Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Ping on January 16, 2003, 01:28:24 PM
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1951 - Mossadigh takes power in Iran and declares that they will control their own oil
1953 -After 2 years of U.S. sponsored sanctions CIA supports plot to overthrow Mossadigh and place Shah in power. American Gen. Norman Schwartzkopf Sr. helps Shah develop SAVAK secret police.
1958 - popular revolution led by Abd al-Kassem Quassim overthrows British-installed king of Iraq
1959-Saddam Hussein was one of assassins who wounded Quassim
1963 -coup aided by CIA overthrows Kassem. Baathist party briefly in power. Hussein runs torture center
1968 - Baathist Party comes to power for good in Iraq
1972-Iraq announces the nationalization of oil. Pres. Nixon plots with Shah to arm Iraqui Kurds. Iraq placed on list of nations supporting terrorism
1975-Iraq Vice-president Saddam Hussein and Shah reach agreement ceding control of Shatt-al-Arab waterway to Iran. Kurdish aid abruptly stopped. Concerning the Kurds who were left in the lurch, Henry Kissinger said , " Covert operations should not be confused with missionary work".
1979-Shah is overthrown. National Security adviser Brzezinski publicly encouraged Iraq to attack Iran to take back the Shatt-al-Arab waterway - which the U.S had forced Iraq to cede to Iran four years earlier.
1980-"Carter Doctrine" states U.S. will intervene militarily to protect U.S. access to oil. Iraq invades Iran at U.S. urging.
1982-Iraq removed from terrorist nation list
Taken From http://www.scn.org/wwfor/iraqhist.html
And Its not about oil?
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And you stopped at 1982 because? After that it no longer supports your oil conspiracy?
-SW
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1984-U.S restores full diplomatic relations with Iraq. Pres. Reagan authorizes intelligence sharing with Iraq. At same time U.S. begins sharing intelligence and selling weapons to Iran.
1985-Oliver North tells Iran that U.S. will help Iran overthrow Saddam Hussein
1986-U.S increases aid to Iraq
1987-Norman Schwartzkopf Jr. Named head of CENT-COM. U.S bombs Iranian oil platforms.
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No..stopped cause it just got worse is all :)
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There was a little thing called the Cold War and US and Soviet interest forced everyone to maneuver for position in the Middle East as "tides" turned...
They should be glad they have oil and people pay attention otherwise the Middle East's importance would be just above sub-Sahara Africa. :eek:
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Ok..I guess Lies Deceit and State sanctioned terrorism is ok
1972-Iraq announces the nationalization of oil. Pres. Nixon plots with Shah to arm Iraqui Kurds. Iraq placed on list of nations supporting terrorism
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That's all fine 'n dandy, but are you going to ignore that Saddam actively pursued weapons grade plutonium? Bought himself a calutron (which makes nuclear material for a bomb) which was later found by UN inspectors? Oh, not to mention he moved it just as UN inspectors came to the site and they watched the vehicles drive away helplessly. He created thousands of tons of Anthrax, VX, the virus that causes botchilism, and several other chemical/biological weapons I can't remember off the top of my head- had them packed into warheads, had them primed and ready to be attached SAMs on mobile SAM launchers aimed at Israel, and when told by the UN to destroy it.... only half was actually destroyed?
He used a biological agent on the Kurds which killed thousands and the surviving population is forever mutilated at the DNA level resulting in some pretty messed up looking people from birth.
"It's all about oil"
No, it's all about getting a crazy lying fuk out of power in Iraq.
Oh yeah, and not to mention all of the toejam we found after the Gulf War...
-SW
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Cmon AKS :)
I just gave you everything you asked for and now you discard it like some dirty Tard Thong :p Have to admit the facts don't really look good on the US governments ability to take the High Moral Ground.
Yes they used gas on the Kurds...look into the history on the Kurds and you may find that the Iranians and the US in the past treated them just as bad. The Kurds have been fighting the Iraqis for a lot longer than Saddam has been alive.
Does the situation stink? Hell Yes. But I for one will point out that this war is about alot more than meets the Eye
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Sorry, you gave me up until 1987... if I'm not mistaken, it's now 2003...
Iraqi history just didn't stop happening for 16 years.
-SW
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AKS..are you incapable of research? I said last time I would let you do it for yourself, I should have held true to that. Do your own research now.
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That's a nice cop out... I wasn't asking you to show me the history, I wanted to see if you would pull all the facts... which I highly suspect you wouldn't, which is why you insist I do my own "research".
You started the argument, but you couldn't take it to the end... oh well, guess you'll never truly understand just how much of a threat Saddam is to the people in that region.
-SW
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Ping takes AKS by the hand and gently shows him to the Library stairs, " Dont be afraid AKS...You can do it"
There is such a thing as "Casting Pearls before Swine"
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Yeah, I figured you'd do that.
Have you been reading the newspapers for the past 9 years? Just outta curiosity, did you miss that Iraq continued to throw UN inspectors out, threaten them with death threats and give them the run around?
If you didn't miss that, did you miss the amounts of weapons they found there that had been destroyed? Did you miss the amounts of weapons they had in reality been manufactured?
Did you fail to subtract the amount destroyed from the amount manufactured?
I know you can do it!
-SW
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Are you forgeting the toejam the previous administrations had been handing them for the previous CENTURY? I seem to recall the War of Independance started over less than what they had been subjected to.
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No I am not, I am also not forgetting that he was mandated by the UN to destroy ALL the toejam he had. Period. He has not proven himself to have done it.
He is in violation of a UN treaty, after several years of giving the UN the run around, moving stuff around and finally letting them in a mere 9 years later... you don't for a minute believe he has all kinds of bio/chem and maybe even nuclear stuff hidden around his desert?
If you can't see that for what it is, then yeah... I guess it is all about oil.. atleast to people who only want to see their side of the issue.
-SW
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Time to get Nasty.....And the US ally in the form of ISRAEL is in disregard of HOW many UN slaps on the wrist? Oh please do tell me that you know about those...right?
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Yes I do... Israel also proved how reserved it can be while under attacks- twice in the past 9 years.
Iraq has proven it's an aggressor and will go on the offensive first.
If the US dropped support to Israel, what do you think would happen in that region?
-SW
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Iraq brought the current state of affairs on itself by the invasion of Kuwait and continued UN violations.
Had it been a good little rouge dictatorship without invading another sovereign state it could have operated indefinitely without the present US pressure.
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May 1990 - At Arab summit Saddam accuses Gulf states of waging economic war against Iraq. The Iraq economy has been devastated by the war. Iraq had borrowed billions to wage war against Iran. Price of oil was down because Gulf states were dumping oil on world market. Kuwait was slant drilling with American equipment into Iraqi oilfields. Kuwait and Saudi Arabia at behest of U.S. demanded immediate repayment of loans to Iraq.
Kuwait was slant drilling with American equipment into Iraqi oilfields. Kuwait and Saudi Arabia at behest of U.S. demanded immediate repayment of loans to Iraq.
Little bit of intrigue there on the US part i guess.
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Israel reserved?
Press Release
GA/SPD/196
During its consideration of the Special Committee’s report, the observer for Palestine said that, in light of recent tragic developments and the deterioration of the situation in the occupied Palestinian territory, including Jerusalem, the Special Committee’s mandate continued to be appropriate and timely. The Israeli army’s excessive and indiscriminate use of force against Palestinian civilians in the past five weeks had resulted in the willful killing of more than 150 Palestinians and injury to thousands. It was the belief of many that such a gross violation of human rights might amount to war crimes.
This is from the UN website
http://www.un.org
Do a search on Resolutions against Israel and afterwards tell me they are reserved.
And then explain to me why Israel is allowed to defy them and Saddam is not. This has been on ongoing Two faced position from the US Government for decades.
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Israel had also been dealing with palestinian meat bombs.
Of course, it's easy to sit back in relative safety and criticise them for their actions (and this is entirely different from what Saddam did to Kuwait) when dealing with terrorists.
I can't say it's the right thing to do, or what should have been done... but they have been essentially fighting a war for survival against their neighbors for a long time.
US pulls out of Israel, Israel is on it's own and gets demolished by the surrounding countries.
It may be "two faced", but Israel wouldn't exist if it weren't for US support.
-SW
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Excuse me but these meat bombs were not always the case. I gave you the directions to the UN. Those resolutions were happening a long time before the meat bomb parade became fashionable. You are sitting in Reasonable comfort saying to go after Saddam is prevention.
In your laws is it JUST to kill countless numbers of people because they MIGHT do something? Sheet thats tantamount to war crimes.
The UN, Russia and a number of other countries are saying that this can be resolved through diplomacy. So Why is it that the Bush administration feels the need to go in and remove him from power?
Never have I said that the US should abandon Israel, They have a right to exist, but does that permit them to ignore the UN and international Law. Does that give America the Moral highground when they ignore human right violations(not just Israel I'm talkin bout here) just because they are alies?
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Excuse me, but those meat bombs were the cause of Israel killing Palestinians.
That's terrific though that Russia and the UN think this can be solved with diplomacy. If it can be, I'd be ecstatic... but diplomacy AND the UN hasn't been working for the past 9 years... think Saddam's had a change of heart?
And that is exactly why the Bush Admin believes the only way to stop Saddam and ensure that he has no WMDs as he is supposed to not have is by going in, taking him out of power, and examining every square inch of that country.
I haven't been sitting in reasonble comfort or safety for a year now... I work in Washington, DC.. the illusion of safety left me long ago.
Of course what's even funnier is that you said this: "In your laws is it JUST to kill countless numbers of people because they MIGHT do something?"
We already have reasonable cause with the newly found 11 warheads. We've had reasonable cause when Saddam couldn't prove he destroyed half of his WMD inventory. Saddam even proved he would invade a neighboring country.
This is beginning to sound like something that happened 60 years ago...
-SW
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http://www.mfa.gov.il/mfa/go.asp?MFAH0m6k0
The first suicide bombing in Israel occurred on April 16, 1993 (before that, there had been suicide attacks directed against IDF soldiers in Lebanon). In the years 1995-1996, a murderous wave of suicide attacks erupted in Israel.
The reasons for the Israeli reactions before this is????
Still looking . will edit more time frames.
Suicide and Other Bombing Attacks in Israel Since the Declaration of Principles
(September 1993)
Apr 6, 1994 - Eight people were killed in a car-bomb attack on a bus in the center of Afula. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack.
Israel has ignored resolutions from what date?
And yes that is the Official Israeli Web Site.
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Hey, I know you can do the math.. cause I said "in the past 9 years"
-SW
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So Un and Diplomacy havnt worked in the last 9 years.
What does History say about Gunboat Diplomacy. Because that is what Bush is doing, Do it my way or I will kill you. Who is to tell Bush that his way is wrong? His Dad?
You praise him for the Diplomatic route being used with NK, but with anyone else you are saying it hasnt woked for the last 9 years. Inconsistant.
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I praised the diplomatic route with NK?
Nope, not me. I don't think an invasion is a good idea in NK. I don't think an invasion in Iraq is a good idea.
But I can see that in the case of Saddam, the only thing he understands is a nice .50cal between the eyes.
For the past 9 years nothing has worked with Saddam.
N. Korea was told in 1994 to keep it's reactor turned off. It wasn't until recently (1 year) that they began messing around with it, and admitted to actually having nuclear weapons.
What's so inconsistant? That for the past 9 years nothing has worked with Saddam, or that for the past year, nothing has worked with Kim?
-SW
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What a disgustingly sordid affair the Iraq situation is.
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Oh but lets not forget this lil fact either:
Kim has come outright and told us he has nuclear capabilities and has a desire to continue down this road.
OTOH, Saddam has been desperately trying to hide this fact and even when confronted by the US, and the UN, he continues to feed them nothing but lies and deciet.
-SW
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I before E except after C. :D
Hmmmm, lies and deceit.....sounds familiar.
Where's the proof Iraq has nukes...or had anything more than a few empty chemical artillery shells?
Chimpy kind of reminds me of a line from the movie Gladiator....
"He will give them death, and they will love him for it."
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Did you guys ever see the movie "Canadian Bacon"
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Originally posted by weazel
Where's the proof Iraq has nukes...or had anything more than a few empty chemical artillery shells?
The proof comes from the UN inspectors... no, not what they find.... what they had found at the close of the Gulf War.
-SW