Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Fishu on November 02, 1999, 08:30:00 AM
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I Would like to know what you others think about that how useful Anti-stick stir is in AH? (in its main purpose at the moment)
In my honest opinion I say it should be get rid, at least it does lower enjoyament of game with me when I am afraid to do some basic maneuvers.
Of course it is good to get rid of stick stirring players (with cost of fair players nerves), but I bet there is better ways to prevent stick stirring too...
I don't believe that this anti-stick stir would ever be perfect enough to stay.
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Personally I'd rather see a severe drag penalty causeing a stall for stick stiring than anything else.
More than X number of control inputs in a 3 sec box????? Would drop your airspeed X amt per movement.
Anyone?
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I've only seen the message a couple times, when I was doing some real hard moves. I have since learned to move the stick more smoothly. I don't see the message at all now, so my personal opinion is to keep it.
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Personally, I like it.
I have seen quite a decrease in planes spinning like tops and flopping all over the screen since it was implemented.
Can it be improved? Probably.
But I also think that some people may have to replace very spikey or very low quality equipment. And most importantly adjust their flying styles to be more smooth on the stick.
And No I'm no pointing fingers, and I think it needs a little work to reduce these problems.
But I vote it stays.
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Vermillion
WB's: (verm--), **MOL**, Men of Leisure,
(http://web.mountain.net/~arringto/emote/Snoopy.gif)
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FYI,
I have yet to see that message some are talking about.
My SW 3D Pro, several years old apparently never spikes.
I vote "keep it"
delta
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I've never seem the message. I vote to keep it.
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I would say keep it, but it does need to be improved. Some say it kicks in too soon, but for me its effectivly turned off. It used to work, but never kicked in unless I actually tried to do so. Now its like its turned off.
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Haven't had it activate single time w/o me trying to play with it while cruising for alt. That is it has never poped up in combat.
//fats
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I must be a lousy ACM pilot, because I've never seen it either. I did have a 51 wiggle all over the place in front of me last night, so I say keep it. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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The whole point of the thing was to stop stick stirring.
I too have seen p51,s wiggel all over the place. and every other plane in the set i might add. If it gave me a big edge over some other players, I might want to keep it to. But being on the receiving end of what amounts to a built in cheat. I gotta vote NO.
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please end it
my sidwinder is 6 months old
and the rudder spikes like mad always has just like all the others i have seen (admitedly only 3 or 4) if i dial in aenough damper to stop i i got slow mo controls
and hight imput x and y axis (read top right or diagnal sitck input) has a good chance to kick it in. seems to me the software could be written to only notice true jerkin i.e. when the controls vary from one side or deflection to the other rather that cuttin in on spikes .(i am not software engineer) bus as it stands give me the stick jerkers over this ill thought out and i guess not tested (on many sidwinders at least) idea .
i had not noticed andy complaints on this board about stick jerkin so why is it there at all?
the flight model should be all the punishment needed (i.e. drag would kill their e)
TURN IT OFF!!!!
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I've had quite a few problems with the S.S.It seems to be less a problem with the lastest update.I have reduced it on my end with joystick tweaking.The amount of problem that remains is fairly perdictable.I look at it as a limitation of aircraft performance.(i.e. not all spit 9 perform the same)
I STRONGLY support HTC's attempt to regulate gameplay.Urge them to continue and expand that effort.
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Get rid of it.
Much better idea to implement max stick travel speed like WB has.
WB claims to use data from old NACA files for this.
I have a spiky stick, I've seen this 3 times, not since latest upgrade though, where HT implemented his stick damper.
About the stick damper, its effect can readily be seen, just wiggle the stick as fast as you can while watching the aileron.
Actually observing this, it seems to me HT already has implemented a max stick travel speed.
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I'm for it in principle, but it clearly needs refining. Tends to screw the poor benighted kb rudder driver (snif snif), not like we ain't screwed enough already. I'm gonna break down and build or buy pedals real soon.
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Flathat
'Black Dahlia'
No10 RNAS "The Black Flight"
Angel on your wing, devil on your tail
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Keep it!
3 year old MS Siderwinder 3D pro, and have never seen the message.
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I vote to get rid of it.
It won't allow a correct snap roll. Now, one could snap roll without full deflection, and one could eventually snap roll without snapping the stick back. But the point of the snap roll is to get the aircraft rolling as fast as you can. If I have to slowly pull the stick back before it breaks, my opponent will see it coming. If I want to snap roll, I want the aircraft to have started rolling yesterday (and I'll use full aft elevator, opposite aileron, and full rudder to get it). Teh current stick stirring limiter doesn't allow me to do that.
If I want to risk not regaining control of my aircraft, and the massive E-bleed my snap roll will bring, that's my business.
I applaud the idea of forcing people to play smarter, and I like what the outcome has been (I haven't seen any stick stirrers since it has been on), but I don't like the way it's done.
blk (AT)
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Don't throw the baby out with the bath water.
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Doug "Pyro" Balmos
HiTech Creations
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Keep it, has not happened yet once while being online. It does not even limit my acm at all..
blk, just yesterday another of those AT guys was about to die to my Kanonenboot when he did just what you said is now impossible (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Blk: there has to be something seriously wrong with your stick if you can't snap roll an aircraft with full back stick, full rudder and opposite aileron.
It's a stock move for me and I've seen absolutely no problem with doing it in this release.
I also didn't even know about the anti-stick stirring code until reading it on this board, and I'm not afraid to throw an aircraft about during ACM. Only time I've ever seen the message is when I've tried to bring it up.. to see what al the fuss was about.
Spiking sticks, bad calibrations.... you can't design a game to make allowances for faulty equipment or the way in which it is used. Stick stirrers have always been a curse.... and I vote that the current code STAYS IN!!!
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C.O. Phoenix Squadron
www.users.bigpond.com/afinlayson/index.htm
'feel the heat .......'
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For them who says keep it, I would give one notice, how if theres other ways to eliminate stick stirring?
Simple way to prevent it is to do little control delay, so that you can't just simply pull ailerons in 0.000001 seconds from full up to down position (same with elevator ...)
I doubt that control surfaces switches position that quick against wind forces, specially when there weren't hydraulics in 999% of the planes. (P38L at least had, but that was those late war dweeb stuffs (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) )
Myself I am afraid to do basic maneuvers with rudder (i use key rudder), because it ends up to stick lockup (woo, sometimes i get it on the runway and i barely get time to touch engine key!)
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My snap roll problem isn't related to my stick setup (it's been well tuned). I think the problem is that I'm really banging it around with maximum deflection in all three axes. (Aft stick, full rudder, full roll away from desired snap roll). I "can" snap roll it, it's just that I can't snap the stick back and boot the pedals like I prefer to do. I just have to slow it down a tad, or delay one of the inputs a bit, and then it doesn't limit me.
but, I'd still rather be able to bang the stick around as fast as I please...
blk (AT)
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Keep It!
I have done some extensive testing with it, and it works as advertised. I can move the controls as fast as I want in a single direction. I can snap roll accel stall you name it. When I try to cross controls as fast as possible (ie Stick Stir-crossing controls with a joystick faster than you can with a real planes stick) I get the dreaded message. I admit that I have invested a lot of time and money in my flight controls over the years, and they are always in top condition. Considerring the time and effort that sim junkies like us put into these games, I can't imagine why anyone would fly with less than the best functioning equipment.
If you have a spikey stick, then you will be penalized, but if you have a spikey stick you were penalized before the code anyway (you just didn't know it). If you have flakey or defective gear, then you cannot compete at the same level as someone with solid working parts.
If your flying style is such that you activate the SSS code, then you better review your habits. You may be a stick stirrer and not even know it (or be willing to accept it).
No offense in tended to anyone. Just my .02$
val
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Scott (val) Valline
Dweebs of Death
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Attempt to express myself better:
Get rid of the "freeze".
There's something fundamentally wrong with having a 'freeze' that could be trigged by accident unfairly.
If modeling didn't allow surfaces to move faster than they really could, the problem would be gone.
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A point to ponder......
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If your flying style is such that you activate the SSS code, then you better review your habits. You may be a stick stirrer and not even know it (or be willing to accept it).
No offense in tended to anyone. Just my .02$
val
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hblair, C.O.
>==The ASSASSINS==>
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Keep it, since 0.37 and the new damper my
SW FF pro has no spikes. Before the new
damper I had lousy rudder control, they
moved much to quickly at the slightest touch.
now I finally have some control. The rudder
seems to move in a more realistic manner.
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I haven't seen it since 0.73 either.
Only had it affect me once, then learned what not to do, so I wouldn't see it again.
Keep it, but keep tweaking it until it is fair for all.
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"I could feel the 20MM Cannon impacting behind me so I made myself small behind the pilot armor" Charlie Bond AVG
lkbrown1@tir.com
http://www.tir.com/~lkbrown1 (http://www.tir.com/~lkbrown1)
Very Opinionated Person.
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I also like what GhostH said, severe drag penalty. If they fall from the sky, I like that too.
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"I could feel the 20MM Cannon impacting behind me so I made myself small behind the pilot armor" Charlie Bond AVG
lkbrown1@tir.com
http://www.tir.com/~lkbrown1 (http://www.tir.com/~lkbrown1)
Very Opinionated Person.
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I haven't seen it happen yet...but then I don't expect to survive by "tricks" when I've let some so-called dweeb get on my six, the way some so-called aces seem to think is their private realm of "superior ACM" moves.
The lack of the ability to do a magic snap roll is so far down the list of importance from killing stick-stirring as to be almost unworthy of consideration IMO.
But it should definitely be tweaked so that it isn't affecting guys just because their joystick is spiky. If you have a "stable" joystick and you're getting locked up by the code, I reckon you should re-examine the way you fly and fight.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
--jedi
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I hate it too, but I think the damn thing has helped my flying. As my tendency when engaging has always been to jerk the stick around like PeeWee Herman at a double feature matinee, it's helped me get settled down and gentler on the controls.
I hardly get the dreaded freeze anymore, so I got no problem with it. Also, it's been awhile since anybody's hopped away from me, a decidedly welcome turn of events.
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ROFLMAO
JEEEZ.... artoo now I gotta clean my monitor off! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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I thought this would be a one guy one vote deal but since others have posted more then once i will as well.
I borrowed a TM stick from a friend. If you think you are not fighting with one hand behind your back (if you have a pre pro) you are liveing along de,nile. As to the comments about inferior brands, thats just a prejudice. My stick is outstanding for AW FA and WB. All of which ive played.
This game is still in beta. And im sure it will go through many changes before it is done. Score doesnt mean anything at this point to most people. I cant imagin why it would. But the direction the sim is moveing in does matter. If there is no more than passing intrest in fair play, I think people will pick up on this and get discouraged. Im not suggesting that this is the case. It is just that these people are so busy trying to put this thing togather, they just dont have time to keep us abreast of ever turn they take.
At this point ive seen to much stick yanking to belive that the SSS is anything but a nuseance in its current configuration.
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TT wrote: "I borrowed a TM stick from a friend. If you think you are not fighting with one hand behind your back (if you have a pre pro) you are liveing along de,nile. "
I am confused by your post. Did the TM fix your problem or not? What do you mean by 'in de,nile' if you have a pre pro?
When you say "My stick is outstanding for AW FA and WB. All of which ive played.", that doesn't mean your stick isn't spiking.
None of those games use code to freeze stick inputs to counter stick stirring. If spiking sticks are triggering this code, then it is possible that you have a spikey stick and do not know it.
To resolve the issue you need to determine if the problem is related to hardware, flying style, stick driver, or in the AH code.
I am not trying to argue and fight with you. I am trying to understand and help you resolve the issue. From your last post I cannot tell whether or not the loaner stick made a difference for you. Please explain further.
val
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Scott (val) Valline
Dweebs of Death
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Hblair: you have to take note on that every player doesn't have same kind of equipment, which can affect into anti-stick stir.
Myself, I might get that stick freeze if I use my key rudder for simple maneuver (sometimes even on the runway)
Can you call that as stick stirring or any kind of abusing?
Ghosth & Downtown: that would be more rude against people who dont do anything wrong but gets stick freezes
v0.37 damper things, they don't seem to affect on key rudder.
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Fishu I'm not trying to be a smart a*s so don't take it that way, but flying around using keys for rudder isn't exactly practical is it?
To test your problem last night I flew a sortie offline with only rudder keys. I got a stick freeze message. I adjusted my yaw sliders, and wala! it fixed the problem, took every bit of 3 minutes offline.
I noticed in my CDW catalog that Logitech has a new stick with a twist rudder and 8 or 9 buttons for 30 to 40 bucks. I've owned a Logitech stick before and they are well built. You might go in that direction.
TT, I've known you and flown with you on another simm and I know how deadly you are when you get dialed in, but I really think it may be your stick. If you've had it less than a year you can take it back under microsoft warranty. My MS Force Feed stick went bad after only 6 months, spiking, jumping, then finally quit working altogether. At first the problem was periods of nonresponse, then gradually got worse.
If you've had your stick less than a year, it wouldn't hurt to take it back, would it?
Most places give you a new stick on the spot.
(thats what I got)
If it turns out its not your stick I'll let you shoot me down 20 times straight. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
I'm not trying step on any toes, but I'm thinking the people with these problems are either just plane 'ol stick stirrers or they are geniunely good pilots with some sort of bad; marginal; or not enough hardware.
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I use to fly with a Sidewinder Precision Pro.
But I ended up going thru 3 of them, all in less than a year, and I decided that the durabiity just wasn't there.
So I sprang for a sale on buy.com and bought the CH Fighterstick and Pro Throttle (already owned a set of rudders) as a set for real cheap (realitively). I haven't regretted it every since.
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Vermillion
WB's: (verm--), **MOL**, Men of Leisure,
(http://web.mountain.net/~arringto/emote/Snoopy.gif)
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Me and my 3 year old MS Sidewinder 3D Pro have never seen this message.
In theory I like the idea and vote to keep it. In reality, if it is not working properly, tweak or get rid of it.
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HB. If the SSS worked, an argument could be made for requiring another stick. But stick stirring has slowed very little. It seems to be very popular among the p51 guys in particular. Ive called 2 or 3 guys on it, on the open channel. and they never answer me so I assume they know there doing it.
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I want to see -blk-- be able to do his snap roll. It will make for a more interesting fight. If we leave some type of stick-stirring prevention in, it needs to be implemented well.
I had many ss messages in .36, but not in .37. Things have improved, but they could stand to improve some more. A pilot should be able to make an abrupt combination control movement at slower speeds. However, he should not be able to get away with continuous abrupt control movements if this causes problems in a computer environment. Personally, I hate the idea of control lock-ups, but I would tolerate this solution if it only happened in obvious ss cases.
Since the responses in this topic are still divided, it indicates to me that more tweaking of the anti-stirring code is still needed. I look forward to a future post by -blk-- stating that he can do a decent snap roll the way he likes to without getting the control lockup. When that post happens, we know we're getting closer to a useable product.
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I realize that this message probably won't get read due to the number of messages on this thread.
This stick-stir is real lame... we are striving for an accurate sim, yet we are technically putting in a system that detracts from realism. Think of it this way: now in a jam...guns defense... not only do we have to fear the con, but now we need to fear the front end itself.
in short, lose it!!
Iculus
Warrant Officer, 111FG
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ICULUS if your idea of "Guns Defense" is banging the stick around enough to trigger the SS code, then you may have devolped bad flying habits that borderline on stick stirring.
-BLK- doesn't like the code, because he can't "bang the controls" around like he is used to. Is the code bad or his flying habits?
TT has not openly stated whether or not a different stick made a difference for him.
Listen to yourselves. I don't think some of you know what Stick Stirring is. AH punishes over-controlling the AC. If that is your flying style, then it is time to review and adjust.
I have seen more examples of bad flying habits, and possible flakey joysticks than concise and reasoned discussion about the code. Those that are against the code will have to find better arguements if they want to convince HTC to remove it.
val
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Scott (val) Valline
Dweebs of Death
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I was only able to get the message one time out of many trys with the TM stick. I climbed to 12k, than put it into a rip the wings off dive. When the speedo was pegged i yank the thing around and managed to get the SSS. Other than that I yank the thing all over the place and could not set off the SSS.
BTW. if any SW owners doubt this, go to a store that will take the thing back. Buy one and try it your self. If you can borrrow one that is less hassel (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
Another BTW. All my whineing makes it sound like this is not a great sim. Nothing could be less true. They made it clear from the start that it was not for everybody (no mac,s ect.) They will either change The SSS or not. I doubt anybody has a vote on the matter. As HT told me "there is no they. Ill decide whether to turn it off or not". It is just my bad luck to be fond of the wrong stick. Frankly, IMHO the lack of toggel button alone will have some sw owners looking to other new sims as they come out.
Regardless this is my last post on this subject. It is not like HT is unaware of the problem. More than one post on the matter by, an indiviual, is not likely to sway him one way or another.
[This message has been edited by TT (edited 11-05-1999).]
[This message has been edited by TT (edited 11-05-1999).]
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Guys, this is a fairly simple, yet almost universally MIS-understood phenomenon here. I've heard guys clamoring for blackouts, redouts, stalls, excess drag penalties, and all manner of "I think stick stirring should do THIS" models.
The FACT is that "stick-stirring" a REAL airplane would produce NONE of those effects. Stick-stirring a REAL plane produces a mild, cyclic, low-amplitude gyration. In effect, it causes the airplane to "wobble." And that's ALL it does. The pilot isn't pinned to the ceiling, or banging off the canopy. What occurs is basically "pilot-induced dampening" of the control inputs. Before each control input has a chance to produce a flight path deviation, the pilot has introduced a maximum control input opposite the previous input. The airplane moves, but only a little bit.
In the SIM, with netlag, the SMOOTHING CODE translates stick-stirring into LARGE deviations from the original flight path and attitude, because it "moves" the aircraft in the direction of the control deflection, and then WAITS for an update before it "discovers its mistake" and moves the aircraft back the other way. Exactly the WRONG result!
So, IF the anti-stick-stir code can be tweaked properly, it will in fact result in the MOST realistic SIMULATION of what happens to the plane when you stick-stir. Sure, from the cockpit, stick-stirring will not "feel" realistic, because you're hauling on the pole for all it's worth, and nothing is happening. From the OUTSIDE, tho, your plane will be doing about what a REAL one would do.
And of course, the question must be asked: "Why do you want the airplane to "feel right" when you're stick-stirring?" You're not supposed to be stick-stirring in the first place, so don't cry about it when you get caught and get spanked (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Which is not to say it's "right" NOW, if it's interpreting simple stick spiking as stick-stirring and punishing guys for not having "perfect" joysticks.
But as for "realism," it's quite simply the most imaginative approach yet to this problem, and more realistic than any of the other suggestions I've seen.
If you've flown real planes and tried to "stick stir" one, you know what I'm talking about. If not, sadly, it's not something you're going to "intuitively" believe. You kinda have to see it to believe it.
--jedi
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Jedi! You've done it! Now I get why I can't stand this thing. I didn't think of the smoothing code thing.
[Edit]
OK, just went and played with this. I think I can live with the model with regard to snap rolls and all if I put the dampening up a tad. Now, that makes the FM feel mushy to me, but now I can enter a spin/snap roll with as much control deflection as I please (even though it the mushy FM makes it take too long, but I can live with it).
However, I've discovered another problem. I was just playing around with it... So, I decided to do a few rolls on a point (the sun workeed nicely). After about 720 degrees of roll (two rolls), I would get the stick stir message. Now, I thought this might because I had full aileron, about half rudder, and am punching the elevator in and out to roll around the point. So, I decide to do some plain aileron rolls to duplicate the problem. Sometimes it happens, sometimes it doesn't. Sometimes it happens after a single roll, other times I could roll four or five times before I got it.
So, to see if it might be spiking of the stick or rudder pedals, I put the dampening WAY up. Now, it sometimes seemed to do it even more!?!
Anyone know what's causing this? If anything, I would suspect the rudder pedals, since they're three years old (RCS). I doubt the stick (Force FX, 4 months old). I assume the throttle can't contribute to the SS code (SFS, 4 months old)
A confused:
blk
[This message has been edited by -blk-- (edited 11-05-1999).]
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A note to MS Sidewinder user:
I have used various Sidewinder stick for years now, and I can tell you that they are very sensitive compared to other sticks. In order to fly smoothly, you need to lower the sensitivity (the stick scaling sliders in joystick setup, particularly toward the left end of the scale.
The default settings are far to sensitive for my tastes -- try toning down the scalings and see what you think.
absnth
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Aaarrgh!
Just downloaded version 0.37 (my last was 0.34) Please get rid of the lag in control response, it is starting to feel like Warbirds.
Version 0.34 was great, nice and instantaneous, just like a real aircraft.
Please don't sacrifice the wonderful flying qualities of 0.34 for this stick stirring problem...
Rob Coppock
rob@pctestpilot.com
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Keep it.
I'm using an old MS 3D Pro and have never seen the msg and I have my stick sliders set at 100% except for a slight roll off near the rest position for pitch & yaw
Sorry to the guys with spiking sticks but your problem is elsewhere.
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>>>The FACT is that "stick-stirring" a REAL airplane would produce NONE of those effects.
Stick-stirring a REAL plane produces a mild, cyclic, low-amplitude gyration. In effect, it
causes the airplane to "wobble."<<<<
Gee I always thought this was "jinking".
I have all CH Products gear, to enclude the Auto3 game card.
I'm still working on tuning my stick scaling, when I had major scaling restrictions (50-20)
I would get a "dont move your stick so hard" or something like that. Is this the message you all are talking about? If not I guess I have never seem this messaage
I have to say that in AH keeping my Pony from spiraling to a firey death is a full time job.
My vote (if I counted) would be that anything that wouldn't happen in a real plane (FE emposed freezes) Shouldn't be used. There will always be those who have to win at all costs,(score-dweebs)(alt-Monkies)(vulchers)
etc.
I'm here to fly a P-51D and experince flight & air to air combat Like my father (the real Mr.ED btw)saw during WWII.
AH is and can be the premier flight sim.
I say simulate a P-51D as close as is possible, and don't big brother me because others can't "straighten up & fly right".
After being in WB & AW3 I myself know the difference in being shot down by a dweeb OR fighting white knuckled with an con, that is so draining that you go AFK afterwards and reflect on what has just happened for a few minutes.(have a smoke sometimes it was that good)
Mr.ED (son of)
Pony driver (wanna-be)
Knight
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In other words, you don't cheat so don't put anything in the sim that prevents others from cheating if it detracts from your idea of realism?
A nice sentiment, but if you're a vet of AW and WB, you know where that leads (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Also, who's realism is "real?" If you want to whip the stick around as fast as you can move it, the real airplane wouldn't move much, so having "frozen" controls is probably just as realistic as letting you rock and roll in the cockpit and having your virtual aircraft jumping all over your pursuer's screen.
If you don't look at BOTH aspects of "realism" (what YOU see inside the cockpit and what your OPPONENT sees through the filter of the net) you can't make an adjustment to realism that will be acceptable to everyone. IMHO getting the realism "right" is going to involve a compromise between what each player sees his OWN plane doing and what he sees the OTHER planes doing. Getting either side of that equation "perfect" will make the other side "unrealistic."
Of course, you COULD make the airplanes react realistically, and account for net effects by making gunnery "easier," but the "realism nazis" always howl at that one, since it takes away one of "their" advantages they've worked so hard to build up over the years (bogus tho it might be) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
I think HTC is on the right track here, but if guys are getting "locked up" by normal manuevers or stick spikes, then it needs some more tweaking.
BTW, realistic "jinking" involves a more deliberate stick movement than what guys do in "stick stirring." Jinking generally involves slower stick movements, because you're trying to get your opponent to start to react to your move, and THEN rapidly reverse your direction, then WAIT for him to start his reaction again, and reverse again. Stick stirring is making your aircraft image "jerk" unrealistically around the sky, without any particular regard to what your opponent is doing. It's nothing to do with jinking.
--jedi
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Hear hear! I still think the code needs work.
Since, as it is (and no I'm not going to debate the realism of my "banging the controls around"), I can get the message sitting on the ground not moving. I suspect it's picking up some sort of spike from the rudder pedals (since it doesn't do it unless I hold rudder in). But, I checked the pot on the RCS... It sure seems fine. It's spotless, it's been well oiled/cleaned recently, and when I bench tested it with a DMM or simpson meter it was silky smooth. When I tested it under load (in whatever maching it is that tests potentiometers--I don't remember what it's called), it checked out fine.
Since we've got relatively new carpet, I'm wondering if the most recent cleaning will help it much. Haven't got the message since.
But either way, I think the code needs to be toned down just a bit, cause as it was (with a decent set of rudder pedals), I could turn the damper up and not get the message, or I could move the damper to what I would consider a playable level, and get the message...
blk