Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: OZkansas on December 29, 2002, 10:09:41 AM
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I understand that the UN inspectors are being thrown out of N Korea. What is the UN doing to stop N Korea from violating UN resolutions? How come the talk seems to be that the US must act to stop N Korea yet in Iraq the US dare not to act alone? I am confused as to the UN role in stopping A-bomb proliferation. Is it up to the American taxpayer to police the world or will the world back the UN?
This is a chance for countries like Germany and France and the rest of Europe to act and show just where they stand. It's about time they provide some leadership in the world if they feel they should benefit from UN actions. It's time to get off the sidelines and stop the carping and whining and act. Will Europe get off its butt, I bet they won't!
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its a ploy to get more cash. we are overextended and cant fight them. and europe generaly thinks we have a mad man at the helm. like they are gonna help under thos circumstances.
p.s. it will take basicaly everything we have to win over them. and china wont let us. (an yea they can stop us easy) no win situation.
Bush cut off their oil they need power so they turned on a power plant. now they are evil ? you are a republican no?
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Yeah, N. Korea can be trusted with a Nuclear Power Plant :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by lord dolf vader
Bush cut off their oil they need power so they turned on a power plant. now they are evil ? you are a republican no?
Why was the free fuel oil cut off?
From the BBC: "The Bush Administration confronted the North Koreans with new evidence that showed that they had broken their agreement of 1994 to freeze all nuclear-related activities."
Oh.. wait... it's all lies, conspiracy and black helicopters. I forgot.
The peace-loving people of North Korea have broken no agreements and have no nukes and no ongoing nuke weapons programs.
They are the beneficiaries of an incredibly successful political and economic system and are actually only starting up the reactor to supply electricity to their starving bretheren in South Korea.
BTW. there's quite a few Democratic Congressmen that are very concerned about the leader of these peace-loving peoples of North Korea and his non-existent nuke weapons program.
Gotta go... 'copters overhead.
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Toad I'm sure you heard Bush is Hitler reincarnate and is trying to take over the world... :D
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talkin to a wall dosen't appeal to me. but here goes
they already have nukes.
they aren't evil as your president says. (I wont claim him)
the deal was oil to support them till we built them new safe power plants,we didnt meet the deal we made so they started their power plants. its that simple " free oil my bellybutton "
the majority of the rest of the world thinks bush is and out of control idiot. they arent gona help us with the "make the arms manufacturers rich war".
you acting all superior about it just confirms how out of touch you guys are.
this wont change your oppinion nothing will change a domatic fool but the future character assasination that is part and parcel to your typical arguments will hopefully be transparent to non brainwashed readers.
love and kisses.
ohh and i take it you are a republican, noticed you never got around to answering a direct question, go figgure.
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N Koreans are up to no good, I just watched "Die Another Day". But Halle Berry is so hot, yum yum chocolate...
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Towd,
Powell spoke on Meet the Press this morning:
...What we found out, though, is that within a few years of agreeing to cap that program, the North Koreans began another program to enrich uranium. We discovered that over the last six or seven months. Our intelligence sources told us this was happening....
...In Brunei at the end of July, I asked to see the foreign minister of North Korea. We had a pleasant conversation. I told him that the United States wanted to engage with North Korea, we wanted to help them, we wanted to help their people, but we had to deal with these issues of proliferation and weapons of mass destruction. He understood that.
A few weeks later, we sent in Assistant Secretary Kelly, presented them with the evidence of this new capability, and they initially denied it and then they acknowledged it. So they acknowledge that they had violated the agreed framework and were putting in place another way of developing nuclear weapons...
For emphasis:they acknowledge that they had violated the agreed framework and were putting in place another way of developing nuclear weapons
So we're just supposed to look the other way? THEY violated the agreement Towd, not us.
The North Koreans themselves admit they violated the agreement. YEARS AGO, THEY VIOLATED THE AGREEMENT. YEARS AGO.[/I]
Additionally, Japan and South Korea are part of the KEDO reactor building plan along with the US. They're also opposing North Korea's present actions and PAST violation of the '94 agreement.
The fuel oil was stopped when the North Koreans ADMITTED they had violated the '94 agreement YEARS AGO.
Now as to the "Republican" aspect:
Also from Meet The Press
Senator JOE BIDEN, (D-Del.)
Chairman, Foreign Relations Committee
And so I think they’ve started off the correct way. I think going through the U.N., if we can get some solidarity here, is a way in which we can find a way out for the North Koreans and us without rewarding their bad behavior. And let me conclude by saying, you know, under international law-everybody forgets this—they’re entitled to have Yongbyon. They’re entitled to produce that plutonium. They’re not entitled to build nuclear weapons. They’re entitled to have that. And so they’re going to give up something. It seems to me one aspect of the agreed framework that should be able to be salvaged through the international community would be for them to cease and desist what is the clear, present and immediate danger, Yongbyon, and provide them fuel in the interim while we’re trying to work out and/or privately having a demarche saying, “If you do not, we will use force.” That’s on the table. But privately.
Bush's war? That's a DEMOCRAT talking war there.
And what did Mr. Clinton have to say about it?
From CNN online:
..."We actually drew up plans to attack North Korea and to destroy their reactors and we told them we would attack unless they ended their nuclear program," Clinton told a security forum in the Dutch port city of Rotterdam Sunday.
...Commenting on the North Korean announcement, Clinton said the move made it imperative that Pyongyang be persuaded or forced to halt its weapons program.
"Make no mistake about it, it has to be ended," Clinton said.
Bush's war? That's a DEMOCRAT talking there.. and a former President that drew up plans for war with North Korea.
Lastly......
this wont change your oppinion nothing will change a domatic fool but the future character assasination that is part and parcel to your typical arguments will hopefully be transparent to non brainwashed readers.
Better look in the mirror, chum.
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...all parties involved have shown themselves to be deceptive, so what are you going to do? believe what you want to...
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It's time to play Falcon 4.0 again... :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by whgates3
...all parties involved have shown themselves to be deceptive, so what are you going to do? believe what you want to...
I think I'll go with the guys that don't operate as a dictatorship and that don't starve their own populace.
Put me down on the list of folks that doesn't think North Korea having lots of nukes is a good idea. You know, that list with Clinton and Biden and Powell and Lieberman and Bush and the governments of Japan and South Korea and of course the Chinese who've said they don't want nukes anywhere on the Korean peninsula.
From CNN:
Our position has always been to support the de-nuclearization of the Korean Peninsula," Zhang Qiyue, China's Foreign Ministry spokeswoman said after North Korea's shock admission
But if you want to believe North Korea with lots of nukes, a dictator and a starving population is an OK thing... well, believe what you want too....
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Being of a conservative bent more then likely I would vote for Republican candidates and policies.
My question boils down to just what the UN is going to do about its inspectors being thrown out of N Korea? I am thinking that the timidity of the world, through the UN, will only inflate the boldness of the N Korean leadership. A one-man dictatorship with nukes needs to be addressed at once. But, the UN must do it as it is their inspectors and policies that have been trampled by the N Koreans!
Here I think the world will dump yet another problem on US leadership and dump additional financial burdens on the US taxpayers. I for one am getting very angry at having to nurse maid the world. The world dumps everything on the US and then sits on the sidelines telling the US how badly they are handling the situation. Give me a break!!
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i'm getting angry@paying taxes to bu||shit artists
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Originally posted by whgates3
i'm getting angry@paying taxes to bu||shit artists
I think you'll have to take a number.
The line started in 1913 I believe, and has continued unbroken down to this very day.
In true IRS fashion, I think they are still working on the guy with number 55 right now... so we'll all be in line a while longer.
Enjoy!
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Originally posted by OZkansas
My question boils down to just what the UN is going to do about its inspectors being thrown out of N Korea? I am thinking that the timidity of the world, through the UN, will only inflate the boldness of the N Korean leadership. A one-man dictatorship with nukes needs to be addressed at once. But, the UN must do it as it is their inspectors and policies that have been trampled by the N Koreans!
Here I think the world will dump yet another problem on US leadership and dump additional financial burdens on the US taxpayers. I for one am getting very angry at having to nurse maid the world. The world dumps everything on the US and then sits on the sidelines telling the US how badly they are handling the situation. Give me a break!!
Agreed....The UN wont do ANYTHING.....
They will wait on the US to make the first move then every single memeber will come out of the woodwork and critisize the American unilateral plan.
Better yet.. What will China do about it?
Does China really want nukes in North Korean hands? After all if China is the next super power why cant they act like it.
Its funny how the new president of S.Korea suddenly likes US troops being stationed in his country when he ran on a platform of not bending to the US will. How much money could we save the American tax payer if we pulled out of Korea and let them defend themselves. They have the 13th largest economy in the world spend some of it.
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I don't believe we need to do much about the nuke inspectors being thrown out of N. Korea. The N. Koreans are a rather insignificant problem. You can't eat nuclear bombs, and that is the situation they are in.
Remember, N. Koreans have enough food to eat only because of the USA. Incredibly, we still provide huge amounts of aid to N. Korea, even now.
N. Korean govt is a loose canon on the world scene, but besides those couple of nukes they've got, they are irrelevent and on the verge of collapse - that is why they are grandstanding.
Does anyone else see this differently?
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South Korea isn't the only country in jeopardy, Japan is short nuke lob away.
Anti-american sentiment has been growing in South Korea over the last decade or so. Maybe it is time to stop baby sitting over there and encourage Japan to spend more than 5% of their GNP on defense as well.
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If South Korea is happy without us, let China handle it. Of course that little police action 50 years ago should tell SK something about the way China views things, but hey, maybe things are changed. At any rate, I really personally don't care if SK is communist or not, and I am more than a little tired of sending our boys to places they aren't really wanted or needed.
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Originally posted by OZkansas
What is the UN doing to stop N Korea from violating UN resolutions?
the same thing they're doing to stop isreal from violating 40 years worth of UN resolutions- nothing.
come on. not the US nor any other country actually cares whether a country violates UN resolutions unless it's helpful to their agenda.
the US needs an excuse to exert it's will from time to time and the resolutions are a handy way to justify our actions when the 'reason' guys can't think of anything else good enough to hold back the press.
you didn't think that whole "they violated UN resolutions so that's the reason we've got to get em" stuff was anything more than rhetoric did you?
i can't believe that stuff works so well.
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Middle East is different to me for one reason- Israel.
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I think the point most of in the west don't pick up on is Far Eastern culture differences when it comes to nation and conflict. These guys think in 50, 100, 200 year terms - NOT 4 year terms.
I remember Tianaman square and Kate Adie reporting on BBC. She spoke to a chinese historian just after the masacre about the view of the chinese government to the foreign outrage. The answer was they don't care - they knew that in 5 or 10 maybe even 15 years we would have forgotten it. That is exactly what has happened - our leaders have changed and with it foreign policy and we want their trade now ....... what square was that ?? What happened?? :rolleyes:
The North Koreans don't give a rats bellybutton what we think - their leadership is looking way further in the future than this year or next year and will do whatever they can to achieve what they want.
The threat is real - we should deal with it IMHO or our children will have a much bigger one to sort out.
Iraq is a distraction to secure the next 50 years of oil - look further East for our long term future.
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South Korea isn't the only country in jeopardy, Japan is short nuke lob away.
Yep... Japan should be uneasy. I agree, let them do as they see fit.
In light of all the anti-American sentiment in S.K., its no wonder N.K. is now apparently trying to do peacefully what we have prevented them from doing militarily - reunite the Korean peninsula. (against those war-mongering capitalist pigs, the Americans)
I'm wondering if it isn't time to get the hell out of there. Let them do as they wish. (it should be fun to watch the failed communist north try to blend with the successful capitalistic south.) :eek:
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The reactor provides only 5MW of power which is same as 2 (!)windmill generators do. So the _only_sole_ purpose of it is to create material for nuclear weapons, thats why it was ordered to shut down years ago.
If you look the past of N Korea you see, that they are only trying to blackmail another 500 000 tons of oil from USA with this action. Our peace loving Europeans will sit with their thumbs up in their bellybutton and yell at you if you wont pay the ransom. I really feel ashamed of European behalf. They try to cover their inability to do decicions with nice words like "Lets try the diplomatic way".. BS, nuke them N Koreans theyre scum of the earth with their current leadership.
:mad:
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Originally posted by Tuomio
Our peace loving Europeans will sit with their thumbs up in their bellybutton and yell at you if you wont pay the ransom. I really feel ashamed of European behalf.
man, drive around the asian continent for a while.....every third mile there's deutsche telecom or totalfinaelf or something. the europeans have invested deep into asia especially the germans and french.
i remember traveling around china and running into loads of germans and french. sometimes i wonder if the reason for their hesitance in these world affairs isn't financially motivated since asia looks like a giant industrial park for western business anyway.
don't be ashamed, no continent will ever nail canned fish and chocolate covered wafers the way you all have. ;)