Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Sandman on May 20, 2002, 11:19:16 AM
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Here's an interesting article on why you may not want to consider purchasing X-Box.
http://red-mercury.com/mmceo/mmceo_current.html
I haven't bought a console in years and the last one was a Nintendo 64, that my son still beats on. Were I to buy one today, it would probably be the PS2.
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these people are biased. dont bother reading it.
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Interesting read
I used to work for a local Electronics Boutique and got to know the inner workings of Sony/Nintendo pretty well. They would send representatives up, brief us as to what was up and coming, etc. They really did a nice job of making us feel like we were part of the "team". Both Sony and Nintendo left the employees with lots of free t shirts and other gizmos. Great advertising for them, and it made us all feel like we had the *inside scoop*.
Sony went one further and gave each store a demo unit, and the manager let a different employee take it home for a month. We had a policy at EB where employees could take games home and try them out (ahem, or visit the happy CDR equipped PC...hehe).
I've always been torn between Nintendo and Sony. No doubt, as an adult, Sony had the better games. But boy, do I hate "Loading...". The N64s were an easier sell for folks who had toddlers/young kids. Mario, Yoshi and the sort appealed to kids that age. I had a N64 at home and loves the Flight game and the Zelda stuff. Cartridge meant no waiting for CDs to load...but also limited the machine to games that fit on a cartridge.
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One little issue Sandman. Check out the MS license for developers/licensees that want to sell/develop for the X-Box.
MS gets from 60% to 75% of the gross revenue of the game sale.
Personally, I think MS has bitten off more than even they can chew. Sony is not a little overnight corporaton.
Also, the nice things about the X-Box are also the bad things about the X-Box. They give you an Internet connection port, but just how can you play any games over the Internet that are not FPS type games? Ever tried to fly a plane with the controls they have? Ever want to talk to a player online? Hard to do with no keyboard.
The only positive aspect of the Internet connection works in conjunction with the HD they have. It does allow games to be updated, rather painlessly, but how many of the console developers actually update games? When they do it is usually a new release.
MS has stated they want to own the console/gaming market, but I think they may have severly under-estimated Sony's committment and it certainly appears Sony has a better handle on the console market in terms of how to stay there for the long haul.
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Supposedly there is a keyboard coming for the XBox.
There had better be I guess, LucasArts announced they are porting Star Wars Galaxies to both the XBox and PS2. Unless they will have separate servers for the console customers, it's going to be very hard for consolers to communicate with the PC players without a keyboard.
my guess is separate servers. I know it's slightly off the original topic, but it's relevant to Skuzzy's musings. (edit: yes, separate servers for each platform, according to a post from the devs)
As for the article themselves... I don't think Microsoft is in the X-Box for the profit in the short term. Their goal is probably like every other goal they have. Be the alpha dog in the pack, and then rake in the profits.
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My friend has a gamecube and we love the get 4 players and play Super Smash Bros. Melee. The GC has almost NO loading time...the thing is so FAST. And the graphics are very VERY well done. The GC is a VERY nice machine. I have yet to see the PS2, but I'm sure it will be just as good. Also for those you of you who don't know, the GC uses a Mini CD, nintendo no longer uses the cart.
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All three consoles are at the same price here in Sweden, since i havnt invested in an DVD-player yet i see this as an great oppurtunity to get both an DVD-player and an console game at the price of one... Since GC aint got the DVD player im going with X-Box.
Regards.
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get the PS2, the PS2 is also a DVD playa
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I've played a little bit with the PS2. The load time is a little annoying compared to the cartridge systems, but it's not any worse than loading up a game on a PC.
I like the fact that PS2 will play PS1 games. I really like the fact that PS2 and PS1 controllers are one in the same.
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cc that Beef! DVD is a big bonus for me. XBox can also play DVDs but you must buy a separate device or something to 'enable' the thing to play the DVD.
Its an interesting read no doubt, but I really coudl care less about who's winning the overall battle. I'll buy the console that interests me (mainly for the software titles). And the console can only do so much... for me, the PC will always remain #1 for its versatility. :cool:
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Originally posted by JoeDirt
these people are biased. dont bother reading it.
Just wondering what the bias was?
-Sikboy
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Originally posted by Octavius
cc that Beef! DVD is a big bonus for me. XBox can also play DVDs but you must buy a separate device or something to 'enable' the thing to play the DVD.
It's a remote with an eye receiver which goes into one of the game controller ports
XBox is the only console which offers High Definition. Now the games just have to be written for it :)
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Originally posted by Sikboy
Just wondering what the bias was?
-Sikboy
the xbox:rolleyes:
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Originally posted by JoeDirt
the xbox:rolleyes:
The Xbox was the bias? How does that make any sense? I don't understand, are you saying that the writer/site is biased for the Xbox. Or are you saying that the Writer/site is biased AGAINST the Xbox? I serious here.
-Sikboy
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Uh? Let me start out by saying I have a Game Cube. My parents got it about a week after it came out. They got it for $160.:D Though that is because we go to military bases to shop. :p I love my little black box. It looks like Hal9000s kid. I hate sony I hate XBOX. Why, you ask. The XBOX over heats. The playstation is from sony.
Just to give a hint on how rugged this little thing is I will give you some examples. 1.I dropped it on the hard wood floor from 5 feet. 2.I forgot to turn it off on a 5 day vacation, when we got back it was still on to my horror. I went over to it and turned the t.v. on and the paused screen from rogue squadron was still playing.
Thats I got this system and I love it.
:)
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my XBOX has NEVER over heated. i am sayign the writer is AGAINST the xbox, sikboy.
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Superpug, thats some weak arguments there, i might be sold with screenshots of amazing games or something similar, but i dont plan on bashing my console against the floor or leaving it on for days hehe.
I want to play awesome games and be able to watch DVD movies.
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best system if u have young kids would be the nintendo...
more game titles suitable for pre-teens..
SONY and XBOX have relatively few titles for this market share.
I didn't realize this until I visited a friend who has a 5 yr old. He wants a SONY, but the limited titles for young'ns means he will have to buy the nintendo if he wants a console at all
SKurj
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I'm buying the Gamecube because the Xbox games are too much like PC games, and my pc is more powerful than the xbox.
And the PS2 is already outdated.
The cube runs for $150 now, and the games are much fun, because of the wacky japanese style :)
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I bought an US PS2 (god the shipment!!) when Metal Gear Solid 2 came out - just for that single game!! :D
Playing beat 'em ups from time to time... GTA3 of course, Final Fantasy X and had some fun with Jedi Starfighter (hilarious movie outtakes if you complete all bonus objectives!)
The PS2 might not be technically on par with the other 2s but it has the biggest game/publisher base and a head start! And it has those *killer-games* I mentioned! (oh, well Rouge Leader for the Cube is really tempting!! - Halo not worth to mention, hope the PC version gets better!)
The X-Box, as mentioned, is just a PC in different clothes - most games you get there you get on the PC (and better: higher res, better controls, online etc.) - those exclusive *killer-games* with the launch did not convince me... yup, some are beautiful (Wreckless for example) but gameplay far from innovative. And of course it's (was) severly overpriced! Last but not least the controller plain sucks!
Da Cube - well, been a Nintendo fan since those LCD pocket games, had NES, SNES and N64 - great games, but not many... Compact, on par technically, built in LCD screen for travel play!! Rouger Leader is an absolut killer and Pikmin as fresh and innovative as you would expect from the Mario-creator! Would get one if my GF let me have it... ;) (oth saving for a cougar and a faster CPU... :D )
If you get a console NOW - its the Cube! If you absolutely want a DVD player to go with it get the PS2 (or a DVD player and tv-adapter for your PC!)
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Originally posted by JoeDirt
i am sayign the writer is AGAINST the xbox, sikboy.
I see no evidence of this in the article. Have you come to this conclusion via some other source?
-Sikboy
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"heavy box that looks a lot like a PC and would probably maim a small child if it fell off the top of a TV"
:rolleyes:
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thats a statement of fact joe. my xbox almost killed me when i bumped into the tv stand... this is an event i do not wish to relive
:D
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a PS2 could also easily "maim a small child".
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Originally posted by Octavius
thats a statement of fact joe. my xbox almost killed me when i bumped into the tv stand... this is an event i do not wish to relive
:D
lol:D
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Guys that play x-box game cube and PS2 are all fat lazy Nancy-Boys who are too chubby and nerdish to play real games like baseball and basketball.
I would LOVE for Maury Povich to do a show on "My kid is addicted to his x-box" and see Superpug and Joe Dirt sitting up there, their mothers crying uncontrollably because they have so obviously failed, and Pug and Joe grinning like idiots as they attempt to justify the filthy bedrooms, disrespect for the gifts their parents give them, and their fat pudgy-assed lifestyle they live... and then I hope Maury gives Pug and Joe BOOTCAMP! Yeah, send them off for a six week session of how to make a bed, how to shower, how to friggin poop, even- You guys need it, Joe Dirt and Superpug. I hope you get it.
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Ya know Elf, when you 1st came on here you were a 1st class troller
Now you're just old news. You call that bait?
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Uh? Let me start out by saying I have a Game Cube. My parents got it about a week after it came out. They got it for $160.:D Though that is because we go to military bases to shop. :p I love my little black box. It looks like Hal9000s kid. I hate sony I hate XBOX. Why, you ask. The XBOX over heats. The playstation is from sony.
Just to give a hint on how rugged this little thing is I will give you some examples. 1.I dropped it on the hard wood floor from 5 feet. 2.I forgot to turn it off on a 5 day vacation, when we got back it was still on to my horror. I went over to it and turned the t.v. on and the paused screen from rogue squadron was still playing.
Thats I got this system and I love it.
:)
It's good that the GC is so rugged, since it's only real use is as a doorstop. Or maybe a paperweight. It may be a collectible too, as it's quite likely to be the last non-handheld gaming system that Nintendo releases.
Console arguments like this are rediculous. Each system has its strong points (though, as an adult gamer I don't see much of one with the GC.) and a couple of games that are system sellers. It's always been this way since the days of the Atari VCS and Intellivision.
The "my system is better than yours" crap mostly comes from poor kids who can't afford more than one or who hafta make do with whatever their mom bought them. Of course they wanna feel that they've got the good system, so they're gonna trash the others. Often by using unfounded rumors that they have no actual knowledge of ("Xbox's overheat" Where did that come from? I've never heard a report of an X-box overheating in typical use.).
"I hate Playstation because it's from Sony"? What's the point of that? To dislike a game system from a company that's revolutionized the business and made it mainstream? One that constantly releases quality games and has made great consoles at a great price? Sounds pretty juvenile to me.
The comment in this thread about the PS2 being outdated is rediculous and shows a lack of knowledge about the PS1 development history. As programmers became more familiar with it, games on the PS1 continually pushed the boundaries and kept it in step with supposedly more advanced consoles such as the Dreamcast & the Nintendo 64.
Some of the games available now on PS2 are easily the equal of anything currently available on Xbox or GC. There's no reason to suspect any one of these consoles will suddenly make some great leap forward in graphics quality.
True gamers own all of the systems and realize that they all have some great games. Because that's what it's all about right? The games?
I've got a PS2 and an Xbox. I've given my Gamecube to a friend, as there hasn't been anything since Rogue Squadron that interested me. (She has a young son though, who finds more good games at his level than on the other two.) I've got a stack of great games for both the PS2 and the Xbox though, and there are more being released every day.
Anyone who thinks that Nintendo or Microsoft is going to "win" this round of the console sales wars is sorely mistaken. Sony "won" it when they released the PS2 long before the other consoles and when they included PS1 support. Per week, Sony sells over twice the number of consoles as the other two combined. That's just simply not gonna change. Doesn't mean that Microsoft won't keep making the Xbox and that there won't keep being great titles, but they're not gonna "Stomp Sony into the ground" as so many Sony haters were crowing before the Xbox's release.
Were I to suggest just one console to some poor soul on a limited budget who couldn't afford 'em all, it'd be the Playstation 2. DVD right outta the box with no need to spend >$30 for an add-on. The best console controller ever created, so no real need to buy another. (Unlike my Xbox, which has a controller even worse than the horrible N64 one.) A whole ton of great super cheap PS1 games available at any used game store. And (IMO) currently more "must own" exclusive games than the Xbox.
Luckily I'm able to own more than one console, so I can relish all the gaming goodness that is to be had when you don't limit your options. :)
D
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Originally posted by Sikboy
I see no evidence of this in the article. Have you come to this conclusion via some other source?
-Sikboy
Yeah, the source of "I own an Xbox, so anything negative about it is a direct attack upon me and my intelligence. And must be biased."
Sorry JoeDirt, but the economics of the console games have been discussed in depth all over the web. This article is saying nothing new. And it's certainly not biased. Facts are pretty difficult to bias.
D
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I Rather buy a new PC that burns away these silly game consoles.
:rolleyes:
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I Rather buy a new PC that burns away these silly game consoles.
Except that the PC games market appears to be getting smaller and the console market *alot* bigger.
A couple of years ago, PC games would take up about half the floor space in the gameshops here in the UK..now it's less than 25%.
Daff
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Originally posted by moose
Ya know Elf, when you 1st came on here you were a 1st class troller
Now you're just old news. You call that bait?
You're right Moose. I need a vacation. The stress is getting to me.
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PS2 = NCAA College Football 2002 for me.
that's the only reason I got it. Plus I was about to have surgery and was gonna be stuck in the easy chair with no comfortable way of playing games on the PC for a couple of weeks. Basically I played the hell out of it for 2 weeks, and now occasionally play a game of football here and there on it.
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A good sim will never come out on a console
I will never buy one, consoles are for kids with two left hands.
Btw that 25 % for PC is not bad at all
That 75% for consoles.
PS1,PS2,gameboy,gamecube,Xbox,etc.
U ain't got that 75% for one type console.
And btw those games are way to expensive too
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hey, mydickisinawolf (E[lfe]nwolf) i happen to play ice hockey. i weigh 187 and im 6'. but im lazy and yeah my roomis a mes. i play the xbox 30 mins to an hour a day....now that its summer. :D
so, pull it out of the wolf, and stfu. (http://ubbsmile.free.fr/smileys/diddly.gif)
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just wait for BROADBAND!!! :p ;)
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Heh, weak or not, it still worked.
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I've read this thread with some interest as I have recently considered an XBOX or a PS2. I play flight and driving sims mainly and a few FPS games (sorry but keyboard and mouse is the ONLY way to play an FPS) so my PC is fine for that. I want a DVD player but figured for a little extra I may as well have a games system as well so my son and I can play the sports games we enjoy playing together such as the EA series of games (Madden, FIFA etc etc) He has a PS1 with not many games so it would not be much of a bonus to be able to play them on a PS2 (PS1 games look terrible now anyway)
While the XBOX is technically superior it seems SONY is not content to sit back with recent announcements regarding the PS3 and its long term support that appeals to me as I sometimes think if Bill Gates decides the console market is a little too much to conquer he might just pull out and leave the XBOX to be the BETA MAX of the console world. On the other hand if he is really commited he has the bucks to throw at it and surely future XBOX's would be backward compatible but then his track record is not so good at delivering this. Seems both the PS2 and XBOX have online gaming planned, the XBOX more or less comes resdy for this while the PS2 has online gaming in the pipeline and Sony say online gaming will feature heavily in the PS3. As I already have a cable connection supplying two pc's I'm not interested in browsing through a console but the thought of online gaming such as the EA sports eries is kind of appealing (maybe I can find someone I can beat as my son is near invincible at all the games I used to think I was good at...ho hum must be getting old)
I have heard reports of the XBOX scratching DVD's, is this an urban myth or anyone experienced this problem? Also I fancy setting up a better sound system for my TV so would be interested in setting up a Dolby 5.1 system to incorporate either and XBOX or PS2..anyone done this?
With EA supporting the two formats I'm interested in (sorry Gamecube you look good but no DVD support) its a hard choice.
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I do not own any consoles and likely never will, but the article is pure BS for ignorant public.
Moore's Law applies only to silicon chip, not to the rest of the hardware.
In $300 X-Box a processor costs MS about $60 - with $40 of that being cost of the chip itself - the processor base dies not get cheaper.
If in 6 years the Moore's law reduces the price by 1/8th, it will apply only to the chip, so the sabings will be 7/8 x 40 = $35.
The processor mounting, boards, metal, plastic, case manufacture, brackets, assembly will cost the same or more in 6 years, so the X-Box will cost MS $262, not $37.50!
Hard drives are not going to get cheaper as in any product there is a minimum price at which it is worth making it at all. HDs capacity will be much bigger in 6 years at thw same price but why wwould X-BOX need extra capacity.
CD-Player will not sell for less then $50 even if it plays DVD, etc. - becasue the main expence is in laser and motor, not circuitry.
How about transportation? Storage costs? Distribution expences? Retail expences? Advertising expences?
Even if MS gets the processor for free along with the chipset and graphics processor, it will not drop their cost by half.
That is true with any product that achieves maturity - cars, furniture, clothes, etc. - the price stops dropping while quality continues increasing.
Whether MS is losing money on X-Box or not, I don't know - and too lazy to examine it's quarterly reports - but the argument of that article is flawed.
miko
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Originally posted by JoeDirt
hey, mydickisinawolf (E[lfe]nwolf
I really hope that was a knee jerk response, and not something you put any effort into.
-Sikboy
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i ask you a question...who CARES everyone knows you can get 5* the power and graphics from a good computer and if you want ot play the console games get a emulator and some roms but who wants to play those when you can play AH
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Careful, SB. He's a 6' 187 lb. hockey player. :rolleyes:
Vorticon, here's why:
1. It's a group thang. Playing with four people in the same room, while we're pitching back beers and eating pizza is an entirely different soft of game than huddling in front of my glowing screen, playing with people I've never met.
2. Flight sims on consoles generally suck. Sports games are far better. Huddling around a computer desk with gamepads is feasible, but not nearly as comfortable (see #1).
3. Software Maturity. Out of the box, the software works. No patches, no updates. It's done.
4. Longevity. There are still plenty of people using PS1. I wouldn't be surpised to find PS2 still in action five years from now.
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Elfenwolf thot we were fat children that didnt play and sport....i was just correcting him :)
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Originally posted by JoeDirt
Elfenwolf thot we were fat children that didnt play and sport....i was just correcting him :)
Sorry Joe. See, I had assumed after viewing the pictures of your room and reading your posts that you were a fat lazy twelve year old who lives in a pig sty. My bad, you are a fat lazy 6' 187 lb. hockey player who lives in a pig sty. I stand corrected.
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thank you
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Originally posted by BUG_EAF322
I Rather buy a new PC that burns away these silly game consoles.
:rolleyes:
As I said above, no true game fan would limit themselves. Not to just one console, nor just to a computer.
There are PLENTY of kick-ass games available only on console. Or that are so far down the road for a PC release that it's foolish to wait.
Played Metal Gear Solid 2 on your PC lately? Virtua Fighter 4? NFL 2k2 with 8 players at the same console? Gran Turismo 3? Jet Set Radio Future? Final Fantasy X? Any real gamer denying himself these pleasures probably really isn't a real gamer. And oughtta remove himself from gaming discussions.
Consoles do their type of game very well. PC's do theirs. Denigrating one over the other is close minded.
D
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why metalgear when there is OPF
Why gran turismo when there is needforspeed
and alot other subtitudes.
I will never buy one that'sfor sure it's a waste off money and the games are mostly 130% off the price u would pay for a PC version .
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Originally posted by BUG_EAF322
why metalgear when there is OPF
Why gran turismo when there is needforspeed
and alot other subtitudes.
I will never buy one that'sfor sure it's a waste off money and the games are mostly 130% off the price u would pay for a PC version .
True; but where in the PC is Final Fantasy X, Pikmin, and such games?
The is no originality on the PC gaming field anymore.
My last console was a Super Nintendo.
My next one will be a GameCube
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Originally posted by BUG_EAF322
why metalgear when there is OPF
Why gran turismo when there is needforspeed
and alot other subtitudes.
I will never buy one that'sfor sure it's a waste off money and the games are mostly 130% off the price u would pay for a PC version .
OPF? Not sure what that is. Do you mean Operation FlashPoint? If so, you're thinking of a completely different game genre. There's nothing in the same catagory on the PC that's the equal of Metal Gear Solid 2.
Maybe if there was a new Need For Speed, but none of the NFS titles equals what GT3 is. There are certainly better driving sims on the PC than on a console (Nascar 2002 & GPL being just 2), but for pure fun racing GT3 reigns supreme. Though I sure would like to see a new NFS done as nicely as the Porsche game but with a more exciting mix of cars.
I suppose if you have trouble paying $50 for a game, you can find cheaper crap for the PC. But I can go out and buy GT3 now for $25. Hell, I can probably find GT2 for $15 and it's STILL a better game than any NFS on the PC. And I can't remember the last game I bought for the PC that cost less that $45.
Hey, it's all OK though. I remember back when I couldn't afford to be buying a buncha console games. I convinced myself that they were all lame and that my computer games ruled and that I didn't need anything else. I'm just happy now that I can experience all of the awesome games that the industry has to offer.
D
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I don't know why people bash each other for owning a certain game system. I have a Gamecube with a little attachable tv and Ps2, and every system before(yes i still have a jaquar and sega cd;)) The reason I don't have a X-box is because of the games. I only reason i buy a system is when it has games that are good or interest me. I will eventually buy a X-box but no anytime soon. Plus the X-box controller is too big All I'm trying to say is buy the system that has the exclusive titles only for it that you like,becuse most 3rd party games come out on all systems.:cool:
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Grand Theft Auto III for the PC hits stores today. :D
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Anyway a pc comes around the corner to make these games for consoles.
A pc will always outrun a gameconsole
I would not have the time to check out all those other games also
So there will be enough games for the PC to satisfy u a life time.
:cool:
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Originally posted by BUG_EAF322
Anyway a pc comes around the corner to make these games for consoles.
A pc will always outrun a gameconsole
I would not have the time to check out all those other games also
So there will be enough games for the PC to satisfy u a life time.
:cool:
Yeah... And Bill Gates once said, "No one will ever need more than 640K of RAM...
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Originally posted by BUG_EAF322
Anyway a pc comes around the corner to make these games for consoles.
A pc will always outrun a gameconsole
I would not have the time to check out all those other games also
So there will be enough games for the PC to satisfy u a life time.
:cool:
Maybe enough to satisfy you, but don't speak for me.
Your out-of-hand dismissal of gaming consoles assumes that everyone has your desires or situation. A little self-centered isn't it?
D
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With regard to what to buy PS2, gamecube, X-box - it can only come down to which console will cosistantly give you the games you most want to play for the forseeable future.
You can only look at what is out game-wise already and what's in the pipeline and also how well the console is selling. The console which sells best will be very attractive for developers due to the (much ?) larger sales base. This is the console which will have a steady stream of good games through sheer weight of numbers. The console will be come a cash cow for the company and any thought of replacement will be delayed giving the console a longer life span = more games = more value for money.
A safe bet at this point would be the PS2, however in this day and age of low prices i'm sure the market can support all 3 so hopefully they will all continue to offer something for nearly everyone now and in the future. It's all down to whatever floats your boat.