Aces High Bulletin Board
Help and Support Forums => Technical Support => Topic started by: kkierste on March 18, 2002, 08:22:29 AM
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Since 1.09 has come people have been dropping like flies. What will be done to address fps issues? Two people in my squadron already running for the hills, waiting for relief. Anybody else know people who are giving up on this version?
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So, the 400+ in the MA, the 40+ in the CT arena, and the 20 odd few in the TA is an indication of folks dropping like flies?
I can remember having 100 online as being a big event...not very long ago.
(Incidently, historically when a new release comes out, you'll see patches later on where Pyro or HT says "We found a bug that may have been affecting FPS"...so just be patient)
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i also have to leave AH after 1.09 pach 1.. before pach 1 everything worked fine (except for the known bugs)
several fo my squadmates (332viking) have to leave too, or they are having serious problems with fps
to bad
loved the game
:(
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Give them time.
HTC has shown it's serious about customer service. Lots of people have complained about FPS, I'm one of them.
109 has only been out a few days, most of that was a weekend. We've already had one patch. I'm sure more are coming. Frame rates might never be as good as they were pre-109, but they'll probably get better. (Keeping fingers crossed.)
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Well, I have seen a FEW folks post in here about framerate issues that I tried to help out. A few. Personally, I gained about 5-10 fps on my Voodoo 5 5500 running 1024x768 32 Bit 2xFSAA. I've heard others state that they lost framerate, but usually on nVidia cards.
If you are having framerate problems, you need to post ALL the details of your system and the settings you run in a message here. Do that, and myself and others may be able to help. If you just quit without giving anyone a shot to find the problem or help you out.... well that's your problem.
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With all due respect Sir, if the only thing that changed was the program the user is running, why would the problem be on the user’s end?
I know I am running on the low side of the requirements, however I worked and tweaked to go from 10fps to 30fps pre-109. I downloaded the new version (full download because my sys wont auto update AH without locking up) and could not stay connected. I went through my system upgrading and re-installing video driver, DX, DeFrag, etc… and still lost 5/10 fps with this new patch! Since 109.1 I have not been discoed not sure if that was my fault or the game.
350mhz PII
went from 64 Mg RAM to 128x3 Mg Ram
went from ATI Lt Pro AGP to ATI 7500 AGP
went from 5 – 10 fps to 20 – 30 fps pre-109
went from 20 – 30 fps to 10 – 20 fps with Version 109!
Losing fps is a problem with the upgrade, could be to much for our meak machines
:mad:
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Originally posted by awcajnn
With all due respect Sir, if the only thing that changed was the program the user is running, why would the problem be on the user’s end?
I know I am running on the low side of the requirements, however I worked and tweaked to go from 10fps to 30fps pre-109. I downloaded the new version (full download because my sys wont auto update AH without locking up) and could not stay connected. I went through my system upgrading and re-installing video driver, DX, DeFrag, etc… and still lost 5/10 fps with this new patch! Since 109.1 I have not been discoed not sure if that was my fault or the game.
350mhz PII
went from 64 Mg RAM to 128x3 Mg Ram
went from ATI Lt Pro AGP to ATI 7500 AGP
went from 5 – 10 fps to 20 – 30 fps pre-109
went from 20 – 30 fps to 10 – 20 fps with Version 109!
Losing fps is a problem with the upgrade, could be to much for our meak machines
:mad:
Geez, a Pentium II 350Mhz... How about getting a new CPU first before you start complaining about bad games? Try playing IL-2 on that system and see what a great game that is...
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Originally posted by awcajnn
With all due respect Sir, if the only thing that changed was the program the user is running, why would the problem be on the user’s end?
Actually, Cajnn, I also had framerate problems after the 1.09 update and was also thinking it could not possibly be my fault - turned out it was! :eek: I was running the separate, stand-alone version of AHVoice while being logged in the game with the integrated version.... I got a clue eventually after experiencing lots of echoing! In my case, all I needed to do was close down the separate AHVoice and my framerates returned to normal. :)
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Originally posted by Lephturn
Well, I have seen a FEW folks post in here about framerate issues that I tried to help out. A few. Personally, I gained about 5-10 fps on my Voodoo 5 5500 running 1024x768 32 Bit 2xFSAA. I've heard others state that they lost framerate, but usually on nVidia cards.
I had to reformat my boot drive because the regestry got hosed from a corrupted AH D/L...at least that's what I think happened. After the reformatting of both my AH partition and boot partition and reloading both AH and Win98 my frame rate got 15%-20% better. I bet some people that are complaining about poor framerates are running AH on a machines that are well overdue for a reformat. My machine had a year old OS load and has gone through many patches for AH as well as lots of experimenting with Detonator drivers. So, bottom line is, and I firmly belive in this, that the Windows OS needs to start fresh every 8 months to a year depending on how much BS is installed and uninstalled.
Lars
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in short:
HT, stop improving your game, because I am unwilling to upgrade my machine!!!
hmmph. Isn't that more than a little rediculous. I understand the costs involved, and I am not a rich man, but I upgrade my machine as necessary to play the games I enjoy.
F.
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Originally posted by Lars
I bet some people that are complaining about poor framerates are running AH on a machines that are well overdue for a reformat.
Lars
Never assume because you'll always make an...well, you know the rest.
Ever since the 1.09 update, I've been one of those that took a serious frame rate hit in the MA. I've lost 20-25fps and nothing has changed on my system to reflect such a dramatic loss of fps and I'm not running this game on a bare minimum spec computer. By going from previous experience with updates in AH, I'm sure that HiTech and flock will find the reason why a lot of us are having this problem and fix it, hopefully in the next patch. Personally, I think it's the built in vox program that's causing the loss of fps and I think giving us an option of disabling it might go a long way in solving the problem.
system specs.
1.2Ghz AMD Duron
384megs RAM
GeForce 2 GTS 32meg
Detonator 4 27.70 drivers
DirectX 8.1
Don't even bother saying it's the beta drivers because it isn't. Prior to 1.09, using the 27.70 drivers, my fps were in the 55-65 fps range, even on deck in furballs over smoking bases. This revision is far more stable than the official 23.11 release.
Ack-Ack
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Just my experience Ack-Ack. I was using the 23.11 drivers with ok performance. I had tried lots of different Det drivers, using the Det Destroyer for each install, but I got a sizeable boost in frame rates with the OS, and vid driver re-install. It may not be a popular solution but a fresh OS install would help a lot of people experiencing problems IMO.
It would be interesting to see how long most people here have had the same OS load on their machines and what, if any, frame rate hits the older installs vs. the newer installs are experiencing.
This is exactly the reason I have a small, 2gig, boot partition as well as a 1.8gig AH partition. Makes for easy reformatting and with the use of Nortons Ghost, an OS reload takes only a few minutes :D
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yep, cant say enough about reformatting. You got a problem, I bet that will fix it.
It is a pain, but you will be happier.
We have a couple in my squad with problems too, but I am trying to guide them through it.
btw, I was at 100fps before the update, and I am at 100fps after the update.
I also have a slower computer at work, 800mhz with and old nvidia viper 32card. It was running at 35 before the update, and now it is at 35.
How many aol messengers have been installed on your old puter????
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So sue me for using the term "dropping like flies," whilst ignoring the point that players that had been enjoying the game are now quitting the game. Many I'm sure have tried all the fixes.
I've worked IT for 9years and I did reformat. Sure I have an older processor (AMD K6-2 300) but the game ran fine before, and in a very odd note, other 3d resource hogging games are still running at 40-60fps on this machine. But not AH.
AH is the only online game I have had fps issues with. The only one. Think of a setting--I've changed it twice. Latest det drivers, reformat, msconfig to ease background apps, virtual mem. allocation, on and on, and I have 196MB of ram and the 32MB 2x AGP Elsa Erazor x, and after the format (which gained me nothing and lost me 12 hours of retweaking) I even downloaded the GeForce Tweak Utility....all kinds of changes, read all the tips, read all the posts, blah blah blah... Updated the via 4in1 drivers, This is just rambling now; I've come to the bottom of the tweak bin. Resolution, refresh rates, color depth, dx 8.1, etc. etc. nothing is helping...
I get 4-10fps (sometimes less when in action) down from 20-30 pre109.
Doesn't matter really; I'll have a new system soon. Maybe the new fsb speed will make the difference...or the 4x vs 2x agp, or the ddr sdr vs sdr...
But should one have to buy new? Is it my "fault" that the update took my machine from a medium walk to a slow crawl?
OR...is there some improvement to be made...and just because you see 410 people in MA or whatever, doesn't mean they'll be staying...
I'm patient; I'll wait around for patch/new system, but the attitude in the remarks is unwelcome. Was merely suggesting solution.
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Originally posted by Lars
Just my experience Ack-Ack. I was using the 23.11 drivers with ok performance. I had tried lots of different Det drivers, using the Det Destroyer for each install, but I got a sizeable boost in frame rates with the OS, and vid driver re-install. It may not be a popular solution but a fresh OS install would help a lot of people experiencing problems IMO.
It would be interesting to see how long most people here have had the same OS load on their machines and what, if any, frame rate hits the older installs vs. the newer installs are experiencing.
This is exactly the reason I have a small, 2gig, boot partition as well as a 1.8gig AH partition. Makes for easy reformatting and with the use of Nortons Ghost, an OS reload takes only a few minutes :D
I think my problem may be because I'm forced to use the onboard sound on my motherboard. Onboard sound sucks up resources anyway and vox just makes it worse. Don't have this problem with RW or GV though, so maybe it's not the onboard sound after all. As for system bottlenecks, this system is barely a month old and pretty much optimized for gaming and no bottlenecks have been detected.
ack-ack
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I just remembered this. I had this exact same problem on a friends computer, and when I tried switching back to my onboard sound card! It was the bleeping sound card drivers. The more sounds being played, and particularly flak or enemy engines would cause a massive hit on fps (even to 0). All I did was found a different sound driver (i actaully think it was older) and installed it. Voila worked like a charm!!!!!!!!!!!! I would try it if you havnt. Go find an older driver if you have the newest or look for a non manufacuter driver.
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http://www.driverguide.com
login: drivers
password: all
then do a search. Pretty good tool.
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My frame rates have also become unplayable since 1.09.
My system specs are:
Win98SE
P3 1GHz
384 MB RAM
60gb HD
Plantronics USB Headset (I don't use a soundcard).
VisionTek GF3
Dx8.1
Promise ATA 100 Mass Storage Controller
mb: Tazer II - Tyan S1854 Via 133A 4X with Integrated Components
BTW, My Frame rates are usually the worst in the MA, and in smaller fights with less aircraft the game is as smooth as it was pre-1.09.
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I left the game too....
FOR 3 hours while I attended class!!
SKurj
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This is just plain bizarre. I see several posts about frame rate loss, and yet I have 3 different systems here ranging from a 550Mhz P3 to a 1.8Ghz P4 Northwood and 3 different video cards (NVidia Gf2 64MB GTS Pro, ATI Radeon, and ATI Radeon 9500) and for the life of me I cannot duplicate the frame rate loss.
Indeed, my 1.8Ghz ATI Radeon 8500 based system actuall gained a few FPS from 1.08 to 1.09.
The only thing I can speculate on as to why some would see a loss and others would not would be the Internet connection itself. I do have faster than normal access to the Internet than most would.
To those having frame rate loss, I think it might be interesting to see what type of Internet connection you have. Whether of not you are using a USB based modem, winmodem, or whatever type of connection information you can post might help. If you have DSL or cable, please state the up and down speeds of the connection as well.
Are you NAT based? Do you go through a proxy? Are the effects different when you disable or enable your personal firewall?
Those that are not having any FPS degradation, please post your data too.
Maybe we can find a coorelation between these. I am really reaching here, but there has to be something consistent between those who claim a loss in FPS versus those who have no degradation of FPS.
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I'm starting to suspect it's sound cards Skuzzy.
Take a look above at the folks having problems with lower quality integrated sound chips. And then there's Nath's USB headset instead of a soundcard, which I highly suspect is the source of his problems given that the rest of his machine is pretty beefy.
For now, try upgrading your soundcard drivers if you can folks. It's worth a shot. Other than that, we may have to see if HT can give us the option to disable AH Voice, and see if that gives you your framerate back.
BTW, I'm running AH 1.09 on the following:
Athlon Classic 700 (Slot A)
Abit KA7-100
256 MB PC-133 SDRAM
Voodoo 5 5500
SB Live Value
D-Link Ethernet --> Cable modem
Windows 98SE
I've actually seen a small INCREASE in framerates.
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amd xp 1800+ (1.53ghz)msi geforce3 ti200 64
gigabyte mb kt233 (I think)
256 ddr ram
windows XP
15g harddrive
really old crappy us robotics 56k winmodem
connecting through toad.net in Washington, DC.
100fps everytime, all the time.
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Could be sound card _ I got a crappy onboard chip and I took a big hit. Maybe the new AH voice setup is just too much for it, although it seemed to work fine with the beta.
I know it's not internet connection issues, since I have the same problem flying offline as well as on.
I doubt it's my OS _ I installed it only about four months ago, and really haven't loaded much on the machine.
Some odd things I've noticed.
1. My FPS are about the same taking off, with lots of ground clutter and stuff, as they were before. The problem is that they don't improve like they used to when I get off into the wild blue yonder. They actually get worse.
2. When flying offline things will start off like the good old days, 65-70 fps, but then drop to 35-38 after I fly around awhile or if I check the map.
3. In MA I notice a virtually unplayable drop in FPS after I blast someone and they begin to smoke _ something I'd never noticed before.
I'm going to try installing my old Soundblaster16 and see if that improves things.
AMD 800
256 ram
Voodoo 3 16mb
via sound chip
win 98
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I have a very-well maintained and well-tweaked:
AMD K6-2 300
196MB PC 133 RAM
32 MB GeForce 256 Based Elsa Erazor X with dedicated IRQ (11)
AOpen 56k PCI data-fax-voice
MB is AX59 PRO (AOpen) with Via Mvp chipset
SB Live! (Brand new)
Ok I think those are the only ones that will matter; what I'm going to do is disable my sound card in Device Manager to see what happens to fps...will be back...
Ok...back
Can't get into game w/sound card disabled (makes sense I think)
Other things to note:
I use ZA firewall; no changed in Fps disabled (checked already)
I can't believe internet connection should have anything to do with it, but there is a 10fps gain when I play offline, up to a whopping 18fps.
My modem connection is consistently fast connecting at between 49 and 52kbps, and downloads usually run at about 5.1K per sec which is good for 56k modem.
This system is on it's way to the donation bin
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I have a MB sound card.
P4B266 with the C-Media Soundcard, sound is awsome, Voice works great, no frame rate loss at all.
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Also have USB headset... works great by the way, didn't notice any change, but then I wouldn't with a 2000+ and 512MB... GF3. USB headset thou works as advertised.......
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I have a 1500/384 DSL connect.
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A little FPS lost happened in 1.09 but its not problem. Its usually now in 30-50 and earlier it was 30-70.
My system is:
Athlon Classic 650mhz
Asus K7M
3 x 128 Mb sdram 133
Creative GF3 Ti200 64mb
20Gb HD
Win ME
The only problem I have is that system freezes sometimes when crashing down. I think iit is the same bug (or similar) what was in AH few months ago.
Minor problems has been with AHvoice.
Oh.. almost forget... connectionproblems are quite bad... lag is really bad.
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I lost fps to .. Just reformated ..
98se
384 ram
o/c 1008Mhz
gForce3 Ti200
TURTLE BEACH SANTA CRUZ
I was getting around 60 fps 1280x1024 32 bit 2X
now close to 38-40 in 16 bit 2X
sprint
:cool:
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I'd like to see what version of DX and what version of the Detonators all you folks with nVidia cards are running.
I'm sure HT is working hard to find this one, so lets just put as much info in here as we can.
kkierste, That CPU is your problem certainly. Any additional strain, such as from AH Voice, is bound to crush that K chip. Those things have really really crappy FPU units and AH relies heavily on FPU performance.
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I have noticed only a slight drop in framerates, if at all . I installed the new version from the website rather than the autoinstaller.
The only problem I have which I had before is that when the stall horn goes too much my Ms FF stick goes limp untill I re up!
1800xp
512Mb ram
Geforce 3ti500
21.83 drivers
DX 8.1
Audigy Player Latest XP drivers
Win XP
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Welp I updated my sound card driver, double checked that I have the latest Video driver, I have DX 8.1 and got on last night with the same low fps.
I noticed that AH Voice didn’t seem to affect my fps. When I upped from a base where there were no other friendlies my fps was the same as bases with 4 or 5 friendlies.
It looks like the new version sucked the last bit of extra power my feeble machine had last. Plans are in the works (read: beggin the wife) for a new machine :D
cajnn
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Lost up to 20 fps... truly discouraging :(
Win 98 SE
Athlon 800 MHz
640 MB RAM PC 100
GeForce 3 Ti 500 Graphic Card with latest official drivers
Audigy eX Soundcard
2 MBit DSL connection via an Ethernet card
Daniel
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DX8.1
21.81
Gainward GF3 Ti200
sprint
:cool:
PS> I did a full re-installed
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For those that lost fps, did you install go smoothly? Or did it abort?
Also, on my work computer (win2000) i could not get the game to work with the 23.11 det drivers. I had to go and dig up an old diamond viper ultra 770 driver from a couple years ago.
At work it is a viper ultra 770 32mb on a 800mhz amd thunderbird
256megs sdram
4gb harddrive.
fps
26 in tower
30-50 out the front on runway
75 looking up
Not sure if it experienced a drop, but I doubt it.
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I logged on for a few last night. There were well over 400 in the MA last night. People leaving? Hmmm I fail to notice :D
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I have been using the 21.83 drivers since before 1.09, anything newer than that caused me other probs in AH, like sound clicking and small freeze frames.
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I lost 10 to 20 fps, but its still playable.
My system is:
Duron 650 OC 950
Asus A7V
256 Mb sdram 133
Visiontek GF3 Ti200 64mb
20Gb ATA100
crappy robotics -I think- winmodem(48k+ connect, 100yrds from a southeast area main trunk :D)
3 or 4 year old yamaha sound card
Win ME
I had a smooth install from the download page.
I also updated all drivers within the last month.
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Don't forget to consider that 400 in MA could be 50 new that replaced 25 who left, and the 50 new join another 25 who'll leave, and you start seeing numbers drop.
I didn't base my guess on MA numbers; rather, I based it on people saying they were leaving the game and then leaving it.
(I hope it all gets worked out; not trying to promote an epidemic)
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This worked for me no warranties implied or expressed. If it doesn't work for you, or smoke starts pouring out of your machine that's your business not mine.
Here's what I saw before...
Specs 512M ram, AMD 1.8, Geforce 4 MX 440, and Soundblaster Audigy Sound Card. Running XP, with the Nvidia reference drivers that are certified from their site, as well as the latest Audigy drivers from the Soundblaster site.
I run in 1200 resolution 32 bit color.
AH ver 1.08 min 30 FPS about over a huge furball at a smoking field. 75 FPS (limited by monitor refresh rate) most of the time in average flying conditions.
AH ver 1.09 min 15 FPS max mid-40's FPS.
My solution...
I went to http://www.guru3d.com, I went into their drivers section and downloaded the 27.70 ver of the windows XP Detonator drivers, downloaded the Via 4.10b AGP driver for my motherboard, I manually turned off anti-aliasing by going into the control panel for the video card, and turned the sound acceleration down to half.
I made the first mistake in trouble shooting, by changing all of these things at once. Forgive me I was getting tired of the slide show every time I was flying near any field on fire.
The Result...
45 FPS per second in the absolute worst possible flying conditions. 30 + planes everything on fire (Rooks got all cranky that we vulched their field so they came over and egged our house) 75 FPS every other time I looked at the counter.
I didn't do any more testing than that. I was just happy to have fluid frame rates again. Hopefully, this may help some of you.
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WTG kutt! Your the first positive story I have seen on this yet!
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I have experienced a fps drop from mid 20's to 6-10fps with ver 1.09. amd k6-2 533 mhz
g-4 mx 420 pci graphics 64 mb
256 mb ram
on board sound (ess allegro)
dial up conn.
I have tried to install the det drivers but they wont install because the installation program finds a pci device it cant identify I suspect this might be a pci bridge device. also the video card shares irq 5 with the onboard sound neither of which i can change. I just upgraded to the g-4 card from a voodoo 3 card with no improvement in performance. also my frame rates are the same offline as online. as far as game play goes I sometimes run ah on a machine that gets 70+ fps and I still suffer the effects of lag, it's a smoother nicer lag but it still slows down to a crawl in a big furball. unperk the f4u-1c!
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Ok, I'm replacing this...
AMD K6-2 300
196MB PC 133 RAM
32 MB GeForce 256 Based Elsa Erazor X with dedicated IRQ (11)
AOpen 56k PCI data-fax-voice
MB is AX59 PRO (AOpen) with Via Mvp chipset
SB Live! (Brand new)
with this
AMD xp 1800
256MB PC333 on a Gigabyte 7vrx KT333
XP home
nVidia GeForce2 Mx-400 64MB agp
Here come's the judge...
Will post results when I get system
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
(Incidently, historically when a new release comes out, you'll see patches later on where Pyro or HT says "We found a bug that may have been affecting FPS"...so just be patient)
See? You should trust ol' Ripsnorts advice! Read below...
14. Got the FPS back to what it used to be or slightly more. The addition trains and convoys in the new
terrains was effecting FPS substantively. We optimized this section of code to work more with the objects
only in visible range.
[/b]
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PIII 800
ASUS CSLU-2
150mhz FSB
512mb PC133 .8ns
gForce3 Ti200
Det 23.11 drivers
WINMODEM PCI 230ms average
SB16 latest drivers
After an OS and AH partition reformat my frame rate went up 10-15%. Now typicaly 75 tower, 65-75 inflight, 25 minimum at a smoky vulched field.
I am interested in what difference a usb modem would do for my frame rates.
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A USB modem would kill your frame rates. Any USB based device that requires a steady stream of data will cause the CPU to be swamped.
A good external modem will probably increase your frame rates from the Winmodem you are using now.
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God I long for the good ol days when at 1am PST there wound be 4 rooks online and taking a base was just a matter of how fast you could get the goon there LOL> best was capturing the rearward base and just uppin tanks to the HQ and blinding them rooks also, then 2 of the 4 would get pissed and log off leaving 2 rooks to defend LOL :D
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Originally posted by kkierste
Ok, I'm replacing this...
AMD K6-2 300
196MB PC 133 RAM
32 MB GeForce 256 Based Elsa Erazor X with dedicated IRQ (11)
AOpen 56k PCI data-fax-voice
MB is AX59 PRO (AOpen) with Via Mvp chipset
SB Live! (Brand new)
with this
AMD xp 1800
256MB PC333 on a Gigabyte 7vrx KT333
XP home
nVidia GeForce2 Mx-400 64MB agp
Here come's the judge...
Will post results when I get system
And the system came, and it was good...
Framerates jumped 10 or so on old setup, and now (even before I get tweak happy) my new system runs at between 40-55 normally...
The Judge absolves AH of all responsibility and sentences Ogun to life in a Lanc. :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by Ogun
The Judge absolves AH of all responsibility and sentences Ogun to life in a Lanc. :rolleyes:
I take it you won't be joining the hordes who are leaving then? :p Glad you got it sorted out in the end... - hey, and what's wrong with Lancs? ;)
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I am currently running a PII 400MHZ myself...I have seen dramatic increases big time with FR. My average was around 30...After 1.09 patch 2 it has jumped to averaging about 50. I have a Hercules 3D Prophet II MX GeForce2MX 32 MB Video Card. I have updated drivers and have gotten a better internet connection if that would give me that much better FR. People with slow computers like mine, and im sure a lot others, just need to bite the bullet and try everything to make computer run faster.
~BlueiceJ~
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Glad to see so many good ideas and hints.
Thought I might add a tidbit too. Checking the performance tab on the WIN95 and 98 machines and making sure you are running 90% or so. If yer not, close down everything except Systray and Explorer. (Ctrl+Alt+Del). I have also found as was previously mentioned, Instant Messenger is a hog as well as many Anti Virus products.
I am running WIN98 667 MHZ...256 MB PC133 RAM...GeForce2 32MB AGP.........SB16 old card....DSL and my FPS are solid at 45+ in 1024 x 768 16bit. When I first built this machine, and in earlier versions, I started getting 100+ FPS at altitude, but 60+ to 70 in furballs, but I think the video card has lost some of it's virility with all the flying I do :D I could update the drivers, but if it ain't broke, I won't fix it-or even try. I can live with it like this for a while.
K-KEN
http://www.cutthroats.com/
(http://www.cutthroats.com/art/buttons/on_patch8Xs.gif)
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It's a total waste of money to swap Erazor X to a MX2 400.. They're identical in performance.
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K-Ken
Why dont you try and to a little O?C to both your CPU and video card ... just a little bit would help a lot. Check this site out.
http://www.overclockers.com/
sprint