Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: cord on March 24, 2000, 12:36:00 AM
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Gentlemen,
I have a 12 year old daughter that likes to watch me fly this sim. It has been a lot of fun for me and her. Tonight I had to explain to her several terms, that came across the buffer. I'm sure that real men in combat used these terms in a fit of rage or in deep pain, I don't think these men would use them to taunt and degrade another in a game.
I deleted my account tonight. Tomorrow I will e-mail my squadron commander and enform him of my resignation.
Quake On.
cord
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"Why is it called a R.I.P cord?"
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And I thought I was a fuddy duddy for feeling the same way. Sorry to see ya go man. Sure we have the squelch command but there are some words that if typed on an open channel oughta automatically kick the punk to his desktop for at least 24 hours. People would suddenly be concerned what they typed. I love this game, but there are some bad apples with THE worst attitudes on the open channel that I've ever seen online.
[This message has been edited by hblair (edited 03-24-2000).]
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I generally squelch ch.1, just so I don't have to hear a lot of that nonsense. I figure if someone from another country wants to contact me they'll do so privately. Of course, this doesn't stop me from seeing what my own countrymen have to say about something, but if a comrade gets base I usually let them know.
Thing is, I have a 2 month old son, and I really haven't put much thought into the idea that he might very well be standing next to me someday, watching me play online. This is certainly food for thought.
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leonid, Komandir
5 GIAP VVS RKKA (http://www.adamfive.com/guerrero)
"Our cause is just. The enemy will be crushed. Victory will be ours."
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Actually the language doesn't bother me so much as the whiny context of it, but I could see if I were in your situation where it would. I wouldn't mind seeing bumping when it gets out of control at all.
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Fatty
FAT DRUNK BASTARDS (http://fdb.50megs.com)
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Ditto hblair.
I get blasted on open channel, blasted on private channel, people utter physical threats towards me on the BB among other things.
Cord why should you leave, I fail to understand that, make them leave.
It's such a select few that are spoiling the whole atmosphere in AH. HTC has more important things on their minds other than babysitting!
Hopefully HTC can come up with a few filters.
WE CAN CALL IT TOWDSQUELCH VER 1.0
[This message has been edited by Torque (edited 03-24-2000).]
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.squelch xxxxxx
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That's really too bad. Since most of us are adults, I think some of us sometimes forget that young children may be watching. If someone really feels the need to express themselves in this way, why can't they at least take it private and spare the rest of us?
bloom25
THUNDERBIRDS
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Too bad (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif) . I'd like to know why we can't squelch channel 1 and 2 and only use private channels or squadron channel?
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Agreed, a Filter is needed...we already have a strong policy about that in JG2.
Sorry to hear you leave for that...Keep in touch !
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Saw/Saintaw
GMT T.O.D. SITE (http://www.wardogs.org/ah/)
Don't shoot ! I am only an observer......
(http://saintaw.tripod.com/dorasaw.gif)
JG2 "Richthofen" (http://www.busprod.com/weazel2/)
"Firepower Mate, that is what separates the men from the boys..."
[This message has been edited by Saintaw (edited 03-24-2000).]
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I think that the use of degrading words are used by mostly the youngsters and tryouts in the game.
(hopefully)
Theres easy ways to get rid of em, "screenshoot" and send it to Hitech corp.
Probebly they will be warned and finely kicked out for sure.
It happens that I take a "screenshoot" once in a while, reading very strong words in the buffer. But never sent any in, yet.
You American guys must understand that its a
little bit hard, for us europeen guys, (atleast swedes) to see what is the diffrance
between watching TV and reading a text buff. in a online game.
But it is just the way it is .
Dont get this wrong I am against all "badtalk" in games open for all ages or when children might be watching.
Crabofix, "fish, fish, fish"
Svenska Kungliga Flygvapnet.
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ohh for those who want to squelch 1 and had no luck so far .. just set your radios to any other number or name and have none tuned to 1 and you're reliefed !
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My wife had to explain to me some terms I seen in the text buffer.
Me: Honey, What does this mean?
Wife: Well, it is a message addressed to a pilot named Swager.
Me: Oh! That's me! (grinning)
Wife: Well this person here is explaining that your flying sucks and you're a dweeb!
Me: What does that mean?
Wife: Well Sweetheart! These people that you're flying with? They realized in 6 short months without ever meeting you, what I've known for 5 years.
Me: Is that good?
Wife: Yes Dear, it's good, you just go back to flying.
Me: Thanks Honey! Maybe I'll take this cute little blue plane this time. My CO calls it "Chicken of the Sea" and "Quakehog". Yea! that would do nicely!!
Okay! To be serious! Yes sometimes the text buffer gets alittle foul. It seemed to be decreasing lately. You'll always have your hotheads that spoil it. As pointed out earlier, JG2 has a policy about that. It is totally unnecessary. If the person belongs to a squad, the squad should be responsible for putting it down. If the squad cannot take care of it, then it should go to HT. Okay! My belief only. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Swager
"Damn.....I can't believe I missed that shot!!!"
(http://saintaw.tripod.com/swager.gif)
JG2 "Richthofen" (http://www.busprod.com/weazel2/)
[This message has been edited by Swager (edited 03-24-2000).]
[This message has been edited by Swager (edited 03-24-2000).]
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Simple, Crabofix, in the US the FCC likes to yank people's broadcast licenses for putting out material deemed "obscene or indecent" according to vague "community standards". You may not believe this, but have to come to Europe to see nekkid scenes on broadcast TV, and hear all the good swear words.
They might be lettin' stuff slip now, but you ain't gonna see no softcore (or, where I am now, hardcore) porn on the air in Peoria, IL any time soon.
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Fortunately for me, I could care less
what anyone says to anybody about anything.
I am in this sim for one reason. To have fun
*virtually* killing other people sitting at their computers.
If my girls are standing behind me watching when one of our arena drunkards goes on a self degrading slurfest I simply say "see what amazinhunks are like! avoid em"
Big deal!
Yeager
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Foul language is inappropriate at all times, and it seems that HTC is trying to inforce that to some extent. Whining is just a part of the game and we just need to offer the whiners cheese to go with their whine.
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Originally posted by Yeager:
If my girls are standing behind me watching when one of our arena drunkards goes on a self degrading slurfest I simply say "see what amazinhunks are like! avoid em"
Yeager
Bravo, Yeag, Bravo! You cannot shelter our youth from the butts in the world, you can only teach them to detect and avoid!
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Isn't it sad that a person feels compelled to leave a game he loves, because of the stupidity of a minority of idiots out there who's vocabulary consists of nothing but profanity.
I'm no prude, but in a public forum like this BB or in AH itself, I try very hard not to use profanity, or to insult someone else. I call it common courtesy. Unfortunately, in this day and age, those of us whom promote decency, chivalry and honor are laughed at and scoffed at for being "self-righteous" or "sentimental" or even plain naive.
Seems like to be accepted into today's gaming society, one must be skilled in the art of "talking smack".
Just watch this thread. There will be people defending and justifying the use of profanity in AH, stating that "that's how life is", etc, ad-nauseum.
I'm tired of being beat up and abused just because I'm a "nice guy". And I'm tired of seeing people like cord leaving AH because of the conduct of others. I say we throw out the jerks and the profanity users, so the rest of us can have fun and enjoy each other's company.
Can't wait to see how long it takes to label me a "whiner". Just watch, it'll happen.
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banana
308 (Polish) Squadron RAF "City of Cracow"
"On the whole, it is better to deserve honors and not have them than to have them and not deserve them"
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<S> banana
Profanity= A weak mind trying to express itself.
Cord, I respect your decision but hope you change your mind.
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Milo
"A MiG on your 6 is better than no MiG at all"
JG2 "Richthofen" (http://www.busprod.com/weazel2/)
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Well While I might not be flying right now, I have gotten my Bro-in-law into the game, so I do get to watch a lot of the action, unfortunately, so do my girls. While it is true one can use this as a learning experience for children, the US government would most profoundly disagree, which brings us to my point, unless HTC has plans to relocate beyond the national boundaries, they had better implement controls on this behavior that are a tad more rigorous than what is already in effect, The government is finally starting to stir on the internet issue, and I have reason to believe that "the guiding hand" of government regulation will be revealed as a stranglehold.
If one disagrees with this assertion, fine it is a free country(somewhat) but I have something on the side of my statement, it's called history.
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pzvg- "5 years and I still can't shoot"
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i sincerly hope that you wives give you your balls back at some point. or maby we can have a no cussin war simulation yall are out to emaciate the whole world. people have the right to say whatever they want, WHATEVER THEY WANT not till the make your delicate senseabilitys and implyin beccause a server is in usa all speach must be controlled to what you consider apropriate cause the moral majority or some equaly out of touch bunch of sanctimonious wife puppets. dont want their 12 year old girl to know men cuss givit a break you cant take it go to hell.
a personal opinion supported by the constitution of the united states at least till yall get a hold of it.
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Am I to infer that I, having served this nation in the field, am somewhat less than a "good" American to you?
God I hope so, 'cuz if you're the best we got, I'm learning Chinese
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pzvg- "5 years and I still can't shoot"
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Sorry, Towd thats just idiotic!
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See? It didn't take long, did it?
Thanks for proving my point, Towd.
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banana
308 (Polish) Squadron RAF "City of Cracow"
"On the whole, it is better to deserve honors and not have them than to have them and not deserve them"
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people have the right to say whatever they want, WHATEVER THEY WANT not till the make your delicate senseabilitys and implyin beccause a server is in usa all speach must be controlled to what you consider apropriate cause the moral majority or some equaly out of touch bunch of sanctimonious wife puppets. dont want their 12 year old girl to know men cuss givit a break you cant take it go to hell. a personal opinion supported by the constitution of the united states at least till yall get a hold of it.
Towd, the only context in which the constitution applies to Aces High is that they (the company and the staff of Aces High) are free to do what they see fit in terms of what they will and will not allow in their forum, in order to keep their broader customer base (and profit lines) happy.
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Fatty
FAT DRUNK BASTARDS (http://fdb.50megs.com)
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For the transmitters - It doesn't take much to keep it down. Just don't type it! If you feel the need to vent, do it out loud in your office/ bedroom/ livingroom. (That's what I do.) It's not a matter of rights or the constitution - I wish everyone would quit falling back on this as an excuse to be obnoxious.
For the receiving end - I understand your not happy about this. It seems to be a fact of life that this will occur. You should be aware of this just as you should be when exposing your kids to violence on TV. Squelch the offenders as they show up, squelch the open channel or don't allow your child to watch.
Just one man's opinion.
Sour
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Sourkraut
JG-2 Richthofen (http://www.busprod.com/weazel2)
"Hey - someone has to be the target...."
(http://saintaw.tripod.com/saurkraut.gif)
[This message has been edited by sourkraut (edited 03-24-2000).]
[This message has been edited by sourkraut (edited 03-24-2000).]
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TOWD (http://members.home.net/torqss/baby_boy_lg_clr.gif)
Need I say more?
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I'm not that sure of the technical details, but wouldn't it be possible for HTC to keeps logs of the text messages? If anyone complained it would be a simple matter to check the conversation and appropriate action.
banana, interesting point from somebody with a name like that (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Heheh well I must admit that I feel somewhat dismayed by all this censorship talk???
The orginal poster wants to control the community for the sake of his daughter????
His actions were conceived and taken to some how enforce HIS ideas of whats right and wrong???
If HTC does implement a serious assault on some outbursts of frustration, I hope they extend it to HANDLES some of which are very suggestive and far and away worse than what I see in the text buffer from time to time.
I could go into the whole idea of introducing one's daughter to the idea of killing and maming (which of course war is all about) and the obsenity of same but I will leave that for some other time. The fact is the poster has every right to not subscribe for ANY reason, he just doesn't have the right to impose his moral's on me or others who see things differently period.
BigJim
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Thus Spake BigJim:
...he just doesn't have the right to impose his moral's on me or others who see things differently period.
Jim, if you swear openly and often on the ch 100 buffer, isn't it you that is imposing your morals on him?
It can work both ways, eh?
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banana
308 (Polish) Squadron RAF "City of Cracow"
"On the whole, it is better to deserve honors and not have them than to have them and not deserve them"
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I hate to say it but I kinda agree with towd.
Not how he said it or all of what he said but part of it.
I agree that the language and the name calling degrades the game but on the same token I don't agree that someone should try to censor me because he/she can't tell his/her young child not to read the buffer.
It's on the same line as telling the TV company not to air a show because you don't feel it is appropriate for your child. Instead of telling your child NOT to watch something you would rather make it so NO ONE can watch it.
Cord I'm not saying what you are doing is right or wrong only you can decide that but there are ways of stopping some of the bad language. .squelch <id> works very well for the rants that go on.
You can also change the buffer so you cannot read it.
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Mighty1
The New Baby Harp Seals
"Come try to club THIS Seal"
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Hmmmm... dammo.. just lost another puritan pilot.. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif) Salute Cord. We'll miss yah.
Oh well.. I wonder what it's like in the Saint Louis Schools for 12 year olds these days? I should think the repetitive 4 letter words are rather common place. Hmmmmm....
Gee; If i decide to do something with my kid that MIGHT expose her to some profanity, and instead elect to NOT do it for her 'protection', well then my kid would spend all her time locked in her room; with NO radio, NO TV and certainly no CD's or video tapes. And thats just to protect her delicate and senstive and highly impressionable 12 year old soul from profanity.
Not that I'm pardoning or even remotly advocating the use of the textbox for what has so offended Cord and his sheltered child.. I'm just looking outside at the real world and remarking that it's a heluva lot rougher out there than it is 'in here'.
Reality has more vile things in it than AH does... any and EVERY day.
Hang
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Hmmm...I certainly do feel for any parent (myself included) in todays world. However, my 5 & 7 year olds hear worse things everyday (once in awhile from me (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif) ) than I see on these buffers. Cursing is a natural form of human expression and a true hi point of the english language (certainly the most eloquent language for the above mentioned pastime).
I agree that at some point it is and should be a TOS...BUT...this is a competative enviornment and it should be expected, tolerated and even appluaded within limits.
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hmmmmm...
Maybe this is not what cord meant but here is where I'm coming from ...
None of you free thinking open minded 'tough guys' (TOWD types) curses in front of the kids, gets pissed off, drinks more beer, or farts more than hblair does. If you think I'm some kinda wussy bookworm, think again.
My point...
Would any of you guys stand up in a roomful of 80 grown men and call another one across the room a f*cking idiot because of a game? HELL NO you wouldn't. It aint cool and you know it.
But there are some of you donutheads (not all) who think its OK to do it hidden behind your pretty little monitor a thousand miles away from the other guy.
If it were really real life, (as some of you refer to) you would likely get that bellybutton beaten out in the parking lot.
Hate to sound so radical but some people just DON'T get it.
It's called RESPECT
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AMEN Hblair!!
I however dont curse at all, dont want my three small boys (all under 8)to hear or read it-- I Dont want to hear it or see it. i do however realize that I dont control other people (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Still--its not like it just "slipped" out. You have to had "thought" about saying it. I guess. I guess I am a "fuddy Duddy'. I like that though (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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*DING* ......give hblair a cigar!
It's kinda funny... back in the good old days when the men wuz men, and the sheep wuz nervous folks were very VERY polite to one another.
I submit it's because a fair number of the populace was armed to the teeth; booze wuz cheap, and man; yah just didn't run yer mouth unless yah could out run a bullet.
Hang
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Can't we all just get along and have fun without all the swearing and talking smack?
Sheesh, I must be getting old. 34 yrs old and I'm starting to sound like Ward Cleaver and Mike Brady! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Peace to all, goodwill and lots of kills for everyone.
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banana
308 (Polish) Squadron RAF "City of Cracow"
"On the whole, it is better to deserve honors and not have them than to have them and not deserve them"
[This message has been edited by banana (edited 03-24-2000).]
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I always do the .squelch 1 thing when I first get online. Channel 1 distracts me and takes away from the realism to hear all the babble going on. It also eliminates most of the profanity, which I personally do not care to see come across my pc screen.
But I still hear profanity, whining, and complaning about this plane or that pilot on the country channel. what purpose does that serve? Why complain and swear on the country channel where the person you are ticked at can't even hear you! I,for one, do not want to here it.
I say, if you have a problem with someone, get them on the private channel and cuss them out there. Find out who that Fu4 or Spit driver (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) was on ch 1, if necessary, then confront them. Take them to the training area and beat the virtual crap out of them if you want. Settle it man to man! Don't be a whiner (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
Of course I could squelch out the country channel too. If aces high had a click on 6 call thingy like warbirds, I probably would.
What we really need is more WOMEN flying this game. If more WOMEN flew, maybe those cussers would think twice, or be put in their place! Women seem to be good at that (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif).
ps. If you are cussing on the country channel, don't bother calling my 6- I can't hear you (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif).
[This message has been edited by gospel (edited 03-24-2000).]
[This message has been edited by gospel (edited 03-24-2000).]
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Originally posted by Camel:
Sorry, Towd thats just idiotic!
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif) Okay, so I am the last person in the worl that should say something here...
Cord was a squady of mine. Not a bad stick either, imho. I don't know if my leaving the squad had anything to do with his decision, but I honor his reasons.
I also think HTC should invest in the "Potty Mouth" filter. Something I emailed Pyro about a month or so ago.
When I signed on to AH, I read the EULA and danged if I could find anything in there about language. Harassment, yes. Abuse, yes. But nada on cussing. (I been wrong before but the printout is in B&W)
Okay, that said...
I had always thought TOWD was an educated and literate man. His reply to Cord's posting is an insult to the citizens that adhere to the precepts set forth in our Constitution.
Heck, the guy can't even spell "Y'all" right. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/tongue.gif)
I stand down from the soapbox.
PS Yeah my mouth runneth over at times. But I usually apologize for it afterwards.
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Tern
"Live to Fly! Fly to Fight! Fight to Live!"
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I agree, there needs to be some controls on the bad language. As for our kids, Yes I know that they are exposed to the list of 4 letter words and worse, but it's what they see and hear at home that reinforces what they believe to be good and bad. I have 6 children that are grown and living on their own and everyone of them knows that Mom and Dad won't put up with bad language.
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An interesting topic to be sure.
I'm all for having the right to say what I want, when I want, how I want. I'm also all for everyone else being able to ignore me or leave the area of my presence.
That being said, I also try to watch myself because I know some people are actually offended by foul language. I'm better at controlling my outbursts now then was I then, and I'll be even better at it later.
Those who say using profanity is for the weak minded just dinnae get it. Many a time the proper, creative use of profanity is much more effective and efficient than the most eloquently written/spoken fillibuster. The more creative it is the more points it scores.
Cussing is also a major release for frustration. Some things just require the use of expletives.
For the children, I have to go with Hangtime. Go build a little cubicle for your child so you can shelter them from real life for the rest of thier life. The question is not "Will they be exposed to it?" but "When will they be exposed to it?" It will happen. Go rent any good R rated action flick and you've just exposed them to it. Most PG-13 movies will give them a little taste of it too.
The answer is "How will they deal with it when they're exposed to it?" Yeah, I know, the answer to a question is a question. Oh well, everyone already thinks I'm nuts (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
I have a 3-1/2 year old daughter and twins due in October. As my children grow I will teach them when it's appropiate and when it's not, along with the proper use of it (much to the chagrin of thier mother (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) )
And hblair, when someone's a f**kin idiot and needs to be reminded of that, I'll remind them of it, in person, on the phone, or over the net (like I said, I'm nuts (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) )
[This message has been edited by CavemanJ (edited 03-24-2000).]
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Simple solution:
Client side language filters. Let everyone screen language however they see fit. Seen it in other games and it works just fine.
AKDejaVu
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Wow...what a great bunch of replies.
I know that I do not like profane language in our CMC Newsgroups, and I don't have the right to sanction those who violate my personal beliefs of conduct on-line. I have 8 years in the military, 1967 to 1975....I have heard it all. But that doesn't mean I have to use the language. Several folks mentioned "Respect". That is really all this man wants and all that we deserve. I respect you, and ask that you respect me. I have twin girls 27 and a son 24, and they all speak the foul stuff too, but not around me.....unless in a joke or such. And I don't care to hear it either. Ladies and gentlemen, is a term that has meaning. Conducting onesself in such a manner commands respect, IMO. Anything less, is unworthy of respect.
Certainly, we all have constitutional rights, and I fought for those too. It doesn't mean that everyone has to own a gun, it doesn't mean that O.J Simpson is NOT-GUILTY.....and Pres Clinton didn't inhale! But, certainly, it doesn't mean we have to curse in a gaming environment to make a point. As was stated before, it is lame, childish, unprofessional, and unwanted. If ya feel like cussing, call your parents, and blast them-first. After all, they brought you into this world, and it's their fault you were shot down.....or vulched. Had they practiced safe sex-or had an abortion, this post would be......moot!
Just beacause you can spell the words, doesn't mean ya have to!
KKEN
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A hint for those that need one: If you want to impress people, learn to cut folks down to size without resorting to cussing. Vulgarity is the only weapon an idiot can wield in a battle of wits. Using it just demonstrates how thoroughly you've been bested;>
Gordo
FDB (http://fdb.50megs.com)
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Cord, I understand your feelings completely.
I am sorry to see you go.
I used to squelch many guys individually, and TOWD was one of the first I ALWAYS squelched. Then I discovered the command ".squelch 1".
THIS SQUELCHES CHANNEL ONE COMPLETLY.
The ability to squelch all the nonsense was a great addition to this game.
I too dont think swearing is at all necessary in this game. It only makes you look like a stupid jerk to the other gamers. Thats my opinion, and I am welcome to it. You are free to disagree, no matter how wrong you are.
Courage seems inversely proportional to the distance people get from each other.
Dago
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Courage seems inversely proportional to the distance people get from each other.
Well said dago...
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LOL.. I'm enjoying this thread... and Gordo just tagged another base... yep, there's better ways than cursin to get the point made.
"... never met anyone yet that didn't understand a slap in the face or a slug from a .45"
And one GREAT thing I learned during my tour in a green suit was how to say 'Sir' or 'Officer' or any other honorific like it means "a**hole". Comes in handy quite often these days... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Hang
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I understand your actions Cord. IMHO, peaple get carried away with the whole thing. I for one have no idea why I want to strap myself in a prop driven plane (Simulation) and go shoot at another person in the same frame of mind. I do know that when the rivets start popping out of my monitor and bouncing around my cockpit, I'll log off. Heck, I've kids to raise! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) All jestin' aside, I feel another loose here of a valued member.
Cord, thanks for an eye opener. I just hope you understand, I do not want to see any more limitations placed on anyone online or any place else, because of one groups sensablities. Personal filters can be a hassle but if you are so inclined it should be your decision and responsibility to use them. Not to the cost of the forum operater IMHO (your local laws may very) <S>
AO2
Man...what a can Of Worms!
How many real war aces fly sims anyway?
[This message has been edited by Luckyone (edited 03-25-2000).]
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Well I have NEVER cussed out another pilot, I have in frustration typed out some "cuss" word about a situation. Now to HAVE a guy who's handle is banana take exception to my opinion is to say the least laughable, I fail to see the diffenece in Slang cussing and outright cussing and banana sure is Slang for something we all know (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
BigJim out
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I called someone a "Poophead" once!
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Swager
"Damn.....I can't believe I missed that shot!!!"
(http://saintaw.tripod.com/swager.gif)
JG2 "Richthofen" (http://www.busprod.com/weazel2/)
[This message has been edited by Swager (edited 03-25-2000).]
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For those interested the Constitution Does give us the right for free speach. It does not give us the right to openly offend others. There are places in this great country that if you were to use that language face to face it would be called assault.
Saying that we should teach our kids to ignore these words or those poeple saying them (and believe me I use my fair share of them)is not helping the matter much either. Look around at the sorry state of teenagers these days it used to be More of them were good kids now you have to realy look hard to find a good kid. I have never seen so much lieing not even from when I was a kid. As stated above there is no need to swear in a game none at all, the most that will happen is you get squelched and you might wonder why some one dont type to you.
If some one gets the best of you then get even with your guns your language cant shoot anyone down in this game. As for killing and maming you can show your kids that it is a game by letting them see that the guy you shoot down was not realy killed. There is no blood ang guts falling out of the sky and we dont need it leave this junk for quake.
These are my view and mine only.
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Tommy (INDIAN) Toon
1st Aces High Trainer Corps.
Home of The Allied Fighter Wing A.F.W.
A.F.W. Homepage (http://www.geocities.com/~tltoon)
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What is needed is some sort of permanent squelch. One that remains when you log on and log off. This way you don't have to continually squelch folks.
IC
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It's a sorry situation when people like you cord feel forced to leave over something like this.
I agree whole heartedly with everyone who raised this as an issue of respect - IT IS. I have a daughter of 12 also who is getting interested in flying AH and I don't see why I should have to monitor every flight she may watch, or squelch ch1, simply to allow those who want to swear openly online the freedom to do it. It used to be you didn't have to worry about protecting your kids as much because people RESPECTED their childhood, they RESPECTED the right of the parent to set the standards they believed were right for them.
AH is a totally open enviroment and does not carry a rating certificate - so I say to people like TOWD - if you RESPECT me and my family you should moderate your speech to a level you would use in any other family place.
I don't believe that parents have the sole responsibilty of filtering our society to our kids - we all have a role to play and I think I have a right to expect others to respect my family in an open public place.
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well I see all you "decency" folks have refused to address the issue of "smut" handles and I fail to see how your kids will be protected when the kill buffer flashes some of the squad names and handles????? I think AH and most of the sims of this ilk were designed for ADULTS (in the early days no kid could afford to play) and to have someone "scream" over the buffer "hey watch it my kid is here" is somehow offensive to me, I didn't take your kids to raise (I raised my own who turned out ok) and I don't want to feel "responsible" for your kids downfall if I get "carried away in the moment", but of course since this is a "God, Mother and Apple Pie" discussion all opposing views will be soundly beaten down. I think this is the "very reason" the ACLU came into being. As for your perspective Indian, you are right there have been alot of laws passed to favor one point of view, most of which get struck down if they reach the supreme court in this country.
[This message has been edited by BigJim (edited 03-25-2000).]
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No one has quoted Apocolpse Now...
My boys are more likly to hear me swear about getting shot down then read anybody else swearing.
I think we are kidding our selves if we think that the US gov. is going to stop swearing on the internet. Watch your daytime TV for a week. See whats on at 3:30 when the kids get home from school. Crack open a teen beat mag and see what they are reading or a Cosmo.
Ohhh the good old days when people were polite..If they werent we shot em.. The US should be real polite right now, its way better armed then any society in history. Is it the most polite? From outside it doenst seem so.
We where real polite to our enemies in WW2...
LOL. Did any body refer to anybody in a way that wasnt a racial slur? Most of the world was activly de-humanizing the rest of the world. Makes it easier to fire bomb their cities I guess. Oh ya that counted as polite then...
Hypocrocy alive and well apperantly.
And much more deadly than swearing.
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Pongo
The Wrecking Crew
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This is not an open public place. It is a privit club. You have to pay to be a member. It is no suprise that in a moment of furstration some one is gonna get PO,ed and there will be an out burst. If you have played for more than a day, you know exactly what is going to happen. So it is up to YOU to censer things for your familiy if that is your choice. It is not the goverments job, or HTC,s.
If they were to waste the time and energy to create an R rated, and G rated arena. kGuess where everyone would be. I would rather see the place fill up with towd,s than see more of my freedoms get chipped away at.
I wish that you younger guys could have seen the America I grew up in. Before all this PC crap started, this was a hell of a country.
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>>well I see all you "decency" folks have refused to address the issue of "smut" handles and I fail to see how your kids will be protected when the kill buffer flashes some of the squad names and handles????? <<
Well BigJim - I would definitely extend my dislike of the sort of language cord is talking about to handles - I can't understand why banana is allowed to keep his.
>>I think AH and most of the sims of this ilk were designed for ADULTS (in the early days no kid could afford to play) and to have someone "scream" over the buffer "hey watch it my kid is here" is somehow offensive to me<<
So it's NOT OK for you to be offended but OK for me to be offended? Why are your views of acceptable more valuable than mine? Also if the game is aimed at adults only then that is fair enough but let HTC put that on the signup screen - I don't have a problem with that.
>>I didn't take your kids to raise (I raised my own who turned out ok) and I don't want to feel "responsible" for your kids downfall if I get "carried away in the moment", but of course since this is a "God, Mother and Apple Pie" discussion all opposing views will be soundly beaten down. <<
No you didn't take my kids to raise and neither did I yours, but I hope I wouldn't swear in front of any of your family - it's only common respect. I know what you're saying about "God Mother and Apple Pie" (even though I'm a Brit)and I recognise your views, I just disagree in this forum. If this was adult only arena I'd be swearing with the rest probably.
>>My boys are more likly to hear me swear about getting shot down then read anybody else swearing.<<
Pongo - your choice - your home.
>>Watch your daytime TV for a week. See whats on at 3:30 when the kids get home from school. Crack open a teen beat mag and see what they are reading or a Cosmo. <<
I recocgnise all that but just coz it's around doesn't mean it's ok and I have to think it's acceptable...
>>Ohhh the good old days when people were polite..If they werent we shot em.. The US should be real polite right now, its way better armed then any society in history. Is it the most polite? From outside it doenst seem so.
We where real polite to our enemies in WW2...
LOL. Did any body refer to anybody in a way that wasnt a racial slur? Most of the world was activly de-humanizing the rest of the world. Makes it easier to fire bomb their cities I guess. Oh ya that counted as polite then...<<
I love a bit of dramatic over-generalisation of history to back up an arguement.
Sorry - just call me a hypocritic old duffer - I like it that way
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Censorship, denial of rights? Those get tossed around a lot, especially of late in online communities. A provider deciding what content it will or will not allow is no more censorship than a magazine deciding what it will or will not print.
Acceptable use policies (you've agreed to a number of them if you're even reading this) are nothing new, and many of them stem not from the protection of the innocent as much as a business making a concerted effort to ensure their customers do not have to put up with nonsense.
When the actions of a few threaten to incur a loss of customer base, the business has every right to deny service to that or those individual(s). To deny them that right would indeed be censorship, you would be telling an entity what it can and cannot do in its own private game, service provider, web hosting, whatever the case may be.
So the question is not what people have a right to say. The questions are what audience Hitech Creations wants to target, what that audience wants or does not want in terms of language, whether or not it is in their interests to enfore those wants, and if so how strictly. Your 'rights' are limited to whether you subscribe and pay them or not, and to protest those decisions in an open forum (read: Outside of Hitech Creation's servers), so long as those protests do not violate the terms of service on THAT forum. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
In the meantime, preach about it on the streetcorner all you like, you have every right to.
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The AH server belongs to HT, if they want to kick people out of it, they can, the same thing goes for this forum. Its THEIR property, free speech does not apply in private property. If any loudmouths remain here its under the sufferance of HT.
I think its sad to see someone leave because of this.. I mean, this is real life anyway!. That 12 year old will learn all those terms in school anyway, you can't fight the inevitable (no offense Cord, 'tis the truth IMHO).
People are bound to get frustrated while flying, it happens to me all the time.
But I agree some people just go *way* beyond the "Im frustrated, I curse the inbreed that put water on my fuel mix and got me killed" kind of talk online...
I can only suggest something that other online games have and that is VERY successful: EJECT feature via voting.
If a player goes overboard with language/disrespect, players can actually VOTE to eject him from the server. Usually 6 or 10 votes are required to eject someone..and its even better when the eject feature does not allow the player to re-enter the server in X time (usually 4 hours).
In AH, you could use:
To eject: ".eject playername" .It would require 4 votes of same team to eject.
Better than squelch eh? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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I think you guys have mis-understood me. I'm not trying to tell anyone how to behave. (except my daughter) And yes I'm sure she has heard these words or even used them (I hope not)
And if my wife were here I would beg for my balls back, because i loved her dearly.
But, if I tell my daughter that this type of verbage is not acceptable behaviour, and she sees me is a GAME where it is used, what am I to do.
The constitution was drafted by men with the ideals of Patrick Henry and Thomas Payne; not Howard Stern. Although Howard Stern hides behind the words and enjoys the liberty of all free men, as he should.
I only meant to say goodbye to friends. I have done what I felt was the right thing.
Thanks for all the comments, I have learned some things from a different point of view, although I don't agree with some of them.
All my best,
cord
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CANNON and BigJim....no one is asking you to give up any rights. Maybe just asking you to use better judgement-if you decide you need to use foul language to make your point on-line. I am sure your parents and friends may find it questionable. But then, it is your right. I'd like to dedicate this to you...and others like you....http://www.twistedtunes.com/songplayer/playsong.asp?songnum=291&speed=288 (http://www.twistedtunes.com/songplayer/playsong.asp?songnum=291&speed=288)
K-KEN
[This message has been edited by K-KEN (edited 03-25-2000).]
[This message has been edited by K-KEN (edited 03-25-2000).]
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Well Sparks and Cord unfortunately I find myself defending the "wrong" thing for the "right" reason, it is not that I think cussing is a good thing or should be displayed to kids, it is that I like many others here fear that if I give up too many things in the name of "decency" I will wake up one day and find that I no longer have any right to speak on anything cause it was "given away" under some "rightous banner" to others who will now decide for me, and spark I doubt very much if you are any older than me (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
[This message has been edited by BigJim (edited 03-25-2000).]
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Wow. It says that Towd is from Texas so I assume he can speak the English language. I can barely make out what he is trying to say in his rambling, misspelled, illegible rant. I hate to be the English teacher here but let me break it down just so I know what's going on:
"i sincerly hope that you wives give you your balls back at some point."
-Ok, this is at least a complete thought. I assume he means "your wife". Or does he imply that cord is a polygamist, "you(r) wives". Or is he speaking to "us wives". I'm not sure. Let's just skip it.
“or maby we can have a no cussin war simulation yall are out to emaciate the whole world.”
-Mmmm. I think I see two sentences here, "Or maybe we can have a no cussing war simulation. Y'all are out to emaciate the whole world." If that is correct than the first sentence makes some sense. The second sentence makes no sense, unfortunately. "Emaciate" is to make feeble or to cause a loss of flesh. Is he accusing "Y'all" (I assume to mean those of us who agree with cord) of trying to enfeeble the world by removing cuss words? Will removing cuss words from various forums make the world thin and weak? That's a strange statement if that is, in fact, what he is saying here. I'm really just guessing, though.
" people have the right to say whatever they want, WHATEVER THEY WANT not till the make your delicate senseabilitys and implyin beccause a server is in usa all speach must be controlled to what you consider apropriate cause the moral majority or some equaly out of touch bunch of sanctimonious wife puppets."
-Ooh, this one's going to take a while. I totally understand "(P)eople have the right to say whatever they want." (It was even clear to me BEFORE the repetition in capital letters) Unfortunately, the rest of the paragraph seems more a random selection of English words than the expression of thought. I'm guessing here, but I think the bunch of words grouped around "delicate sensibilities" implys that people should not tailor their language to cater to those with delicate sensibilities. You could simplify the thought to, "People should not be courteous."
I'm not sure what the server being in the USA has to do with anything. It might have been a multi-word typo.
I think that the rest of the "paragraph" states that people who take offense to foul language are the moral majority and are in danger of robbing us of free speech. Apparently, being married augments this sensitivity to vulgarisms. Married females seem to be the ones that infect or control their husbands with such sensitivity. Ladies take offense to something and then control their husbands into posting protests on message boards. Although maybe this person refers to people who aren't actually married but pretend that they are and humanize their mania by playing with hand puppets. After many years of confusion they begin to think the puppet, in fact, controls them.
" dont want their 12 year old girl to know men cuss givit a break you cant take it go to hell."
-The first part of this grouping of words actually makes some sense. Although the sentence is missing a subject, I think Towd means, "(They) don't want their 12 year old girl to know men cuss(.)" I think Towd misunderstands that the offense was not at the fact that men cuss but that men were, in fact, cussing at that very moment. Although, I wish my son to be aware that there are immature jerks out in the world, I don't want him to think that that behavior is acceptable for him. Therefore, it might not be advisable for me to surround myself with immature jerks when I'm around my son. I think that's why cord is quitting. But, again, I'm merely guessing at Towd's meaning here.
The next thought is, I think, "(Give it) a break(.)" as in, "Stop prattling on." which really doesn't relate to cord's original post so, again, probably a multi-word typo.
The next expression is, I think, "(If) you can(')t take it go to hell." Now this is almost correctly spelled if not punctuated which implies that Towd is more comfortable with these types of sentences. It's fairly self explanatory. It doesn't aid in the meaning of his post although it may shed a little light on the quality of Towd's character.
"a personal opinion supported by the constitution of the united states at least till yall get a hold of it."
-The final word group in this bizarre post suggests that Towd's opinion is supported by the Constitution of the United States. I suppose in as much as you are allowed to pretty much say anything that doesn't physically endanger people it is supported. The Constitution doesn't specifically say you can't be an idiot.
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Oops missed you K-Ken, thanks for your views you have every right to express them (of course if you support censorship long enough maybe you won't). As far as using good judgement goes I will stack my behavior up with anyone I have seen on-line so far, so trying to paint me with a tarred brush won't work (it is however an age old tactic used by many to get what they want without logic). Thanks for the song (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
[This message has been edited by BigJim (edited 03-25-2000).]
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Kieren already gave me a theme song. "Now your messing with a son of a........" As far as my parents are concerned. Im 52 years old. They have there own problems to worry about. BTW my dad cuss,s like a salior.
NOt that i ment to offend any saliors. We all know that no one cusses in the modern navy. and there might be female saliors around and that would be sexual harressment. Not to say they cussed in the old navy , I wouldnt want to offend them. They probably spoke as if there mothers were around. Not to say they might have been around. Im sure they all worked outside the home. I mean of course if they wanted to. There is nothing wrong with working in the home. of course... I mean.....ah screw it . you cant breath whithout offending someone.
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You are very welcome BigJim. The point is, that we aren't giving up rights, we are asking you to exercise good judgement. I say you can own a firearm. But I also say you can't spray the local McDonalds, Post Office or Church....with lead, just because it is your right to own a firearm! You need to get a grip, my friend. And certainly, make sure you can be accountable for your actions, as well. Maybe one day, someone may take offense to your language, and blow your brains out for the $3 ya have in your pocket.
Someone needs to say....be reasonable, but be professional too. (I cuss in my living room when I get killed-but I am here alone) I dont have to type it! (that was prolly why I got killed in the first place! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) )
KKEN
Originally posted by BigJim:
Oops missed you K-Ken, thanks for your views you have every right to express them (of course if you support censorship long enough maybe you won't). As far as using good judgement goes I will stack my behavior up with anyone I have seen on-line so far, so trying to paint me with a tarred brush won't work (it is however an age old tactic used by many to get what they want without logic). Thanks for the song (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
[This message has been edited by BigJim (edited 03-25-2000).]
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Well, I am 51, very soon to be 52..May to be exact. If you want to support the language issue, then I too support constraint. Not that I am a saint, and not that I haven't posted my fair share of flames in NewsGroups the last 3 years, but it smacks of why do we expose others to things that are now questionable, that werent 20 years ago. Consider the tobacco industry...I smoked for 25 years, I quit 4 years ago. They are paying the price, and now they can't advertize....did we infringe on their freedom of speech? (advertizing) Maybe..but it was harmful and/or offensive to others that we smoked in public places....I smoked in public places, and was offended that I had to leave, or quit! It IS my right to smoke! I am of age, it isn't an illegal drug....what's the point! ???
I remember those things in my life, and the majority can and will rule. So, if ya can, please light em up- outdoors! Otherwise, leave.
K-KEN
Originally posted by CANNON:
Kieren already gave me a theme song. "Now your messing with a son of a........" As far as my parents are concerned. Im 52 years old. They have there own problems to worry about. BTW my dad cuss,s like a salior.
NOt that i ment to offend any saliors. We all know that no one cusses in the modern navy. and there might be female saliors around and that would be sexual harressment. Not to say they cussed in the old navy , I wouldnt want to offend them. They probably spoke as if there mothers were around. Not to say they might have been around. Im sure they all worked outside the home. I mean of course if they wanted to. There is nothing wrong with working in the home. of course... I mean.....ah screw it . you cant breath whithout offending someone.
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Article [I.] of THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION, commonly refered to as THE BILL OF RIGHTS.
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or[/b] abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press;[/b] or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
You cannot say anything you want, anytime you want if someone like Cord or anyone else finds it objectionable. If you constantly cursed and were disruptive in public, you could probably be taken to court by a citizen to get you to shut your yap and lighten the load in your wallet.
As mentioned, this is a private "club", HTC is the court system and Hitech is the judge. If any fines are to be levied it's up to him.
You cannot hide behind the Constitution.
[This message has been edited by Rock (edited 03-25-2000).]
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Originally posted by Sparks:
>>
I love a bit of dramatic over-generalisation of history to back up an arguement.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
He he ..guilty as charged.glad you liked it.. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Pongo
The Wrecking Crew
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My last half penny worth here (hurah shout all)..
You're right BigJim, I'm younger than you - 38. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I also admire you're defense of people being able to speak their opinion - I just have to disagree that it extends to the language of the opinion. I think failure to control the language will be the reason we lose the right.
So I'll nail my colours with K-Ken and the others.
To Cord ... I wish you'd reconsider
To HTC - it's your call on this now IMO
Now, being "joystick challenged" as this politically correct world would have us say, I'm off to test the patience of another poor unsuspecting trainer.
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Originally poste]d by K-KEN:
[BYou are very welcome BigJim. The point is, that we aren't giving up rights, we are asking you to exercise good judgement. I say you can own a firearm. But I also say you can't spray the local McDonalds, Post Office or Church....with lead, just because it is your right to own a firearm! You need to get a grip, my friend. And certainly, make sure you can be accountable for your actions, as well. Maybe one day, someone may take offense to your language, and blow your brains out for the $3 ya have in your pocket.
Someone needs to say....be reasonable, but be professional too. (I cuss in my living room when I get killed-but I am here alone) I dont have to type it! (that was prolly why I got killed in the first place! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) )
KKEN
[/B]
Well Ken first off I am 57 so I have been around this planet alittle longer than you, secondly I DO own guns and I have NO problem being accountable either face to face or over the internet. I don't take kindly to threats (that is how I read your post if I am wrong sorry about that) so I think it is you that need to get a grip. I spent my time in the service (during Viet Nam) to insure that all the folks on here (at least the Americans) have the right to flame away at me for my opinions and likewise I have the same right. Sparks asked a valid question above "what makes my rights any greater than his" and as Shakespear said "ah theres the rub" in fact my rights ARE NOT greator NOR lessor therefore some type of compremise is needed if we are both to have some semilance of what we want, he must accept me when I slip and I must make a conscienious effort not to slip. As for business rights etc...... you folks are right HTC DOES control the board and the game but without all of us they will control nothing for long and I NEVER intend to give up ANY right I have without a fight, since we seem to have less and less rights as time goes on, as for smoking I never argue with a reformed sinner they are the most pious and unshakable of the lot (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) Sorry if you folks think I am wrong to defend what I feel is a "freedom" issue but that is my right here in America (American cousin to you Brits (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) )
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Rock. Ive been hideing behind the bill of rights my whole life. I like it there just fine thank you. It is the loss of this very protecetion that I am concerened about.
Ive read the first ammendment many times. I could find nothing in there that said I cant say anything I want. In reality, the supreme court has ruled repeatedly that you can not, in effect, yell fire in a crowded building. Beyond that we are on or own. Cussing is at worst bad manners. Hardly a clear and present danger.
On a more practical level. If every american that has ever cussed in public were exiled from the country. There would be a lot of empty spaace around here. Much the same would be true of AH.
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Scene: Kieren wading yet again through the congested mall traffic. Yes, being the puppet of his wife-master, he is forced unwillingly into servitude as packmule. Worse, he must also consume a most disgusting concoction (generously labeled "lunch") from a food stand whose name he cannot pronounce. An hour later, while buried in packages on the elevator bound to ever higher levels of shopping bliss, Kieren feels a rumbling in the lower regions of his abdomen. The pain is intense, and the need is immediate.
He farts loudly, with a sharp crackling stuccato.
As all faces turn to him, the noxious cloud rises, filling all nostrils with a sulphuric stench. Immediate moans of agony fill the crammed elevator, with old women pounding on the "door open" button, ready to jump the second the passageway opens.
When the intermnible trip ends, all passengers flee, shouting epitaphs and shaking fists. His crimson faced wife-master's temples pound, and Kieren knows that he faces hell on earth when they get home.
Cut.
Now, in our above scenario our hero broke no laws. He did however violate social taboos, and garnered the distaste and disrespect his actions deserved.
After all, what self-respecting man carries the packages? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Do any of you really think Hitech minds what words anyone uses in the game???
He named his squadron "FUBAR". Everyone know what that means?
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AMMO
332nd Flying Mongrels (http://www.ropescourse.org/flying.htm)
without us the Air Force is just another scheduled Airlines
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This is a matter of policy for an internet gaming company based in Texas, not the United States Constitution.
Ya gotta love it when people try to hide behind their "Rights" to cuss and raise hell! LOL!
I live out in the country. I have a neighbor who lives across the road from me who runs an open wheeled modified car down at Talladega on weekends. I go over occasionally and share a brew with him and talk about his luck at the track. The conversation gets pretty colorful as you might guess.
Well yesterday, the 'check oil' light came on in my pickup as I was leaving the house, so I shut it down and walked over there with my 3 year old son to see if I could bum a quart of oil. He starts in on his racing stories with the usual "f*ck this", "GD that" kinda stuff with my boy standing right there, which really pissed me off, not because I don't think my son will ever hear that, or I'm trying to "put him in a closet"
The reason was his lack of RESPECT.
Some of you guys who say WE need to get out in the real world, I've got news for YOU my friends, it is YOU who are living in a fantasy land.
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Kieren. You might be a bit quick to assume you broke no laws. That cloud might have drifted out to sea, and killed a helpless whale. Then theres the clean air act. God knows what it did to the trees. Any children present would doubtlessly thought it funny. Ya got a contributing charge there...
I wont bore you with the rest of the list.
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Originally posted by CANNON:
Rock. Ive been hideing behind the bill of rights my whole life. I like it there just fine thank you. It is the loss of this very protecetion that I am concerened about.
Ive read the first ammendment many times. I could find nothing in there that said I cant say anything I want.
The First Amendment protects you from government actions meant to curtail speech. It does not, nor did it ever, protect you from private, non-governmental intrusion.
Newspapers, for instance, may decide if they wish to publish a controversial advertisement or editorial. Should they refuse, the advertiser or writer has no recourse to sue over First Amendment violations. Along the same lines, movie theaters may eject you if you talk incessantly and disruptively during a movie. HiTech Creations is no different; they own the servers, they own the code, and your presence in their game is a privilege, not a right. If they decide that colorful language is inappropriate, they may legally remove players who violate the rules on THEIR system.
The First Amendment applies if Congress passes a law stating that all players of online multiplayer games may never use colorful language. Chances are that violates the First Amendment.
Hope that clarifies things. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) If need be, I can search out some cases to make my point.
-- Todd/DMF
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FACTS:
HTC ownes this game.
HTC controls all aspects of this game.
We are HTC customers.
We are subject to HTC TOS.
We have no rights!!!
An HTC customer has gone because of actions of some. Not an unreasonable reaction.
Now the question is how many others will or have gone for the same reason??
I'm sure HTC is monitoring online behavior as it is in their best interest to do so!!!
If you can't say it in a public forum, don't type it here. Not unreasonable,right?
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heheh oh yes we do 1776 we can opt NOT to pay and if enough do it then the "privilage" is ours (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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No BigJim, no threat. You misread the post, but that happens. I served in the military 1967 to 1975. We don't seem to be getting anywhere here, but at least we all have an understanding of 1 thing: Language CAN be a problem for some.
Maybe that is a beginning..... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
K-KEN
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BigJim, then you do understand the point Cord is making!!! Congrats!!
You do not have any rights in this game enviroment. It is strictly governed by HTC.
If you can't conduct yourself via self
control within the game as a civilized individual you must be delt with by HTC and their TOS. This is in the best interest of the entire AH community, and HTC. Eliminate the few that cause the problems and you produce a happier customer base. Now what kind of reputation does AH have in Cord's mind,not good, for sure. What do you think he will tell others about AH? No, kick out the uncivilized, so few would have little affect on the AH reputation.
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Whew.
Finis...
Match; Game; Set..
I hope.
Hang
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Funny world isn't it.. the guy can have his daughter watch him as he goes around SHOOTING people who virtually DIE as they get destroyed, yet seeing some swear words fly across the screen is too offensive..... very very strange indeed.
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I guess YOU don't get it 1776, YOU are not HTC so don't go spouting off about what they will and won't do I find your attitude as harmful to HTC as anyone else's, I am sure that any company that stifles it's paying customers will pay the price in the long run (witness Sierra) and your holier than tho junk is just that JUNK
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I give up,BigJim. I can only conclude that you would be the person in the restaurant eating mashed potatoes with your hands,because of rights. It's a shame that all conduct has to be accepted. It's a shame our society no longer has self imposed limits. Sure, anything goes!!! Now go find a crowded theater and yell FIRE!!! You have that right!!!<currently baking cake with file for BigJim>
The only thing anyone can conclude from my previous comments is HTC is the final judge. They and only they can determine the level of uncivilized on-line behavior that is acceptable. I accept their judgment.
Can you?
[This message has been edited by 1776 (edited 03-27-2000).]
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Well once again you have proven my point, when logic fails resort to self made quotes that I never said. You see what I mean 1776, just because you differ in your opinion you feel it is fine to make up something that I never said and act as though it is a fact, and this you allude is civilized behavior???? At least with the Barbarian you KNOW where he/she stands, unlike the devious "civilized man" who like the willow will bend with wind no matter the cost to its shape or form as long it is in the same direction as the rest of the "willows". It is interesting to note that Hitler counted on such as you to take Poland, the Rineland, and numerous other parts of Europe until such as people of my ilk said "enough". Now for the lawyers in the community who have quoted civil law, I would remind you that parliment had the LAW on its side in the "colonies dispute" (only referenced to make sure you can tell when LAW and rights maynot coinside)
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Ok, that's enough of this.
This is a social game. You're going to interact with people and sometimes it's not positive. If you have problems with other players, then you should contact me and we'll work to resolve them.
Our terms of service are simple, we can terminate an account for any reason. Don't give us a reason. We can't protect players from having a negative experience and make no claims in that regard, but we will do what's in our best interest.
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Doug "Pyro" Balmos
HiTech Creations
No sniveling!