Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Eagler on January 22, 2003, 08:22:55 AM
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wtg - 30 years of bloodshed :(
the "good news" is teenage births have declined :(
for every 100 births there are approx 30 aborts ... amazin
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Funny thing is 'abortion on demand' has proven to be a myth.
Abortions actually decreased 4% since 1996.
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Eighty percent of women having abortions are single; 60 percent are white; 35 percent are black.
Eighty-two percent of the women having abortions are unmarried or separated.
Almost half of American women (43 percent) will have an abortion sometime in their lifetime.
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You going to adopt all those unwanted children and give them love? The mother who definitely doesn't want them is going to raise them and love them?
43% of American women??? Not a chance in hell. That HAS to take into account women having multiple abortions. I know one female that's had an abortion. Then again, I live in the town where the abortion clinic has been bombed and one of the doctors shot...
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I know one female that's had an abortion.
you know one who will tell you about it.
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Take action!
Oppose attempts to undermine Roe v. Wade (http://www.aclu.org/ReproductiveRights/ReproductiveRights.cfm?ID=9988&c=143)
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take action, appose atempts to avoid responsability for your actions by killing babies
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You know what is really funny about this issue?
That it wasn't an issue until women's sufferage.
Seriously, there was no outrage about abortion before women started asking and demanding equal rights. Once they did that the anti-women people had to find new tools to keep them "in their place".
You can find adds in New Englend papers from the 1700s and 1800s advertising abortion services. Nobody picketed or shot those providers. Why? Because it wasn't an issue.
I'm not saying that people like Eagler are being two-faced about this. I am saying that the people who started the attacks on birth control (abortion is simply one form) back in the days of women's sufferage were two-faced. Modern people like Eagler have simply been educated and brought up in that environment to believe as they do and are thus innocent of the base and vile manipulation that started the whole anti-women movement in the USA. They have been manipulated just as much, if not more so, than the women attacked by these principals of unequality.
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I celebrate 30 years of women's right to choose what happens to their own bodies.
Eagler..the middle ages called..they want you back.
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Originally posted by capt. apathy
take action, appose atempts to avoid responsability for your actions by killing babies
You're free to do whatever you like with your womb. Don't like abortion? Don't do it.
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Originally posted by Karnak
You can find adds in New Englend papers from the 1700s and 1800s advertising abortion services. Nobody picketed or shot those providers. Why? Because it wasn't an issue.
you sure about that?
I found this:
American Colonies
U.S. adopts English Common Law, which forbade abortion. The procedure was ruled a misdemeanor if performed prior to quickening (feeling life) and a felony if performed after quickening.
Early 1800s
Discovery that life begins at fertilization and not when the mother 'felt life.'
1860 Eight-five percent of the then-present U.S. states had laws that made all abortions a felony.
1869
British Parliament passes the Offenses Against the Persons Act, making all abortions a felony.
then we become "enlightened" :rolleyes:
1967
Colorado and California legalize abortion.
and it goes downhill from there...
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once again, Eagler, you gonna adopt all the unwanted babies?
You can't force people to love a child, you can only force them to provide for the children. Wait, no, you can't do that either, because they can give the baby up for adoption.
I guess more orphanages would be better than abortions. Those children don't really need a loving family.
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sorry I can't but seems many capable couples looking to adopt
I think the emphasis should be on the womens right to "keep her legs closed" than her right to "shrug her responsibility for her actions" via an afternoon trip to the suck, flush & forget it clinic.
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I'd very much like (and wish) for every pregnancy to be a planned one. If that was an option, then we'd not need abortion.
btw, let's not put it all on the female and keeping her legs closed. How about we put some of the blame on the guy for not putting the raincoat on his monkey? Takes 2 to make a baby, yet only one gets the blame for it if it leads to an abortion.
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wow......
Originally posted by Eagler
Almost half of American women (43 percent) will have an abortion sometime in their lifetime.
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Kanth
that is a Planned Parenthood info ... could be just some form of sicko advertising from them as they endorse the"option" 110%
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You can't legislate morality....even though "conservatives" wish they could. :p
I'm no fan of abortion, personally I think it's murder...but it's also a choice for the person(s) in that situation.
Originally posted by Eagler
I think the emphasis should be on the womens right to "keep her legs closed" than her right to "shrug her responsibility for her actions" via an afternoon trip to the suck, flush & forget it clinic.
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Too tough to argue. The arguements for or against don't seem to oppose each other.
On one side of the coin: Women's right to do with her own body as she will.
On the other: Killing babies.
The two arguements are not even the same language. It boils down to which one is more important to the individual. Personally, I'm against abortions.
Here's what I don't understand.
The same people that are all for saving trees and outlawing the declawing of cats (read recent West Hollywood news) are pro abortion. Where's the logic?
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Hey looky, yet another abortion thread. Sorry you can't have your views forced upon people you don't know and who's business is none of your own, Eagler. Perhaps someday we'll take a huge step backwards and you'll get your wish. At that point, maybe we could round up all of the women who have had to make the choice and burn a big A into their chests!
I'm crossing my fingers for ya!
SOB
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And every fukin time pro lifers wanna protest, where do they go? That's right, DC. Guess what? Those inconsiderate fuks really screw over people who work here, roads get blocked off, all parking on main streets gets shut down, and the cops are out in force.
That means I a) can't go into work and thusly lose money, b) get a parking ticket cuz I have to park so fukin far away, or c) get my car towed and pay in excess of $250.
Pro lifers ain't exactly winning me over right now.
-SW
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My wife and I were foster parents for 2 and a half years, and adopted 5 children. My wife was adopted. There are MANY MANY people out there that are willing to love and care for a child they they are not biological parents to. I am truely blessed by those in my life that were given the chance to live and be adopted. My children are my own. I did not produce them, but they are mine just the same. They care, laugh , cry and love just like everyone else. They are responsible members of their school and I make sure that they look out for those less fortunate in our area.
Prospective parents are eager and willing to adopt. There is so much red tape and politics involved though that many get discouraged before they get a chance to adopt. Im now just ranting so I will close, but adoption is an area that hits close to home for me.
Hope to be back in the game soon.
Hello Rattlers and Blue Knights
Filadog
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its probably more of my business than you know SOB and that business, sir, is none of your business.......... I'm just expressing a viewpoint here. Seems to hit a nerve everytime I do as many of you turn into rabid dogs in an attempt to justify baby murder..
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Human vegetables are alive too, but no one cries for them when their plug gets pulled except maybe close relatives.
Stop pulling the plugs!
-SW
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"If you're preborn, you're fine. If you're preschool, your diddlyed."
or better yet:
"Conservatives don't care about you until you reach military age. Training soldiers from the start"
Both of those were said by George Carlin, and both are true in some cases.
You see...I am a firm believer that a woman can choose what she wants to do with her body, and nothing I read on these boards or in life will change that. It's amazing how people say that "God hates baby murderers!" but then bomb abortion clinics. How can Christians apply the name of their God to abortion to justify killing doctors? What if one of those precious little babies grows up to be an abortion doctor? Not gonna work, we gotta kill him too!
Come on...stop trying to force your views on all of us. Parading around in tight shorts screaming "No more baby murder!" is like me driving my car in circles. It wastes time and serves no purpose...
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texace
lets see how you feel about it in say 20/25 years
in HS I'm sure my view on the subject was different too..........
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Lets see you feel about it when you are a women who is pregnant with an unwanted child.
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or when you are a father and she has the right to kill your child, and you have no rights, just responsabilitys.
women get choices men get bills
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Originally posted by Greese
The same people that are all for saving trees and outlawing the declawing of cats (read recent West Hollywood news) are pro abortion. Where's the logic?
Once again... it's not pro-abortion. It's pro-choice and self determination.
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Originally posted by Eagler
I'm just expressing a viewpoint here. Seems to hit a nerve everytime I do as many of you turn into rabid dogs in an attempt to justify baby murder..
lol
could it be your choice of words?
Imagine the rate of incarceration in the US when pot and sex are illegal...
I can see eagle standing on the last non-prison square foot of his perfect country....feeling like everything is perfect in the world.
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Originally posted by capt. apathy
or when you are a father and she has the right to kill your child, and you have no rights, just responsabilitys.
women get choices men get bills
When was the last time a man had to carry a child to term?
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You can't legislate morality....even though "conservatives" wish they could.
actually, we legislate morality everyday.. we say you can't run a red light..we say you can't steal, or hurt people etc.. all moral issues.
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Originally posted by hawk220
actually, we legislate morality everyday.. or hurt people etc.. all moral issues.
unless they are little bitty ppl who are too small to speak for themselves .... then you can suck their brains out..
yeah, it might be my choice of words .. sry for lack of sugar coating.
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LOL, sorry Eagler, I didn't stop to think that it might actually be your business what a woman does with her body and the parasite living inside it, despite the fact that you don't know her, never will know her, and don't give two toejams about her. I can't believe I was so short sighted!
SOB
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should hitler's mom have been allowed an abortion if she had wanted one?
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In 10 to 20 years I'll see it, Eagler? In 10 to 20 years if everything went your way there would be a boom of illegitiment children roaming the streets or ending up in trash bins. No abortion? Sure there's adoption, but most of those kids who are born unwanted end up in trash bins or in the bottom of lakes.
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SOB
was referencing an experience involving abortion, it has hit as close to home as I would care it too..........
texace
the problem isn't the child, it is the creator of that child and their lack of ethics or forethought which prevents the child in the first place
abortion ain't a root cause fix - it's an after thougt - a gross and bloody one at that........
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great new abortion bills for oregon.
1. requiring notifacation of the mother that the baby will likely feel pain at what is being done to it.
2. requiring anastetic to help elimanate this pain.
3. parental notification in the case of minors. (they require parental concent to give your kid an asprin, how the hell do they justify not notifying in abortion)
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What amuses me (if it was all possible in this subject), was if all these baby killers were forced to keep these babies - that the same people who forced this upon these women would be squeaking about them sucking off their taxes to actually help raise these babies.
Its their bodies, let them decide what to do with it if you don't mind Eagler
Tronsky
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Originally posted by Eagler
SOB
was referencing an experience involving abortion, it has hit as close to home as I would care it too..........
You're not the only one.
SOB
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i find it strange that the same general group of people who are against the death penalty are not against abortion & vice versa. its quite convenient though, as it splits the catholic vote, which would be in the range of 35% nationaly and near a majority in a lot of the larger states (Fl, Tx, Ca, NY, Il, Ma) - if there was not this dynamic US politix might be a lot like northern ireland, except w/ the 2nd amemdment maybe a lot more bloody
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ya, it seems very cofusing.
republican party says they are for less gov't envolvement in our lives. but they are against abortion, for death penalty, against assisted suicide. so they have no real problem with killing as long as it's gov't ordered. less gov't envolvement but don't die unless we say so.
dem. platform isn't a whole lot better. but at least when they say they are for personal freedom it kinda goes along with their opinion on these issues. you can decide to die, you can decide to kill but the gov't can't.
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They should feed the aborted fetuses to endangered animals.
Two problems solved.
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A fetus is not a living and thinking person. It's just a fetus. Doctors commit murder every day when they pull the plug on braindead patients for example, killing a fetus is no different. It will not remain to miss anything in this world because it has never seen anything in this world - or could.
"the problem isn't the child, it is the creator of that child and their lack of ethics or forethought which prevents the child in the first place"
I guess you never had a condom break on you Eagler? It's easy to get on a high horse and spew all knowing wisdom.
Make no mistake, an abortion is one of the toughest thing a woman can do. It takes a long consideration and it will cause great mental distress to the woman years after. It's not flush and go, you simply don't know what you're talking about Eagler.
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Heheh, it's so easy to be against something that cannot happen to you.
Just Say No To Menopause! It is evil!
We've been over this time and time again. Unwilling invasion of body->right to self determination/treatment->abortion.
Sperm/egg->embryo->fetus->human baby
Or alternatively
Life begins at conception->thing in womb is a human person with personhood->killing it is murder.
Sperm meets egg->human person with personhood.
In both cases science is used (in the latter case erroneous). In both cases there are legal issues (right to self determination vs murder (which is an unlawful killing of an individual with personhood). As it stands, 'murder' is an inaccurate term. Since the thing hasn't got personhood yet, it cannot be murdered. At least not til the laws change.
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I suggest you all get unwanted pregnancy for 9 months.
oh.. wait a minute... here isn't a single woman taking part in the discussion :rolleyes:
I'm sure it's easier to talk as the one who has to just throw the sperm in female, than as the one who would have to take the consequences for 9 months and what not.
If you make someone accidently pregnant.. well, you can just marry her or support with money.. big deal, you can still work and live normally.
Now let's see this from the subjects point of view.. he might not be financially capable of staying away from work nor could he just do what the mr. cocky moralist is doing.
If someone wants and can afford the pregnancy, but give away his child for adoption or make an abortion, I think it's her choice.
Much easier to take consequences as male than female, as male isn't the one carrying a big ball within for 3 months and having being careful.
During the time when abortion has to be done, theres no rationally thinking person to kill.
"It" will most likely not even realise "it" had ever lived.
I think unwanted child is much worse.
If something should have to be criminal, it would be forcing people to have unwanted childs, when considers what CAN happen for the child after birth.
It is not necessarily so that the child will find a nice family to be adopted into.
It can also ruin the mothers life.
That is criminal, it will not only affect one fetus, but two persons: mother and the child.
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given the "unwanted child" angled maybe we should have 50 or more aborts for every 100 births
again, the problem starts before the fetus arrives on the seen ... you ain't attacking the root cause - just throwing out a temporary fix. as long as this option of birth control is available and is used more with each generation, there isn't any incentive to look at the root cause ..........
you think its like killing? I hear once you kill once, the second and third time is easier...
how many repeat customers do you think there are now, in the future?
last post, will bring up the subject at a later date to rile the "freedom" dogs again
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I hear this very clearly... You wish to impose your sense of morality upon others.
That's a rather arrogant position.
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Originally posted by Sandman_SBM
I hear this very clearly... You wish to impose your sense of morality upon others.
That's a rather arrogant position.
it isn't my sense , but since you brought it up - are we not now living under the "morality" of those who believe abortion is ok?
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Pro-choice isn't an endorsement of abortion. It's allowing a woman to make the decision about what happens to her body. It acknowledges that the woman's rights supercede those of her unborn fetus.
Pro-choice means zero government involvement. The minute someone in government talks about banning abortions, they begin explaining all the excemptions, exceptions and exclusions to the rule.
I think it's best to let the decision be made at the lowest possible level, the mother.
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I think most of you are forgetting that bearing the child is the EASY part.
The real work begins when the labour starts. My wife almost died to the stress of a 20-hour childbirth and I was there to witness it.
I'm telling you, nobody and I mean nobody will do that for nothing if it's avoidable. C-sections aren't any easyer solutions.
I guess what Eagler is suggesting here is that we should abstrain from sex totally unless it's for the meaning of reproduction LOL.
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Originally posted by mrsid2
I guess what Eagler is suggesting here is that we should abstrain from sex totally unless it's for the meaning of reproduction LOL.
or willing to accept the consequences and responsibilities for your "actions"
but I digress, this is the "if it feels good do it" generation, we can always "fix" it later
many ways to have "sex" that do not involve the possibility of bearing children ... no matter how slick willie defines it :)
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or willing to accept the consequences and responsibilities for your "actions"
which may include terminating the life of your unborn child.
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Originally posted by bounder
which may include terminating the life of your unborn child.
you should rephrase that as that does sound like murder
need to use the terms "fetus", "it", "mass of cells", "obstruction to my lifestyle"
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Eagler if you grow a tumor to one of your buttcheeks it will be removed. That tumor is growing and developing, it has a lot of bloodveins and nerves and it senses pain. Much like the fetus does before its brains develop to a level at which it starts to have some level of intelligence, say like a worm or a cockroach.
When that happens, it's already illegal to perform the abortion. You make it sound like you're terminating Einstein after 2 weeks of hard calculation on a cell level.
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I knew a girl who had an abortion... she was an crack head.
You may not like abortions Eagler, but I despise crackheads... and now there is one less. Regardless of what you think, that child would not of had even a remotely decent lifestyle.
-SW
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Originally posted by Eagler
or willing to accept the consequences and responsibilities for your "actions"
but I digress, this is the "if it feels good do it" generation, we can always "fix" it later
many ways to have "sex" that do not involve the possibility of bearing children ... no matter how slick willie defines it :)
You would be surprised to hear the opinions of young people on abortion. I think you'll see a decline in occurrences of abortion in generations to come. They tend to view it as a violent act.
Give it time, Eagler.