Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Rojo on August 01, 2001, 04:10:00 PM
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Hey, everyone else is doing them…why not me? The P-40 is my favorite plane, and is likely in the hopper over at HTC. My own preference is for the P-40N (approx. 3000 built). There are a number of famous paint schemes/nationalities HTC could choose to model, as this aircraft served in almost every theater, and in the air forces of every Allied nation. Below are some of the possibilities. Mine own vote is either Royal Australian Air Force or Royal New Zealand Air Force. ANZAC force operated the P-40, in all its variants, literally from the start of WWII to the end of it.
RAAF
RNZAF
AVG Chinese (ala the Flying Tigers)
RAF (Africa/Med scheme)
USAAF 5th AF
Red Air Force
Vote now!
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China
RAAF
RNZAF
USA, UK, USSR have plenty of other planes they can put their markings on. :)
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AVG Chinese (ala the Flying Tigers)
eskimo
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FLYING TIGERS OR ITS NOT A P40.
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Though I'm a fan of the Chinese AVG markings, from a historical perspective is anyone sure that any P-40Ns served in China with AVG markings? If not, then you're limited to the earlier models and not the N-model. If so, then Chinese markings it is :)
Second choice is the RAF - Africa scheme
[ 08-01-2001: Message edited by: SpitLead ]
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The P-40 N did not serve with the AVG in China. But, who is to say that the N should be modeled, I say the earlier is more accurate of it's war time use. Lastly since the aircraft is of US origin, it should have US markings on it, and "blah" to all those who whine and say their airforce flew it better. If a marking should be put on this aircraft, my vote is for the Operation Torch color scheme, basically a desert camo scheme with the US insignia surrounded by a 4 inch yellow band. Followed up with an RAF fin flash marking so the damn Brits would not shoot at it. My second choice would be the Nationalist Chinese Markings used by the AVG in China, as they were the ones that first put the aircraft to it's best use. Note I said "best". Finally my 3rd and final color scheme is the Soviet Air Force, even though they used it poorly, and most were destroyed by the Finns and Germans. My reasoning for this 3rd choice is simply that this aircraft will get wasted in the MA, and it will be better represented as a Soviet aircraft, as it spins down in flames! ;)
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Bodhi..."ouch" on that last comment about spinning down in flames. Remember, it's not the crate but the man in the crate that counts - Baron von Richtofen
[ 08-01-2001: Message edited by: SpitLead ]
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Well, my choice would be a P-40N, and since we're unlikely to see any other aircraft with Chinese markings, maybe we need our P-40Ns to be CACW.
That way, we can also have an earlier model P-40 in AVG markings.
We are gonna have lots and lots of different P-40s, right? ;)
anRky
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P-40B in AVG colours
P-40E in RNZAF colours
P-40N-1 in RAAF colours
If USAAF has to have one, make it one of the units based on the Aleutian islands.
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USAAF P-40E
China (flying Tigers) P-40B
RAF africa/med P-40N
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RNZAF all the way
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AVG or me and funk open a can!
get down on it!@
flying tigers or its puke...
LaVaDog
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P-40B AVG
P-40E USAAF
P-40N RAAF
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A) Its gotta have shark teeth on it.
B) votes from MOL dweebs don't count.
Hooligan
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Yeah! Flying Tigers or it's me!
<g> Hey, they named a plane "yak", so what's wrong with "puke"?
My $.02:
AVG
USAAF
-Puke
332nd Flying Mongrels
[ 08-02-2001: Message edited by: Steven ]
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Hmmmm
(http://www.tir.com/~lkbrown1/06212.gif)
[ 08-02-2001: Message edited by: Downtown ]
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What's with all this number stuff?
You guys talking about the Warhawk, Tomahawk or a Kittyhawk?
Dam yanks, we're not just numbers!
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South African Airforce!
P-40's flown by the SAAF include:
Curtiss P-40B Tomahawk 1941
Curtiss P-40C Tomahawk IIB 1940 - 1942
Curtiss P-40E Kittyhawk IA 1942 - 1944
Curtiss P-40 Kittyhawk III ? - ?
Curtiss P-40M Kittyhawk IV 1942 - 1948
Curtiss P-40N Warhawk 1943 - 1948
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To heck with the paint scheme (although I do prefer the AVG scheme) -- GIVE US THE P-40!!!
(Please)
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I couldn't find the original superlong post about bringing the P-40 to AH... so this one will have to do...
BUMP!!!!!!
P-40B in AVG colors please :)
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ya kno the RCAF had a BEEEEEEEEEEEEAUTIFUL p-40 paint scheme, along with the spits:D
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Yalls hearts are in the right places so I have no need to say anything :).
PS AVG Flying Tigers all the way!!!!! :)
Cw
=Twin Engined Devils=
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the RAF africa were the first to use the "sharks teeth" paint.
i vote for RAF north africa
the AVG P40's were speical built ,cause all the reg production p40's were going to england, the AVG engines were built from out of spec parts that were hand finished so they ended up with "blueprinted" engines that put out more power than std production engines.
only 100 AVG P40's were built
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My vote is on the Flying Tigers :)
I think generally that's the favorite among all foavorite schemes
for P-40s :)
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mmm.. Now if we just had A6M2s :)
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naah... give us P-36 ;)
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Alot of you can have your cake and eat it too!
The Flying Tigers were disbanded in July1942, however the air group (23rd FG) that took their place continued using P-40s with shark mouth motifs, until late '44 or '45, when the P-51A started replacing them.
So you could get a P-40E, P-40K, P-40M, or P-40N with 23rd FG markings and it woudl have the shark mouth.
The P-40 flew in nearly every combat theater, so I hope we get several different models with a good variety of color schemes. Definitely a China P-40 with a sharkmouth, but also a British P-40 in desert camo. :cool:
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Performance Specs on the AVG P-40????
Cw
=Twin Engined Devils=
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Allright firs off. The P-40 was an AMERICAN PLANE, OF AMERICAN DESINGE. you brits have the spits temps typhoons hurri's and other things. The americans need more fighters and bombers. Allso give us the FLYING TIGERS:D :D :D In my mind probibly the best fighter squadren ever:D They fley and were totaly out classed by the Japanies Aircraft. The americans deserve the P-40 in the AMERICAN SCHEEM, Keep the warhawk from going AWAL.:mad: That was my rant:D :p
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Brief translation of the reply above minus the nationalism: Like me, he wants a P-40B in AVG markings :D
Of course it wouldn't be such a bad idea to dress a P-40C in AVG colors to permit carriage of a drop tank, unless HTC wouldn't mind adding both at one time since they are almost identical.
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any of the above.
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thank you streak. do you wanna see what i would do to F6F'S. MUAHAHAHAHA
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No Viper! No!... P-40s shoot Japanese aircraft not F6Fs!
Save all that rage for Zekes, Tonys, and Georges until the Oscars show up.
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oh yea i forgot. was still in my aces mode i need to find a pic of a burning Zero. but i hate those F6's in the ma those .50's hurt
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That F6F brings Cavalear to mind for some reason .... :D
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that pic is of me crashing my F6F in order to take the P-40:D :D When i get more money im gona make a p-40 squadren:cool: Those Jap planes are gonna fry:D :D :D :D
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Keep this thred alive PLEASE:D
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Maybe 1.09 is taking so long to be released because as a big surprise, every variant/paint scheme of P-40 ever requested is coming out with this release :D
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:D
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While it looks really mean, I prefer the sleeker B/C nose.
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Do we get to have these too? :D
(http://user.chollian.net/~hartmannshim/images/010406bloodchit1.jpg)
"This person is an American pilot fighting against the Japanese invaders.
He is currently in trouble. Anyone who finds him save his life, protect him
and help him return to his base.
(http://user.chollian.net/~hartmannshim/images/010406bldchit2.jpg)
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Originally posted by john9001
the RAF africa were the first to use the "sharks teeth" paint.
i vote for RAF north africa
the AVG P40's were speical built ,cause all the reg production p40's were going to england, the AVG engines were built from out of spec parts that were hand finished so they ended up with "blueprinted" engines that put out more power than std production engines.
only 100 AVG P40's were built
Britain's order came under the Lend-Lease agreement.
Of an original order for 471 Tomahawk IIB fighters, AK100 - AK500. Of these 21 were lost at sea en route to Britain. Of the remaining Tomahawks "125 were shipped to Russia and 9 transferred to the RCAF and one to the Turkish Air Force. 36 were diverted to China for use by the 'Flying Tigers'. Britain released a total of 100 Tomahawks to the AVG which adopted the famous shark's teeth nose emblem originating with the RAF which used the markings on its Tomahawks in North Africa during 1940."
Tomahawk/Kittyhawk Models
Tomahawk (Model 81) A total of 1180 delivered under British direct-purchase contracts. In addition, the RAF took over ten P40C fighters from the USAAC. The RAF operated them as Tomahawks of an unspecified mark and without RAF serial numbers.
Tomahawk I (Model H81-A) A total of 140 equivalents to the USAAC P40, except for four wing guns, were ordered on two contracts with deliveries commencing in April 1940. It was decided that these were unsuitable for combat use and they were relegated to training roles.
Tomahawk II Designation not used officially for specific aircraft, but was a generalisation for improved Tomahawks delivered during October and November 1940.
Tomahawk IIA (Model H81-A2) Protective armour and externally-covered self-sealing fuel tanks on 110 aircraft equivalent to the P40B. 23 transferred to the USSR and one to Canada as an instructional airframe.
Tomahawk IIB (Model H-81-A2, A3) A total of 930 in four lots. These were generally equivalent to the P40C and were used extensively by the RAF and SAAF in North Africa as from 16 June 1941. Of these, 100 fighters unofficially designated H81-A3 were released to China and used by the AVG. A further 23 went to the USSR, and unspecified numbers went to Turkey and Egypt.
Kittyhawk The French contract for Curtiss Model 87s was taken over by Britain prior to construction commencing. The airframe and engine changes justified the new name - Kittyhawk. A total of 560 was procured on direct-purchase contracts and a further 2432 were supplied by the Lend-Lease programme, bringing the total to 2992.
Kittyhawk I (Model A87-A2) Fitted with four .50 cal wing guns, the 560 fighters were comparable to the P40D. The UK took over the initial French order and deliveries commenced in August 1941, with 72 diverted to Canada, and 17 to Turkey.
Kittyhawk IA (Model H87-A3, A4) The 1500 fighters were direct equivalents of the P40E and were delivered under the USAAC designation P40-1 to distinguish the British equipment etc. from those for US service. Many were diverted to Canada, Australia and New Zealand.
Kittyhawk II (Model H87-B3) WW2 British sources identify the 330 RAF P40Fs and P40Ls as Kittyhawk IIs; later records list the first 230 as Kittyhawk IIAs. 81 were transferred to the USAAC overseas and 7 were given to the Free French Air Force. RNZAF had one.
Kittyhawk III Of the 616 Kittyhawk IIIs, the first 192 were P40K-1s, the next 160 were P40Ls, and the final 264 were P40Ms. The last 170 were diverted to the USSR. 9 P40K-1s were delivered to the RCAF on 26 Nov 1942 retaining their US serials.
Kittyhawk IV (Model H87V, W) The final 586 Kittyhawks were USAAC P40Ns delivered from Mar 1943 - Jan 1944 of which 130 were diverted to the USSR. The type was used by the RAAF, RNZAF and the RCAF.
(When Curtiss introduced the P40F powered by the Rolls Royce Merlin engine, the new name Warhawk was applied to distinguish it from the Allison-engined P40D and P40E. This name was not adopted by the RAF for the re-engined model, and the name Kittyhawk was retained for both versions of the Model 87). [/i]
Although the P40 was used by many nations during WW2, the UK was the only purchaser of the type other than the USAAC. Many RAF models were released for use by other Allied air forces (for free??).
Taken from 'Lend-Lease Aircraft in World War II' - Arthur Pearcy
Hmm... hope some of you found the above information interesting! :)
Regards
Nexx
PS I would love to see an AVG P40, and either RAF/RCAF/RAAF/SAAF P40 in North Africa colours.
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Take your pick.
Note the difference in Shark mouth designs.
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Replicant said:
Tomahawk IIB (Model H-81-A2, A3) A total of 930 in four lots. These were generally equivalent to the P40C and were used extensively by the RAF and SAAF in North Africa as from 16 June 1941. Of these, 100 fighters unofficially designated H81-A3 were released to China and used by the AVG. A further 23 went to the USSR, and unspecified numbers went to Turkey and Egypt.
Taken from 'Lend-Lease Aircraft in World War II' - Arthur Pearcy
End Quote.
From what I have been told by the people who flew them, the AVG P-40's had NUMBERS from that production series, but that the airframes and engines were not built to standard. The AVG birds had more power, lighter weight and the radio sets were not mill spec. (I think on the last)
The true model is H81A-2, not H81-A3.
Engine
These engines were built to Allison Specifications 145A, rather than Spec 120D and identified as the V-1710-C15A. There were no military designation for these engines.
It is estimated that in the heat of the battle or disengaging from enemy fighters, some engines had drawn between 1600 and 1700 Horse power. (This would give a power to weight ration of better than even the vaunted Zero had.)
At one time on a photo recon flight, while circling my objective, apparently I had run into my own prop wash, but at the moment thought it was A A fire. I pushed the throttle forward but when I settled down I saw that I pulling 50 in Hg, and quickly reduced it to 40 inches. According to the Horse power chart was 1380 HP.
Roll rate
200 mph 95 degree/sec
240 mph 105 degrees/sec
280 mph 110 degree/sec
320 mph 105 degree/sec
360 mph 100 degree/sec
400 mph 90 Degree/sec
Perfomance
The AVG's H81A-2 was 355/360 mph at 14,500 feet compared to the H81-A2's speed of 340 mph.
This info is from Erik Shilling, AVG pilot.
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Again, the ones that went to the AVG were "unofficially designated H81-A3 ", hence as they were 'unofficial' they still officially remained H81-A2. Therefore for them to be 'unofficially called H81-A3s' it would mean that they had modifications like the ones you describe.
So the non-standard P40s you describe is supported by it's 'unofficial' name.
This makes sense to me... they were unofficial because they wanted to distinguish them from the standard model.
Regards
Nexx
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If we get p40n I hope it looks like this .
(http://home.satx.rr.com/suvorov/p40n.jpg)
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KEEP THIS THRED GOING MABY HITECH WILL NOTICE:D :p :D :p :D :p :rolleyes: :eek:
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The P-40 is a GREAT AIRPLANE,yes it need's to be in Aces High!!
This airplane has worn many faces in it's lifetime! Everyone has
there favorite! Let's remember who made this airplane into a
legend, who put it in the history book's, who were the Hero's
of a proud nation!! The AVG Flying Tiger's!! The AVG flew the
P-40 B Model. They drove the Japaneese from China with the B
model!! The P-40 B with it's shark mouth and wicked eye's is
the airplane that everybody knows!! So AH if we get this proud
bird let's salute the the Men and their plane that made history!
The GREAT "AMERICAN VOLUNTEER GROUP" and there P-40B.
Sixter
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Sixter calm down. Not everyone knows flying tigers. Not everyone thinks handful of american pilots drove Japanese out of China. That may not be the case in US...but have you ever thought why?
It's cool paintjob. And I believe it was flown by good pilots, but...
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But the majority of players of this game are American, and the majority of Americans who know anything about WWII fighters know about the Flying Tigers. John Wayne even made a cute movie about them.
US gringos love their John Wayne heros and their US dollars go toward anything that lets them live out their John Wayne fantasies. We have every right to get excited about things we love, whether you know them or love them yourself :D
I am all for adding every World II plane in every conceivable variant and paint scheme, but in a WWII flight sim being marketed to Americans, the P-40B in AVG markings should be a pretty high priority for an early war planeset as evidenced by the number and length of threads about the P-40 in this BB alone. The only American aircraft that would be of equal importance would be the F4F. When the P-40B is added, it would make sense to add the F4F, A6M2, and the Oscar as well. Could this be the theme for AH 1.10? Early Pacific!
I think if any aircraft is more deserving to be added to the planeset than the P-40B, it is the Ju87. I don't know about anyone else, but for me, "World War II" conjures up an image of the Ju87 diving on Poland with sirens screaming and fat German POW camp guards who like apple studel and know nothing.
Of course, there is plenty of room for Finnish variants of F2A Buffalos, British Gladiators, French De.520s, or any other plane most Americans have never seen or heard of.
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US gringos love their John Wayne heros and their US dollars go toward anything that lets them live out their John Wayne fantasies.
ROFL! I guess you gotta have the point there. :)
What about John Wayne modeled in her cockpit?(imagine pilot leaning to side window frame) I guess I would like to have one too.