Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: AcId on March 15, 2001, 09:08:00 AM
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I had yet another dream last night that I was in AH. "Another?" you ask. Well, tell us about both of them.
The first was about 3 weeks ago, I was flying through a canyon and all the textures were bump-mapped. Man was that a beautiful sight, almost realistic. (no I wasnt dreaming about flying for real, it was AH) All the textures seemed to have life to them. If you dont know what bump-mapping is I posted a small example below. I'm not sure if what I saw was Hardware bump-mapping or pre-rendered textures, still it didn't matter to me. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
The other dream was last night. The cloud affects were enabled, only slightly different. They werent the same cloud repeated as is current, and individual dark thunderheads would form, not just a big square "sector" of a cloud but varrying in size and shape. Sorry no lightining, though it was very beautiful.
Maybe a sign of things to come? It would be nice.
Original logo
(http://home.swbell.net/r-azar/vmforig.gif)
Original after I Bumped with software
(http://home.swbell.net/r-azar/vmf222bumped.gif)
Some would argue it's not true bumpmapping if it's not done in Hardware, but this should give you an idea of how I saw the in-game textures.
XO VMF-222 of MAG-33
[This message has been edited by AcId (edited 03-15-2001).]
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Maybe it's just me, but your post reminds me for some reason of "Raising Arizona"...
Mk
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Originally posted by Mk10 225th:
Maybe it's just me, but your post reminds me for some reason of "Raising Arizona"...
Mk
"...She lost all interest in law enforcement and personal hygiene...."
LOL, that is one of my all time favorite movies!
Cobra
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Bumpmapping...it would be nice but the 500 celeron voodoo2 folks will start crying and ask how dare you wish to up the system requirements so that their outdated machines wont run it well, besides, most of us with 800mhz up only buy them for office and word, god knows no game should ever have system requirements that are over the slowest computer that may want to play it.
Just ignore the sys req whiners, and cover your monitor and keyboard with plastic so the tears dont short it out.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Every night, sadly.
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Sheeeesh...ur name is acid (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Wobble, I'll gaurantee you that the bump mapping currently sought after to give you a good representation is done in software mode.
Guess what? Even a PIIII 1.4GHz chokes on that when you couple software driven bump mapping and a lot of polygons on the screen.
You think it will be the low end users screaming?
Maybe you should learn more about computers and graphics before you spout off about something you don't know.
-SW
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Maybe you should learn more about computers and graphics before you spout off about something you don't know
Yea, I should thought of that before I finished My A+ certification,
or got my degree,
Or started working at Computer Technical Services,
or began Computer Systems Services.
Yea, i guess you can do alot of things these days without knowing anything huh?
Use hardware bumpmapping, or a bogus bumpmap emulation of sorts, IL2 sort of does it on its terrain.
[This message has been edited by TheWobble (edited 03-15-2001).]
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Touting off about certifications might be nice for a suit looking for employee, but it sure don't work against me.
I'm not certified at all, I work side by side with people with that are A+, MCSE, etc certified. Funny how I know things they don't, and things I don't know I can figure out faster.
-SW
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You know...... ive got no degree, dont own a business and im rarely very successful in my ventures. I do know though that although computers APPEAR smart... the smartest part of 'it' is the operator that codes it to do whats wanted. Ill guess the smart thing here is to make a 'switch' in the program for Hardware/Software(if they can be assed)/NONE(for when you get tired of the frame hit)
Can i punch someone now ? Like they do in Jerry Springer ?
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You're wierd.
SwampRat
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I'm toothless, homeless, and enjoy collecting bottle caps and old, crumpled cigarette packages.
Mk
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<Grabs Petrel's hair and starts pulling hard while screaming in his face!>
Saw
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Wow....It was just a dream guys. It wasn't posed as a "could it be done?" question. But, in the not to distant future it will be possible. Look how far Graphics have come in the past 4 yrs. alone, nevermind before that.
SW said:
Guess what? Even a PIIII 1.4GHz chokes on that when you couple software driven bump mapping and a lot of polygons on the screen.
Why do you think the graphics market moved to GPU's? And why do you think they are moving more and more of the operations off the CPU side and on to the GPU? I'm not going to try to sound like I know what I'm talking about here but you said:
I'll gaurantee you that the bump mapping currently sought after to give you a good representation is done in software mode.
Do you know what 'per-pixel shading' is? And did you know that the GeForce2 does it in Hardware? Not very good yet but it does, and How bout the GeForce3, it does
Dot3 Bump mapping
Environmental Bump Mapping
Per-pixel reflections
True, reflective bump mapping
Z-correct bump mapping
Phong-style lightning effects on bump maps with reflections
The card may not be available to you yet but its out there and on its way.
Do you know who else does Dot3 bump mapping? How about ATI's Radeon? mmmmm could beeee.
Funny.....you made no mention of Hardware in your post. You comenced on putting the smack down on TheWobble for no apparent reason and failed to back up your response intellectually. I don't care who you are, who you work for/with, what degrees/certs you do or don't have. If you talk the talk you better walk the walk.
*Hands the mic back over to Jerry*
[This message has been edited by AcId (edited 03-16-2001).]
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hmmm wobble... that explains why you think that you should be entitled to more perk points simply because you spend more time taking up space in the game. Why you should have a better plane because you "earned" it.
lazs
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I made no mention of hardware, because in order to do bump mapping, Acid, you need to either have it on all platforms or none.
The only way to get it on everyone's system is to force them into buying a Geforce card, or tell 'em to f*ck off.
You think the game will last with the few people that can afford a GF2 or the 600$ GF3?
The point behind my stating to get decent bump mapping, it has to be done in software is because it NEEDS to be done in software for cross platform compatibility.
I know what cards do bump mapping, and I know what cards don't. I didn't need to bring up a list, I was telling "TheWobble" that it would be done in software.. and that's not very fast at all.
Remember: Cross Platform Compatibility.. it either makes or breaks software.
-SW
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Originally posted by aztec:
Sheeeesh...ur name is acid (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
"aztec"
like those south americans don't have anything to do with psychedelics... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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And if you want to know why I "gave TheWobble the smack down", re-read his post.
Why should *HE* be forced to play a game when *HE* has the system to play it with a lot more detail and a fully active environment?
Hmmm if he's so damned rich, I wonder if he can afford to pay for us all to HTC to keep the game running for his higher specification system?
You can't very well make people upgrade because some people have the hardware and some don't, and then call them whiners because they can't push their system to the limits nor can they afford to go out every year to dump 1500 - 2000$ to get the next best thing.
Think in terms of what people have today, and what they are probably still using from yesterday... Next year the Geforce 40000 might come out with every graphical feature you could think of done in hardware... but how many people have the money to buy it? How many people are still running something else?
Think about it.
-SW
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Games that do support Bump mapping do infact run on systems that don't support it with that effect disabled. It is added eye candy for those who have the capability. So you see it isn't a question of cross-platform compatibility. It's simply an option, just like 16 bit Vs. 32 bit color. If you want 32 bit you had to upgrade your vid-card right? But the same game that does 32 will run on a 16b card as well. I agree that if it was done in software everyone could have the option but like you said It would require way to much horsepower, not to mention a coding nightmare to get it to work on every possible PC/Vid-card config out there. Which is why it is being done in Hardware. To reiterate, it does not need to be done in software to make it work, the obvious better option is Hardware. It would be nice to be able to give it to everyone for free, but if you want to see it you gotta pay for it. Just like 32b.
Edit: I'm not talking about "If you want to play the game, now you have to upgrade." Options dude, I'm talking about Toggled options. You don't have the capability, fine, but you can still play the game without added eye candy.
[This message has been edited by AcId (edited 03-16-2001).]
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Right, I understand what you mean Acid... but I'm trying to say that the engine would need re-worked.. perhaps even a new engine to accomodate both bitmap and bump mapping terrains.
Obviously, it would need an entire new graphics engine to run bump mapping, no question there (many many months of work too), but in order to accomodate both you might run into problems.
Just the way the two ways of creating terrain would work.
Yes, I think bump mapping would be nice, but it may not be a viable option for online gaming (where there is a definite need for speed) for another year. You also need more system memory and an AGP card to do it well.
I have enough system memory, I just have an outdated system.
I wouldn't be against bump mapping, but it may not be a worthwhile option until it's completely supported in hardware with a few more options.
I understand you don't want it right away, but TheWobble comes off that way. I think it would be a nice option, by the time we see a really good bump mapping engine and video card that can support it (maybe 6 months to a year for the video card) then there's really no point in making an engine right yet.
As an option down the road, yes I think it's a good idea. But right now, it is probably just as good to have a terrain with a bitmap overlay.
-SW
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Yeah......It was a beautiful dream.
*runs off to the lab*
Time to do some work for a change.
[This message has been edited by AcId (edited 03-16-2001).]