Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Widewing on March 07, 2002, 12:25:53 PM
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Last night, after a successful night of cherry picking in a C-Hog, I decided to take up an F4U-4 for my last sortie. I loaded it up with 2k of bombs and a wing full of rockets. Flying over to a low activity field, I dumped my bomb load, rocketed and strafed some acks. On the return trip, I climbed out to 25k to feel out the -4 at altitude. Nearing my field, I spot two dot near my height on an opposite heading. These turned out to be a Lanc, escorted by a Tempest. A quick check of my ammo state was not encouraging, with 16 rounds remaining. Spotting me, the Tempest heads in on a HO merge. I side-stepped his run and high yo-yo onto his 6, about d1.4 behind. I watch the Tempy ease into a high-speed climb. This was a mistake, because I closed down to d.8 in seconds, easily out-climbing the Hawker. He then steepens the climb, only exacerbating his position. Now just 400 yards behind, he hits the panic alarm and begins turning left. I follow without any sweat. Trying like hell to shake me off, he pushes his nose down and jinks like a madman. No joy there... Finally, he does a split-S and runs. However, we're still at 24k and the Corsair closes so quickly that I have to pull off throttle to avoid overshooting. Finally, at less than 200 yards, I fire my few remaining rounds. I see a few hit sprites and smoke begins. He's hit in the radiator. Down below, I see several enemy fighters and decide to disengage. The Tempy must have made it to an airfield or ditched, because I never got credit for a kill. A few more rounds would have made the difference....... Indeed, if I had more ammo, the fighters below (at 10-12k, I believe) would have had to deal with me as well.
Anyway, I was quite pleased to see the performance edge the F4U-4 has over the much vaunted Tempest at altitude. Other than the Me 262, there's nothing else that can get away from the -4 without resorting to a terminal velocity dive. Without question, if I were in a Mustang or Dora and stumbled upon an F4U-4 at Co-Alt, I'd be sweating bullets. Especially if it's near Co-E as well. Now I understand why it's perked so high.
Now, if HTC would give us the F4U-4B, with those 4 Hizookas, (just like the C-Hog) you'd have the ultimate BnZ monster.
My regards,
Widewing
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That's one way to remind, or learn, one of the a 'daft lads' that the Tempest (and Typhoon) weren't known for any kind of sterling hi alt performance. :)
Westy
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that high alt performance must be why its perked. because on the deck...la7's and p51's will eat ya alive. kinda like a 152...but even a 152 can be a monster on the deck sometimes.
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Originally posted by pimpjoe
that high alt performance must be why its perked. because on the deck...la7's and p51's will eat ya alive. kinda like a 152...but even a 152 can be a monster on the deck sometimes.
Well Joe, it's not just high alt performance, the F4U-4 is a monster on the deck too. It's 20 mph faster on the deck than the P-51, and about 5 mph faster than the La-7 down there too. In fact, the -4 out-performs the Mustang at just about every height, and climbs much better too. Now, the La-7 has a slight edge in speed between 2k and 5k. Above that, the -4 rules the roost.
Down in the weeds, the only fighter that has any chance of catching the -4 is the Tempest. However, it only has about a 5 mph advantage, so it had better be close when the chase starts, but if the -4 has any initial speed advantage, it'll take all day to catch it.
Clearly, HTC recognized that the F4U-4 was a superlative fighter, and easily out-classes the C-Hog, which can also dominate when flown wisely. If the -4 were perked like the C-Hog, the La-7, P-51 and Dora would become somewhat of a rarity as the -4 would soon be the ride of choice.
My regards,
Widewing
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disagree. i think -r should be a 10 perk ride. this prevents it from being common but still lets it have fun and get down n dirty.
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Well from what you wrote I think that you just met some unexperienced Tempie hotshot.... Im affraid that if you met someone who knows how to fly it you would be dead... But im not denying that F4U-4 is a beast... It is and it deserves to be perked...
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P47M :p
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......the shame of one of our big birds running them down and hammering them with eight 50-cal's! :p
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The 152 is a turd at low atl, I know cause I bounced 2 of em last tour in a Mossie and shot down 1 and outran the other. :D
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Originally posted by MadBirdCZ
Well from what you wrote I think that you just met some unexperienced Tempie hotshot.... Im affraid that if you met someone who knows how to fly it you would be dead... But im not denying that F4U-4 is a beast... It is and it deserves to be perked...
At 25k, it matters little what the skill level of the pilot is as long as the F4U-4 pilots knows his aircraft. With a speed advantage of nearly 40 mph, and twice the rate of climb, the Tempy is at a distinct disadvantage to the -4. It is just a case of forcing the Tempy to turn. With a considerable power advantage, breaking the Tempest down to a stall isn't especially difficult. Indeed, the Tempy had better get below 20k as fast as possible to have any chance. Add to this, the Corsair pilot can disengage at will. The Tempest is a great fighter, but a pilot has no business up above 25k. Too many of the better fighters out-perform it way up there.
Mustangs and Jugs rule the thin air. That is, if no F4U-4s show up.
As Frenchy points out, the antidote for the -4 is the P-47M or even the N model. Forget the Ta 152, it needs to get much higher to really shine. Better off with the Dora at 25k.
My regards,
Widewing
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Originally posted by Widewing
Mustangs and Jugs rule the thin air. That is, if no F4U-4s show up.
Hmm will have to point Orel to this thread... Maybe he would be interested in some 'tests' consisting of him driving the Tempest and 'someone else' driving the F4U-4... He is quite dedicated Temest driver... :)
But I agree that Tempest's performance degrades rapidly over 20k
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IMO, it is not right to compare a brand new F4U-4 with an old P 51D. P51H is a much closer to the -4, concerning the production dates.
As for Tempest, well, Brits used it for low alt AFAIK. They had Dweebfire XIV for high alt job, I believe.
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Don't compare Mk. XIV to F4U-4. Mk. XXI is a more direct comparison in terms of production and service dates.
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Well how would P-51H and Spit XXI compare to the F4U-4 then?
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Do not compare... Kill them All! :D
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We need a proper perk Tempest, like this one
Image from Neil Sterling at Butch2k's board
http://pub47.ezboard.com/fallboutwarfarefrm1
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Originally posted by Widewing
Anyway, I was quite pleased to see the performance edge the F4U-4 has over the much vaunted Tempest at altitude
Another man who think that fight is about airplanes ????
I had some nice ride in Typhoon 3 weeks ago and i shot down 2x F4U-4 in about 3 mins .... when i got 1st, second was there and he was dead in about 20 seconds (second snap shot chance).....
Man F4U can have better performance at that alt, but it does mean anything. If you think that TaB or BaZ is kind of fight, i have to disagree. Tempest isnt BaZ nor TaB ... its just Tempest and F4U-4 is just blue crap :D
Any way my best kill in tempest was 25k LA7 :cool:
i will not advise you from your dreams , stay in the F4U-4 and watch the Tempest Brothers ... or ..... Dai Feng dweebs
if you will judge airplane instead of pilot you will be surprised 1 day ..... and somebody will have a big SMILE
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Originally posted by Widewing
Better off with the Dora at 25k.
chmmm ... dora at 25k ... chmmmm chmmmm
Do you fly so high because you fight there or because you wanna be in the advantige ?
dora at 25k .. its real sadomaso
isnt it MINUS ?
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btw we dont have Tempest II
we have Tempest V
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Heh, try an F4U-4 vs a P-51B on the deck, in a slow stall fight.
The 51B can stay with the F4U-4 :). Even shoot it down, (this was in TA where you require lotta hits to down the enemy)
I have witnesses, too :)
But, to sum it all up:
Nothing beats the C202.
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Originally posted by StSanta
Nothing beats the C202.
actualy in 1 vs 1 its loving true...
but i will HO you till dead santa :)))))))))))))))
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Originally posted by StSanta
But, to sum it all up:
Nothing beats the C202.
True, very true... I just dicovered the sleeping blood thirsty devil within that plane...
Agree you have 19 kills and 2 deaths in it.... I have only 14 and 2 deaths.
But i killed two B17s in it in a single sortie (take-off, climb, 2x b17 dead, radiator hit, landing on field, successful exit) :D So question is - can you do 3? :D :p
to all 202 pilots out there
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Originally posted by Eaglecz
If you think that TaB or BaZ is kind of fight, i have to disagree.
I strongly agree with you here Eaglecz . Lucky for us many players don't seem to get this. I wince everytime I see someone say "model A is a BnZ plane and model B is a TnB" . The fundamentals of acm are the same no matter what plane you are flying .
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Heh 20 kills and 3 deaths now. Very hard to not get killed when ya have to fire 5 second solid hits into the targets.
Today: 1 kill, about 22 assists.
Yesterday I actually killed 4 enemies in one sortie with one load of ammo in it. That's the best I've done in AH with just one ammo load, considering the sort of munition.
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Originally posted by Eaglecz
Another man who think that fight is about airplanes ????
I had some nice ride in Typhoon 3 weeks ago and i shot down 2x F4U-4 in about 3 mins .... when i got 1st, second was there and he was dead in about 20 seconds (second snap shot chance).....
Man F4U can have better performance at that alt, but it does mean anything. If you think that TaB or BaZ is kind of fight, i have to disagree. Tempest isnt BaZ nor TaB ... its just Tempest and F4U-4 is just blue crap :D
Any way my best kill in tempest was 25k LA7 :cool:
i will not advise you from your dreams , stay in the F4U-4 and watch the Tempest Brothers ... or ..... Dai Feng dweebs
if you will judge airplane instead of pilot you will be surprised 1 day ..... and somebody will have a big SMILE
A couple of points.
There's little skill in cherry picking with an altitude advantage. I killed three Tiffies Monday night doing that. Likewise, I'm 18 and 2 doing the same thing with Corsairs (F4U-1 and F4U-1C, not using -4). Big deal. It's just an easy way to pad the numbers.
As for killing La-7s at high alt, so what? Lavochkins are dogs at 25k. I know, because I killed a brace of them up there in a P-51D two tours ago. Here's a challenge for you, Take your Tempest up to 30k, take on one of the experienced Jug drivers (such as Ammo or Sancho) and they will hand you your butt in a basket. Then tell me the aircraft means nothing. Moreover, if the plane is meaningless, why do you only fly 262s, Tempests and Tiffies? Why not fly the Zeke or C.202? It wouldn't be that there's no safety advantage in flying the decidedly non-uber fighters, would it? You seem to be quite the hypocrite in this regard. :rolleyes:
This tour I am largely mud moving. I'm enjoying attack missions (when I remember to designate them as such), despite the heavy loss rate associated with attacking heavily defended targets. I find it a much greater challenge to take a fighter down, bomb a target and then fight my way through hordes of defending fighters. Yeah, my K/D stats take a beating, but so what? It's a game. Indeed, despite getting vulched repeatedly, I like nothing more than to get airborne from a capped field and ripping into the attackers with a Zeke.
Oh yeah, for the record, I've flown the F4U-4 once in three tours.....
My regards,
Widewing
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P38 eats the F4U4 at any alt anyway. The only thing that blue plane can do is run like a pony.. run very,very far.
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Originally posted by Samm
I strongly agree with you here Eaglecz . Lucky for us many players don't seem to get this. I wince everytime I see someone say "model A is a BnZ plane and model B is a TnB" . The fundamentals of acm are the same no matter what plane you are flying .
You can BnZ with a Zero, or you can turnfight with a G-10. So yeah, the fundamentals are the same, but the application isn't. Neither of the above is suitable for that role indicated, and is not a wise choice. Just because you can do it, that doesn't make it smart. However, taking advantage of opportunity may dictate that you use tactics not normally preferred for each type.
The primary reason for the success of the Spits and N1K2 is that they are very capable at both BnZ and turnfighting, making them especially dangerous.
Indeed, Spits and N1K2s are generally looked upon as angles fighters. However, they are readily able to function as E fighters too. One must adapt to the tectical situation, rather than assume that their aircraft cannot, or should not be used for any purpose other than for that perceived to be its forte'. Within that context, you can certainly turnfight in the F4U-4, but you had better take care as to what you are fighting and understand the limitations and capabilities of your machine, as well as that of your enemy. Nonetheless, the F4U-4 is best suited to BnZ tactics, where its speed and high-speed handling can best be exploited.
My regards,
Widewing
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Notes from the AFDU Tactical Trials between the Spitfire F.Mk XIVc and Tempest Mk V:
Range and Endurance
24. Rough comparisons have been made at the maximum continuous cruising conditions of both aircraft. (3150 revs. +4 1/2 lb. boost Tempest, 2400 revs. +7 lb. boost Spitfire XIV).
24A. The best heights of each aircraft are very different, producing the following results:-
The Tempest is faster and goes further up to 10,000 ft. From 10,000 - 20,000 ft. both aircraft cruise at about 300 I.A.S. Above 20,000 ft. the Tempest cannot maintain its high crusing speed and no comparisons can be made with the Spitfire XIV which increases its ground speed and range up to 29,000 ft.
These comparisons remain the same with the full fuel loads at present available (2 x 45 gall. long range tank Tempest, 1 x 90 gall. longe range tank Spitfire).
Maximum Speed
25. From 0 - 10,000 feet the Tempest V is 20 mph. faster than the Spitfire XIV. There is then little to choose until 22,000 feet, when the Spitfire XIV becomes 30-40 mph. faster, the Tempest's operational ceiling being about 30,000 feet as opposed to the Spitfire XIV's 40,000 feet.
Conclusions
30. The tactical attributes of the two aircraft being completely different, they require a separate handling techique in combat. For this reason Typhoon squadrons should convert to Tempests, and Spitfire squadrons to Spitfire XIVs, and definitely never vice-versa, or each aircraft's particular advantages would never be appreciated. Regarding performance, if correctly handled, the Tempest is the better below about 20,000 feet and the Spitfire XIV the better above that height.
You want a high altitude RAF killer, give us a Spitfire XIV. If the Lanc hand been being escorted by a Spitfire Mk XIV you'd have had a real fight on your hands, one in favor of the Spit.
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Originally posted by StSanta
Heh 20 kills and 3 deaths now. Very hard to not get killed when ya have to fire 5 second solid hits into the targets.
Today: 1 kill, about 22 assists.
Yesterday I actually killed 4 enemies in one sortie with one load of ammo in it. That's the best I've done in AH with just one ammo load, considering the sort of munition.
So far 4 kill sortie on 1 ammo load is best for me as well... And yes, I stopped to count assists because when Im on a con pumping him up with my 7,7mm almost always comes some kind friendly NIK oe Hizookas equipped plane and blows MY con into bits... oh well I think in Knitland its prolly the same... :D
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Widewing what side do you fly ?
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Originally posted by Eaglecz
Widewing what side do you fly ?
Does not really matter, does it? Dueling arena is open 24/7 :D Just post the movie afterwards ok? ;)
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are you rook ?
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Originally posted by Tac
P38 eats the F4U4 at any alt anyway. The only thing that blue plane can do is run like a pony.. run very,very far.
Aw Tac, the F4U-4 is a much better runner than the pony!!!;)
Nothing wrong with running.... Unless you're doing the chasing.p:
This is why I refer to P-51 drivers as "tourists". They only come to visit, and never stay long enough to get aquainted.
My regards,
Widewing
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Lol so true. :D :D
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Originally posted by Widewing
Aw Tac, the F4U-4 is a much better runner than the pony!!!;)
Nothing wrong with running.... Unless you're doing the chasing.p:
This is why I refer to P-51 drivers as "tourists". They only come to visit, and never stay long enough to get aquainted.
My regards,
Widewing
*my* pony runs TO baddies much much more often than FROM them, tank ewe verra mush.
;)
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Originally posted by Shane
*my* pony runs TO baddies much much more often than FROM them, tank ewe verra mush.
;)
Yeah it goes like this:
Shane and his runstang are screaming towards the bad guys... They go for the Merge.... There is No more Shane.... :D So of course there is also no runing away from bad guys ;)
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Heya Widewing,
You mentioned under 10k the superiority of the F4U-4 over the P-51D at low alt.
Well I had a dicouraging encounter with a P-51D the other day where after I blew an ealy kill oppertunity I attempted to seperate. After an initial sprint out from 10K I gained about D1.0 full WEP from 10K to the deck he caught me. Not slowly either, I mean he caught me like I was standing still. I needless to say I was dissapointed with the result.
BTW if anything I had an E-advantage when seperating. Maybe over 20K she can out run them but not down below.
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F4UDOA:
Unless the HTC performance charts are totally goofed the -4 should have a decent speed advantage over the 51d at low altitude. When somebody is caught by a slower plane as you describe my experience is that the pursuing aircraft started with an E advantage or just did much better E management on the merge and subsequent maneuvers. I outrun same-speed or faster aircraft all the time because I unload either in a dive or a climb and most players just don’t understand this aspect.
Hooligan
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Hooligan,
Don't go tipping anyone off re: what that accelerometer is for. :rolleyes:
Mike/wulfie from WB
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Widewing I don't TnB or BnZ in any fighter . Like Eaglecz said BnZ or TnB is not a type of dogfight .
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Tempest II *drools*
(http://www.ipmsstockholm.org/photos/detail_temp2_01.jpg)
Is it me or does it look a tad like the 190?
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Originally posted by Eaglecz
are you rook ?
That's right, I fly with the Rooks. You will know me when you see me. I'll be the Corsair dive bombing with my gear down. Which, by the way, I consider the aviation equivalent of mooning. :D
See you around the MA, Orel.
My best,
Widewing
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That's what I was thinking before I saw the caption Thrila.
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22k Nothing will catch the 109 G10 clean. it will out pace anything minus the 262. F4U4 is a fun ride but it is ez meat down low, and at any alt under 10k. I prefer the dora down low, and the LA-7 mid alt and the g-10 above 18-24k. Remember it is still a F4 it is not the best turner.
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Hooligan,
When I say I had an E advatage I was understating it a bit. I had a huge E-advantage. I tried to sell out and go for the quick kill but it didn't work so I tried to extend. I was shocked to see my distance increase to D1.0 rapidly and then disappear to D500 almost as fast.
I film many of my sorites and I got this one. If you want to see it I'll send it to you. I still can't figure it out.
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lol! tourists
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Yep, send it to me. I'm really curious.
Hooligan
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Originally posted by Widewing
I'll be the Corsair dive bombing with my gear down. Which, by the way, I consider the aviation equivalent of mooning. :D
ok i got it im looking for fast blue thing with 2 stick`s instead of gear :D
cya up there
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hey Fester long time out Hallo there
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Hmm I killed an F4U-4 in Tempest 2 days ago... No big deal... Didnt notice any uberness of F4U-4... When thinking about it it was my first kill of F4U-4 ever... I pinged few of those blue things before but most of the time I spend in the Yak and although I lit them up like candles those bastards kept flying and extended away like if nothing happened... Fortunately Tempest packs a bit more deadly punch than the Yak so the short burst on convergency when Sancho showed me his full profile was all that was needed to remove his right wing :) Btw Sancho
It was funny fight anyway when rooks tried to bang A17 and they had it pretty capped... I rolled Tempest from 16 to help the base. When I came there (at 22k) I met a 109 coalt - so I droped my DTs and headed for merge but the 109 went nose down as soon as the driver noticed what is coming in his direction.... There were no more high cons so I went a bit lower and then I noticed an blue bent wings F4U-4 vulching (err suppressing I wanted to say) the base (plus spit and p47 and the now low 109). Rook fleet and more cons were flowing in from A18... So I decided to go in and help the base a bit with removing those easy kill seeking dweebs... 109 died he prolly never seen me coming... But the F4U-4 noticed me and I cought a glimpse of it nailed to the deck runing away from the field where the bad weather (tempest) started to take its toll. I desintegrated the p47 and started to make preparations for the F4U-4 encounter which seemed to be coming because I anticipated an skilled oponent who will extend frome the field grab alt and come back to hijack me fishing low his friends... Well problem was that I kinda expected that so I extended and climbed as well... We met at about 10k. At the begining the F4U-4 had the upper hand he had an E advantage but soon he wasted it. Anyway he managed to ping me but this time the turbolaser .50 calibers have failed and I suffered no visible damage. Then after few more moments he presented me a full profile of the ugly F4U-4 in a perfect position for a short snapshot. I took the chance and I saw an perfect concentrated hit on D400 at his right wingroot. Whole right wing went off just seconds later - pilot bailed I think with no problems (im NOT chute shooter) so I leveled off checked my blood pressure and heartbeat - both high above normal, organism saturated with adrenaline I set out to refuel at 16... When I came back to 17 I got 6 more kills there but no more perkplanes in the area... :p
See you up there rascals :D
One more thing - If you happen to be a Bishop then whatever you do dont fly Tempest with Orel as a wingman.... Whenever I do that I get killed or just lose my plane... Like last time when we met knight B17 over 11. B17 was above us and of course Orel wanted to go for it. I told him to leave the B17 alone... But did he listen to me? Of course he didn't. What was the result? 1 B17 dead and 2 Tempests with no engine gliding home. Need to add that during this glide we were bounced by Knight 262 and 152 (fortunately those drivers were total lamers so no damage). Well not sure who was in the 262 but the 152 was prolly a newbie because he followed me all the way to the field - I had no engine and I was gliding straight at speed of aprox. 200 when I was at the beginig of the runway I just checked my 6 to see the 152 about 500 behind me going BOOOOOOM :) well I hope it was worh of it for him. But at the other hand I have to add that I went boom soon after because I didnt notice one landing leg damage and I fliped over while landing (why the plane fliped over at low speed goes boom is beyond me :confused: ). And of course Orel landed with no problems :D Damn It! Why is it always me who pays for Orels 'great' ideas? :rolleyes:
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Guys why all this BS about x being faster than y. We all know that a combination of factors make this type of comparison meaningless. Who cares if one plane is 5mph faster than another unless your talkin zero vs g10 then its totally irrelevent. The initial E states will decide who is the fastest not the plane. Like I said if ther gap is wide enough spits, zeros nikis etc vs the faster set then yeah it matters. The only thing that matters in a dogfite is the pilot, and how he manages the fight. Even then with equally skilled pilots various circumstances can often sway the outcome. I'm forever hearing 'hey grem how'd your 51D outturn my la7' etc. The longer I been in AH the more I realise, its not what you fly its how.
I say stop looking at the plane and start lookin at your tactics.
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BTW,
Here is a F4U-5 Chart to go with the "New Perk Tempest II".
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Originally posted by Gremlin
Guys why all this BS about x being faster than y. We all know that a combination of factors make this type of comparison meaningless. Who cares if one plane is 5mph faster than another unless your talkin zero vs g10 then its totally irrelevent. The initial E states will decide who is the fastest not the plane. Like I said if ther gap is wide enough spits, zeros nikis etc vs the faster set then yeah it matters. The only thing that matters in a dogfite is the pilot, and how he manages the fight. Even then with equally skilled pilots various circumstances can often sway the outcome. I'm forever hearing 'hey grem how'd your 51D outturn my la7' etc. The longer I been in AH the more I realise, its not what you fly its how.
I say stop looking at the plane and start lookin at your tactics.
I generally agree with you. I frequently fly the Hogs or 190A-5/F-8. In these these types, I have 58 kills. Let me break it down.
FW 190A-5: 27 kills, 14 deaths one death air to air, two by Buffs.
FW 190F-8: 4 kills, 0 deaths.
F4U-1: 3 kills, 0 deaths.
F4U-1C: 23 kills, 5 deaths, one death air to air, one by Buff.
F4U-1D: 1 kill, 1 death (flak)
Of the 190 deaths, all were flak or field acks, except the three listed.
Of the Corsair deaths, all were flak or field acks, except the two listed.
Of the 58 kills, 6 were GVs or PTs.
So, flying these types, I've managed 52 kills vs 5 deaths air to air, but remember that most ack kills get proxied to the nearest con. Therefore, it is hard to determine cause simply by observing the stats. Personally, I actually keep notes on my losses to aid me in perfecting my field attack tactics.**
With a K/D of nearly 10/1 air to air, this reflects tactics more than anything else. Staying fast, working the vertical, and effective deflection shooting are the keys to being successful in aircraft not known for remarkable turning ability, or especially good speed down low. Many of those kills were against faster or more maneuverable aircraft, who had wasted their E or had become fixated on a single enemy, leaving themselves at risk for a bounce. Granted, much of this is low risk cherry picking. But, that's how most of the high scorers get their numbers, cherry picking around furballs. The best part is ambushing the cherry pickers. :D However, just when you think you're higher than anyone else, someone shows up even higher. :mad: Usually one of those Mustang "Tourists". :D
**Last evening, I took up a Spit Mk.V with one 500lb bomb, for three sorties. I destroyed numerous buildings and one gun emplacement. In exchange, I received minor damage from a field ack and lost a Spitfire to a Mustang (Iron1 getting even for my earlier bounce of him in my 190F-8), against 5 kills, three assists air to air. Yeah, I actually write this stuff down!
My regards,
Widewing
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"Usually one of those Mustang "Tourists". "
How funny you should say that. The only time I can recall metting you in the arena, you started somewhat above me and it ended up you running away from me. Fortunately the 51 is faster than the F4U-1D/C/whatever you were flying. :P
J_A_B
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Originally posted by J_A_B
"Usually one of those Mustang "Tourists". "
How funny you should say that. The only time I can recall metting you in the arena, you started somewhat above me and it ended up you running away from me. Fortunately the 51 is faster than the F4U-1D/C/whatever you were flying. :P
J_A_B
The only Hog I've lost to a Mustang was a C model. I was climbing out to 20k or so with 2k of bombs and four HVARs. I stumbled upon a P-51 about 2k below me. I dumped the rockets, but kept the bombs, as I had to kill some FHs. I prefer to get as high as possible if I have no other Rook along. This allows me to avoid the gaggles furballing at 5k and the Lone Rangers prowling the routes. In this case, I was taking an around-about route.
Anyway, I spot the Mustang at my 2 O'clock, slightly below me. Here I'm faced with a dilemma. My E state is lousy, with only 200 mph TAS. I'm hauling about 3,000 pounds of ordnance. My mission is relatively important. What to do? I decide to keep the bombs, but jettison the rockets, which I do (you should have seen that). I then execute a descending turn to meet the Mustang head to head, on the chance that he will take the risk and challenge those 4 Hizookas head-on. He doesn't and I have to turn again. But that heavy Hog doesn't turn worth a hoot, and the Mustang is gaining position fast. Still unwilling to dump the bombs (a dumb decision in hindsight), I have no choice but to drop the nose and haul ass. However, the drag of the bombs limits my speed and the Mustang eventually gets in a crippling shot.
If that was you in the Mustang, J_A_B, then you are the only guy to kill my C-Hog in air to air. Salute!
My regards,
Widewing
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I was wondering why you were lugging that stuff around, and was even more perplexed when I saw your handle (at first I assumed it HAD to be a newbie or something). Considering the stuff you were carrying you flew that hog amazingly well.
J_A_B
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Originally posted by J_A_B
I was wondering why you were lugging that stuff around, and was even more perplexed when I saw your handle (at first I assumed it HAD to be a newbie or something). Considering the stuff you were carrying you flew that hog amazingly well.
J_A_B
Thanks for the kind words. I have no aversion to climbing to high altitude for a strike mission. My reasoning is that I can avoid most enemy fighters by simply being above them. When I reach the target area, I'll spiral down, kill my airspeed, dump the landing gear and flaps, and roll in vertically. About the time the gear starts groaning, I've released the bombs.
I have a bad habit of biting off more than I can chew. When we ran across each other I should have dumped the bombs. At least, I would have had a chance. Keeping them was a mistake. Especially when faced with a good stick on the other side, like yourself.
Tonight I did something equally imprudent. I tackled two F6Fs and two Seafires while flying a SpitV. The only other Rook in the area was shot down fairly quickly, although he did take a Seafire with him. Anyway, I get into a really busy fight with the remaining three. I believe that the one Hellcat bugged out, after I pinged him with a snapshot. Those other two had me hopping, as they teamed up to try boxing me in. Finally, I vector rolled onto the 6 of one of them, and started taking little squirts as he tried to dodge. He was an elusive character, but he wasn't going to get away. Realizing his situation, he chops throttle and barrel rolls to force an overshoot. I expected that and did the same, adding a big skid to bring my guns to bear. While this is going on, I see the Seafire boring in for a shot. However, if I don't kill the F6F, I'll be in deep bandini anyway. I fire and get good hits, his engine konking out. Full throttle with WEP now, and I try to claw around to avoid the Seafire. Too late, I get hit and bail quickly as I'm pretty low. Meanwhile the F6F had already crashed. It turned out to be Nath, and naturally, his wingman in the Seafire was Leviathn.:eek:
These being two of the better sticks to be found in the main arena, I was satisifed to get away with breaking even. I upped another SpitV and raced out to where their CV was. However, when I arrived, both Leviathn and the CV were gone, the CV having been sunk by Rooks who arrived just after we had our little encounter. So, the rematch will have to wait for another day. Next time, I'll bring a wingman too.;)
Nath, Leviathn, that was a great tussle. A tip of my hat for some terrific flying guys. By the way, who was in the other F6F?
My regards,
Widewing