Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: mosgood on October 18, 2002, 12:59:41 PM
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I'm thinking about getting a hand gun for Home defense and target shooting.
Anyone now resources that can help me figure out what kind of gun to get?
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Get yourself a shotgun for the house. You can hunt with it as well.
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charter arms .44 bulldog is all you need for home defense.
1 shot will drop and pcp/crackhead.
A shot gun you'll just end up fediddlein your house all up. Where are you going keep a shot gun? in the closet? how you gonna to it?
A hand gun definately, and 1 that drops the attacker quickly.
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If you are just starting out on a handgun look into a 9MM it will take you less time to learn cause the recoil is not so bad.
http://www.sigarms.com/
These guys make the finest stock handguns in the world in my opinion.
I have owned a P220 for 8 years and put well over 4000 rounds through it. The only time it ever gave me trouble was when the magazine springs went bad.( after 3 years holding 7 rounds all the time) I called sig and had new springs on the way no problem.
The gun has never failed to fire.
I wish the Colt Mag springs lasted even 1/5 as long.
(http://www.sigarms.com/apps/cmt/img/P220_large.gif)
Ultimately, get what you are comfortable with.
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I have an British Enfield that will drop an elk. I'm looking for something a little more well...err.... little .
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.22 calibre handgun for home defense. Anything bigger is liable to go through walls and into your neighbor's space. Small enough with little recoil - anyone can shoot it with a fair amount of accuracy.
Or, pistol-grip shotgun. No aiming necessary when creeping around dark hallways. You see, you spray. Downside is that it can cause a lot of collateral damage to furniture and decorations.
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what are the issues to consider when comparing the Sig form a Glock from a Colt... etc?
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If you don't have a lot of experience with firearms, get a revolver, not a semi-auto pistol. Revolvers are easier to master. If wall penetration is not a consideration, a .44 special is a good choice; large caliber, low velocity, low recoil . Ammo is a little difficult to find, but not inordinately so. Taurus makes a high-quality .44 special, as does Charter Arms and Rossi. Stick with 3 to 4 inch barrel, Pachmayr grips, and practice, practice, practice.
Regards, Shuckins
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Glock and Sig are both great. Just personal preference.
I of course would choose Sig cause mine has been great. All the Glock owners I know love theirs.
Colt sucks, if you are going to get a 1911 of some form go with Springfield armor or some other company.
Colts are not as good now and you pay for the colt name.
Does colt even sell to civilians anymore? They said at one time they where going to stop.
Mostly make sure the gun feels goon in your hands, and you can reach the controls and that it points well.
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I do not like revolvers they are big and clunky, and the trigger pull on most sucks.
But again, if you feel comfortable with one over an auto, by all means go for it.
One other point, if you do have to use it and the local DA, has a burr up his butt or you get sued by the guy you shot's family. Anything with in the .44 caliber could be played up as a big man killer to make the jury not like you.
Shuck, do not flame me! hehe I know its a fine handgun, just no my taste.
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I'd recomend a .357 (ruger is my fav here) with a 4" barrel for home defense and target range stuff. You can load .38 bullets in it if recoil is something you'd like to avoid or magnum if armor is something you'd like to penetrate.
Its a good well balanced weapon... if you're looking for a handgun.
Of course, a shotgun with an 18 1/2" barrel is your best bet... though I would not use it at the range or for hunting.
AKDejaVu
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Originally posted by mosgood
I'm thinking about getting a hand gun for Home defense and target shooting.
Anyone now resources that can help me figure out what kind of gun to get?
Mosgood,
Go to a good gun range that has rentals so you can try out the different handguns. Also, try to hook up with friends and co-workers to go target shooting with (make sure you have ear and eye protection), so you can try all the different handguns.
Ask yourself some questions:
1) Are you going to practice shooting the gun? If you can't 'handle' your gun in pressure situations, during all lighting conditions (get one with tritium night sights), hate to have your own gun used against you. If you can't hit what you're aiming at, don't buy a gun.
2) I hope you realize that if you ever fire your gun in a 'self-defense' setting:
2a) If you miss and your bullet travels into/through your neighbors house and hits your neighbor, kiss your house and car goodbye to legal bills. Attorney's fees are expensive. Depending on when election time is, you might get an overzealous DA charging you with attempted manslaughter or worse.
2b) You actually hit the suspect, kiss your house and car goodbye to legal bills. You can bet that his family will sue you.
2c) If you unfortunetly do end up shooting someone (better be because you feared for your life and the suspect better have bullet entry holes facing you and there are no 'coup de gras' last shot to finish him off), You need to say only two things to the police (they are not your friend in that situation no matter how they appear). "I feared for my life." and "I would like an attorney please." DO NOT answer any other questions! You will not be in a normal frame of mind.
3) Will the gun be stored properly? Better be sure no kids EVER have access to your firearm as they seem to be the one's shooting themselves out of ignorance (happens once in a great while). More people get hit by lightning than a kid accidently shooting himself or his friend.
4) Do you really need a gun? Do you fear for your life on a constant basis? THAT is the million dollar question. Are you into recreational/serious target shooting? If you do decide to get a gun, make sure you store it in a gun safe that happens to be bolted to the frame of your house/apartment. You'll have ready access IF you've practiced to open your safe. Takes only 5 seconds to spin the dials to open your safe.
5) If you live where there could be others around when you have to shoot (apartment complex or nearby houses), get a .22 or make sure you have Glaser Safety Slugs (fine shot) for the caliber of your choice. You don't need collateral casualties.
Remember that a solid hit with a .22 is much more effective than a loud miss with a .44. ;)
6) You better spend more time and effort on choosing the right gun for yourself. You're going to have to live or die by your choice.
It better be bought legally and registered (follow your local, State, and Federal laws).
Regards,
SaburoS
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if you are new to handguns I gotta second the .22 for a couple reason.
1. while it doesn't have much knockdown power. it has little or no recoil, so it's very easy to get several rounds on-target in a very short period of time. it will drop an intruder at 'in house' ranges.
2. very little mussle flash. it won't blind you for a couple seconds in a dark house.
3. ammo is dirt cheap- the same $15 that will buy you a box of 50 rds for a .44 will get you about 500-700 rds of .22lr. I mention this not because it's worth the difference to pay $.35 per clip for .22 as apposed to about $3 per clip for most larger guns. the main benifit is you can take $10-$20 worth of ammo for a .22 out into the woods and when you run out you will be damn near expert with that gun. by the time you've fired the same amount through a larger gun you've spent well over $150 in ammo, so most wont do as much practicing with their gun.
if you've never owned a handgun before go with a double action revolver, preferably double only(internal hammer). the key here is simplicity double only revolvers require a full pull on the trigger to cock and fire the gun. they require a fairly strong pull, so they don't make very good target pistols (the extra effort throws your aim off slightly, but not enough to matter in home deffence). the main benifit to these is they don't have or require a safety. just pick it up, point, and pull. safetys, jacking the slide, or cocking the gun really confuse people in a stressful situation unless the are VERY comfortable with their guns.
if you are more experienced with shooting, loading, safteys ect. then a nice automatic is good. for in the house I prefer a 9mm. factory loads have alot of mussle flash, but no more than most, other than the .22 (personally I take care of this by handloading my own ammo, Blue-dot powder is great for the 9mm, low recoil, high volocity and the mussle flash is blue not orange so it doesn't blind you)
IMO .44 and .357 are overkill in the house. too much chance of hitting your nehbores or your kids through walls. (besides I'm not particularly fond of either load anyway, .41 mag is a better all-around load than either of them)
if you are ready for something bigger than the .22 but not comfortable with the auto's. I'd recomend a hammerless double-action revolver in .38 spl. I'd probably go with a S&W, or a Colt.
whatever you decide as far as style go with a brand name (S&W, Ruger, Colt, Sig) I've heard good things about Glocks but they just feel weird in my hand (if you've never known anything else I guess they'd be fine)
you'll know the names you've heard before. guns rarely depritiate in value (they loose some value the first time they're fired, after that if you take good care of them, keep them cleaned and oiled, good quality hand guns only apriciate in value) I've owned many over the years and I've never sold one for less than I payed for it.
what ever you get practice with it, a lot. you should be able to load, cock and get it ready to fire by feel alone. you should be able to tell the positions of safetys and wether or not it's loaded or cocked in the dark.
while someone is breaking into your house is no time to educate yourself on your gun.
btw, if you got kids in the house take them with you when you go practice (after you are confident in the gun) let them fire it and answer all questions they have. you don't want that gun to be some big mystery your kid explores on his own the first time your back is turned.
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Everything Subaru says is true.
But consider this, it is better for you and your family to be alive and facing litigation then dead, if you ever need to use the gun.
But everything he says is true, it is not just a purchase, it needs to be taken very seriously, and you need to be very careful.
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Thanks for taking the time to write those up guys.
I appreciate all this advise and will be considering it all.
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capt. apathy is very right about the kids. heheh
This thread has been good, good advice all around! lol
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If you want your house to be safe, a dog is better then a gun, it will keep you home safe 24/7 as long as it is there.
Do not get me wrong. I love guns and buying one is not a bad thing.
When I was taking classes in school in prep for becoming a reserve cop (one reason I bought the sig) The books had statistics for home robberies, lol like 99% of robberies are non dog houses.
Unless the crook wants something specific he will just hit someone else instead of dealing with the dog.
Get a lab of some kind, great kid dogs and big enough to be scary.
Your kids will fall in love with it too.
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Originally posted by mosgood
I'm thinking about getting a hand gun for Home defense and target shooting.
Anyone now resources that can help me figure out what kind of gun to get?
Statistics show that you or a member of your family are more likely to be shot with your own handgun than it is likely you will shoot an intruder. If you are really intrested in home protection then get a dog and a baseball bat. Of course statistics show that you or a member of your family are more likely to be bit by your own dog or clubbed by your own bat too.
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Statistics show that the dog will most likely attack a family member or a neighbor than being shot by your own gun. Also, statistics also show that once your kids a teenager in a liberal family, he's more likely to beat you with that baseball bat while you sleep.
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That are not put out by some anti-gun organization, until then they are about as useful as any colt fire arm! :D Not very.
I am surprised no one jumped to colts defense lol.
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Here is a real life shoot out story for ya. A friend of mine works at a cop shop in a small town here in Texas. He told me the following.
Bad guy excapes from the Huntsville pen. Cops are out looking for him. A state trooper sees a suspicious car sitting in a road side park. He approaches, and when he reaches the drivers door. The guy inside starts firing a .38 special at him. Keep in mind that the cop is standing right next to the window. The cop pulls out his 9mm and returns fire. The bad guy empties his wheel gun. The cop empties his 9mm. Total damage. The bad guy got a bad scratch on his arm, as a result of some flying glass.
The moral of this story is. If you have the time, and money, to practice enough, to establish adequate muscle memory so that you are confident you will hit what you are aiming at. Even if you are ducking, and not aiming, per se, at all. Get a hand gun. Otherwise. I would suggest a 12 gauge Mossburg pump. Use 3 inch magnum loads, with #4 shot. Double ought clumps to much.
Oh, and BTW. Always. Always. Always. ID your target. AND your background. Getting shot will hurt a hell of a lot less then killing one of your children
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Get a dawg and a shot gun :D
Those Mossbergs are pretty good and reasonably priced. Those top 2 look pretty good. I don't recommend the pistol grip versions. A stock gives you a lot better stability in your aim.
http://www.mossberg.com/pcatalog/Specpurp.htm
A standard pump hunting type shotgun will go a long way in home defense use. Use Number 6 birdshot. It will do fine at the combat ranges where most home invasion activity takes place. In addition, it is less likely to go through walls or into another house.
I have a variety of weaponry but my preferred home defense gun is my Remington Pump Shotgun which I use for turkeys and dove. I use a modified choke setting. Backup to that, I carry on ocassion and the spouse uses it as well when I'm gone or when needed, a Kimber Compact Stainless II with the .38 Super.
Others are kept locked up.
Another thing about a shotgun is the pumping of a shell into the chamber makes a very distinctive sound which can certainly scare an intruder.
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Originally posted by easymo
Here is a real life shoot out story for ya. A friend of mine works at a cop shop in a small town here in Texas. He told me the following.
Bad guy excapes from the Huntsville pen. Cops are out looking for him. A state trooper sees a suspicious car sitting in a road side park. He approaches, and when he reaches the drivers door. The guy inside starts firing a .38 special at him. Keep in mind that the cop is standing right next to the window. The cop pulls out his 9mm and returns fire. The bad guy empties his wheel gun. The cop empties his 9mm. Total damage. The bad guy got a bad scratch on his arm, as a result of some flying glass.
The moral of this story is. If you have the time, and money, to practice enough, to establish adequate muscle memory so that you are confident you will hit what you are aiming at. Even if you are ducking, and not aiming, per se, at all. Get a hand gun. Otherwise. I would suggest a 12 gauge Mossburg pump. Use 3 inch magnum loads, with #4 shot. Double ought clumps to much.
Gotta agree with Easy. Hitting stuff with handguns in a combat situation is not as easy as shown on TV.
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you can develope some really nasty loads for shotguns. I had some I loaded for the wife while I was out of town. I used 7 1/2 shot cast into a slug using jewlers wax. we tested them up in the woods. what awsome loads at just about any range. they hold energy like a slug but on impact they completely come apart giving maximum 'moment of force' power. another plus was if you miss and hit a wall they break up fairly fast and don't penitrate to far.
the only really bad thing about developing loads specificly suited for deffence is if you have to use them it's likely some prosecuter will try to establish you where 'looking to kill someone' or 'setting up a trap'. complete crap, but thats the way the legal system works, prepare for a 'worst case scenereo' and they'll say you where looking forward to it.
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a .44 special is lo velocity were not talkin 44 magnum.
In home defense situation most likely the attacker is within 6 feet of you. You need to drop him.
Stick with a revolver, they are reliable cheap and easy to maintain. You need a calibre that will drop a guy. More then likely a dopped up guy.
my choice for home defense would be a charter arms .44 bulldog
I own several handguns most stay locked in the safe but my 44 is where I need it.
You dont 600-800 dollars for home defense. You also may want to look into you homeowners insurrance or renters insurrance. Even if you kill a badguy you wanna be protected against lawsuits.
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Just a word on penetration. IMHO if you have a loved one, on the other side of that wall. You do not want to fire ANYTHING in that direction.
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Well, if ya really wanna defend yer home in style go with a .50 cal Desert Eagle. I thought a .357 magnum was loud 'til I fired one of these. Guaranteed to wake the neighbors.
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You need to be the Incredible Hulk to handle one of those effectively.
Christ, I'd need a bipod just to hit a guy in the doorway to my bedroom.
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You jack a shotgun round into the chamber and you will scare the crap out of most intruders. Shotgun for inside. Get one with 18" barrel(or cut it yourself) and a folding stock. Take out the hunting chokes.
HC
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ok... if you have very little experiance with handguns and/or are not planing to train extensively with one.... don't get an automatic. You don't need to figure out if the gun has one chambered or if the safety is on or if there is a magizine in place.... in the heat of a conflict. Also... you will not be able to use a variety of exotic ammo like alternate hydrashock and hollowpoint.
I am partial to 44 mags but I reload. I can make any ammo i want including multiple projectile rounds that don't overpenetrate.. You probly wouldn't want to get hit by three tumbling 44 cal rounds at once. penetration is acceptable
But... I digress... get a good .357 revolver by Smith or taurus or ruger in stainless steel... 6 or 8 shot your choice.. with what you have left over from not buying the latest gee wizz full digital automatic... by a smith K22 masterpiece revolver in .22... take both guns out a lot and practice. practice double action with the K22.
For the .357.... use either hydra shock loads or 125 grain hollow point slugs better.... load both alternately (the beauty of revolvers).. Overpenetration should not be a factor with either of these loads. Use .38 full wadcutters to practice double action in the .357. 357 is still king of the hill in every study done on actual stopping power when the data is taken from actual fights.
Colt.... I have a 1930's vintage 1911 that I use 7, 8 and 10 round magazines in. It eats every brand and vintage of ball ammo that I put through it and is the very example of dependebility... I keep one in the chamber with the hammer down and have never put the gun on safe. I thumb back the hammer for the first shot.
The best gun to have is the one you have on you when you need it. My Walther in .32 is very accurate , dependebole and reasonbly compact and if i put 7 silvertips into the hulk I bet I could kick his bellybutton after that. The walther is never on safe either with one in the chamber. it is double action so very quick to get into operation... it is hefty for a small gun and points well.
whatever gun you get... get one you enjoy shooting cause you should shoot it a lot.
.41 mag? useless. not as handy as a 357 but not near4 as powerful as a 44. Same size gun as a 44. Hard and expensive to reload for... the 41 idea died for good reasons.
bulldogs? had a bunch of em. you guys ever shoot one? LOL... these things kick! and i ain't exactly recoil consious. Bulldog is an experts backup. if a newby gets one he won't shoot the first box of ammo in a year. No real point to getting one unless you need a carry gun and are married to the 44 caliber idea. Personally... I cut down a ruger redhawk and it works better for me. My 5'3" daughter shoots the cut down 44 double action and enjoys doing it. bulldogs are to light and tend to flip in the hand.
shotguns are not good in the house.. you can't get to em... they cant be nmanuevered easily and.. you are in real danger of having one taken away from you... They also are hard and slow to point in the house and it is easy to miss with one. Once you miss.... a second shot is difficult unless you have a double barrel or autoloader.
lazs
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a bulldog kicks but in a hall way or bed room you aint tryin to plink cans at 25 yards.
Even if ya miss the noise will scare the toejame out of umm.
in close quarters you dont aim.
A shotgun sounds all good but where are going to put it? How ya gonna get to it?
In my .357 I have 158 grain hollow point hydro-shok, you dont need to worry about overpenetration.
Anyway its a matter of choice.......
laz is right for a someone who hasn't handled a gun go for a revolver.
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wouldn't you be able to sue the guy you shot for causing the collateral damage?
well that is if he lives:D
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Frangible ammo will also prevent over-penetration. It's more expensive but worth it if you have such considerations. Whatever you end up buying make sure you are serious about using it and train with it or else the guy will just end up taking it way from you and shoving it up your prettythang.
Los
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Hey Mos
The best thing to do is find out which one you are most comfertable with. If you have some friends with any arms, try them out, see which ones you handle the best. There are some gun stores that have test guns also. When looking at Sig arms and Glock, they are both good, colts are ok. You can take a Glock and drag it for miles in the dirt and it will 99% of the time fire with no problem. Sig's are excelent, they have a double trigger pull. First shot is a long pull of the hammer, after that, if you don't de-cock it, ther rest are quick trigger squeeze. I own 2 Sig 229's (one a .357 sig and other a 40 S&W) and use a Sig 228 on duty. You can also look towards smaller arms like the Beretta or 38 special. Also think about getting a lock box or a gun safe, you never can be to cautious with arms.
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or just get a 9mm auto carbine.
Fire off 30 of em quick, you either scare him or you hit 'im ;)
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
statistics also show that once your kids a teenager in a liberal family, he's more likely to beat you with that baseball bat while you sleep.
Untrue- my sister is a single mother with twin teenage boys and they didn't beat HER with a baseball bat- they beat the Republican couple who lived across the street from their Section 8 housing.
Even though Roscoe and Oscar are only 17 and this is only the second time they've been arrested for assault the judge threw the book at them- he confinscated their X-Box. Of course the ACLU has stepped in and we've appealed the punishment as being cruel and unusual, but this makes me wonder how Draconian we can get as a society and not allow our children a third or fourth chance.
I might move to France.
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wotan... I just meant that if he gets a bulldog he won't spend time shooting it. I wore two blue bulldogs out with hot reloads but most don't like the recoil and it cuts the web of most folks hand.
lazs
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ah ok ....... thats the truth. Its the last gun I go to to plink targets with.
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mossberg 5500 semi-auto pistol grip, 18" barrel.
dispels all myths about unweildy shotguns.
Very effective weapon, and perfect for situations where 'home defense' is in fact the issue..
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Gotta go with the shotgun... At six feet, it won't knock 'em down. It'll cut 'em in half.
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..and with a door slug load, it'll cut a caddillac in half. :)
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Here are the weapons we use at work, reliable and accurate.
http://www.cz-usa.com/_p/p01.php
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Wha??? Who's the .... recommending .22's for home defense? .223? nah...9mm, well not so bad, but still no stopping power unless...
You buy one of those 9mm Lugers from Cornerd Rat Guns-N-Stuff.
I hear there 100% effective at upt 300 yrds. 1 shot.
Seriously, you should do a liberal check in your state and local area before shooting perps. Recently we had a Newspaper delivery guy loading up the paper machines a gas station in a bad area of town. He witnessed a fella sticking up the gas station, gun to the head and all that. He calmly went to his truck, retrieved his pistola, walked into the gas station and put 3 into the bandito. The guy was on the floor twitching and squirming, so he put 2 more in him. No robbery, no lawsuits, no charges. Very very grateful gas station attendant though, said something about owing him his life.
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the 2 extra shots would've probably got him quite a few years in the pen in this part of the country
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For home defence :
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monk... cz's are fine firearms. I simply don't feel that most (new gun)people should bother with an autoloader. If a person were to be dilegent about geting familiar with the gun then I would recomend one in .40 cal and.... I would buy the .22 conversion kit for cheap practice.
shotguns... any of you guys ever even shoot a shotgun? ever cut anything "in half" with one? They don't cut anything in half and they don't make 6" holes in stuff like on TV. The are clumsy and hard to weild in a house.. My mini 14 is more handy than a 18' mossberg pump. you don't want to anounce your presence by a foot or so of barrel preceding you.
A lot of you guys seem to be putting form over function here.
Another plus for the 357 and 44 mags is.... versatility.. if you like to target shoot or plink.. you don't have to chase the brass.. they are simple to reload for and cheaper and easier to reload than autos.... plinking is the best tho... you should see the sour, disapointed looks on the faces of the gee wizz autoloader guys faces when they try to hit a five gallon bucket at 1 or 2 hundred yards with one. The wheelgun guys are having fun and the auto guys are left out.... looking on the ground for brass...
Anything will work tho if you are diligent. I don't feel the least vulnerable with a single action wheelgun in 357.. 44 or 45. What they did then they still can do now... It is a little known fact that in all competion... the fastest gun from the holster to the first shot is still a single action wheelgun and..... No autoloader can get off 6 shots as fast as a double action wheelgun... The differences are slight but it is true.
lazs
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capt apathy... the extra two shots saved him a huge lawsuit and a lot of trouble.
lazs
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once the guy was down (unless he still had his gun in his hand, or you put it there afterwards) those extra couple shots would probably be described as 'execution style' by your prosecuting attny. once the guy is down and un-armed it goes from deffence to murder. although it does simplify the whole witness thing as yours would be the only story heard.
on the other hand if the guy wheren't alone I'd say the extra couple shots would be justified so he doesn't get back up while you are dealing with his freind
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For shooting, .22s are the way to go. Dirt cheap guns and ammo. They also won't damage your ears, retinas etc. from lots of shooting.
BTW, I keep all of my firearms disassembled and the firing mechs. well hidden. Less risk of kids or theives getting into trouble.
For home defence, I have a giant pepper spray can. The good thing about these is that if you mistakenly use it on a loved one, well,... they live.
eskimo
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Originally posted by capt. apathy
once the guy was down (unless he still had his gun in his hand, or you put it there afterwards) those extra couple shots would probably be described as 'execution style' by your prosecuting attny. once the guy is down and un-armed it goes from deffence to murder. although it does simplify the whole witness thing as yours would be the only story heard.
on the other hand if the guy wheren't alone I'd say the extra couple shots would be justified so he doesn't get back up while you are dealing with his freind
Remember the Vancouver couple that had an intruder? The husband had gotten his gun and said the intruder was going for his wife when he pumped 15 rounds into his back? He was never charged... and his wife was never touched.
AKDejaVu
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ya, but if I remember right they where all fired before the guy hit the ground.
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Originally posted by capt. apathy
ya, but if I remember right they where all fired before the guy hit the ground.
No they weren't... they were just all fired. The investigation pretty much concluded that the act of continually squeezing the trigger until all of the ammo is gone can be just as... um... "spontaneous" with 2 rounds as it is with 15. That is... there isn't really a point where pre-meditation enters the picture in certain circumstances.
Now, if someone were to stop firing, walk over to a body and then pump a couple of reassurance rounds in... another story.
AKDejaVu
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I'd recomend a .357 (ruger is my fav here) with a 4" barrel for home defense and target range stuff. You can load .38 bullets in it if recoil is something you'd like to avoid or magnum if armor is something you'd like to penetrate.
I'm gonna agree here. I have a 6" stainless colt king cobra. Its very accurate for a pistol and easy to shoot considering the power of the round. With a .357 and some good hollowpoints one shot will kill damn near any intruder.
Its alot of fun at the range, but ammo is expensive.
My other pistol is a S&W sigma .40. Its far less accurate, less powerful, less reliable and has more recoil . Most people prefer autos. I however prefer a wheelgun. Like some suggested try renting guns (or go shooting w/ a buddy.) Try some different ones out and get what you are most compfortable with.
For me, if I ever DO need to defend myself, you can bet I'll grab my .357 before anything else.
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My take on home defense weapons:
handguns...good because they can leave you with one or both hands free while you investigate the situation. Not good for much except home defense. Expensive.
rifles...not too good for home defense, unless you have a lot of land. Good for huniting. Can be expensive.
shotguns...pretty good all around, for home defense, hunting, and target clays. Cheap, versatile. Unlikely to hurt a far away innocent bystander if you are using lighter loads.
I own one of each, if I had to keep only one it would be the shotgun. If you are mainly interested in home defense I would recommend a cheap 12 guage Mossberg pump, as others have. Shoot some target clays for fun and to stay familiar with the gun. Take the hunting plug out at home so it can hold more shells.
ra
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Just buy a fragmentation grenade off the black market and let the burglars beware! :)
dago
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Hiya Mos. =)
For home defense and a general plinker, you cant go wrong with a 1911. Im a CCW permit holder and even if I do walk out of the house with a gun, which I almost never do for some reason anymore, it would be a 1911.
As others have mentioned, some rounds have you running the risk of shooting your neighbors as well as the intruder.
For self defense I would urge you away from anything chambered in 9mm... stongly. The 9mm is like a nail - it will go through just about anything, but wont cause much damage. In other words, you shoot a guy from 15 feet, hes going to keep coming at you and that round you just fired went through your wall, through your neighbors wall, and into the family dog.
If the 9mm is a nail, the 45 ACP is the hammer. Its slow and heavy. Not much penitrating power, but whatever you hit with it isnt getting up. (In addition to that, the wide muzzle opening is intimidating enough that you may not have to shoot... no damnit, look in a mirror, dont point the fediddleing thing at yourself!)
Colts are fine examples dispite the rumers, Springfields are excellent, Kimbers are the best "out of box" and since I dont see any mention of higher end custom 1911's, Ill skip the Wilson/Les Baer argument. :cool:
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My shop is the Canadian distributor for Kimber, and I shoot a Custom CDP II as my IDPA gun, and you'll fine no finer bang for your buck anywhere IMO if you're looking for a .45 as your defensive system.
I strongly recommend taking a weekend course on home defence, which will teach you not only the proper use of a firearm in an indoor environment, but also teach you how to set up your house and have fall back/lockdown positions with phones in the right places, etc.
Also, caliber IMO is not as big an issue as the type of cartridge you use. Full metal jacket is a major no no, be sure you use a round specifically made for defence purposes (ie kill people, not put holes in paper.)
Unlike what many are saying here, 9mm with 147 gr hydrashocks or other similar rounds don't overpenetrate at all, in fact they often penetrate even less than a similar 230 gr .45 hollowpoint/frag round. .45 is a lot of gun for a newbie, 9mm is easier to shoot, usually smaller, cheaper on ammo, and will suit your purpose just fine, IF you use the correct ammunition for the purpose.
I just took a course from SigArms last weekend on advanced tactical pistol, Tim Connell who trains the Air Marshalls as well as "other" military units in the art of pistelro was up for a week or so, and he said unofficially that the Air Marshalls are using Sig's with the .357 Sig cartridge, which is virtually the same as any 9 in caliber and weight, only going about 400 fps faster. They obviously have the ammunition/penetration situation well in hand there, being on aircraft and all, so don't worry about a 9mm going through your house and into your neighbours. It can happen with any caliber, if full metal jacket or lead swc type ammo is used.
Best advice that I've read here and can give is to seek the help of a local professional, and not be afraid of trying out what he suggests.
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Get a pump action shotgun. The "shuck-shuck" of putting a shell in the chamber, and a calm, low question, "What chyall doin' in my house?" will bring 95% of intruders to to thier knees, quivering in wet pants. The shells are for the other 5%;)
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
Get a pump action shotgun. The "shuck-shuck" of putting a shell in the chamber, and a calm, low question, "What chyall doin' in my house?" will bring 95% of intruders to to thier knees, quivering in wet pants. The shells are for the other 5%;)
That's a very distinctive sound alright!!! Think how great an alarm system sound that would be...LOL, along with the "What chyall doin' in my house?"
Les
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About the Charter Arms Bulldog .44. I was told Charter Arms didn't make it any more, and had gone out of business. Anyone have any info on that?
Les
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air marshalls all use frangable bullets, thats what they were designed for , back when the US started using air marshalls the US govt went to the ammo mfgs and said "make a bullet that will kill but won't damage a air plane" the ammo mfgs invented the frangable bullet, it is also good for home defense if you live in a frame house, it won't go through a framed double drywall wall, costs alot more than reg ammo
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you may be right leslie I bought mine a long time ago.
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That's a very distinctive sound alright!!! Think how great an alarm system sound that would be...LOL, along with the "What chyall doin' in my house?"
n highschool I new this girl who had the cheap alarm that has the sounds of dogs barking, (it was a motion sensor I think). anyway we made her a new tape for it that had the sound of a round being jacked into a shotgun. just one pump loud and clear with no other sound.
I have no idea how well that worked but we did have some fun making the tape. don't think she was ever broken into though.
we had some major brake-in problems in my nehborhood a few years back. a lot of break-ins for about 6 blocks around, plus things being stolen out of the yard.
so I had this old roll-up window shade on the window that was set into the back door. so I cut the shade off at about 6" then I went to the shooting range. took a siloet target and ran it out to about 40', then took the nine out with 2 clips plus one in the chamber. I put all 25 into the 9-10 zone then rolled up the target andtook it home. taped it to what was left of the shade. so when you goto bed at night you pull down the shade and leave the inside porch light on. it's wuite an effect going outside and seeing the blacked out silouet with all the holes of light shinning through.
for whatever reason (the target or the new dog I got at about the same time) we never had any trouble after that.
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Is they cost so much, it is hard to justify the expense. Very hard to get the girlfriend to understand spending the money too, lol even though she is a better shot then I am if she uses a 9mm.
I want this next.
(http://www.springfieldarmory.com/images/pistols/a1/PX9510L.jpg)
They have one called the V10, like the one in the picture, but it has compensation ports cut in it.
I want! (http://www.springfieldarmory.com/prod-pstl-1911-uc.shtml)
Maybe after this one, I will get a Sig pro.
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capt... I am afraid that I would be so traumatized by the whole event that I wouldn't even notice that I had put a couple extra shots into the perp. Just a fortunate hapenstance. I mean... I was frieghtened and I don't even recall the gun going off.... I just wanted to stop him...
lazs