Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: JimmyD3 on October 26, 2023, 12:51:02 PM
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Been reviewing my 3 maps, etoma, 3points, and blacksea. Beginning to think the bases maybe a little to dense. Was striving for faster action, but with bases only 12 to 15 miles apart, there is no time to realistically respond to an attack, or mount an attack. The aggressor can up from a base farther away, but that still leaves the defender at a significant disadvantage. :uhoh
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Been reviewing my 3 maps, etoma, 3points, and blacksea. Beginning to think the bases maybe a little to dense. Was striving for faster action, but with bases only 12 to 15 miles apart, there is no time to realistically respond to an attack, or mount an attack. The aggressor can up from a base farther away, but that still leaves the defender at a significant disadvantage. :uhoh
Nah nah. Far away bases kill the fight. It's either one side ganging while the other side does not want to roll from a back base to defend because it's too far. So once the attack side caps the field, they almost always have it. Back fields are crucial to stopping hoards. Far away fields make it painstaking to fly to a field, only to die quickly. Once we get to "off hours" people leave quicker because it's too far to fly. You have to remember that AH already takes a while to find action if you are attacking a field. Flying another 10 miles is going to bored them to sleep. Closer bases provide quicker action and allow defenders to not have to spend 10-15 minutes flying from a back field to defend a base.
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Not enough players for larger maps
Small is best - who cares if they rollover quickly
Double the subs then enlarge the maps imo
Eagler
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Etoma could maybe lose a few bases. Three points could be a tad smaller maybe.
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Thanks for the feedback gentlemen, I am currently working on a map of North America (minus some parts of Mexico & Alaska), with each country having 40 bases (that includes Task Groups). was thinking of reducing it to no more than 35 to 38. That would reduce the base overlap somewhat. Just a thought at this point. :D
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Thanks for the feedback gentlemen, I am currently working on a map of North America (minus some parts of Mexico & Alaska), with each country having 40 bases (that includes Task Groups). was thinking of reducing it to no more than 35 to 38. That would reduce the base overlap somewhat. Just a thought at this point. :D
Super excited for this one!
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I personally think 20-25 miles is the ideal distance between bases. Am I alone in this? It gives you plenty of time to grab some altitude and plenty of space to fight between the bases without getting too close to ack.
I don't know the name of the map, but the map that was up Tuesday night had some really fun, low altitude fights. I do think the closer the bases, the lower the fights will be (which I'm all for).
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I think its more important to create "battle areas" rather than have bases just to have bases. I'll tell what creates a lot of action, gv fields in-between 2 fighter bases. I'm telling you right now, people average are getting 6 kills per hour. That's extremely low already. Banshee is correct in that far fields also create much higher atl fighters and lead to more late war plane usage.
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Id say look at some of the older maps. sm isles, minadeo. How are the fights on those maps? Compare them to the newer maps, are the fights better?
I dont get to fly as much as Id like these days, but I do know I like to see one of the old maps up when I do log in. There just seems to be more action even if it is the usual spots.
The Newer maps might not be "known" enough yet to generate fights. At this point players are just grabbing bases for the win. What we need is some analytical guy to graph out the fighting on the maps.
Snail you ready to come out of retirement? :devil
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I do know I like to see one of the old maps up when I do log in. There just seems to be more action even if it is the usual spots.
NDISLES and Uterus will always be my two favorite maps for this reason. Especially if no one tries to land grab in tank town/fighter town.
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I personally think 20-25 miles is the ideal distance between bases. Am I alone in this? It gives you plenty of time to grab some altitude and plenty of space to fight between the bases without getting too close to ack.
I don't know the name of the map, but the map that was up Tuesday night had some really fun, low altitude fights. I do think the closer the bases, the lower the fights will be (which I'm all for).
I like some distance to get up to 15k and full speed before I get to any fight, almost never the base right next door.
As far as actual size of maps doesn’t bother me, But size of fighting land mass could be a consideration. Some of the old maps seem to tend to that.
IMO, Number of players will always matter, small or huge map. Not going to start s new convo with why big maps don’t bother me.
Frankly, not meaning to sound rash,…but I don’t see very much player movement on correcting either issue. Has anyone talked to HT on the map issue, or do we not have maps to offer? I’m still a little out of the loop, I’m sure it shows.
I’m going to do a real “ad” vid. I’ve show what I wanted to in the first 3, the first 2 I’d rather delete. Don’t like em. Got vid speed wrong.
I’ll be up daily in 1-2 months.
But, ya, I actually desire some room to get proper alt.
Keep the faith. >
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NDISLES and Uterus will always be my two favorite maps for this reason. Especially if no one tries to land grab in tank town/fighter town.
Baltic and ND are my two faves. Unfortunately, they are a bit prone to going down fast when a horde is present so I don’t see them much. Can’t wait for the new ND to be uploaded.
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I like some distance to get up to 15k and full speed before I get to any fight, almost never the base right next door.
As far as actually size of maps doesn’t bother me, But size of fighting land mass could be a consideration. Some of the old maps seem to tend to that.
IMO, Number of players will always matter, small or huge map. Not going to start s new convo with why big maps don’t bother me.
Frankly, not meaning to sound rash,…but I don’t see very many player movement on correcting either issue. Has anyone talked to HT on the map issue, or do we not have maps to offer? I’m still a little out of the loop, I’m sure it shows.
I’m going to do a real “ad” vid. I’ve show what I wanted to in the first 3, the first 2 I’d rather delete. Don’t like em. Got vid speed wrong.
I’ll be up daily in 1-2 months.
But, ya, I actually desire some room to get proper alt.
Keep the faith.
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I don’t know about everyone else but I do not think we should trim maps sizes. We should for sure keep a variety of all sizes. I also like three countries but that angers some people.
I will defend both if anyone cares to ask. The fact that AH caters to a large swath of combat sim types is always its core strength.
People tend to focus on the fast action, high revving flight sim portions. I would be willing to wager 40% or more of regular MA players only fly when they need to.
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Been reviewing my 3 maps, etoma, 3points, and blacksea. Beginning to think the bases maybe a little to dense. Was striving for faster action, but with bases only 12 to 15 miles apart, there is no time to realistically respond to an attack, or mount an attack. The aggressor can up from a base farther away, but that still leaves the defender at a significant disadvantage. :uhoh
You guys do great work. If you’re second guessing yourself I’m sure there is an educated reason. Sounds like a logical thought to me. I’m just glad you do what ya do.
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I don’t know about everyone else but I do not think we should trim maps sizes. We should for sure keep a variety of all sizes. I also like three countries but that angers some people.
I will defend both if anyone cares to ask. The fact that AH caters to a large swath of combat sim types is always its core strength.
People tend to focus on the fast action, high revving flight sim portions. I would be willing to wager 40% or more of regular MA players only fly when they need to.
I can agree with that.
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Kennai/Jimmy,
The only gripes I hear about your maps..."Could he have added any more hills, Trees yadda yadda."
That from GVers, and you, Sir OF ALL fellers know how I deal with GVs! :devil :rofl
If I said it once, I said it thrice..."If they wanted to defend their base and have more fun, they wouldn't waste time climbing to 25k and then getting there! Too LATE! Airfield was 3/4 to 1 1/2 sector away. Happened 5 times last evening.
Not very many fellers care about the "MAP WINS" and it is fine by me! YES, it is fun to do coordinated Missions, but is NOT the Be All-End All for fun. I join Missions all the time, when they are posted and I Ride for the Brand! I am more than happy to fly CAS in my Spitfire MK16-A-10c with 3 Tank Busters, Low and Slow and heavy. HEHE Gonna get "Picked" maybe....hehehe Come On Down, your the next Alt Monkey, on the Price for flight :devil
I see no differences in FIGHTS to be had between maps..except for BuzzSaw and maybe Ndisles? Even with Kongs "Ranch Pizza" map! :rofl
Anyone gripping about your maps...SHOW ME YOURS or Shut The Front Up....too much Sugar Honey Iced Tea as is, these days
BW1stpar/ULCapkid
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I like some distance to get up to 15k and full speed before I get to any fight, almost never the base right next door.
That's why I don't think base density is an issue. Typically, if two bases are a sector (25 miles) apart, you can get up to 10-12k easily depending on the plane. If the bases are 10-15 miles apart, you can lift from the next base over and still not be that far away.
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When did 10k become the norm?
I think I rarely got above 6k for the 1st 15 years I played this game..
Now it's 10k minimum or you will be the low guy..
Closer bases should lower the altitude imo
Eagler
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If you want the alt, you can just take an alternate route rather than nose on base and auto climb. There is usually the option of coming from another base at maybe more of a high speed climb also. I don't really see that as a valid concern. The closer bases seem to get people to fight a little more aggressively, more frequently because they arent invested into a large amount time to get to the party.
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If you want the alt, you can just take an alternate route rather than nose on base and auto climb. There is usually the option of coming from another base at maybe more of a high speed climb also. I don't really see that as a valid concern. The closer bases seem to get people to fight a little more aggressively, more frequently because they arent invested into a large amount time to get to the party.
Agreed.
The back-field bases are there for those who want more alt.
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Definitely need closer bases. The best fights are when there is a CV nearby and there is a 5k furball. A big issue already with the low numbers is the amount of time it takes to get to the fight. There are already plenty of options for those who like to climb above everyone before they engage.
PS You're missing an o.
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Agreed.
The back-field bases are there for those who want more alt.
There are various POV, comes down to how one squints their eyes. I’m ok with either decision. I’m just happy its still around to fly MP
I like coming in at 400-500 mph
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Kennai/Jimmy,
The only gripes I hear about your maps..."Could he have added any more hills, Trees yadda yadda."
Yeah Par, I get a little ribbing about that too, all in good fun. Funny part is, I drive every spawn at least 3 times minimum, I do try to eliminate the steep hills as much as possible, and make the trees a balance for the gv-ers vs the flyers.
To everyone else, I appreciate the feedback, good or bad. I enjoy work with the Terrain Editor, and spend almost as much time on it as I do in game. :D
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Definitely need closer bases. The best fights are when there is a CV nearby and there is a 5k furball. A big issue already with the low numbers is the amount of time it takes to get to the fight. There are already plenty of options for those who like to climb above everyone before they engage.
PS You're missing an o.
“The best fights” is very subjective.
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Yeah Par, I get a little ribbing about that too, all in good fun. Funny part is, I drive every spawn at least 3 times minimum, I do try to eliminate the steep hills as much as possible, and make the trees a balance for the gv-ers vs the flyers.
To everyone else, I appreciate the feedback, good or bad. I enjoy work with the Terrain Editor, and spend almost as much time on it as I do in game. :D
Whoa what you drive then each three times?? How long did that take on Etoma lol. This is fascinating to me and wow I am now way more appreciative of our cartographers! :salute
That said I have some notes… :rofl
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Yeah Par, I get a little ribbing about that too, all in good fun. Funny part is, I drive every spawn at least 3 times minimum, I do try to eliminate the steep hills as much as possible, and make the trees a balance for the gv-ers vs the flyers.
To everyone else, I appreciate the feedback, good or bad. I enjoy work with the Terrain Editor, and spend almost as much time on it as I do in game. :D
Back in the day, I worked on things much more than flying. Its just what I liked to do. Today its the opposite. It’s an odd feeling to not be working on something. I’m on ignore, so I guess I’ll stay this way.
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Whoa what you drive then each three times?? How long did that take on Etoma lol. This is fascinating to me and wow I am now way more appreciative of our cartographers! :salute
That said I have some notes… :rofl
etoma took about 4 months from the time Oboe and I started discussing it, to when it was first put in the MA. We then had the icon issue. Took me about 6 weeks to figure out that problem.
I use Airteks terrain generation program, which takes real NASA generated topographical data and creates a Aces High terrain map. This data can also be scaled up or down as needed. With that it is imperative any where gv's will be used, or where Bases, Towns or Strats are located, you have to insure reasonable access. This requires actual driving from each spawn point, to the town/base/strat it is accessing. Then each Air base needs to be checked to insure fighters and bombers can launch from the majority of the available runways. Tedious but very rewarding when it all comes together. I normally do the spawn test drives in an M3, it has reasonable speed, and yet reflects steep hills quickly. Aircraft launch test are normally done with a Fully loaded Lancaster and Auto Takeoff. :)
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etoma took about 4 months from the time Oboe and I started discussing it, to when it was first put in the MA. We then had the icon issue. Took me about 6 weeks to figure out that problem.
I use Airteks terrain generation program, which takes real NASA generated topographical data and creates a Aces High terrain map. This data can also be scaled up or down as needed. With that it is imperative any where gv's will be used, or where Bases, Towns or Strats are located, you have to insure reasonable access. This requires actual driving from each spawn point, to the town/base/strat it is accessing. Then each Air base needs to be checked to insure fighters and bombers can launch from the majority of the available runways. Tedious but very rewarding when it all comes together. I normally do the spawn test drives in an M3, it has reasonable speed, and yet reflects steep hills quickly. Aircraft launch test are normally done with a Fully loaded Lancaster and Auto Takeoff. :)
Well then we need to discuss runway trees lol.
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When did 10k become the norm?
I think I rarely got above 6k for the 1st 15 years I played this game..
Now it's 10k minimum or you will be the low guy..
Closer bases should lower the altitude imo
Eagler
Its kinda been a concept that one should be 15k, for various reasons. Some planes were built to fight at that alt, and ya have pickers who come in at 20k. That said, half a sector away I nose down in a decline of -2, by then time I arrive I’m cooking at 525 with no compression on the deck. How one pilots is personal preference. There are no rules. :)
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Its kinda been a concept that one should be 15k, for various reasons. Some planes were built to fight at that alt, and ya have pickers who come in at 20k. That said, half a sector away I nose down in a decline of -2, by then time I arrive I’m cooking at 525 with no compression on the deck. How one pilots is personal preference. There are no rules. :) .
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A P47 can float like a butterfly above 15k.
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For just a second, I thought the title of this thread was asking if Players are too dense.... :) :bolt:
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How one pilots is personal preference. There are no rules. :) .
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Very true but by removing close bases/increasing flight time you force the fight higher and requires more time to take to get to it..
So you are forcing rules with such a change imo <S>
Eagler
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For just a second, I thought the title of this thread was asking if Players are too dense.... :) :bolt:
:aok Good to see you still around Guppy. :salute
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Very true but by removing close bases/increasing flight time you force the fight higher and requires more time to take to get to it..
So you are forcing rules with such a change imo <S>
Eagler
No no, as I stated above (maybe poorly), I just take off from further base, which is normal for me. No matter the map size or base placement I prefer 1-1.5 sectors away. Won’t affect me at all. Change things at will or keep things as is.
I think Fugitive got it right, newer maps aren’t as well known, therefore could be being played differently.
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Its kinda been a concept that one should be 15k, for various reasons.
I have always had a 10k cap. If I am at 15k, I'm mad that I climbed up that high :rofl
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I have always had a 10k cap. If I am at 15k, I'm mad that I climbed up that high :rofl
That's fine, flown this way for decades. Most times,... I'll go to 15k,..BUT,...by the time I actually enter a base zone I dump 5k for speed, I'm at 10k and moving, it'll take a 262 or someone else doing the same thing to get anywhere near me. There's also commonly pilots at 10-15k, I'm fighting the vulchers, who are going after those who have no alt. A lot of those are 20k. OTOH At 15k I can grab another 5-10k to get to 25k if I'm going after a hi buffs instead. It gives me more than one choice. I'm going after what ever is getting the least attention. It's just my way.
Point being, map size will not change my style, but some changes could help for more or bigger fights. All this stuff truly is a science, dripping of opinions and variables. But talking about forcing rules, it's kind of forcing rules making it too small and those who fly like me or higher and wider lose out. I don't think it would be wise to arrange it just for low alt flyers.
Personally, I can go with less bases (smaller map), not sure if I'd change the base distances, that can go either way. IMO. One map I really thought hit a honey spot does not come up often, but should. Can't remember the name, starts with an M. older map. Mandino? I think the land mass size is great, the map produced some great fights/battles.
I think some time-lapse vid of a map in use could tell some stories we are missing. Looking for movement patterns.
All that drivel said, big maps are a selling point, if you're coming from another sim. It has a wow effect. That I know of, sims like DCS don't have maps this big. We miss that point because we are deep inside studying it.
From other vid comments I read, a lot of former players don't even know the game exist anymore, they tend to go into nostalgic mode. No one expected it to go this far. Pretty sure that includes HT. That's a problem, probably the bigger problem.
A few things need to come together full circle. Promoting and spreading the word/vids we're still here. Vids will be more sell-able with modern FX. The more players the less map problems, as well as more income for HTC to be able to afford some new updates and maintenance issues. In a biz sense, it has to be worth putting the time in for updates. I think the more we put effort into drawing former players back or new players, the better many things will be. I think that is a core solution.
Idea
30 day trial
$20 mo.
No one can convince me that paying $20 per mo is more expensive that buying a collection of planes at $70 a pop. It comes out to about the same, or higher on their end. WT, DCS, IL-2 have seen their peaks, their 15-20 yrs is catching up, numbers are slowly dropping. we have been gaining arena count more than losing. And that is a flag. DCS just came out with a video totally in my style, music an all. Bring AH up to speed could be a threat. No one has scenarios or MP arenas of any real count, we laugh at 50 in one arena.
2 cents.
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Yeah Par, I get a little ribbing about that too, all in good fun. Funny part is, I drive every spawn at least 3 times minimum, I do try to eliminate the steep hills as much as possible, and make the trees a balance for the gv-ers vs the flyers.
To everyone else, I appreciate the feedback, good or bad. I enjoy work with the Terrain Editor, and spend almost as much time on it as I do in game. :D
Brings back memories of the Early Days! In AH3! Fellers had been playing for a Decade, before I got here? Can't dodge trees?"
Ya Ya..Cumquates and Lemon..maybe Orange Trees....all "HIT" different...but really? Maybe it is VR? I cant remember the last time GVing, that I got stuck..."He...add enough trees?" LOL Dont get me wrong, as per Last Evening...YES I hit a tree...defending that Base. That is different "Tree' situation. :rofl :furious "TROOPS RUNNING"........dive in..........Da TREE...and next trip back.."The Building"! Even had a few Tard Misses..."BW, you doing OK?" :rofl Dang I love you fellers!!! Having too much fun!
BW1stpar/ULCapkid
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1stpar3 I'm doing great. Getting older but we all get that. :D I'm still putting in 2 to 3 hours a day in the game, and an additional 3 or 4 hours in the Terrain Editor, if I'm working on a map. :banana: