Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: lemur on March 22, 2001, 03:13:00 PM
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More like the end of an epoch, actually.
Sad to say it, but it looks like EA is shutting down Kesmai studios. For those of you who don't know, Kesmai was the company behind the very first Massively multiplayer online sim: Air Warrior.
In fact, many of the great talents behind the current crop of MMP sims are allumni of Kesmai. And certainly a lot of players in here can trace their roots back to AW (I started playing DOS AW about 7 years ago)
While Kesmai isn't officially 'shut down' as of yet, they just laid off a whole slew of the 'old time' talent that had worked on AW for years. And I've been through enough mergers in my time to know this does mean the beginning of the end of Kesmai.
So, a moment of silence and a big <S>
~Lemur
p.s. Westy, if you say "I told you so" I'll hunt you down and vulch you until you cry (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum4/HTML/001726.html (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum4/HTML/001726.html)
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p.s. Westy, if you say "I told you so" I'll hunt you down and vulch you until you cry (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I wouldn't do that, honestly. That's for the small in heart to do. My speculation a year ago wasn't a wish but just calling things out as possibilites as I saw them.
To the friends I knew that may be coming over here? Welcome!!
And to those who cannot or won't be? For with no AW-IV on the horizon who knows when ....(3mb mpg) we''ll meet again (http://www.townisp.com/~jugdriver/salute.mp3)
-Westy
[This message has been edited by Westy (edited 03-22-2001).]
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Hence the " (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)" Westy.
I have a lot more respect for you than the ostriches over in BigWeek who refused to see the world outside of AW.
Look on the bright side, with the whole AH vs. AW religious debate rendered moot, you can hang out in BW again.
Or not (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
~Lemur
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Tis a sad sad day (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
SALUTE Moggy & GreyEagle !!
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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
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Old shirts, Lucky socks, your kids first shoes...Air Warrior.
All things that may be hard to let go, but life goes on.
The sad thing is that Kesmai is not that old, and unlike an old pair of socks, they could have rebuilt it.
I know many of us tried our best to warn them, and I also hate to see the end.
I'm sure a company like EA sees the "Old Dogs" as washed out because they can't learn new tricks. Well, I don't believe it. I think it's more like the dogs got comfortable with their kennel and started biting the had that fed them. They thought they were the master.
All to often this is the way successful companies end.
But, I'd bet that many will follow in the same path even knowing the possible demise.
If I were in this business (any business for that matter), I would be saying to myself:
Tom, don't let ONE of your customer's complaints fall on deaf ears.
Do EVERYthing necessary to fix the problems, even if it means a total rebuild.
Offer restitution for any service agreement you can not fulfill, and DON'T let your company grow out of your reach. Tom, you drive this company, and you can not drive if you can't reach the wheel!
Aces High is IMHO the best sim available, but I know in my heart that other sims will come, and they will be better. I just hope that Dale and the gang can reach the wheel when that time comes. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Sky Viper
(http://www.siteviper.com/54sq/bbsigs/rfd.jpg) (http://flyingaces.bizland.com/54sq/main.htm)
[This message has been edited by Sky Viper (edited 03-22-2001).]
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This is indeed a loss. AW was the fist online flight sim I ever played, and I had spent many an hour cruising the virtual skies looking for one more victory over DD or Moggy. I eventually moved on because of the dearth of play in the more realistic arenas, but I never lost my love for the game.
The last I had checked it hadn't had a major update in many years, and was showing its age very clearly.
But in its day, there was no equal. Eventually, its legend will fade, and the initials AW will lose their now well known meaning, its legend will fade, and all I'll have are my memories, and an old bill for $6/hour, that at the time, was worth every single cent.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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Why did aw die?
I know why. The guys who ran it!
Every time i interact with a AH guys i think respect. I never thought this about any of the aw guys. Too bad.
Except for whels i must add. His head never got to big. He was always a help.
EYE
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Old software doesn't die, it 'just fades away'.
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It has gone to siliconheaven,,,,the same place all the calculators go,,,,,siiiighhhh.
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It's sad to see it go, like many here I started my sim career on aw dos, but the fact is they refused to keep current. I'm suprised they've lasted this long. IMO This will be good for the sim community, I'd like to see all of the old diehards over here as one big happy flight sim community again. The future has some really cool stuff in store for flight simm enthusiasts, every year it gets better and better. Here's to looking forward (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
CRASH
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Thanks Lemur. Wish I could give ya a noogy to show you I feel likewise (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif) When it comes to those <cough> discussions-turned-sh&tslings on "BigWeek" I got to auto-defend.
-Westy
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I'd like to see all of the old diehards over here as one big happy flight sim community again.
Sounds like a few of you guys with ties in AW should do a bit of marketing and get your buddies over here (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Originally posted by Beurling:
Why did aw die?
I know why. The guys who ran it!
Every time i interact with a AH guys i think respect. I never thought this about any of the aw guys. Too bad.
Except for whels i must add. His head never got to big. He was always a help.
EYE
Whels is a great guy, friend and foe alike, though I prefer him on Knits!
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Sounds like a few of you guys with tiesin AW should do a bit of marketing and get your buddies over here
Those that saw the light already moved to here or WB's. While a bunch always held out hope, offering their $10/mo as a sacrificial offering in the hopes it would help bring AW4 sooner, there's not much left out of that group of folks. Some more are coming here (or WB's) but for the rest? Either they do not log online enough to fly for $30/mo, can't afford $30/mo period, PC won't let them run much more than AW in "2D" or they're the real hard-hardcore and they've decided to go down with the good ship AirWarrior.
-Westy
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Originally posted by Revvin:
Sounds like a few of you guys with ties in AW should do a bit of marketing and get your buddies over here (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I know of one big group rounding up their sheep and velcro pants in order to bring the flock over...
Damned Xanax
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Hmmm.... seems like stomping on a dead horse, but AW client and server software becoming abandonware would be a very cool thing.
Would be good for a laugh and would make a great recuitment too for the newer online sims.
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Hmmm.
Would be good for a laugh and would make a great recuitment too for the newer online sims.
Yeah, let's all laugh at those poor folks who sweated and slaved over the granddaddy of all multi-player flight sims.
Pinhead.
Y'know what I'm going to miss most about AW?
The community.
Given your comment, I'd trade any one of my old buds on AW for a dozen people like you.
~Lemur
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Hiya;
to Westy and many others: I was threatened with termination if I continued on BigWeek in our lil flamewar of a few months ago.. now that threat is moot .. LOL.
I bought the company line; hook, line, and sinker. You have little idea how it felt to have the skill to model kick bellybutton planes, trains, targets.. you name it.. and be told to do a chair .. or a table .. for other games .. anything but what I was hired for originally, lead artist for Air Warrior. Watching months go by with Air Warrior buried behind so many truly worthless 'projects' one after another.. adding up to years of wasted time that we just could not afford.
One of my many mistakes was waiting so long, hoping sooner or later that I would finally be allowed to do what I can do. I mean, EA has studios world wide.. they should know what it takes to do a quality product.
It takes more than just one guy who can make kick bellybutton airplanes.
I wanted very much to see a studio grow that could handle box quality production in a timely manner.
Want is good.. it's a motivator (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I still want it all. Perhaps in another 'studio.'
Air Warrior is dead. So many reasons why.
It will be the 'Pong' of combat sims when the world has moved on to the 'Unreal Tournament' version unless changes happen at EA that I just do not beleive will.
I know I did my best, there, in every way I was allowed to ..to make Air Warrior shine.
Air Warrior for windows rocked.
Air Warrior 2 ..high density targets and huge terrains .. an opening animation that raised goose bumps the first time I saw it with the music..it rocked.
Air Warrior 3.. first texture mapped online combat sim ..with a P-51D that you could see *was* a P-51D, even down to the panel lines in the texture map.. it rocked big time.
That plane was 290 polys. I smile at what I was able to do on a P-90.
Dale asked me long ago when I would be ready to work for him.
-shrugs off 6 years of KesCo-
I am ready.
-GE
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Even a Mushroom will eventually see a light.
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Hello GE, I still have your Business card in my wallet from our meet at the Houston CON. I was amazed at what you did, and a fan.
Keep the faith.
NUTTZ
Originally posted by Grayeagle:
Hiya;
to Westy and many others: I was threatened with termination if I continued on BigWeek in our lil flamewar of a few months ago.. now that threat is moot .. LOL.
I bought the company line; hook, line, and sinker. You have little idea how it felt to have the skill to model kick bellybutton planes, trains, targets.. you name it.. and be told to do a chair .. or a table .. for other games .. anything but what I was hired for originally, lead artist for Air Warrior. Watching months go by with Air Warrior buried behind so many truly worthless 'projects' one after another.. adding up to years of wasted time that we just could not afford.
One of my many mistakes was waiting so long, hoping sooner or later that I would finally be allowed to do what I can do. I mean, EA has studios world wide.. they should know what it takes to do a quality product.
It takes more than just one guy who can make kick bellybutton airplanes.
I wanted very much to see a studio grow that could handle box quality production in a timely manner.
Want is good.. it's a motivator (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I still want it all. Perhaps in another 'studio.'
Air Warrior is dead. So many reasons why.
It will be the 'Pong' of combat sims when the world has moved on to the 'Unreal Tournament' version unless changes happen at EA that I just do not beleive will.
I know I did my best, there, in every way I was allowed to ..to make Air Warrior shine.
Air Warrior for windows rocked.
Air Warrior 2 ..high density targets and huge terrains .. an opening animation that raised goose bumps the first time I saw it with the music..it rocked.
Air Warrior 3.. first texture mapped online combat sim ..with a P-51D that you could see *was* a P-51D, even down to the panel lines in the texture map.. it rocked big time.
That plane was 290 polys. I smile at what I was able to do on a P-90.
Dale asked me long ago when I would be ready to work for him.
-shrugs off 6 years of KesCo-
I am ready.
-GE
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GE! *Truly* sorry about what EA did and I hope all is put back to right very soon!
-Westy
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GE!!! Damned good to "see" you here!!!
Let me know if you come up my way any time in the future. Same for Moggy.
StuB
stub@nova.org
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Things will work out, Grey.
Know how I know? ;-)
-DoK
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I played AW since the summer of '96 and made many friends there. It was my first online sim and I will always have fond memories.
Nomde
63rd FS, 56th FG
"Zemke's Wolfpack"
(http://nomdegurre.tripod.com/signature.jpg)
"God loves the 56th cause we keep Heaven filled"
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Geez....
Even StuB is here?
Next thing you know, even Slug is gonna show up.
MD
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GreyEagle, sorry to hear what happened bud (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
I wish you and Moggy the best of luck. And I hope everything works out for my other friends that still work for EA; Quarters, Mage, Zephyr( he is a non-AW guy), and all the rest. If there is anythign I can do guys.. just ask.
I haven't flown AW much for the past 2.5 years, I have been in WB's and now AH much more, but I kept my account open in respect to my friends and a hope for the future. Today I canceled that account. And I encourage anyone who still has an account there to do the same.
And I made it very clear why I canceled my account.
EA.com doesn't deserve my money anymore, and I won't support their screwed up agenda with my money. About the same reasons I canceled my UO account for. Bastards.
Good Luck my friends, and I hope everything works out for you. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
[This message has been edited by Vermillion (edited 03-24-2001).]
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Heheheh
Beware, all glory is fleeting. Chairs. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Cya up...Braz
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Originally posted by lemur:
Hmmm.
Yeah, let's all laugh at those poor folks who sweated and slaved over the granddaddy of all multi-player flight sims.
Pinhead.
Y'know what I'm going to miss most about AW?
The community.
Given your comment, I'd trade any one of my old buds on AW for a dozen people like you.
~Lemur
Lemur...
You obviously misunderstood my comment.
After reading it again I can understand why. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
FWIW:
I flew AW for a long time btw so I KNOW what the community is like and I am sad to see ANY online sim go...Period.
When I said "good for a laugh" I meant that without support it wil become more 'dated' but will be FUN to go back to occasionally, if it became 'abandonware'
(I still have a copies of AW for Windows, AW2 and AW3 on a CD for that exact reason.)
If it became "abandonware" (both the client and server software) it would then be very accessable and therefore a great way to expose people to online flight sims. I think we all would benefit from this.
I also think it would be a huge shame to see AW just disappear after the legacy it created and many of us enjoyed.
For that matter...
An even better scenario would be the source code to be released so that AW could be improved the way Greyeagle and other members of the team wanted to. Without corporate 'considerations' :P to worry about.
GPL license software is created with just such a mindset, And it is all the better for it.
'Target For Tonight' is an example of a free flightsim project that is 'by simmers-for simmers' and for that reason it has fantastic potential.
What would Falcon 4 be like without the people who hacked the code and improved it when the publisher :P didn't care ?
Am I laughing....NO...Not one bit.
This event makes me all the more angry with the corporate mindset that makes this happen.
Snoopi
[This message has been edited by Snoopi (edited 03-25-2001).]
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Thanks Warriors for the kind words..
Off to download AH's latest.
Perhaps I will see ye up in a bit.
-GE
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Originally posted by Grayeagle:
Thanks Warriors for the kind words..
Off to download AH's latest.
Perhaps I will see ye up in a bit.
-GE
Yeah, just be careful GE, the flightmodel sux !
<G>
Immel (just signed up fer a couple months)
[This message has been edited by Immel (edited 03-26-2001).]
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As 'Immel' ????
-Westy
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Originally posted by Westy:
As 'Immel' ????
-Westy
No, I'm coming out as 'Mary-Ann' .
<rolls eyes>
Immel ;-)
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Ask a silly question..... get a Dutch answer (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Silly poepl!
-W