Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Axis vs Allies => Topic started by: Karnak on September 15, 2002, 10:28:59 PM
-
Well, I flew in the CT for 3 hours tonight. This is what I saw:
2 to 1 odds against the Japanese.
50% of the Allied fighters were P-51s, most of which were flown intelligently enough to run at the slightest disadvantage.
The N1K2s we flew down from A16 were wholly inadequate to stem the tide.
I got shot in my chute for the first time ever in the CT. to that Allied flier.
The Allies were vulching, a nice MA tactic.
Yeah, this setup is a riot. Allies, make sure to whine all competive setups away in the future as well. They're so much better this way.
-
Fly in that new test arena Karnak....free unperked Spit 14's :)
J_A_B
-
IJN/A Whine now or forever hold your piece!!
CT is a joke. I hope whomever is in charge of this thing got paid enough for it from the allies. My goodness why do I waist my time on this BBS?....never mind dont answer that!
-
You know, it may be that it is not the CT staffs fault. People want PTO setups and the CT staff does their best to try to produce one. But the problem is, historically the Japanese were overmatched and if we want to keep the CT "historic" you just have to live with that. The Allied planesets simply have too much depth to them for any PTO post 1941 to work right. This then amplified by the fact that the Allies tend to out number the axis and the fact that you might find yourself facing a P51 with an F4F wingman. Tactics are little tough there.
to the CT staff. Hang in there guys, what you do is appreciated.
-
Very true, Mudd.
...
Curtiss, it is not any sort of problem concerning the CT staff.
Your accusation against the staff members, no matter how much it was from pure exaggeration, was uncalled for. I don't know what your past experience from Warbirds would tell you about "staffs", but to the extent of my knowledge, and as a member who regularly flies in CT as much as the MA, the CT staff are a fair bunch of people you wouldn't find in any other part of the AH community. They are not biased in any sort of way and they never will be.
This trouble we are going through is regularly met whenever we try a PTO setup at the CT. Current AH just does not have enough IJN/IJAAF planes to bring fair balance no matter how hard "compromises" are dealt, and often there are complaints of how much we should take into for "balance" while at the same time maintaining "historicity". Besides, the Japanese planes were in a large disadvantage in the historical context anyway. The disadvantages of Bf109G-6s against P-47D-11s are relatively marginal, when you compare it with the disadvantages a typical Japanese plane would meet against its US adversaries.
While it emphasizes on history, CT is also a part of the "game". Therefore, whenever PTO situations are dealt, there will be "compromises" which some would like, and others would hate. This time, it seems a bit unfair to the Axis fans. Other times, it could seem unfair to Allied fans.
That is all there is to it.
Even if we get more JP planes to use, the Axis pilots will have to face "jousters" on a regular basis. Some part of the problem just cannot be solved, or requires some very careful organization to be solved.
(I remember flying in CT with hazed in a four plane formation of A6M2s meeting superior numbers of Wildcats. It took some incredible organization and discipline to overcome the disadvantage in numbers, and the virtual USN pilots already knews they shouldn't turn fight Zeros, too. It was a hectic experience, but it was fun. We bragged in brash manner as we shot down all Wildcats we engaged with minimal losses. That's the kind of fun the CT can offer...)
-
HFMudd, Kweassa,
That's bunk.
The Allies freely get the P-51B, an aircraft that wasn't present in the Solomons at all, wasn't even in serice yet and there isn't a peep of an objection from the Allies.
The Allies are only too happy to have an advantage above and beyond what they should, but there'll be hell or high water if the Japanese get a bone tossed their way.
The ammount of historical revisionism on this subject is massive. People consistantly overlook the shortcommings of the Allies aircraft while pointing out the shortcommings of the Japanese at every opportunity. Its roadkill.
The Allies get all sorts of artificial advantages, yet nothing is said about that. If the Japanese get anything to try to play balance the game (yes, it is a game) the Allies throw a temper tantrum.
Now, I don't think the CT staff is trying to be biased, I think they're being heavily preasured by the whiny Allies who want their victories handed to them on a silver platter just like in their fantasies. Its getting really, really hard to fly for the Japanese with the blatant (though not intentional) bias towards the Allies.
In the early war we get super F4F-4s that practically out turn our A6M2s and eat most of an A6M2's ammo load and then in late war we get jacked for our late war fighters and have to fight free P-51s, P-47s, F4Us, ect, ect. Add to that that 1,000lb bombs are freely available to the Allied fighters, even though they were rarely carried in WWII.
-
The only Allied fighters you will see me in this week when I'm in the CT are P-40's and F6F's if there's no land bases around.
J_A_B
-
While I do share the opinion that the P-47's and P-51's should be restricted like the N1k is. To point out one side as being more whiney than the other is ridiculous. Just like arugments about the side X being better than side Y in the MA don't prove or accomplish anything. If the situations would have been reversed and all the axis players were flying allied the first night of the setup we'd be right back here in the exact same situation we are now just with different names next to the whines. Everyone does it regardless of what they fly.
and for some numbers to chew on for fun, with all due consideration of what stats can and cannot prove.
In CT tour 8 the A6M5B is
25:27 against the P47-D11
and 43:42 against the P-51B
I'd wager that the Allied offensive tonight in the CT benefitted more from superior numbers and more importantly favorable positioning of the naval assests than from the superiority of their planeset.
-
Even with the N1K2 the Japanese were at the disadvantage. Without it we're roadkill.
-
Well I have noticed that allies outnumber the Axis a lot in the CT. Then they just vulch the hell out of the place. A favorite tactic of the whiney allies is to demand a CV in every CT setup so they can just CV vulch a base and use it is a portable 8th air force of heavy bombers by upping 1000lb bombs every time on f4u and f6f.
A CT scenario I suggested there were no CV , a mix of P40E Hurri2C vs 109F and 109E. This was very well balanced at least the people I asked said so.
Perhaps a good CT setup for the PTo would have P40E vs Ki61. I dont know if they often met in combat but we know CT historical accuracy is often a joke. Maybe set it in China/SE asia and screw the CVs.
And Karnak I'm happy you have finally found out about the AH Allied whiner Gestapo. They are the same guys who rabidly attak and insult almost every LW request or concern. They are and have always been the biggest group of sorry whiners ever in AH.
-
"I dont know if they often met in combat"
A lot, although mostly it was slightly different models of P-40 and Tony. P-40 vs Tony would be a GREAT CT setup and would actually give the Japanese a slight speed advantage for once.
J_A_B
-
Oh Brother, here we go again! Wish it were perfect then every other time you went up you would die next time you would win 50/50 now that would be fun (would be for me, i stink anyway, I was 0 for 5 the other day, mostly to Busc and Mudd in their crummy IJN iron and me in my superior F4 and 51) of course if it were a perfect setup I might have won 1 or 2. Its never gonna be even and I think I see just as much whine from axis and allies that is 50/50 or should I say 100/100. Good job CT staff, keep up the good work!
-
I want to believe Kweassa's post, because the success of the CT depends on it, but I can't find evidence of its intent with what's happened in this setup. We've gone from one ahistorical extreme to another.
The removal of the N1K2 to rear bases has just tipped the play balance scales in the opposite direction. Add to that 2v1 odds faced by the Japanese and its a tough row to hoe for the IJ forces. It would be easier to take if it were historical, but its not.
Jarbo, if you are still open to adjustments, please consider implementing Squire's planeset as listed in his recent thread. (Basically he removes the P-51, P-47, and N1K2). I think it would be a much better matchup between forces than we have currently, and is more representative of the 1943 Solomons. I can live with a smaller planeset that is more evenly matched.
With the amount of whining this setup has caused, I'm afraid the CT won't be back to the PTO for quite a while. I hope you keep experimenting Jarbo, until you hit on something that is better balanced. We've still got months before v1.11 is out, and no release has had more than two Japanese planes in it anyway. So we've got to deal with what we have.
Maybe try perking the 1944 planes, and bringing the N1K2 back, or try Squire's setup:
Solomons 1943:
Allies: F4U-1 (land only), P-40E, F4F-4, SBD, TBM, BostonIII (Havoc). Maybe the B-26.
Japanese: Ki-61, A6M2, A6M5 (which DID see service in 1943, and is also an A6M3 stand in), D3A Val, and Ki-67.
-
I havent checked this out but dont the allies have only A1 to fly their p51's and p47's out of .
-
Remind me what is wrong with Warloc's (Squire's) 1943 Solomon's setup?
The P51, P47 and Hellcat don't belong in Slot 43.
-
would be for me, i stink anyway, I was 0 for 5 the other day, mostly to Busc and Mudd in their crummy IJN iron and me in my superior F4 and 51
Hmm. I sure see the text "HiJacker shot you down" a lot. ;)
Anyway, I didn't mean to imply that the IJN Iron was crummy. I don't feel it is. One on one vs. anything but the F4F, which eat me alive, I don't feel overmatched. I do feel a bit frustrated and with limited options yes, but not overmatched.
I honestly like the A6M5. Good visibility, decent cannon and jamming the stick into a corner usually will get you out of trouble. Every few flights I manage to compress and auger but what the heck, somebody gets a kill and goes home a little happier.
What I don't like is having to fight three different aircraft types at once. This is the ahistorical piece that we have never solved in the CT. 1:1.5 or 2:1 odds don't really bother me too much, but attempting to out ACM a F4F while at the same time dodging a BnZing P47 and attempting to E-Fight an F6F does. Leviathn or Drex will get all three, I on other hand simply strive to make them work for it before I get the free pass back to the tower.
-
Originally posted by oboe
I want to believe Kweassa's post, because the success of the CT depends on it, but I can't find evidence of its intent with what's happened in this setup. We've gone from one ahistorical extreme to another.
Yo, Oboe!
You're probably right about historical extremes. I think, though, that you and some others in this thread perhaps are losing sight of the Really Big Tension that's inherent in the CT, and that Jarbo was wrestling with when he stayed up until all hours arranging this setup for our amusement. And that is this: History v. Balance. Most historical setups are going to be unbalanced, just because that's how things worked out in real life. In the CT, this means that the sides will be unbalanced, because of all the people who don't want to fly for the Loser Side. Anyone who logs on to AH, and who is curious about the CT, will note the 2:1 imbalance and move on to the MA, and we will lose our total numbers, and Hitech will replace us with something like Mission Arena. Pretty sad.
OTOH, this IS supposed to be a more-or-less historic arena, and so we get upset when we see P51s in the Pac in 1943. Without the CT cadre, the CT will revert to its old self, that is to say, it will be empty at all times.
I imagine that Jarbo looked at the historic planes available for mid-1943, and thought something like "those dancing Zeros are going to cream those poor P40s and Wildcats. Better even things out with a plane addition for the allies." Once you get started, where does it end? Niki for the Japanese, and so on.
I'm very, very happy that we have our Jarbos who will spend their time fussing around with this sort of problem. I don't imagine that they will always get it right; that's the nature of experimentation. I'm willing to drink the mistakes, because, IMHO, our CT has it hands-down over the well-balanced-but-pure-fantasy MA.
- oldman (sits down, red-faced)
-
Oldman, and Jarbo! I could honestly start every post with how much I appreciate the work the CMs put in on the CT - it literally brought me back to AH from a sim-less existence.
I apologize if my post came across to strongly. Tweaking a PTO setup for balance/history has got to be one of the toughest acts there is right now. (IMO, it'll even be tough when the planeset is completely fleshed out). YOu are right on the money, there, Oldman! I do appreciate you guys making the attempt, observing and making changes as necessary.
Whatever Jarbo comes up with, 27th Sentai will be there Tues and Thurs nights. And I hope if the sides are imbalanced, people will switch and fly Japanese to even them out.
Personally I'm looking forward to some Ki61 vs P-40E fights. Hope I can find some!
!
-
I can understand being frustrated with the set ups being the " whiney vulching chute shooting Allied LW basher" that I am. But am i to understand that we should not have the P-51,P-47,F4U,F6F, and the FM-2? But keep the N1K, but make it available at all bases so as the unbalanceing P-40E does not run rampant?
I dont disagree with tweaking the set up some. Removing the P-51B is fine with me and even the P-47 (though id rather have it:D ). We do need more Japanese planes but thats a given. None of what im saying really matters because we wont come to an agreement on a plane set anyway.
I think the fact that this is breaking down in whiney roadkill name calling is sad. My .2 cents. Dont give a damn if you like it or not at this point.
and thanks to the CT staff for all your hard work.
-
My squad will be there tuesday night at 9:00 EDT for our regular CT night. If we see an imbalance for #s or types flown we will be flying IJAAF the whole time. You wont see us in P-51s.
In regards to the "conspiracy theorists" from both sides. You are just plain wrong about that, many players like to see balanced sets, most I would argue. I wont change any minds by saying that, but I think it is true.
Regards.
-
OK, now that I have had a day to chillll out I will change my wording about the CT Staff. They do work hard on makeing the CA and other arenas what they are. My complaint is that they seem to catter towords the allies a little more that the axis, however, I have only been in AH for a few weeks if that. Maybe I came on at a bad time who knows....
I just dont recall many if any accounts where P-47s, P-51s, F6Fs and F4Fs were attacking the same damn field!!! Is that Historical?
Screw the N1K2 thats not my focus.
Last night I flew the A6M2 just to see what would happen. I was surrounded by countless F4Fs, P-51s, F4Us, P-47s and one or two P-40s. Very seldom was I able to shoot at anything due to evasive manuevering trying to keep from getting shot down.
The allies continuosly came in in a steady line from where ever they were comming from. Even when I brought in a N1K2 there were too many P-51s and F6Fs that I couldnt get low enought to fight anything because eventualy I would get caught.
The allies know that the IJN/A caint run in a givin plane as the F4U, P-40, F4F, F6F, P-47 and even the P-39 if flown right.
If one caint catch you one caint kill you, we all know this. This game will never be historical, you caint make allied players forget they dont know how to NOT fight the early war Zero in the F4F, therefore even in early war, Allies still have the advantage.
And another thing, just as soon as the main arena guys find out just what a zeke fest there is in the CA, they remind me of migrating birds!!!! Extra Extra Extra, read all about it, The CA now serving Zekes for lunch!!!!!!!!
Many Allies dont care about RTBing a kill, they come in one life after the next just to drop bombs die and replane to be able to sink ships etc........
enough for now
Damn better proof read next time...eek spelling sucks!!
-
once again I agree with almost all of you, on one point or another. The fact that most ct maps cant be done exactly the way it was during the time period of that map will always upset the apple cart, the ct staff try to make it as interesting and fun as always possible, in their opinon. You cant make everyone happy all the time, and some you cant make happy any of the time, so what the hell makes the diff? VF27Hellcats fly every Tues and Thurs, alot of the time we really hate the setup, but what the hell, its always better than the ma, always! Some post their dislike for certain maps, I dont always agree with what some of my squad say or do, but we all have opinions, I have read some really nasty posts about milkrunning and gangbanging and bad setups and whining about one side or the other getting their way, one thing is for sure VF27 flys every tues and thurs no matter what, we want the ct to survive, we do not milk run, we very seldon ever try to capture a base, what we do is try to make a fite for everyone no matter what the setup or the planes, and if we happen to get good planes we fly them, if we get bad planes we fly those to, just like everyone else. We are all in the same boat, and a little suggestion to the ct staff is good, name calling and such has no place here, just fly what you have it will only last for a week, try to make the best of it. The ct has the most couteous and friendly pilots in the game, lets try to keep it that way. Great job Jarbo!
-
I think hijack hit some fundamentals here.
Now, I formally apologize for the 2 pages of silliness that I started over the last setup, I think I started something bad, and we should stop.
now for the fundamentals...
1. When things have gotten so tense that a person will blame the planeset on dieing when outnumbered means we need to settle.
2. Base capture really isnt part of the CT. It never has been. It is tough coming from the ma and finding something other than furballing to do if you dont think a little. Base capture is really pointless and dissappointing in the CT, to the point where I think the maps should have it disabled. Here is my idea.....
Disable base capture. If possible make strat targets more plentiful in new maps or redos.
Make hangar downtime 1 hour. Make fuel and ammo downtimes 1 hour. Make ack downtime 1/2 hour.
Make hangars a little stronger so guys straffing will have a harder time at it.
Here is what happens......
You pork a base and they will slowly lose plane support/ammo/fuel/radar/hangars, but after that nothing else changes. Somebody could bring a goon in (does it work that way in here?) if they need to.
What do you do to have fun? Furball, organize a torpedo run on an enemy destroyer group, do a jabo run on a fuel depot, do anything you want! Just set yourself a 'win' scenario and go at it. If you take off with the intent of putting torpedos into a destroyer, and you do it, and live, it is actually rather enjoyable.
Whatcha think?
-
Slash27,
Are you intentionally dense, or does it just come naturally?
The fact of the matter is that Jarbo's original setup, while not historical at all, was fairly balanced. Removing the non-historical N1K2 from play while allowing the non-historical aircraft in was balancing to remain created a completely unbalanced and completely unhistorical setup. The worst of both worlds.
Now, we need to decide what we want from the CTMs who so graciously donate their time to this. Do we want absolute historical accuracy, or do we admit that we are playing a game that needs reasonable balance for it to be entertaining?
If we want to go historical, lets go all the way. The F6F-5 wasn't in service until July, 1944. If the CT setup is set in June, 1944 then the F6F-5 does not get in. The A6M5b was in service in May, 1944. If the setup is April, 1944 or earlier, then the Japanese just have to make do with the A6M2. Absolutely no fudging and no stand in units at all. Make the rule ironclad so nobody can squeak about it.
If we want some balance so that there is a challenge for both sides then we are going to have to let the CTMs do their thing and not squeak at them the moment we have a tough fight that we lose. No more running to mommy to get the bully suspended. Allow the CTMs to have the leeway to play with the historical reality enough to make balanced setups.
-
100% right erg. "Base capture" doesn't belong in the CT. I think Wotan is proposing to do something like this. He has much larger non-airfield facilities to bomb in the terrain and he plans to make them tough. That means people will have to run organized and escorted bomber raids. I am all for that.
-
I think we need to forget the "historical" aspect of the CA and just try to fly plane sets of the same year in sequence to the best that CA and AH can give us with no subs just to show that we need more planes to use as the way they need to be used in the CA.
As I said before, start early war and work onward. CT Staff needs to look for what is being abused and help us nip it in the butt!! No steady steams of airplanes comming into a field untill its captured etc. Stop putting capturable bases so close together. Make field captures harder to get to and capture. One thing is for sure, (not trying to be historical but..this is not the MA) I dont think fields were so easy to cap and capture in WWII as they are in CT as one person just said in a tread here or on that other post....Field capture is what we are here for.Ok fine, so lets make it harder, for now its too easy. Lets make the CVs harder to sink. The flak is enough I think, just up the hardness.
Any other opinions?
-
missed Karnak and mista's post but thats what I say. Forget the base capture all together. Let the bases be captured by the CTM's on a daily dated routine per yearly advance as the fighters/bombers/vehicles are activated. Maybe the fields cities can be disabled for 15 min or so then gradually reopened untill the above said.
-
wow karnak what crawled up your pants and bit you on the inside of your ***. ;P
Somebody needs some time in the little padded room.
-
Holy CRAP! I think its time for a
<>
ahhh dosent that feel better now!
:D
-
Did you even read my post Karnak? Or were you just ready to continue your whining and get in a few more jabs at somebody?
BTW what the hell is your point? Did i say somewhere that i wanted an unbalanced set up?
Where did i say remove the N1K and leave something else?
Where did i run and tell on the "bully"?
Who's doing the most squeaking?
talk about dense.
Im all in favor of something more historicaly accurate, thats why i love the CT. But with people like you its getting a little less fun. And no i wont be going elswhere i rather us just work this out and get back to the fun instead of this roadkill. We all need to relax a bit (including me) before this becomes another MA.
-
Karnak,
I am Slash's wingman and longtime friend. I did not see where he stated o remove anything except allied planes and stated the need for more Jap planes and I know he supports historical events. I think you must have misunderstood the post and I think what he was saying was that if Axis has a nonhistorical plane so should the Allies. He even suggests removing the plane that he likes to fly. I have never seen him "run to Mommy" and is always appreciative of the Ct staff, even in the post in question.
Maybe your post, with exception to the first line, was not intended for Slash only. If that is the case disregard the above.
BUT, as for the first line, I don't know where you get off, I'm willing to bet that if you were standing in front of the man you would not throw out insults like that. I realize that for some people it is easy to talk tough on here because they can get away with it, but it is Cowardly comments like these that make the MA so irritating.
I believe that the main subject of the post from Slash was how we should stop all the whiney name calling which you obviously are in favor of.
-
I personaly feal that base capture is a vital game play componet, and generaly speaking attendance will suffer if it is not an aspect of game play, the base capture is what brings us to gether and provides an imputious for battle. Their are of course exceptions ans I sincerly hope Wotans set up succeds.
-
It would sure be nice if the conditions for base capture could be set. The obvious condition would be the number of troops needed in the map room to capture it. If we could tweak that and make it require a few more LVTs or C47s the flavor of base capture would change quite a bit.
I'm sure other true/false conditions could be added that make it different but it is getting too close to bedtime to figure them out.
But of course, I state the obvious...
BTW: Tonight in the CT was fantastic, Ki-61's and Zeros vs. F4U-1's and F6F's with the occasional FM2. Not a P51 or P47 in sight. I though the fights were evenly matched and quite engrossing and number stayed about even. The Zeke in those conditions almost make me want to trade in my leather undies. to all!
-
Dink72,
Only the first line was for Slash27.
Originally posted by Slash27
But am i to understand that we should not have the P-51,P-47,F4U,F6F, and the FM-2? But keep the N1K, but make it available at all bases so as the unbalanceing P-40E does not run rampant?
How is this supposed to be taken. It insinuates in the least subtle fashion that those of us complaining in this thread want the P-51, F4U, F6F and FM2 removed and the N1K2 added back in at the same time. What other meaning can this sarcastic phrase mean: "but make it available at all bases so as the unbalanceing P-40E does not run rampant?"
Slash27,
You blantantly and knowingly distorted our position and then you and your friend whine about you being called on it?
Don't make me laugh. You're the one who started throwing insults, don't play coy and innocent now.
-
HFMudd,
I was on for about an hour, to an hour an a half. I saw one P-47, and all the rest were P-51s and F4Us. I saw no F4Fs, F6Fs or TBMs. Not one.
-
Sorry, we're not the ones whining. You obviously can't read.
-
Dink72,
Maybe you're not aware of the massive ammount of whining that got the Japanese fliers to start posting. You know, the whining that removed the N1K2 while leaving the P-51 and P-47 it was balancing still in place.
I never, nor did any other Japanese flier, request the US hot rods to be removed while adding the N1K2 back into the mix. I would have argued against that as being just as silly as removing the N1K2 and leaving the P-51 / P-47.
Frankly, I think the setup could have done quite nicely without any of those three from the get go. But as they were there to balance eachother the N1K2 should not have been removed.
Snidely suggesting that the Japanese fliers wanted the setup massively biased in their favor is nothing but an insult, and that is exactly what your friend did. Maybe he meant to say something else, but if so he spoke very poorly.
-
I have read enough. Karnak, pull up your ego, and go run to mommy. enough is enough. This is no longer productive in any way shape or form. The whining in here has now surpassed my hurri one thread and is now entering a place that only shane would dare tread.
-
My first statement in that post was a sacastic and an unfair summary of what I had read. Alot of of which came off as insults and whines. I guess you once again have selectively read what you want, taken things out of context, and continued with your roadkill tirade.
There was nothing "coy" or "distorting" about what I said. You seem to be on top of that aspect. I never once said I supported an unbalanced set up for EITHER side but I have already stated that. I also have not SERIOUSLY implied that the Axis wanted an unfair advantage. I simply responded to what I felt were unfair generanlizatons about the Allies. In turn if what I replied with came off in the same manner towards the Axis flyers, my apologies, that was not my intentions.
Karnak , you have called me on nothing. I was not being subtle, snidley,coy, or playing innocent. Like I have already stated, the first part was sarcasm. I stated my point and said what I meant. I cannot help you dont get it. Maybe I just dont get my point across with my "poorly" written replies.
If some Allied pilots have whined about the N1K I cannot help that. I have not read those posts but judging by your responses from you, I can only guess that maybe you missed they're point like you have missed mine. I have already stated my support and given suggestions about evening out the planset and it looks like Jarbo has handled already.
So get what you want out of this Karnak, maybe the third times the charm. If not, then the hell with you.
-
Originally posted by HFMudd
to the CT staff. Hang in there guys, what you do is appreciated.
...What he said...WTG CT. Don't sweat the small stuff (but I still want the Ki-84!) :rolleyes:
-
Originally posted by oboe
Solomons 1943:
Allies: F4U-1 (land only), P-40E, F4F-4, SBD, TBM, BostonIII (Havoc). Maybe the B-26.
Japanese: Ki-61, A6M2, A6M5 (which DID see service in 1943, and is also an A6M3 stand in), D3A Val, and Ki-67.
Sounds good.
-
Slash27,
The why the heck did you get irritated when I called you intentionally dense? You just stated outright you were being intentionally dense, meaning you were intentionally and massively exagerating and mocking our perspective on it.
If I just said it like it was and had read you perfectly, why the squeaking about how fair and nice you are. You insulted us, I responded. That's all there was to it.
(I don't recall ever commenting on what type of setup you'd have prefered. After your opening comment I ceased reading your post as it was garbage, and thus had no idea what kind of setup you'd have prefered.)
-
Okay this is no means meant to stir the pot, theres been enough of that, and I was responsable for much of it.
The 1943 setup everyone is agreed upon is great, and Bug this isn't a stab at you I know your stance is the F6F is a 1944 bird.
I respect your opinion, and the fact that being in an Allied Naval squadron your willing to give up the Hellcat.
I know the F6F5 certainly belongs to the class of 44, and thats what we have in AH. However F6F3s from the USS Princeton CVL-23 DID attack Rabual in November 1943, along with F6F's from thje USS Saratoga.
The following is just my opinion nothing more......................... ..........
But there should be at least ONE CV with the F6F, even though ours is the F6F5. Theres a 10mph speed advantage over the F6F3, and some pilot armor improvements, and possibly bomb carrying capacity. Other than that not much difference. If I don't have to dodge Hellcats, believe me it won't hurt my feelings, however it's one of the planes that were there, so why not include it.
Thats it I'm off this thread and this discussion, whatever happens..... happens. No matter what I fly or what I fight against,
I'll end up a flying bonfire sooner or later. So wasting anymore of my time pissing and moaning is pointless. Time to go out and ethier Fly, Fight, and Win, or Fly, Fight, and Die, like a good little Samurai.
-
Originally posted by Löwe
...Time to go out and either Fly, Fight, and Win, or Fly, Fight, and Die...
Behold the essence of the Samurai. You have learned your lessons well, Lowe-san.
-
Lowe, Well spoken.
Karnak,
You just stated you did not read the post as a whole, so who here was "INTENTIONALLY DENSE". I believe that you said it all with that one. I have had enough of this crap.
-
Ok lowe, you sounded great there and oboe patted ya on the back so I will follow your footsteps............oboe?..*turns back towards oboe for a pat*... ;-)
-
Okay Hawk but after you turn your back, be sure to bend over. If he starts patting you with both hands RUN!:D
-
:eek: LOL I'm outta here!
-
:( LOL!!
-
Jeeze if there is this much fear of the slowmo n1k2 imagine the "Perk it!" hysteria when the ki84 arrives .