Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Kweassa on September 29, 2002, 04:30:14 AM
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I met this strangest situation, one quite like I've never seen before, in H2H today. Now, before I describe what it was, let me tell you that I am usually one of the first person who brings up the possibilities of the mistakes done by the pilot when somebody posts a "cheat" problem. And while I am not a great pilot, I have experienced AH for quite some time, and I am pretty much sure I know how to tell the difference between a "mistake" and a "something strange".
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Well, here it goes.
It was one of those typical rooms where the ammo is set to something like x10, the fuel burn is 0. Of course, nobody can really expect ACM in these sort of conditions, where usually the guy behind you will hold the trigger for the entire length of time he is behind your arse. Then, in the distance, I see a typical icon shining "TEMP". Ah, one of those ever growing Tempy tards infesting H2H arenas.
After the first engagement where I shot him down, and the second where I was shot down after a hairy rolling scissors, I think to myself "hmm.. this guy ain't too shabby." Ofcourse, the amount of bullets he fired would be enough to fill ammo for four Tempests, but he wasn't too bad.
But not good enough so as to use well disciplined ACM. In fact, after the second fight, I decide to use the aggressiveness, where he turns the Tempy into you after the first merge, as if he were in a Spitfire, against him. "Force a couple overshots? It shan't be too hard" I think to myself. The way he flies with his throttle open, a few rolls should be enough to lead him into a black-out and an overshoot.
To my surprise, he doesn't fall for it. As if he's seen where I was rolling all the while during the high-speed high-G turn, he's just sticking behind my butt! Oh wow, how does he do that.. I wonder. I check my speed, I am flying over 390mph. The way I am going, the black out turns my vision to whacko. During this high G turn I reverse the roll in a manner effective enough for some people in the MA to accuse me as a "stick stirrer". All the while, seeing how he turned into me at such high speed, there is no way he can see where I reversed, I think to myself.
Wrong, he's back here again!
In panic, I initiate a dive and regain speed upto 400mph. Go into another turn, I see the distance is not widening. He's a Tempy, he turns better, thus, maintains E better in turns. He is lmost definately faster than me, and he still turns into me. As I go into a blackout, *thup thup thup*.
Wow, he shot me during black-out. How incredibly lucky.
Then, for the next three engagements, things go exactly the same. He doesn't really use E tactics, he doesn't extend away, all he does is max throttle and turn into you. There are many many planes that turn better than the 109, but frankly, even Spitfires cannot shoot you down in such high speeds. I've met a few good Spit pilots, they'd almost certainly chase you in a lag pursuit or a high yoyo.
But this Tempest, my god. He comes in, he just turns into me, and then, while he's fast enough to catch up on me and at black-out, he shoots he scores.
Now, I know black-put tactics aren't as easy as they seem. I know you going into black out doesn't necessarily mean he's into black-out too. However, as I said, I've been flying for some time. I know which situations the guy behind me can aim, and which he cannot. And most definately I've been repeatedly shot down in situations where I considered "no way!".
My remark of disbelief, brings a short verbal clash. I ask him how the heck he lead shoots at someone turning at 380mph four times in a row. No answer.
By golly, this doesn't make sense. I forgot to turn on the recorder, so as I challenge him again, notify that this is very strange and I will record the event, and ask for his cooperation.
Well, whaddaya know. He's gone.
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Then I remember something. It does not happen very often, but sometimes, after you get shot down or crash during a black out, AH would get this strange bug where you don't have any black out, or have a strange black out where it isn't tunnel vision, but overall "greying out" sort of black out. I am sure I'm not the only one who has experienced this type of "black out" bug.
So I am curious, and wonder how the black out phase is coded into AH. Would it be technically possible that the "black out" phenomenon can be removed? If there's some sort of bug which initiates such things, then can there not be some artificial way to reproduce it?
I must admit it is not good form to think of a possible cheat after you've been shotdown. But as I have said before, this is the strangest of things I've ever experienced than AH. Remember when people sometimes exclaim that the N1K2 does weird things?? Well, believe me, this experience was stranger, and way more discomforting than that.
I know of some harmless third-party programs that is designed to work with AH. Such as, a custom "film analyzer" which takes the recorded film data and recreates it in its own way. The people who made those programs knows how data in AH is handled.
Then, would it not be possible there'd be others who would know how AH works?
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Anyway, this is more of a "twilight zone" sort of story than a real "cheat accusation". But I wish this might give the people enjoying AH heightened sense of warning.
Strange things happen everyday within AH.
How much of them are you sure that its your fault?
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Certain GFX-card/driver combination allow a kind of "black-out-cheat" --> only small black dot on screen - rest totally visible...
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The situation you described might have nothing to do with that.
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It's also entirely possible that he just held you in lag pursuit, letting you pull away, then catching you on the reversal.
If a plane pulls max G's, you don't need to waste E working too hard to follow it if he's just going to reverse.
Also, If you're 500yards in front of someone, and pull X g's, the person behind you can lead the turn, and catch you in a snapshot, without having to pull that hard. A lot of people confuse this with being out-turned.
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Mmm.. possible explanation.
Though I am quite sure that was not the case.
Anyhow, what does the "small black dot" phenomena mean?
I think that's the first time I've heard about it.. :confused:
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I don't think I've ever blacked out in AH except when wounded. Tunnel vision yes, but no black outs .
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As noted above, there is a bug in AH where under certain circumstances the "tunnel vision" effect doesn't occur, allowing you to pull up to the point of total blackout with no loss of vision. I had this happen to me twice offline on my old computer when I was playing around with different gunsights.
I don't know how to reproduce it (and it has never happened on my new computer so it may indeed be video-card-related as Kirin suggested), but if somebody DID figure out how to reproduce it this could give them quite an advantage in the MA. I have little doubt that a few people do indeed do this.
J_A_B
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Is there a full blackout/unconscious in AH? I've seen the blackout many times, but never a blackout that stays (unconscious?) when you release the stick...until the other night. I was in a 51B and had Gurge saddled up nicely on my six o'clock and was pulling my nose all over the place and getting that typical blackout and then I noticed the blackout wouldn't go away even when I reversed and even when I let go of the stick. I guess I could've been pilot wounded while yanking and banking during the blackout, I won't know and so am wondering, is there an unconscious model in AH?
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Pull too hard for too long and you will black out completely for a short time, even when you let go of the stick.
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Is there a full blackout/unconscious in AH?
Yes. Easiest plane to recreate it in is a 262 unsuprisingly. Just get reasonably high and very fast and hold as many G as possible for a while. You'll stay blacked out for 2-5 seconds after easing off.
Gatso
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kewassa ... i had the "no blackout" thing happen in the MA 1 time. Well at least sort of...
i got killed in my D9 1 time and immediatly re-upped. the next fight i got into was totally wierd. the "tunnel" vision we are all used to (when u pull close to but not fully a blackout) was reversed. IE the solid balck started in the middle and slowly got smaller the closer to full blackout was achived.
meaning .. as long as i was in a full or almost full blackout turn i could see the whole screen.
this proved to be quite annoying for a Dora pilot considering how many high G turns we do (i KNOW u know kewassa:D). many times we are in a bit of a turn and the edge of the screen is just a bit blacked out. imagine this view in reverse. so i just relogged and problem gone.
never have recreated this and has never happened again. but that was my experiance with this.
<>
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If you do an "ALT-TAB" a few times you can wind up getting an "invisible cockpit" along with no black-out effects.
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If you press "Alt-Tab" a few times.. you can get an "invisible cockpit".. as well as sometimes take away the black-out effect.
It has alot to do with your graphics drivers though.
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Yep I was just going to say that too. When i had my out of the box drivers in my gf3 titanium it would do this all the time. Just alt tab then your plane would be an outline, the ground would get multipcolor, and you would not black out. Its so annoying I cant believe anybody would use it as a cheat.
If you can do this though, I assume a smart hacker could wack out his own 'cheat' driver with only certain aspects missing.
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on my buddies box he was using a ge 256 card. If you alt/tab'd to desktop then came back the cockpit was gone. Happened everytime.. I'm sure many players exploit this. Alas this card is outdated so he doesn't use it in his current machine.
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Originally posted by SunKing
on my buddies box he was using a ge 256 card. If you alt/tab'd to desktop then came back the cockpit was gone. Happened everytime.. I'm sure many players exploit this. Alas this card is outdated so he doesn't use it in his current machine.
I had this happen on my old vid card in 1.09(1.10 fixed it I think)
It caused aircraft textures to screw up randomly(Sometimes transparent, sometimes weird colors) While sometimes it would cause the cockpit to be transparent, intstruments and gunsight were invisible, and icons were impossiblle to distinguish beyond thier color. I have a screenshot of a neon green 109 from that. :D On my system, it never had any effect on blackouts.
While with some patience you could see through large portions of your cockpit, the fact that you could see though other peoples planes, had no gunsight, and no icons makes it useless as a cheat.
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I would wager that by means of a 3rd party program or patched .exe the client routine responsible for displaying the G-effects could be disabled.
Anythings that happens client-side can be hacked.
-Amboss
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Mebbe they're just using the ASUS transparency drivers for GForce. You can switch them to wireframe mode, and blackout *fill* won't get displayed..........
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I did a search on yahoo >
http://google.yahoo.com/bin/query?p=ASUS+transparency+drivers&hc=0&hs=0&ac=
Can they still do this ? Looks like the posts are older .