Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: moose on May 16, 2002, 07:27:40 AM
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How much would you say this plane is worth?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1731448286&r=0&t=0&showTutorial=0&ed=1021944849&indexURL=0&rd=1
I want it. Very badly. Seller is willing to end auction early if I give him a suitable offer but I'm new to the hobby and am not sure what I should say.
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oh yeah, imagine THAT plane with THIS scheme!
(http://www.hitechcreations.com/pyro/109e.jpg)
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there are several 109 kits on the market... you could build your own...
To me there is something wrong with buying a plane someone else built... (ARF's etc exceptions)
No i don't fly RC, but my dad has for as long as I can remember, for him the pleasure is probably 60% building 40% flying.
My thots +)
SKurj
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Don't bid higher. You probably are getting a burned-out engine, junk radio, and that is a stand-way-off scale 109. Not crashed? Pfft. You fly 'em, you crash 'em, that's how it is. I especially liked the "It is a little on the heavy side though. You need to give it gas or it will drop.". Yup, that means it will snap-roll if you're not careful.
I agree with Skurj, build your own. This will probably wind up being more work and expense than starting from scratch. And don't buy a used radio from someone you don't know.
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i wouldnt buy it moose. it doesnt even come with a radio or servo's
ready to fly with YOUR radio and servo's
which means that you are going to pay at least another 75-100 bucks for a decent radio and some more $$$ for the servo's. and like kieran said...your probably gettin a burned up engine.
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Dunno if RC planes are like High Power Rocketry which I’m hopelessly tarded addicted, but if anyone builds your stuff in the latter case, you don’t know what your getting, which is a bad thing. Not only is it blasphemy to not build your own rocket, it would suck to load up a J97 and find out the builder used glue instead of epoxy or something. RC stuff is way more forgiving, but the same ideal I assume.
Related I went to the local Reno RC airport awhile ago just to watch, this black dude was doing some insane inverted stuff with a RC Helicopter. Never knew they could be flown like that, you might wanna check that out.
Very fun to watch.
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IMHO $90+ is too much for that plane, Yeah it may be pre-built but what's the quality of his workmanship? Here is a link to the kit (http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p.pgm?Q=1&I=LXAP73&P=0) that I think this plane is. I'm currently building the smaller version of this plane and if the plans are similar he mounted the engine incorrectly, who knows what else could be wrong. You can buy the kit for a few bucks more and build it yourself knowing that the quality is there :)
Edit: Scratch that quote on the Engine mounting, mine is a different manufacturer, but if I were him I would've mounted it inverted, that cylinder head popping out the top is uuuggglllllyyyy :D
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Not trying to hijack moose's thread here, but....
What is the best (read cheapest) way to get started in the RC hobby? I have always been intrigued, but I'm not sure I want to take a $500 plunge.
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Well, I already bought a nice p51 kit but the problem is that I'm real bad with balsa. I'm expecting to mess it up and then be real frustrated.
I figure if I can find a used plane that needs to be fixed up I can learn that way before ruining a new kit. I already have a 4 channel radio and servos, and there is a hobby shop right down the road if that engine is burned out
i originally thought that plane didnt look all that good but upon further request the guy sent me a couple better pics of it
(http://www.103rd.com/109.jpg)
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Moose don't buy that Bf109 thing.
1) It's not a trainer so you will not be able to learn to fly on it.
2) It's heavy and has a small wing so it will fly very fast and will stall and snap on landings. You will loose this plane if you try to learn landings on it.
3) Fox engines are pieces of toejam.
4) This plane is very old, and an obvious beater. Plus don't belive when people say "never crashed". People very easily lie about this, even when a sale is arranged over the phone.
5) It is ugly. :)
Go buy an ARF (Almost ready to fly Trainer), preferably a .40 size with a 60 inch wingspan. Join AMA http://www.modelaircraft.org which is required to join a local RC club. The RC club guys will teach you how to fly.
Target it will cost you $500 to get into the hobby with a new glow
powered trainer, radio, engine accesories, AMA membership, and club dues. If you cant/dont want to spend this much then best not waste money and start it only to give up soon.
As a trainer I reccomend the Hobbico Avistar "Select" ARF.
http://www.towerhobbies.com (Do a search for Avistar)
For $300 you get plane, engine and radio- plus the engine and radio are completely installed. You just assemble the plane.
Then figure 50 dollars for AMA, up to 100 for RC club membership and 50-100 for basic accesories and you are set.
NO MATTER WHAT DONT ATTEMPT TO FLY THESE PLANES WITHOUT EXPERIENCED RC PILOTS HELP AT AN RC CLUB. IT IS NOTHING LIKE AH FLYING AND YOU WILL CRASH YOUR PLANE IN !)SECONDS, POSSIBLY HURTING SOMEBODY!
Good luck, and be prepared to spend much more money after you enter the hobby- it is like drugs. :)
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What GRUNHERZ said.
RC flying is not a "whim" hobby. Be ready to spend a lot of money to get into it and to stay into it.
I will also add:
NEVER buy a used RC plane from someone you have not flown with at a RC field. NEVER.
DO get involved with a RC club. They are a tremendous source of help and fun.
This is not a car, or house. Fixing up a RC from someone else's mistakes can cost you more money, time, and frustration than starting from a good basic kit.
GRUNHERZ gave a good list of startups for those interested in getting into this hobby.
In many ways, flying RC is much harder than real flying. The planes react almost instantly to inputs. They will be effected by wind gusts. They are fragile. You will crash them.
Not to put anyone off,...this is one hobby that will sucker you in like no other.
If you are serious about wanting to get into this hobby. Contact a local RC club and ask them if you can come out with them to watch and talk to them. Most will be happy to do so. This will give you a feel for what to expect and how much it will cost in the long run.
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I definitley wouln't buy it if you are learning to fly RC..However,if you have a low wing trainer under your belt go for it..Me109's are very rare at flying fields and that one looks good (very good condition)for stand off scale.Might make a nice backup plane at that price...Most people crash their WW2 warbirds before they sell them(I know this first hand)...:),so that says to me it's a good flyer...Look at the nice big tail too..prolly flies like a low wing trainer....though the narrow landing gear disqualifies it from that catagory..
SKurj,do you belong to the Oshawa Flying Club?..I flew a float Beaver a few years ago from that bay in lake ontario at a float fly in.I'm currently a member at Oakville.Perhaps we hook up at a fly in sometime?..
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My friend, Joel Scholtz, designs and builds Kites and R/C planes. I visited him yesterday, and he has completed a 109 and a Hurri I in 1/7th scale. His looks much, much better than that, and I bet you could talk him into burning you a parts set(he has a laser cutter).
He doesn't have pics of the 109 up, but you can try and contact him through his website-http://www.skydelight.com
He uses all electrics, and trust me, he designs good stuff(his next plane is an He111).
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GRUN and Skuzzy are right on.
I flew R/C for quite some time and did train others. I worked in a hobby store for 5+ years too. Even flying the easiest high wing, flat bottom airfoil trainer, some guys could take months at the local flying field before soloing. (flying weekends only)
The plane you are looking at is not a learning plane. It is an impending disaster for a new pilot. I'm not saying don't buy it, but dont fly it as your first plane.
My experience is: if you fly, you will be doing repairs. If you can't build it in the first place, how are you supposed to fix it? :) Trust me, you learn alot about the airplane and its characteristics from the building process. (Incidence, dihedral, airfoils, thrustlines, engine, wingloading, control surfaces...)
I recommend a simple trainer kit: box fuselage, high wing, rudder, ailerons, elevator and throttle control, constant chord wing (flat bottom is more stable) and something in the .40 cubic inch displacement range.
I built a Sig Kadet (mkII) 15 years ago very quickly (2 days), did a mediocre job, but learned alot and was up and running very quickly.
ARF's (Almost Ready To Fly) quality is much improved these days, but the customers I dealt with had great trouble repairing them when they eventually crashed, and/or had to order replacement parts.
Great Hobby tho. Fascinating.
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Originally posted by Arcon
"I built a Sig Kadet (mkII) 15 years ago very quickly (2 days), did a mediocre job, but learned alot and was up and running very quickly."
I did the same thing 22 years ago!...Built a 3 channel Sig Cadet,stuck on a hot Super Tiger .35,pointed it into the wind and with no stick experience landed it safely after a 10 minute flight.(though it touched down a half mile away and bounced into a neighbour's backyard fence is another thing)..:)Still have more memories from that plane than all the others that followed.
Start with a high wing plane built to take punishment.Then go low wing..then go Me109..:)
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I learned on a Great Planes PT-40. Excellent aircraft. Mine had a unique color scheme also, yellow wings, black body, and a black stripe on the right wing and right horizontal stab to help orient myself in case of emergency. Have only had one minor crash in it.
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In the past, Great planes used very good wood with a high degree of prefabrication. PT-40 was flown a lot as first plane at our club.
SirLoin, I used the Briggs & Stratton of R/C for my first Kadet... the K&B .40 :)
Originally covered in doped cloth, It was recommended I recover in monokote, which I did. Much easier to repair :)
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Or start with a glider.
eskimo
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With all due respect, eskimo, a glider isnt going to help smooth the way to powered flight very much, certainly not the semi-scale he wants to fly.
Gliders can be flown just about anywhere without upsetting people, so that is an advantage if your not in a club...
Granted, orientation, radio controls, simple stuff can all be learned from a Gentle Lady, but if your headed towards powered flight, nothing substitutes for a powered aircraft.
I've built and flown gliders, slope soarers (their fun and simple!) Powered: ARF, scale, performance, pattern, etc. Don't make me an expert. But going from a glider to the ME would be like going from crawling to juggling while riding a unicycle
:)
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True, but it's a cheep easy way to ease into the hobby.
eskimo
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Originally posted by eskimo2
True, but it's a cheep easy way to ease into the hobby.
eskimo
Rgr that..It's cheaper and easier to go the powered glider route.Lot's of electric arfs out there.Also lots of glider kits that would take an OS 1.0 on the nose or wing pod.I have a 2 metre Top Flight "Metrik" that I built 20 years ago.It still flys great!(though I did have to use the plans to build a replacement wing after flying it into a goal post)...:eek:
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Punt -
How good are the 'house of balsa' kits?
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Heh SirLoin I don't have the coin or the workshop for RC, mebbe one day!
Dad's the RC'er yet he's lucky if he gets to spend 24 hrs a yr withem these days. Mum has too many projects for him
SKurj
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Originally posted by moose
"How good are the 'house of balsa' kits?"
House of Balsa make very good kits though I have not built any.They have an excellant line of small scale kits too.Anything from a J3 Cub to a Me109...Kits are around $59.00 and are by far the best small scale kits on the market...Check out "Model Airplane News" June 2002 or http://www.houseofbalsa.com
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I think gliders are the perfect way to ease into R/C. I started with a Gentle Lady myself. It takes a while to get the feel of reversing aileron input when the bird is coming at you, and gliders give you the time to figure it out. They also teach you about stalling without killing you. This is especially true if you are starting without any instruction (like I did).
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Originally posted by SirLoin
Originally posted by moose
"How good are the 'house of balsa' kits?"
House of Balsa make very good kits though I have not built any.They have an excellant line of small scale kits too.Anything from a J3 Cub to a Me109...Kits are around $59.00 and are by far the best small scale kits on the market...Check out "Model Airplane News" June 2002 or http://www.houseofbalsa.com [/B]
Yeah, I saw a bunch of them on ebay and I picked up a P-51 kit for $40
Maybe one of these days ill get a digital camera and make notes of my experience building it :)
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I built a House of Balsa P-51... used a .20 engine on it. I left the gear off and did grass landings. It flew fast and honest, but was no beginner's bird.
Moose, if you build any warbird as your first plane, go bigger. One of the best scale birds I had (for honest flying) was a Pica 1/6th scale FW190D9. It was laid out very well for an R/C bird, was light enough to be forgiving on deadstick, and didn't suffer much in the way of needing trim change with speed. It had the added benefit of being very easy to see, too.
Whatever plane you build, you won't be able to squeeze a pin into your rectum on the first flight. ;)
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Moose you are making a huge mistake if you don't buy a trainer type plane when learning.
There are reasons why even real world pilots started on easy handling, slow, light wing loading trainers. Much the same, even more actually applies to RC.
Buy a .40 size trainer, not a .20 Mustang.
You WILL crash your Mustang, loose money, then either quit- or do what you should have done in the first place and get a trainer.
FIND AN RC CLUB
Get to know the guys, ask around, ask what trainer is popular at the field and who can train you to fly.
JOIN AMA
http://www.modelaircraft.org
JOIN THE CLUB
AMA membership is required at all clubs in USA for insurence reasons.
BUY TRAINER
I reccomend the Hobbico Avistar "Select" ARF, this plane comes with a high quality name brand OS engine and Futaba radio installed for $300. It's the best value in RC Trainers. Plus this plane has a semisymetrical wing and less dihedral so it can be quite aerobatic after you learn the basics.
Don't be arrogant and prideful by avoiding trainers, you will buy one sooner or later after you crash the Mustang. Its way too small, too fast, and will be thrown around by the wind way too much.
Buy a trainer and join a club if you wanna learn and don't wanna kill somebody. :)