Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Sandman on January 19, 2002, 10:54:26 PM
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(http://www.screaminbluemessiahs.org/image/shots/talibanbmpgoboom.jpg)
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It looks like a BTR-70 hitting a land mine. Amazing pics though!
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Guess I should have added:
AUTHENTICITY IS NOT VERIFIED.
:D
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Actually that's not a Taliban BMP it's not even a BMP (notice it has wheels instead of Tracks) judging from the size it looks like a BTR.
By the way this video was taken during the Afghanistan War in the '80s, those are Russians being ambused by a bunch of Mujahadeen fighters the mine is either a Remotly Detonated or Magnetic mine. I have seen this video before 9/11 so i can guarentee it's not from Afghanistan (the present conflict)
Pretty cool though, I've actually seen a video of this, you hear the fighters mutter something in Arabic before the BTR goes up
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Hmmm....
Guys on the armour wear Soviet helmets and something that looks like Army bullet-proof waists.
I think it's a Chechen "rebel" advertising film: they have to make such tapes for Bin laden and their other sponsors...
Poor guys... They have to ride on the armour, not inside the BTR to survive in case they are hit by an ordinary antitank mine. And there is no way to survive such remotely-controlled landmine :(
Look at http://www.kavkaz.org - they have many pictures and films like this.
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Bad fake caption .
US Army 4th special operations group ? WTF is that ? And the US Army doesn't have FAC's they have FO's . Thats obviously not a BMP, and the blast is coming from under the vehicle .
What we don't know is the age of the person who contrived the caption, but I'm going to speculate he's in middle school .
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The pic is a broken URL.
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The link is good. It's the server that's not running at the moment. :mad:
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You know, even if this pic is a fake I'd be willing to bet there are a number of WS Video's that are very very similar.
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Celebrating and watching the deaths of 20 people? That's not entertainment, it's disturbing.
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Not if they are bad people.....
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Grunherz...people are people. As a 18 year old kid, I saw that stuff first hand and thought it was pretty cool. 12 years later I see it in a different light. Maybe they're bad people, maybe they're not. I'm sure they have people who love them and I'm sure they're probably fighting for something they think is right and just. I just don't think that gawking at someone's death is the right thing to do.
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Originally posted by Raubvogel
Grunherz...people are people. As a 18 year old kid, I saw that stuff first hand and thought it was pretty cool. 12 years later I see it in a different light. Maybe they're bad people, maybe they're not. I'm sure they have people who love them and I'm sure they're probably fighting for something they think is right and just. I just don't think that gawking at someone's death is the right thing to do.
I'll gawk. Hell I'll go pull the trigger too given the chance. Osama, Al-Quieda and their minions would gladly slit your babies throat to make a statement (and because you do not adhere to thier faith). They are not worth human comapassion. Better, they are not worth any more thought than you give a common cockroach as you stomp it to death.
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Tsk. Dehumanization is so easy, isn't it Tumor? I'm glad that you are able to objectify the killing of other human beings so easy - was it part of your training? What are you seeing? Flying bodies, or flying bullseye fragments? No matter how cold-blooded they may be (and those are Russians, apparently, not terrorists), they are still people, and they are like they are for very human reasons. Don't presume to judge every last Taliban soldier. They are complicated beings, just like you and I.
This breaking people down into targets, because they are "undeserving" of any acknowledgment as human beings is sickening. You have no way of knowing. There's a lot more to a person than the army they serve.
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This breaking people down into targets, because they are "undeserving" of any acknowledgment as human beings is sickening. You have no way of knowing. There's a lot more to a person than the army they serve.
Is this the same guy, who thought Jim Brown blowing up some Germans trapped down in a hole, was such a cool movie?
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you enjoy their dead ... as they enjoy dead of your friends.....
i cant decide whitch of you is bigger foolishness
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
Not if they are bad people.....
AND WHO WILL JUDGE WHO IS GOOD AND WHO ISNT ?
this concern about Afghanistan is parade of self-regard,hypocrisy
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Osama ben Tumor need to meet a trip mine one day.
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Originally posted by funkedup
It looks like a BTR-70 hitting a land mine. Cool pics though!
Funked look only at pic 7 and 8 making abstraction of the others ...
Is it so cool ?
If so looking at bodies falling from the Twins was cool to ?
Sincerely I would remove this sentence from your post ...
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I decide who is bad. Was that ever in question?
Bad people sometimes need to die, its that simple.
Bad people are those who deliberatly and willfully and intentionally and with no other percieved pretense or cause hurt generally innocent or uninvolved people.
Sometimes they need to die. It makes me glad when they do.
It makes me feel like this: :D
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you restricted the bad guy definition Grun, it can be also people who don't think like the majority.
As Robespierre (I think ?) said :
majority minus one is allways wrong .
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There is nothing wrong if somebody thinks different from the majority. Even if they are nut cases. The problem is when they behave inappropriately.
Behavior and action is what really counts.
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I agree but Robespierre used to use this sentence to Guillotine a lot of people...
Behavior and action is what really counts
at least whe do agree on one point :)
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Well we konw what happend to him, dont we. :)
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hehe ;)
Nothing like testing your own equipement yourself :D
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Human is a predator. We naturally love the taste of flesh (monkeys do too) and we enjoy hunting (in some cases, same species).
Civilized human is same, but with moral values. Those values are there mostly to suppress our animal instincts, so we can act as a society. Army's(which actually equals country leaders) important job in the war is to dehumanize the enemy, so soldiers dont get confuzed. Man with moral values gets confused when hes supposed to kill man "just for the kick of it", 'cause theres no justification for killing, just excuses.
In moral logic, that is.
Americas at war against Talebans, theyre done pretty good job in dehumanization. Im sure this same applies for the Taleban side.
Just wanted to add something intellectual in this flame war..:p
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Dangit, Tuomio beat me to it!
My father was in WW2. He will still tell me how he HATED all Japanese and Germans. He was taught to hate. To see these people as things, as targets, as less than human. People in a war do not have the luxury of seeking the humanity of the enemy. Sad but true.
Please know this Grunherz, there will come a time when you will realize these are fellow humans, no matter how foul.
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Originally posted by straffo
Osama ben Tumor need to meet a trip mine one day.
How dare you compare me to that low-life terrorist. You are a fool, no more....no less. Just a simple fool.
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Originally posted by easymo
This breaking people down into targets, because they are "undeserving" of any acknowledgment as human beings is sickening. You have no way of knowing. There's a lot more to a person than the army they serve.
Is this the same guy, who thought Jim Brown blowing up some Germans trapped down in a hole, was such a cool movie?
Yes it is. Apples and Oranges. The movie wasn't cool, it was a grim, gritty war story. If you somehow got the impression that I thought that they did good things in that film, you are mistaken.
Let me put it this way: these people are serving in the Taliban or Al Quaeda military. Why? Is it because they are evil and want to kill all the Westerners? Actually, not quite. Many, hell, probably most of them are poorly educated and brainwashed young men. They would kill you without shedding a tear, because they have been told endlessly that you would do the same to them (ironically, you would, to hear what you're saying). They have been told that the Western, Jew-ruled world will stop at nothing to annihilate them from the earth. They believe us to be as evil as we believe them to be. It's not simple hatred, though they do indeed hate us. It's survival. They believe this because there is nothing else to believe that doesn't come from the Great Satan that they have already been warned against.
Yes, they are going to die. Sadly, there isn't much we can do about this, because they believe what they have been told so thoroughly. They will willingly go to their deaths, in fact. Even more sadly, you will rejoice over it. "Another evil terrorist bites the dust." Well. Evil after a fashion...
If there is indeed a hell, I hope that Osama bin Laden and all of his disgusting kind will have a special place there, not only for what they has done to us, but what they have done to their own people. Because of them, there is that much less hope of bridging the gulf of understanding, knowledge, and hate. I hope that this is resolved quickly, but I have a feeling that the repercussions of all of this are going to be pretty far reaching.
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Originally posted by straffo
Funked look only at pic 7 and 8 making abstraction of the others ...
Is it so cool ?
If so looking at bodies falling from the Twins was cool to ?
Sincerely I would remove this sentence from your post ...
You're a self rightous idiot . It is a cool pic, and if you infer that to mean that I think that it is great that the people in it were killed, well then like I said you're a self rightous idiot . With your attitude you must think that anyone who enjoys watching gun camera footage is sick too .
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Straffo said:
Funked look only at pic 7 and 8 making abstraction of the others ...
Is it so cool ?
If so looking at bodies falling from the Twins was cool to ?
Sincerely I would remove this sentence from your post ...
Maybe cool is the wrong term. I just meant that it is an amazing series of photos, to catch a fast action like that in such detail.
The death of those men is not cool. Unless they are actually Al Qaeda. In that case I would stick with "cool". And in that case there is no valid comparison to pictures of WTC victims. One is innocent civilians being murdered, the other is murderers getting what they deserve.
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Thanks Funked
I needed this explannation cause I didn't wanted to believe you find it cool.
It was a quite shocking assessment IMO.
I was using the WTC comparaison just because it's a common reference of horror. I would have used the Oradour sur Glane comparaison but I bet that less than 1% of the reader of this thread know what happened in Oradour.
Samm
With your attitude you must think that anyone who enjoys watching gun camera footage is sick too
It don't compare as we make abstraction of the human in the plane wich made the viewing of the film easier.
I won't digress more as I need to translate lot of concept I'm not sure to be able to express in English.
btw do you know how many normal human enjoy killing other human even during war ?
It's less than 10% for french average soldiers(green berets and comandos are exception)
Killing is hopefully an exception not a rule in our societé.
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Who is this "Oradour" guy anyway ? :D
Reading that poeple here enjoy seeing dead bodies and Animal's post about the Etnic cleansing game start to make me want to turn the TV back on and watch some A-Team series .... or something..
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Originally posted by easymo
This breaking people down into targets, because they are "undeserving" of any acknowledgment as human beings is sickening. You have no way of knowing. There's a lot more to a person than the army they serve.
Is this the same guy, who thought Jim Brown blowing up some Germans trapped down in a hole, was such a cool movie?
Movie?
Get a grip. This is reality! Movies are movies.
I guess there really IS a need to censor these things, some people can't tell the difference between fictional entertainment and a document.
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Oradour (http://www.oradour.btinternet.co.uk/index.htm)
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Originally posted by midnight Target
Dangit, Tuomio beat me to it!
My father was in WW2. He will still tell me how he HATED all Japanese and Germans. He was taught to hate.
well its common fact in our country. Most of people whitch hear about ww2 by people whitch survived, hate germans as nation. But when i meet some german, i have nothink agains him, i have no problem to speak with him.... that old hate agains their nation is not related to him.
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Tahgut Im well aware that they are human, they probably have kids and friends and love a certain food and have a favorite song or whatever, I fully realize that.
But I don't see how that changes the fact that they might need to die?
You see my philosophy is to be civilized and nice and reasonable during good times and peace, when attacked all that goes away- then its time for utter barbaric killing against the enemy fighting forces. Just no rapes of women on penalty of death, no mutilation or torture of irrelevant people, try avoid killing civilans as much as possible), if you have to kill them, no mutilation or torture allowed just shoot them- but ABSOLUTELY NO MERCY for anyone activly fighting you. Make it clear to them that they will be killed if they continue fighting. Prisoners (or detainees :) ) should be treated well and that should be broadcast widely as to make widespread surrenders more palatable. Its very inconveniant if the enemy is willing to fight to death in fear of gross mistreatment during captiviy. Absolutely no meaningless cease fires or anything of the sort. No cease fires during negotiations. The only acceptable cease fire is the total surrender of all enemy forces and the nation at large. After the war is over you must take over the country and make every effort to make these people your friends and allies. Change their cultures and schooling to show that fighing your country was bad and that your country is good.
This is how wars should be fought!
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Dunno, seems to be a BTR 70 rolling over a magnetic anti tank mine. I could look up the proper classification if wished.
I don´t wanna talk about people flying around and telling that entertaining.....
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Not even the deaths of despised enemies will make me feel good.
I'll always see it as a tragic waste of a human life - in the case of the Taliban and Al Queda fighters, bad decisions made in a surrounding where opportunities to make good ones are few and far between.
Those of you who like seeing The Evil Enemy being destroyed and killed ought to see a human being, injured and fighting for his or her life, lose and exhale one last time.
Taking pleasure in the deaths of human beings is morally abhorrent.
Feeling relieved that a threat has been eliminated is a whole other thing. Sometimes that means, unfortunately, that there will be loss of life. But to value that lives are lost - that, to me, is a sign of a mental issue - inability to feel empathy, or put oneself in a similar situation.
I'd celebrate a threat having been eliminated, and I'd be extremely determined to see all threats eliminated - if it comes to killing, so be it.
But I'd lose my sanity and indeed my humanity the second I begun taking pleasure in the deaths of humans.
I think if you're exposed to the violent death of a human being, one you view as just that, unless you're mentally disturbed, you will not feel pleasure.
It's a spectacular series of photos, and we as humans are fascinated with violence and death - me as much as everyone. Still, I always feel like a stabbing when I view even WWII fighter gun cameras - thinking 'who was that man? How many meals has he not eaten before this? His mother, his father, his siblings and his children - this man has felt love, just as I have felt love'.
What must be done shall be done, but feeling good about killing people ain't healthy.
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My list of things worth dying for is much MUCH larger than my list of things worth killing for.