Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Vulcan on December 11, 2002, 09:05:07 PM
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Travelling home last night I spoted a patch of white out of the corner of my eye, tucked up in some bushes. A cop with a laser... damnit! I have a pair of forward firing jammers but no rear protection :(
So this cop gives chase, I immediately grab my radar detector off the dash and throw it under my seat - usually if they see a detector they show no mercy. Anyway he pulls me over, "you were doing 112km/h in a 100 zone". I apologised, searched for a lame excuse (Tailwind!), and he was just about to let me off when all off a sudden another patrol car rounds the bend going in the opposite direct.
From under my seat comes a BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP KA BAND BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP KA BAND BLEEP BLEEP . Cop looks at me funny like, peers into the car "is that a radar detector"... "ahhh yeah" (very sheepishly) - cop proceeds to write ticket :(
On the bright side Bel 980's are really sensitive and can still pick up Ka band from under your seat!
Anyway, I ordered a Bel Prolaser 904 with bellybutton coverage today.
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Damn dude. :(
I feel your pain.
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Yeah, I hate it when those damm cops catch me breaking the law...bastards. :(
:D
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Ha ha that's funny, bet the cop got a laugh with his buddies back at the station :)
J_A_B
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I remember one time I got a warning on my old detector but the cop was driving the opposite direction. I had about 1 sec of warning and couldn't get it slowed down in time. He hangs a U and pulls me over and I'm too stunned to even try to hide the detector. He walks up and he's like "How's that detector working out for you?" :D
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nice story,
it's good to know that my obeying the speed limit and having absolutely no tickets saving me time, money and anguish :)
oh and humiliation , can't forget humiliation. :D
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Originally posted by funkedup
I remember one time I got a warning on my old detector but the cop was driving the opposite direction. I had about 1 sec of warning and couldn't get it slowed down in time. He hangs a U and pulls me over and I'm too stunned to even try to hide the detector. He walks up and he's like "How's that detector working out for you?" :D
How does that work? They can gauge your speed while in motion themselves? Unless they were in cruise control, I don't see how they can use the closure rate minus their own speed (varying no doubt) as grounds for a ticket. There's room for error... you got a ticket for that funky?
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Last two times I was pulled over, I received warnings:
1. Phoenix to Tucson, 91 in a 75mph.
Cop: "do you know how fast you were going"
Me: "about 90"
Cop: "now, why were you going 90?"
Me: "to be honest I didn't notice my speed until I saw you"
Cop: "well slow it down"
2. Phoenix to Tucson, 85 in 75. Got a warning again.
I guess I'm lucky
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sure are Nuke!
First ticket Milwaukee -> Madison.. 86 in a 65. WITH a probationary license (points double). Almost lost my driving privies... turns out I got off with a faulty speedometer... lucky for the circumstances I guess.
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Prolly made Gman's day.
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(Joke)
Mr. Jones is happily driving along in his newly aquired (enter sports car of choice) when he notices the tell-tale flashing lights of a police cruiser behind him.
Now, he was driving rather spiritedly, and perhaps had broken the local speed limit.
Either way, Mr. Jones wasnt about to end his Sunday drive with a ticket. He opens the throttle and speeds away from the cop. A chase ensues for about five minutes when Mr. Jones gets board and decides to pull over.
The cruiser pulls in behind him and walks up to the (enter sports car of choice).
Mr. Jones expects the cop to be angry, but hes not...
Cop: "Its 4:30 on Sunday and I have half an hour left on my shift. If you can give me a reason Ive never heard before that explains why you tried running from me, Ill let you go."
Mr. Jones: "Officer, my wife left me for a Policeman last week and I thought you were bringing her back."
Cop: "Have a nice day."
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Originally posted by Octavius
How does that work? They can gauge your speed while in motion themselves? Unless they were in cruise control, I don't see how they can use the closure rate minus their own speed (varying no doubt) as grounds for a ticket. There's room for error... you got a ticket for that funky?
Pretty sure it's built in to the radar system/speedometer that it'll simply subtract the cops speed from the radar speed... or something like that.
It's happened to me before, I couldn't get out of it.
-SW
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Yep the system they have figures in the speed of their car. They get a relative speed from the gun then subtract out their speed. The answer (assuming the gun is working right) is actually conservative, because I don't believe they factor in the lateral offset between the lanes.
Speed laws are basically a road usage tax. If you want to use the roads as God and Henry Ford intended them to be used, you have to pay a little extra. :)
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About 3 months after rodney king verdict. I was driving hom from work in Maywood Ca. (surburb of LA) to my house in La. Cresenta in the hills above LA.
After working late to about 9pm i was speeding about 80 in 55 zone. no one around I see headlights turn on from car sitting on the on ramp to the highway. Right away I know I've been had.
I make sure pistol is unloaded and in its case. I wait for cop to walk up to door. He Asked me for my lic and reg. I gave it to him and waited in my car. About 2mins both he and his partner were asking me to step out of car.
I'm a big man 6'4" 325lbs the partner dwarf me in size at least 6'6' about a good 290 all muscle. Other cop was 6'1 or 2 and in great shape. Both were Black officers I am white.
lead cop turns to his partner and says "Look here buba we got us a white Rodney" I smiled a little i think. Next his parnter says I don't see any cameras do you bigjim. Now I get real nervous and look around for cars. Buba say think we should give some payback seem like it could be fun/ ( now in my mind i'm thinking shouldn't have unloaded gun). as they both give me looks that made me sure, it was going to get nasty. They both start laughing thier tulips off. I sure was pissed at first but not enough to give them toejam.
They look at me and say have a nice day we just thought it would be funny, Only thing i was happy about was the no ticket.
whats funny is They took off name plates and hate never even got badge numbers lol. Can look back and laugh now but not then. :)
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Wrong honey.
Current Police radar techology is Ka Band DSP run technology. Using good old fashioned doppler calculations. Same as Lidar (Laser), it uses doppler calculations to work out your speed, of course the problem with Lidar is it can only track on 'object', ie not the ground (or background), so Lidar has to be used stationary.
Most older radar detectors have problems detecting Ka band. The new ones pick it up easily. However new Ka Instand on radar is virtually undetectable in standby mode, the only thing that gives it away is when they 'fire' instant on the signal is much stronger than usual and can be picked up around 10km away. So on the open road you get fairly good warning as long as theres other traffic around.
Because Lidar and Ka band use doppler calculations they also give a lower speed reading as the angle of deflection reading the speed increases. IE, at 0 degrees offset (12 o'clock) the reading is perfect, at 90 degrees the reading is 0 (zero), at 180 degrees (6 o'clock) the reading is perfect.
In NZ our Police are equiped wayyyyyy ahead of the US cops in terms of speed detection. All highway patrol type vehicles have Ka band (digital) as well as Lidar (Laser), stand patrol vehicles have K band (analog). We also have Ka band Speed Photo Radar in mobile vehicles, and pressure trigger mounted speed photo camera's in permanant mountings.
Currently in NZ if you exceed the speed limit by 10km/h you HAVE to be booked. They are trying to lower it to 5km/h. IE, do 105km/h in a 100km/h zone you get booked. Plus we have demerit points, too many points (about 4 speeding tickets) and you lose your license for up to 2 years.
As funked said, for the most part its nothing more than revenue collection. As an example, near where I live there is a stretch of highway which is a real killer. We used to live on a the main road leading up to it. Every weekend we would hear the ambulances (and before the soap box bunch talker about ambulances responding to speeders like me, more than often it was an old fart losing control and crossing into the oncoming traffic). Anyway, Govt refuses to build an alternative route recommended by a roading study. No, they're keen on getting more cameras out there.
I do a fair bit of travelling, hence the 'countermeasures' collection :)
Originally posted by funkedup
Yep the system they have figures in the speed of their car. They get a relative speed from the gun then subtract out their speed. The answer (assuming the gun is working right) is actually conservative, because I don't believe they factor in the lateral offset between the lanes.
Speed laws are basically a road usage tax. If you want to use the roads as God and Henry Ford intended them to be used, you have to pay a little extra. :)
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The last time I got pulled over for speeding was by a Texas Trooper on I-40 in 1987. It was truly a surreal experiance.
1) 1959 Ford F-150, oversized tires so the speedometer was off
2) I didn't think the truck would even do 65mph, but figured it was close, kept the pedal on the floor all the time.
Trooper walks up "Ya know why I pulled ya over boy?"
Tumor: "No Sir.... tail light out?"
Trooper: "Nope.. you military?" (Duffel bags in back)
Tumor: (playing along) "Yep"
Trooper: "You wuz doin 66mph in a 65mph zone"
Tumor: (Blank stare)
Trooper: "Since ya'lls military... here's a warnin ticket.. slow'er down son"
Tumor: (Blank stare... thinking "this is a joke right?)
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there is no problem with most of the radar guns today in picking getting accurate readings when the target and the police car are moving. We've done lots of tests and it works just fine.
Also, don't totally depend on those 'detectors' because that isn't the only way cops can tell how fast you're going :)
just fyi
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Three weeks ago I got my first ticket in 22 years...for a busted headlight. Does that count?
Shuckins
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Vulcan, FWIW none of what you said contradicted what I said.
Doppler gives you relative velocity only. You still have to subtract out the speed of the emitting vehicle to get target absolute speed. This is done automatically by the radar gun, because it also measures the doppler shift of ground reflections to gauge the emitting vehicle's speed.
And the bit about 0 degrees, 90 degrees, 180 degrees, that's what I meant when I said the readings are conservative when they zap you going the other way. Most interstates in the US have a median strip between lanes going opposite directions. About 50 yards of grass. So when they are driving towards you, they usually get a reading at about 10 degrees to 20 degrees. Which gives them a conservative reading, slightly less than your real speed. I don't believe they bother with a calculation to compensate for the angle.
Cops here have instant on Ka and LIDAR too. There's not too many of the automated stationary devices though. They keep finding those machines riddled with bullets. :)
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British police are.......
well ok, check this:
I was runnin late.....not for work or anything important, I was just running late so I was putting the hammer down.........it was 8pm on a sunny sunday evening in the middle of July, hardly any traffic around and....as I say....I was late.
My bike at the time was a Suzuki RGV250, twin cyl 2 stroke that always sounded like it was about to blow up. Probably not the kind of bike that you want to ride past Gloucestershire Police Headquarters at 70mph in a 40 zone.
Anyway, as luck would have, there was a patrol car waiting to pull out as I went past.....and he did pull out, quietly, calmly and then put his foot down. Now the mirrors on RGVs are, frankly, crap. I never even saw him. At the end of this road was a slight dip and then some traffic signals, as I came over the rise the signals were just changing to red......so I went straight through as there was no way I coulda stopped in time anyway and there was no other traffic around and no pedestrians.
Still I hadnt spotted this patrol car.
About 5 miles further down the road I reached the turning I wanted, still oblivious to this patrol car behind me, and indicate I'm turning right as there's some traffic now coming the other way.........so I'm slowing down for the turn, still indicating when suddenly matey boy behind me turns the siren on.
SOB. He's about 3 feet behind me and I'm concentrating on stopping for the traffic and suddenly there's this God awful screaming that sounds like it's coming from my rear seat it was so damn loud. So I start looking behind me thinking I'm in the way of a fire engine or something, see this patrol car......then I look back in front and realise I'm not gonna stop in time and the only choice there is is to make the turn.
Which I do, then stop in a hurry and get off the bike. I tell ya, I was so shrecking furious, this numpty could have killed me.
SuperCop then made the huge mistake of trying to tell me I almost fell off on that last turn and I should learn how to ride a bike. HUGE argument then takes place at the side of the road, the red mist had decended on me and I wasnt taking prisoners.
Wont bore you with the details but I managed to talk myself into a charge of Dangerous Driving (probably this >< close to an Assault on a Police Officer charge as well considering the finger jabbing). However, it never went to court and I got let off easy with 3 points and a 40 pound (GBP) fine.......all because the dopey cop actually put in his statement to the court that I was indicating my intention to turn right.
Anyway, to finish my initial statement: British Policemen are mainly meat headed clots straight outta the army, no wonder we dont allow em to carry guns.
(http://image1ex.villagephotos.com/extern/640697.jpg)
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*crying* *wiping screen of tears*
Im so sorry...so sorry
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hehe.. nice story for me.. sorry for Swoop.. :)
Swoop.. sounds like me in my younger days..
FWIW radar guns are even accurate at oblique angles.
tested and proven.
the 'other' way they catch you is so simple that no technology will stop them.. doesn't matter what fancy electronic detector you have.
They time you over a pre-measured distance.
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Originally posted by funkedup
And the bit about 0 degrees, 90 degrees, 180 degrees, that's what I meant when I said the readings are conservative when they zap you going the other way. Most interstates in the US have a median strip between lanes going opposite directions. About 50 yards of grass. So when they are driving towards you, they usually get a reading at about 10 degrees to 20 degrees. Which gives them a conservative reading, slightly less than your real speed. I don't believe they bother with a calculation to compensate for the angle.
That is true. The only time this "cosine effect" will hurt the driver is if the radar is not pointed in the exact same direction the police car is going. This would cause the radar to indicate a velocity that is greater than that targets vehicles velocity. All other instances of this discrepancy benefit the target vehicle's driver.
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In Michigan the limit is 70 and if you're not going 80, you're obstructing traffic.
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the 'other' way they catch you is so simple that no technology will stop them.. doesn't matter what fancy electronic detector you have.
ie. Vascar
Easy to spot and remember where the traps are though.
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Valentine detector.
Accept no substitudes.
4 Conventions attended, over 5000 miles driven, 0 tickets :D
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The cool thing about Vascar in GB is that in rural police forces they dont have the manpower to have the system calibrated more than once a week......and by law if the system wasnt calibrated that day then it's inadmissable as evidence.
(http://image1ex.villagephotos.com/extern/640697.jpg)
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Originally posted by fd ski
Valentine detector.
Accept no substitudes.
4 Conventions attended, over 5000 miles driven, 0 tickets :D
AMEN BROTHER, PREACH ON. :)
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Funked what I mean't was they don't use internal speed devices from the vehicle (ie speedo), as you said the dar uses background objections to establish a base speed.
Mickey the cosine effect only ever gives a lower reading so it always works in favour of the driver.
They don't use vascar here, it was trialed and found to be to difficult, the only other method is the track you for 1/2 km in their car. And if you don't see the cop coming up behind you then you deserve a ticket.
Valentine? Bah the Bel 980's and Escort 8500's piss all over the valentines in performance and sensitivity.
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So how do laser jammers work? DO they work?
And how about beating those damned photo traps? We have vans here with toned windows. Got some device and a camera sticking out and you get flashed if you're driving too fast. Father got ticketed this way - they just plop a fine into your mailbox.
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My dad, who is pretty well skilled in electronics built his own Radar emitter, alls you have to do is point and click, anybody on the recieving end with a radar detector will slam on there brakes.
Its hours of entertainment on those long trips. You can find instructions on how to build one very easily. You just need the required parts and a sottering iron.
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One of my luckiest days.
About 10 yr. ago I was working out of town (k-falls for those of you who know the area). I was working 10 hrs a day 6 days a week. About 320 miles each way with about 100 of that in narrow a mountain pass.
This schedule had me getting home just in time to say goodnight to the kids on Saturday. Wake up early Sunday and be a father for a day, take care of stuff around the house. In bed by 8 up at 1:30 out the door by 2am to haul bellybutton down there and go right from the car into a 10 hour day, which started the whole thing over again for another week. This lasted about 3 months.
So one Saturday about 25 miles into the pass I get stuck behind a motorhome doing 25-35 (why the hell do people buy vehicles they are afraid to drive?) with 4 other cars behind him afraid to go around in the pass.
None of these other cars would really get going when we got the passing lane. Plus the wider road gave the motor home driver confidence so he sped up until the road narrowed again.
The end result was the additional cars bumper to bumper behind him made it impossible to pass him. Turning a 1 1/2 trip through the pass into a 3+-hour deal. Don’t look like I'll see the kids tonight.
So I finally make it out of the pass at Eugene and hit good road, nice 3 lanes of blacktop, brand new refinishing on the road, only moderate traffic.
The only down side is by now it is around 10pm and I've been up since 5am driving since 5pm, I'm exhausted. Also the road is only 55mph limit for the next couple miles and there's this dude in a white car in front of me who seems to think he has to go just under 55 and not move over when he can to let me pass.
He’s really starting to get on my nerves, there’s no room between cars to go around him safely on the right (but enough he could slide over easy to let me by). So I roll up pretty close and hang there waiting for a chance to go around.
Finally there’s room so I cut it hard into the lane to the right, floor it, and just gain enough speed to cut back in front of him (a little close I must admit) then floor it up to about 85mph.
Just then, those lights on top his car lit up. There he was a fully marked state trooper. I was so tired I didn't even notice the lights, antennas, or the 'state trooper' written on the back.
So feeling like an idiot and being completely busted (no way in hell to talk your way outta this one) I pull over.
I roll down the window with license and reg. ready. He walks up and says "and just what the hell is wrong with you"
So I am kinda tense and just unload "well it's like this" then I explained about the hours and miles, and finished up with "I've been on the road for 5 hours. When I left I had just enough time to get home kiss the kids goodnight, wake up, be a father for a day, haul bellybutton back down here and do it all again next week. I've been stuck behind this guy doing 30 all the way through the pass for 3 hours. The road here is flat wide and clear and you where in my way"
He stands there for a minute holding my license, not saying anything. Then asks if I have insurance. I tell him I do. So he throws the license in my lap and says, "well get going then. If I take the time to write it up you'll just drive faster to make up the time"
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Basically a set of powerful IR LED transmitters.
The most common misconception about Laser (or Lidar) is there is a tight beam being reflected back so its really hard to aim to jam. In fact the reflection is a massive scattered light pattern, and the Lidar electronics do some whiz bang doppler calculations with the reflected light waves to calculate your speed.
The Lidar receiver is susceptable to jamming by these IR LED transmitters, as well as reflected sunlight, and halogen lights which both have enough IR light in them to throw the lidar gun off. Essentially the Lidar gun seeings the 'extra' IR light coming in and can't calculate the speed properly, usually throwing up an error (error 7 - to much ambient light is the one I think our guys get in NZ).
In testing my jammer the most common reaction I got was for the cop to pack up and move 500 metres along the road. So it seems they are trained to just move when they get this error.
As for them working, well, the Rocky Mountains stuff doesn't. Its pure BS. But my current unit is a CMB, very dumb, always on, twin head, but no rear protection. It seems to be 100% effective (from the front). The one I've ordered is a Bel model, theres also an Escort model available, as well as the M-10 which is a little older. Watchout for renamed Rocky Mountains stuff, its basically empty except for a LED and buzzer.
The photo traps over here are similar, station wagon with tinted windows, a camera, and a Ka band radar constantly on firing at about 22 degrees onto the road. Best defence for those is a good detector. My Bel 980 gives me around 200-500 metres warning depending on the camera setup. Cheap radar detectors (such as Uniden) will only go off once you're on top of the camera.
Nefarious, its not hard to make something that'll set of radar detectors. Hell, most cheap detectors in cars coming the other way leak enough RF to set them off mine on a regular basis.
Originally posted by StSanta
So how do laser jammers work? DO they work?
And how about beating those damned photo traps? We have vans here with toned windows. Got some device and a camera sticking out and you get flashed if you're driving too fast. Father got ticketed this way - they just plop a fine into your mailbox.
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(151 mph)
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I don't know what is more retarded:
Posting pictures of your speedometer on the internet.
Or taking the time at 152 mph to grab a camera and take those pictures.
:D
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He's got the back wheels lifted off the ground funked.
Rip's to much of a nana to do 152mph :D