he heard people from other countries saying that “we” did it - as in “mankind”, not just the Yanks.
I can testify to the magnitude of the ripples from this event. Inspite of being born some 4 years sfter the last moon landing, half a world away from the US, in a village with no phone at home and a B&W TV, I was as a child completely fascinated with this. Looking at the moon and being told that people recently walked on it left me wide eyed and open mouthed. Lots of kids wanted to be astronauts back then - but I very early realized that I wated to be the scientist. Life is complicated, but I consider the “Apollo effect” to be a major reason I ended up being a physicist and astronomer in particular.
Now the reasons - The US did not go to the moon because it cared about science or humanity, or turning some kid in a village into a scientist. It went to the moon to beat the Russians. The Russians went to space to scare the Americans. So in the end, it was all about petty human disputes snd conflicts. It is very unlikely to go this path again any time soon. The ending of the cold war is the worst thing that happened to science. Without it, “progress” today is having emogies on your iPhone that mimic your face - we could have had colonies on Mars by now! But no - we wastesll our creativity and brain power on self indulgence and recreational commodities.
Maybe Elon Musk is the only guy that gets it. That still dream really big, like a 5 years old kid. We need many many more people like that.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: bozon on July 21, 2019, 08:43:27 AM
Well, there is the problem of not being able to see it with the optics limitations and all. You have to be an expert at microwaves to bounce radio off of the landers, which has been done. Otherwise you have to spend a lot of money just to prove there are things there, and then it would still be denied.
The astronauts planted corner reflectors on the moon. They are used for reflecting lasers back to the source with minimal scatter. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_Laser_Ranging_experiment
Many people have used it already. The reflectors are definitely up there.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: puller on July 21, 2019, 08:49:04 AM
People who deny the moon landing and think the Earth is flat are nuts...
how about this one???
Elvis and Tupac are both still alive and living at Area 51 in the room that holds JFK'S ghost....
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: puller on July 21, 2019, 09:49:47 AM
Quote I read this morning
"Anyone subscribing to Apollo conspiracy theories does so only after making a deliberate, willful decision, with full knowledge and malice aforethought, to embrace a lie. Why do they do it? Probably because it enables little men to tell themselves that they are really Big Men, because they know more than ordinary little people, whom they can then scorn. It is a lot easier for mediocre people to believe that they are Great People just by telling themselves that they are, than it is to achieve real greatness through talent and hard work."
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: Shuffler on July 21, 2019, 10:43:34 AM
The original tapes were just sold at auction for 1.87 million. The guy bought them in crates from NASA back some time ago. He was a young fella that had worked at NASA. He paid something like $287 for several crates of film and the original three rolls were in there.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: Chalenge on July 22, 2019, 12:00:17 AM
The astronauts planted corner reflectors on the moon. They are used for reflecting lasers back to the source with minimal scatter. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_Laser_Ranging_experiment
Many people have used it already. The reflectors are definitely up there.
The first "laser" was actually the "MASER," which was microwave amplification through stimulated emission of radiation (where the name comes from). The first reflected signals were microwave signals and they are still used to this day, though mostly by amateur radio operators talking from opposite ends of the world. You would think they would have switched to cell phones by now, but if that fails at least someone still knows how.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: zack1234 on July 22, 2019, 01:26:02 AM
The moon is a projection and the Earth is flat :old:
The landings were filmed at Pinewood Studios :old:
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: Arlo on July 24, 2019, 09:59:49 AM
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: Nwbie on July 29, 2019, 11:57:32 AM
I am firmly on the fence here. I do not think we did it however willing to listen to both sides of the discussion.
My opinion is it was a cold war propaganda must have and am not sure it was actually achieved.
It's obvious you never heard about this...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZgD89VYkVc
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: perdue3 on July 29, 2019, 02:51:04 PM
Throughout the night, the BBC covered the event. In the wee hours was a show that featured a panel of scientists as well as a jam session by a young band from Cambridge called Pink Floyd. If you were up at that time watching the BBC, you saw footage of the moon landing while listening to Pink Floyd jam out this song:
I am firmly on the fence here. I do not think we did it however willing to listen to both sides of the discussion.
My opinion is it was a cold war propaganda must have and am not sure it was actually achieved.
I had Charlie Duke on my jumpseat for three hours. After listening to him and asking him questions—including directly as to whether or not it was a hoax—I am absolutely convinced we did it.
As Duke noted, faking it would have been harder than actually doing it. Also, the Soviets had moles inside every nook and cranny of the program. If they had possession of evidence that proved it was a fraud we would have seen it then.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: AAIK on July 29, 2019, 07:42:56 PM
Before you believe anything you should be warned of the following:
1. People make stories up to intentionally trick other people. 2. People make ideas up that are destructive to others. 3. People make laws that destroy people's lives and future.
This world is not all good advice, sometimes its just nonsense to make people look stupid (the ones who made it just laugh at those who believe it).
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: redcatcherb412 on July 30, 2019, 09:29:47 AM
If it was all fake it was a good one.
I spent weeks in an Army frequency monitoring station at Fort Huachuca in the Arizona desert at the Mexican border locked in a concrete building. The radio traffic was impressive and vast if it was faked. The monitoring was 24/7 for setup thru launch and the entire mission till splashdown.
Enlisted housing back in '68 was the old cavalry officers quarters clapboard housing.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: pembquist on July 30, 2019, 10:38:04 AM
With regard to fake moon landings flat earth etc. etc. I just watched the Netflix "documentary" Bob Lazar Area 51 and Flying Saucers and I guess I had an epiphany in that it became absolutely clear to me that people want to believe in spooky woo to a degree that suggests to me a fundamental bias in human cognition that must have had some evolutionary advantage in the way back. If you put two explanations side by side for an event or series of events a large number of people are going to disbelieve the more straightforward and plausible story in favor of believing the more convoluted long winded and implausible story. In effect the more implausible the explanation the more plausible it appears.
I personally remember being confounded by coin flips in that I could not understand why after a series of heads coming up it wasn't more likely that tails would come up on the next flip. I mean confounded in that while I could understand that coins don't have a memory and the odds of any given coin flip are 50 50 I couldn't get rid of an intuitive sense that it was time for heads to come up and that some how it was more likely than not that it would. This isn't the same mistake that people who believe in a flat earth fall prey to but to my ear it kind of rhymes.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: Arlo on July 30, 2019, 11:33:54 AM
I'm more of the mind that it's a desire become belief thing. If someone wants to believe something badly enough there's no amount of actual proof to deter them. Likewise the smallest fraction of imagination becomes proof to them.
Their biggest downfall is the apparent inability to keep their delusions to themselves.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: pembquist on July 30, 2019, 12:31:51 PM
Arlo I don't think it is an either or thing in that I would agree and enfold what you describe into what I was trying to describe. I am not sure that you can really separate the phenomena of starting with a belief in magical explanations for phenomena and then torturing evidence to maintain that belief despite the evidence on the one hand and the basic human drive to explain things and recognize patterns on the other. Simultaneously this style of cognition both drives scientific/technological development and heavy betting losses at the horse track. The key element missing in the magical thinkers understanding is any real application of the principles of scientific inquiry or even those principles dilute form of common sense. Still, common sense itself should always be suspect as intuition is informed by experience and that is actually very limiting in terms of understanding, at least in my opinion. There was some nice video shot in the ISS about failures of intuition in a zero G environment which really illustrated this for me. Increasingly I believe our brains were built for the wild and have remarkably created all this culture and civilization where some of our most valuable cognitive mechanisms are somewhat sub-optimal.
Clearly I have too much time on my hands avoiding another tenant turnover repaint etc.
Title: Re: 50 yrs ago ....
Post by: Vraciu on July 30, 2019, 06:47:16 PM
I'm more of the mind that it's a desire become belief thing. If someone wants to believe something badly enough there's no amount of actual proof to deter them. Likewise the smallest fraction of imagination becomes proof to them.
Their biggest downfall is the apparent inability to keep their delusions to themselves.
https://youtu.be/y4hieHY0jHM[/youtube]
What I still revel at is that Buzz nearly dropped the guy. Imagine being waylaid by someone almost twice your age (who happens to be in his late-60s or early-70s). Lol.