Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: weazel on January 18, 2003, 01:44:18 PM
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INCARCERATION RATES PER 100,000
Netherlands 49
Ireland 62
Finland 65
Denmark 66
Sweden 69
Belgium 71
Germany 80
Italy 80
France 84
Switzerland 85
Austria 88
Spain 90
Australia 91
England 93
Canada 116
USA 519
So why does the U.S. have five to ten times the incarceration rate as the rest of the Industrialized world?
Well, let's look at how we differ from all those scummy other places we're "better" than:
We are the most Christian.
We are the least Agnostic.
We are the most conservative.
We are the least socialist.
We execute the most people.
We have the least gun controls..
We pay the least taxes.
We have the harshest drug laws.
We have the longest sentences.
And we give less of a toejam than just about anywhere.
Conservatives would have us believe that the blame for having the highest crime rate in the industrialized world -- and probably the non-industrialized world as well -- is because of welfare, gun controls, not long enough sentences, too few executions, not enough jails, not smacking our children around hard or often enough and of course, not having enough Jesus shoved down our throats.
Well excuse me! All those awful other countries who suffer far less crime have more welfare, more gun controls, shorter sentences, no executions, less jails, do not hit their children as much as we and have far less God being jammed down their throats.
Every argument conservatives use is a straw man bypassing the basic underlying truth of their entire ideology.
That the selfish callous disregard endemic to both their politics and personalities is the central problem to our moral decay. (http://rackjite.com/index.html)
Hope all you "conservatives" have a nice day!
:p
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Maybe your cops are just better at catching the bad guys. Maybe your prosecuting attornys are better at making their cases.
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Accept the Lord Jesus Christ into your life and you will be saved.
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WOO HOO!!!! Go America!! We're NUMBER ONE!!!
Maybe some of those other countries are nothing more than prisons run by a dictator so everybody is imprisoned. Maybe there's nothing worth stealing over there. Maybe their citizens can't afford drugs. Maybe thier women are ugly so nobody will rape them. Maybe the only people that go to prison are those that actually LIKE America.
I know that, like Iraq, the opinion of the United States counts more than the opinions of the United Nations and our allies. Those other countries might say that we have too many people in our prisons.. I say they don't have ENOUGH people in thier prisons.
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let's buy weazle a ticket to whatever other country he wants to live in.
I'll pitch in $50.00
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Ok Weazel so you are a liberal democrat, kinda like Nancy Pelosi and Barbara Boxer and Hillary Clinton.
Thats cool.
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weazle, you are such a dim wit it is almost not worth replying.
I would be interested to hear you explain why you think our prison population and crime rate are a conservative issue.
Did our crime rate or prison population suddenly change recently?
Weazle, did you post on this subject when Clinton was in office? cause??
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LOL Nuke remember your blood pressure!! Relax bud!!
Breathe deep... breathe deep...breathe deep....:D
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Weazle hates that Repubicans are in charge now. )
It's only gonna get worse for him, as Dems and LIbs get exposed for what thet are.
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Just in case you missed it in the Rumsfeld thread, I thought I'd repeat it here... I'd really like to help you Weasel.
first posted in the Rumsfeld thread
You know Weasel, I have yet to discern if you have a coherent political philosophy other than opposition to anyone in power.
You seem to be an angry little man wandering the vast plains of the internet following an anti-scientific method and lifting only the information, whether or not it is of questionable origin, which proves your point that all who wield political influence are corrupt.
I have heard advertisements for herbal male enhancement products that may be able help you alleviate your frustrations.
I hope this helps.
Holden
Please let me know if I can help in any way.
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Hey wait a sec Nuke...I am a dem and a lib and I have NEVER exposed myself!! That is a Damnable Lie!!
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Something I've learned here on these boards recently is that no matter how many numbers you post...no matter how long you say something is bad...it will not change.
Wezel, you think GWB is a bad president, that the US is in peril and that conservatives are bad people. Know what? No matter how many times you say that, it won't change.
GWB will remain president for another year, and conservatives will be who they are. All your crying in this board won't do anything but reinforce the general public's opinion about you.
But hey...British Airways always has seats open...
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hey holden , i have a ..er .. ah... "friend " that could use that "inhancement " stuff
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hey John, have you ever tried Viagra? One of my brothers is a pharmacist and I get it from him occasionally. In fact it's my recreational drug of choice.
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Originally posted by Airhead
In fact it's my recreational drug of choice.
So, what does it do to you?
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As I understand it, some of these preparations increase length and girth, not just result in a temporary betterment of performance.
For someone who is 'challenged' in this arena, {like Weasel} a positive attitude change could manifest.
Although I am getting this all second hand, I assure you.
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Originally posted by mietla
So, what does it do to you?
More often and longer, for a couple of hours and two or three times easily. Face it, at fifty we aren't as virile as we were at thirty, and although Little Sparky only fails me if I've been drinking Crown Royal Viagra is a fun treat for me and my wife. In fact my wife is urging me to see a doctor and get a genuine prescription for it instead of begging my brother for an occasional tablet, but I don't need it..really..I can uh...perform without... I think..
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Originally posted by Airhead
Maybe thier women are ugly so nobody will rape them.
I'd say it's pretty obvious that you've never been to Sweden.
But I must admit that I thought the reputation of Swedish girls was better than that.
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hey John, have you ever tried Viagra? One of my brothers is a pharmacist and I get it from him occasionally. In fact it's my recreational drug of choice.
- Airhead
LOL :D
That cracks me up. Sounds fun. I think I'm going to ask my Islamic Doctor, Saleem Haq, MD. for a few of those. Dude is totally anti-drugs, so I don't know what he will say...
WEAZEL, you should go to your doctor for some Lie-agra, then double up on 'em, and take them with some holy water, then your tongue won't be black anymore! ;)
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I swear you 'live' in left field, John, lmao once again :D
Originally posted by john9001
hey holden , i have a ..er .. ah... "friend " that could use that "inhancement " stuff
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Originally posted by texace
GWB will remain president for another year, and conservatives will be who they are. All your crying in this board won't do anything
Prolly 5 years :p
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Weazel,
How much more money are you personally willing to throw into the gaping maw of the Federal Tax System to rectify all that injustice?
You know to pay for the "free" benefits.
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We have the harshest drug laws.
We have the longest sentences.
The two combined exacerbate the problem.
Reform laws & penalties for drug use and U.S. statistics would fall into line with the rest of the worlds.
The war on drugs is the most serious problem, (destruction of the 4th and 5th Amendment), the old rallying cry of law and order (fascism), mandatory sentencing (totalitarianism), and seizure/forfeiture of property on accusation. (denial of due process)
We have allowed prosecutorial power to get out of control.
(http://www.lp.org/images/liberty.gif)
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"Drugs to keep Dare off Kids"....or something like that.
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Gotta agree with hortlund, i don't think airhead has seen a swedish gal before. I met some Swedish girls in France....:)
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Originally posted by weazel
All those awful other countries who suffer far less crime have more welfare, more gun controls, shorter sentences, no executions, less jails, do not hit their children as much as we and have far less God being jammed down their throats.
Do I understand your last correctly? Lesser penalties for drug convictions and shorter sentences for any crime would solve the problem?
So "more welfare" isn't really an issue then?
... and "more gun controls" won't help either?
... and "no executions" really has nothing to do with it......
... and "less jails" isn't a factor.......
.....and "hit their children"... isn't a player.....
... and "god being jammed down their throats" is also a red herring?
It's just drug sentences and overall length of sentences?
So, if I understand correctly, having much softer drug laws and shorter sentences would save us from having a high incarceration rate per 100,000?
Yes, I'd bet your right.
In fact, if we didn't put anyone in jail, I'd bet we could have the absolute LOWEST incarceration rate per 100,000 than the rest of the industrialized world.
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You only asked about money.
Do you think there's a corellation between drugs and crimes commited with a gun?
Take away the financial incentive that causes drug crime and it will alleviate a lot of the problem ya think?
Remember a "conservative" president lead the ban on assault rifles.
God being jammed down peoples throat represses natural urges causing sex crimes.
Compare sex crime statistics and morality codes between any euro nation to the U.S.
Sexuality in the U.S. is repressed and thought of as "nasty" instead of an act of procreation.
Execution obviously isn't much of a deterrent even though IMO it's warranted depending on the crime.
Dunno about you but I don't hit my kid, I talk to her about problems instead.
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This individual, weazel, like blur's hatred of his country is only surpassed by his inability to leave it. Since the posts are so similar I am beginning to suspect they are the same. Virtually nothing but negative back biting and contempt for his country and any opinion not their own.
Of course there might not be any causative factor in the behavior of those incarcerated. Thay are all innocent bystanders I'm sure. :rolleyes:
Thanks for the bbs squelch HTC.
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well, yah, I did ask about money, since it takes money and lots of it to do the welfare programs.
You come back with, "skip that stuff; it's the drug trade and the sentences".
Seems rather obvious that if you quit arresting, trying and incarcerting folks for drug violations and shorten sentences overall for everything else that the rate of incarceration would drop significantly, eh?
It's almost a "duh".
Question is, is that what this society wants? Shorter sentences for violent crime? Decriminalize some or all drugs? I don't think there's a majority for that basic program.
Legalizing drugs would change one aspect of the problem but may well.. probably.. will present others just as serious.
Gun controls? We've got way more than we need now. What you need is enforcement of what you've got. And there's documented examples to show that. Project Exile for one. Doesn't fit with your "shorter sentences" aspect though.
Sex crimes and religion? You want to try to legislate religion? Good luck! Remember that old "church and state" separation thing?
Execution may or may not be a deterrent. But it is 100% effective as a "no recidivism" tool. I don't necessarily require it to be a deterrent. I may well be satisfied with "no recidivism".
Nope, don't have to hit my kids. They're pretty reasonable and when reason fails, there's always the car keys. Seems to make them see reason awfully fast.
Overall, Weazel, I don't see a workable program in your post. Just another laundry list of things you don't like.
We've all got those.
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Originally posted by Hortlund
I'd say it's pretty obvious that you've never been to Sweden.
But I must admit that I thought the reputation of Swedish girls was better than that.
he must be thinking of some other sweden..
swedish gurls...mmmmm
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swedish conservative? contradiction in terms ?
most libral place this side of berkly
and yea i have been there.
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
Ok Weazel so you are a liberal democrat, kinda like Nancy Pelosi and Barbara Boxer and Hillary Clinton.
Thats cool.
....and clint eastwood....i wonder who would win in a fight (maybe over the last glass of prune juice) between eastwood & heston...only stokholm seems really super liberal. most of the swedes i know are from the north & they are pretty consevative types - although one has been 'on the dole' for over 3 years
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geeze weazle... first you name all these benifiets we have over other countries and then you claim that the only disadvantage is that we lock up too many scumbags?
did you ever wonder what the figures would be if we didn't have 10 time repeat offenders?
lazs
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We would do a lot better in reducing crime if we legalized drugs, got rid of any laws that we didn't have the resources or inclination to enforce, and lowered the sentences to a reasonable time.
We spend so much time and money on the drug issue; it's a huge waste. If a person has their drug use under control, it is really nobodies business. And if they don't, legalization would make the drugs cheap enough they could afford to OD. OD is effective at stopping peoples drug use than either prison or rehab, with 100% no repeat offenders. Also even if they don't OD, if the local crank head could get it for $10 a gram instead of $100, he's only have to steal 1 car stereo for every 10 he's taking now.
When you have laws that you can't or wont enforce, you teach kids to not fear/respect the law. You teach that you don't really mean it when you say 'don't'. Kids start getting in trouble in their teens and we give them '2nd chances', probation, suspended sentencing, etc. Then they get picked up for something and when it's over he goes back to see his friends and they say "what happened?", "nothing". What was learned? - Nothing.
Along with the last goes that for most crimes our sentencing is too high. Basically our courts are so over-crowded (from the drug crimes) that they don't have time for trials. Prosecutors would much rather go for a plea-bargain. So we set the sentences so high that you can do a plea-bargain and negotiate down to a reasonable sentence. This may be a great time saver when defendants are guilty but it's not justice. And you have innocent people pleading guilty and taking a couple moths in jail because to exercise their right to a trial they would risk years in prison. And as we have seen in Illinois death penalty cases lately not everyone who is convicted really did it. So, people can't afford to risk the trial just because they know they are innocent.
Also in Oregon we have 'measure 11’, mandatory sentencing for 'violent crimes'. These mandatory sentencing, zero tolerance kind of laws are stupid. We have kids that are 18 years old looking at 7 years in prison for a fluff'n fist fight. One case I know of involved 2 guys (both 18) mutual fight, cops broke it up, and neither wanted to press charges. The DA filed the charges. 2 years ago when I heard of it, he was on his first year of 7 in prison.
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Originally posted by Hortlund
I'd say it's pretty obvious that you've never been to Sweden.
But I must admit that I thought the reputation of Swedish girls was better than that.
I do some contract work for Ericsson..
You bastards send all your ugly women here... where the hell is the swedish bikini team !!!