Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: hazed- on May 10, 2002, 07:11:49 AM
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having just read a book on bomber crews and also being a bit fed up with the rediculous 7.92mm guns on a ju88 with a poor top speed to boot I am requesting a new bomber for the LW pilots in this game.
heres some choices :
Dornier Do 217:
produced : 1,730
performance: Max speed 348mph at 18,700ft
armament: 2x13mm up to 6x7.92mm + 8,818lbs of bombs
used in large scale operations against UK in early 1944, by middle of the year the majority remaining in service were missile carriers, and these continued to operate with limited success until the end of the war.
Heinkel He-177 greif
produced: 1,200
performance: Max speed 304mph at 19,685ft
armament: 3x13mm 3x7.92mm 2x20mm
+2,205lb + 2x Henschel Hs 293 missiles OR
33 rockets OR
75mm cannon
etc etc (loads of various loadouts)
Junkers ju 188
produced: 1,076
performance: Max speed 311mph at 19,685ft
armament: 1x20mm 1x13mm 1x7.92mm + 6,614lb of bombs
this aircraft would at least be a more suitable aircraft for MA/CT than ju88a4
what do you think? is there a possibility of anny of these arriving in AH?
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Sorry to Hijack.
But i would rather see a FW-190A3 before Luftwaffe gets a bomber that will be seen just as much as JU88. Sporadically.
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Sorry to Hijack.
But i would rather see a Me410 :D
To the Bombers, yes the Greif would be cool, i mean LW needs a really BIG BUFF (like VVS too).
Furtheron i would like to see a few variants of the Ju88.
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Originally posted by Duedel
Sorry to Hijack.
Furtheron i would like to see a few variants of the Ju88.
Oh yeah and those too, Yes it it is time for Ju88C-6 or G-6 with painted tail too like C-6.
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(Barges in and cracks a couple of heads together)
Hello!
Hazed, I'd happily go for the Do217 of Ju188, but NOT the He177, because that would just get used like B17s in MA play, and is very little use for scenario plays. I'd rather have the He111 than the He177 for that very reason.
The LW does NOT need a big buff so much as it needs the conditions to fly in that the real LW did - which was far more often night and cloudy weather than is seen in the MA.
Imagine if we more often saw solid cloud at 3,000ft... -which would mean the heavies would have to fly into murderous low-level flak. Theyre bigger targets and less manouverable than planes like the Ju88, B26 and Ki67. True they can take more of a beating, too, but I'd stll rather take my chances in a Ju88 than a Lancaster in THAT scenario.
IMO, it's far better to ask for planes that would add more variety and see more use OVERALL than trying to find Axis planes thatll survive in the Axis-unfriendly MA environment. On that basis, I;d go for the Do217, Ju188 or He111. :-)
Esme
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Wow, five posts on a "new plane" thread and nobody has asked for the Bearcat or biplanes.
Got to be some kind of record.
(Oh yeah, I want ME-410, a larger Japanese planeset, the ME-163 and ... early war bipes!)
Having contributed nothing to the thread, I now return to my hole.
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I am all for the Dornier!!! Sometimes you just need a BIG pounder and as a LW only freak I have no choices in AH...
What brings me to another Hijack (sry mate... ;) ). The other niche where LW is totally lacking is a transport! There is only ONE choice for it: Ju52! Hey, carries troops, supplies and defense armament... :D :drool: Infact the 'Tante Ju' is the only WW2 plane that is regularly roaring over my home! (well, there was an airshow near my home some time ago - man, was I surprised to see a B17 coming over the forest... ;) )
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ju188 gets my vote its a beautiful plane with a tad bit better defense.
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great choise man! i would rather see a Heinkel He 111H or a Z with good defence and good bomb oad of 2500kg ( 5511lb) the Dornier is another good choise great bombload of 4000kg (8818lb) and has good defence to boot. the Greif aint a good choise it was a horrible plane engines cought fire quite frequently and it was a major mechanical problem and would only be 'realistic' if those probs were put into AH (and what are th chances of HT doing that just for one plane):rolleyes: otherwise you have a good choise.
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Sorry to hijack.
But before more LW bombers are implemented, AH just needs a FW-190 to fill the gap between the A4/A5 and the A8 - you guessed right: bring the FW-190 A6 to AH !!!11 4x MG151/20 goodness on an A5 airframe, many A5s were field-modified............................
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Originally posted by Esme
...but NOT the He177, because that would just get used like B17s in MA play, and is very little use for scenario plays. I'd rather have the He111 than the He177 for that very reason.
Do u really think that we (the leather wearing LW's) like to fly a B17 as a substitution for our He177? :D But honestly its not only a matter of szenarios. The He177 would be a good addition for the MA. Because my knowledge about history is limited i dont want to argue about the use for szenarios.
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If I had to pick a German "heavy" it would have to be the He 177 I beleave it's max bombload was 13,200 pounds, it packs a serious defensive aramement and was in service at about the same time as the JU188 and far more capable in terms of bombload and defensive aramement than the JU 188. The Do 217 is not nearly as capable a plane as the He 177 and would be redundant in the since that we already have the JU 88 a early war buff. The He 177 A5 had most of the bugs worked out of it that made the He 177 famious for it's mechanical problems, those types of defencies are not factored into HA and would be of no concern to the players, Hands down the He 177 is the best bomber for AH for the Germans.
I must say this though, I hope it is NOT modeled in the near future, Japan,Italy,and the USSR are in dier nead of aircraft of all types I sincerly hope we see those wholes filled before the second whealthest county (plane model wise) has another plane added.
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HE-111
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Originally posted by HFMudd
Wow, five posts on a "new plane" thread and nobody has asked for the Bearcat or biplanes.
Got to be some kind of record.
(Oh yeah, I want ME-410, a larger Japanese planeset, the ME-163 and ... early war bipes!)
Having contributed nothing to the thread, I now return to my hole.
I'll fix that, Add Biplanes!!! :D
Hs123 Carries 2x20mm cannons and 1000lbs of bombs:eek:
and still seeing combat as late as 1944!
CR42 Has top Speed of 312 mph and carries 2x20mm cannons or 2x12.7 mm mgs. :D
Gloster Gladiator/Sea Gladiator: 4x7.9 mm Mgs with total ammo of 2000 rounds top speed of 254mph in level flight.
I-153: 4x7.7mm mgs or 2x13.7mm mgs and 2x110lb bombs and 6xrockets some also had retractable landing gear.
Fairey SwordFish: Carried 1500lbs of bombs or 1x1500lbs torpedo
1x7.9mm mg firing forward and 1x7.9 mm inback for gunner/observer. type: carrier based.
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The obvious choice is the B-24, of course.
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LW needs big buffs and greif would be answer for this. He177 got heavy armament, big bombload and would be suitable for the MA. Do217 obsolete and useless as bomber but good night-fighter. Ju188 much better bomber than A4 and more suitable for MA...
He177 max bombload was 7200kg (15840lb)... :p
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HE177 best MA choice without doubt. Ju188 was pretty fast but couldn't take more load then the JU88, and with extrenal load, the little speed it has quickly falls away.
There are quite many other buffs we can have instead of these, will post some later.
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Some info from A2 version...
325 mph (523 kmh) at 20,500 ft (6250m)
bombload 3000 kg (6600 lb)
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Yeah, both the Do217 and He177 would be very nice additions. How about the Ju289 (or is it the Ju290, I get confused!!)??
Has anyone got date for the Ju289, I seem to have misplaced my Luftwaffe reference book!
Regards
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Junkers Ju 290A-5
Nine-seat long range transport and reconnaissance bomber
Four 1700hp BMW 801D radial engines
Wing span 42.00m, length 28.64m, height 6.83m, wing area 203.6m2
Maximal take-off weight 44970kg
Max. speed 440 kmh (273 mph) at 5800m
cruising speed 360 kmh (224 mph)
Service ceiling 6000m
Range 6150km
Armament
Two dorsal turrets, each with a 15mm MG151, one MG151 in the tail, two in beam windows, and one in the front of the under nose gondola. One 13mm MG131 in the aft section of the gondola
FuG 200 Hohentwiel search radar, range 100km
Bombload 1800 kg (3960 lb)
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With He-177 we could have 50mm or 75mm cannon and guided Henschel antiship missiles :)
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Zhivago that thing looks kinda like a Nimrod in a wierd sorta way.
Cool pic.
Tumor
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Dr Zhivago, 325Mph is not 440km/h, it's about 520 (523) km/h.
If we're gonna get another JuX88 we might aswell get the Ju88 S, high speed bomber, top speed 615km/h which is 382Mph.
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Do217 useless? Don't make me laugh! :-)
Some data:
Ju88A4: served Sept 1939-1945, 14,980 of all types, including over 7,000 Ju88A's. Max bomb load 2,000kg both internally and externally. (the A5 could carry more, but how much more I am unsure). Max speed 292mph. Ceiling 8.2km
He111: served 1939-1945, over 7300 of all types produced, including about 6200 He111H's. Maximum bomb load 3,250kg (includes external bombs). Max speed (He111H) 250mph Ceiling 6.7km
Do217: served late 1940-1945, 1730 of all types, of which 1366 were bombers. Maximum bombload 4,000kgs Some types carried 2 FX1400 of Hs293 guided bombs externally instead. maximum speeds 320-340mph Ceiling about 7.5km for bomber variants
Ju188: served 1943-1945, 1100 of all types. Max bombload 3,000kg, max speed 325mph Ceiling 9.3km
He177: served March 1942-1945, 908 built (8 prototypes, 35 He177A0, 130 He177A1, 170 He177A3, 565 He177A5). Between February and December 1943 Heinkel and Arado delivered 261 He177A-5's. Performance was improved, with ceiling raised from 7km to 8km. Max. offensive load was 6,000kgs, including externally carried Hs293 or 294 guided bombs or two FX1400 bombs. I am not sure, but I think the internal bomb bay could carry just 2,000kgs of bombs, and was often blanked off, with ordnance being carried externally only. Max speed (A5 version)303mph
On 13 February 1944 Goering was at Rheine to watch planes of KG100 set off to attack England. 14 taxied out, 13 took off, 8 returned soon with overheated or burning engines, four reached London, but only three came back.
OK: lets suppose that the He177 is modelled. It then has just a 2,000kg bomb load unless or until radio-guided bombs are introduced into AH, and I can't see THAT happening any time soon. That makes the He177 a poor choice for a heavier bomber, and the Do217 the best candidate so far as sheer weight of bombs delivered goes.
If radio-controlled bombs ARE modelled, the Do217 still has the edge, because more of them were produced, and in a wider range of variants, making the Do217 a more useful addition to the game.
If engine overheating etc is ever introduced, the He177 probably will be treated like a leper in the MA. It'd probably ONLY get used in scenario games, then!
With regard to defensive firepower, yes, the He177 is on a par with a B17... which means it cant make unescorted daylight raids and hope to survive very long very often. Same as any other bomber.
For speed the Do217 wins, for ceiling the Ju188 wins, and I suspect the Ju188 was the more agile. In terms of quantity built, the He111 wins.
Note the Ju88A4 bombload, btw; note that at the moment AH allows combinations of loadout that in real life would seldom, if ever, have been used (planes were sometimes flown in overload condition, but not as a common thing) (AH isnt alone in this).
So... what are our criteria for wanting to include a plane in Aces High? What are Hitechs? A good representational cross-section of planes that were used in WW2? Planes that will aid gameplay or balance? Planes that will add variety and colour? Planes that will be as useful as possible to all sections of the community? Dream planes that someone thought up 3 days before VEday and drew on the back of a beermat?
If the latter, then it's not a WW2 combat flight sim you're interested in. (Which is OK, but its good to know what it is different folk want when they ask for planes) If you're not after representational types, then you're not interested in a good simulation of WW2 aerial combat (I'll leave weather and nightfighting out of the argument this time! :-}) Fighting with WW2 planes you may well like, but it ain't WW2 combat as we know it Jim!
With an eye to the all-round usefulness of the planes AND the current limitations of the game, then, it seems to me that any of He111H, Ju188 or Do217 would be a better choice than the He177 for the next LW bomber to be introduced. I'm not saying I wouldn't like to see the He177 in AH at all, mind - I'd love to take my chances on those midnight raids over london in one, if my engines held up long enough! - just not NEXT. And before ANY LW bombers, what about an Italian one (SM79?) followed by a Russian one (Pe2!). Those two planes would both add far more to the game than the He177. IMO, of course... :-}
Esme
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Thx Wilbus, looks like my source (http://www.kotfsc.com/aircraft/ju-188.htm) got wrong speed ;)
That Ju88 S is quite intresting plane, faster than Mossy what we got at AH and about 90 mph :eek: faster than A4 (A4 292 mph, Moss 375 mph). But how big was that bombload at S version, not much i think. Defensive armament must be puny to achieve that speed...
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Esme
Its good to remember that AH isnt super realistic game. Arado and me262 engines are more closer hairdryers than jet engines. In real life those jumos needed very smooth throttle control. If you moved the throttles too fast, they would flame out and lost thrust. And engine life was only between 10-25 hours and they werent very reliable either.
Whats next LW bomber addition to game ?
Allies got b17, lanca ,b26 , a20 and tmb3. Axis got Ju88, Ar234 and Ki67 but lacks heavy bombers. He177 was only german heavy buff during ww2 and its only drawback was those engines. Ju188, He111 H and Do217 were just medium bombers and thus carried lighter defensive armament and bombload. Do217 was largest german medium bomber and was much closer heavy buff. Would be good if axis got at least one heavy buff to game...
He177 carried 1000 or 2000kg ? of bombs internally and there were racks under wings wich could carry bombs or two missiles. Hs 293 weights about 1,045kg, Kramer X-1 about 1,570kg and plane could carry three missiles if the bombay was blanked off and racks added to it. So normal bombload should be bigger than 2000kg.
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My vote would still go to the Ju188A-1.
Its faster than a B-17, Lanc, B-26 or Ju88 and carries a larger payload than the B-17, B-26 or Ju88, has defensive firepower at least equal to the B-26 (better in my opinion) and is probably tough like the Ju88A-4 is.
He177A-5 would probably be detrimental to the MA. It would be adding an aircraft with the payload of a Lanc, the defensive firepower of a B-17 and the speed of a B-26, all in one package.
Can you guess how many B-17s, B-26s or Lancs would be seen after that?
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Originally posted by Karnak
He177A-5 would probably be detrimental to the MA. It would be adding an aircraft with the payload of a Lanc, the defensive firepower of a B-17 and the speed of a B-26, all in one package.
Can you guess how many B-17s, B-26s or Lancs would be seen after that?
So you're saying He177 is the best WW2 bomber aside from B29? :)
Good! Bring He177 to AH!
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Do-17 IMHO!!
PUNT
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GRUNHERZ,
Yes, I'm saying that the He177A-5 is, in the context of the MA, the best WWII bomber other than the B-29.
Just the way that the Spitfire is the best fighter in the context of the MA.
Put either in the real situation and major flaws appear.
In reality I have absolutely no doubts that the B-17, B-24, Lancaster and Halifax were much better bombers than the He177A-5.
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yep b24 would be better than any german buff
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The Ju88S could, i think, carry as much as the Ju88 we have now, which is about 6600lbs or 3000kg. Not sure of it's armament, its speed kept it allive.
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Karnak, Ju188 A1 was just prototype, A2 was mass produced bomber version while A3 was torpedo bomber. Ju188 is based to A4 version airframe, so its just same rugged plane with much better defensive armament. Major difference was new spherical full view combat head with turret on the top of cabin. Cockpit held four men and arrangement was similar to the A4. So it should be quite easy job to model Ju188 A2 to AH.
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Originally posted by Wilbus
The Ju88S could, i think, carry as much as the Ju88 we have now, which is about 6600lbs or 3000kg. Not sure of it's armament, its speed kept it allive.
Ju88 S1 got BMW 801 G engines with Gm1 boost. Defensive armament was single MG 131 behind the cockpit and bombload 800kg (1760lb). Max speed was just 600kmh ???
Ju88 S2 used BMW 801 TJ engines. Armament was twin MG 81 behind the cockpit and bombload 1500kg (3300kg)
Pick is showing S2 version, S1 is similar looking but lacks big bomb bay under the fuselage...
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How bout a FokerWulf-200-Condor?
Type: Maritime reconaissance bomber, missle platform, and transport
Origin: Focke Wulf Flugzeugbau GmbH, in partnership with Hamburger Flugzeugbau (Blohm und Voss)
Engine:
Type: BMW-Bramo Fafnir 323R-2 nine-cylinder radial
Number: Four
Horsepower:
1,200hp at 2,600rpm with Methanol-water injection for take-off and emergency
1,000hp at 2,500rpm at sea level
950hp at 2,500rpm at 13,124ft (4,000m)
Fuel:
Standard Fuel Capacity: 1,773 Imperial Gallons (8,060 Liters)
Overload Fuel Capacity: 2,190 Imperial Gallons (9,955 Liters)
Type: N/A
Dimensions:
Wing span 32.84m
Length 23.46m
Height: 6.3m
Wing Surface Area: 1,270.14 Sq. Ft.
Weights:
Empty: 12,951kg (28,550 lbs.)
Loaded: 22,700kg (50,045 lbs.)
Performance: Fw 200 C-3/U4
Maximum Speed:
190mph (306kph) at sea level
224mph (360kph) at 15,750ft (4,800m)
Maximum Continuous cruise:
172mph (277kph) at sea level
208mph (355kph) at 13,125ft (4,000m)
Economy cruise:
158mph (255kph)
Range at Economy Cruise:
2,210 mls (3,556 km) With Standard Fuel
2,760 mls (4,440 km) With Overload Fuel
Service Ceiling: 19,030ft (5800m)
Armament:
Forward Dorsal Turret:
One 15mm MG 151/15, One 20mm MG 151/20 Or One 7.92mm MG 15 with 1,000 rnds mounted in hydralically operated FW 19 turret
Ventral Gondola:
One 20mm MG 151/20 with 500 rnds. manually aimed at front
One 7.92mm MG 15 with 1,000 rnds. manually aimed at rear
Beam:
Two 7.92mm MG 15 Or Two 13mm MG 131 with 300 rnds.
Aft Dorsal Position:
One 13mm MG 131 with 500 rnds.
Bomb Load:
4,626 lbs. (2100kg) carried in ventral gondola and beneath wings
Missle Load: (C-6 to C-8 models)
Two Hs 293 Anit-Ship Missles under outboard nacells
Avionics:
Fw 200 C-8: Fug 200 Hohentwiel Search And Bombing Radar
Total Production: 276
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nah, I'd prefer a He177 A5.
Fw200 is like us asking for a 190D9 and they suggesting us to get a 109V2 instead. NO thank you :D
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Condors are purdy:D
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Condor is nice looking plane for sure but it's worthless for the MA. max speed of about 230Mph and less load then a Ju88 and B17. Worthless to say the least.
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Condor isnt best LW bomber addition to game. Fw200 was quite effective long range bomber during early part of ww2 but later this plane proved too vulnerable. Condor got structural weakness in the wings and fuselage so plane could break up in the air or during landing. Condor would be good transport or goony plane.
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Precicely. A EARLY long range LW bomber. it carrys as much as B26 PLUSS 2 missels.
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You have to be kidding ! A Fw 200 ? How many of you would fly it in tha MA anyway ?
If LW types ask for a decent buff, then He 177 is the choice.
How is it fair to even mention the B24something in this thread ?
Look at how many LW buffs are here. A Ju88A-4 ! Great. an early war buff with small bombload and weak armament. And now someone even sugests Condor, an ex-passenger plane, used only to its great range and only against shipping. The plane would disintegrate even if the 202 attacked it. No thanks.
He 177 all the way !
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Hristo don't ya know anything would be better in MA than a He177...... Especially the mighty He111 of 1940 fame..... :)
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You are right. But if recon was a biger part in this game i could see the usage of the condor. 2,500+ range verry useful.
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For whom is it useful? For MA there are only 2 things that matter speed and armament non of which the Fw200 has the He177 is a 110% better choice for a luft bomber than a measly condor.
Again it's like asking for a 190D9 and instead someone suggesting a FokkerDr1, no thanks.
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Glasses is right. The Condor was a joke, pressed into LW service as a bomber only due to desparate need for a long range recon/bomber. If another German bomber from that time period is added I would vastly prefer the He111.
In the context of the MA I still think that the He177A-5 would cause issues that make it a poor choice and that the Do217or Ju188 is the way to go. Particularly the Ju188A-1.
Dr Zhivago,
Info I have says that the Ju188A-1 was the first production version to have the intended Junkers Jumo 213A engines. The Ju188A-2 added flame dampening equipment to the Ju188A-1 model.
IIRC, German prototypes are designated by a "0", Ju188A-0 for exmple. Any number greater than zero indicates a production model.
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Originally posted by Dr Zhivago
Esme
Its good to remember that AH isnt super realistic game.
- It's about par for the course,m'dear. :-)
Arado and me262 engines are more closer hairdryers than jet engines. In real life those jumos needed very smooth throttle control. If you moved the throttles too fast, they would flame out and lost thrust. And engine life was only between 10-25 hours and they werent very reliable either.
- yes, I know that. I was actually disappointed when I hard the Ar234 was added rather than the He111 (before I had an AH account, that was. Been keeping an eye of AH for a long time)
Whats next LW bomber addition to game ?
Allies got b17, lanca ,b26 , a20 and tmb3. Axis got Ju88, Ar234 and Ki67 but lacks heavy bombers. He177 was only german heavy buff during ww2
- Incorrect. See my earlier post. It LOOKED like a heavy buff, but by Allied standards wasn't quite there. And the external weaponary commonly carried isnt modelled in AH yet. Radio-controlled guided missiles, for heavens sake!
and its only drawback was those engines. Ju188, He111 H and Do217 were just medium bombers and thus carried lighter defensive armament and bombload.
- the Lancaster's defensive armament wasn't so great, either, which has a lot to do with why it flew by night.
Do217 was largest german medium bomber and was much closer heavy buff. Would be good if axis got at least one heavy buff to game...
- the LW didn't have any true heavy bombers, due to the high commands fixation on tactical support for the German Army.
He177 carried 1000 or 2000kg ? of bombs internally and there were racks under wings wich could carry bombs or two missiles. Hs 293 weights about 1,045kg, Kramer X-1 about 1,570kg and plane could carry three missiles if the bombay was blanked off and racks added to it. So normal bombload should be bigger than 2000kg. [/QUOTE]
- Yes, I covered all that; Not being "funny" but did you read ALL of my post? HTC would have to model the guided weapons as well to give the He177 more than a 2000kg bomb load, m'dear. So it's not just a case of modelling the He177, there's the weaponary as well, and that isnt going to be trivial to do.
On balance, I maintain that the Do217 is still the best one to model because its payload doesnt require extra game systems to be implemented, its fast (even at night the He177 had to resort to long shallow dives to gain enough speed to help it survive the nightfighters), and has reasonably good defensive armament if it's modelled right. And it came in a number of useful variants, too. Plus, as I remarked, it'd be useful not only in the MA but in many scenario games as well, where the He177 would be less useful. (btw; can anyone tell me why the nose gun on a flexible mount in a Ju88 isn't modelled, the one the observer could shoot from the Kanzel?).
I also believe that too many folks are over-fixated on the notion that the LW needs a heavy bomber in order to fight the way the US 8th air force did (why should the LW WANT to do that?!), rather than the conditions that allowed them to fight (caused them to fight, actually) the way they actually did. Variety, m'dears, I want variety, rather than the US 8th AF fights the US 8th AF. Dull, dull, dull!
And again, the He177 by that stage of the war flew by night because it couldnt survive by day even assuming it didnt develop mechanical problems. The best way for LW bombers to survive after late 1940 or so (in the west) is by stealth, rather than flying straight at the enemy, and in adequate numbers where stealth isnt possible. Havent seen a lot of either in the MA since I started flying in AH. Some, but not much.
But then it's the MA - I don't expect a great del of realism in things there. I would like to see stuff added that helps the realism in other areas of AH gameplay, though (SEA, CT, TODs, etc.)
If it weren't for MA considerations, I'd be asking for the He111 instead, but I like to try to think of everybody, not just us realism nuts :-)
Esme :-)
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Karnak
"Info I have says that the Ju188A-1 was the first production version to have the intended Junkers Jumo 213A engines. The Ju188A-2 added flame dampening equipment to the Ju188A-1 model."
Ju188 A1 was the "first production" version and planned engines were Jumo 213 A. But Jumo 213 engines wasnt available yet so A series was dropped. The Ju188A with planned Jumo 213 engines came production not until the summer of 1943. Since at the beginning of the Jumo213 wasnt available for the A-1 yet, so V-1 and V-2 were equipped with BMW 801 D-2 engines and this lead to 188 E/F series. The E-1 was the first Ju 188 version built in series with BMW 801 D-2 or BMW 801 mA engines and built starting from spring 1942. E1 got dive brakes installed while they were deleted from A2 version. Ju188 A2 corresponded the planned A1 series, the quantity production began in the summer 1943 and plane was powered with new Jumo 213 engines. Total production of ju188 in all versions was about 1036 planes.
"(btw; can anyone tell me why the nose gun on a flexible mount in a Ju88 isn't modelled, the one the observer could shoot from the Kanzel?)."
Ju88 A4 got two MG 81 or one MG 81 and one MG 131 firing forward, twin MG 81 or one MG 131 upper rear, one MG 81 or MG 81 Z at rear of ventral gondola and later aircraft two MG 81 at front of gondola. So Ju88 what we are using at game is missing one MG 81 from cockpit or one MG 131 from ventral gondola. And why A4 cant carry two 1000kg bombs under wings ??? Inner racks max load was 1000kg and outer racks 500kg...
And finally pick from Do217 and its armament. Note Ju188 and Ju88 carry only 3000kg of bombs and Dornier 4000kg, but 188 got equal or better defensive armament.
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Thank you, Dr Zhivago!
Am currently wiping the drool off my monitor... I want a Do217E2 (I KNOW the M has some advantages, I just think the E2 looks prettier) NOW!!!
Esme