Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: majic on April 14, 2002, 01:19:38 AM
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Just wondering what people think. When you play are you just lookin for a furball, or a milkrun, or do you like to play the strat game and take bases? Do Bish and Rooks do things different from Knights? (I have the most fun when we are working as a team, what about you?)
Some thing else: It seems the more people online the less teamwork there is. Is it too crowded in the MA?
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In my time in Aces High. I've been in all categories. When I started 2+ years ago, all I knew was fighters. I built my squad up with good fighter pilots. Before long, we got tired of doing just that, and started capturing fields. We got really good at it and did it a lot. There's no telling how many field capture missions I put in the planner. I got to the point where I got irritatated if countrymen were just furballing and not watching the big picture. Now I've come full circle. I'm back to just flying fighters. I don't give a rip about strat, although I understand other guys enjoy that. But when I log on now, I just grab a fighter and have fun. Being the general gets to the point to where you wonder if it's work or play. To heck with that. I just have fun these days.
As far as the countries go, they're all the same. Sure, you're going to have different personalities in each country which adds to the fun, but it's just different people in a game. rooks, bishes, and knights are no more evil than each other. My squad changed from rook to knight a few weeks ago after flying rook for 2+ years. We recieved a private message telling us how cowardly we are. Tell me that guy doesn't need a life. :)
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Huh? Assassins Knight now? :)
I'm mostly a lone wolf, enjoy long range high altitude intruder flights aswell as low alt fights. Like it best up high though where you can fight with one or two people without getting jumped by ten of their friends or they getting jumped by ten of my friends.
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I have been on base taking missions but don't really enjoy em. With so many people and the bases so far apart it is mostly organized gangbanging. I don't like being gangbanged and I don't like fighting for scraps so missions hold little appeal for me. I also don't play for more than an hour or so at a time so overwhelming a few feilds is not that apealing. I mean.... What's the point?
I like to find a fight between two fields that has a lot of planes involved and the numbers no too lopsided. If I get killed or run out of ammo or fuel I can get back into the fight quickly in such a setup. I like a lot of planes in the air at the same time from both/all three sides. If there are a lot of planes involved you can usually sneak home too without 8 fast planes chasing you down before you get to your base.
lazs
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Originally posted by majic
Just wondering what people think. When you play are you just lookin for a furball, or a milkrun, or do you like to play the strat game and take bases? Do Bish and Rooks do things different from Knights? (I have the most fun when we are working as a team, what about you?)
Some thing else: It seems the more people online the less teamwork there is. Is it too crowded in the MA?
I like doing a bit of everything.
eskimo
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Originally posted by hblair
But when I log on now, I just grab a fighter and have fun. Being the general gets to the point to where you wonder if it's work or play. To heck with that. I just have fun these days.
Oh NO!
THEY'VE taken over hblair's mind TOO! THEY got HIM!
They're HERE! They're HERE!
I knew it! I knew it! THEY'RE already walking AMONGST US!!!
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
;)
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teamwork? because we both fly for knights doesn't mean we are on the same team.
when most folks talk about teamwork or better, organization, they are basical saying fly and attack what I say is more important. I dont care anything about resets but for some they seem to take it personally if they arent on the "winning" side. I have more fun when we are pushed near reset then gang raping the the last 2 rook bases.
Most field grabbers dont have a clue. And most of the guys on the country channel crying about "team work" arent the guys who can go in deack a field or level a town on thier own. Thats why they cry for teamwork.
You want teamwork convince folks to do the basics like check 6 calls and clearing 6's. Teach them how to drag so their country mates dont have to bleed all their e to clear them. It doesnt take a team to cature a base. It doesnt take a team to gang bang 1 side until you reset them. Most gangbangers arent working as a team. They are fighting each other for easy kills.
I am only a part of 1 team, 3./JG2.
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Wotan, I think you misunderstand me. I don't want you to do anything but enjoy the game. :) I enjoy it my way, you enjoy it your way. I just wanted to get some opinions.
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:) thats my opinion not a criticism of how you fly. I dont know or care how anyone chooses to enjoy there game. If you have fun great.
The airmarshalls and generals and land grabbers are the ones with the problem. They dont seem to appreciate the fact that some only play ah to enjoy the A2A combat. Most who talk of teamwork and organization really dont want either. They want the rest to comply with there idea of what we should be doing in the main.
I am not saying you do this because I dont know. But in general this has been my experience with the teamwork types.
It might be better if you explain your idea of teamwork. Is it everyone doing the same thing? land grabbing? pushing for a reset? or what?
I think that teamwork is a bit more broad then that. That checking 6s, clearing 6s, not kill stealing, watching killshooter, etc are much more important to bring about a sense of team then "lets all hit a12" or "stop hitting bish you are helping them win".
again just mho. I point no finger or make any judgement about how you spend your time in AH. Have fun doing what ever you like to do. But I think the "lets get organized" types oughta offer that attitude to those who dont enjoy their version of ah.
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"I think that teamwork is a bit more broad then that. That checking 6s, clearing 6s, not kill stealing, watching killshooter, etc are much more important to bring about a sense of team then "lets all hit a12" or "stop hitting bish you are helping them win". "
I think teamwork involves all those points. Also base defense, missions, etc...
PS. -I'm not trying to get everyone to come around to my way, I think everyone has the right to play the way they want. (except Lazs, he bothers me. ;) )
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Teamwork to me means I don't shoot at the green icons- mainly because of killshooter. ;)
Sometimes I pitch in, some times I don't. The surest way to get me to avoid helping is for someone to start the pitiful wailing on country channel. I get bossed around at work enough, I don't wanna log in for more of the same for my fun time.
Lazs, sounds to me by your description you ought to visit the Tunisia map in the CT. Other than it being Axis/Allied, it is pretty much what you sound like you want.
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I like stratigey :) gettin like 3-4 bombers to fly with me in formation, planning your attack etc. I don't really care if I'm winning or loosing actuelly I like to be on the loosing side,
and try to get things orginized and defeating a greater enemy :)
One game we were out numbered 2 to 1 and wound up with a kill ratio of 2 for every 1 we lost, I even survived a 4v1 but was forced to ditch cuz of fuel, those are the kinda games I like :)
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yep kieran it is funny how the CT is slowly turning into the "furball" arena that so many of it's members derided as dweeby in the main. Still... Axis Vs Allied is a tough handicap to get over. No variety and little parity..
I would love to see "average" stats. I have mentioned them before. Average K/D, average K/T gunnery etc... when people say "there is no action" or "there is a lot of action" we will have a yardstick to look at. If a guy says "you should fly my way because it is action packed an I am on the edge of my seat at all times" and then you see that he get's into a fight once every houur and a half and the average is every 15 minutes... If someone says "I have no trouble finding action in the __ area" and the average K/T in that arena is 3 times some other one...
majic... it's good that you are not trying to get people to come around to your way.. It would be very disappointing for you. As your desiples got more talented they would be leaving the flock.
lazs
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I've been doing the online flightsim thing for a long time, so I go for variety -- missions, lone wolf, furballing, tanks, boats, bombers, goons, field guns -- I do them all.
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I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude. I will not respond to Lazs2's condescending attitude.
Ain't a gonna do it.
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I like to think of myself as a pure team player. If there's a mission up, I'm in it. As soon as I log in, I check in on Channel 2 and ask if there are Eggs, or goons needed anywhere.
Honestly, I find gooning as boring as hell, but it's a necessary evil to me. The worst is the resupply run. Risk your bellybutton for nothing but helping the team and completing a sortie.
Either way, I enjoy a good furball from time to time, but I have to agree with Lazs. A Furballs only fun when the numbers are pretty close. WHo wants to fly into the middle of a gang bang.
Now, gimme a B-26 on a strike mission, where I can blast GV's, and fight off bogs all the way and I'm a happy pilot.
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Ok, I change my answer to just "No".
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I enjoy both furballing without a wingman/team mate and flying missions with a team. Variety is the spice of life.
Without the real people interaction I get in my squad this game would grow old quick.
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Teamwork in the MA should be on a more fundamental level. Right now, the general concensus seems to be that teamwork means getting 40 people together to fly to a field. I am not for that.
Fought a Spit and N1K2 flying together the other day. It was one of the first coordinated team efforts I've seen in a long time. Their timing was excellent and the fights were extremely tough. One would bait.. the other would swoop. It was executed quite nicely. It occured to me at the time how rarely I see that in the MA anymore.
And Lazs... the arena size grew because AW shut down and HTC has been on an advertising blitz. That means new people to the game. The best way to learn the fighters and their guns is to fly them in furballs. Many people do that when they are starting out. Most people's abilities mature and they end up wanting a tad bit more from the game. I remember kindergarden being really fun... I just don't know why someone would want to stay there for 3 years.
AKDejaVu
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You're here to have fun. You're paying HiTech Creations 15 bucks a month. Seems silly not to do what you have fun doing.
Dam that was simple wasn't it?
:D
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Umm, for the time being (maybe indefinitely?) I don't have the time to play in all the MA strat game stuff. I can't even afford the time to join a squad. So... I fly lone wolf most of the time doing whatever it is that will make me happy in the time I do have. Sometimes I may actually try to help my country. Othertimes I may try to defend a vulched base all by myself. I am not against teamwork, but I simply don't have the time to commit to it. In the end, I just like flying and am not too concerned about whose kill ratio is what or which side is about to get reset.
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Originally posted by streakeagle
Umm, for the time being (maybe indefinitely?) I don't have the time to play in all the MA strat game stuff. I can't even afford the time to join a squad. So... I fly lone wolf most of the time doing whatever it is that will make me happy in the time I do have. Sometimes I may actually try to help my country. Othertimes I may try to defend a vulched base all by myself. I am not against teamwork, but I simply don't have the time to commit to it. In the end, I just like flying and am not too concerned about whose kill ratio is what or which side is about to get reset.
Beautiful, and exactly my situation. Whether or not that is kindergarten flying (S! AKDejaVu!) matters to me little. I take what I can get, just like you.
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"...Most people's abilities mature and they end up wanting a tad bit more from the game. I remember kindergarden being really fun... I just don't know why someone would want to stay there for 3 years....".
I've read this point of view in various forms on this BBS...basically it requires no talent to furball. The real skill is in BnZ style fighting.
Never quite understood that. In a typical furball situation you are in a plane that cannot outrun anybody. This means to survive you have to stand and fight, outflying the opposition. Meanwhile a BnZ type flies a very fast plane and typically only enters a fight with an E or SA advantage. When the fight starts to go badly, his plane choice allows him to exit the fight at will.
I can get tired of furballs also, just like you would with anything over time....but to bring skill-level or maturity into it is ridiculous. I suspect those comments come from people who find it tough to survive in a furball.
bowser
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Bowser-
Anytime you paint with that broad a brush you inevitably tar the wrong people with the right.
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For you furball guys: Would you join a fighter sweep mission?
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I might join any mission, but I won't sit in the tower for even 5 minutes waiting for it to start. Too little time to play as it is.
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it isnt a question of "furball" vrs "strat". I jabo, buff, gv and occassionallly fly a goon.
I fly missions occassionally. But my idea of "teamwork" has nothing to do with anyone aspect. What it comes down to is if you enjoy the mission planner aspect of ah then go for it. But a lot of folks aren't into a 40 people mission gangbang of an undefended field. Also when folks dont join its particularly annoying to hear the guy aking the mission screaming over channel 2 "join my mission" then when no one does to listen to him then complain how stupid everyone else is because they wont follow his idea of how the game should go.
People enjoy A2A combat above everything else.
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deja.. I do fly in a squad and as such.. we have "teamwork" but the goal is killing the red planes.
I think that the strat in AH and any sim is the kindergarden. It is extremely simplistic and, if done properly, risk free and a waste of time.
I see more fluffs and GV's and PT boats and gunners than ever before. A lot of the more timid guys are doing the easy things....
furballs are everchanging. the combos are allmost infinite. I thought you would have known this by now. I also would agree with you that new guys that will eventually be good ALL start out in furballs. You can't learn how to fight if you don't strain your abilities and SA. Caution and timidity only lngthen the learning curve.
lazs
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strat.. per se, is less 'simple' than furballing lazs.
Variety . depends on my mood.
sometimes I'm into the mindless lazs furball,
sometimes it's GV's or strat.. fighter sweeps, etc.
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Originally posted by majic
...When you play are you just lookin for a furball, or a milkrun, or do you like to play the strat game and take bases?...
Yes
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For the most part I get my fill of teamwork in our squad time. TOD's rock, and teamwork there really counts. Been getting some lately in the CT, been some great flying in the current setup.
Brady
So when I'm up in main I'm looking for 2 or 3 good kills, and perhaps the chance to match up against one of the really good pilots. Perhaps a good vulch or maybe a nice long pony chase.
That does't mean I won't help out if someone I know asks for help. But I won't do it because some general is pounding on the radio about it.
First rule is don't tell someone else how to play the game.
Second rule is respect and consideration for all.
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Originally posted by lazs
I see more fluffs and GV's and PT boats and gunners than ever before. A lot of the more timid guys are doing the easy things....
Why do you continue to have a one-dimensional, myopic, and condescending attitude towards anyone that doesn't play the "game" the same as you ?
We use GVs alot, and I can assure you that no one in the MAW is "timid". GVs, IMO, are now playing an important role in the game, for those of us that like to take bases. Labeling people that use any vehicle besides a plane as "timid" and are opting for something that is "easy" is wrong.
Originally posted by lazs
furballs are everchanging. the combos are allmost infinite. I thought you would have known this by now. I also would agree with you that new guys that will eventually be good ALL start out in furballs. You can't learn how to fight if you don't strain your abilities and SA. Caution and timidity only lngthen the learning curve.
The WHOLE game is completely dynamic, operative word being "WHOLE". I have only been flying since January (never flew any sim prior) and I think at this point, I can hold my own, and it WAS NOT ALL due to furballing. Furballing is like shooting fish in a barrel. A target rich environment where it is NOT HARD to find some unsuspecting plane that would be easy to shoot down. If I need perk points, I simply up in an F6F or a F4U-1 off a carrier and BnZ 'till my hearts content or get shot down by some guy that is doing the same thing as me. Can be boring at times.
I enjoy taking bases. That's what AH does for me, but I will not insult or label anyone that chooses to play AH otherwise. You should do the same.
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Hey Slap,
Do me a favor and wing up with me tonight on a few BnZ's.
I need work on my fighter skills and I don't see Ice around much lately.
Meanwhile, I have been working on a few new mission's for Squad night. I hope you don't value your score too highly!:D
Oh, and Lazs, does gooning count as a "No skill" aspect of the game. (No sarcasm here, really want to hear what you think)
I think goon drivers are some of the most resiliant pilots in the game. Flying NoE, for extended periods, in an ungunned plane made out of cardboard is gutsy in my book. (And not because I do it...cause I hate it)
But I have to admit, some of my most exciting moments have taken place in a goon. Just 2 days ago, I was trying to slip into a semi-capped base, and had to dodge 3 HO attempts from desperate enemy fighters just to make my drop. Great fun, even if most of the drunks got strafed.
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Sure muck ... BUT Ice is a master at "BnZ". I have been watching/studying Ice for awhile now and still have a lot to learn.
Score !!! ... nah ... not a concern (It all starts over on May 1st). Missions and taking bases ... ready, willing, and able.
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I have to agree majic.
teamwork is the best............
sometimes,you don't know if people might be playing allsides.
but I would choose teamwork.:cool: :) :cool:
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The Team work is what keeps me interested in AH, but There are times when I am lonewolfing it... I fly almost any plane that is offered, including GV's and whatever else is availible... I figure that if I understand the flight models of all the planes I will know how to fight against them sooner or later.. "Hopefully sooner"
Laz sounds like he should be back in AW! is amazing how someone can throw a wrench in every thread he posts too..
Fortunantly we have freedom of speech and Lazs is doing what he is able to do..Speak what he feels..
as long as you all pay your monthley dues to HT, Fly when, where, how, and what you want to fly... And don't worry about
what other people think, cause it aint ther business!!
Enjoy the "GAME"
T0J0
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I've learned not to take the tone of Lazs' posts too seriously. Beneath it all he has some good points.
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shhhhhhh....
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I've read this point of view in various forms on this BBS...basically it requires no talent to furball. The real skill is in BnZ style fighting.
Ummm... that has nothing to do with my post. I don't comment on BnZ vs Turnfighting... since that is solely preference based. And the assumption that BnZ and Furballs are somehow seperate is somewhat ludicrous too. Hell... BnZ is one of the best furball tactics you can use.
The point is... furballing is a good way to learn about the aircraft handling and gunning. You turn.. dive... shoot at every angle. It really helps you get a feel for the FM.
After a while though... many discover that doing the same thing over and over and over can get somewhat tedius. Many look to get a little more out of the game and decide to try doing something else to add to their repretoir. Some would call it moving on or maturing. Well... most would call it that.
AKDejaVu
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Some would call it moving on or maturing. Well... most would call it that.
...others call it "arrogant".
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Not really kieren. Maybe if I insisted that one aspect of the game was the only one that mattered. It seems to be the primary squeak by most of the true complainers on this bbs.
Theres more to the game than some are willing to admit, acknowledge or explore.
Now.. check your definition of arrogance.
AKDejaVu
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Now there may be a point (connotation vs. derivation), but you must admit there is more to the AH world than the "One size fits all" mold all the advocates try to paint. People are complex and are motivated by their own combination of skills, conditions, mentality, etc., but assigning the "maturity" or "intelligence" cards is frought with peril- the connotation is overwhelmingly negative for either appelation.
Now, if you mean people will generally first furball, then learn the strat of the game- agreed. The learning curve is such that people will fly, then determine what matters in terms of "winning" a war.
Streakeagle summed up my category perfectly- want more, can't have more. Others may be burned out on the strat thing, etc. Some will decide it is a nice addition and pursue their learning in that area, yet some will say, "Nope, not for me". Again, maturity isn't the issue.
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Again, maturity isn't the issue.
Maturity isn't always the issue.
If the game doesn't offer enough for you... then fine. If you insist on playing just one aspect of the game then complaining about the rest of it... see above.
AKDejaVu
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Originally posted by Kieran
...others call it "arrogant".
Spot on sir .
I fly AH cause I like airplanes....nuff said. Don't care if I suck and never will. Some obviously feel their way is more mature.....I remember kindergarden being really fun... I just don't know why someone would want to stay there for 3 years.
Now I'm sure you didn't mean to offend DV, but that is a little bit back handed don't you think?
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Yep.. it is backhanded.
And it really only applies to one person I've seen post on this bbs.
AKDejaVu
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Originally posted by AKDejaVu
I remember kindergarden being really fun... I just don't know why someone would want to stay there for 3 years.
AKDejaVu
I don't remember doing you no harm, why bring my personal experiences into this post?
NUTTZ
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Sorry Nuttz... I should have added that it wasn't intended as a remark towards anyone that actually spent 3 years in Kindergarden. ;)
AKDejaVu
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Ah, I think I see where you're pointed now.
FWIW, if I had the time I would be one of the most strat-minded, squad-involved, play-all-the-time type of guys. I don't have the time, therefore I take out of the game what I can. I think Streakeagle was saying the same thing.
You know me, and you know I would never take away from any legitimate form of gameplay (legitimate as defined by HTC). Just different flavors, and variety is good. ;)
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I can only go by my own experiances over the years. Nothing I have done in sims holds my interest like huge amounts of planes all fighting it out. I find strat and missions per se to be boring about 90% of the time. I don't get anything out of the achieving the goal end of it. A well planned one means little or no action and a poorly planned one means getting gangbanged a long way from any help.
GV's? well... they would be fine if they fought each other but for the most part they are highly dependant on fighters to make their fun.. they simply wait around for a fighter to make their day. same for fluffs ... killing fighters abilities is their only function. they are totally dependant on fighters to make themselves useful.
I will admit that I fly the planes I like badly or, wrong. I fur with the -1a and get it low and slow. I will admit that I fly it "mindlessly" as wlfgang so aptly points out. The way I fly it tho I don't really have a lot of time to use my "mind". I also admit that I can "think" my way thru to a much better K?D in the hog by simply using it's strengths and making sure that I have lot's of time to "think". Problem is.... that get's boring real quick and fun wins out over my concern for my K/D. I have reached a comprimise over the years... "ok, K/d is totally in the dumper...better be a triffle cautious the nest couple of sorties..."
As for me badmouthing someone else's gameplay.... Well gee fellas.... I didn't start this whine.. I'm not the one crying because "people aren't joining my missions waaaaa..." I don't care how you fly but if you claim any special talent for teamwork and any lack of skill for gurballing I will be glad to point out how wrongheaded I feel that you are.
lazs
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"I didn't start this whine.. I'm not the one crying because "people aren't joining my missions waaaaa..."
I've never posted a mission Lazs...reread the original post, it said nothing like that.
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:) lazs
never fear.. I fly 'mindlessly' most of the time
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majic.. sorry.. I really didn't mean you per se. You have been very tollerant. I meant the "organized" threads in general and the "mindless furball" type of remarks.
lazs
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No hard feelings Lazs.
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The game is set up for team play but that doesn't mean thats what you have to do here. Many pilots really don't care how much property a country has but how important that property is to them. If there is a shortage of bases or pilots on a side these guys will be the first to switch. It's kind of all about a persons character in a way. If you looked into a squad that worked as a team, lets say to take bases, you might find they are some of the more friendly and respectful people in the arena. Guys who fly around just for themselves might be more arrogant and disliked here and in real life. The game is here for us all to have fun in our own ways even tho I would like to see more team cooperation.
Hblair came up w an idea I would love to see implimented by the Hitech boys. We have TOD, the combat arena and wild Wednesdays but there is nothing for us guys in large team oriented squads. The Arabian Knights, Assasins, Nightmares, Dickweeds, Flying tigers AVG and many more I'd like to mention. I believe these squads would love to see an arena where we could test our skills against some of the best out there. I know we're not to bad a squad and might be up to the challange. Basetaking would have to be part of it tho because thats a big part of the game. We take 120+ bases a month, maybe not the best, but not bad either.
Although his idea is good I think we need the programers to put it all together. There would be a lot at stake in the way of honor and pride and it could promote some bitter rivalry but all in good fun. Many squads might chicken out but a few of the best would come show their stuff.
BTW, whats the sense in being in a squad of 2 or 3 or even worse, a squad with more but don't fly together. It really makes no sense IMO to join a squad just to carry around a name. Join a squad to really do something and get a feeling of accomplishment and comerodery. Thats what I'm talking about! :)
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Well.... I'm just looking to have fun. Somethimes 'my fun' is 'your fun' and sometimes it's not.
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maw... I think that the organized squads are arrogant and ridgid and probly disliked in real life just as they are disliked by everyone in the game. The fun loving squads with no real goals are populated by fun loving guys who can think for themselves.
lazs
Public relations Officer for the BK's