General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: LCADolby on February 12, 2025, 07:03:17 PM
Title: Rye Games
Post by: LCADolby on February 12, 2025, 07:03:17 PM
Catching up on some YT late night and I find AcesHigh in Rye's "Dead Games"
:salute to "Blenheim" patience of a saint.
Anyone want to weight in on this little 720k views :eek:
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: DmonSlyr on February 12, 2025, 09:40:27 PM
It hurts watching how completely new he is to flight sims haha. Not knowing about using views is a huge disadvantage and makes it so much harder. Playing with a mouse and key board is also really tough. It seems he was trying to take off a lot right at bases being vulched. Not sure if he knows about dar bars. He shows how hard it really is for a total newbie but damn he has a lot of basic things to learn. I'm glad the community was good to him though. Hey we all started there :rofl
I agree that that the MA is such a tough place to learn the game and then having to pay the sub after only 2 weeks is really tough for most who aren't totally into it yet. I really wish there was a quick action arena for these types of folks like H2H use to be but I can only dream.
If only he knew about the special events too...
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: ZE on February 13, 2025, 10:52:01 AM
A demonstration that this community is doing better and can attract more young players. Just being friendly and enjoying the game without drama can make the difference.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 13, 2025, 11:17:52 AM
A demonstration that this community is doing better and can attract more young players. Just being friendly and enjoying the game without drama can make the difference.
This
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 13, 2025, 11:19:25 AM
It hurts watching how completely new he is to flight sims haha. Not knowing about using views is a huge disadvantage and makes it so much harder. Playing with a mouse and key board is also really tough. It seems he was trying to take off a lot right at bases being vulched. Not sure if he knows about dar bars. He shows how hard it really is for a total newbie but damn he has a lot of basic things to learn. I'm glad the community was good to him though. Hey we all started there :rofl
I agree that that the MA is such a tough place to learn the game and then having to pay the sub after only 2 weeks is really tough for most who aren't totally into it yet. I really wish there was a quick action arena for these types of folks like H2H use to be but I can only dream.
If only he knew about the special events too...
You seem to enjoy spreading experience and training. Why don’t you look into being a trainer?
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: DmonSlyr on February 13, 2025, 03:30:44 PM
You seem to enjoy spreading experience and training. Why don’t you look into being a trainer?
Yeah it's really just the timing for me. I don't get a lot of time to play that much.
That being said, I'm working on getting better with the training style videos and video editing side of things so I can make more good videos.
However, it's not going to be "basic" training techniques. People can find that in other places.
Just realizing that he wasn't utilizing his views at all... I only wonder how many others don't even know how to look around lol. Its like damn, those super basic things like that are a game changer.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Mongoose on February 13, 2025, 08:54:17 PM
I agree that that the MA is such a tough place to learn the game and then having to pay the sub after only 2 weeks is really tough for most who aren't totally into it yet. I really wish there was a quick action arena for these types of folks like H2H use to be but I can only dream.
I suggested having a new player's event, where new players would gather with a few veterans who could show them the ropes. The problem is we couldn't find a good way to get new players together like that. New players tend to come in one at a time. This is why there are training videos for new players when they first join.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: AKIron on February 13, 2025, 10:48:15 PM
You cannot buy advertising worth 730,000 views. If that doesn't attract attention you need to rethink your product.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 14, 2025, 09:25:45 AM
You cannot buy advertising worth 730,000 views. If that doesn't attract attention you need to rethink your product.
L Your game sells unsupported plane. Beat it idiot
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: DmonSlyr on February 14, 2025, 09:46:32 AM
Even with 750k views it's sorta unfortunate he wasn't a little more knowledgeable about flight sims/AH before starting. I'm hoping that many try the game from it. I noticed that Blennehiem was a star in the comments, so it really goes a long way to reach out to noobs and help them. As you can see they need all the help they can get. I just hope his noobness (no offense) doesn't deter potential since he didn't even have his views set and made it seem difficult just to get in the air, only to be vulched :rofl
And of course he posted my comment at the end there about rooks/knits not looking like they are fighting. I only talk crap to try to get them to fight lol. But this is my issue with these big maps... tiny dars doesn't look like action and makes it tough for new players to know where to roll for action.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: AKIron on February 14, 2025, 11:22:20 AM
Getting over 700,000 views is big. Gamers interested in older games is a prime audience.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 14, 2025, 12:44:54 PM
Even with 750k views it's sorta unfortunate he wasn't a little more knowledgeable about flight sims/AH before starting. I'm hoping that many try the game from it. I noticed that Blennehiem was a star in the comments, so it really goes a long way to reach out to noobs and help them. As you can see they need all the help they can get. I just hope his noobness (no offense) doesn't deter potential since he didn't even have his views set and made it seem difficult just to get in the air, only to be vulched :rofl
And of course he posted my comment at the end there about rooks/knits not looking like they are fighting. I only talk crap to try to get them to fight lol. But this is my issue with these big maps... tiny dars doesn't look like action and makes it tough for new players to know where to roll for action.
Be aware of subtle product steering in these blog type stuff. We see steering on bbs cloaked as innocent comparing. Their fav game will always be end result that shines. Get your own word out.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Bruv119 on February 14, 2025, 08:19:50 PM
:salute blenheim,
was so nice of rye to comment on the help he received, whilst seasoned vets pummel him like it was a free bar. :banana:
from an outsider perspective he did sum up the main issues at hand, the sub pay wall prevents most new blood from joining, it is just alien to this generation of gamers. The solution has been suggested, give access to some basic planes to get them learning and off the ground. up to HT how stringent he wants to be with it. like one new plane a month providing you meet some sort of combat/hours logged criteria. AH doesn't have to become warthunder it just needs to give the kids a chance. Any weird gamey shenanigans then ban their IP.
Good to see that AH isn't dead in a video about dead video games though. He sounded British does he want to join a squad? :old:
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 14, 2025, 08:24:27 PM
was so nice of rye to comment on the help he received, whilst seasoned vets pummel him like it was a free bar. :banana:
from an outsider perspective he did sum up the main issues at hand, the sub pay wall prevents most new blood from joining, it is just alien to this generation of gamers. The solution has been suggested, give access to some basic planes to get them learning and off the ground. up to HT how stringent he wants to be with it. like one new plane a month providing you meet some sort of combat/hours logged criteria. AH doesn't have to become warthunder it just needs to give the kids a chance. Any weird gamey shenanigans then ban their IP.
Good to see that AH isn't dead in a video about dead video games though. He sounded British does he want to join a squad? :old:
Good positive take on it. I don’t watch or read that stuff, varying opinions throw me off. Sme just write to write.
Thanks for the clarity.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: -gg- on February 14, 2025, 08:34:00 PM
Haha! I love that guy and his attitude. He's a great commentator on those videos.
From 8 mis ago, not all that old
Ok , I broke down and watched it. Fresh change from wannabe analyst who have one track minds. . Kinda smashed the steam dweeb reputation. Sure seemed impressed with the community
Should invite him back at prime time.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 15, 2025, 05:43:09 PM
Ya know, I myself don't mind the sub because I play often. But since I've been back this seems like a serious constant repeat issue.
1) Impressed with the community 2) Loves the game 3) The Sub Hex 4) Too competitive 5) Learning curve
The community has really calmed down on the over-competitive stuff. I think his comments made everyone proud because we're so used to negatives reviews and comments forced on us, Its strange to get a several compliments.
The only thing we have no control of is the sub. It seems to keep us in a catch 22. We don't draw enough subs to make an update affordable, anything free certainly won't pay for it. Frankly the players just want more players.
Personally, I think just modernizing the visual FX (explosions etc..) would go a long way for an update. It would bring it back into the eye-candy zone.
Like it or not, The pay model has to change if we want to stop spinning wheels.
I floated the thought in my own head of how would pay by day work. one thought is you deposit $15-20, each day you log in it subtracts 50-75 cents.
I've done biz where we would undercut the competitor, and most would say well you'll lose money, but if you attract enough customers in the end you actually make more money than if ya did nothing.
Every idea has pros and cons and hidden nightmares and gambles. This would just be tweaking the current system and appeasing the modern gamer. I *THINK* FX update and this could be a compromise to attract new players. Best biz in done in compromise.
On HTs end the income is more predictable in subs.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 18, 2025, 12:33:20 AM
Haha! I love that guy and his attitude. He's a great commentator on those videos.
Ya.
Some people dig so far in to being king gamer that they end up missing what the common person is looking for or their POV.
I kinda had that advantage as I back 14 yrs later and had new outside perspective. Ya can get clouded up with all that digging into the science of audience. Peple who "know it all" don't.
The guy was very casual and just let it flow naturally without wiggin out. I think he gave an honest POV, not like some around here who constantly HINT negative but we should try their game, steering the convo. Since that's all we get here it was refreshing to see an honest take.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: ZE on February 18, 2025, 02:31:20 PM
In any game or audiovisual recording, the sounds are a key factor in the experience. I would like to see someday a better set of sound for guns and planes. They are good now but could be better... :salute ZE
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: hazmatt on February 19, 2025, 01:07:38 PM
You cannot buy advertising worth 730,000 views. If that doesn't attract attention you need to rethink your product.
Sadly I think everything we've said has fallen on deaf ears and I for on have given up on being attacked for trying to offer advice based on playing multiple other games.
Did you hear how he ended it? He said something about how he can't justify the "subscription". This has been mentioned eleventy billion times. Everyone is so sure it doesn't have anything to do with anything. I know I'll get attacked for just mentioning it by the whole, less the a coffee a day crowd defending it, but the fact remains that if you look at comments all over the web, and listen to what people like this have to say, it becomes obvious that it IS a problem for many would be new players and players like me who have 4 Warthunder accounts and 4 IL2 accounts so I can play with my kids. Now that my kids are old enough to play, I'm not willing to pay 720 a year to play AH with them. I'd rather buy them new shoes or maybe a new plane or tank in one of those "other" games.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: AKIron on February 19, 2025, 02:07:30 PM
Sadly I think everything we've said has fallen on deaf ears and I for on have given up on being attacked for trying to offer advice based on playing multiple other games.
Did you hear how he ended it? He said something about how he can't justify the "subscription". This has been mentioned eleventy billion times. Everyone is so sure it doesn't have anything to do with anything. I know I'll get attacked for just mentioning it by the whole, less the a coffee a day crowd defending it, but the fact remains that if you look at comments all over the web, and listen to what people like this have to say, it becomes obvious that it IS a problem for many would be new players and players like me who have 4 Warthunder accounts and 4 IL2 accounts so I can play with my kids. Now that my kids are old enough to play, I'm not willing to pay 720 a year to play AH with them. I'd rather buy them new shoes or maybe a new plane or tank in one of those "other" games.
Know what you mean. I used to have two AH accounts so to play with my son. Later 4 DCS accounts to play with my grandsons. Most fun we had though was Left4Dead sessions lasting 'til 2-3AM. Invariably the younger 2 would start shooting each other instead of zombies.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: AKIron on February 19, 2025, 02:14:14 PM
Maybe 7 or 8 years ago I first introduced one of my grandsons to the F-15C in DCS. He was about 14 I think. Covered all the basics with him. He was able to take off, fly around, and land. Then we graduated to missiles. I was cutting him slack of course but eventually I shot him down. He started complaining about not being able to shoot missiles. Then I noticed I forgot to give him any. :D
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 19, 2025, 02:16:59 PM
Sadly I think everything we've said has fallen on deaf ears and I for on have given up on being attacked for trying to offer advice based on playing multiple other games.
Did you hear how he ended it? He said something about how he can't justify the "subscription". This has been mentioned eleventy billion times. Everyone is so sure it doesn't have anything to do with anything. I know I'll get attacked for just mentioning it by the whole, less the a coffee a day crowd defending it, but the fact remains that if you look at comments all over the web, and listen to what people like this have to say, it becomes obvious that it IS a problem for many would be new players and players like me who have 4 Warthunder accounts and 4 IL2 accounts so I can play with my kids. Now that my kids are old enough to play, I'm not willing to pay 720 a year to play AH with them. I'd rather buy them new shoes or maybe a new plane or tank in one of those "other" games.
Thus may be the wrong thread
It doesn’t seem to be a problem with current players as it does possible future players. But clearly, it is an issue.
Just because others reply that may conflict with your point, doesn’t mean they are attacking you. Many times I’ll play devils advocate just to push it and see if a point stands up on its own. If so, lets get after it. Nothing at all personal or meant to be attacking.
Many ideas have been floated recently in other threads, one in wishlist.
Don’t be mad at us, we’re just the community, we don’t have that power. We’re doing what we can to keep it as fresh as possible. Many are putting in time and great effort.
I may suggest you join that thread. Maybe a good idea will come out of it. Just remember, totally removing the sub could have a negative impact. A few of us posted ideas there.
Its quite clear you want back in, the convo may apply to your situation.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 19, 2025, 02:18:26 PM
.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Dadtallica on February 19, 2025, 03:18:46 PM
Sadly I think everything we've said has fallen on deaf ears and I for on have given up on being attacked for trying to offer advice based on playing multiple other games.
Did you hear how he ended it? He said something about how he can't justify the "subscription". This has been mentioned eleventy billion times. Everyone is so sure it doesn't have anything to do with anything. I know I'll get attacked for just mentioning it by the whole, less the a coffee a day crowd defending it, but the fact remains that if you look at comments all over the web, and listen to what people like this have to say, it becomes obvious that it IS a problem for many would be new players and players like me who have 4 Warthunder accounts and 4 IL2 accounts so I can play with my kids. Now that my kids are old enough to play, I'm not willing to pay 720 a year to play AH with them. I'd rather buy them new shoes or maybe a new plane or tank in one of those "other" games.
When I was sharing and recruiting for the masters of the air scenario, it was definitely the number one reason I was told no thank you.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: The Fugitive on February 19, 2025, 03:29:04 PM
Sadly I think everything we've said has fallen on deaf ears and I for on have given up on being attacked for trying to offer advice based on playing multiple other games.
Did you hear how he ended it? He said something about how he can't justify the "subscription". This has been mentioned eleventy billion times. Everyone is so sure it doesn't have anything to do with anything. I know I'll get attacked for just mentioning it by the whole, less the a coffee a day crowd defending it, but the fact remains that if you look at comments all over the web, and listen to what people like this have to say, it becomes obvious that it IS a problem for many would be new players and players like me who have 4 Warthunder accounts and 4 IL2 accounts so I can play with my kids. Now that my kids are old enough to play, I'm not willing to pay 720 a year to play AH with them. I'd rather buy them new shoes or maybe a new plane or tank in one of those "other" games.
Im sure multiple accounts can run up a bill pretty quick, and its a choice you made. I never had to add accounts as both of my sons, while gamers both, neither one was into flying at all. On the other hand, if they had one or both wanted to fly AH and I couldnt afford to run 2 or 3 accounts I believe Id still keep my account even if they couldnt play. I enjoy the game and $15 a month is a good price for the value I get. Daddy gets to have fun too even if it isnt always with my boys. Your mileage may vary.
I've been post videos about the game all over the place and I would say the subscription is the #2 reason many balk, the graphics are #1. Still I think we have a great game. I dont know what Hitechs plans are but at this point Im doing everything I can to try and get other people to see us here. As Animl said there is another thread with a number of .....what I think.... some great ideas on changing the subscription rates or tweaking things for the game.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Eagler on February 19, 2025, 03:43:47 PM
As mentioned in the wishlist a family account price or some kind of change is needed..
Maybe $7 for one $12 for two and $16 for 3
Eagler
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: xanax on February 19, 2025, 04:50:43 PM
As mentioned in the wishlist a family account price or some kind of change is needed..
Maybe $7 for one $12 for two and $16 for 3
Eagler
This woulda helped me at times. I've opened accounts for a nephew, a neighbor and his wife (they took turns), a former player and a buddy from college days. One still currently plays but he still needs his own Windows machine. I think the others may have kept trying if they saw discounts like these you propose. I'd gladly keep paying for them either way but they don't want that and fade out after a couple of months at the most. Before you know it, they're off playing the wizard and dragons or space laser games.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Spikes on February 19, 2025, 06:24:40 PM
Sadly I think everything we've said has fallen on deaf ears and I for on have given up on being attacked for trying to offer advice based on playing multiple other games.
Did you ever take into account that HTC is a business and perhaps he just...I dunno, doesn't agree with you?
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 19, 2025, 06:37:56 PM
Did you ever take into account that HTC is a business and perhaps he just...I dunno, doesn't agree with you?
I'm not sure some do the math on his end. If he were to totally remove subs, the game could come to a financial close prematurely. I always look for workable compromises. Can't just go at things with a chain saw. Its a very catch 22 subject. We don't have a buffer for mistakes.
I DO understand hazmat and a couple other's points about something like family discounts,.... in another thread. This convo on the front page is probably not the best place for it.
Loved the guys take on AH tho, he talked well of of it, which was refreshing.
BTW Spikes, Metal Machine song,.... has created an ear worm in my head,... I'm going to have to invoice you for rent in my head. LOVE that vid
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Eagler on February 20, 2025, 06:12:11 AM
How can we tell? Not much feedback on our ideas from HT...
He knows we hang on his every word posted..
Eagler
Every word he says instantly goes under the microscope. These are usually convos that happen behind closed doors, as they should. My guess, for him this is not for bbs. These are private biz discussions.
“Do I risk making money at the risk of making less.” Probably the most risky decision. He could drop his income and nothing come of it. Just because non-players complain about subs does not guarantee they would play if it changed. Basically, we’re gambling with his income.
Personally, I think it could use some tweaks, but a chainsaw approach will go nowhere.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Spikes on February 20, 2025, 08:50:31 AM
I'm not sure some do the math on his end. If he were to totally remove subs, the game could come to a financial close prematurely. I always look for workable compromises. Can't just go at things with a chain saw. Its a very catch 22 subject. We don't have a buffer for mistakes.
I DO understand hazmat and a couple other's points about something like family discounts,.... in another thread. This convo on the front page is probably not the best place for it.
Loved the guys take on AH tho, he talked well of of it, which was refreshing.
BTW Spikes, Metal Machine song,.... has created an ear worm in my head,... I'm going to have to invoice you for rent in my head. LOVE that vid
I found the video to be enjoyable but he highlighted a lot of the learning issues with AH. I would say it would take the average person a couple months to get comfortable with the game and all of its nuances, probably less if said person has a background in flight sims in some capacity (a DCS person would likely find it easier, whereas a War Thunder person would find it to be slightly harder or maybe on-par).
I decided to watch that video again and it made me smile - might try to put something new together and dedicate myself to AH VR for a bit. :)
How can we tell? Not much feedback on our ideas from HT...
He knows we hang on his every word posted..
Eagler
You don't I suppose, unless you call him. I will say over all the years I've seen some pretty terrible ideas posted, just my opinion of course. If HT listened to everyone this game probably would've crashed and burned long ago. I think HT has shown his willingness to tinker if given a reasonable idea along with reasoning and pros/cons. Disabling the M3 with troops or supplies (can't remember what it was) comes to mind. I think the AWACS radar would be fine so long as the pilot has line-of-sight on whatever it is. But I don't know if that's possible to code with this game engine. Simply AFK climbing out with your map open and spotting a plane as it passes under you shouldn't trigger radar until you roll your plane over and visually see it, for example.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Eagler on February 20, 2025, 09:21:22 AM
Please not the ..you should call him again answer...why the bbs then?
Eagler
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Shuffler on February 20, 2025, 10:41:42 AM
My kids, when young, had hobbies. They earned and saved money to do them. I could have just paid.... but I was teaching them how to make their own way.
The games that are pay as you play like DCS depend on those who spend large sums paying to be better. Not those who just buy a plane every once in awhile. Without the ones who spend large sums, those games would not exist.
Have fun in whichever game suits your interest. As for being attacked on which way you think is better, that goes both ways.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 20, 2025, 11:05:40 AM
I found the video to be enjoyable but he highlighted a lot of the learning issues with AH. I would say it would take the average person a couple months to get comfortable with the game and all of its nuances, probably less if said person has a background in flight sims in some capacity (a DCS person would likely find it easier, whereas a War Thunder person would find it to be slightly harder or maybe on-par).
Probably a lotta truth there.
Totally opinion. Probably another WOT Some, like on steam, are looking for a game, ya pop in ya complete the levels and move onto another game. This is a sim played as a game. The game part is a vehicle for flying in a sim. Its a two part experience. Sometimes the learning curve weeds out those who weren't planning on staying in the first place. IMO because our interest is in the sim portion.
DCS is so into the sim portion fun gaming is a Oh BTW. WT, sorry, but just watching that FM in vids is painful. IL-2 seems to have the glitter, but it's growing old too, that engine is probably maxed out. Again, I watch that FM in vids is not painful but I can see it doesn't really flow like AH. Mind you, drivel from someone who has played none of them. so take it for what it's not worth.
I have a different view as a return player on the learning curve. Actually flying the plane came like riding a bike, even tho I had seriously worn gear and muscle memory loss. The harder part was re-learning the setup and and how to configure to best suit me. It was amazing how much of that I forgot. I used f to fly bufs a LOT, couldn't even remember how to cal the sight.
I think every sim is a mass learning curve to someone who has never taken part in them. It's starting from zero. If we keep making it sound hard that alone could scare people from trying. If we can do it ANYONE can do it. Why I think training and tech support (customer service) is a highly valued system Minimize the curve.
That said, even those who have been a round a long time still find something to learn. And that to me is what keeps the longevity. IN other "games" you learn it, max out, move on. In most good sims it never ends.
I think we mistake the gamer for the simmer. Its a different mindset.
Genre dying? I dunno about that. Between all the sims there is still a massive crowd, who gets who is the challenge.
We,as a seasoned community can, to a point, ease the learning curve and tech support, that's something we can control. The recent Training Forum posts shows that is in full gear, where we need it.
What we cannot control is the payment model. We can only use the power of suggestion. There are some good ideas and some, on the biz end, are non-workable ideas. Including my own.
I think most of us think the same in regards to we need to draw new/future players,...make it more inclusive and inviting. IMO tweaks yes, over-haul no. Where is that honey spot?
These doomsayers have been doomsayers for over a decade now. Yes, the earth will end SOME DAY, that day does not make you right, its the inevitable. Today, is not that day or week or month or year. Know when one preached too long to prove a point that is not panning out. They said it would end 10 yrs ago. Nonsense drivel dark doom and gloom because they would enjoy credit for being right, even if they destroy it themselves to make it so. if you have to lie to make a point, you have no point.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 20, 2025, 11:06:49 AM
The games that are pay as you play like DCS depend on those who spend large sums paying to be better. Not those who just buy a plane every once in awhile. Without the ones who spend large sums, those games would not exist.
Have fun in whichever game suits your interest. As for being attacked on which way you think is better, that goes both ways.
Good points
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: nopoop on February 20, 2025, 02:03:47 PM
I think HT has painted the game into a corner which he is quite aware of. The game will not survive without the subscription model. That won't change.
Besides approving new skins and maps...he's done. Thats obvious. Smaller maps, a possible two side MA. Minmal work to change. Not seeing that happening. He is done. He has at this time a nice income stream with an absolute zero effort.
He may surprise me, but I am not seeing that happening..
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: hazmatt on February 20, 2025, 02:12:44 PM
I was commenting on the comments made in the video linked in this thread.
I wouldn't mind playing with my kids and maybe my wife obviously, however as time passes we all get more involved in other games. My 7 year old is a terror in a tank and my 11 year old loves to fly. My wife used to play back in the day too but if she joined us it would be $900 a year which is obvious a deal breaker.
Maybe attacked was too strong of a word. I don't take it personal, however there are many who defend the status quo and seem to wonder why the more things stay the same the more things stay the same and they seem to think any suggestions for changes from people that actually play other games are somehow an attack on them or their game.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: hazmatt on February 20, 2025, 02:30:03 PM
I found the video to be enjoyable but he highlighted a lot of the learning issues with AH. I would say it would take the average person a couple months to get comfortable with the game and all of its nuances, probably less if said person has a background in flight sims in some capacity (a DCS person would likely find it easier, whereas a War Thunder person would find it to be slightly harder or maybe on-par).
In my experience AH is the easiest of all of them.
In IL2 you have to setup all he engine management stuff, rpm, cowl, oil cooler etc etc. In Warthunder you have to setup everything from ecm to manual missile guidance as well as radar modes etc.
I think one of the reasons that Warthunder is so popular is because you start with planes that are very basic and then the complexity builds as you advance though your research so it's not overwhelming to start. There are those people that go buy a high level plane to start cause then think the can pay to win and get beat down mercilessly.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: hazmatt on February 20, 2025, 02:37:01 PM
Did you ever take into account that HTC is a business and perhaps he just...I dunno, doesn't agree with you?
Hey captain obvious! LOL.
I guess I just miss the old days and wish there could be numbers like that again and want to see more people playing is all. I would also like my kids to be able to play with me in a game that I played for prob close to 20 years.
I was merely pointing out that in the video that Rye seems to mention that the reason he doesn't seem to plan on continuing playing was the subscription. It has nothing to do with agreeing with me. It has to do with agreeing with reality.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: hazmatt on February 20, 2025, 02:49:22 PM
My kids, when young, had hobbies. They earned and saved money to do them. I could have just paid.... but I was teaching them how to make their own way.
The games that are pay as you play like DCS depend on those who spend large sums paying to be better. Not those who just buy a plane every once in awhile. Without the ones who spend large sums, those games would not exist.
Have fun in whichever game suits your interest. As for being attacked on which way you think is better, that goes both ways.
I said I enjoy playing games with my kids. My kids earn and save money too. They however are obviously not interested in spending their limited resources on this game when they could buy a shiny new plane in some other game that they can play for free which means if I wanted to play with them that the only option would be for me to pay for it. You are not the only one who teaches their kids how to "make their own way"
That might be true about the DCS model, I haven't played it enough to know. I do know that WT also has in game currency that you can buy all kinds of stuff with that you have to pay real money for if you want it. I suspect that WT makes more on the currency then any planes they sell.
Not sure how it goes both ways. I haven't attacked anyone here. I have only responded.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 20, 2025, 02:53:44 PM
I was commenting on the comments made in the video linked in this thread.
I wouldn't mind playing with my kids and maybe my wife obviously, however as time passes we all get more involved in other games. My 7 year old is a terror in a tank and my 11 year old loves to fly. My wife used to play back in the day too but if she joined us it would be $900 a year which is obvious a deal breaker.
Maybe attacked was too strong of a word. I don't take it personal, however there are many who defend the status quo and seem to wonder why the more things stay the same the more things stay the same and they seem to think any suggestions for changes from people that actually play other games are somehow an attack on them or their game.
Not sure where 900 comes from.
You’re right people not fond of change. But t it’s nit a bad system, it just doesn’t attract modern players. Back in band camp playing on genie by the hr a flat rate with gamestorm and AOHELL was a blessing. So ya, it stuck. Don’t ask people to change ask them to compromise. Ya don’t wanna run some off while attracting others. Spinning wheels goin nowhere.
I don’t think my idea passed the grade with the masses.
Which was an option to deposit 15, subtract 50 cents for each day logged on. Basically ya get 30 days for 15, may be 10 thus month 20 next month, recharge account. It’s the current sub with a tweak.
A family option requires deeper thought. That is easily gamed. But a idea good enough to consider.
On the account page in the clipboard a new page swings out with those options, IE like the Roster page.
Some the ideas are good enough to consider, but nit refined enough to easily implement
>IMO<
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: hazmatt on February 20, 2025, 03:03:38 PM
Totally opinion. Probably another WOT Some, like on steam, are looking for a game, ya pop in ya complete the levels and move onto another game. This is a sim played as a game. The game part is a vehicle for flying in a sim. Its a two part experience. Sometimes the learning curve weeds out those who weren't planning on staying in the first place. IMO because our interest is in the sim portion.
DCS is so into the sim portion fun gaming is a Oh BTW. WT, sorry, but just watching that FM in vids is painful. IL-2 seems to have the glitter, but it's growing old too, that engine is probably maxed out. Again, I watch that FM in vids is not painful but I can see it doesn't really flow like AH. Mind you, drivel from someone who has played none of them. so take it for what it's not worth.
I have a different view as a return player on the learning curve. Actually flying the plane came like riding a bike, even tho I had seriously worn gear and muscle memory loss. The harder part was re-learning the setup and and how to configure to best suit me. It was amazing how much of that I forgot. I used f to fly bufs a LOT, couldn't even remember how to cal the sight.
I think every sim is a mass learning curve to someone who has never taken part in them. It's starting from zero. If we keep making it sound hard that alone could scare people from trying. If we can do it ANYONE can do it. Why I think training and tech support (customer service) is a highly valued system Minimize the curve.
That said, even those who have been a round a long time still find something to learn. And that to me is what keeps the longevity. IN other "games" you learn it, max out, move on. In most good sims it never ends.
I think we mistake the gamer for the simmer. Its a different mindset.
Genre dying? I dunno about that. Between all the sims there is still a massive crowd, who gets who is the challenge.
We,as a seasoned community can, to a point, ease the learning curve and tech support, that's something we can control. The recent Training Forum posts shows that is in full gear, where we need it.
What we cannot control is the payment model. We can only use the power of suggestion. There are some good ideas and some, on the biz end, are non-workable ideas. Including my own.
I think most of us think the same in regards to we need to draw new/future players,...make it more inclusive and inviting. IMO tweaks yes, over-haul no. Where is that honey spot?
These doomsayers have been doomsayers for over a decade now. Yes, the earth will end SOME DAY, that day does not make you right, its the inevitable. Today, is not that day or week or month or year. Know when one preached too long to prove a point that is not panning out. They said it would end 10 yrs ago. Nonsense drivel dark doom and gloom because they would enjoy credit for being right, even if they destroy it themselves to make it so. if you have to lie to make a point, you have no point.
Good points. I think getting some videos out there is great. One thing about AH is the community that actually notices a new player. In other games the reception of new players is not nearly as positive to say the least.
To see the actually WT flight modeling you might want to check out the Sim videos as the Arcade mode gives arcades a bad name lol.
I think there a great many people who play flight sim type games and I agree somebody who has only played COD is going to have a hard time coming up to speed quickly on any flight sim type of games. I think there are so many players in this space (hundreds of thousands) on the most popular games, that it would be easier to convince some of those people who already have a joystick to give it a go.
That said if there was a game that had the community to help a new player get started that video shows it. I think the community here is the one thing that none of those other games have and it's one of the things that is still around after all these years. Salute!
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: hazmatt on February 20, 2025, 03:20:43 PM
You’re right people not fond of change. But t it’s nit a bad system, it just doesn’t attract modern players. Back in band camp playing on genie by the hr a flat rate with gamestorm and AOHELL was a blessing. So ya, it stuck. Don’t ask people to change ask them to compromise. Ya don’t wanna run some off while attracting others. Spinning wheels goin nowhere.
I don’t think my idea passed the grade with the masses.
Which was an option to deposit 15, subtract 50 cents for each day logged on. Basically ya get 30 days for 15, may be 10 thus month 20 next month, recharge account. It’s the current sub with a tweak.
A family option requires deeper thought. That is easily gamed. But a idea good enough to consider.
On the account page in the clipboard a new page swings out with those options, IE like the Roster page.
Some the ideas are good enough to consider, but nit refined enough to easily implement
>IMO<
We are a family of 5 so I calculated cost for 5 accounts so we could all play together and came up with 900. We have 5 gaming computers setup with joysticks and throttles of which 3 are setup for VR.
I remember those days on GEnie. If it wasn't for ramen I would have staved in those days with all my money going to GEnie.
I think there are lots of good ideas and I think your 15/30 could make sense too.
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Eagler on February 20, 2025, 03:43:03 PM
Is warbirds still on steam?
Seems like it's the closest thing to AH ... more than il2 or dcs
What's the pay model for it?
Eagler
Title: Re: Rye Games
Post by: Animl-AW on February 20, 2025, 06:53:13 PM
well my idea of 15/30 probably came from my concert Talent Buy/Promoter days. A short stint I did in the 90s, about 2 yrs.
The amount of calculating and risk will make your nerves crawl. I'll try to keep it short.
I'll use my first as a learning experience example.
Waylon Jennings, I'm going to not use actual numbers, that is private biz.
Via an investor's money, I'm buying WJ for $25k. He carries only personal instruments as it's not a tour it's a fly-in.....so I must provide transportation to and from airport (limos), stage crew, sound, lighting, catering, promotions, plus 10k for the venue for the day. It's a 3200 seat theater. Now I'm up to $50k expenses. $ Part of the contract is I had to provide no less than 2 months solid advertisement prior to the event. They even want to establish a minimum of money put towards advertisement. of what My investment just got bumped up from 50k to about 65k. I cannot run another WJ show within 6 months of the same venue or 100 miles between 2 venues.
The worst thing that can happen to your investment is you throw a party and no one shows up. Second worst thing is you break even. 3rd is a 10k return on a 65k investment.
So trust me, you learn a lot about your target audience, in this case country, where they are, what they want to hear in ads to trigger them.
Now I crushed numbers on one concert about 30 times on ticket prices to lure and make profit.
At that time ticket average in that venue was $50 x3200 seats - 160k >IF< you fill them. The key in planning these is you want half house (1,600) to be the break even point.
My lure was not being full price of $50. I risked not filling the seats. SO I dropped down to $35. Minimize risk, At $50 I might have guaranteed 2/3 house seats filled. I DO NOT LIKE RISK NOR GAMBLING. I want a predictable full house.
That concept happened to pay off, as the lower prices filled every single seat Sold Out.
At full house at $35full house I made more profit than half-house or 2/3 house at $50, and more guarantee I'd stuff the house. That became my formula. You seemingly lose to make more. Profit of $47k. That 47k bought the next concert, which was 80% profit. If i had an artist that would guarantee a full house the ticket price formula could change. I was trying to help WJ stay relevant which made him happy and more likely to do biz again. I gave him a 3k tip for stuffing the house. Its just good biz.
My concept of 15/30 is the same concept. Less for more. There is a major problem with this concept, pretty much any concept,.. ya lower the cost and the numbers do not change, now you just put the guy (HT) in a spiral. Marketing is a risk, and it better be an educated one. It works only if it works, learning the hard way is not an option.. You could set it up as a short term Sale concept for one month to see if that kind of marketing actually produces numbers. Then you can use it or 86 it.
The family thing, that is harder to regulate, but if the numbers are crushed enough you may end up with a working concept. Its not the idea, its blocking holes how it cane be gamed, like one guy in a squad says it's family but it's 3 of his squad buddies, that ain't right. Next thing you have 3 guys in the squad doing it an all those are flying for less,... less profit for HT. The finished concept cannot put HTC at risk. It's not a finished concept, it just cracked the egg shell. Keeping them honest might require something like IP or device fingerprints( But if you change any hardware that fingerprint would change and you'd have to re-resister it.) I'm sure HT has much better way.