Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: JustJim on October 16, 2002, 02:56:40 PM
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Also Posted In Bug Reports
Seems I Have No Luck With Panzers.
Was Trying To Take Out A VH Fired All 60 He Rounds Into It,
Dead On Hits Flashes And Everything Never Damaged It.
Another Thing That Is Getting Real Bad Is Panzer To Panzer Combat,
I Can Hit An Enemy 15 Times With AP Rounds Sometimes I'm Lucky To Make Him Smoke.
Others I Just Wait For Him To Hit Me Once And I AM Destroyed.
Also Went Through This In A Flak Pnzr, Plane Came Down Took Him Out 2 Rounds,
Pnzr Comes By I'm Lined Up Perfectly 20 Rounds Flashes Right On The Turret No Damage I Get One Hit On Me SEE YA, Tower Time.
I Have Gone Through The Whole V-Sync Senerio Its All Fine
Was Getting Rubber Bullets On Planes Awhile Back That Seems To Not Happen As Often.
But This GV Thing Is Crazy, Course You Would Think I Would Film This,
Nooooo Last Thing On My Mind In A Battle Is To Hit Alt+R,
Maybe Not Being A Score Monger Or Film Freak Has Something To Do With This.
Any Thoughts Or Suggestions (Besides Dont Operate GV's) Would Be Appreciated.
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Don't you know the best tank in the war was the osti?!?!?!?! Use it for realistic base captures and hanger flatteneing. To kill panzers just up in a m-3 and hose them with the 50 cal. It's the second best anti tank gun in the game after the osty.:rolleyes: :D
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Perhaps pondering the perienial panzer problem, could be sumed up by saying, panzer porkage problems presist presently primarly do to a lack of presestant panzer porkage problem posting.
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Maverick, you make joke , yes?
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:eek:
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Ah... no. The Flakpansie is simply the best vehicle for killing any other vehicle inside of 2,000 yards. It is also the best vehicle for killing buildings, and the only vehicle worth a toejam for killing planes. All of this adds up to it getting used about 3 times as often as the next GV, which is the Porkedzer IV.
The M3 and M16 are more than capable of killing the Porkedzer IV inside of 1,000 yards, it is easier to kill them if you are behind them, but you can disable the turret and tracks no problem from any angle inside of 1,000 yards.
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da bwady dush wone ting ta say
di cant find my tounge
AKA: Nice Tounge Twister LOL!
:eek:
ok took me 5 mins to look for a tounge twisted smiley and someone is gonna post it below
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reason why you went down with one hit is because he was using HE rounds not AP (he rounds are armour peircing i think...ap arnt)
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:)
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Honestly, I've found the only way to reliably knock out panzers, or osties, with a panzer AP round is to hit them high, in the turret. Once you hit them in the turret it seems to be better than a 50/50 that they will have the turret knocked out, at most angles and distances. If you hit them in the core of the body, it just bounces off. If you hit them low in the turret, nothing, if you hit them in the face of the hull, nothing, but a hit right up near the top of the turret seems to work 80% of the time.
Just an observation, but I've knocked 10+ AP rounds off a Ostie at point blank, right into the hull, with no effect and the first round that hits high on the turret knocks out his gun. Then I can take my time with him and finish him off with shots to other parts of the hull.
-Soda
The Assassins.
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Originally posted by vorticon
reason why you went down with one hit is because he was using HE rounds not AP (he rounds are armour peircing i think...ap arnt)
Just the opposite, vort. HE stands for "High Explosive" and AP for "Armor Peircing."
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Just the opposite, vort. HE stands for "High Explosive" and AP for "Armor Peircing."
Nah, this is AH where: HE = Highly Effective and AP = Ain't Penetrating.
"So I pasted his Osty arse at 1500 yards with three 75mm 'Ain't Pentrating.' Well, as you might imagine this got his attention and he swung around and pumped a dozen 37mm 'Highly Effective' rounds into my front armour and sent me back to the tower."
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I Fully Understang Your Points And I Agree.
Problem I Am Having Is No Damage Shots From My End.
How Do You Explain Pulling Up To A VH Hitting It With 80 HE Rounds Producing No Damage.
Then After Running Out Of Ammo, Going Back To The Same VH I Origionaly Spawned From Watching Someone From The Tower Spawn Hit The VH I Am In 2 Times And It Explodes, Not Being Softened Prior??
I'm Thinking This Could Possibly Be A Router Issue.
I Understand People Were Using Routers To Cheat Sometime Back,(wish i was here for that lol) And HT Did Something To Stop It, I Dont Know Just A Thought.
One Occasion My Squad XO And I Were Sitting Side By Side Pegging A Panzer At Least 12 Times Each Not Causeing Even Smoke, Then He Proceeds To Take Us Out 1 At A Time With 3 Or Less Hits.
Happened Again The Other Night On Pizza Map, Myself And Some Of The JB's Along With 4 Others Were Trying To Run The Outer Ring To Get To Our HQ. Again The Same Thing Some Would Get Destroyed After Many Hits (Which Was Cool Finally) Others Seemed Indestructable.
This is Basically The Issue I'm Trying To Address, Something Is Not Right Here.
I Do Understand The Hit Placements And Its Affected Damage, Soft Spots, Ect. Ect. But It's Just Frustrating To Watch 30 Perfect Turret Hits Cause No Damage At All, Or Getting Killed After Connecting 12 Times On The Enemy Followed By Death With 1 To 2 Hits On My Tank.
Same Goes With The VH Situation.
Guess I'm Going To Have To Remember To Hit ALT+R At The Start Of Every GV Mission I Partake In, Because I Do Need To Document This On Film I Just Never Remember To Do This.
How LOng Can You Film For Anyway? Is Their A Time Limit ?
OK Thanks Again For All The Info You Guys Posted I Will Check This Daily For Any New Info.
JustJim
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it is about weight of fire, the osty kills hangers better and faster because the HE equivelency of it's rounds add up to a weight sufficent enough to kill it faster than the slow firing Panzer, also VH's at Airbases take more to kill than VH's at V bases. Interesting enough it takes about the same number of 30mm MK 108 rounds to kill a Hanger as it does 37mm osty flak rounds.
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Would be nice to get a Sherman next.
;)
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Brady..ive prolly posted a dozen stupid-GV-things in last year or so...never see HT respond..never see stuff changed...HT usually says it hasnt heard of problem
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Their have been several post's in this section and in the general forum about GV issues, and frankely debates on this subject have been raging since I came to AH over 2 years ago. HTC is certainly aware that a portion of the comunity has a problem with how HTC hadels GV modeling.
Also Big Brother is always watching, the entire staff reads the BBS including HiTech himself. In the past they have adreased issues with GV's, the following come to mind:
The M3 uber armor issue was fixed.
A general revamp of the armor model was done I beleave quiet some time ago.
M8 Bugs were adreased.
Rof on the osty was lessened.
A hull MG position was added for the Panzer hull.
HTC does respond to posts about issues, typicaly they do not repond to issues they have covered over and over again.
The single coolest thing about AH(other than the game) is the fact that they do listen, AH is a living thing it grows and changes " The Caracter Develops". with so many people with divergent agendas and wants they can not possably satify us all. ultimately I do not expect to be fully satified, nor am I shure I would want to be, but they have done things in the past that I have hoped and campainged for, I suspect this will hapen in the future again.
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I still can't believe the Osti can kill a Panzer with only 3 shots.
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Well, the GV damage model is porked, more or less, and often it has very little to do with net connection.
Grabbed a M8 the other day to intercept an inbound Ostie. A friendly Panzer disabled the osties Turret and engine, The ostie punctured all tyres on one side. I totally emptied all my ammo into the osti at a range down to approx 200 yds, from all angles and everywhere into the tank, - the hull, the sides, the turret, the tracks, you name it. Result, no damage. I hit with roughly 90% of the shots, only a few were over the turret. Here is a picture of my second last shot:
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I'm surprised he didn't kill you with the hull gun.
I don't know enough about the weapons to know for sure that the Ostwinds 37mm really couldn't kill a Panver IV. All I know is that if an Ostwind gets within 1,500 yards or so of your Panzer at any angle, you are in trouble.
The 37mm on the M8 is quite useless. If you load the HE rounds, you can sometimes kill an M16 or an M3, although they'll likely kill you first with the .50 caliber MG. It goes without saying that although the 37mm HE rounds the Ostwind fires are quite effective against M3s, M16s, Panzers, and other Ostwinds, the 37mm HE round the M8 fires are entirely useless against Ostwinds and Panzers. Doesn't matter how close you are, doesn't matter what the angle is. You can't kill a Ostwind or Panzer with a 37mm HE round if you are in the M8.
On the other hand, should you decide to load the 37mm AP rounds, you may be able to kill a Panzer or Ostwind. If you are behind them at least. Oh, and inside of 600 yards. I've had some lucky disabling turrets out to 1,000 yards or so, if you hit the side or the rear of the turret. The 37mm AP round can't kill a M16 or M3 though, I've hit M3s 8-10 times with it for no damage at all.
I've always been curious as to what kind of ammo the Ostwind has. It would seem likely that it would be HE, given the fact that it IS an anti-air weapon. It also kills M16s and M3s quite handily, which would point to it being HE. It is easily the best weapon for killing any sort of building with, and since the AP rounds the Panzer and M8 have are entirely useless against buildings, this would seem to point to it being a HE round. On the other hand, an Ostwind can kill a Panzer or another Ostwind in 2-3 shots if they are close, from any angle. This would seem to indicate an AP shot, and a very high velocity one at that.
I've never heard HTC comment on it, so I've no idea what kind of round our beloved Flakpansie is shooting.
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I noticed from the photo that you were shooting at the front of the Osti. I'm thinking that, if the Osti uses the same lower-body shell as the Panzer, then you were shooting at the tank's strongest armored side.
Then again, I put two M8 AP rounds into the backside of a Panzer last night and didn't do any damage to it. The tank pummelled me before I could get off a third shot.
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The Ostwind is just a necessary evil in some ways, yet the scourge of the arena. Without it all we have for air-defense is an M16 (which is at best a 1 for 1 trade against aircraft). Without it, we have Panzers firing half their ammo into a hanger, taking many minutes to knock it down. The problem is, there is a game balance issue that needs to be addressed with the purpose/effectiveness of these units. What should be the preferred GV for taking out buildings? A offensive historical unit like a Panzer, or a defensive one, like the Ostwind. it's pretty obvious which is the choice right now. The Panzer can't defend itself from air attack, can't fire quickly, the ammo is ineffective against structures... blah blah blah.
It's a balancing issue. Whenever anyone asks "what is the best anti-air GV unit"... obvious answer, Ostwind, one hit one kill, at ranges out to D2.5 or more. When someone asks "what is the best anti-structure unit"... obvious, Ostwind, it fires fast and hits hard with a huge ammo load. When someone asks "what is the best anti-GV unit", well at least this one can be argued, but for those with aiming issues at shorter ranges, the Ostwind all the way. Just walk the rounds onto your target and let them do their work. Fast GV's can't escape your firing rate while the slower Panzer doesn't have the armour to protect it from the 10 rounds you will land between his reloads.
the shame really is, I doubt the Tiger will be of any use in the current model. It'll have the tracks strafed off just like a Panzer, and then it's simply a matter of time before it's blown up. I'm sure HTC has thought of this though and plans to do something... at least I hope so. If not, it's a whole lot of modelling effort to make something that looks awesome, but is simply a big hanger queen.
-Soda
The Assassins.
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Couple nights ago in CT I killed an Osti with an M-8. Lobbed them into him HE rounds, Don't know how many hit him as he was at distance but he and I fired quite a bit.
Sakai