Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Wilbus on February 10, 2002, 04:46:35 AM
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I've asked HT many times during these past years why we can't have realistic gauges for the planes that should have them, 109's and 190's didn't fly around with a US dash board measuring MPH and feet, that's almost only the US and Brits who do (wich is the minority of the world but maybe majority of AH).
The reason I've got in the past, is that it would be confusing for people, one gyu saying 5km and another one saying 5k. OK, I can understand that although I don't agree with it.
However, we have Combat Theater now, where historical setups is allways on, country planes vs another countries planes.
Now, this adds a whole new thing, flying around as LW using MPH is taking away a HUGE deal of realism.
Allso, in the CT there are the same sort of planes in the same country, thus saying "he's at 5km" would make everybody understand.
Atleast make it an option to choose between Miles and Metric system!
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I second that request.
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Lets have realstic cockpits for every plane!
We have a distinct flight model for all planes, why not have the cockpits that came with those planes as well?
Maybe a switch in the setup could switch between the cockpits we have now and the planes historical cockpit. That way if people are not comfortable with a realistic gauage setup they can select the relaxed realism cockpits we have now.
Grayarea.
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To paraphrase a certain famous speech in concern with this matter..
"I have a dream.
A dream where all planes are NOT CREATED EQUAL..[/I]"
Yes my brothers and sisters.
We all know the chariots of the skies are definately NOT EQUAL!!!
Don't let this dream die!
Someday my fellow pilots, someday!
:D
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I'd rather have more planes.
Besides.. until they stop using the same FE for both the CT and the MA... absolutely nothing has changed to affect HT's reasoning.
AKDejaVu
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I think it'd be great to see realistic cockpits too. It'd be nice to have it as an option in either arena. That sounds like a hell of a lot of work for what you'd get out of it tho'.
SOB
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I second that Wilbuz, :)
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It's all SUPERFLY's fault... what a slacker ;)
I'm for removing Ammo counters before that.
Oh, and Wilbus, i'd edit that title if I were you...
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As an option, perhaps. But it does no more to simulate historical accuracy to have a pilot reading a guage who's units he is either not used to or does not understand. It's more the opposite.
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I've dealed with the English system all my life, I still have trouble reading Metric system but, I still would want an accurate portrayal of the instrument gauges and their cockpits maybe it should not all be done at once 2 aircraft per patch maybe with regular short patches to add them . Heck at least the IAS gauge could be used for all the 190s and 109s the Turn Coord on the 190 is different from the 109 I believe.
Also if it means removing an instrument that the aircraft did not have by all means do so if it is an accurate portrayal of what it DID look like it should be done.
You see if they take on all the aircraft at once it may take a big chunk of resources but if they do it at a moderate pace it won't deviate them from the plane making process.
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Well Fatty, idiots like me managed to do that the other way around... should't be too much trouble.
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Ahh, but we're a different sort of idiot. Meters or even liters (not that volume would even matter) are nothing that complex, but it remains that the game is developed by an American company for mostly American people (Eaglecz I left you a perfect opportunity to insert some drooling ignorant american comment there). If you're into the whole I'm a WWII pilot roleplay thing, then having instruments in any language or measurement system other than your native is unrealistic (with limited exceptions).
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Yes, m and km gauge please!
There is kg already.
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Mitsu
Stab./JG1 "Oesau" (http://www.dd.iij4u.or.jp/~nobo/jg1/)
"Let me fly Tony, it's an Axis plane!"
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Wilbus, Japanese uses the Metric system too. :)
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You got a point about the American thingie.
But I still don't think it's too hard, then again I might have been moving around too much :)
(hell I've been flying here a while now & I still don't know if that Icon distance is in yards or feet.)
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By the way that's the same reason I wouldn't mind seeing it as a user end setting (to even change US planes to metric if someone's more used to metric), I'd probably toggle it now and again just for a different look.
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As a option.
I really thought I would use authentic FW cockpits on and off just for a change of pace if available. In fact I tried it in IL-2, and it was quite strange. Fortunately, they chose "realistic" 3D cockpits that aren't realistically readable on computer monitors, so I spent all my time watching that hoopty F16 HUD readout in the corner. It would be cool to be able to select real guages in HTC's much better readable cockpit.
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In an FW instead of crusing at 300 kts.. it now reads 425 km. To shoot at 300.. your conv needs to be set to 450. What is that thing in the middle?.. Some sort of compas IAS?.. That'll be hard to get used to.
OK your done flying the butcher bird and it's time for the pony. Ah geese another 10 minutes switching your head back to standard.
:cool: JK
I'm with Wibus put it in! :) The game, both arenas
damaged cockpit too.
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do what we did in canada when we switched to metric 25? years ago. Put little stickers on your speedometer so that you can see metric too....
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Yes Mitsu I know :)
It's just those Yanks and Tommies who wants to stand out ;) (together with one country in Africa or something).
Majority of the world uses Metric, and IMO, I'd get one hell of alot better feeling in AH if I had a metric system in my 190, goes for any other plane I fly too, I'd use miles in teh US planes though just for realism but the feeling of speed would be far greater with a realistic system.
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If it ever came to pass, as an option only please.
I definitely have no desire to fly cockpits that are that exact. Quite the contrary, I prefer a standard across the board like exists now. If others want to flick that switch and paste in that art, fine by me. Gotta agree with DejaVu though, I'd much rather see resources directed elsewhere, like into planes or more detailed terrain/strat features for CT rather than into something like this.
Just my two bits anywhoo.
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Now don't be so demanding new graphics. I strafe trains, so don't argue HTC update staff resource managment. Well once I did shoot at a train on the last patch release, hadn't seen one since. Still...
Did I just whine? I believe I did.
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kilometers and kilograms yeaaaaaaaahhhhhhhh, come on lets confuse the us and uk buggers :D (joke with some truth in hehe)
Sounds nice for me im used to both, and ofcourse the germans and japanese did not had miles measureing speed in their planes.
That also goes for the Italian and russian planes too.
Mabye if it get to complexed for some people have it as a option so people can choose, because im afraid alot of people will hesitate to use planes with metric mesurment.
airguard
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Don't understand why thge European community should be left out...
I can read both quite easily, not evreybody can.
Not all who play AH are US or Brits.
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I agree with you wilbus, but I think there should be a option so people can choose what they want.
airgaurd
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To shoot at 300.. your conv needs to be set to 450.
10Bears, AFAIK, a yard is equivalent to a meter or about three feets.
Conv 300 yards = conv 300 meters.
What is better, quantity or quality? Do we want 200 averagely modeled planes or only 50 almost perfectly modeled ones?
I vote for the second.
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Go outside the cockpit in outside view. Zoom in, so you can see the instruments. Needles et al will be moving.
This is hard coded into the 3d model. If we want a metric option, it means doing extra 3d models for every plane.
In other games, it's simple: just take the 2d cockpit image, switch. Of course, 2d cockpits is *sooo* 1990's.
Regarding ammo counters: I've asked HT many a time, and every time the answer has been the same: "no, we don't want to remove the ammo counters".
I'm hoping that he won't remove them, but make it an *option* to have them show '0000'. That way, one could set up the CT so ammo doesn't show, but MA, where those who aren't really qualified to fly in the CT fly, would have ammo counters.
Heheheheh.
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What is better, quantity or quality? Do we want 200 averagely modeled planes or only 50 almost perfectly modeled ones?
Well said!
And we can have you be the judge of "almost perfect" so that you can give HTC the OK to model more planes. :rolleyes:
I'm concerned about FM. The rest is eye candy. How much or how little you want will change from person to person. But regardless, it is still eye candy.
I'm just not a big fan of halting a game's forward progress to cater to the "we need more eye candy" crowd. Yet... that's exactly what you propose here.
AKDejaVu
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It's not just 'eye candy', it's immersion for some people, which can be a huge attraction to the game.
I have no clue how HTC spends their time making their product, and outside of making a goof on the trains, surely won't suggest how they should. Seems good so far. I'd just like a option to have a real historic cockpit somewhere down the development road.
You can have a opinion on which features get more attention, but to discount a ACCURATE cockpit in a Simulator as eye candy is... wrong I think.
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Originally posted by Creamo
it's immersion
And inmersion is one of the most important factors in any modern simulator, specially for those that aproach a product for first time.
As a matter of fact, 99% of players probably have no idea about real life specs of a Ta152, but all of them can say whether they feel like being into the real thing or not.
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Dejavu, that's typical US to say (no offence to those who are US and don't think like that). It's been proved over and over again, what US doesn't have, nobody else should have either. It's a US game, european community shouldn't have anything to strenghten the immersion.
If you like MPH, fine, fly with it, Europeans who are used to Metric system get alot more immersion from metric gauges, not to mention speed feeling, so please don't come and say it's just eye candy.
I know there are quite many US people who want Metric for their LW and Japanese (ok, everything but brit and US actually) rides too, however, it seems to me that most US people think that miles is the only thing that exists...
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Oh, and isn't it ironic that the outside views aka 'eye candy' are the suggested limiting factor to the optional realistic guages? :p
Go outside the cockpit in outside view. Zoom in, so you can see the instruments. Needles et al will be moving. This is hard coded into the 3d model. If we want a metric option, it means doing extra 3d models for every plane.
Whatever, AH does what it does very well, and I do understand why easy to read panels work.
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the whole mph and feet thing is archaic and ridiculous.
it's kind of embarrassing that we(the u.s.) can't get in step with the rest of the world and use a logical system of measurement. remember the resistance when carter tried it? unreal!
we claim to be so advanced, but people turn into syrup when SI units are around.
"i aint chaingin mah mezhermints!!! - they is u.s. guverment spayshul so that means they is is strate frum the baby jeezus jus' like the constitooshun and futball - amen!!"
no, let's not use systems of tens lets use 12's and the mile will be oh let's say some arbitrary length, 5 thousand whatever feet and of course farehnheit will show freezing at 32 instead of just readjusting the damn scale to zero (what was that retard thinking?!)
the scientific community has been using SI forever in the states but they still have to convert before they go on tv so they dont scare anyone with all that "exotic and foreign" measurement.
as far as the game goes, straight historical panels all the way no question about it. i understand why they initially went with miles etc but come on. dont play to the LCD have a little faith that people can get it :)
if you are capable enough to fly around and get kills you have what it takes to understand what every european and asian 3rd grader knows about measurement. good grief.
:rolleyes:
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wohow! Well said Mrfish :D
Think we learn it when we're 6 though ;)
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Fish you should know base 10 numbering is out of date and archaic as well.
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hehehe....outstanding, very funny :) My opinion, screw the rest of the world, let them get in step with us. Everyone should speak english, use our measuring system and all be governed by some form of democracy. Why you ask? Because we've shown it to be the best way to live in almost every respect relative to the way much of "the rest of the world" does it, thats why. If it aint broke, dont fix it. That aside, if possible, I'd like to see realistic cockpits, not because its a better system, just because thats the way it was.
CRASH
"i aint chaingin mah mezhermints!!! - they is u.s. guverment spayshul so that means they is is strate frum the baby jeezus jus' like the constitooshun and futball - amen!!"
no, let's not use systems of tens lets use 12's and the mile will be oh let's say some arbitrary length, 5 thousand whatever feet and of course farehnheit will show freezing at 32 instead of just readjusting the damn scale to zero (what was that retard thinking?!)
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Originally posted by Vortex
If it ever came to pass, as an option only please.
I definitely have no desire to fly cockpits that are that exact. Quite the contrary, I prefer a standard across the board like exists now.
Agreed. Germans, Italians, Japanese and Russians were used to reading their own language. I'm not. There are far more important things to do before training us in foreign languages, weights and measures.
- oldman
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It's not just 'eye candy', it's immersion for some people, which can be a huge attraction to the game.
roadkill.
Immersion is a word that is thrown around the same as realism.
Immersion comes from the combat, not the cockpit. If you feel the cockpit needs to be realistic to be truly "immersive" you are going to be disappointed for quite some time.
Someone wants metric in German planes because they feel it is offensive to have U.S. style guages in them. I can understand that (They are LW afterall). "Immersive"... I laugh at that.
Now.. what if HTC does model metric guages and makes it an option... but each aircraft with it modeled as an option requires a slot in an arena that has a fixed maximum number of aircraft... Do you make the change? Do you make it metric only instead?
Is this "fix" catering to a majority of HTC's customers or a minority? Would it be benificial to a majority or minority of their customers? How do you prioritize it after answering that?
I'm all for 100% accurate representation of every aspect of these aircraft. I'm just not willing to accept some of the potential tradeoffs. If HTC can do this without impacting the number of types of aircraft in the arenas.. then cool. If they can't... then not nearly so cool.
AKDejaVu
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Immersion comes from the combat, not the cockpit
Lets play in a wireframe world with 500 blue wireframed aircrafts fighting over 4 green wireframed terrains.
What about having the C205 camouflage for a P51?? Hey, camo is not immersion, right?
What about having red stars in the nationality markings of a P47??
Would u ask HTC to change these "deviations" or will u ask HTC to continue modeling new planes over'n over forgetting these mistakes?
What can I say... roadkill!
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Right mandoble... make it even more mellodramatic.
If you're in a fight, you are looking at the enemy plane. If you aren't.. you are doing something wrong. The things that make that better are what really matter.
How do you know you are about to stall... how do you know when your speed is dropping off... how do you know when you are too low. All those things are important... but the guages are the least relevant way to tell you. Ground effect, wind noise, stall warnings, buffetting, mushiness... overall feel. That is what matters because in a fight, you can't take your eye off of the enemy.
I wonder how many of the aces so many sing the praises of spent their time looking at guages during an engagement.
AKDejaVu
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Originally posted by Fatty
Fish you should know base 10 numbering is out of date and archaic as well.
pedal your hexadecimals elsewhere you cur
the current SI base ten system is just fine for learning as a common world standard and good for everyone, save math and computer dorks who want us thinking in intervals of 6 or 18 or whatever - they are just show-offs screw them :)
and FYI you pagans - the u.s. IS a metric country in every way that matters already. as for the 'foreign-ness' of the SI system i would submit: where do you think the system you are using now originated? sout' joisey?
the entire scientific community is on SI units with the exception, apparantly of people who designed the mars climate orbiter for nasa.
the old system is for lay-people and the unwashed masses only. you should shed the chains of that system and join the equanimious ranks of the SI annointed. ;)
remember....
mile=oppression, hatred, racism and anti-kittenism........kilometer=glorious freedom and equality
'kills me that people resist a common world system! yeah, fighting against a common system of measurement for the world - now that's vision!
or my favorite: "we gotta big militury so let THEM (ie. the rest of the globe) change by god...or we'll NUK-U-LATE 'em commie bastards"
'course if it's too much for you, ya know: "comprehendin'-like" i'll understand.
remember though....that little yyves or pierre the shy sensitive 98lb(44 kilos to the rest of us) artist in paris(and his 'partner') got it AND understand your system and language as a hobby. but if that doesnt bother you then ok. put back a cold coors 16ozer for me too hoss
;)
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Crash, you guys obviously learn nothing about other countries in school either, you're so in love with your self that you can't see past your own nose, maybe if you guys spent some time learning about other countries, cultures, political system and humans, you would actually see that USA is not the center of the earth nor is it the most developed country in the world in any aspect, sure you got nukes, do you think that's a good thing?
How many people in % can read in the US? No matter what numbers you find there and ensure you that many countries will have FAR greater %. How many people are homeless in the US? How many people live on welfare? You call all these things good and highly developed? Once again, you only see as far as your own nose goes, you care nothing nor know nothing about the people who doesn't have the same standards as you, and yet, you call USA the perfect country?
How many % of the world uses Metric System? 70? 80? more?
Wich system was there first do you think? Which one is being used most? Wich one is being used by all scentists?
Please don't give me any crap about USA being the most developed perfect non faulty country of the world, you'll make me throw up.
Now, I've got nothing what so ever against USA, it's a good country overall, if it weren't for you guys over there who sacrifce your lives for Europe in two world wars, the earth would most likely be a much worse place, I don't meen to offend anyone, just burst the bubble of USA being free from errors for those of you who think that.
Going back to the real thread, Dejavu, if you were European you'd understand, obviously, you don't understand now. We don't think of 400Mph being pasat 600Km/h, we think of it as 400 and thus quite slow for a plane, it's got nothing to do with eyecandy, it's got to do with feeling.
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What I mean with immersion is not limited at all to gauges.
Much better graphics effect, much more detailed damage modeling and so on are things that make u feel inside a plane, even without knowing a bit about aerodynamics.
U prefer to use the available resources making more and more billion polygon planes while representing a damaged aileron with the absence of the aileron, a hit with a small sprite, a fire with... ...no comments about the fire, and so on.
Wilbus, u forgot a crucial question... ...What % can write in proper english? ;)
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And what can you do with nukes now, other than shove them up your ass.
Practically worthless.
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Originally posted by Wilbus
How many people in % can read in the US? No matter what numbers you find there and ensure you that many countries will have FAR greater %.
Far greater? Just what do you think the literacy rate is in the US, anyway? I mean, you're from another country, you must know everything about us, right?
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PUNT
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About 97% in the US above the age of 15 can read or write. Over 99% in Sweden above the age of 15 can read and write.
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If we're gonna continue this discussion let' bring it to the O'club.
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Hard to see why there's even a discusion about this.
AH; and the AH community prides it's self on realism. That's why we have those arsebleedingly annoying radar/strat/CV tirades so regularly.
All that, and some people *want* fake cockpits?
Well, that's consistent....not!
That's immersive.....not!
Besides, unitary worries aren't really an issue in a well crafted cockpit; as pretty much the world over an instument needle at 12 o'clock is half way there, an instrument needle pegged at three o'clock is going flat out/full/too hot/ too high/take your pick.
This isn't rocket science; are some people really trying to say they're computing IAS to TAS in their head in combat to see where their advantage is?
Now, different lettering (Russian, Jap)...that I could understand being ----> <----- of a problem......but if yanks managed it in Spain, France, Britain and China then they can manage it in the comfort of their own home.
It's bringing the pilot into the equation.....almost as much fun as modelling fatigue!
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Wow, note to self, Seeker has some whipass BBS sense, and delivers the banter 10 fold. WTG.
Knock yourself out AKDeJa. It's all "roadkill" anyway. Explain the eye candy realism thing again?
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To get back on topic... :)
How hard can it be? Just introduce a toggle between mph/feet and km/h like the one for tracers on/off. Use the same gauges but scale the values for speed and climb before displaying them. No need to rebuild the whole 3d cockpit.
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Got a BA in Political Science, spent 4 years studying the rest of the world. Some countries do some things better but all things considered no one even compares to the U.S. Political and Economic model, not even in the same league. You and I both know that the statistics your quoting are faulty and not representative of the American experience for many reasons. No need to be jealous, just move here like everyone else :)
CRASH
Originally posted by Wilbus
Crash, you guys obviously learn nothing about other countries in school either, you're so in love with your self that you can't see past your own nose, maybe if you guys spent some time learning about other countries, cultures, political system and humans, you would actually see that USA is not the center of the earth nor is it the most developed country in the world in any aspect, sure you got nukes, do you think that's a good thing?
How many people in % can read in the US? No matter what numbers you find there and ensure you that many countries will have FAR greater %. How many people are homeless in the US? How many people live on welfare? You call all these things good and highly developed? Once again, you only see as far as your own nose goes, you care nothing nor know nothing about the people who doesn't have the same standards as you, and yet, you call USA the perfect country?
How many % of the world uses Metric System? 70? 80? more?
Wich system was there first do you think? Which one is being used most? Wich one is being used by all scentists?
Please don't give me any crap about USA being the most developed perfect non faulty country of the world, you'll make me throw up.
Now, I've got nothing what so ever against USA, it's a good country overall, if it weren't for you guys over there who sacrifce your lives for Europe in two world wars, the earth would most likely be a much worse place, I don't meen to offend anyone, just burst the bubble of USA being free from errors for those of you who think that.
Going back to the real thread, Dejavu, if you were European you'd understand, obviously, you don't understand now. We don't think of 400Mph being pasat 600Km/h, we think of it as 400 and thus quite slow for a plane, it's got nothing to do with eyecandy, it's got to do with feeling.
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Prove that they are faulty, show my the true numbers and I might belive you. You might have studied it for 4 years but to me it seems as if you learnt nothing. Were your teachers like this too?
If you wanna live in your little bubble believing USA is the top notch of the world when it comes to everything, sure, do that, some americans might agree with you but the rest of the world will just walk away laughing.
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Originally posted by CRASH
Got a BA in Political Science, spent 4 years studying the rest of the world. Some countries do some things better but all things considered no one even compares to the U.S. Political and Economic model, not even in the same league. You and I both know that the statistics your quoting are faulty and not representative of the American experience for many reasons. No need to be jealous, just move here like everyone else :)
CRASH
You spent 4 years studying "the rest of the world", and this is what you "learned"? What were you doing when you were supposed to be in class?
Take this thread to the O club...I dare you...
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4 years only for Political Science?? Is that a joke or still unfinished?
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roadkille? How do you know what's immersive for someone else? For myself, the little things ARE immersive. From the way the prop looks when it's spinning to the fact that the control surfaces show movement in the game when you move the stick. I may not be checking out the control surfaces while I'm in combat, but you can bet your hairy heiny that I'm looking down at the guages to check at least my speed. And hell, I just love flying the planes, I even fly offline now and again just for the hell of it, and I do look at all the little stuff that make the sim great.
Now, go take your meds, have a pint of whatever's on the nitro tap, then go home and relax while watching one of those gay DVDs that you bought "for the wife". :D
SOB
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Dejavu, it ain't eye candy.
Potentially, we could have all planes have a standard 3d model - shared by every plane - and then use the icons as identifiers. Below the eye candy, there'd be the various flight models of course.
Bit melodramatic, sure :). But it does illustrate the point.
Having *realistic* measurement system in a flight sim doesn't appear to be eye candy to me. It's about pure numbers, not about something pretty to look at.
Having said that, I would be at a loss if I switched to the metric system. Am so used to the Imperial one that a climb rate of 750m/m would confuse me. Heh.
Having it in Imperial sticks out though. it's like a sore point that really detracts immersion. it's sort of like having one of those studmuffing*tt Barney Dolls right next to the gunsight.
Bit melodramatic again. Is nice to exaggerate :D. No, it's extremely pleasing and overwhelmingly satisfying to exaggerate.
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Originally posted by StSanta
Having it in Imperial sticks out though. it's like a sore point that really detracts immersion. it's sort of like having one of those studmuffing*tt Barney Dolls right next to the gunsight.
So, what's this do for your immersion? :D
(http://www.matthoffman.cc/bb/gunsight.bmp)
SOB
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If you don't like Hitech's game just don't play it go where they have what you want. This looks pretty simple to me. I like it and I will stay and play it like it is, and I bet most of the others will too.
ab8aac out
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LOL, nice interjection aac. From here on, I will be advised that input is unwarranted, and will contiue to fly the strait and narrowminded.
SOB
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I read and post on the bb's when I have time and for fun, not to argue politics, thats work. I have niether the time nor inclination to educate you, no offense, I just dont feel like writin' a book here. That may be something you could learn from Americans, we understand that no one owes us anything, when we want to be educated we do it ourselves, we dont ask somoeone else to do it for us. As for the rest of the world walking away laughing, seems to me the rest of the world is bangin' at the front door tryin' to get in.
You want to argue welfare? How bout the poorest of Americans has more to eat and better shelter than the middle classes of most countries, to include the Liberal Democracies you refer. It's all in how you measure things, how you use your statistics, as I'm sure you're well aware, they can be used to substantiate almost any position, but at the end of the day we have the best standard of living in the world and best opportunity for social and economic advancement. Most of the world who cares too understands that which is why they are all bangin' at the front door to get in, and have been for 150 years.
Hmm...just read another one of your posts alluding to literacy rates amoung those below the age of majority. Do you have any idea how many of those American children are the children of imigrants and dont speak english as the primary language in they're home? So, now what does that stat measure? Does it measure the effectiveness of the U.S. school system as I believe your attempting to do or does it simply measure the cultural diversity of America? Thats what I'm refering to when I say that your statistics are faulty and dont represent the American experience. Geez, I'm startin' to write that book I didnt want to:)
You alluded to the Swiss before, I gotta tell ya I've lived in Germany and I've had countless political discussions with people from all over the globe and by far the most critical people regarding America from the various liberal democracies are the Swiss. They seem almost driven to convince anyone they can that they're superior to America....you wouldnt be swiss, would you?
CRASH
Originally posted by Wilbus
Prove that they are faulty, show my the true numbers and I might belive you. You might have studied it for 4 years but to me it seems as if you learnt nothing. Were your teachers like this too?
If you wanna live in your little bubble believing USA is the top notch of the world when it comes to everything, sure, do that, some americans might agree with you but the rest of the world will just walk away laughing.
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Originally posted by Wilbus
Crash, you guys obviously learn nothing about other countries in school either, you're so in love with your self that you can't see past your own nose, maybe if you guys spent some time learning about other countries, cultures, political system and humans, you would actually see that USA is not the center of the earth nor is it the most developed country in the world in any aspect, sure you got nukes, do you think that's a good thing?
<<< Why shucks no Wilbus. We here in the US of A are jest backwoods inbred idiots with the exception of them there smart liberals from San Francisco like Mr. Fish. And I don't think America is perfect. On the contrary, I think we have much work to do in many areas to achieve racial equality, proper education and Goverment reform, among other issues. Thank God we live in a Nation where we can at least discuss these things and work for change. I WOULD make a comment about your generalization of ALL Americans being the same way, but why state the obvious? As far as learning about other cultures? Uh...Who spends more tourist dollars abroad than any other Nation? Personally I've visited 17 countries on 3 continents including the year I spent in combat in Viet Nam, but no, I've never been to Europe. Why? Because ALL Europeans hate Americans. After all, generalizations are fair if used as a criticism, right, Wilbus?>>>
How many people in % can read in the US? No matter what numbers you find there and ensure you that many countries will have FAR greater %. How many people are homeless in the US? How many people live on welfare? You call all these things good and highly developed? Once again, you only see as far as your own nose goes, you care nothing nor know nothing about the people who doesn't have the same standards as you, and yet, you call USA the perfect country?
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How many % of the world uses Metric System? 70? 80? more?
Wich system was there first do you think? Which one is being used most? Wich one is being used by all scentists?
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Please don't give me any crap about USA being the most developed perfect non faulty country of the world, you'll make me throw up.
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Now, I've got nothing what so ever against USA, it's a good country overall, if it weren't for you guys over there who sacrifce your lives for Europe in two world wars, the earth would most likely be a much worse place, I don't meen to offend anyone, just burst the bubble of USA being free from errors for those of you who think that.
<<< I can tell you hold no anamosity against the USA. Also I can tell you aren't envious and intimitaded by us, and the gratefulness of you and so many other Europeans just shines right through in your Anti-American posts. And thank you so very much for recognizing that many more Americans died in WW1 and WW2 defending Europe.Thank you, Welbus, for bursting my bubble and pointing out the many ills of not only American society but Americans too. >>>
Going back to the real thread, Dejavu, if you were European you'd understand, obviously, you don't understand now. We don't think of 400Mph being pasat 600Km/h, we think of it as 400 and thus quite slow for a plane, it's got nothing to do with eyecandy, it's got to do with feeling.
<<< I'm amazed that people can take something as innocent as the gauges on a pretend airplane and turn it into an Anti-American thread, but the REAL kicker is when Weebus says "You have to be European to understand." What a cop-out! That's like saying "You have to be African American to understand racism," or "you have to be a veteran to understand war," or any one of a million special interest cop-outs.
Weebles, why in Holy Hell are you posting on this board? There MUST be a zillion Anti-American boards out there, ask Mr.Fish for directions to one of them. I thought these boards were about Aces High, not how crappy America is. And no, I'm not a super-patriot, and in fact I probably am more politically aligned with Mr. Fish than he might believe. I just think this isn't the proper forum for political discussions, so take it somewhere else, OK?>>>
Sincerely,
Elfenwolf
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Elfenwolf, if you read my whole thread you'd know that I said US was a good country, I have nothing what so ever against it and I've even thought about moving there (Alaska) but only for Bush flying. The only thing I am against are stupid people who think that USA is the best, most advanced country when it comes to everything in the world. You don't seem to be one of those. But please understand what I typed before, I have nothing, what so ever against USA, it IS a good country and without you Europe would probarly be under a Nazi regim now wich would be bad for the whole world.
Now, I wasn't the one who started the whole thing with USA being superior everything else and that everybody should adjust after USA, that was Crash, so if ya gonna come down on someone, it's him.
Allso, I did not say that every american think that USA is the center of the earth, most of you don't, and almost everybody who I've had the pleasure to meet during my years in the online community are smart and educated.
Once again, read everything before coming down on me, allso read Crash's posts and you'll understand why I write what I do Sir.
Sweden stayed neutral threwout the war, it was Swizerland who held most, if not all of the Jewish gold. I for one think many of the things Sweden did (rather didn't do) during WW2 sucks, we should have hit the germans in the back when they invaded Norway from OUR COUNTRY, that just proves that the government in Sweden is as cowerdice as allways and allways follows the "strongest". This sucks.
I have said nothing about americans being stupid, I have said nothing Anti american, and I have never ever writen an anti american post, some of my best friends on this forum and in AH are from the US, some of them I've known for more then 8 years!
You alluded to the Swiss before, I gotta tell ya I've lived in Germany and I've had countless political discussions with people from all over the globe and by far the most critical people regarding America from the various liberal democracies are the Swiss. They seem almost driven to convince anyone they can that they're superior to America....you wouldnt be swiss, would you?
Hehe, and you say you're educated Crash? If you were, you would know that SWEDEN and SWIZERLAND ARE NOT THE SAME. Sweden is a country (quite long and thin) In the north between Finland and Norway, Switzerland is WAY down South from us, did you ever study Geography in school?
Elfenwolf, think it is enough that you read Crash's last post and I think you will understand what I am talkin about. Once again, you, like many other (most) seem educated, smart and know what it's all about, you know about other countries etc, then there are people like Crash here, who live after the rule that every and all countries in the world should adjust to USA because USA is superior in all and every aspects, every person in the world are banging at the door to get in, every country and government adore USA for their political and econimical standing.
I said nothing about bursting your buble Elfen, you don't seem to be living in one. I am bursting Crash's (wich seems to be a lost cause since he won't even differ from Swedish and Swiss people).
Take care.
Ps. I am FAR from Anti American, my dream is to go to Canada and become a Bush flier/flying fire fighter. I wouldn't go to a country I don't like, although Canada is not US, Alaska would be just as good, which is US.
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Elfen, I understand if you didn't read all posts in here, I sure as hell wouldn't read 50 posts either.
This is what I am refering to, this was the first post from "Crash".
hehehe....outstanding, very funny My opinion, screw the rest of the world, let them get in step with us. Everyone should speak english, use our measuring system and all be governed by some form of democracy. Why you ask? Because we've shown it to be the best way to live in almost every respect relative to the way much of "the rest of the world" does it, thats why. If it aint broke, dont fix it. That aside, if possible, I'd like to see realistic cockpits, not because its a better system, just because thats the way it was.
Hope it will give you some perspective to why I wrote what I wrote, wich was mainly intended to Crash and not the whole US community and the US country.
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I think some of you think it is fairly simple to go back and revise (60+?) cockpits to change the gauges around and then add in the ability to switch between the two cockpits.
The 3D shape of the cockpit itself is all part of the overall 3D model. The game incorporates what many people know as LOD models (and does it quite well I might add), and as you zoom in closer the plane becomes more detailed. In the end, you can eventually zoom right into the cockpit and could potentially fly from that point. Not sure if you would want to.
As far as I know, there are two sets of guages, or atleast one set with a few additional ones... like the Spit's guages don't look the same as the P51s... atleast not to me.
Anyway, what it all boils down to is time. I really do not think HT, Superfly, Natedog and Pyro have time to go back over each cockpit, place new instruments into the cockpit and then go back and write a new function that allows you to not only use these newer metric instruments, but also to convert from Imperial to Metric.
They are much busier busting their chops to get other details into the game, the much cried for strat for instance, and newer planes, etc.
When HTC decides it's time to go back and revise what's currently in there, then I'm sure they'll take the time to get metric instruments included too. But to go back and change each of the 190s, 109s, etc, requires a lot of work and development time which could be used to bring you more interesting things such as submersibles, troopers running around with a rifle (and to defend themselves from Fat Dirty B*tches), etc.
Remember, nothing is set in stone. It is, however, against the entire customer base best interests to go back and spend some odd amount of time on re-working things when HTC already has a lot of much bigger and important things on their plate.
-SW
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Originally posted by Wilbus
Elfen, I understand if you didn't read all posts in here, I sure as hell wouldn't read 50 posts either.
This is what I am refering to, this was the first post from "Crash".
Hope it will give you some perspective to why I wrote what I wrote, wich was mainly intended to Crash and not the whole US community and the US country.
Damn Wilbus, Now I feel bad because we've already launched the Nukes. Oh well, Crash is the one who entered the coordinates so there's a good chance we'll nuke Switzerland instead of Sweden(one E this time BTW).
My point of trying to compare Sweden to the US is like comparing apples and oranges. My daughter goes to High School with kids from Mexico, Cambodia, Viet Nam, Russia and quite a few other Nations. None of these kids can speak English very well, but their parents brought them here to seek out a better life and realize their potential.
Although I'm one of the very few who didn't display the American flag after the events of 9-11, and I find many aspects of Americanism revolting, I'm proud of the fact the USA, founded by immigrants, still allows people in who yearn for a better life.
Hey, my ambition is to move to Tahiti and lead a revolution there against French Imperialism, hang out on a tropical beach drinking Rum and watching topless Hula girls play Twister with each other....After all, the French will surrender quicker than anybody else.
Oh, and BTW- I learned more about geography playing Risk and Axis and Allies then I ever did in 8th grade geography class.
Ciao,
Elfenwolf
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Ouch, gotto have some pretty bad geography classes over there ;)
Not comparing Sweden to US, liek you say it can't be done, and what US does with taking in people from Russia, Kambodia, vietnam etc is GREAT, if I am not misstaking, they will get a way better life their, Russia went down the drain after the cold war, many other countries have been war torne as US offers help. Sweden takes in alot of immigrants from war torn countries is aswell, in % we (no numbers so I can't back it up) probarly take in about the same number as US, mostly from the present war torn countries, there is no way Sweden would have resources to take in as big a number as US does. I think it is great that your daughter goes together with immigrants, it will teach both her, and them alot more about eachother, and it will teach them first class english.
to display the American flag in the open, is great IMO, you guys over there can walk around with an american T-shirt without being called rasist. Do that with a Swedish flag in Sweden, and you're not far from getting labeled rasist right away, all countries have its up's and down's, USA aswell and I think you agree with me on that. Crash doesn't.
Btw, the geograpy thing wasn't ment to you either, this has more or less become a privat disucussion between me and a guy who seems to think that his country has no errors what so ever and all other billions of people in the world should adjust to a relativ small number of people just because they are the most powerfull.
To you, and to the rest who CAN see past your own nose.
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anti-american? i'm as american as apple pie amigo.
i want our country to be at the cutting edge and will taunt every last american into learning to handle progress if it's the last thing i do. i cant stand people who dont question the actions of our country - who is driving this thing anyway some fat-assed liar spin roadkillter or you joe q. public?
americans tend to have an ego that is prohibitive toward certain things.
being balanced is being able to assess your weakness and learn from others' strengths - not just sitting back saying we're #1 all day. there's no quicker way to being #2.
'unamerican' are the slack-jawed yokels who blindly follow everything handed to them and resist change in favor of stagnation and mindless obedience.
half of you would bow down if a senator walked by... like they are a king or something.
america just isnt right to mrfish unless there's a little whiff of rebelion in the air. i live in a country of equality where the people fought to be in charge not the politicians. let the people be the celebrity not the servant politicians.
i dont answer to the bureaucrats or the mind fu*&ers that dominate the media - only my understanding of what's right.
if that's unamerican - sign me up.
PS- i have been to switzerland 4 times in the last 2 years - it's almost a home away from home. it's a great country with 26(26?) very unique "states" cannons i think they call them - and in many ways they adhere to the doctrine our forefathers intended us to adhere to - leave local government in charge of local issues and dont centralize everything.
of course we americans couldnt have possibly have departed from our founding principals because we are too damned righteous right?
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...
the more real they look the better.
we flying in an illusion of WWII aircraft, so why not an illusion a bit
closer to what it visually looked like?
Read an interesting suggestion somewhere inside that pile of
political shi*.
"1 cockpit redone per every patch"
I say this is the way to go. Slowly but continuously.
it's eye candy, so what? No denying the candy is sweet.
"God is in the details" who said that? Pascal? don't remember.
Anyway, AH immersion also is with the details. We may not all
want to be immersed in a WWII WAR surroundings, but I'm
pretty sure most everybody wants to be immersed in a WWII PLANE
illusion.
New logo on the mugs:
"1 cockpit per every patch"
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Oh My God- QUICK,turn on CNN. The US just launched a nuclear strike against Swaziland. Damn, Crash, what the hell did the Swazis do to piss you off??? Breed ugly goats???
Hey Mr. Fish, my gut instinct was right- we're pretty close politically. "Question Authority" was my favorite bumper sticker too, right next to the one that says "Honk If You're Horny." I'm surprised you aren't in prison yet.
As a new user I'm struck by how much more of an international community there is on Aces High than on Air Warrior or Fighter Ace. Air Warrior had a strong British presence, especially in the beginning, but AH seems to be played by people from all over the world. I'd be curious to know just how many different countries are represented here. Hey, we might be the Olympics of Flight Sims. (BTW, Wilbus, the USA beat Switzerland today in curling. Serves all you Swedes right.)
For what it's worth I can't see the numbers anyway, and I can barely see which way the needle points, so I don't care if the numbers are metric or not.
Peace out,
Elfenwolf
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Wild thread.
MrFish. kick that congressman for me, will yah?
On topic.. I'm quite happy with the cockpits we have now. Whats the beef? ;)
As far as an option for cockpit readings for the metric minded.. hey, that's cool. But what other improvements will be sidelined while this is implemented? What other subtle lilttle system things will be impacted... like Icon ranges? Range info on tank and ship artillery sights?
How's this gonna effect system inputs for arena settings and terrain maps? Will some poor CM lock in wind sheer settings that force the mars probe to vanish?
And what's the metric measurment on SOB's gunsight molls tush?
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Yup, Sweden is definately not switzerland, mistype on my part. I'm gonna relay a personal story or two to make my point here, and dont take it wrong, I'm not bashing Sweden, never been there actually so how could I anyway. About 15 years ago I was tending bar while in my first year of college and in walks 5 people of obvious foriegn decent. Being the bartender, I have to talk to them and they seem nice so I start a conversation with them. They're all Swedes working for a European airline, flight crew, and are here on a layover out of Newark IAP. Almost right off the bat and without provocation these people, 3 men and 2 woman start bashing Americans. Americans are ignorant, poorly educated, are this, are that, on and on. I listen to this, nod a few times, give'em a few hmm's and they continue. Now being the bartender I know better than to engage customers in political debate so I dont say much, but of course, I cant get over how incredibly rude and obnoxious these people are. I spent two years living in Germany and visited a few other European countries and I would never even think of walking into a German bar and openly bashing German culture, the political system, or the German people, even if thats how I felt. The most ignorant trailer park raised redkneck amoung us, and being military there were more than a few, would not have behaved so poorly. Imagine walking into someones house as a dinner guest and insulting the host in that fashion, and these people were going on about how superior they were....incredible! I simply made a mental note of it and moved on. Over the years I've had the oportunity to meet and communicate with people from Sweden and for some reason they all seem to feel obliged to offer up these types of sentiment without being asked. Is there something going on in the primary schools over there that has to do with comparing Sweden to America all the time? Why do you people all seem to be spouting the same flawed statistics, all the while sounding incredibly pompous? I'm inclined to believe it's nothig but some type of a national jelousy, why bother comparing yourselves to the U.S. in the first place, much less institutionalize that flawed comparison? I understand to a certain extent, after all what have the Swedes contributed towards shaping World destiny? Not much I'd say. Definately not anything but a bit player on the world stage. I understand the hurt feelings but in attempting to convince the rest of the world that you as a country are really more than a bit player is one thing, and not such a bad idea, but actually having convinced yourselves of it is really sad.
And in response to your concern about Americans thinking that we are the center of the earth.......ALL THINGS CONSIDERED THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA IS THE BEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD FOR A GREAT MANY REASONS......PERIOD.
CRASH
Originally posted by Wilbus
Elfenwolf, if you read my whole thread you'd know that I said US was a good country, I have nothing what so ever against it and I've even thought about moving there (Alaska) but only for Bush flying. The only thing I am against are stupid people who think that USA is the best, most advanced country when it comes to everything in the world. You don't seem to be one of those. But please understand what I typed before, I have nothing, what so ever against USA, it IS a good country and without you Europe would probarly be under a Nazi regim now wich would be bad for the whole world.
Now, I wasn't the one who started the whole thing with USA being superior everything else and that everybody should adjust after USA, that was Crash, so if ya gonna come down on someone, it's him.
Allso, I did not say that every american think that USA is the center of the earth, most of you don't, and almost everybody who I've had the pleasure to meet during my years in the online community are smart and educated.
Once again, read everything before coming down on me, allso read Crash's posts and you'll understand why I write what I do Sir.
Sweden stayed neutral threwout the war, it was Swizerland who held most, if not all of the Jewish gold. I for one think many of the things Sweden did (rather didn't do) during WW2 sucks, we should have hit the germans in the back when they invaded Norway from OUR COUNTRY, that just proves that the government in Sweden is as cowerdice as allways and allways follows the "strongest". This sucks.
I have said nothing about americans being stupid, I have said nothing Anti american, and I have never ever writen an anti american post, some of my best friends on this forum and in AH are from the US, some of them I've known for more then 8 years!
Hehe, and you say you're educated Crash? If you were, you would know that SWEDEN and SWIZERLAND ARE NOT THE SAME. Sweden is a country (quite long and thin) In the north between Finland and Norway, Switzerland is WAY down South from us, did you ever study Geography in school?
Elfenwolf, think it is enough that you read Crash's last post and I think you will understand what I am talkin about. Once again, you, like many other (most) seem educated, smart and know what it's all about, you know about other countries etc, then there are people like Crash here, who live after the rule that every and all countries in the world should adjust to USA because USA is superior in all and every aspects, every person in the world are banging at the door to get in, every country and government adore USA for their political and econimical standing.
I said nothing about bursting your buble Elfen, you don't seem to be living in one. I am bursting Crash's (wich seems to be a lost cause since he won't even differ from Swedish and Swiss people).
Take care.
Ps. I am FAR from Anti American, my dream is to go to Canada and become a Bush flier/flying fire fighter. I wouldn't go to a country I don't like, although Canada is not US, Alaska would be just as good, which is US.
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And in response to your concern about Americans thinking that we are the center of the earth.......ALL THINGS CONSIDERED THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA IS THE BEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD FOR A GREAT MANY REASONS......PERIOD.
I givé up, you just won't ever get, keep living in your little bubble thinking that Sweden is in the center of Europe where people speak soime sort of german sounding language and wear lederhosen. You might have studied some things but sure as hell nothing about other countries then USA.
Have fun with your life.
Elfen, Swedish women got beat in Curling by the US aswell so now you have 2 things to teas us for! #1 Swizerland lost, #2 Sweden lost! :D
Btw Crash, for those swedes you have met, yes, that sucks to come in and start bashing a country/country men like that and I would never do it, I know quite many who will though so might very well be a Swediush thing. WHat I've done in here is not to bash USA, I've said many times that I like the country, and many if not most things about it. However, to think it is the #1 best country in the world for almost every reason is just pure foolish, so I've only been, more or less, bashing you.
That's final I have to say about this boring messed up lost cause subject, succeeded in Hijacking my own thread.
Kweassa, sounds great to me, don't eve have to start with LW planes :D
What I moslty want is some option to have metric system wich would, no matter what anybody else say, strenghten my immersion.
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Back to the topic: Hell yes, I'd like to see metric/ATA gauges in the cockpits of Regia Aeronautica, Luftwaffe, Russian and IJN planes :)
Even Warbirds has them :rolleyes: And the idea of "one cockpit redone every patch" is good. "One old skin redone/improved every patch" would be good as well.
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THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA IS THE BEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD FOR A GREAT MANY REASONS......PERIOD.
Even a small country like Spain has much better public services (health, transports, education, etc) than USA. I've been there for several months (business) and it is not on par with Europe in any living aspect. And, please, dont tell me u have more CVs than us :D
To be correct, you should change your statement by:
THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA IS THE RICHEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD FOR A GREAT MANY REASONS......PERIOD.
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Originally posted by CRASH
That may be something you could learn from Americans, we understand that no one owes us anything, when we want to be educated we do it ourselves, we dont ask somoeone else to do it for us.
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My God, you have no idea how unintentionally funny you are do you? Could this be the policy of the US schooling system too perhaps? "Educate yourselves kids, you are Americans"
You want to argue welfare? How bout the poorest of Americans has more to eat and better shelter than the middle classes of most countries, to include the Liberal Democracies you refer.
[/b]
Lets see…apparently homeless people in the US has more to eat and better shelter than the middle class of "most countries"? What did you say…4 years in political science was it? I guess you were one of those Americans educating yourself...
Do you have any idea how many of those American children are the children of imigrants and dont speak english as the primary language in they're home? So, now what does that stat measure? Does it measure the effectiveness of the U.S. school system as I believe your attempting to do or does it simply measure the cultural diversity of America?
[/b]
You know, the more I read of your posts, the more I find myself staring at the screen in disbelief, while the phrase "4 years in political science" echoes through my head. Do you REALLY mean, that poor literacy rates among american children is nothing but a good indication of cultural diversity? What then could we/you learn from Ghana?
Yup, Sweden is definately not switzerland, mistype on my part.
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Yeah, "misstype", because you sure didnt confuse the two countries did you? I mean, after 4 years studying "the rest of the world" in political science, that would be kinda embarrassing. Besides, its easy to MISSTYPE Sweden and Switzerland.
Why do you people all seem to be spouting the same flawed statistics, all the while sounding incredibly pompous? I'm inclined to believe it's nothig but some type of a national jelousy, why bother comparing yourselves to the U.S. in the first place, much less institutionalize that flawed comparison? I understand to a certain extent, after all what have the Swedes contributed towards shaping World destiny? Not much I'd say. Definately not anything but a bit player on the world stage. I understand the hurt feelings but in attempting to convince the rest of the world that you as a country are really more than a bit player is one thing, and not such a bad idea, but actually having convinced yourselves of it is really sad.
And in response to your concern about Americans thinking that we are the center of the earth.......ALL THINGS CONSIDERED THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA IS THE BEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD FOR A GREAT MANY REASONS......PERIOD.
[/b]
After this brilliant analysis from Mr 4-years-studying-the-rest-of-the-world, what could possibly be left to say? Sweden, or any other country criticizing the US, does so out of one single motivation, jealousy. Whatever bad anyone from Sweden or any other country has to say about the US, its based on flawed statistics. The US is the best country in the world "for a great many reasons…period."
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If one wants to have a "realistic" feeling of flying a WW2 AC (whatever german or us or...) the gauges (and the whole cockpit) play a role surely. If I fly a P51D and it would have metric gauges due to the fact that imperial gauges are not modeled I hardly could believe I'm sitting in the Mustang.
Every little thing that brings an improvement or brings the AH AC nearer to a real AC is welcome. The only thing to do is to prioritize all the valid suggestions (and metric gauges are valid) and that surely is the task that HTC has to and will manage.
BTW it is totally unnecessary to discus the pros ans cons of the imperial system (there are no pros :D ) neither to discuss if the USA is the best country of the world (that's germany anyway :D ).
Did I said that? ... ups, I better duck and cover. :rolleyes:
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Deudle, it's the way you say it not just that you say it ;)
I agree, metric system in a P51 would suck, how do you think (do you fly LW alot?) for LW pilots only seeing MPH in our planes? I even think that GB has started going over to Metric system.
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Thx Wilbus :) (BTW my name is Duedel not Deudle - what ever this means in swedish :D )
I started with WB offline 4 months ago. Then I saw AH and I enjoyed it much more than WB. The only thing I was asking me at that time was:
AH looks better, AH feels better, AH is better but why does AH don't model metric gauges although the developers came from WB? To cut a long story short, YES I want them (not because mainly I fly FW190A5, because its more realistic) but as i said before it depends on other things that might be done first and this is up to HTC only to decide what will bring the most improvement to their simulation - I believe realistic gauges are not at the top of the "most important to do list". But for me it's not questionable if we'll get them or not. It's only a matter of time.
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My appologize for misspelling, there's been alot of that going on in forum lately ;)
To me it is a question of IF, and I allready know that answer too, and it is NO. HT has, himself told me several times that it won't happen no matter how much we ask and beg. I won't give up though.
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You can twist my words around, pretending to be truly ignorant of what I'm talking about (I genuinely hope your pretending), you can twist the statistics to say what you think they should say but in the end the truth is the truth. For some reason Swedes seem to be fixated on comparing themselves with the United States, comparing apples to oranges. What was the stat Wilbus quoted? Something about the literacy rates amoung young americans and swedes being 97% and 99%. How rediculous (sorry Wilbus). First of all there's no study in the world that can ascertain literacy rates with that margin of error, 2%, I'd be embarassed to make such a rediculous statement. Its simply displays your ignorance in measuring and accurately modeling social phenomena. Seeing as how I now need to do your thinking for you, add the language differences of first generation immigrants and now what happend to your margin of error? I can just imagine what criteria your using and how you would possibly standardize the measuring criteria between the two different languages of our two countries.
You want to discuss homelessness, fine. Are you aware that some 90% of homeless people are mentally ill, and many refuse help? It is in fact a failing of our country that we dont provide for the mandatory care and feeding of our mentally ill in some curcumstances, but like the rest of the world we are indeed struggling with our health care system in general. Oh sure, it would be easy enough to simply increase the general tax rates to those of many of the other "more humane" liberal democracies but some how we find a 60% or higher general effective tax rate a bit much to swallow, doing greater harm to an economic model that lifts more people out of poverty than any other.
Ok, now that we've learned a bit more about the difference between homeless people and "poor people" on welfare lets discuss the general state of our welfare recipients in America. The average welfare/foodstamp/social aid recipient lives in more than adequate housing where heat and hot running water is of course required by law and, in my estimation though I have no statistics at hand to substantiate it, has more square footage of living space than many of the middle class dwellings of many European countries and certainly more living space than even affluent urban Japanese. They have two tv's and take in enough calories to warrent concern by the U.S. Department of health because the obesity rate amoung the poorest of americans is extraordinarily high and of national health concern. Not only do "poor" Americans have enough to eat, they are eating so much it endangers their health.
Now, would you care to discuss how children born of the poorest families and immigrants who come here with nothing but the clothes on their backs are made wealthy by anyone's standard through their own hard work and the opportunities that the vastly superior American economic model provides?
Is America the best at everything? Of course not. All things considered though, we are the best at most things that matter.
CRASH
Originally posted by Hortlund
After this brilliant analysis from Mr 4-years-studying-the-rest-of-the-world, what could possibly be left to say? Sweden, or any other country criticizing the US, does so out of one single motivation, jealousy. Whatever bad anyone from Sweden or any other country has to say about the US, its based on flawed statistics. The US is the best country in the world "for a great many reasons…period." [/B]
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This is the very last time I write about this...
You kind of prove my point of the literacy rate Crash, I said people above teh age of 15, not bellow, that means everybody BETWEEN 15 years and up to the oldest person in the country, didn't read english in school?
Poof
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Actually, we use to house and take care of our homeless here in the US....
They were booted out of the mental homes and other places they were staying at because the general public and the government decided the money would be better spent elsewhere....... like the war on drugs. And to date, that is a war the US government has been losing terribly.
We might be a great country to live in, but there's still idiots in power here.
-SW
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"I've asked HT many times during these past years why we can't have realistic gauges for the planes that should have them, 109's and 190's didn't fly around with a US dash board measuring MPH and feet, that's almost only the US and Brits who do (wich is the minority of the world but maybe majority of AH). "
Because you lost the bloody war! :D :D
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Doesnt change anything, it's still a deeply flawed statistic for all the reasons I cited earlier. I simply cant believe that you or Hortland don't understand that. I think you understand it very well, just choose to ignore it.
CRASH
Originally posted by Wilbus
This is the very last time I write about this...
You kind of prove my point of the literacy rate Crash, I said people above teh age of 15, not bellow, that means everybody BETWEEN 15 years and up to the oldest person in the country, didn't read english in school?
Poof
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:cool:
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Originally posted by VWE001
Because you lost the bloody war! :D :D
No, it was actually Switzerland who lost the war....;)
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VWE001 : Because you lost the bloody war!
And therefore we must use those weird, silly, ridicolous, absurd, inscrutable measuring that was invented by 4 english people after a big party and 24 5/8 gallons (<-gallons lol) of cider and whisky when england has beaten germany in a ancient soccer match?
:D
This is the cruelest punishment a man can imagine
P.S.
1 Gallon = 4,54 liter (english)
1 Gallon = 3,78 liter (amerikan)
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :D
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Originally posted by AKSWulfe
Actually, we use to house and take care of our homeless here in the US....
They were booted out of the mental homes and other places they were staying at because the general public and the government decided the money would be better spent elsewhere....... like the war on drugs. And to date, that is a war the US government has been losing terribly.
We might be a great country to live in, but there's still idiots in power here.
-SW
he's right.
now lets go waaaaay off topic ;)
there's also tremendous pressure from the left to keep people living in their own feces and on the street begging.
ex: every so often citizens here in SF get together to clean up some of our alleyways of the debris, beer bottles, needles, crackpipes, condoms and human waste left by bums.
this year there was a protest saying that the act of cleaning up was an insult to the bums and another attempt to criminalize homelessness. people came out and taunted and picketed the volunteer cleaners.
another program tried to assure that to get a place in the homeless shelter you had to register with the city so they could place you with a treatment plan or other health facillities-
again the homeless advocates came running to stop it saying "why dont you just put a yellow star on their lapels!" (they really said that)
homeless advocates are ugly, squatty, cat-eye glasses wearing women oops i mean 'womyn' who are really bitter with the world and never got a date in highschool and keep insisting that people have a right to kill themselves on your doorstep and that republicans sneak into your house at night and empty your bank account, put a bottle of mad dog 20/20 in yer hand and kick you out on the street.
they are only happy when they get to play mommy and have someone 'need' them. they could care less about the dignity of the individuals who are reduced to groveling for their fix.
one time they threatened to sue me for running a bum out of my car-stall and throwing away the piss-stained cardboard nest he'd errected as a home near my front bumper
- they said i had destroyed his home and thus his personal property and committed battery for insisting he leave after he said he didnt 'want to'.
thats how bad homlessness is now. we need to have the collective cheekbones to tell those lib debutantes that we dont give a damn what they think and take control of our cities.
also a lot of the bums out there are not drug addicts or alcoholics, they are just stark raving mad.
there isnt enough room for all of them so i suggest we take care of the poor loonies(the only real victims here) first with the resources we have and put the drunks to work making license plates or something til they get their act together.
giving them money every month and asking them how they feel about their fathers is doing NOTHING!
again - just another example of how we aren't on the ball but could be. next we could take charge and adopt the metric system then we wouldnt worry about translating historic panels! see back on topic! ;)
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man Mrfish, nice way of getting back :D
In a language you can read, yes, proabaly, although personally I enjoyed looking at the weird japanese and russian symbols in WB quite much :)
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hot thread :D
:eek:
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You all should know that AcesHigh is not the type of game to have accurate gage readouts like a simulator would have. AcesHigh is the type of game that has functional gage readouts like a good game would have
IL2 Sturmovik is a damned good combat flight simulator.
AcesHigh is not a combat flight simulator. AcesHigh is a game (and a damned good one).
Y
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Heh Yeager, i honestly don't find IL-2 to be much more realistic than AH. The difference between the two is too little to label one a game, and the other a simulator..