Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Robert on May 02, 2001, 05:17:00 PM
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I recieved this mail from a squadmate. I think we all should take a look at it very close.
Hi,
I quit playing Aces High today (05/02/2001), because it's just a stupid game which
makes me aggressive. Lots of people on the message boards say Fighter Ace II is the
Quake of the Skies.... I think Aces High desserves the name.
I am playing Sims for almost 3 1/2 years now, starting on Air Warrior II
on AOL and almost six months in Aces High now.
The reason I leave is, that this game just consists of gang banging other people.
To say the truth, in the six months I have been flying Aces High I have only seen
so many 1 on 1 fights like I can count on one of my hands. The rest were all,
all on one fight. 5 guys see a low Spit and every one hunts it down, yourself being
alone again and have to watch the five other unfriendlies above you, preparing their knives.
I haven't seen any real good fights in Aces High, every time I was going to see one, another
bandit joined the fight and Head On'ed me.
In the beginning I thought it was my setup and the way I handle the game, I tried to improve
myself, but I got shot down all the time in freaking situations where you just think how'd
he made that one. I even thought it was a problem with my ACM skills etc, but right now
I realized that this game doesn't need any ACMs, just some luck and a good connections,
so you can head on shoot the other away. Yeah I know I said once
Head Ons aren't that bad, but meanwhile my attitude changed, they're just for freaking
losers, who want to see Victory X by Callsign X of The X. Man Crap, I am flying a P-38
seeing a slower N1K2 on my six spray and pray shooting from distance 900ft and see my
whole tail falling off after one hit, that really sux after 30 mins of flight and look for a good
and at least fair fight.
Another reason I leave is the community of Aces High, maybe some people may have
recognized that I don't talk much on ch#1 and ch#2 or post messages on the bbs.
Every single word you write in Aces High is analized by those guys and seen in a negative
way, so people can start flaming you again or insult you. The 2 years I flew on GS and AW
i haven't seen so much people talking so much stupid stuff and getting personal in such
a way like they do it in Aces High. You can't even write Hello on ch#1 without being
attacked by some of those guys.
People calling other people cheaters, whiners etc, are the people I don't want to see
in a community since most of the people in AH are like that, I better leave because
I can't force 500 ppl to leave a game.
I had bad days in Air Warrior and I got over 'em, but I am having 3 bad months meanwhile
and that really sux, so I better leave. Maybe I gonna fly in the H2H Arena from time to time,
at least there people really fight instead of type wars. Probably I gonna fly in the MA one day
too, but this is place full of people who aren't old enough for the Kindergarten.
This is no offense against you guys, cause I know The Damned are civilized and have lots
of Cool Heads!!!
Enjoy Aces High better than I do Guys...Have Fun
DmdCM/Chris
RWY
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(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
I'm sorry that he had a bad time in AH.
Don't know what to say about the community though. There are many people in the AH community who have very strong and very divergent opinions and many of us don't hesitate to press our view forward.
Mayhap we need to calm down and think about where the other guy is coming from. Certainly the frequent accusations of "whiner", "cheater", "dweeb", "cheerleader", ect. doesn't help the environment.
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We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother
Bring the Mosquito FB.MkVI Series 2 to Aces High!!!
Sisu
-Karnak
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nm
[This message has been edited by bowser (edited 05-02-2001).]
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Hope he changes his mind. Does he know you posted his email here? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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I've played all the simms as well and there is no difference in the on-line enviroment here. It just seems that memories are always fonder.
AH is very competative and filled with some really good pilots.....I can see it being frustrating for a casual player.
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For his first reason for leaving.... uhm.........................
His second reason though has some merit. There's a lotta roadkill on the airwaves..... I tend to tune it out and play the game though.
-SW
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SeaWulfe, that you??
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No foo.. it's Mista T! The Inspecta Collecta sell out! My TV show got cancelled and I couldn't catch no other programs to get onto cuz Hannibal was on that jazz again and ruined my chances for being popula again!
Yeah it's me. :-)
The last UBB crash porked my UBB account and I don't feel like emailing Ronni to get it fixed.
-SW
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I completely agree with Robert on what he said about the gangbanging tactic. I feel it is kinda lame that if you happen to fight one on one with someone, 6 of his buddies have to come in and tango also. I mean It may be my fault for wondering into the enemy territory, but how lame or lack of challenge it is for 6 guys to take out someone when they are already engaged. The ACM "escape window doesnt really apply here because You wind up having 6 guys on you and no room to run. Now 2 even 3 guys would make sense and be more realistic, but anything more would be a waste of that flights mission.
If you do happen to run when you vis other cons commin your way, your automatically a loser/running dweeb/or whatever name they might throw at ya.
What i would like to See is PEOPLE actually fight to SURVIVE, but not rack up 300 kills and 259 deaths!! This type of fighting is ultra firstperson Quake like and very UNrealistic as far as being a GOOD pilot.
I know that I cant change the way people do things, its up to them to play this simulation as realistcally or as fake as they intend.
Everyone should try and learn teamwork tactics, Rope a dope with your wingman is awesome, Good tumbles in an equal plane count is really a good stratgic fight. There should be more of these. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Enough of this Jibba Jabba! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Seriously, I am sorry to hear we upset someones delicate sensibilities. Sure, there are some differant personalities here. Some guys get hammered for things they say. But alot dont. Alot of the players are good guys, have mature discussions and share jokes.
One on one fights can be hard to find sometimes, or easy to find if you look. I seem to get into plenty, but of course I also am known to attack 6 cons by myself just to see if I can get any before they shred me.
Find the fun where you can, squelch any channel or player that bugs ya, and have fun.
Dago
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I agree that it sucks to be constantly teamed up upon, but acting as a loner in this game will generally get you killed if you're not an expert pilot.
If you go out alone in the wilderness, do you think only one animal will pick at your remains? Team up and be smart. A lot of us fly with our squads in the MA so there will always be groups on nmy fighters.
Vruth
412th
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The gangbanging is a result of the in flight AWACS datalink HSI display.
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RWY...
I feel bad that Chris left. I only spoke with him a few times, but he seemed like a real nice guy.
I see all the bantering and pointless name calling in the MA myself. I don't like it any more than you do, but unfortunately, it's just the way the MA will always be.
Gone are the days of old where people where kind and flew with respect for others. Why? Because, the game is no longer only for mature adults with money to spend $2.00/hour or more (from much older days).
These days, parents buy there ill tempered dweeb kids computers so they can play video games and keep out of the parent's hair. That coupled with the American attitude of "it's the other guy's fault, not mine, I don't have to be responsible or respectful" will keep downgrading the community for everyone.
I wish there was something that could be done to teach respect, but I doubt it will ever happen.
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Midnight CO
412th FG "Braunco Mustangs"[/i]
The 412th is actively seeking P-51 Mustang pilots. E-mail me for more information davidl@splusnet.com
"You tell them I'm coming.. And Hell's coming with me!" -Kurt Russel Tombstone
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Prolly got get my head bit off for this... but I've seen a few of the DMD-xxx squads kicking around. They use all the same tactics everyone else does, gangbanging, HOs, n1ki's, whatever. They don't seem terribly experienced in AH, so its not a case of dweebery more a case of they need to get a feel for things.
I find plenty of good fights, I also engage in plenty of multi-con fights and come out ok.
Sorry but this post smells of rotten fish to me.
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Well I can honestly say he is right. I came from FA and was labeled a vulcher. I do find some 1-1 fights but it turns quickly into a feeding frenzy. This map has promise though we have been finding more 1-1 or 2-2 fights. Depending on the plane I will even go 1-3. But as it stands now something has to be done to get rid of the monotony, I have slashed my time online hoping that would help. Maybe and a big maybe a axis vs allies room would help I dunno. Sorry for him to leave, and yes this BBS has gotten out of hand as of late. <S> if ever send me a private and we can arrange a place on the map for a 1-1 or 2-2 duel.
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(http://members.home.net/cgoolsby6/sachs1.jpg)
Verkaaft's mei Gwand `I foahr in himmel!
Sell my clothes I am going to Heaven!
[This message has been edited by AG Sachsenberg (edited 05-02-2001).]
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I can sympathize with much of what "Chris" says. Not all of it, but a lot of it.
J_A_B
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the frequency of gangbangs is a direct result of darbars and radar inflight.
your position is broadcast to all enemy aircraaft online at all times w darbars and when in range your exact position is given to all enemy aircraft.
solution:
remove inflight radar and sector darbars
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Hm, 9./JG 54 can usually find a few good several v2's or however many we're up. While gangbanging is not avoidable, it is possible to select fights that suit your temperament.
For a while on the old pre cv map, this was very doable. With the cv map, it's impossible, and with this mpa, although it is much to prefer compared to the cv map, the small front lines make those 1v1, 2v2, 2v3-4's more rare.
I must say that your ex squaddie probably didn't think his engagements through enough.
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Von Santa
Staffelkapitän 9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
"If you return from a mission with a victory, but without your Rottenflieger, you have lost your battle."
- D. Hrabak, JG 54 "Grünherz"
(http://stsantas.tripod.com/stsanta.jpg)
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As for all the whinning thats true. But for the gangbangs as he put it well thats what happens in war you help you fellow country men out not just leave them to it. Be real if you want 1 on 1 go to the ladder or H2H or dueling areana. You can get 1 on 1 fights in MA. And i am always getting shot down gets to me for a bit then take off and start again. i thing of myself as a moving target for the other players must have a bigger Icon then every 1 else they all seem to make a beline for me. lol
[This message has been edited by NHMadmax (edited 05-02-2001).]
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I think everyone has periods where they get disgusted, angry, or maybe even bored with the game.
Take a break. If something that just happened to you sends your blood pressure through the roof, log off or do something different for a while. Deep breaths and a scotch and soda work wonders for me.
I fly with a great bunch of guys in the evenings, U.S. They can testify to the fact that I blow up, get discouraged, whatever. Same thing happens with them. We're not in a squad, we just enjoy flying together and learning from each other.
All in all, we spend more time ribbing each other, and getting ribbed, than screaming about the *insert cannon-equipped plane here* that just shot us down from 1.5K away, or the goon potato who didn't tell anyone they were waiting 1 minute from the base, while 3 others auger in or ditch in order to grab a goon to make sure you capture a base.
We all have our pet peeves. You just gotta keep your perspective, and have some friends who understand when you blow a gasket. Your buddies help get you over these rough spots, just like you help them (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Strange, when I flew AW (and Robert you were a squaddie of mine there for a very long time) gangbanging was as prevalent as it is here.
Hey, I like a good 1 v 1 as much as anyone else, don't get me wrong. But when you fly in a main arena, whether it is AW, FA, WB, or AH, I find the style all very similar.
Pack tactics and gangbangs.
Sorry to see Chris go, but he certainly flew a different AW than I did.
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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
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What you really mean when you say "Gangbanging sucks" is "My SA sucks rocks and I hate when I get killed for it." When I get killed by 5-1 odds, I can ALWAYS think back a bit in the fight to a time where I should have disengaged and grabbed E, or extended or checked the map at least. Dying to being greatly outnumbered happens because you lose your SA, or you don't take the right steps to correct the situation when you are getting in a bad situation. If you don't want to get "gang banged", don't fly into those situations. It really is that simple. The most you have to do to engage in the gangbangs is switch to an E fighter or something with some speed and fly it properly. Then you can always work the furball, and extend and grab altitude when you need to and come back.
The radar works both ways. It is just as much a tool for SA to help you avoid bad odds as it is for others to find you and gang up on you. No inflight radar would just mean you couldn't find a fight easily, and that wouldn't be as much fun IMNSHO. It would also mean you could fly into very lopsided odds without knowing about it, and get gangbanged with no way to avoid it. Personally, I think taking away the in flight radar would make gang-banging ever worse.
The inflight radar is the BEST tool to AVOID getting gangbanged. Just look at the damned thing from time to time. If you see a tiny green bar in the sector you are entering, and a HUGE red bar, you are very outnumbered in that area. If you are willing to fly into that situation, don't whine about getting gangbanged. If you don't want to get ganged up on, the don't enter the area. It's REALLY simple.
Do what I do. Grab a BnZ bird, climb to 25k, and roll into that big blob of bad guys. Pick off the top one or two, and extend back towards your base. Sooner or later you'll drag a few to your side of the front, and the odds will even out or turn in your favour. Failing that, just fly smart and pick an appropriate plane, and you can work around the top and edges of a large group of enemies without too much trouble. Try it in the Pony, it excells at just this sort of work. If your a Loosewaffle type, the D9 or G-10 will do the same. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
It's a mega-player game guys. There will always be situations where you are heavily out numbered, it's part of the game. The trick is to either avoid those situations or deal with them and do the best you can. We have to tools to do it.
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Sean "Lephturn" Conrad - Aces High Chief Trainer
A proud member of the mighty Flying Pigs
http://www.flyingpigs.com
Check out Lephturn's Aerodrome (http://users.andara.com/~sconrad/) for AH articles and training info!
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Sean, I see you steered clear of his BBS comments. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Oh and BTW, it seems to me that DmdCM's real problem is his attitude. I play the same game, and get nothing but relaxation and fun from it the vast majority of the time. I get nothing but kind words and respect from the vast majority of the AH players online and on this BBS. It isn't always that way, and sometimes I get pissed too, but the problem when that happens is always MY attitude, not the game or the community.
I type "Hey folks!" almost everytime I enter the arena, and I'm always given a "Hey Leph!" by lots of folks in the game. It's extremelly rare for me to be on the receiving end of any insults online or in this BBS. Even on the odd occasion that this has happened, I've normally done or said something to contribute to pissing a guy off. There are always a very few vocal amazinhunks, but that's life for ya. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Sean "Lephturn" Conrad - Aces High Chief Trainer
A proud member of the mighty Flying Pigs
http://www.flyingpigs.com
Check out Lephturn's Aerodrome (http://users.andara.com/~sconrad/) for AH articles and training info!
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Not sure what ya mean Rip?
Erm... ok well I just put that second message on before I saw yours. That cover it?
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Sean "Lephturn" Conrad - Aces High Chief Trainer
A proud member of the mighty Flying Pigs
http://www.flyingpigs.com
Check out Lephturn's Aerodrome (http://users.andara.com/~sconrad/) for AH articles and training info!
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Yessir!
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IMO the Quake furballs and HOs in AH are caused by the lack of respect for one's own life!!!
A suggestion:
If you die:
-no kills recorded for you on that sortie
-no points recorded for you on that sortie
If you bail out:
-kills recorded
-no points
If you ditch:
-kills recorded
-1/2 of the points recorded
ONLY if you land the sortie:
-kills recorded
-points recorded
How many recless HOs would we see? How many times would 5 guys blow their alt to dive after a single enemy at low? How much more AH would be a sim and how much less AerialQuake? This would give a new meaning on shooting the chutes as well (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Lephturn, I strongly agree with your comments, except for one thing. I find your method for dealing with gangbanging very boring. It's either stay away from the gangbang, and not fight, or spend most of my time trying to get in position, make a few passes with a kill or two if I find the enemy sleeping, then run away. Also very boring IMO. It's more fun for me just to dive into the gangbang and try to make myself a difficult target. Last night, when the Knights were down to one base, I found it more fun just to stay around the base, and practice my gunnery shooting friendly planes.
So, yes, I find the MA very frustrating or boring, depending on how I try to deal with it. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
Friday night snapshots are great, but it's just one flight a week. Same with Hostile Shores (or any scenario I'm able to attend). Monday night furball fever is some of the most intense fun I've had in AH. The rest of the time I spend in AH is just burning me out. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
anRky
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The gangbanging is the result of the crappy strat/fighter hanger closures as is the bad attitiudes.
If a field is still open but "you are unable to take off from this field".... duh.... gangbang. No matter what the "dar" says... you have no idea what you will find when you get to a field... probly you just wasted a tank of gas and are so bored that you gangbang or.... you find nothing but osties or... you fly two sectors and end up arriving at a field defended by 10 guys butr the 10 green guys are spread over two sectors...
Also.... when a guy burns a whole tank or two of fuel and gets no action... dying is even more unpleasant and any real or imagined disadvantage is magnified.
contrast this with the fields where no one kills the FH for a while.... the fighters congregate and the numbers even out... everyone is busy and doesn't have time to complain.
lazs
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Originally posted by BlauK:
IMO the Quake furballs and HOs in AH are caused by the lack of respect for one's own life!!!
A suggestion:
If you die:
-no kills recorded for you on that sortie
-no points recorded for you on that sortie
If you bail out:
-kills recorded
-no points
If you ditch:
-kills recorded
-1/2 of the points recorded
ONLY if you land the sortie:
-kills recorded
-points recorded
How many recless HOs would we see? How many times would 5 guys blow their alt to dive after a single enemy at low? How much more AH would be a sim and how much less AerialQuake? This would give a new meaning on shooting the chutes as well (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Wouldn't really matter, because there'd still be some people who wouldn't care if their kills counted, as long as they got to shoot someone down.
Only way to force more people to care about their virtual pilot's life all the time is to have some sort of punishment (can't fly for X minutes, can't up from the same base as before, can't up in the same plane as before, etc.) for dying. This isn't a good idea because it does "force" people into a play style they don't want (this is a bad idea if you want people to pay $30/month to play your game.) Some people enjoy the "quakefest" style of play in AH. That's fine, it's their $30/month (or their free 2 weeks) and they should be able to play their way in the MA. The solution to this is to have two persistant arenas. Keep the MA as it is now, and throw up an alternative arena with more penalties for dying, possibly even having forced plane sets (Historical Arena baby!!). This solution isn't viable at the moment due to there only being around 250 people on in peak times. Hopefully one day there will be enough active subscribers to warrant a persistent 2nd arena with a different playstyle. Until then, you just have to make the best of the MA for yourself. If you don't like overwhelming odds, don't get yourself into that situation. Heck, that's realistic and historic!! If your life mattered, and you saw you were outnumbered 6 to 1, you'd run! If you don't like constant HO's, avoid them and shoot the bastard down! Or make him miss and shoot him down on the HO! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
sorry if this makes little to no sense, I haven't had lunch yet, and I'm starving! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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I completely understand this fellow's point of view, figure the old saying "to each his own" is in order. I get a little irritated when I see 5-6 v 1 but not because it's a gangbang, to me it show's how goofy the extra 4 or 5 pileit's are...then eventually I find myself BEING one of those gangbangin goofballs <slaps forhead>, it's the nature of the game. (Incindentally Leph, it doesn't have to be "My SA sucks Rocks" issue, not everyone is like you). I find myself taking the same stance on HO's...I HATE when other's EVEN TRY to HO me, Then I slap myself again when I find myself doing it...how many of us can say we don't do the same thing when the need arises?? YOU CAN?...liar. Some folks just get too involved and frustrated. When I do, I use that neat "Quit" feature, works wonder's when this killer game becomes opposite what it should be, fun.
SwampRat
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anRky,
I'm not saying you have to deal with bad odds that way, I'm just pointing out one way to do it. If you want, dive in with a turnfighter and TnB till' ya puke! Just don't complain that you got "gangbanged" when you get killed... that's what happens when the odds are not in your favour. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) Also, I'll point out that what I do is not "make a few passes and get a kill or two if the enemy is sleeping". What I do is take an E fighter, get to the fight with an E advantage, and work with it. I target the guy with the most E, and work him with good E fighting tactics until he is either dead, or dives to the safety of his buddies. Then I pick on the next victim. Many times I just end up in great energy fights one after another, either working my way down the furball, or engaging new folks that arrive with E to threaten me.
SwampRat,
I know not everybody is "like me". My point is that the tools are there for everybody to KNOW what the odds are roughly. The sector counters are available to all. If you don't pay attention to them, that's bad SA in my book. If you are flying very close to an enemy airbase with active fighter hangars, you can expect to be outnumbered as your buddies get shot down and the enemy just launches more and more. Not realizing that the odds will turn when fighting at the enemy field is bad SA in my book. Bottom line, you almost always know the odds going into the fight if you look. If you still choose to fight that way fine. Just don't complain about "gangbanging" when you knowingly entered that situation.
Do I sometimes "gangbang"? Of course, why wouldn't I? The only reason I can see not to gangbang is to counter other threats. If we just wiped out 10 enemy planes with 20 of our guys, joining the 8 guys chasing that last La7 around isn't a good idea. I'll take that time to grab some altitude, check my fuel and ammo, and get ready to meet those guys we just killed when they arrive in a few minutes REALLY pissed off at us for killing 'em. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) Now if we just took their base, and the next one is 2 sectors away and I'm low on gas and ammo? Hell yeah, I'll dive in on the last con or two and take a whack at them with the other 10 guys. I won't feel a bit bad about it either. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Now a note about HO's. I LOVE it when somebody tries to HO me. It's great, it hands me both E and angle advantages at the merge when they try it. I only get pissed when I screw up and they nail me in the HO. That's natural. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) I just try to check myself up, beat my ego down, and realize I died because I SCREWED UP, not because the other guy did anything bad. I don't feel bad about taking an HO shot either. The only reason I don't do it most times is because it's a bad risk. However, when somebody in a C.202 lines up HO with my P-47, I'll explode him HO with glee and laugh as I fly through the explosion. I'll do whatever is in my best interests. When I don't HO and don't gangbang I'm not trying to "be nice" or anything silly like that, it's jut not the smart thing to do in that situation.
I'm no different than anyone else though. I sometimes do stupid stuff, get frustrated, etc. I busted my headset one night when I did something particularly stupid and got killed, then ripped my headset off so violently I busted it in half. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) Usually I'll just exit and give myself an attitude check. However, I've been around this here block enough times to know that the problem is me and my attitude, not the game or the other players. I die because I screw up, regardless of how badly I want to blame it on something other than my own failure. As much as we all hate to admit it, 99.995% of the time we die because we screwed up. Ya need to repeate that quote from TopGun: "The Defense Department regrets to inform you that your sons are dead because they were stupid." It's tough to admit that to yourself, but it's the truth for all of us.
SwampRat it sounds like you have this part wired as well. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) If your frustrated and mad, just log off for a while. You'll come back later more relaxed and have more fun if you do.
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Sean "Lephturn" Conrad - Aces High Chief Trainer
A proud member of the mighty Flying Pigs http://www.flyingpigs.com (http://www.flyingpigs.com)
Check out Lephturn's Aerodrome (http://users.andara.com/~sconrad/) for AH articles and training info!
[This message has been edited by Lephturn (edited 05-03-2001).]
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Lephturn:
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If you want, dive in with a turnfighter and TnB till' ya puke! Just don't complain that you got "gangbanged" when you get killed... that's what happens when the odds are not in your favour. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Diving into a gangbang isn't what I *want* to do all the time, but more often than not, it's about all there *is* to do.
And I never complain in the MA about getting gangbanged. Sometimes I ask the other side on Ch1 to only send 4 or 5 after me, instead of the whole 10 or 15, but I don't expect them to listen or comply. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) If I ever say anything else to the enemy in the MA, it's either a taunt, to try to get them to attack me, or occasionally a 'fun fight' or 'good kill' after the fight if it's deserved.
I *do* come in here sometimes and express my frustration when the only fights I can find every night are gangbangs (whether its my side or the other doing the gangbanging).
And whatever you call it, spending 30 or 40 minutes a night of my hour or so of fighting time climbing over the enemy, because there are almost always 5 or more of them to the one of me isn't what I call fun. Neither is flying with my countrymen when there are very often 5 of them to every enemy.
You are right about the attitude part. Sadly, it's the inability to find a fun fight(FUN, not fair, not easy, and I don't even have to come close to winning it) that gives me a negative attitude. I take a break, come back feeling much better, then the negative attitude comes back when all I find is either a gangbang, or I run my tanks dry looking for a fight.
anRky
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I must admit AH makes me very agressiv too (90% of the time). Never ever before had i hated my oppponents as much as in this game.
To be jumped by 5 ennemies isn't what pisses me off, but beeing jumped by one N1K2, one Lag7, one Spit, one 190 and on top of that one Chog, makes me wanna pull out my gun, capture an Airliner, fly over to find you, and shoot you on the spot.
Man, couple of weeks ago i was clobbered by 5 Mustangs in my 109, and man, while hanging on the chute I had tears in my eyes. What a beautifull kill and i was honored.
Maybe it is because of this political correct Bishop/Rooks/Knight thing. In EAW, the sim i played before online on the Zone, we had all this proud Allies Squads, flying against proud Axis Squads. Everybody stuck to their 2 or 3 beloved a/c, and we had no hard feelings for our ennemies. I know AH is a total different concept, but think about it what would happen, if you choose a side with a clear defined planeset. Maybe it would move the focus from what-shall-i fly-in-here-to-kill-kill-kill, over to a very importend thing i think we have lost here in AH: The Roleplay.
Cheers
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For almost 3/4 of the total time I have spent at AH, I've been a lonewolfer, most of the time on a plane not able to get out of trouble by speed, the Fw190A5. Even though I am again in a squad, I still fly more lonewolf sorties than with wingman. I think because lonewolf tactics are now part of my way of flying.
Anyway, the Main arena is full of enemy planes who will dive on you, hit you until you are blown apart and then they will rip apart the remnants just in case. And they wont go one on one but en masse. Why should they go alone?.
I can tell that I find still lots of 1 on 1s, not so much as I'd like, but still enough. And I can tell you that if you dont want to see multiple enemy cons screwing up your lonely plane, then fly with a wingman.
To leave AH because the MA is a vulchfest, and you cant stand it, is IMO a good reason. IF you cant stand a vulchfest, the MA is not a place you will like, because since Tour1 (when I first came here) until this TOD, it has remained this way.
[This message has been edited by R4M (edited 05-03-2001).]
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Interesting. I read what Robert's mate had to say and wondered if I were still in the AWMV arena (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I came to AH along with my squadmates from Air Warrior looking for a sim that wouldn't continue to let us down. I/we are not surprised by what we have seen so far. Much of what robert wrote I have found to be true, some of it though, is in the eyes of the beholder.
Why would I be surprised by a competitive environment that brings out the best and, as we all know, sometimes the worst in our competitors? Gangbanging? Hell, I've seen gangbanging which left me both disappointed and feeling sorry for my nmez. There is always a bright side though. Those dweebs who would dive down (giving up E) to jump all over one low and slow nme, aren't the brightest bulb in the bin. Consequently, they make themselves targets and vulnerable.
If I want a one v one environment, then I ought to go to a dog fighting arena where that can be done. In any main arena there are going to be those who will do anything for a kill, and why not? They are paying for the thrill just as the rest of us are.
Fortunately, for most pilits this is not the way of the fighter pilot (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
This is what I do know:
That the main things is to have a sim that WON'T let you down.
That will continue to improve and evolve
That will listen to the customers, and have respect for them
That will have some kind of standards and provide a challenging and enjoyable experience.
All of the other stuff can be personal and is peripheral stuff.
If a guy goes on CH1 to taunt me, I can ignore him/her or give it back depending on my mood (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) I suppose this is part of the service I am paying for (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I for one am enjoying this new place, and am trying to learn to keel all over again in a new place (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) I am looking forward to the experience, which is why I chose to pay to play. If I don't like a movie, I leave, and Robert's former squaddie seems to have reached that conclusion for himself; it just wasn't trippin his trigger anymore. I hope he finds that environment he is looking for.
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Hehe, I know Anarky from AW, as an nme and also as a group mate in a scenario. AWers are accustomed to fighting, and the way the AW arena became, the fights degenerated to two countries ganging one, practically all the time. It became a place where what you learned in AW, if you started flying before the AW gene pool degenerated, was no longer true. Flying with strat and use of acm and good SA gave way to hordes of dweebs who flew badly, had no SA, and would pork an undefended base sooner than have a fight with an nme. It drove many away from that place. For some I guess, it is kinda disappointing to see some of the same things happening in AH. To add perspective here though, there are an awful lot of folks flying in here now, from other sims like WB and AW and others. It wouldn't surprise me to find out that the alt monkees from AW hadn't established themselves here in AH (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
This is the way they fly folks, and with the increase in numbers here, there are going to be some serious adjustments to be made on everyones part.
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anRky,
Part of this is just the nature of a mega-player online simulation. One of the reasons I play this game is because I can BnZ a 30 plane furball! That means that sometimes, you are going to get times where it is tough to find a low numbers fight. However much of the time when there is big numbers in an area on one side, the other side will put up big numbers as well and a huge fight ensues. That fight will ebb and flow, and at times one side or the other will have numerical superiority in one local area. The trick to it is to predict when that's going to happen, and position yourself to be around friendlies, be higher, or work the edges where there are only a couple of cons.
I rarely have trouble finding a fight, a reasonable one even. The only time I do, is when some B17 or Lanc flies over at 20k and dumps the fighter hangars... be it ours or theirs. That can ruin a good furball. Other than that, I can almost always find a decent fight, even as a lone wolf. There are things you do to arrange that, such as working around the perimeter of a big fight and finding nice 1v1's and such with the guys trying to sneak out and grab some altitude.
However, for a variety of reasons, there will be times that you may have trouble finding just the type of fight you want. That's just the nature of the online flight sim beast. It's a quickly changing, almost organic environment. If you find yourself in the position of not finding what you want, you can also try the Dueling arena. Shout out on CH1 and grab some like-minded folks for some fun 1v1 or free for all stuff in the dueling arena. Or head to the training arena and work on 1v1's with different planes and such. Of course there is alwas the H2H rooms, where you will find much smaller fights that might suite your mood.
Do whatever you have to, to have fun. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Sean "Lephturn" Conrad - Aces High Chief Trainer
A proud member of the mighty Flying Pigs
http://www.flyingpigs.com
Check out Lephturn's Aerodrome (http://users.andara.com/~sconrad/) for AH articles and training info!
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anarky... you are correct and no one can tell you that you are having fun when you are not. lep likes to fly a certain way and does not care if he spends an hour with no action so to him... there is nothing wrong with the way the "strat/sim" is layed out.. indeed, he can find more action than he wants.
You, like me and a lot of others, feel that we could be better spending our time somewhere else if all we are doing is climbing and hiding. For us... the hour or so we spend on line had better be action packed and with some parity or.. we can go work on our hot rods or clean guns or geeze... talk to the old lady... anything is better than droning around doing nothin! The fites need a reason to exist tho for a lot of folk. If the fields were easire to capture but had fighters available till they died then the fights would concentrate more near the front line fields and the "war" would move more rapidly. Those who "e" fight at great altitude could still do as they please unafected. Win/win.
lazs
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I used to think that it was one big gangbang and that it was impossible to get some good one on one action.But then I realized I was always flying into a sector with multi con bars.Try flying to an enemy base with no cons.Take a drop tank and usually an enemy will up within minutes.Stay your distance and let him get some alt while flying away from ack.Ask enemy con on chat if he's rdy and voila! 1 on 1..And if you survive,he is more than likely to re-up and try again.Be sure to be a polite guest to his airspace though.. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Leph, Oh everyone treats you with respect, and it's fun to fly here? Hmmm
They don't even treat Hitech with respect
Fun to fly here? Yes perhaps, if you have an idea of fun that is radically different from the accepted standreds of normal human beings
All of you grand old heads please cut the crap, Maybe if you would all stop endorsing the worst behavior I've ever seen as "Just the way things are, you should have seen XXX- game back in the days" I did, it wasn't and it shouldn't be now.
A positively grand game with one minor flaw,
some of the people you have to share it with have the manners of a doorknob in a bordello.
And in a tip of the hat to the "if you can't take it get out" crowd. Don't see that one in the TOS, so why don't you get out, and take your foul smelling friends with you.
(the last part was analogy Leph, not aimed at you, I won't ever make a personal attack on the BB again, It doesn't solve things)
Seriously, If anyone here really truly thinks that things haven't gotten absurdly out of hand, then I offer it is you that needs to step back and take a breather, because you are in too deep.
Wilton (pzvg) Stewman
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Whilst I can sympathise with your viewpoint Lazs, I simply cannot understand it.
You fly US evenings right? With upwards of 150 online? And you cannot find a fight?
I fly Australian evenings. We have, on average, about 30 online. And I can ALWAYS find a fight.
Maybe its just the US guys who spend so much time running and hiding?
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Jekyll
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
Aces High Training Corps
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maybe jekyl... I have no way of knowing.
I do think that one of the problems is that having all those guys up is no guarentee that you will find parity. The trend during these hours seems to be attacking in huge groups. if the field has recently lost it's lean to's (fighter hangers) then you will be fighting an ever diminishing force of fighters and/or a buttload of osties. If you go to a sector alone, with what looks like parity, there is no guarentee that by the time you get there you will not face 5/1 odds. It is allmost certain that you will. maybe with less guys it is easier to know where everyone is?
lazs
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LOL lazs, I don't normally have any more than about an hour at a time to fly in the main. I certainly don't want to spend an hour or mour with no action, and I don't have to. Proceding the way I mentioned above doesn't take much time, and it's often pretty action packed. Not quite as much as if I dove into the fray with a Zeke I'm sure, but plenty of fun.
Heck, I don't think I go more than 5-10 minutes MAX without finding a scrap. It's just not that tough. And lazs, your definition of E fighting needs work my friend. Just because you choose a plane that excells in E fighting doesn't mean you spend all of your time climbing and running. Far from it. Although there are some things that could maybe be changed to improve the arena, I don't think your charaterization of the arena is one i agree with. I just don't see that when I'm online.
pzvg, I'm just relating my experience. I don't get called names in the arena very often, it's quite rare. Occasionally there is some dweeb mouthing off, but a quik squelch fixes that, but honsetly I haven't used a squelch in months. I'm not saying there aren't some folks with questionable characters around in the game, I'm just relating my experience. If somebody is acting that badly and I'm around, I'll just grab a few screenshots and forward them on to HTC privately. I recommend you do the same. Rest assured, if they are acting in a manner that is harmful to the community, HTC will do something about it.
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Sean "Lephturn" Conrad - Aces High Chief Trainer
A proud member of the mighty Flying Pigs
http://www.flyingpigs.com
Check out Lephturn's Aerodrome (http://users.andara.com/~sconrad/) for AH articles and training info!
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"It's a mega-player game guys. There will always be situations where you are heavily out numbered, it's part of the game. The trick is to either avoid those situations or deal with them and do the best you can. We have to tools to do it." copied from lepthurn
I agree with ya Lep, totally. It is you own responsibility.
Greetings,
JG5FaBi.
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As for getting killed in a furball, or one on one. The fact is that you placed yourself in a position to be shot down. No ones fault but your own....fact of life in virtual or real world flying. So if you're shot down, don't get po'd at that guy that shot you. Get po'd at yourself for placing yourself in that position.
As for the whining etc. That is going to happen no matter in which online communtiy you happen to participate. Same with the occaisional insult. Whining or hurling insults is never warranted. Best thing to do is to consider the source of the insult or whine, and disregard them. Whining and insulting other players just displays to everyone online the level of maturity of the one whining or insulting. Again, consider the source, disregard, have fun and enjoy yourself.
Also, I flew AW a very long time and one fact is clear. The level of skill in AH is much greater enlarge then the level of skill I confronted in AW in the many years I flew there. Get used to it, get better, and have fun.
Hajo