Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: beet1e on September 08, 2002, 05:37:49 AM
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The sensation I derive from writing this post is akin to flying low and slow over an enemy CV, and finding myself surrounded by enemy bullets. But I am motivated to post this because I feel that the AH community's obsession with scores has reached such a pitch that it is taking over the game. I'm seeing guys running away from the job in hand because they need to RTB to land those kills. OK, I've occasionally done it myself, and I'm not proud of that.
It seems like every time I visit this board, there will be at least a couple of threads about how we should change the scoring system, or how we might adjust it to deter one type of flying or encourage another. Right now I see about five such posts on the first page alone.
So I have a suggestion. Why don't we hide the board until the end of the tour? You can still view your own details (but not ranks) and those of your squad. But you'd have to wait till the last day to view the full story as we can view it now. The scoring system can reward vulching and running away to friends, and that's a bad thing. I agree that we should RTB wherever possible, and not bail as a matter of routine.
The obsession with score is harming the game. It's time to act! Try it - even if only for one tour.
OK, flame away - don't make it toopersonal if you can help it. :)
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9 out of 10 AH players will state that score means nothing, they never check it, and it has no influence on how they play. When a discussion on the score system arises, however, most folks add to a thread as if they have great knowledge of how the system works, of their own stats and rankings, and what a huge influence the score system has on their (and everyone's) playing habits.
eskimo
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Getting rid of kills per time would be a step in the right direction.
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Beetle,
Like many others, I like to fly as the real pilots of WWII did. I do not take off, fly to target , fight till i'm out of fuel and ammo then crash like some here do. To me that perverts the whole sim experince. 99% of all pilots of WWII took off with the intent of comeing home to land.
As for Rtbing before the job is done. My thoughts on that are simple, if i'm out of ammo or out of bombs then I am combat ineffective and my JOB IS DONE and it's time to go home. If i'm B: Low on gas then again it's time to go home. Thats my criteria for rtbing.
Vati66
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Is RTB'ing a crime now? I would never RTB and leave a countryman in trouble but if I've done my bit and getting low on ammo or fuel and I've dropped whatever ord I'm carrying then it's time to RTB and I'm not going to stick around and fly till I die. You know yourself Beet1e the stat's I concern myself with No.9 are getting the ord on target and making it home in one piece. If we get kills then it's a nice bonus. If I fly fighters and get kills it's nice because I really do blow chunks in a fighter! but I don't really care either way as most of the time I figure I can help in a fighter just by virtue of being another target for the enemy to chase while a more proficient countryman sneaks up behind him :)
I really don't know how all these percentages and multipliers work, it's all stuff and nonsense to me so really don't care either way.
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Nothing wrong with RTB if low on ammo, although I sometimes stick around to intimidate the enemy and help a friend reach the target because the cons don't KNOW I'm out of ammo. ;)
I'm not suggesting that anyone should fly any differently than they do now. But I do think that by hiding the scores until the end, scorepotatodom would take a back seat, instead of being in the driving seat as it is now.
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although I sometimes stick around to intimidate the enemy and help a friend reach the target because the cons don't KNOW I'm out of ammo
LOL! did that for Dayo and PanZer last night, a particularly warpy F4U tangled with me last night, my gunnery is'nt that great as you know but I lit him up and he seemed to fly away without any damage until finally I hit his wing. I knew Dayo and PanZer were upping nearby so hung on his tail for a while. After about 5 mins he must have figured I was out of ammo and slipped out of my gunsight as I grabbed a few forkfuls of sweet n sour chicken and rice that had just been cooked for me. I managed to evade his inevitable HO attacks and got back on his six then Dayo and PanZer arrived on the scene and finished him off :)
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Not a good idea at all beet1e. Sorry but I just have to disagree. Now I sure don't consider myself a score potato, if I did I sure as hell wouldn't be flying a Jug 99% of the time. But I do enjoy looking at my score through the tour to see how I am doing. The ranking part of scoring don't mean squat to me but my K/D is important as well as my hit %.
As for RTB'ing I will RTB if low on fuel or ammo, but I will also dive in to help a countryman who is getting banged, many times against my better judgment, but I do it anyway. I can't count the times I have gotten myself low and slow in a Jug it save some spit driver whose SA got him in a world of chit. many times I clear him only to watch him fly away as I become the target of the enemies affection. But this is my decision to make and when I drop in to help a countryman I know it could be my demise.
To make AH the perfect game for me people would fly in an organized way, with a common goal and try to make it back to base alive each time they do. So bring on the mission arena!!! As for the main arena, it has always been a ganger paradise and will always continue to be so. I salute HTC for trying to give players a choice in arenas that will suit the type of game they are looking for.
Good thread Beet1e S!!!
Avid
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Ahh beet1e your mistaken :D
( pretty docile eh ?? )
With the exception of "fighter" sorties the scoring system actually rewards furthering the goals of the land grabbers.
Attack, bomber and vehicle scores all revolve around destroying enemy real estate or defending ones own.
I took a week off, and as a result absolutely suck at air to air. I can't kill something if my life depended on it.
Spent most of the day hitting enemy headquarters, cities and bases flying jabo with a few bomber runs thrown in. Milk running I guess you call it :D
Even though I rarely lived, trains are tough but pop with 1000 lb'ers BUT I FINALLY SAW ONE :D Even got killed by ack over headquarters at 10k :rolleyes:
You see, when I suck, I'll find away to die EVEN if there is no enemy fighters in the area. It's my cross to bear...........
Checking the scores in those catagories, even though I died the majority of times, the "score" wasn't half bad.
In conclusion, scores are a good thing.. :)
you..
you....
Hairy backed, knock kneed cast off of a post menopausal bar tart :D
( I owed you that one ;) )
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For some reason I thought the name of this thread was "Hit the headboard" for an instant and I thought, "Woo hoo!".
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LOL !!!
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Originally posted by Thrawn
For some reason I thought the name of this thread was "Hit the headboard" for an instant and I thought, "Woo hoo!".
:D :D
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AvidMC and Poopster: You didn't read my post properly! Let me reiterate, with the important bit highlighted.
So I have a suggestion. Why don't we hide the board until the end of the tour? You can still view your own details (but not ranks) and those of your squad.
So, AvidMC - does this alter your point of view to my suggestion?
Poopster - what does your post have to do with hiding the scoreboard? Fly exactly as before, but you'd have to wait till ToD rollover to see how your scores compared with other guys.
Anyway, it doesn't matter because there's not a vat in Hell's chance that HTC would go along with it. We're more likely to get a compass that's calibrated the right way round. :rolleyes: :D :p
But I wont give up! Got to find a way to stem the obsession with scores. I thought I'd seen anything until this morning, when I read about people changing sides to take control of a CV, and the one about people who have two accounts so they can shoot themselves down over and over again - to boost score. :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by SirLoin
Getting rid of kills per time would be a step in the right direction.
ahahaha No.
-- Todd/Leviathn
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I agree with dead man flying (above). If we got rid of k/t, Lazs would quit. :p
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Some like the stats, some like the score pages, some don't care about either.
Seems this thread is about excluding one or more of the above.
AKDejaVu
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We should just put on our bell-bottoms, and play frisbee.
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Every time I take off I do so with the intention of landing. There is simply something very satisfying to me about the squeel of tires on tarmac after a flight in which I had to fight to survive. The sound is even sweeter if my kite has been shot to hell and I still bring her back. If I am low on fuel, I'll leave. If I'm out of cannon ammo, I'll leave. If the odds are becoming suicidal, I'll leave. I see no benefit to giving the enemy a free kill.
As far as score goes, the only stat that I give any sort of damn about is Kill/Death.
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After reading the thread concerning how to "fix" the scores to stay high in the rankings, I decided to give it a go this tour.
And what do you know it works, spent 3 days hitting strats, fields etc from bombers and ships and then upped in fighters. Now I try and land every kill. A newbie like me can rise to 20 in overall rankings, surely the scoring system is porked anyhow.
It's pretty obvious that the majority of players take notice of their score to a great extent. I didn't but do now for this tour.
Beetle, you play to take real estate, some play to gain high scores. To hide the rankings until the end would just mean that those players that play to score would become even more cautious in their approach, if they can't see their rank they will assume that they need to "do more".
Besides, do you really want to see hordes of P47's on kamikaze attacks on fields, then upping immediately to do the same thing ?
wipass
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My dear friend, Wipass! (you're British, so change handle to wiparse)
Besides, do you really want to see hordes of P47's on kamikaze attacks on fields, then upping immediately to do the same thing ?
Wip, I don't claim to be an expert on the theory of cause and effect, but I don't follow you here. Why would hiding the scoreboard result in P47 kamikaze missions? And even if that were to be the case, would this be any worse than all the sideswitching and N1K/LA7 opportunist dweebery that we see day after day? Note that Cuckoo finished with the highest rank, but not without a substantial degree of N1K dweebery. (I realise that the qualifier of "dweebery" is superfluous when discussing N1K/LA7 activity) Much to his credit, Cuckoo did not switch sides during the ToD.
Dying to know what you did to get to position 20! I suddenly found myself at position 30 in attack planes last ToD. No idea what I did - would be fascinated to find out...
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why would you want to get rid of kills per hour? I think it is one of the better stats for checking out how a person flies. the most meaningless (but still slightly useful) stat is the hit percentage.
I never look at rank but I do track my stats. I also look at stats of people who make claims on this board. I often find that they are flying differently than they seem to be claiming. For instance... the guys who talk of routine sorties of 5-10 or more kills and 15 kill streaks who never get over a 2/1 k/d. Not saying that they don't get those things.... just that they are misrepresenting how they do normally.
lazs
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The only reason I check the score board is to see how far Ive fallen compared to the previous tour(s). Its an interesting thing to have and I would never advocate disabling ot removing it.
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Beetle,
How did I do it and how did I know what to hit. I didn't I just hit everything that was standing still, now at 15 overall :D
As to the hordes of P47's, this wasn't because of any cause and or effect regarding hiding the rankings, just that if you encourage people not to rtb with their scores etc, then this will be the outcome.
As for wipass, WB's was only 6 characters and I wanted to keep the same handle, can't in WWIIonline as they are offended by the mention of ass, so in there it is wipazz,
Anyway Alan my Dear Chap, are you having fun here or are you missing the peace and tranquility of agw ;)
Wayne
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Wayne - if I live to be 90, I'll never understand the AH scoring system. :confused: And if I live to be 100, I'll never understand why anyone would want to enslave themselves to it. :rolleyes:
Finished a WB tod at #8 once, and all I got was a T-shirt, and a big bill. :eek:
Alan.
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I stand corrected beet1e, I did not read the post correctly. I say damn the ranking stats!!!! Do it just as you have suggested. Why?? Because it don't effect me and I am sure that it will piss off the LA-7 dweebs. And anything that angers an LA-7 driver has to be a step in the right direction. :p
Avid
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Originally posted by beet1e
The sensation I derive from writing this post is akin to flying low and slow over an enemy CV, and finding myself surrounded by enemy bullets. But I am motivated to post this because I feel that the AH community's obsession with scores has reached such a pitch that it is taking over the game. I'm seeing guys running away from the job in hand because they need to RTB to land those kills. OK, I've occasionally done it myself, and I'm not proud of that.
It seems like every time I visit this board, there will be at least a couple of threads about how we should change the scoring system, or how we might adjust it to deter one type of flying or encourage another. Right now I see about five such posts on the first page alone.
So I have a suggestion. Why don't we hide the board until the end of the tour? You can still view your own details (but not ranks) and those of your squad. But you'd have to wait till the last day to view the full story as we can view it now. The scoring system can reward vulching and running away to friends, and that's a bad thing. I agree that we should RTB wherever possible, and not bail as a matter of routine.
The obsession with score is harming the game. It's time to act! Try it - even if only for one tour.
OK, flame away - don't make it toopersonal if you can help it. :)
Checked your score and you've flown 6 sorties with 4 LANDED!!!
If your against landing kills, then why did you land yours?
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Gawd, not someone else who doesn’t read everything that’s written... :rolleyes::rolleyes: :p
Rude, if I may quote myself, this is the bit you missed: I agree that we should RTB wherever possible, and not bail as a matter of routine.
I'm talking about the guys who run away in order to protect their score, when there's still a job to be done. I don't buy the fact that when a guy with 6 kills decides to RTB that he's necessarily out of fuel & ammo. Hehe, just for the hell of it I did it myself this afternoon. P47D30 - had bombed the VH, and killed two M16s with rockets, then got a couple of air to air kills, plus a couple of others along the way - six kills in all. Decided to RTB, still with 50% fuel in my main tank, and still with 60% ammo remaining. Why? Enemy GVs in town because no-one else had taken down the VH (too busy vulching). I figured there were enough vulchers, so went back for more bombs and rockets. I could have attempted strafing the remaining GVs, or joining in the vulchfest, but why should I set myself up as the sacrificial lamb? I don't believe I'm the only person capable of bombing the VH.
Have to say, it felt good landing those 6. :D
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I think the real question is just what does a score in the MA really mean? I thought the MA was where you are to have fun, least I do! Others feel the MA is a serious place. When you have many attitudes in the MA the scoring of anykind is meaningless. The only place where a score would be meaningful is a place where your life really meant something and there was a mission to be completed. And if you were in that type of position the last thing on your mind would be a score, it would be the early 1940's and "G" forces would make you sick in the stomach:)