Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Jimdandy on February 05, 2001, 09:29:00 AM
-
I suggest to eliminate any complaints about the perk planes they should be made available to everyone. No points at all. Make the planes available to everyone just limit the number of times you can fly it per tour. Simple and everyone gets a taste of flying there dream ride in the MA. Base the number of rides available on the rarity and performance of the plane. For example the C-hog was rare but not a SUPER plane so allow 10 rides in the C-hog per tour. The Me 262 was rare and a SUPER plane so allow 3 rides per tour. My dream ride the Martin-Baker MB.5 was a one of a kind prototype so allow 1 ride per tour. Make perk bases to fly out of that will limit there use. If you go out and use all your perk rides up at the beginning of the tour than that's your fault. You still can be shot down buy some guy low on your six and never even get to dogfight. The bases that they fly out of can be bombed and limit there flight time. What do you all think? You could even keep the perk point system and allow an extra flight per 1000 perk points or something. This would allow squads to organize special mission with the planes. The number of rides available for any given ride might have to be adjusted but everyone would get a chance this way. You could even have factories for the perk planes that could be bombed like the Spit factory on Air Warrior. All of these would help to limit the use without making people feel like they will never have a chance to use one do to skill level or time factors. You could even make the times these planes are available very during the tour. The later models wouldn't be available for use tell later in the tour.
[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 02-05-2001).]
[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 02-05-2001).]
-
I think HT has much experience in how to limit plane availability and the perk system seems perkfect the more I think about it.
HT has implied that the perk planes are meant to be trophies, or rewards for doing a job well done. If a new guy can't fly an Me262, too bad. He will have to learn to fly then to get better. He already has a whole list of planes to flt from and I'm sure it will get longer.
fscott
-
Originally posted by fscott:
I think HT has much experience in how to limit plane availability and the perk system seems perkfect the more I think about it.
HT has implied that the perk planes are meant to be trophies, or rewards for doing a job well done. If a new guy can't fly an Me262, too bad. He will have to learn to fly then to get better. He already has a whole list of planes to flt from and I'm sure it will get longer.
fscott
fscott have you ever had to work a lot of over time. I mean for a month or two at a time. I have and that's the business I work in. I still like this game and want to have the same chance at all the goodies when I get a chance to play. I work construction and when the job is going you don't get 9 to 5 most of the time. That's the biggest reason I would like to see it. If guys like me only have two or three hours a week to play then they don't' have the time to build points. I would still like to get online when I have the time and have a shot at a perk ride as often as the guy that can set on here all day. It's not all about skill its about time also. I'm sure the HT people can sympathize with that. I bet they get plenty of OT.
[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 02-05-2001).]
-
Jimdandy? The same guy that had a 15+ kill streak going on yesterday? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
-
There's no reason that there can't be a comprimise between both ideas.
-
beat to the next post by Ripsnort...LOL (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
-
If you attack a facility, like Grunt Training Facility, or something like that and score it as fighter you can accrue a huge number of points. Between 20 and 60 depending on the plane you use.
-SW
-
Bah..I say dont care, too bad.
What about all the non-skill newbies who would prefer to see a Fighter Ace calss flight model? Heck, let's just make it mroe accessible for the Quakers and tone down the flight model. It's too hard, I don't have alot of time to learn this flight model. Let's implement straight trajectory bullets casue deflection shots are too hard.
You can't appease everyone. The reward system is perkfect, because it rewards you for working hard at it rather than just anyone getting to fly a monster dweeb plane like an Me262.
fscott
-
Originally posted by Ripsnort:
Jimdandy? The same guy that had a 15+ kill streak going on yesterday? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
LOL!!!!!!!!!! Well Ahhhhh. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) I think that was setting on the CV popping stuff. I wish it was air to air I'd feal like a god. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
-
Originally posted by Jimdandy:
LOL!!!!!!!!!! Well Ahhhhh. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) I think that was setting on the CV popping stuff. I wish it was air to air I'd feal like a god. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Don't worry, there's a perk AA battery in your future...
As Titus' dad would say "Wussie!" (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Eagler
-
I think if I wanted to expand on Jimdandy's idea, I would simply limit the number of planes of type you could fly.
Let's say the Ta152 made it in. You get three of them, period. If you screw it up, you don't get any more til next month. You had your chance, but you didn't have the experience to handle the beast. Higher experienced pilots, or as some elitist prefer to call themselves "smarter pilots" (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif), would maintain a bit more caution. In short, it would allow everyone a shot at flying the elite planes, but force you to be more cautious if you wanted to keep it, rewarding the pilot who wanted to fly "realistically" (whutevah that means).
Personally, outside of H2H flyers I do not see how anyone will be expert in any of the uber planes. You simply aren't going to have them long enough to learn too much if you fly aggressively at all. The whole thing doesn't trouble me at all- it will work out somehow. I do think that saying "screw the new guy or the working stiff" is a poor attitude that some have.
-
Originally posted by Kieren:
...I do think that saying "screw the new guy or the working stiff" is a poor attitude that some have.
Exactly. The planes will still be limited in all the ways I said above. As I said you could keep the perk system just use the points for more rides in your favorite plane. Say 500-1000 points per extra ride. The good pilots would get there bounces that way. The people with no time or skill to get the points would still get to fly them. A poor pilot in a "perk" ride will be a great bounce for a skilled pilot in a non-perk ride. He will add to those points for that extra ride in his favorite plane. Also the fact that squad mission could be planed that way. Everyone in the squad would save there one ride for the tour for that bomber run or jabo mission or what ever. Then that would be it. All of those people would have used up their one ride in plane X for that tour. One of the guys may have gotten enough perk points for another ride but the rest are SOL. It would be a little more realistic also. You would actually have seen these planes more often than not in groups of two or more. You don't go up without a wing man if you don't have to. As I said above base the number of rides available for the plane on the bases of rarity and performance. One ride in a 262 or 163 would be enough. A C-hog might be 10. That's just an example. The good pilots might get 2 or three rides with their perk points.
-
jim... I see what you are trying to do... Get rid of the "everquest" no life, live on line and do boring toejam till ya puke to get perk points mentality but..... it really is only a stopgap fix for an unworkable system. Think about it.... It would allmost guarentee that there were "perk" uber rides in the arena at all times, thereby insuring that there would be no fair fights ever again in AH.... Real or percieved.
Plus... it does nothing about the dead end nature of the idiotic "perk" system. Again, it allmost insures that there will never be early war rides. Some of the most important planes of WWII will never be modeled but totally insignificant "perk" class planes will be the focus of AH.
Granted, I am in the minority in my love of early war planes but certainly.... A "realistic" sim would feature the more significant and important early war planes over the joke perk rides? Or is that a different kind of "realism"?
lazs
-
This simulation is just getting started but you all make it sound like it is in its final format.
------------------
Bare*Metal*Finish
-
laz, I see what your saying too. I was thinking that buy limiting the number of rides and the ability to bomb the perk bases and factories that you could keep them rare. If everyone only gets say one ride in a 262 per tour for example they would be careful when and where they used that one ride (ride being get in the plane and fly it tell your shot down or land and go to the tower). Your right that that's what I'm trying to limit because I would like to see some of these planes. I would also like to see some of the early war rides brought in. You could be right that this would eliminate probability of the early war stuff ever being seen on AH. I know that on Air Warrior there were people including myself that would get in the early war rides for different missions. I really don't know but I would like to see these planes. I just don't like it that my money isn't as good if I don't camp on AH or fly like a god and that's what we are really talking about.
-
Originally posted by fscott:
The reward system is perkfect, because it rewards you for working hard at it rather than just anyone getting to fly a monster dweeb plane like an Me262.
fscott
No, it rewards you for having your bellybutton glued to a chair,staring at a monitor for hundreds of hours a month. No "hard work" is involved. Basically, it's a way of saying that the guy who can't fly a toejamload of hours is not getting the same product as the pasty skinned shut-ins.
I think Jim proposed a good compromise. But, I have to <shudder> agree with lazs, that this will just guarantee we will not see early war planes in the MA.
------------------
LJK_Raubvogel
LuftJägerKorps (http://www.luftjagerkorps.com)
(http://raubvogel.tripod.com/signew.gif)
[This message has been edited by LJK Raubvogel (edited 02-05-2001).]
-
Glued to your chair for hundreds of hours a month... I would think that's considered "working hard". I don't think the casual gamer who floats in once or twice a week for a quick 30 min session should be obliged to fly the same uber-ride perk plane that I spent the last month trying to get. Talk about unfair!
fscott
-
Originally posted by LJK Raubvogel:
No, it rewards you for having your bellybutton glued to a chair,staring at a monitor for hundreds of hours a month.
It's about time someone rewards me for that. At least I'll get a perk plane when my perk girlfriend leaves me...
-
fscott having your fat bellybutton glued to a chair 24/7 is not "working". I will be glad to take you to work with me and show you what "working" is. No one will admire the dipshits that fly perk planes.
Earning an uber ride by gaming the game and camping on line is a formula for animosity not admiration. You have "earned" nothing and you have (IMO) gained nothing. I will not be flying perk points. I will give mine away to a squadie who will be willing to fly a perk plane to keep the cowardly dipshits that fly em away from me.
jim... I don't see a way that perk planes can't screw up the arena. If they are rare then they will be mostly flown by the people who least need em or are the least fun to (cough) "fight". They will be flown by the unstoppable and/or the cowardly of the game. They will encourage cowardly behavoir and discourage newcomers and worst of all they will put focus on insignificant planes and take it away from the more significant early war workhorses. Sure you may see a few early rides just as you see a few eccentrics in Zekes and 202's but...
lazs
Sad thing is, there is a very workable solution that doesn't involve the idiocy of perk.
-
Really, I think some taking this game way too seriously. I hope it isn't affecting the production of the "working" crowd. It's funnier even still when people go as far as calling other people dipsh*ts for flying a perk plane. Come on man, it's a game. Almost as ludicrous as calling someone a dweeb cause they use a Mac.
fscott
-
fscott... yeah I do think anyone who would fly an uber plane against ones of far less ability is a dipshit. I mean, What is the point? Any victory you get is tainted if you have any sense.
lazs
-
With the current system, I am resolved to never flying a perked plane. I'm not the best pilot to begin with, and I can't spend all of my time online playing the game or my job and my wife will both gimme the boot.
I would like the opportunity to fly a perk plane a couple of times a month.
I think that people should be able to earn new rides beyond that, but that for a lot of us, a few 'gimmes' will be the only way we ever step foot in them. Will that unbalance the game? I doubt it... whether I'm in a F6F or a Ta-152, I'm still an easy mark who is here more for the WWII fun than because I'm a hotshot. We won't last long in our fancy rides - I guarantee it.
-
Originally posted by fscott:
Come on man, it's a game.
Sorry to but in but fscott you were calling this game working in your posts above? Now it's a game? I think the point being made is that if you are paying $30 for a product you should get the same value for money as the other guy, whether you use it as much or not. Some are arguing that they are not getting the same value because of the perk system.
I agree with this point of view. Make the perks limited but available to all. (That's all you get for $0.02)
[This message has been edited by bertie (edited 02-06-2001).]
-
Okay, what everyone keeps forgetting is that there's very little wrong with rewarding the pasty skinned, Evercrack-esque, shut-in 24/7 player with more perk rides.
Why? For every hour he's playing he's still going to be flying perk planes the same percent of the time as the occasional player. Between two equal pilots, they will be earning perk points at the same rate. Ergo: They will be in perk planes the same percent of the time.
Assume a flat '1 perk a month':
Why should someone who flies 1 hour a week get to fly a perk 25% of the time and a guy who flies 15 hours a week only get a perk plane %2 of the time he flies?
On the flip side, dweebs will fly endlessly and become major pests in their daily-won uberplanes.
But as long as you're able to gift the points to people, I think we'll have plenty of 'have gun, will travel' types willing to collect the points and take them out.
And if perks vary from arena to arena, some cool possibilities emerge. Once we get the more common, early war / more highly produced planes into the game, I'd love to see a 'WW2 arena':
Axis vs. Allied European Theatre. Rotating planeset by year, with 'This year's model' costing a few perk points. e.g. Spit III is free, Spit V costs 5 perk points. 109 is free, 190 costs 3 perk points.
Just a thought.
~Lemur
-
If guys like me only have two or three hours a week to play then they don't' have the time to build points. I would still like to get online when I have the time and have a shot at a perk ride as often as the guy that can set on here all day. It's not all about skill its about time also. I'm sure the HT people can sympathize with that. I bet they get plenty of OT.
I feel for JimDandy, and can relate to his proposal for a diffrent perk system. A can see how he would not want to be working all day at construction, only to have guys that spend all day at AH getting unfair advantages and cracks at perk planes.
With all that construction overtime, he has fought and scraped only...lets see...
Jimdandy stats - Time hh:mm:ss 22:59:25 + 07:31:48 + 00:00:00 + 00:58:34 =
TOTAL 31:29:47 hours in AH in the last 6 days.
Thats...(taking off shoes looking at toes) um, more than 5 HOURS a day.
Please, for your own health, stop working so much and get in front of a nice cozy computer Jim. Your working yourself to death.
[This message has been edited by Creamo (edited 02-06-2001).]
-
Creamo I hope that's a joke. When you work construction the OT is a fact of life. You work when the work is there. If it isn't a joke then you got a lot to learn about the working world. I do assume your just kidding or trying to troll. I could never believe anyone could be that naive unless they never had a job.
-
5 hours a day! LOL! Tell us Jim, how in the world can you hammer a nail and fly at the same time? You must have one of those wearable computers... Man I gotta get one. Those would be great when I'm at the grocery store, I can spend my food stamps and fly at the same time.
fscott
-
Just as a comparison to the "working crowd", I have 23:25 hours since this tour started. I haven't flown yet today, so divided by 6 days that equals roughly 3.8 hours a day. Amazing how someone who is glued to his AH chair all day can get such pasty white skin...I dunno Jim, maybe you need to spend more time getting BETTER rather than spending time whining about perk points. Just a thought. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
fscott
-
x
[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 02-07-2001).]
-
Originally posted by Jimdandy:
fscott have you ever had to work a lot of over time. I mean for a month or two at a time...I work construction and when the job is going you don't get 9 to 5 most of the time. That's the biggest reason I would like to see it...It's not all about skill its about time also...
[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 02-05-2001).]
I never said I worked OT EVERY day. During the construction season 2 or more months of it isn't uncommon. LOL Construction isn't just hammering nails although I have done that. I've also done asbestos removal, diesel mechanic, welder, and spent some time delivering pizza in between those jobs. Now I'm a Mechanical Engineer. I had to do a lot of things to pay my way thru school. So I don't put down anyones job. Currenty I'm a Mechanical Piping Field Engineer. There are all kinds of different jobs in construction. Generally when the crew is working OT so am I. I have to be there to support the crew. When you doing a 4 hour test on a high pressure line you don't just go home because 8hrs is up. The set up time and labor cost are WAY to high to do that. I'm very sorry if I've scared anyone that didn't know what work was. I can see how talk like this might make you nervous. I'm sorry.
[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 02-07-2001).]
-
Ok Jim, I checked you total hours for tour 12 and it comes out to 3.8 hours a day. You had 136 total hours, I had 145 hours for tour 12. It just seems very funny that someone getting around 3.8 hours a day of AH is whining about perk points and not enuff time to fly.
I am a full backer of the perk system and we are flying about the same. I consider anything over 2 hours a day, lots of flying time. So please don't put yourself in the "working man-not enuff tme to fly" crowd. Your not. If you don't have enuff perks, then like I said, work on getting more kills.
fscott
[This message has been edited by fscott (edited 02-07-2001).]
[This message has been edited by fscott (edited 02-07-2001).]
-
Originally posted by fscott:
Ok Jim, I checked you total hours for tour 12 and it comes out to 3.8 hours a day. You had 136 total hours, I had 145 hours for tour 12. It just seems very funny that someone getting around 3.8 hours a day of AH is whining about perk points and not enuff time to fly.
I am a full backer of the perk system and we are flying about the same. I consider anything over 2 hours a day, lots of flying time. So please don't put yourself in the "working man-not enuff tme to fly" crowd. Your not. If you don't have enuff perks, then like I said, work on getting more kills.
fscott
[This message has been edited by fscott (edited 02-07-2001).]
[This message has been edited by fscott (edited 02-07-2001).]
LOL Oh my god. Your unreal! I don't even think I will tell you why I'm on a lot more than I would be normally. Like I said I work construction. Yep I have been on a lot. I NEVER said I wasn't. But I REALLY hope that in the VERY near future I wont be. By the way did you think I was only speeking for myself. Read some of the other replys. You can just figure out for yourself what might at allow me to be on here as much as I have been. It certianly wasn't because I choose to. But it is something to do in the mean time. Thanks for playing big brother for me. I really do need someone to keep tabs on me.
[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 02-07-2001).]
-
If this gets to the point where your work stories start to include references to you shirtless and sweaty lifting pipes Jim, it could be a serious case of BBS plagiarism. Thewobbled could sue you for fiction copy write violations.
See, what you were saying until you got called on it and edited it out was-
If guys like me only have two or three hours a week to play then they don't' have the time to build points. I would still like to get online when I have the time and have a shot at a perk ride as often as the guy that can set on here all day. It's not all about skill its about time also. I'm sure the HT people can sympathize with that. I bet they get plenty of OT.
You were complaining that you didn’t have time to get a perk ride, and for what reason your still arguing, I don’t know. You do.
Seems to me it was, “I want ta perk ride, and this is how I can have it without any effort. Maybe with all that time on line you haven’t built toejam fer points. That would make sense of all this. Not to worry, I don't think alot of average player are. Im not anyways.
However, I wouldn’t be too alarmed though if you spent 5 hours a day and didn’t get a lot of points. I think they are testing the point system out, and it may change.
Just remember that perk planes aren’t here yet, and I think were originally for introducing some planes that otherwise would be unbalancing.
Oh, and ease off on Fscott, we didn’t mean any disrespect to your occupation as a Mechanical Piping Field Engineer. In fact I know many engineers, and was one myself!
I was a Flat Orbital Italian Food Products Construction Engineer once for Pizza Hut Industries Inc., and then a Mechanical Sprinkler Field Engineer for Rolling Meadows 9 hole golf course. (Specializing in h2O valve actuation to both on and off operations near critical practice putting areas.)
Back then, I’d be lucky to get 3 hours a day on AH, let alone 5.
Believe me, I know EXACLTY where yer comin from.
-
LOL creamo! Very nice creative writing. My hidden point Jim, is that it just goes to show that people just like to start threads and whine about something which more often than not, doesn't even pertain to them. For instance I could waste bandwidth and post about how the C202 is so porked it aint funny, but heck I don't even fly it and never would. But hey at elast it would give me something to do while sitting around the house here wondering where I'm gonna spend my next welfare check.
fscott
-
Well... you can check my time on. When i do get on for a couple of hours I want to fly with my squaddies on roger wilco and, like them, find some action. I certainly don't want to deal with the convoluted and idiotic "perk" system and all the cowardly unbalanced bull it engenders. I certainly do not want to spend my time working my way up to kill some cowardly perkie or wanna be perkie and I don't want to be dodging em either.
What's wrong with a fair and balanced planeset? If it's a game then everyone should have the same choice of tools.
lazs
-
Originally posted by fscott:
LOL creamo! Very nice creative writing. My hidden point Jim, is that it just goes to show that people just like to start threads and whine about something which more often than not, doesn't even pertain to them. For instance I could waste bandwidth and post about how the C202 is so porked it aint funny, but heck I don't even fly it and never would. But hey at elast it would give me something to do while sitting around the house here wondering where I'm gonna spend my next welfare check.
fscott
Ok children..lets put our much needed thinking caps on!
IT IS W I N T E R T I M E!!!
How often do you guyz see buildings of any type being thrown up November - February in certain areas of the world where IT GETS cold, snowy, etc? Winter time puts big dampers on construction, and construction workers find lots of time on thier hands. Construction generally coincides with GOOD weather...so a dude living in, lets say "a cold "winter" climate finds himself working overtime ALOT. sheesh.