Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: funkedup on July 15, 2002, 12:35:26 PM
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Morning Rip! :D
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LOL! You would NOT believe what I was just reading, about the BMW winning the engine-of-the-year again for a 8th straight year when I glanced up from my mid-morning break to read this!
(BTW, I agree with you in some area's, the "paint" on them is not up to USA standards, it chips very easy, and the Glass on BMW's are inferior to USA standards as well, lots of pitting.)
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Well glass is not too hard to replace. And I've seen pitting on lots of cars, especially ones that drive fast in dusty areas with lots of small rocks.
And pretty much all cars have problems with paint chips from rocks.
Again, especially if you drive fast.
That's what touch up paint and bras are for.
BMW winning the engine-of-the-year
Who gave that award and for what engine? In terms of power per unit displacement and reliability they are good but not the best. And obviously they are expensive motors.
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Hey.. I drive a BMW too! Its just not as mid-life crisis as Rip's.
The paint on it was quite nice and its a strange combination of hi-tech and K.I.S.S. The body panel fits were excellent.
Now.. you wanna talk Audi and I can give ya an earfull.
AKDejaVu
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BTW... I've seen bras on autos do much more damage than any rock chips could do. Plastic hood contoured bug deflectors seem the way to go.
AKDejaVu
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You can't drive around with a bra on all the time. But if you are taking a long highway trip it's a good idea to put it on.
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I can't believe it took Rip 4 minutes to respond to Funked's original post. He must have been in the loo. :D
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Originally posted by funkedup
Who gave that award and for what engine? In terms of power per unit displacement and reliability they are good but not the best. And obviously they are expensive motors.
Expensive? BMW325i start at $27,100, thats cheaper than Lexus, Mercedes, Volvo or other luxery class autos in the same classification ;)
What engine(s)? 2.5-3.0 liter class, the 3.0-4.0 liter class, and the 4.0 and above liter class. :)
Ref: http://www.ukintpress.com/engineoftheyear/categories.html
Here's the award report:
International Engine of the Year Award (http://www.powerwheelz.net/bmw/news_article.php?news_id=50)
BMW walked off with the International Engine of the Year Award, and would have done so even if its main contender hadn't been considered, because the Munich company also provided the overall runner-up. In fact, as well as taking the Best New Engine of 2001 prize, BMW won three of the other ten classes in the competition, and in most of the remaining ones it wasn't represented anyway, not being in the appropriate market sectors.
The presentation dinner on June 20 was held, ironically enough, in Stuttgart, home of BMW's principal rival. There were no gongs this year for Mercedes-Benz.
A panel of 38 motoring writers from Europe, North America, India, Japan, Australia and New Zealand took part in the voting, which was organised by Engine Technology International. They gave the rousing 343bhp BMW M3 engine 156 points, with the 1.8-litre Valvetronic engine from BMW's Hams Hall plant in the Midlands runner-up on 140. That ingenious new design will be seen in the 316ti Compact, soon to go on sale.
Third, on 135 points, was the Volkswagen Group 1.4 TDI pump injector turbo diesel, as available in the Polo, Lupo, Audi A2 and Seat Arosa. A score of 126 points gave fourth place, and the one-litre class win, to the three-cylinder Honda IMA engine fitted to the hybrid Insight. It also took the fuel economy award.
Ferrari's 5.5-litre V12, used in the 456M and the 550 Maranello, was judged best engine over four litres.
BMW's classic and now versatile straight-six design used in the Z3, 330, 530 and X5 model ranges - saloons, roadsters and 4x4s - won the three-litre class.
The 2.5-litre prize went to the new PSA particulate-filter 2.2-litre HDi turbo diesel available in the C5, 406 and 607. Honda's super-high-revving S2000 sports car engine, able to sweep easily past 9000rpm, took the two-litre award.
Saab picked up the Best Concept prize for the very ingenious SVC variable compression ratio engine, claimed to combine the power of a three-litre with the economy of a 1.6.
BMW 3-litre (Z3, 330, 530, X5) 162
BMW diesel 2.9-litre (330d, 530d, X5) 149
Mercedes-Benz diesel 2.7-litre (C-Class, E-Class, ML) 85
Honda 3-litre V6 (Accord Coupé, Odyssey, NSX) 66
Subaru 3-litre (Legacy Outback) 60
Volvo 2.8-litre (S80 T6) 57
See a slight disparity between the points on BMW's top two contenders and MB? :)
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Blimey Rip, is it possible for you to let a BMW ragging thread slip past? Ever? Maybe?
(http://www.boomspeed.com/swoop/logo_small.jpg)
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Funked asked me for the link! :)
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Ahh OK makes more sense now. Funny how the manufacturers and their fansites will spin this kind of thing.
http://world.honda.com/news/2002/c020515.html
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Wouldn't you rather have one of these rip?
(http://pandora.tzo.com:81/paj.jpg)
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For Daily commuting? NO! In exchange for our Ford Explorer? YES! :)
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Do you guys think I went to far on my after-market mods?
:D
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It's not the quality of the BMW paint who's inferior to American standards, it's the quality of American roads who are inferior to European standards.:p
BMW, to start to have fun you need to hit in the specially prepared ones like M3s or Alpines. The standard BMW is like a P47 with a T6 engine. It's good for chick hunting but the fun factor is limited.
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I'm not a BMW fan of any sorts (couldn't even affored one if I tried either) but saw an awesome looking BMW when coming out of a parking lot the other day. It was silver and looked like a modern Shelby Cobra to me. I'm not sure if it was convertible with the top down or that it just didn't have a top and is a "roadster." What was it? I'd like to see some photos of it, it looked hot!
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Originally posted by Steven
I'm not a BMW fan of any sorts (couldn't even affored one if I tried either) but saw an awesome looking BMW when coming out of a parking lot the other day. It was silver and looked like a modern Shelby Cobra to me. I'm not sure if it was convertible with the top down or that it just didn't have a top and is a "roadster." What was it? I'd like to see some photos of it, it looked hot!
BMW makes two roadsters... the Z3 and the Z8. Might have been the Z8 if it looked like this:
(http://www.bmw.com/bmwe/products/automobiles/z8/images/design_mov_03.jpg)
(In case it doesn't work Link = http://www.bmw.com/bmwe/products/automobiles/z8/images/design_mov_03.jpg)
AKDejaVu
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Vulcan that Mitsubishi takes 17-20 liters unleaded per 100km. Friend had one but with our gas price (over 1USD/liter) he thought changing it to Chevy Suburban 6,2 diesel 4wd would save some money in a long run... :D
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Rip I did some mods too. The stickers were a squeak!
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btw here's the most beautifull BMW I've ever seen: 507 cabriolet
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My noodle is of sufficient length, and width, that it allows me to drive an old pickup truck. Mrs. easymo drives a new Volvo. (Her noodle is nonexistent).
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I have an old pickup too (74 Chevy 1/4 ton). The mini is so that people don't think my noodle is abnormally large.
AKDejaVu
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Mrs. easymo drives a new Volvo. (Her noodle is nonexistent).
What are you trying to say about Volvos????
I have it on good authority that Ron Jeremy drives a Volvo. Errr maybe he said Vulva?????? :confused: :confused: :confused:
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You can thank the German Green Party for the pain chipping on BMWs, they pressured BMW to accept an environmentaly friendly formula. :p
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lol on the pic Ripsnort :)
Everytime I see one of those spaceships (hi rear wing, "ground effects" kits, coffee can exhaust, stickers, etc. :rolleyes: ) I remember when I thought that was cool in high school. Good thing I never got a car till my first year in college (a 79 VW Rabbit to boot!). Then I saw all the scrapes on driveways and speedbumps and everything became clear.
Frenchy: if you thought roads in mainland USA were bad, you should see the roads here in Hawaii.. We consider the roads on the mainland better :( One of my engineering school lecturer's said a lot when he sarcastically mentioned "CE's (civil engineers) don't give a sh$t."
Btw, having said BMW dealership so nearby makes it more difficult to hope that fiancee forgets about wanting a BMW later on :o
mauser
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Deja,
Yeah, that's the one I think. I saw it from the rear and from what I saw, hearkened back to the ol' Shelby Cobra more than the front view suggests. Nice. I want one.
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Originally posted by SFRT - Frenchy
BMW, to start to have fun you need to hit in the specially prepared ones like M3s or Alpines. The standard BMW is like a P47 with a T6 engine. It's good for chick hunting but the fun factor is limited.
I beg to differ, as one of the auto mags said about the BMW 330:
"Almost M3 power but not quite M3 price" ;) 0-60 in 5.9 sec and 155 mph top speed keeps me happy :D
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5.9? Never seen better than 6.1 for one of those in a magazine. BMW says 6.4.
And they are governed to 128 mph. 155 mph is fantasy if you live in the US. :)
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Yup, 75 litres gets me about 450-500km/s.
I don't drive 'economically' either. The previous owner modified it slightly too, its been lowered an inch or two+suspensions been hardened up a little, has 275 directionals, and some extra gauges for looks. I've added some nice toys, remote start/paging alarm, good quality laser/radar detector, full time laser jammer :D
Its got great onroad performance - it sticks to the road and with the center diff u can whack into 4WD on rainy days. Of road its a little harder than my previous wagon (an Isuzu).
Still trying to find some hispano's for it to take care of WRX dweebs (they're like La7 dweebs only mostly earthbound).
Originally posted by Staga
Vulcan that Mitsubishi takes 17-20 liters unleaded per 100km. Friend had one but with our gas price (over 1USD/liter) he thought changing it to Chevy Suburban 6,2 diesel 4wd would save some money in a long run... :D
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Rip :p
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with the center diff u can whack into 4WD on rainy days
Oh I bet you do LOTS of whacking Vulcan. :D
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Originally posted by funkedup
155 mph is fantasy if you live in the US. :)
Here is a pic of my e36m3 dash...before I installed the chip that got rid of the evil speed governor. But rest assured that I saw 155+ with the chip. :D
There are some lightly patroled places left in the US were INSANE speeds can be reached!
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Crow, Rip doesn't drive an M3. He drives a 330i sedan. It's governed to 128 mph. And I rather doubt a porky luxobarge with only 225 hp could reach 155 mph even if he disabled the governor. That's what I meant by fantasy. :)
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this beats those bmw thingies hands down and is very economical....plus has a large v10 which i find very appealing
(http://www.dodge.com/viper/exterior/img/main_exterior_2.jpg)
Cool specs of killer american muscle car (http://www.dodge.com/viper/specs/index.html)
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This from the guy that drives a kiddies car?
Think I might go ride me some Rex tail .... them kids get nervous with me a metre of their 6 ;)
Originally posted by funkedup
Oh I bet you do LOTS of whacking Vulcan. :D
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Ya'll need to think on the Enviroment......and ride a bike;)
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LOL Ride this. :D
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BMW= Bavarian Mist Wagen.......Muhahaha:D
Sry Rip;) but its got to be Italian.......and no not Ferrari:rolleyes:
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FIAT?
Fix It Again, Tony! :D
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FIAT = Fehler In Allen Teilen ("errors in all parts")
= Für Italiener Ausreichende Technick ("sufficient technology for italians")
BMW = Bring Mich Werkstatt ("take me to workshop")
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I thot BMW meant "be my woman".
:D
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The only BMW I ever drove was a 520i belonging to my father, about 20 years ago. It was quite unlike any other car I had driven - I liked it, but it was a heavy car for the available power.
I tend to think that BMWs are over priced! and personally, I go for upmarket VW - with the 2.8i V6. This VR6 model is the first I owned. I took this to Germany when I went to visit a Warbirds pal in Munich. He warned me to be aware of what I saw in the mirror on the autobahn between Frankfurt and Munich. No kidding! I ran this car up to 140mph (its official top speed), and I still had cars keeping up with me. Surprisingly, the cars being driven the fastest were not BMW, but Mercedes Benz. One that passed me must have been doing 150+. The VW had an oil temp. read out. At those speeds, it rose from its normal 98-102° all the way up to 112° celsius! So I tended to keep the speed down to 120mph. -Perfectly legal in Germany.
The only problem I had with this car was coil pack failure one evening on the way home from Luton Airport. Limped home on four cylinders, and VW Emergency Assistance came out at 8am the next day and fixed it - no charge.
I sold this car last year, and replaced it with another Golf - 2.8iV6 Four Motion.
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I shall soon be able to afford a car.
Well, in theory. First a motorcycle. And a skydiving rig. And I need a new computer. Not to mention my dry suit is leaking, and I need more and bigger tanks.
but soon, I shall have a 1980's Lada that'll kick the toejame outta Rip's BMW.
Just watch me screech up beside him, letting the sides of the cars kiss each other.
Then rip can complain about the inferior paint on his BMW.
My communist Lada otoh, isn't painted at all. That wasn't done due to shortages of paint (but the 5 year plan economy thing worked, I can tell you that).
Hijacking the thread a bit: what kinda bike should I get as my first? It's gonna be a cheap arse 1980's one, but I just want to know which brands/models last, and which to avoid.
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Sry Funk;) Everybody and their brother drives a Bimmer, everybody and their brother's Grandfather drives a Benz.
Me? I got one a these:
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.....but we saving for one of these:D
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Well before I had my Pajero I had a big green beast.
Its an Isuzu/Holden/Honda/Chevy/Austin Bighorn. Nice big rolly mofo :)
Wierd though... theres some trend with my all vehicles Pajero (banana in spanish or something), Bighorn, and Libero which sounds sexual :D
(http://pandora.tzo.com:81/bighorn.jpg)
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Cannot link ...
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you guys have any pictures of mens cars?
lazs
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Lazs... weren't you one of the guys in "men on film"?
Now shadup and give Animal a back rub.
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Do you guys think I went to far on my after-market mods?
:D
I think yer goin into a flat spin to the right when you light those cans, since ya put'em both on the same side
:D
Wonder what that bimmer will look like after spinnin into a telephone pole.....
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I've driven a few BMW's but nothing to make we want to trade.
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Nice ones Monk and Viperman. :)
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I'm surprised you Beemer lovers forgot about Dinan Performance. Now that 500hp Z8 will shake a tailfeather!
I agree with Funked about the 155mph
Also, the M3 is so overpriced.
Masher
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The latest M3 is probably not overpriced. Those things are faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaast.
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Originally posted by lazs2
you guys have any pictures of mens cars?
lazs
Oh that's rich, coming from the guy with the cute little British number.
Here's a pic of Lazs out "cruising":
(http://www.hotink.com/wacky/05.gif)
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deja.. i know I shouldn't ask but... what is "men on film"? I am not judging you... I simply am curious.
I gotta also ask.... judging by all the pics.... how do your wives expect you to find your cars in a parking lot? I bet they didn't think of that wnen they made yu buy those cars!
lazs
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LOL funked! That's actually the girl in the Tampax joke :D
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funked... No fair... that picture isn't representitive... I usually have the windshield folded down.
If it don't set off car alarms when it goes by then it needs more horsepower.
lazs
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Vulcan.. This my brute..heheh..who needs fast cars when we can drive over them in rush hour...plus the push bar..great for annoying people in front of ye.. That and who had to worry about curbs when we can drive over them! :D
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You ain't driving over anything in that jacked up minivan with street tires. :)
Get a real 4x4, thank you, drive through. :p
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Hrrmm..its no HumV but it pulls it own weight.. And no I don't have city tires..traded the stock 15's for 16's and put on a set of decent off road tires by Toyo.
I buy my SUVs to take off road..unlike the 1/2 million or Ford Explores that never some how roll over or belcome some soccer moms night of hell.
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Don't tell me you've actually driven your little toy offroad funky?
Originally posted by funkedup
You ain't driving over anything in that jacked up minivan with street tires. :)
Get a real 4x4, thank you, drive through. :p
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A mans car :D
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True 4X4
:D
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Biggest, heaviest and most powerfull car I've ever drove was a Volvo F-12 "Globetrotter"; about 450hp, more torque than 10 BMW 330Ci has, and can move 50.000kg rig @ 120kmh.
That was a very nice ride :)
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And another real drive
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And this is style
:D
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variations on the theme
no volkswagon is the same
:D
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Hmmm...330i. Yeah Rip, I think 155 might be tough.
Nice ride Vipermann! My best friend bought an R2 brand new. That thing was a blast. Just a few mods and they are MONSTERS.
However, I think both the e36 and e46 M3s are pretty good deals. When the e36 came out in '95, it was the same price as the RX7tt and stock for stock both cars had very similar performance numbers. And the M3 could carry a few more folks and baggage than the RX.
The new e46s are overpriced with the dealer mark-up...but when the newness wears off, its price will be pretty competitive for the performance. AND what else for the money can you get that has a real semi-auto F1 style tranny...not some manually shifted automatic like the Triptronic.
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Hmm. Interesting take on the Explorers. Did you know that the Explorers which had the blow out were 4x2's? It's the driver not the vehicle. have a 2002 Explorer R-IFS at that. Went to Silver Lake and people started laughing when I got there. Only one person besides my wife and I were laughing (my friend who happened to be there, knew that I'd shut em up). I have a bone stock Explorer (save panel K&N) and played follow the leader with some of those laughing (I was the leader). Sure I was at a disadvantage, but I used the 4 wheel IFS wheel travel to my advantage. The campfire afterwards was full of laughs from jokes.
I would NEVER own a Hummer, but a USED HUMMVEE sure, cheaper. Go down a two track and have body panels ready.
Masher
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Vulcan I have driven Rex on some gravel roads and I'm going to rallycross it next season. But I haven't done (and will not do) any type of serious "off-roading" with it. I use to work with a guy who did real 4x4 stuff, i.e. driving over rocks taller than a man. If I wanted to do that I would get a Jeep, not a WRX or a gussied-up grocery getter. :)
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Nuch glad to hear you take it offroad, WTG.
I don't know what is up with all those soccer moms.
All I know is that the last time we had a blizzard in Illinois, the number one vehicle I saw upside down on the median strip was SUVs. Dozens of 'em littered I-57 from Champaign to Chicago.
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Why do soccer moms want SUV's?
I'd say 90% of those who buy 'um buy 'um because they think they're cool, not for any particular need.
An SUV is great if you're a scuba diver or hangglder pilot. Or used as a sort of ambulance at a drop zone. Or for anyone who actually goes off road.
On normal streets, its a gas guzzling unstable car with a tendency to flip. Soccer moms should be thinking about their kids and get a Volvo instead, methinks - judging from the statistics, they don't seem to be able to handle the SUV's, and they put their own kids at risk driving them...
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oi! I'll have you know they use Pajero's on some serious rallies too :) ever seen a Pajero Evo? We go offroad in ours all the time, especially beaches (as you can see). I've taken the bighorn over some nasty rocks.
If I wanted a REAL 4WD I'd take a modified toyota landcruiser or nissan patrol, jeeps ARE those gussied-up grocery wagons.
Originally posted by funkedup
Vulcan I have driven Rex on some gravel roads and I'm going to rallycross it next season. But I haven't done (and will not do) any type of serious "off-roading" with it. I use to work with a guy who did real 4x4 stuff, i.e. driving over rocks taller than a man. If I wanted to do that I would get a Jeep, not a WRX or a gussied-up grocery getter. :)
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If someone flips an SUV on surface streets, speed is usually a culprit. If someone would actually take a corner, in an SUV, at high speeds, they shouldn't be on the road.
Why can't people accept the fact that there are stupid people driving PERIOD, and that others (like myself) have to suffer because of their ignorance?
Masher
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The explorer situation and rollovers was a result of bad tires from Firestone. A blowout would result highway speeds... not a flat... a blowout. The only way to avoid a rollover would be to make an instant recovery move (the right one). Very few people could do it.
As a rule, we don't go into the "driver's fault" arena on this one. Certain people on the board are extremely sensitive to this since they lost loved ones as a result of the defective tires.
The only other rollover issue with fords was with the old bronco II. And that didn't matter if it was 4x2 or 4x4. The thing had a narrow wheelbase and a high CoG.
AKDejaVu
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Originally posted by funkedup
5.9? Never seen better than 6.1 for one of those in a magazine. BMW says 6.4.
And they are governed to 128 mph. 155 mph is fantasy if you live in the US. :)
Funked: Dinan chip $200...takes the governer off :D Thats the first thing I had done because of the benefit of the software that takes off the "dumb-downed" clutch delay/throttle response.
Also, the 5.9 sec 0-60 is what most of the automotive mags test I've seen and our club members have confirmed this speed as well out at the track. BMW always posts conservative values for 0-60 times.
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Originally posted by funkedup
Crow, Rip doesn't drive an M3. He drives a 330i sedan. It's governed to 128 mph. And I rather doubt a porky luxobarge with only 225 hp could reach 155 mph even if he disabled the governor. That's what I meant by fantasy. :)
Not a sedan, a Coupe. And I can do 155 (see the above post) though I've never had it above 140 ;)
Oh, and I have a bra, they suck, I don't like the looks, but it does cut down on the rock chips...
(http://home.earthlink.net/~ripsnort/BMW/Colgan2.jpg)
(http://home.earthlink.net/~ripsnort/BMW/BMWporfile.jpg)
HAJO! Post a pic of your Z3!
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I understand the Firestone issue full well, I witnessed FIRSTHAND a blowout on a 1997 F-150 in 1996 outside of Toronto on a Mineralogy field trip. It wasn't even an issue back then. TIRES aside. When you yank the wheel of an SUV less than 30 mph, it is not going to flip or roll. Be honest, the recall aside, you don't just turn a curve at 20mph and roll the thing, bump that speed to happen, and you took the turn to fast.
The problem isn't with soccer mom's at all. It is people buying these things and have no idea what responsiblity they need to have (MORE THAN A CAR). You are in a framed vehicle, the chances of getting into an accident and killing someone is FAR GREATER than that of a car. But when they tailgate people "because I'm in the bigger vehicle" they should lose any privileges of driving these vehicles. Trust me, if I were President. You would have to take road tests to drive an SUV with Panic stops, evasive manuevers and other forms of training. It would piss people off, but doesn't everything else.
My point is that people treat SUV's like cars and speed through traffic. I watched an Excursion speed through traffic (weaving of course) and rear end a Geo Metro. I stopped and the person in the Geo was alright except for severe whiplash and a bruised wrist. The cops arrived on the scene and one was commenting (off the cuff) on how F'ed up the Geo was and chuckled. I asked what was so funny. He said "The damage to the Geo is ungodly" (he didn't know I had heard the initial conversation. I told him that I did and asked him "Would you be laughing if the driver of the Geo was a family member or a friend?" He nodded in the realization that he acted like an amazinhunk and went back to his cruiser with his tail in between his legs. Would it be funny to most people to see the rear end all the way up to the back of the front seat and the impact so severe that the engine came off of the mounts?! "But it is was a Metro." It doesn't matter there are people driving SUV's and Pickup trucks that have no business driving at all, it isn't a RIGHT, it is a priviledge.
I am sorry if anyone has lost someone to the Recall but my posts GO BEYOND THAT, prevention in the first place.
Masher
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Not a sedan, a Coupe. And I can do 155 (see the above post) though I've never had it above 140 ;)
Come on over here Rip, drive where you really can do 140 or more
:D :D
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Originally posted by Monk
Originally posted by Ripsnort
Not a sedan, a Coupe. And I can do 155 (see the above post) though I've never had it above 140 ;)
Come on over here Rip, drive where you really can do 140 or more
:D :D
Monk, 2005 my wife and I are planning either an M5 or M3 Euro-delivery. We will(granted I'm still employed!) :)
Incidently, if any of you guys need some detailing advice, you can find me at bimmerfest forums (http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/index.php), I'm the Detail forum moderator there.
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Oh, Deja , we've just finished adding a "Mini" forum too, and the Off topic forum gets as hot as this one as well, come join us! :)
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/index.php
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Rip you got a chip, no fair. :D
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I'm NOT going to do this mod:
(http://a324.g.akamai.net/f/324/3595/1d/www.rally-live.com/photos/2002/argentine/diapo_319.jpg)
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Hey, you still planning on getting that car Funked? WRX will beat the pants off just about anything in its weight class, very quick off the line, and great torque! I drove one in Missouri while on vacation (My Nieces husband owns one), though I could easily "lose" one on the twisties...I liked that torque!
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Rip I got it a couple of weeks ago. It's great.
I could easily "lose" one on the twisties
I doubt that very much. WRX are often 1-2 seconds ahead of 330i in our local autocross events. In fact, WRX's sometimes run as fast as E36 M3's. Those are stock cars though. I'm sure a lowered 330i with stickies could run away from a stock WRX and vice versa.
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Originally posted by funkedup
Rip I got it a couple of weeks ago. It's great.
I doubt that very much. WRX are often 1-2 seconds ahead of 330i in our local autocross events. In fact, WRX's sometimes run as fast as E36 M3's. Those are stock cars though. I'm sure a lowered 330i with stickies could run away from a stock WRX and vice versa.
No, what I meant is lose it as in I didn't feel the confidence cornering it as I do my 330. A WRX is gonna beat a 3 series in any auto-X with all that torque ;)
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Funked, did they re-vamp the suspensions on the 2002's? Evidently they must have according to this article at Edmunds (http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/roadtests/roadtest/46122/article.html)...the one I drove was a couple years old (2000?) and didn't handle like they (Edmunds) claims they do now.
Good bang for the buck!
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bah... station wagons and cookie cutter euro boxes you can't find in a fair sized parking lot.... Nobody talks about cars anymore.
lazs
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
No, what I meant is lose it as in I didn't feel the confidence cornering it as I do my 330. A WRX is gonna beat a 3 series in any auto-X with all that torque ;)
Oh I hear you. It's always weird in a new car. I actually thought the handling was weird in the WRX.
What I figured out is that it likes to be abused. You have to kind of grab it by the scruff of the neck and throw it around. Lots of trail braking to get a little oversteer going and then stomp on the throttle early. Then wait wait wait for the turbo lag and then WOOOSH the turbo spools up when the car is ready to exit the corner. If you do it right, the tail will come out in a nice 4 wheel drift.
I think my car is the same spec as the one Edmunds tested except for the wheels and tires. The one they drove had some 17" forged BBS wheels which come with Bridgestone "Pole Position" tires. Mine has cast 16" wheels with Bridgestone RE92's, which are all season mom & pop tires. So mine is probably not as macho as the one in the Edmunds article. It's definitely stiff though, enough that my sister was complaining about the ride.
My goal now is to shred the RE92's so I have an excuse to get some 18" OZ's with Michelin Pilot Sport rubber. :D
You gotta bring your BMW to the Con man! I've never driven one of those.
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What year model and color is you bimmer Rip?
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Originally posted by lazs2
bah... station wagons and cookie cutter euro boxes you can't find in a fair sized parking lot.... Nobody talks about cars anymore.
lazs
Oh please Ms. Pitstop...
Go work under your "bonnet" or whatever they call it on effeminate limey cars.
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BTW since I'm bashing everybody else's cars, I should give equal time.
The WRX is basically smurfy. Unless you look at it from the front, it looks like a rental car.
The interior is pretty spartan. The build quality is good but it's not luxurious at all. Other than the wheel, pedals, and shifter it's rental-like.
The shifter is a bit stiff, and you can grind it if you aren't good at matching revs. You don't have to double clutch it, but ease of use is substandard for a modern syncromesh gearbox.
And the engine sound is pretty lame. Not very sporty sounding at all. Needs an aftermarket muffler.
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Originally posted by hblair
What year model and color is you bimmer Rip?
Pic is about 10 posts up Hblair. 2001 330ci. I've managed to put 16,000 miles on it in 9 months time and about 5600 of that is the twisties right behind my house on this road (http://home.earthlink.net/~ripsnort/BMW/MtRainierBMW.jpg)
Its 10 miles of country road with no blind spots, and no ditches, a 3 mile straight away with 3 "roller coaster" hills that you can actually attain 0 G's in the cabin without losing traction, if you "lose" it, you end up in a pasture...so far I've been fortunate :) I *was* going to track the car in August, but this years con ate up that money, so theres always next year...
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What year is your Rex funky? The guy I share an office drives one, one of my customers/pals has a 2001 STi too :)
Rex's are a common as here - just about every 3rd card is a subaru.
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Vulcan it's a 2002. The STI is not for sale in the USA yet. :(
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Was gonna say Rip, that if it was white or red I believe they are still without clearcoat paint. I'm not sure about the black and I'm too lazy to drag out the chip book. :) When you wax it is you rag black?
It is hard to believe in this day and age some car manufacturers are still producing cars with single stage paint. Just a week ago, a guy came by with a '97 volvo wagon we did some repair work to a year ago. His complaint was "your paint job doesn't match". I went out, looked at the car. The fender and door we did repair work on was still bright as it was a year ago (sher-will base/clear)but the rest of the car was already going chalky. Typical single stage factory paint. Ran the car downstairs and got the detail guy to liven it up with the wheel just to show the fella that indeed the paint does match, but his factory paint required waxing every 6 months to stay alive. He didn't like that. :)
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I test drove a WRX at my SCCA region's autox site. It was a blast. Needs more tire though, but a set of Kumho Victoracers should make it feel pretty good. The only things that bothered me about it was the sound as the clutch engaged when shifting rapidly (a loud bang) and the fake carbon bits inside (carbon FAUXber). I think all the STi bits are available through the dealers too! Of course the DSM EVO VII is coming soon...that should be interesting.
Funkedup...do you autox? I traded my M3 on an S2000 last year...the M3 was just not competitive in B-stock anymore dammit. :(
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Crow ooooooooooh S2000! I lusted after that car for a long time. I finally tried one on and my legs are just too long. With my feet on the pedals and the seat all the way back, my knees were wedged against the steering wheel and I couldn't steer. So I never even drove it. But they are freaking nice cars. :)
Just about everybody on the WRX forums agrees with you about the WRX tires. I'm wearing the stockers out as soon as possible. :)
I've heard people talk about that bang when shifting. Apparently it's one of the driveline components (I forgot which, there are a lot of them) flexing its mounts and banging into the underbody. I have not heard it, maybe I'm not shifting hard enough. :)
Supposedly it can be cured by using the STI tranny mount kit upgrade.
The Carbon Fauxbre is an option thank God. Mine just has black plastic. :)
I have never run an autocross but my dad did for a long time. I have been doing some karting but I'm really too big for those things. So I joined SCCA and am going to run Solo 2 in the SF region. SF region is now also offering rallycross events which is basically Solo 2 on dirt, and I am going to try that too.
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Nice car you got there Funk:)
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......and if I save my pennies I can get this
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Thx Monk :)
Here's my favorite:
(http://www.lanciamontecarlo.net/Rallye037/photo/037a.jpg)
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Okay here's a MAN's car.
(http://home.earthlink.net/~jayboyer/Healy.jpg)
Hooligan
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Ooooh, that Monty is nice:) Nice car Hooligan
Here is my favorite Lancia
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(http://www.chadpfitzer.com/transportation/TRACTOR%201%20(4-19-2002).jpg)
First you ram the pedestrians. Then you run 'em over.
THIS is a great vehicle.
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LOL !
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Text translated: "How is it going / How is it humming over there"
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Originally posted by hblair
Was gonna say Rip, that if it was white or red I believe they are still without clearcoat paint. I'm not sure about the black and I'm too lazy to drag out the chip book. :) When you wax it is you rag black?
It is hard to believe in this day and age some car manufacturers are still producing cars with single stage paint. Just a week ago, a guy came by with a '97 volvo wagon we did some repair work to a year ago. His complaint was "your paint job doesn't match". I went out, looked at the car. The fender and door we did repair work on was still bright as it was a year ago (sher-will base/clear)but the rest of the car was already going chalky. Typical single stage factory paint. Ran the car downstairs and got the detail guy to liven it up with the wheel just to show the fella that indeed the paint does match, but his factory paint required waxing every 6 months to stay alive. He didn't like that. :)
Hblair, all BMW's since 1994 (I think thats the year) come with clear coats.
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LOL funked... "basicaly ugly"??? butt ugly is more accurate. Slow, ugly and stiff shifting with an engine that sounds like a fat mans flatulance after 50 cent burrito night.
One thing tho... I would be surprised if you couldn't find that thing in a parking lot. Maybe if you spend another 30 grand you can have someone pump it up to (sniker) 300 hp for you. Oh well, at least you won't have to learn how to weld or use hand tools.
cept for tacking on a chrome coffee can to the exhaust but you can just use hose clamps or have the dealer do it.
lazs
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Rip, bright red code 415 is single stage thru '02. Don't believe the BMW salesman propoganda. ;)
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Originally posted by hblair
Rip, bright red code 415 is single stage thru '02. Don't believe the BMW salesman propoganda. ;)
Hblair, I detail BMW's and I just did a "Bright red" 2001 325Ci last week end...believe me, it has a clear coat! ;) (No, no "color" on the applicator, and you can even see the "orange peel" of the clear coat. Also, all the touch up bottles, every color they currently export to the USA, comes with a little bottle of clear coat to place on top of the touch up. Not sure where your information comes from, but its inaccurate.
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Speak no more of these WRX's.... please.
My father just bought a 2002 330i a week or two ago - its a nice car. Admittedly, we're still breaking it in, so I havent taken it past about 4500 RPM yet, but I could sum up the car with "It fools you into thinking its fast until you try and actually go fast." The car has surprisingly significant tourque at very low RPM, the throttle response is quick (cant beat an NA engine for that) and the suspension breaths confidence into your driving. However... if it were actually to be put through its paces I think it would be a bit lacking. Far too heavy for the engine output. I will say, however, that for a simple "fun" factor, it fits the mold.
Im currently on the lookout for a 1995 E36 M3... cant seem to find what I want, but thats besides the point. Even the 3.0L M3 seems a bit lacking... the 3.2 (1996-1999) is better, and I havent driven an E46 M3... couldnt afford it even if I tried, so it doesnt really matter. :P Handling is great, brakes are "ok"... what the car REALLY needs is a supercharger. Bump that 240HP to about 320 or so and Id be happy. I just think the E36 M3 is a beautiful car and it would make a slightly more exciting than normal daily driver.
However...
"There is no substitute." :P
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Originally posted by Saurdaukar
Speak no more of these WRX's.... please.
My father just bought a 2002 330i a week or two ago - its a nice car. Admittedly, we're still breaking it in, so I havent taken it past about 4500 RPM yet, but I could sum up the car with "It fools you into thinking its fast until you try and actually go fast." The car has surprisingly significant tourque at very low RPM, the throttle response is quick (cant beat an NA engine for that) and the suspension breaths confidence into your driving. However... if it were actually to be put through its paces I think it would be a bit lacking. Far too heavy for the engine output. I will say, however, that for a simple "fun" factor, it fits the mold.
Im currently on the lookout for a 1995 E36 M3... cant seem to find what I want, but thats besides the point. Even the 3.0L M3 seems a bit lacking... the 3.2 (1996-1999) is better, and I havent driven an E46 M3... couldnt afford it even if I tried, so it doesnt really matter. :P Handling is great, brakes are "ok"... what the car REALLY needs is a supercharger. Bump that 240HP to about 320 or so and Id be happy. I just think the E36 M3 is a beautiful car and it would make a slightly more exciting than normal daily driver.
However...
"There is no substitute." :P
Agree 100%, the 330 has more body roll than you'd care for at the track, alot of guys go with aftermarket suspension upgrades. Personally, I just want to have fun at the track, nothing serious...
As for the older M3's, very good choice for a track car, but be cautious, the 1995's had alot of electrical problems, your best bet would be post-95', like a 1997 M3 4-door, the sedans have a better body regidity than the coupes. Its also very hard to find an M3 that has not been hammared on by some 20 something kid...
Hey, join our Bimmer forums, lots of info there:
http://www.bimmerfest.com
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I submit the following as evidence:
Qualifications:
I work in the autobody repair business. We repaired over 500 cars last year and do not advertise at all, not even in the phone book, and are 6 1/2 weeks behind right now. (we have a customer base)
Facts:
A. We have our own mixing system in our paint shop. Our painters do nothing but mix, tint, spray all day. Our head painter who is also part owner of the company has 25 years experience as a painter and is the type of guy who when he sees a car rolling in the shop usually knows what paint code it is without looking. I was back there yesterday and asked him if BMW still came with single stage. Off the top of his head he said "there's a white and red that is". We both looked in the chip book 30 minutes ago and sure enough there's a red code 415 that is single stage thru '02.
B. Just because you cleaned up a red that wasn't single stage doesn't mean they're all clearcoat, there's more than one red.
C. We repaired a '00 BMW a month or so ago that was single stage.
Said paint booth:
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Hblair, what I am telling you is ALL BMW 3-series have clear coats today. The only evidence I could give you is 27 years of detailing experience, I *know* a clear coat when I work on one. ;) Now, if you want an official letter from BMWNA stating so, go for it, I am not one that needs to be convinced ;)
All BMW paints are applied using the same process which involves a powder base coat and a powder clear coat that are then baked on. I have a friend that has been the to the factory and watched cars of all colors-- including red, black, o blue, topaz blue being painted in the same exact automatied process.
here is a link for the PPG clear coat process:
http://www.electrocoat.org/dp/news/news_search.cfm?Mag=COAT
And one of the state of the art Paint facilities, this one for the Mini, but was modeled after the Germany facility.
http://www.autointell.com/european_companies/BMW/mini/oxford-plant/bmw-oxford-plant-05-paint.htm
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Hblair, what I am telling you is ALL BMW 3-series have clear coats today.
Looks like some miscommunication maybe on my part. I was talking about BMW's in general, I didn't know we were talking only 3-series.
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Originally posted by hblair
Looks like some miscommunication maybe on my part. I was talking about BMW's in general, I didn't know we were talking only 3-series.
I was under the impression that all of em today (since 199X?)have use the same powder base for the clear coat. Now, a 1995 model, that I do not know, but today, I'm 99.9% sure they all have clear coats. Hold tight, getting info for you from their manufacturing site in Germany.
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monk.... what is a "monty"?
lazs
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here is a "Monty", sir
a Lancia Monte Carlo 037
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I've seen 037 in action when it was only 2-wheel drive which still could fight against Audi "Big" Quattros and Peugeot 205 T16s.
Pretty impressive sight seeing it fly from bump to bump with nice flames coming out from exhausts pipes :)
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RIP Henri Toivonen :(
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It is a fact that BMW still puts single stage on cars. Many manufacters still do with solid colors. Honda and Ford still do with white, and Toyota does with white and black. My PPG chip book is showing 3 different BMW colors as still being single stage. Sorry for the poor quality scan, but all I got is a B&W scanner here. I can scan it in color when I get home:
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Here:
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Terrible scan.
For year model 2002 BMW, the following are non-clearcoat colors:
Code 438 Japanrot
Code 415 Hellrot
Code 314 Bright red
All three colors are shades of red.
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"While the body shop focuses on human interaction, craftsmanship and flexibility, the paint shop is heavily automated and boasts an environmentally friendly paint process. As the first manufacturer in the United States to use water-based primers that are color-matched to the base-coat color, BMW has greatly reduced it's use of highly toxic solvents. Only the top clear coat, which is subjected to the harshest conditions during the life of a car, is solvent-based. Advanced paint procedures, such as electrostatic charging and high-temperature ovens, are used to ensure a smooth, even finish that is literally baked onto the body for high durability and a lasting luster."
http://germanautospecialists.com/Newsletter1.html
PPG’s powder clearcoat, Enviracryl, is being applied to a BMW. (Photo courtesy of BMW/PPG)
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Here, http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=106291#post106291
You guys can argue the point. :) I'm just going by experience, all the late model BMWs I've worked with had clear coats, include Bright Red.
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Rip.. that doesn't say the clearcoat is applied to all colors. Only that it is the only solvent containing coating to be used on BMWs.
I think its a bit futile to argue with a body-shop owner in regards to this. No matter how much in-your-spare-time auto-detailing you've done.
AKDejaVu
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Here, http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=106291#post106291
You guys can argue the point. :) I'm just going by experience, all the late model BMWs I've worked with had clear coats, include Bright Red.
LOL RIP! that's a bunch of BMW owners swearing that they know EVERYTHING about BMWs. Its more like a support group of sorts.
AKDejaVu
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Originally posted by AKDejaVu
LOL RIP! that's a bunch of BMW owners swearing that they know EVERYTHING about BMWs. Its more like a support group of sorts.
AKDejaVu
BMW NA reps(Employees of BMW) are users of that board.....awaiting there reply, also emailed BMWNA HQ. We'll settle this within 24 hours ;)
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bout time they got a support group... too many have suffered in silence.
lazs
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Originally posted by lazs2
bout time they got a support group... too many have suffered in silence.
lazs
Agreed! Just read the posts about people suffering while they wait 2.5 months for their new BMW to ship from Germany...its the worst kind of suffering one can have for a car thats won 9 straight "Car of the Year" awards in its classification. ;)
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Originally posted by funkedup
Thx Monk :)
Here's my favorite:
http://www.lanciamontecarlo.net/Rallye037/photo
Heh...I use to own the US baby brother to this thing...a '77 Lancia Scorpion. It was one of the best handling mid-engined cars I've driven. But it was soooooo sloooooow. Even with a transplanted 2.0L injected Fiat Spyder engine the thing was slow. But once you got going you never had to touch the brakes unless you wanted to induce a little oversteer.:D
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Originally posted by Saurdaukar
Im currently on the lookout for a 1995 E36 M3... cant seem to find what I want, but thats besides the point. Even the 3.0L M3 seems a bit lacking... the 3.2 (1996-1999) is better, and I havent driven an E46 M3... couldnt afford it even if I tried, so it doesnt really matter. :P Handling is great, brakes are "ok"... what the car REALLY needs is a supercharger. Bump that 240HP to about 320 or so and Id be happy. I just think the E36 M3 is a beautiful car and it would make a slightly more exciting than normal daily driver.
Too bad, I just sold my nicely SCCA B-stock prepped '95 e36m3 back in Dec. Personally, I'm partial to the 3.0L motor...it revs much more freely and doesn't run out of steam at the top end like the 3.2L. Plus the 3.0L cars are OBDI which are much easier to mod than OBDII cars. The 3.2s have a little more torque down low, which is great if your dirving around town, but if you are tracking or autoxing, the 3.0L is the way to go.
Also, I always thought the brakes were FANTASTIC. If I recall R&T got one to haul from 60-0 in 110ft! The thing has 12in rotors!
And rather than the supercharger, I'd get that new Schrick cam kit from Turner. It comes with the Conforti matching chip, intake, HFM, and injectors. 310hp naturally aspirated and no extra weight or drag on the engine. Plus the cam kit costs a lot less than the SC. if you want crazy hp add a 50 or 75 shot of nitrous to the cam kit set up and see 400hp.:eek:
All the e36m3's have some trouble areas to watch out for, but Rip is right that some of the early '95s had more problems than other M3's. But those were pretty much just the '95s that were actually built in '94. Those with Feb '95 build dates and after are no worse than the 96+ cars. Check the driver's door jam for the build date.
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Originally posted by funkedup
I finally tried one on and my legs are just too long.
I hear ya...I'm 6' and to get in & out I have to push the seat all the way back. That damn Lancia taught me to drive Eye-talian style. Frieaking Italians design cars for short legged men with long torsos! So I end up close to the wheel with my legs bracing on the sides of the cockpit.
But they are freaking nice cars. :)[/B]
Thanks :cool:
So I joined SCCA and am going to run Solo 2 in the SF region. SF region is now also offering rallycross events which is basically Solo 2 on dirt, and I am going to try that too. [/B]
Oooo...very competitive region. You'll have some former National Champs to gauge your progress against. Your WRX should be the car to have for Rallycross.
Here is me in my first event in the S2k...still on stock street Bridgerock SO2s but I still set FTD-stock edging out a Z06 on Hoosiers (not the car's fault just not well driven). And a WRX in our region.
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If anybodys interested in the results of the great clearcoat duel,
Go here:
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=106533#post106533
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Hblair, I detail BMW's and I just did a "Bright red" 2001 325Ci last week end...
LOL...Rip is actually Biff???
"Just puttin' the second coat on now Mr. McFly"
Cobra
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So BMW's in europe are real BMW's coz they are made in germany
:D :p ;)
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Originally posted by hblair
If anybodys interested in the results of the great clearcoat duel,
Go here:
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=106533#post106533
Results? I don't know where you get that. Seems they are just starting to get going on you.
Your pressence has only forced them to get together and conclude that all of your sources are wrong and they still know absolutely everything about BMWs and their paint. Somehow they've done this without posting any sources of their own... but self-affirmation goes a long way.
"My BMW has clearcoat" and "I detailed a BMW last week that had clearcoat" has magically been transformed to "all BMWs have clearcoat".
I guess detailers really do know more about paint than body guys.
AKDejaVu
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Originally posted by AKDejaVu
I guess detailers really do know more about paint than body guys.
AKDejaVu
I wouldn't say "more", but I would say equal,...if you use the wrong product (Polish, Paint cleaner, or polymer/carnauba wax)or use a random orbital polisher incorrectly on a finish that you do not recognize a clear coat on, you can ruin the finish. If you compete in a concours, its critical. Most guys into detailing (Like I've been for 27 years) do their own paint chip repair, in my case, I had an area that was "keyed" stem to stern on my door (I suspect the kids bicycle handle) and the results came out perfect. You can't even see the (to the primer) scratch anymore. If I had take that to a body shop, they most likely would have convinced me to paint the entire door.