Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Ripsnort on March 14, 2001, 10:03:00 AM
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WOO HOO, SNAP SHOTS NOW TWICE A WEEK!
This weeks Snap shot for Friday night and Sat. afternoon (US times)
TURKEY SHOOT (http://www.ropescourse.org/marianas.htm)
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~Death Rattlers~
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"If most Americans believed in political correctness, we'd still be
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Charlton Heston
[This message has been edited by Ripsnort (edited 03-14-2001).]
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Cool! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) I'll have to call in sick every Saturday!
<S>IC
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One of the reasons it was a turkey shoot was because the f6 totally outclassed the zero. I certainly apreciate the effor by the cm team to get these goin on friday nite's and no one is happier than I am bout it but I think without some adjustments it's gonna be really hard to get poeple to fly axis. As it is, the zeros are gonna get slaughtered..maybe a 60% to %40 player ratio would be a quick fix.
CRASH
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Errr, pilot quality had alot to do with it...and here in AH, I think the Zero's will hold their own quite well!
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Thats the biggest problem of any late war plane set: historical scenarios are often unbalanced. The IJN air force will probably be slaughtered in any CV battle.
Same thing will happen in Euro Scenarios with FW190As trying to intercept B17 at 25-28K. And no, Doras and Ta152s were not buff killers (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Anyway, good luck to CMs and players (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) Scenarios keep online flight sims alive.
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Ahhh, in Aces High, the hellcat does'nt do so well against the zero:
Plane vs plane comparison
tour 14, f6f 23 kills, 30 deaths against the zero (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I fly the hellcat a bit, and have a tough time with those zeros (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Should be interesting, the check 6 events the last two weeks had the hellcat and the zero. Not sure what the outcome was, but the allied did not have a huge victory (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) .
gospel
CO 332nd flying mongrels
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The Hellcats got their butts kicked last weekend by Japanese... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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1 reason is because the Hellcat turns better than, say, the Corsair, therefore, Hellcat pilots "think" they can turn fight a zero. Not happening. Fly the Hellcat like a Corsair and you get better results. Hellcat is a divin' SOB.
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Big groups of Hellcats at altitude will do far better against big groups of Zeros at altitude than one-on-one combats in the AH MA in the situations Zeros are normally used there.
I'm really shocked that Zeros would be even remotely competitive in a large scenario vs. Hellcats; wasn't at that scenario and don't know the setup, but had to have been a lot of people trying to turnfight.
Heck, back in Warbirds large Pacific scenarios, the Wildcats and P-40s (and even the P-39s when flown by great squads like the Flying Pigs) used to routinely crush the Zeros (A6M2s, of course) and the gap between the Wildcat and the Hellcat is far bigger than the gap between the A6M5 and the A6M2.
In large, realistic battles, just as in WWII, given relatively equal pilot quality and understanding of their aircraft, speed, dive ability, and durability almost ALWAYS wins.
[This message has been edited by Torgo (edited 03-14-2001).]
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to answer the question.... No... I would love to see some longer lasting furballs in the MA but....
best of luck with any scenerio thing you guys do. I'm all for more choice.
lazs
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I can tell you why my flight of 3 F6Fs got slaughtered last Saturday.
By the time we got launched off the CV, the enemy was already at alt over A7. Like they got a half hour start on us.
And it wasn't zeros we were dealing with, but 205s
Weave
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Originally posted by Weave:
I can tell you why my flight of 3 F6Fs got slaughtered last Saturday.
By the time we got launched off the CV, the enemy was already at alt over A7. Like they got a half hour start on us.
And it wasn't zeros we were dealing with, but 205s
Weave
LOL, I was still talking to the CM on Ch 200 in the tower at A7 when the first bombs dropped on A7 !!! yep, we got jipped in that scenario. Won't be a CO for those anymore(but will participate as a flyer)...any team that gets a good 10 min jump on the other is gonna have a slight advantage!
Also noted that a one point I checked the roster, 26 enemy, and 10 friendlies...I didn't whine, I didn't cry,(I might be now!) I just did the best I could under the almost 3-1 circumstances....was fruitless in the end. I did manage 4 kills for 2 deaths though!
[This message has been edited by Ripsnort (edited 03-14-2001).]
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Originally posted by Weave:
And it wasn't zeros we were dealing with, but 205s
Hehe, 205s with alt advantage over F6Fs ... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) And Zekes will always be slaughtered by medium-good F6F pilots. In the worst case the Cat pilot can always disengage.
Anyway, <S>! to those CM's who works hard to build an event.
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What time Friday night? I always miss Saturday because of the kids.....but if it's later on Friday night I'll be there (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Yeah... am I just blind? I couldn't find a time for the Friday night event...
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Originally posted by Kratzer:
Yeah... am I just blind? I couldn't find a time for the Friday night event...
10 pm EST
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Yeah the ki-205 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) was no match fer f6...I shot down 5 in first hour....well 4 had to drag udie (f4) i think thro ack at 18.....
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Pray not for an end to the slaughter...but for VICTORY!!!
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Originally posted by Weave:
I can tell you why my flight of 3 F6Fs got slaughtered last Saturday.
By the time we got launched off the CV, the enemy was already at alt over A7. Like they got a half hour start on us.
And it wasn't zeros we were dealing with, but 205s
Weave
I remember the zekes rolling after the CM in charge said the logs had started, and the 205's rolled just ahead of us.
I recall F6F's coming in coalt with us at A7? I saw no advantage on our side. The main reason the F6F's died that I killed was they were turnfighting zekes at an altitude of 20 feet off the water. I eventually died to some wiser B&Z Hellcats.
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I'm not saying the axis rolled early or the allies rolled late or vice versa, just that the axis rolled after the logs had started. I got into the arena late, and wasn't on top of what was going on in the big picture.
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For the moment it is 10pm EST for the Friday night snapshots!
The more that play the better the scenerio goes!
Things starting to get interesting with the scenerios and hopefully only gunna get better (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
S!
Rocket
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Woho who .. Ripsnort let me add the CMs perspective to that....
Ok we had a ROLL and at 3:15 PM , i told you before hand, that you might have some problems with the mission planner and that you'd better do it manually, because it ain't working right with planes disabled.
We then agreed uppon that i'll enable planes after i open the logs and you get 5 mins to get your folks moving .. it took you almost 3 times as long .. and Wilbuz used that time to get planes to A7 and recapture it (which could have been repelled if you'd had some GVs at the field)
Also why did the F6Fs of the CV get whacked ? Because if you up from 10 miles away and go in low under a CAP that has alt on you it's very likely that you'll get whacked...
MA-Tactics don't work in Scenarios ... fights tend to be fought higher and more cautious .. Wilbus did and suceeded.
As for the inballance Rip, when you had 10 Pleople only i allowed instant respawn for the allies but not for the Japanese so a got part of the 26 Japanese were actually sitting in the Tower and watching while you had constat reinforcements till the numbers ballanced again (10mins before scheduled Re-UP window) and i locked the planes again.
DW6
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I must have missed the message about instant respawns otherwise I wouldn't have left. After getting whacked within five minutes of leaving the cv, I didn't want to wait forty minutes just to be overwelemed again.
When we got close enough to see the cons over A7, true they only had about 2k on us but we were still in a climb and e was low. Running wasn't an option as the 205s would have caught us easily.
The Axis side was much better prepared than we were, and thats nobody's fault but ours. No doubt their logistics were much better than ours. Course overwelming odds don't hurt either. They must have had close to every man over A7. It looked like a swarm of gnats over the base, and all of em probably wasn't showing on my FE.
Gv's on A7 might have slightly slowed the loss of the base, but even the uber osty is easily killed when more that one enemy engages it.
On another note, I may be remiss here, but I don't recall any co-op campaigns between the Italians and the Japanese in the Pacific or anywhere else. I must have missed it in the preview, but I was somewhat surprised to encounter the 205s.
Wasn't the most fun I've had at a scenario, but it's not putting me off. I'll be back again when I can.
Rip, don't sell your self short, you're a fine commander. I've flown many a mission you've put together in the MA. Hate to see us lose you as such in the scenarios. <S>
Weave
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Originally posted by hblair:
I remember the zekes rolling after the CM in charge said the logs had started, and the 205's rolled just ahead of us.
I recall F6F's coming in coalt with us at A7? I saw no advantage on our side. The main reason the F6F's died that I killed was they were turnfighting zekes at an altitude of 20 feet off the water. I eventually died to some wiser B&Z Hellcats.
hehe, Hblair, A7 was capture as soon as we had wheels up, and we didn't attack A7 in the first 30 min. You must be thinking of the 2nd round.
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I don't want to get this twisted, but here is my perspective Duck:
Ok we had a ROLL and at 3:15 PM , i told you before hand, that you might have some problems with the mission planner and that you'd better do it manually, because it ain't working right with planes disabled.
Yep, but our 5 min was slightly delayed due to more folks logging on
We then agreed uppon that i'll enable planes after i open the logs and you get 5 mins to get your folks moving .. it took you almost 3 times as long .. and Wilbuz used that time to get planes to A7 and recapture it (which could have been repelled if you'd had some GVs at the field)
So, you didn't allow both teams to start at a fair advantage? Did you know I still had a couple of 'last minute' log ins? I think for future CO's, you should wait until both sides are ready, we started at 20 min after the hour, which is late, but I've seen some of these start much later than that. I would not have needed GV's to hold the base if we launched at the same time, so it was not in the plan since I *thought* we would launch simotaneously.
Also why did the F6Fs of the CV get whacked ? Because if you up from 10 miles away and go in low under a CAP that has alt on you it's very likely that you'll get whacked...
By this time of the battle, we were doing two things, trying to protect our CV's from destruction, and, trying to beat back the enemy in attrition so that we could go offensive once again...incidently, they only had a slight alt advantage on us at 7 and 8, so kudo's to the enemy flyers, they did an outstanding job.
MA-Tactics don't work in Scenarios ... fights tend to be fought higher and more cautious .. Wilbus did and suceeded.
Yep, he did, it apppeared he had 2 or 3 large groups just basically on the defensive (which is what his role was)...my fight was dictated by the scenario set-up, take an island, but we could not do that without first beating back the opposition into attrition first, considering at one time we were outnumbered 2.6 to 1.
As for the inballance Rip, when you had 10 Pleople only i allowed instant respawn for the Japanese so a got part of the 26 Japanese were actually sitting in the Tower and watching while you had constant reinforcements till the numbers ballanced again (10mins before scheduled Re-UP window) and i locked the planes again.
Rgr, you took the proper measures, but at that point, we were kinda spread out, when I called for a launch, as the scenario went on, I ended up with fewer and fewer in my launches, meanwhile, the enemy that hadn't died, simply gained alt and waited for us.
What would I do different if I was the CM? First, not allow 1 a/c to launch until BOTH SIDES were ready, like I said, as I was using my '5 min' you gave me, I watched bombs dropping on A7.
Other than that, you did great!
I learned two things about this scenario, 1)Have just 2 big massive plane formations focus on one target.
2)I would not spread my forces so thin (as you mentioned, MA tactics don't work so well, *especially* when the enemy is sitting at alt in a defensive posture)
Like I said, I'll be part of these in the future, but as long as one side has an advantage of wheels up at least 5 min early...I will sit on the sidelines as a CO.
<S>
[This message has been edited by Ripsnort (edited 03-15-2001).]
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The problem with NOT alowing launch was that i had to enable The planes so that the mission planner works. -> lottsa folks hopping to the runway and starting off ... we had that before and it's hard to prevent.
As for the late arrivals .. gotta say i know that that's hard for a CO to have late arriving folks or folks that shufle around for ballance reasons.. probably the best way is to get your briefed folks up and rolling and sort the late ones out as soon as the first wave is up..
As for Wils tactic .. well can't comment on it too much as we strictly keep our fingers out of it (as CMs) but as for his goals , one of his goals was to sink your CV ! So he took advantage of the rules that say you can choose a different A/C after 40 mins and had his first wave use Jabos, Fihters and Goons only..
anyhow we've reported a few not working variables (one of which is the COUNTRY CAN FLY variable) to HTC and hope this to be fixed soon, because then we don't have to disable planes to prevent launch and the mission plannmer should work as intended.
Rip sorry if it looked as if i wanted to pull you down or sth ..
Still hope you'll give it another go next time and we see together how we can work the mission planner and Frame starts.
DW6
[This message has been edited by Duckwing6 (edited 03-15-2001).]
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Ok did a bit of testing with to squaddies in the SEA with the Mission Planner.
What we found is, that it's not really having BUGs, but rather has some features that are not instantly clear.
let me explain:
Ok Mission planner lets you Create Missions with Planes disabled but NOT submit (gives an error mesage) -> this is a feature (me thinks now)
* Suggestions:
1) Disabling the planes wouldn't be necessary if the country can fly variable would work (if that wouldn't cause the mission planner to show an error too if you try to submit a mission for a disabled country)
2) Show in the Field selection List only the Fields that have the selected Plane enabled (that would show nothing if all planes are disabled everywhere)
Expire time of the missions:
I had the time advance at x6 setting because this enables 1 Full day in 2 hours. This caused probably the following:
Rip i guess you went into the planner and edited your missions, but didn't think about the expiry time (i wouldn't have either). if you have the clock advanced beyond expiry time of the mission, when you submit it, it will not launch even if folks are signed up for it, but will disappear from the planner.
*suggestions:
1) have the CLOCK more prominent in the planner
2) Launch a Mision that has folks assigned to it in any case if the time is after the launch time (but don't just delete the mission)
Only 1 "Bug" we found (which could be a feature as well tho
When you select the takeoff direction and afterwards select the field, the Takeoff point will default back to Hangar
*Suggestio:
Keep the takoff direction once selected regardless of field change.
That's it!
Conclusion:
The Big upset with the planner could have been avoided if the CM / CO coordination of Mission start time and starting the clock had been better (Mea Culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa)...
Fort the next time we'll CLEARLY comunicate as of when the Missions launch time has to be set and then only THEN start the clock when the COs signal their readiness.
DW6
CM-Corps
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Duck, let me make this clear, Wilbuz's team beat us soundly, just a few of us were disturbed when we sat in A7 tower, and watched the bombs dropped as we were still trying to get FL's assigned and newcomers into the proper flights.
In regards to the mission planner, I'm not sure if you are saying that the problem has been found and corrected? If so, tell the other CM's about 'Lessons Learned' so that the mission planners will work, they take ALOT of load off the CO's. I do know that in other scenario's, it has worked fine, including large scenario's like Afrika.
Looking forward to tonight!
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Just an FYI here....
We're still trying to find the perfect solution on how to setup the correct fields with the correct planes, allow CO's to plan missions, all the while keeping flight locked down so people can't roll before the given time.
We think the addition of some new GUI CM tools in 1.06 has solved this dilemma, but the testing continues. Pyro has given us his assurance that they will try to get us to the above goal ASAP.
Not making excuses here, but just want you all to be aware that we are trying to make life easier for both CO's and CM's.
<S>
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Rip,
I'm looking forward to tonight too. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Allieds gonna get buggered up. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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Originally posted by hblair:
Rip,
I'm looking forward to tonight too. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Allieds gonna get buggered up. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
Well, Hblair, historically it was the Allies that came out on top, but it was against a Zero that had a very incompetant, young, under-educated pilot in the cockpit due to attrition of their best pilots...but it depends on the pilots of tonights match up handle their A/C...if you see a bunch of Hellcats turning with Zero's, I think you can say Bye Bye to "Lil Blue". (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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rgr rip. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Now help me build some rivalry here. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
We gonna slap you soooo hard, yo momma gonna feel it.
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Nope. I am not tired of it at all!
You have a point here?
Scenarios? Ah, maybe later...
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Voss
13th TAS