Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: hblair on April 24, 2002, 08:11:33 AM
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In front of our business, the state has been in the process of 4 laning a 5 mile section of the highway for about 5 years now. The project has sat there at times for over 6 months with no work done. Don't know if it's the state or the contractor dragging feet. Well, last week they finally opened the new section and closed the old section to do some work on some small bridges. When they did this, they just threw down some stop signs on the roads perpendicular to the new lanes thinking that would suffice. (no flashing lights, warning signs, etc.) Well, there has already been one fatality and several wrecks. People wrote editorials in the local paper about needing more warnings. That the construction area needed more signage for people who have been driving this road for 40 years, then one morning all of a sudden there's a stop sign there.
Well, sitting at my desk here a few minutes ago, I hear a short skid, then a loud boom. I look outside, 1/4 mile down the road apparently someone has pulled out in front of someone. Customer just came in and said they had one of the cars covered up. Sounds like a fatality huh? Who is the retarded fool who's in charge of this?
Just noticed: Coroners car is down there now. Somebodys dead for sure. :(
Idiots.
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doesn't matter who's in charge, call your local news channel, one that does local consumer fight type stories. Sounds like they'd eat your situation up.
The lawyers of the dead will eat it up too ........
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I agree eagler. I think this is one of those cases where a big lawsuit might cause a change of policy.
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Terrible news HB.
After the Northridge earthquake we had some highway work to do here too. The State offered the repair contract with a little twist, a big bonus if completed in (I don't remember the time frame, but it wasn't long...30 or 45 days). The highway crews were there day and night, 24 hours, working under big lights, and they got over a million dollars in bonus money for completing the job on time. Probably saved the State money in the long run too.
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Tah Gut!
Man I remember that! lol when we had our big one on oct 17 1989, here in the bay area, the work on our freeways was still being done when they finnished up down in SOCAL!! OH man norther california cal trans SUCKS !!!
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In Finland usually government finances new roads but few years ago they tried new system: Independent corporations built the highway and government just pays monthly fees until corporations have their own moneys back and then some more. Work was going on 24 hours in 7 days a week wether it was winter or summer and the highway was ready to use quite fast if compared another roadworks.
Once a reporter from local newspaper did ask how much those guys building that road did earn and answer was "More than our prime-minister". They did work in shifts: iirc it was something like 2 or 3weeks work with 12hours a day and after that one week free.
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Originally posted by hblair
That the construction area needed more signage for people who have been driving this road for 40 years, then one morning all of a sudden there's a stop sign there.
It has always truly amazed me the ease with which we hand out drivers licenses. Driving is a full time job! I don't care how many times you have driven a road if you are not paying attention you are just plane stupid. IMO this is just Darwinism at work in its finest.
Idiots. [/B]
true.
Stand by for more idiotic law suits.
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Have you ever made a mistake on the road?
[edit]Darwinism at work huh? What if your wife or kid got plowed in the drivers door pulling out in front of car she didn't see? and died at the scene? Would it be darwinism at work then? That's a foolish thing to say.[/edit]
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Drunk driving, or under the influence of anything in a vehicle, is darwinism at work.
I'm sure that when those people who were killed/injured in car wrecks when Explorer's started flipping over due to shoddy tires was due to darwinism.............
Anyway, HB, you should check out Washington DC sometime.
They've been working on expanding the southeast/southwest freeway for going on 4 years now... the progress they make is so mind numblingly slow and causes more accidents/traffic than the 3 lane highway did before. I figure it'll take them another 3 years to complete whatever they have to do now. Judging from the completed roadway- that's been completed for 4 months now, it should be another 14 months before they decide to put in the medians... then another 2 years to actually get them in place.
Of course, that is DC...
-SW
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Highway departments in general are dumb as all hell.
Example 1. Marshfield, MA.
Town spends MONTHS tearing up and then resurfacing 4 major roads in the town. Two weeks after the project is completed, they are out there ripping up the side of the roads to put in new pipes. Several sections of the roads are now full of potholes, etc. due to uneven filling and poor quality repaving.
Example 2. Boston, MA
Big Dig... Need I say more?
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Originally posted by Midnight
Example 2. Boston, MA
Big Dig... Need I say more?
You beat me to it...and no, you don't have to say anything more. Been there on business a few times, and once for a medical situation since they started. Everytime I go I feel sorry for the people who have to deal with THAT everyday.
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Originally posted by MrBill
I don't care how many times you have driven a road if you are not paying attention you are just plane stupid. IMO this is just Darwinism at work in its finest.
So if someone misses a stop sign and hits your car travelling on the main road, killing you, it would be your fault?
Target: After the Northridge earthquake we had some highway work to do here too. The State offered the repair contract with a little twist, a big bonus if completed in (I don't remember the time frame, but it wasn't long...30 or 45 days). The highway crews were there day and night, 24 hours, working under big lights, and they got over a million dollars in bonus money for completing the job on time. Probably saved the State money in the long run too.
That was because in emergency the governor suspended regular rules for awarding contracts.
miko
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quote from hblair: "What if your wife or kid got plowed in the drivers door pulling out in front of car she didn't see?"
If this happened then YES she was stupid. We are all taught to look both ways before crossing the street at a very young age. Attempting to alibi that now that we are adults with drivers licenses so the rules no longer apply is BS! Sorry nothing personal just my opinion.
quote from AKSWulfe: "Drunk driving, or under the influence of anything, is darwinism at work.
True and I have been guilty of this ... many many years ago.
I'm sure that when those people who were killed/injured in car wrecks when Explorer's started flipping over due to shoddy tires was due to darwinism.............
I'm sure you are correct!
I drive what has been called the most dangerous vehicle in america (the infamous 15 passenger Ford E150 van.). I have had 2 complete tire failures and a couple of radical steering maneuvers to avoid obstacles. I have never lost it. (one was real close though) I "DO" know my vehicles capabilities, and if you think I am driving to slow or leaving to large a space between me and the person in front of me, sorry, I know how long it takes this monster to stop, and I know how far I can turn the wheel and keep it upright, I know it handles differently when the gas and water tanks are full than when they are empty, or when I have 10 people on board.
Most people have no idea what the limits of their vehicle are. You see them on the road every day, tailgating etc. Ask skuzzy if he would take a car out try to push it to spec on a crowded freeway without even knowing what the vehicular limits were!
Sorry but I call BS again! I doubt that one driver in a hundred know any more about driving than turn the key to start it, pull this thing to get it to go forward or backward, push this peddle to go faster, stomp this one over here to stop, and use this thing to aim it where you want to go.
Just my opinion I could be wrong ... but I doubt it.
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Did you have complete tire blow outs in a turn? Or anything like that?
I think, not sure, that the Explorer accidents related to (goodyear was it?) were relatively low compared to all of the tire blow outs. Quite a few of those accidents resulted in flips....
Have you driven an Explorer before? They are relatively notoroius for flipping with a sudden jerk of the wheel...
Tailgaiters don't necesarily not know the limits of their vehicles. I tailgate people who drive under the speed limit or are in the left hand land NOT PASSING (reason for the second lane in the first place)... But that's just my peave on the road, if you are in the left hand lane and not passing... for toejam's sake get over in the right hand lane or get off the road! (not you, just saying)
Anyway, your monster of a van has a better CoG compared to the Explorer... atleast the one I use to drive ('96)... of course I never flipped it, but I never had a tire blow out either.
Yes, there are a lot of people out there who are absolutely horrid drivers and the road would be a safer place without them... but to say that every accident is darwinism at work is fairly ignorant.
-SW
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I agree there are stupid drivers MrBill. I also agree that drivers sometimes do stupid things. But I think when an elderly gentleman is distracted by construction goings on, misses a stop sign (that wasn't there the last forty years), eases into traffic and pays with his life, well, I feel it is very disrespectful to call the man stupid. He is dead, have some respect for crying out loud. That is my opinion.
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I think you guys are missing the point.
A lot of construction is going on, and all the sudden there is a cross street with a single stop sign and no other warning devices.
If you are used to traveling on a street where you normally do not stop, a single red stop sign might not be noticed until it is too late.
There really should be a flashing warning light 1/4 mile from the stop, if not permanantly, at least as a temporary setup to forwarn the drivers.
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Come to think of it, Midnight, isn't there a law for new stop signs/stop lights to have signs 500feet before they are?
Maybe it's just a local law, but every new stop light/stop sign has had a sign put up on the side of the road warning of the new traffic regulator a couple hundred feet from it...
I dunno, maybe it's just one of those things the state does only by request.... sure would make sense though to make it a law.
-SW
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Another minor point hidden in there is they don't rush things down south.
In Michigan when there is major highway construction, I remember them hitting it hard, setting up lights and going 24 hours a day, seven days a week until it was done.
Florida, apparently like Alabama, is a whole different ball game.
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It's a federal guideline, they have the warning on a 4 ft tall pylon, but there are prolly 50-80 of those pylons with sight of the intersection. They need something that stands out. There was a young woman killed last week a few miles down the road at another intersection. 2 deaths in less than a full week since its been open.
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In addition, there is a growing body of experience with fast-track highway rehabilitationand repair projects necessitated by disasters, special events, or destructive accidents. These projects have demonstrated that state highway agencies and highway construction firms can team successfully to reduce highway project construction times when required to do so by emergency conditions or unexpected circumstances. However, there has as yet been nosystematic examination of the lessons learned from such projects or of how these lessons can beapplied more broadly to reduce highway construction project times
This is from an NTSB study.......in other words:
Its been done
It works
amd We still haven't learned from it.........sheesh:rolleyes:
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Originally posted by MrBill
I'm sure that when those people who were killed/injured in car wrecks when Explorer's started flipping over due to shoddy tires was due to darwinism.............
I'm sure you are correct!
I drive what has been called the most dangerous vehicle in america (the infamous 15 passenger Ford E150 van.). I have had 2 complete tire failures and a couple of radical steering maneuvers to avoid obstacles. I have never lost it. (one was real close though) I "DO" know my vehicles capabilities, and if you think I am driving to slow or leaving to large a space between me and the person in front of me, sorry, I know how long it takes this monster to stop, and I know how far I can turn the wheel and keep it upright, I know it handles differently when the gas and water tanks are full than when they are empty, or when I have 10 people on board.
Most people have no idea what the limits of their vehicle are. You see them on the road every day, tailgating etc. Ask skuzzy if he would take a car out try to push it to spec on a crowded freeway without even knowing what the vehicular limits were!
Sorry but I call BS again! I doubt that one driver in a hundred know any more about driving than turn the key to start it, pull this thing to get it to go forward or backward, push this peddle to go faster, stomp this one over here to stop, and use this thing to aim it where you want to go.
Just my opinion I could be wrong ... but I doubt it.
I work for a civil engineering firm and so I know a little about what HB is talking about in his original post. It sounds to me like they (the engineering firm or the city) left something out of their traffic control plan (the warning signs!!!!) When designing traffic control for road projects there are all kinds of problems to be solved for each diferent phase of the project. When we do one one of the most major things we worry about is just what HB described. Change a road that people are used to with no warning and you are inviting a wreck. That's basic human nature. HB if I were you I'd call that news crew and then call the city planning department and tell them who you just called. Tell them you are tired of seeing people die because they haven't done their jobs correctly. Fear and guilt are great motivaters.
Tahgut :) Man LA freeway workers rocked! Back in the late 80's in Houston they ripped up 15 or so miles of I-59 and rebuilt it while never closing it. They did this in under the 3 years they said it would take. They worked 24-7 and did it! Here in Austin they suck!!!!! Over 10 years to do less work than what was done on 59 in Houston and still 3-5 years to go. The way they did that is the way to go. Finish before said date you get x ammount of bonus (which I believe that guy shared w/ his workers as insentive) but finish late and you pay a fine :)
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I am sorry and I apologize to anyone whom I may have offended. To anyone whom took exception to my darwinism remarks, and to anyone else who feels that I need to make an apology to them.
Please feel free to drive however you wish. If you come to a construction zone and broadside someone because you missed a stop sign while rubbernecking you have my full blessing. If you are driving a unstable vehicle to fast for "your" reaction time or the conditions and something goes wrong and a crash results, feel free. I apologize for calling you stupid.
If you, or a loved one, is the victim of one of these morons I DO sympathize with you.
I will agree that there are innocent accident victims ... but running a stop sign in a construction zone is caused by driving while not paying attention, and prolly driving to fast to boot.
hblair,
It is not the elderly gentleman easing out into traffic that I was talking about, (for him I am deeply sorry) it is the moron that ran the stop sign cause he wasn't paying attention to his driving that I was pointing at.
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When I was a kid, they were building a whole buncha new freeways in LA... I can still remember 1 mile a day, 4 lanes EACH way being completed on the 210 freeway.
I also remember that highway contractor after the Northridge quake.. tryly.. that we saw was an excellent example of what can be done.. whats possible. Read somewhere that bonuses and all that job cost the governemnt less than it would have if it had been handled in the 'typical' way.
The current situation nationwide? Graft, my friends... corruption, wholesale. The watering of the mighty federal megabuck road dollar. The systems obviously broken.
A whole new meaning for the term 'highway robbery'
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Originally posted by Hangtime
A whole new meaning for the term 'highway robbery'
Man you don't know how true that statement is. I've watch TxDot extort money from developers, legaly :( Using city governments to get more money from the developers. They know the game and play it well..