Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: PakRat on February 10, 2001, 11:06:00 AM
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I see it way too often. People get shot up or they think their opponent should have died with all the lead they put into them and somehow it is just not possible without the other guy cheating. So the radio lights up.
I would bet there really is the occasional cheat that gets past the server. However, this can't be happening nearly as often as the cries of cheating. Most often it is just that they met a pro that put a few bullets right into the canopy or it could also be the ever-present net lag.
But to go on the radio and claim cheating when there is little to no evidence is ludicrous. To then go on the radio and talk about all the cheating you "saw" as if you actually witnessed it then to reveal under questioning that you only read about it on the BBS is even worse.
Guys, get a grip and accept that there are better pilots and gunners than you and that occasionally your data might get lost through no fault of yours or anyone else's. To cry out and accuse people of cheating - people who have frequently been around, flying and winning, for way longer than you have - is just another form of whining. Only this form is worse. In this case you libel other players.
There are a few players who constantly accuse others of cheating. Who whine "no way" etc. It's far more likely these players just have a hard time accepting they are bad shots or their opponents are better.
If you see what you think is cheating, just document. Turn on the recorder and go test the other player as best you can. Notify HTC with time and player ID. But lay off the accusations unless you are damn sure you are correct.
It's sickening.
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Rape, pillage, then burn...
[This message has been edited by PakRat (edited 02-10-2001).]
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Agreed! Give this man a cigar! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Unfortunately, people aint psychic to know when they are going to meet the alleged "cheater".
Last night my squad saw 2 separate instances of extremely fishy occurances. Flakpanzers shooting goon and troops through the hangar wall (hangars up), which we of course didnt film, and later on a FW190 being turned into a completely wingless FIREBALL and it kept flying while a CHOG, 3 P-38's and I believe a Typhoon hit him repeatedly and the thing kept flying, circling over the field ack at low alt, getting hit by field ack as well.. and it kept turning, going vertical, shooting people down. We did manage to get that one on film.
Those germans not only make good cars it seems (Top Secret Pun heehe)
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PakRat is right on target! <S>
Let me first say I am an Older Pilot (52 yrs of age to be exact)I say this because most of the pilots I come up against are younger, quicker, more co-ordinated, have much better reflexes then I do.
I have to admit that there are many times I get jumped, or fall for a deceleration move. I think that a pilot turned back way to fast or caught me when extending.
First let me say,
I run my recorder on every flight!
When I am bested or really respect a manuver that a pilots displays I review it. I generaly find myself learning something new about my flying, my SA, or the game. Its 99% always a miss judgmentor error on MY part!!! In over 10 years of online air combat sims I can think of a few REAL situations that were REAL cheats that I witnesses.
Pilots that expound on open chanels about CHEATING before they reveiw and logically think about what really happened probably fall into one of these catagories:
- they don't REALLY mean that the other pilot was "cheating" but they use this phrase to overcome there inability to deal with the fact.. they were beaten.
- A quick ego response to let the others in the community to let them know that "Big Bad So & So!" couldn't be killed unless it was a cheat! LOL (some do this .. the real result is there credibility gets eroded!)
- Someone who really thinks he/she saw something unfair. (to this pilot.. review the film and take it to HTC privately.. if it is real ...they WILL deal with it! GEROOOONTEEEED! ) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Usually there are valid reasons for the preceived experience. It does more harm to the flightsim community and ourselves when we accuse someone before first reveiwing and trying to honestly understand the facts.
AGAIN HATS OFF TO PACKRAT..... WELL SAID!
My oppinion,
Thunder
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You would have to be very naive to think that someone could not cheat in AH. It is done in ** ALL ** online games. A while ago, two people, a p51 and a p47(?) I think, were dropping endless amounts of bombs on an enemy field. This was screenshotted by a few onlookers. That was an obvious cheat. However, if I were to cheat, I would make my .50's have the punch of a 20mm gun, Make my P51 climb 1000 feet per min better, add about 20mph to top speed, and increase the armour by 30%.
People are quick to accuse someone of cheating, but they are also quick to blame it on lost packets and the internet.
fscott
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a very useful cheat would be to disable the G blackouts and redouts.
And it would be almost impossible to notice and/or prove.
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Fscott - I never said that it doesn't happen. And I remember the screenshots posted regarding the endless bombs and such. It certainly happens - but not nearly as often as those who claim cheating would lead the casual observer to believe.
The incident that prompted the initial post was one where a player was unable to believe that another could hit as well as he apparently could from a flakpanzer and he was all over the radio accusing the other player of cheating. The "cheating" player's identity was discovered apparently when he was finally killed and a number of other players spoke up to the defense of the "cheater" as it turns out he really is a good shot and is not regarded in any way as a cheater. The guy has a good name in the community.
Unfortunately there are those who constantly accuse others of cheating. Either the gods and the stars are lining up somehow so these people are the only ones who see the cheaters (I have yet to personally see anyone appear to cheat) or these people lay blame on others when the fault is in fact their own or due to their/the connection. These bleaters are falsely accusing others. That's what got me pissed off.
I'm just saying to excercise more care and restraint before labelling someone a cheater and if you see it and believe it is real, to document it and report it. I would guess that HTC would then point cheat detectors at that account to see. Detected cheaters are apparently banned for life as they should be.
I'm not naive by any means. I understand it happens. But it is also more than obvious we have a number of players who don't quite realize the seriousness of their actions when it comes to falsely accusing others.
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Rape, pillage, then burn...
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Cheating is in the eye of the beholder. See my cheat? thread in the gameplay section.
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Email me that film Tac. I gotta see that! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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...or the target is losing packets (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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aye aye, my winger got the film, i'll ask him to send it to you.
I passed within d90 of that FW190 on a near-HO. Massive fireball with no wings doing loops. Talk about Foo Fighters! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Somehow this pics seems appropriate for this thread (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
(http://milenko201.tripod.com/ufo.jpg)
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"ASSASSINS have BIGGER Joysticks!"
<< MILENKO >> (http://pages.hotbot.com/games/davekirk/milenko.html)
ACES HIGH ASSASSINS Website (http://www.cybrtyme.com/personal/hblair/mainpage.htm)
WB/AH ASSASSINS Website (http://members.xoom.com/rowgue/assassins.html)
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I had that experience today actually!
I had just turned off my recorder and I wish I would have gotten this one on film. I put no less than a few rounds into a P38 with my ShVaks and it burst into flames. I assumed another pilot had damaged it in the furball and all it needed was my few rounds. A few seconds after I had disengaged the flames went away, its wings magically reappeared and it flew home to safety of field flak. I never got another chance to take him down after I realized what had happened.
I'm not sure who the pilot was, they never said anything. But if someone has a program doing something to the packet transfer is a plain ol' cheater. There really is nothing to gain from cheating either. If a pilot cheated to get to a very high rank in the (badly configured) scoring system, they'll possibly get bragging rights or whatever, but there isn't any personal game in the real world at all.
Cheating is only cheating yourself.
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-=///Octavius\\\=-
VMF-323 "Death Rattlers"
MAG-33
(AKA Executor)
Maz203@aol.com
[This message has been edited by Octavius (edited 02-10-2001).]
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Well said, Pakrat. This is all what i wanted to write, but my poor english dont lemme do it.
Tonigh i was in a H2H, got a spit on my tail and worked hard to turn the table. Well, it was lagged but i did turn the table and shot the guy down.
Like u said, Pakrat, imediately he started talking about "crazy moves", "u warp to much for me" etc..etc..etc.. He and another guy intend to call me a cheater and the other guy said: thats cheating pirado.
Now, pls dont piss me off and dont ruin my fun. Go read about internet conection, lost pakets,etc... like pakrat said then come here to play and have some fun with clear game with less typing about cheating and more FUN and SKILL.
Have a nice day.
Pirado
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I've only been accused of cheating by two people.
Towd and some newbie named Lotu.
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Originally posted by Octavius:
I had just turned off my recorder and I wish I would have gotten this one on film. I put no less than a few rounds into a P38 with my ShVaks and it burst into flames. I assumed another pilot had damaged it in the furball and all it needed was my few rounds. A few seconds after I had disengaged the flames went away, its wings magically reappeared and it flew home to safety of field flak. I never got another chance to take him down after I realized what had happened.
Cheating is only cheating yourself.
Been playing since day 1 of open beta. Never seen anything remotely close to this. If I did, I'd film it. I wouldn't dream of posting the accusation unless I had a film to back up what I saw.
I've heard people cry "cheater!!!, got you on film!!" in the main arena on channel 1. I propmtly hit 'em up on channel 1 with my email address requesting to see that film. Up until they leave the arena, they usually banter on channel 1 how they will send it to me. Mysteriously, they never do. They get out of the game, review the film, see what a total dork they were, and hope the whole thing just gets forgotten. If you're gonna accuse people of cheating, I wanna see film. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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in answer to nash get out of somthing that is basicaly a cheat mobile and you wont hear crap, you fly like a gamer from hell acm HAH your whole flying ability rests on abusing a screwed up flight model.
and the magic 9xx kills in the overmodeled hog cjust i just cant believer you brag about that.(in another thread)i remember playing this game before there was absolute proof of people cheating,that was when you all said it just couldent happen , "couldent be done" you said well it can and does get done on a regular basis . all the people who play alot see alot of really strange crap and say it on chan one . we had no super players like nash now we have tons of um. every one had a fair chance. seems like now some people get a edge whenever they need it. so here it comes again nash from towd/lotu ( who you knew is the same guy ) you are a no good gamin bugger and i believe a cheatin bastard . anything else i can clear up for ya?
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Having fought Nash many times in his F4U-1C, I can say that I have *never* witnessed him (ab)using it in a "gamey" fashion (whatever that's supposed to mean).
Just some good old-fashioned fine flying, especially in turnfights.
-- Todd/DMF
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No towd, that was good. Gave me a laugh and made my night.
If you could post something like that on Monday morning I'd sure appreciate it though.
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Granted, the cheating happens less frequently than everyone says, but I wonder how many cheaters are doing things that you would not detect. Two types of cheaters, one who wishes to be caught, and the other who doesn't.
HOWEVER, one thing no one has mentioned is that a cheater soon becomes bored with the game and quits. I know this from experience. I used to cheat in Descent several years ago. Yet, I made it very obvious by shooting 100 Earthshakers, or letting people shoot me with everything they had, then I would laugh, and laugh. That was obvious. But the game became very boring within a week and I quit playing because I knew others would be cheating also. In the end, I wished that I had never knew how to cheat in Descent because it ruined for me, an otherwise very enjoyable experience.
BTW, that particular cheat was becoming pretty common, and more and more people were using it. It did involve hacking the EXE file with a hex editor, so some skill was involved.
fscott
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hitech is a cheat he hasent become board with the game.
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hello all:
well I dont think you really have to film the person cheating. If you think somebody has hacked the system, just get some film on them, send it to HTC, and let them look at the programing stuff, that should be enough for them to know for sure. well I think it should be enough for them to know.
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wolf37
C.O.
THUNDER BIRDS
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Well said PakRat, I agree. I fly a fair amount and I cannot remember the last time I thought I saw someone cheating. Maybe it happens on occasion, but I think if it does it is rare.
I havent even noticed that many cases of someone accusing another of cheating, since RAM stopped flying anyway, at least as RAM. He never could seem to understand that when you log on from Spain, you might see a warp or two, and it wont always be intentional. Its the distance/lag factor there.
Most of the time I think when someone starts this, its a matter of an inflated ego. Some guys just seem convinced they are great fighter pilots, nearly invincible, and when this illusion might be shattered, they take refuge in the claim that the other guy just had to be cheating.
I find it easier to accept that someone killed me, end of story, and move on with my next flight/fight. I do see the occasional big warp that affected a fight. When I do, I try to go private with the guy and mention it, hoping he will offer to relog. Most usually do this. Before doing this, first I will consider if it could be my connect, and will ask countrymen or squaddies if they saw the warps.
Anyway, my two cents,
Dago
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Ahoi all,
Cheatin? GTR comes into mind, he,he.
This guy is incredible good in his ostwind.
If Deutschland would have seen him in ost in WW2, we Krauts would have never lost the war (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Big <S> to you gtr .)
blitz
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Cheating accusations are the ultimate compliment.
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Anyone who shoots me down is obviously a cheater . And yes GTR is damn good in the flakpanzer.. damn cheater .
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I have to admit I have in haste whined on the main or private channel acusin someone of a hack. Most the time it is because this game pumps your adrenaline up so high that when you get waxed you end up venting. To prevent this I squelch 1 know. That being said I do believe hacks infiltrate this game but I dont have a way of proving it, the only one who can police the game is Hitech.
Other things may be perceived as hack probably are not. I have witnessed people flying lancs like fighters (split s immelmans, etc.) first hand have I tried to duplicate it no, what is the point if manuevers like that are capable then it should be addressed by the developer if need be. My guess is some members learn so much about their crafts that they can find and exploit ways of doing things perceived as hacks. In summary we have hacks all games will have hacks, if it gets to the point where this game is no fun then time to take a break or cancel, when that day comes I will exit in a quiet manner.
PS. Where has torque been? I miss being frustrated by getting waxed by him. I have called him many names and on public channel.
He is a pilot ya just love to hate. I guess that is a compliment.
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WELCOME BACK TOWD/LOTU !!!!!!
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Cheating does happen but I'm sure it's not as rampant as some might think.
I know there are guys that cheat but there is not alot I can do about it so I don't complain.
You guys have all seen them..you know the pilots that take more damage than others and keep flying or ostwinds that don't die no matter how many eggs you drop on em or even the plane that come out of no where and ends up on your 6 even though you just checked around and saw nothing.
Yes some is netlag but some isn't. Some are worthless hacks who can't win on their own so they have to cheat.
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Yes NASH ,, we already know you cheat ,nobody is that good (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) <S>