Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: AKDejaVu on April 29, 2001, 03:08:00 PM
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If you've read any of these posts on this BBS, you've noticed a couple of names keep popping up. "Mitsu" and "Torque" are two that come to mind.
The more of the hacking posts you see, the more you see acceptance and name association.
So many people just know these two were cheaters, they just couldn't prove it.
I flew Warbirds until 2.0 was released. I was a closed-beta tester for 2.0 and had flown Warbirds since .96 was out. When 2.0 lost its NT 4.0 compatability, it lost me as a customer.
I floundered around for some time playing various sims until I stumbled across a game called "Flying Circus". It was a pretty simple WWI simulation with each country having two different planes that were identical in performance to the other side's planes. Camel Vs Fokker.D1 and Albatros vs (can't remember). No realism in flight charateristics... just identically matched aircraft.
After 2 years of Warbirds, this game was cake. I eventually latched on with the AKs and hooked up with some awesome wingmen.. and as I learned more about the limits of the aircraft I began doing better in the game. Eventually, I found that I was leading in virtually every statistical category.. by a large ammount. Yet, I wasn't flying for stats. I was flying to kill and then make it home.
I learned that putting rounds into the same wing was the most reliable way to take someone down... and I mastered it. This game had a simple damage mode where 25 hits to a wing damaged it, and 30 broke it. Very straight forward. Combine that with some practiced gunnery and it was easy to kill an aircraft and move on.
After a year, the accusations started rolling out. You see, someone had discovered that there were two other aircraft about to be introduced and edited the FE code to "release" them. The patch was distributed amongst the community and then all hell broke lose.
If this was possible, then surely it was possible that I was cheating in order to be so successfull in the game. And, the more it was discussed, the more it became likely that I was cheating at the game. And if I wasn't cheating, then I obviously had some kind of unfair advantage (even had squadies buying into this).
How do you disprove this? What are the options for pilots that get bombarded with this? The community gets together and theorizes about the actions of individuals and ZERO good comes out of it.
To this day, I resent that community for what was done there.
I can't help but get the feeling that Torque falls into that same category, as does Mitsu.
<S> to those that do so well everyone assumes they are cheating.
<Finger> to those that have nothing better to do but try to figure out how someone is cheating.
AKDejaVu
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when i was a newb i thought torque must be cheating because he so far outclassed me
now i kow its just because he was in a good airplane and is an excellent pilot
there is no cheating in aces high
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Originally posted by Zigrat:
there is no cheating in aces high
Zig if u beleive that, then ur fooling ur self. any game/sim can,is or will be hacked by someone. there is always someone out there
thatw ill do it just to piss other off.
whels
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I never said that there isn't/wasn't cheating in Aces High.
I do believe that the community is not the place where cheats should be discussed... in any form.
AKDejaVu
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I think the fact with hacking/cheating is that it is possible.
But we should be careful if and when we cry "Hack".
Most issues can be directed to lag, better plane and most often better pilot.
But when an issue can not be linked to one of the "normal" reasons for impossible things, it is legal to think of hacks.
What was with the P51 dropping tons of 4000 lbs bombs?? was that lag? NO, there proof was there, and that is the way we should do it all, when something is supicious, film it, and report to HTC about it.
The most probs will always accure from gunfire and certain ACM, cause if someone manages to increas his gun dmg by 20% or increase thrust by 5% this actually will not cause any suspicions.
But i also believe that this progamming stuff is so complex that only a real minority will ever use it in AH and i would say 99% of the AH players play this game fair (this also includes the many N1K1 and cHOG pilots (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) ), and hacking will, whenever, only accure very very randomly.
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Originally posted by Zigrat:
there is no cheating in aces high
lol
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I don't know if there is really any sure fire method of detecting cheating by the players. I have noticed when I was playing off and on in the MA this year that players have mentioned hacking the AH code in the text buffer. I also saw one of the better known players discussing potential hacks. This is somewhat distressing. I would hope that this stuff is just bs but I know from past experience in a sim built for mac that real cheating happens. The competitive environment probably has something to do with it. The more competition the more potential for cheating. My experience has also been that most online sim developers don't want to talk about it much-probably sensitive to business issues. I have also gotten direct comments from both developers and sim site moderators which usually go something like 'It's up to the player community to police itself'. I feel that the sim developer/admin has the real responsibilty for taking action with this particular issue. If however, a player really has some information about a certain other player who appears to be cheating then I don't think they should feel like Judas if they email the admin about it. It might help if we got a little feed back from the developers about this to help establish a little more real communication between what the community of players expects and what what the developer expects.
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Exactly my thoughts DejaVu (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I was always proud when called a cheater -- it means I flied really good this time (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Fariz
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Torque AKA PPIT in WB's and I grew up killing each other in the P & D arena in WB's long long ago in the 1.06 dayzz. He really sucked then but after much (and I mean much) practicing and fighting he turned into a damn good F4u pilot which in WB's was hard to do. Thw Hog in WB's was a dog in my prespective. He brought those same skills here to AH and has been called a cheater quite a few times. ALl I got to say to anybody calling him a cheat is to go to the P&D arena here and start practicing. Torque may be a real TARD but he fights fair and well. If you cant beat him then your just not good enough. I beat him all the time huh ya Tard? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
LLB OUT!!!!!!!!!!!
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i flew against and with torque in the early tours....he was a hell of a opponent and taught me a lot about the F4u...mostly the reason i fly it since tour 2 cuz it was a plane to master back then..almost nobody flew it and called it a pig
I'm glad it has gained some reputation (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I never saw him cheating in any way..all just awesome SA and anticipation
i even joined on some flights as observer..hehe what a freaking show
i hope he will be soon around us again
as for mitsu he's the devil in person,
he controls the force and makes us auger just when we get our sights on him (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
hehe btw mitsu were you born with real hands
or some new genetic BIO HOTAS system?
[This message has been edited by storm (edited 04-29-2001).]
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Originally posted by Zigrat:
there is no cheating in aces high
That's a bit of a stretch, but I also doubt it's as prevelant as some would have you believe.
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I equate this all with the UFO phenomena... Could they exist? Sure they could. If you see a formation of lights over the Nevada desert, are they UFOs? With all of the other possibilities in the world that could explain such things, the fantastic theories always seem much more fun to believe in.
We all see what we want to see.
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Hehe, I think I will join in with Mitsu "cheat" comments.
I am sure he have developed some kind of "Bullet Repellant Spray" for his Spit. It is darn hard to hit. Everytime I meet it I end up using most of my ammo and hardly get more than an assist.
He sure has learnt to use the ever present netlag to his advantage. Always doing that little move in the nick of time to make you miss the target.
That is however equal to all and not much can be done to solve it, except getting the best possible connect you can.
I do notice a big difference in my hit-rate with good and bad netlag stats. As I am connecting from Europe, I will never get as little netlag as US pilots can. There are always some netlag. Most of the time my netlag is in the area of 0,3 to 0,5 seconds.
That netlag is more than enough for me to see con in my crosshair, sure to get a hit - however, in reality the plane has already left my gunsite. Thus I get no kill when I was sure to get it.
I think this situation has lead to many cheat accusations. We also see it the other way around. Where pilots are accused of inducing warps. In reality I dont think we have much of it, even if it is possible.
One thing I am sure off is that netlag warps are to the most disadvantage for the guy who warps. Not to those who see the warp.
At times when netstat is bad I have to use much more lead than when netlag is less. It is something we have to live with and learn how to compensate.
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Cheaters are every where in society.
If every time you get beat beacause some one is better than you, and you automatically call cheat, you'll never learn.
The only cheat in that situation is the one you pull on yourself.
Sax
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Mitsu is a great pilot he has shot me down a number of times,and I never needed to suspect him of any wrong doing.he's just a better pilot than me.
and I aint afraid to admit it...
dang my stupid spelling
[This message has been edited by Uvvall (edited 04-30-2001).]
[This message has been edited by Uvvall (edited 04-30-2001).]
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never saw a plane in AH that did anything out of line with the FM.
lag occasionally a problem but never in on demand warpers did i find.
all that should have died often did. other times they saved themselves with better tactics or skill.
cept for a lancaster that found a way to teleport from place to place.
he was hard to shoot down. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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there is no cheating in aces high
Deluded rubbish. I have it on film and it is corroborated by 4 other pilots - Toad saw the same guy in a later incident.
This was less than a month ago.
HT has dealt with it, AFAIK.
Secondly, remember the P51 which could drop never-ending 4000lb bombs or the B26 which was stuffed with troops?
It has happened before, and it will happen again.
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only prob imho with cheating and hacking is the more we speak about it, the more people will try to use it so they can get some attention on this BBS.
a cheater will in most cases have very low skills so he wont be too much of a danger unless he manages to code a glue gun or some
spiderman sticky stuff that will make me tow him behind me (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
if i see too much warps or intentional ones i just disengage...i dont even comment
these b26 fulla bombs and troops can grab some fields etc..but they will always werk alone and wont accomplish too much without assistance.Noone here will help them anyway.
So i guess the best approach is just ignore
em and report stuff if ya manage to film it
my 2 cents
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yep, the more you whip up the hackers ego with topics as this, the more time they spend trying to break it for the fame. I can say I haven't experienced anything I'd call hacking or cheating yet. Warping I blame on the net, the rest on my poor marksmanship (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Eagler
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Deja,
I remember you from the FC days (along with some of the other AK's).
I also remember the accusations that started flying around. Didn't believe em then, & still don't.
Yes I've died a thousand times to Mitsu, Torque, GTR, etc. They EARNED each & every one of them. <S>
If you have proof, send it to HTC. IF you don't, hold your cards close to your chest till you get it!
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Originally posted by Fokker:
Most of the time my netlag is in the area of 0,3 to 0,5 seconds.
That netlag is more than enough for me to see con in my crosshair, sure to get a hit - however, in reality the plane has already left my gunsite. Thus I get no kill when I was sure to get it.
That could not be further from truth. Reality has no meaning in that context. You are not shooting at another plane. You are shooting at a representation of a plane as your front end sees it. And what it sees, it displays. So if the plane is in your crosshairs, that is where you are aiming.
If you see the hit sprites, that means you are hitting. All hits and damage are determined on the shooting plane front end.
There may be three reasons for you not getting the kill:
1. You see the hit sprites but the packets with damage are lost. If your or his connection are bad, that may happen. You would see warpiness in that case.
2. You are shooting but the plane leaves the crosshair by the time bullets arrive to your aiming point.
3. You are not using the right amount of lead.
miko
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3. You are not using the right amount of lead.
LOL! this is a great statement. I read it 5 different times.
Led
Leed
Led
Leed
led
He means Leed! I don't know why it never occured to me that the two words were spelled the same. Not until I saw it in a situation where both words would fit.
Of course, you can never use enough lead. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
AKDejaVu
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OOOOOOHHHHHHH RAM....
(http://content.communities.msn.com/isapi/fetch.dll?action=view_photo&ID_Community=MMPAviation&ID_Topic=2&ID_Message=8)
Those damn rear firing Typhoons!
-SW