Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Ripsnort on January 30, 2003, 01:44:49 PM
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My house rules:
No Xbox
No Game cubes
No video games whatsoever.
Now, my oldest son (whos just turned 7) doesn't seem to mind it, he knows the rules..but then occasionally he'll come home from a friends house and whine "I wish I had a Xbox" but then drops it soon after since he knows there is no use argueing with me.
I believe that a child should have more to do than the brain-rotting repetitive actions that one does on a video game. Reading, going outdoors, riding bikes, etc. etc. is permissable, but Video games are definately out.
He has his computer, with many learning games (he's top in his 1st grade class for reading, writing, I might add) and a few simulators, but no "games" to speak of.
Any other "bad" parents out there?
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OK yeah, games like DOA extreme beach volley ball would be bad but not all arcade games or puter games are.
I am not saying let them have fee riegn, but whats wrong with an hour a day or so?
There one thing to think of too. You do not want your kids to far from the norm in school, it will get them picked on and that will do them more harm the an XBOX...
As long as they do go out and play and you spend as much time with them as you can, arcade games are not going to hurt them.
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Ripsnort. WTG!! Growing up I was only allowed 1 hour of cartoons on Saturday and THAT was on a Black and white tv. After my hour was up, that was it. The tv was turned off.
Jonny Quest was my favorite. I think I turned out ok
More parents should do what you are doing. Force their kids to get off their collective fannies, get outside and do stuff. Might solve a great number of the overweight problems we are seeing now. Read a book versus sit in front of the boob tube.
With that said, back to AH for more video games, beer and cheese. :D
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Its just that I feel guilty when we visit the neighbors, only to see that their children have all the latest and greatest hardware/software for video games. Their children are usually fat, and they're always playing video games! My kids are limited to TV too. When the TV goes off, the cardboard, paper, glue, scissors, color crayons, playdoe, board games, etc. come out.
I sometimes feel like I'm depriving them of some fun at home, but at the same time, I don't want to be hollaring at them to get off the damn video game either! Rock and a hard spot with me conscience I guess?
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Tough one here. Obviously "games" dont really add anything to the growth process than entertainment, but since when is entertainment bad?
If youre semi opposed to the idea of buying them a console - I say let them get an XBox if THEY can raise the funds for it (maybe buy them a game to "congratulate" thier ability to save money after purchase). This way, they learn to appreciate money and are able to talk about the latest and greatest video game with their friends at the lunch table in school.
Nothing really wrong with videogames in my book - just because people enjoy them doesnt mean that they are never going to go organize a game of roller hockey in the street.
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it does seem a little odd tho that someone like yourself who spends so much time playing a computer game will forbid his children to. I mean .... example and all that..
personally.... I admit to being a lousy parent... if it wasn't for their various mom's I doubt my kids woulda even survived.
lazs
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And yet Daddy flys AH. ..The key to this question is...Do you take your own advice/rules, do you read when you could be playing AH? I agree with you, but, to totally eliminate those things that your kids peers do is gonna come back to bite you later own. Moderation in most forms is not bad. Abitratary and capricious rulings do more harm than good. My advice..think about setting times and days they can play. Rewarding them for A's on report cards, doing chores etc. It might be a win win situation.
HC
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LOL
Im not going to say anything about "bad" or "good" parenting, I mean that is totally up to you my friend.
I have two sons, one aged 2 and one aged 6 months, and I cant wait for them to get older. Soon Im going to buy one of those racetracks so we can play with that one. Then an electric train. Then a RC car, then an X-Box...well you get the idea :)
You get to play with all those things yourself too Rip, and the kids will think you are the coolest dad on earth...think about it.
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Originally posted by lazs2
it does seem a little odd tho that someone like yourself who spends so much time playing a computer game will forbid his children to. I mean .... example and all that..
personally.... I admit to being a lousy parent... if it wasn't for their various mom's I doubt my kids woulda even survived.
lazs
Do you relize that my time online is under about 3 hours a week (exception: Christmas when I had 2 weeks off) and its usually after they're in bed....and I only have two sims on my hard drive, no games.
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Originally posted by Hortlund
LOL
Im not going to say anything about "bad" or "good" parenting, I mean that is totally up to you my friend.
I have two sons, one aged 2 and one aged 6 months, and I cant wait for them to get older. Soon Im going to buy one of those racetracks so we can play with that one. Then an electric train. Then a RC car, then an X-Box...well you get the idea :)
You get to play with all those things yourself too Rip, and the kids will think you are the coolest dad on earth...think about it.
Oh, we play with all the aforementioned except video games, which IMO is brain rot. You don't "learn" anything. My kids get software that are games for their computer, but they're learning games. (Thus, my son being #1 in his 1st grade class I suppose~!)
I'm just hung up on these video games...I see his friends, they're fat, they play games all day long. Not going to be my son...
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Originally posted by hardcase2
And yet Daddy flys AH. ..The key to this question is...Do you take your own advice/rules, do you read when you could be playing AH? I agree with you, but, to totally eliminate those things that your kids peers do is gonna come back to bite you later own. Moderation in most forms is not bad. Abitratary and capricious rulings do more harm than good. My advice..think about setting times and days they can play. Rewarding them for A's on report cards, doing chores etc. It might be a win win situation.
HC
When my kid reads, I read with them. When my kids study, I study with them or if they're familiar with the homework they're doing, then I always have work stuff I need to get caught up on..we all do our "work" at a set time around the dinner table after dinner. In essence, yes, I practice what I preach.
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Hmmm... my son is into all of that... He's 14... 5'7... lean and physically active as well.
Every now and then, he and his friends will get together and all four of them will gaze at the screen while they play. It's one of the ways they socialize and enjoy each other's company.
Moderation...
Now... if your kid is slow, fat and spends a lot of time in front of the console alone, you probably need to take steps.
I grew up in a more rural environment... we had an Atari 2600 in the house. We also had a thousand acres of orchards to roam in. I can't recall my parents ever limiting our console time. At the same time, most of my memories of my childhood with my brothers are of outside activities or alone inside reading.... My father didn't much care for my indoor reading habits. He always thought that I should be outside playing baseball, a game I thoroughly detest.
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Hope they don't see you playing on your adult video game (the computer) playing AH. A parent's got to walk the talk to have credibility and respect from their kids. It's when they play their video games and how long that could be bad or good. If your kids are usually good get them a video game machine (check out the games then buy the machine) but have certain iron clad rules like no playing if their homework isn't done (that homework better get good feedback from their teachers). No plying video games on school nights. Only 1 hour (choose your time limit and stick to it) or so at a time/per day.
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I wouldn't say your a bad parent Rip. Consoles have always been in our family (for the kids... even though I hate the damn things) but we don't let them sit around playing them all day. Personally... I figure with good parenting, a kids gonna turn out ok. I go against the grain of PC with raising my kids on allot of issues. I don't see how sheltering a child from anything (within reason... subjective of course) does them any good, especially when mom and dad go out of thier way to know what they are being exposed to and are ready to discuss it (and sometimes discuss it whether they want to or not). Everyone's different... I was sheltered (heavily) through about age 13 when I basicly told mom and pop to shove it in allota ways. I "think" I turned out ok. Gotta couple cousins who were in the same boat I was but never grew the nads to "rebell"... today as adults I consider them about a fruity as they come... ya just never know, so ya do your best now.... and thats your call.
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
No video games whatsoever.
Any other "bad" parents out there?
AH doesn't count as a video game? ;)
I'm with you on the console games though...no way. My kids will read books.
My sister has a little girl who is 9...avid reader and has no desire to have an X-Box or gameboy etc. Bright girl.
She has a brother and sister...twins, in fact. All they do is sit and play with gameboys. They are not so bright.:(
You are a good parent...not a bad one IMHO.
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Welp,..I always held to the "rule of moderation". As long things are done in a moderate manner, I see no harm in it.
Me being the computer nerd I am, I have always had several computers around the house. I use to get LAN games and play with the kids for an hour or two on Wed. nights.
No other time was allowed to play games on the computers and they always had to have all thier chores and schoolwork done.
The kids would look forward to those nights to maul Dad, and not have to worry about any retributions. It was just fun time.
Course, I was careful about the games chosen.
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well,,i dont think you should take away all games,,,i had a atari,,and nitendo growing up by the time i was 6 years old..im 28 now,,and all i do now is play aces high,,,and go out and ride moto dirt bikes ,,play football,,hike,,,go to the shootin range,,,,i dont think games affected me,,or turned me into a lazy bum,,,i dont think kids should be restricted from games,,just restricted from there time playing them,,and dont let them play adult games till there old anuff
what you will do ,,is turn him into a game addict,,he will go over to freinds house play there games,,,and wont be able to stop because he dont got any of his own,,i got a freind<~~good example,,,his parents didnt let him watch tv as a kid,,,,and when he comes over to my house,,,his eyes are glued on it ,,and you cant even get his attetion hardly with out hitting him on the head,,because its like a kid looking at somthing for his first time,lol,,,depriving him of the tv,,turned him into a tv zombie!!
i think you should give them games,,but just dont let them play them all day,,make them go out side and play
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They both enjoy AH.(THey have it on their computer in their room) and my oldest has an AH account he uses now and then... Its a flight sim. They ask questions, I explain to them history, my son even checked out a book for youngsters at the library for WW2 aircraft! They build models of WW2 aircraft, paint pictures of the aircraft, my oldest knows every WW2 fighter by silouette alone!...So, in essense, AH is pro-active for historical study...can't say the same for Frogger, now can you?
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Gezz..Rip..you get to play a Video game how many hours aweek?? Think thats fair to the little one? I know know that I could not do a single thing till I got my home work done.
That was the rule in my parents house..Homework then you can play.. and of course there is the 'required family time' I think I recall.. I got one or two hours on the old sega..lol then it was family time..
But then each parent has the right raise their own children up the way they want to.
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Originally posted by nuchpatrick
Gezz..Rip..you get to play a Video game how many hours aweek?? Think thats fair to the little one? I know know that I could not do a single thing till I got my home work done.
That was the rule in my parents house..Homework then you can play.. and of course there is the 'required family time' I think I recall.. I got one or two hours on the old sega..lol then it was family time..
But then each parent has the right raise their own children up the way they want to.
Read the whole thread.
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Rip, If my parents raised me that way...I actualy might be glad..
But maybe what you can do is say if you can make a fire or what not since he is only 7 then you can let him "Rent" a game system..or make him buy it himself...
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sims? games? You say tomato, I say tomatoe....:)
Rip, is this the same kid that shot me down in the H2H arena several times?
Do you have a time frame for when you think he'll be old enough for an X-Box, or is it forever banned (omg, hot button keyword) from your home? I know you're teaching him responsibility with fishing gear, firearms and chores around the house, and I know you love your boys and you're a good father, but with all due respect a little compromise on your rules might not be a bad thing...anyway it gives you a bit of leverage to ensure the chores and the homework are done. At seven he can't be expected to share your love of aviation any more than you could share his love of playing Tony Halk Pro Skateboarder on an X-Box.
Don't be as ridgid as your Dad was now ;)
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Originally posted by hyena426
well,,i dont think you should take away all games,,,i had a atari,,and nitendo growing up by the time i was 6 years old..im 28 now,,and all i do now is play aces high,,,and go out and ride moto dirt bikes ,,play football,,hike,,,go to the shootin range,,,,i dont think games affected me,,or turned me into a lazy bum,,,i dont think kids should be restricted from games,,just restricted from there time playing them,,and dont let them play adult games till there old anuff
what you will do ,,is turn him into a game addict,,he will go over to freinds house play there games,,,and wont be able to stop because he dont got any of his own,,i got a freind<~~good example,,,his parents didnt let him watch tv as a kid,,,,and when he comes over to my house,,,his eyes are glued on it ,,and you cant even get his attetion hardly with out hitting him on the head,,because its like a kid looking at somthing for his first time,lol,,,depriving him of the tv,,turned him into a tv zombie!!
i think you should give them games,,but just dont let them play them all day,,make them go out side and play
Well, with all due respect, my 7 yr. old has better punctuation when typing on the computer than you! LOL! ;)
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rip... hate to break it to you but I don't think your kids will quite see the distinction between your "sim" and a game.
hell man... you even went to a convention of the damn geeks... I have the pictures!
Still... I would be more worried that they might carpet their garage when they get their own home.
you should probly be horsewhipped but then... that's just my opinion...
lazs
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Originally posted by Airhead
sims? games? You say tomato, I say tomatoe....:)
Rip, is this the same kid that shot me down in the H2H arena several times?
Do you have a time frame for when you think he'll be old enough for an X-Box, or is it forever banned (omg, hot button keyword) from your home? I know you're teaching him responsibility with fishing gear, firearms and chores around the house, and I know you love your boys and you're a good father, but with all due respect a little compromise on your rules might not be a bad thing...anyway it gives you a bit of leverage to ensure the chores and the homework are done. At seven he can't be expected to share your love of aviation any more than you could share his love of playing Tony Halk Pro Skateboarder on an X-Box.
Don't be as ridgid as your Dad was now ;)
Very good input, I'm not sure...I'm sitting on the fence with this question...should I let him have one? I think not yet...but am pondering it...I want them to find enjoyment in other things first, then maybe..
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Originally posted by lazs2
rip... hate to break it to you but I don't think your kids will quite see the distinction between your "sim" and a game.
hell man... you even went to a convention of the damn geeks... I have the pictures!
Still... I would be more worried that they might carpet their garage when they get their own home.
you should probly be horsewhipped but then... that's just my opinion...
lazs
I suppose they don't see the distinction, but again, they're allowed "simulators"...tanks, boats, whatever, just no "role-playing" or fantasy games on their computer. You don't check out historical books in a library because you played "Frogger" or "Brain-rot-game-here" but you do when you fly aircraft!
LOL at the rest of the post.
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Originally posted by SaburoS
Hope they don't see you playing on your adult video game (the computer) playing AH. A parent's got to walk the talk to have credibility and respect from their kids. It's when they play their video games and how long that could be bad or good. If your kids are usually good get them a video game machine (check out the games then buy the machine) but have certain iron clad rules like no playing if their homework isn't done (that homework better get good feedback from their teachers). No plying video games on school nights. Only 1 hour (choose your time limit and stick to it) or so at a time/per day.
I agree except for one thing... IMO "Do as I say, not as I do" is perfectly acceptable in the parent/child relationship. IE: I have earned the right to walk my walk... this is a point I regularly make clear to my children.... this does not mean if my kid goes out mowing lawns for a summer and buys his own playstation, he gets to sit around the house for days on end playing games. He is the child, I am the parent... what I say goes, no argument. I've got one who turns 18 next month... rules are modified on his birthday to a great degree, however they will be followed or his path will lead out the front door. Everything is relative when it comes to raising kids.
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Airhead, yes, same one, but granted, he's played flight sims since age 3. A 4 year veteran he is ;)
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i dont type like that because i dont know how too type right,,i type like this because its my own style of crap to irritate people who are too stuck on typing:)
Well, with all due respect, my 7 yr. old has better punctuation when typing on the computer than you!
how can that be if you dont let them play on the computer in the first place? lol
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Originally posted by hyena426
i dont type like that because i dont know any better,,i type like this because its my own style of crap to irritate people who are too stuck on typing:) how can that be if you dont let them play on the computer in the first place?,,lol
No no, they have computer time! Just no Xbox or any of that crap. Was just digging on ya. ;)
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Well, I grew up in the age where consoles first came out. Atari, NeoGeo (sucked), Nintendo, etc...
I got 4 consoles in the course of my life, but one I sold to pay for the second one, in this order: Nintendo, Sega Gensis (sold it for..), Super Nintendo, and Nintendo 64.
My friends have the Xbox and PS2, but despite a few games here and there for the consoles... I have always used the PC more for games... and they were always flight games, with a few exceptions (Unreal, Half Life, Op Flashpoint, Doom, Doom2 and Return to Castle Wolfenstein).
The flight games I started playing when I was about 13- RB, AOE, AOTP. But they inspired me to read more about the wars to learn more. Any bookstore I went into, I always found myself in the WW1/WW2 section and would find a new book to buy and read. It also got me into doing science experiments (we had to them for grade school) with planes- finding out good airfoils that produced a lot of lift, least amount of drag, fuselages that are sleek and assist the wings in lift- stuff like that.
So basically, I think that there are some games that will inspire your kids to learn more (not necessarily fit in with what they are supposed to be learning in school, but atleast learn something)- specifically if they are created to be a factual rendition of the past or present, but then there are games that won't contribute to your childs education process except for troubleshooting obstacles, but can still be good entertainment...
But... the better games almost always come out on the PC first... and some come out for the PC soon after anyways (GTAIII came out pretty quickly, while Halo for the PC won't be out till this summer).
-SW
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Just bought my son a PS2... I have trouble limiting his TV time though, he's 24 and lives elsewhere.
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of course no, all the money goes towards daddy's computer so he can play AH. :)
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Originally posted by udet
of course no, all the money goes towards daddy's computer so he can play AH. :)
Trust me, money is not the issue here ;)
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ok,,,,well,,just making sure,,and im just saying,,i grew up with a kid that was deprived from tv alot,,and it really made him weird around tv's,,you cant get his attention,,like i said,,zombie!!,,its weird,,,but anything else he is doing,,lising to music,,going down the road,,,doing stuff outside you can get his attention,,but soon as he is infront of a tv,,he is consumed by it<~~long as you give your kids a little games its fine,,just dont let the games rule there lives
i beleve you have a point,,,i dont think kids should waste there lives on games,,,but i think kids need a little entertainment besides outdoor stuff,,a good well rounded family life,,so they dont have to feal left out when othere kids are talking about games
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Well, seems I should probably give in to the "Dark side" of video games on a console someday...with restrictions of course. It just has me worried..thats all.
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lol,,i know what ya mean,,there is a dark side,,just need to watch the games you get them is all,,and dont let them play all day and night
notice your in washington state to<~~lives in a tiny hick town about 30miles from richland
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Well, seems I should probably give in to the "Dark side" of video games on a console someday...with restrictions of course. It just has me worried..thats all.
Rip, the fact that you even give this thought means you CANT be a bad parent - 2 cents - Ill wipe the brown off later... but a "bad parent" would even be giving this a thought.
In any event, as previously mentioned, I really dont see any harm in it. I bought console games when I was younger - 2600, Nintendo, Genesis, N64, etc - but never bought PS/PS2/XBox because I had more interest in the "games" on the computer. I'd consider myself a "gamer" (probably buy one or two a month) and my childhood was just as normal as anyones. I grew up with 10 or so guys in my neighborhood all the same age and we would make up our own games to play outside because we bored of playing football and roller hockey everyday after school after 4 or 5 years... (try playing lacrosse on skates - thats tough) :D
My father tried to limit my game time for awhile, by allowing me to play only after homework was done, etc - and everything turned out fine - but as previously mentioned "banning" your kids from doing something every one of their peers does is not good for the child... you create a social problem at school because he isnt part of the "crowd."
Good luck.
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I hope he asks the next time you are glued to a brain rotting evening of flying Aces High.
Seriously, don't think an XBox/Video Console game is the end all of a kids life. If he's good, plug it in and let him play. They can easily be plugged in and out.
Yep, I think you're a meany...tell him the truth...Daddy can't afford a console since he blew all his money are a tacky imported car :D
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1st game you should buy is GTA 3..
Now THAT is family values.
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Thks for feed back all, good to read all of this.
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this reminds me of that poking smot commercial....
"if you love your kids.....something something....just talk to them."
as long as they know, as long as you know, good or bad, right from wrong, there's a reason parents do what they do. just lettem know why, that's about as simple a thing a kid wants to know. Don't tell them, 'cuz i said so' , tell them why. They're your kids, their gonna listen to ya.
if that don't work....you can always tellem to move out. (ps. dont forget to take picture of the 7yr olds face when doing this!)
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Originally posted by mason22
if that don't work....you can always tellem to move out. (ps. dont forget to take picture of the 7yr olds face when doing this!)
ROTFLOL!:p
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He has his own PC, then why to buy a lower machine like X-Box? Actually there are lots of games for X-Box already published for PC too, and running A LOT better and looking A LOT nicer in a good PC. In the other hand, Nintendo and Sony games are rarely ported to PC.
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Thks for feed back all, good to read all of this.
Good, now go buy a freaking console. I am partial to PS2.
Aside from four computers (getting ready to add a 5th), there is a Sega Genesis, 2 Nintendo 64s and a PS2 in my house. The consoles collect dust for the most part, and so do the computers, except mine :).
I have a 9yr old and a 3 yr old. My 9 yr old is involved in numerous afterschool activities, so she maybe gets on teh console 1hr a week. I have not imposed a time limit or some such, but I have no reason to do so. The 3yr old, likes Bob The Builder and Star Wars toys more than the console.
Keep your kids doing stuff and they will rarely touch the consoles, but to deny them the consoles out of sheer stubbornness is rather silly IMO. I grew up with a dad like you. He finally wised up and my little brother, now 12yrs old, has that stuff that I never did until I was on my own. My little bro is a damn smart kid, and plays baseball and basketball in the school teams. He rarely uses the console (according to mom), but in times it proves good entertainment.
Chao.
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It doesn't really matter what you do now rip. Eventually, your child will realise he'll also be bald by the time he's 21 and you'll have to start from scratch.
I guess, in the interum, denial of luxuries might help prepare him.
MiniD
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moderation
watch what you create as a "forbidden fruit"............
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Rip, as someone else said, moderation is the key. Since you already restrict the hours of tv they watch, simply make the time they spend playing a console the same as tv time since it has to be used with the tv. They can then choose and budget their time between conventional tv programming and console time.
In regards to the type of game you allow them to play I wonder why you don't allow RPGs? Personally, for a child I see real advantages to RPGs. They are puzzles that require a good deal of cognitive and reasoning skills to complete. Modern RPGs are also like graphic novels or comics...they have a plot and dialog that the player reads and hears. While I'm not into RPGs that much, my younger half brothers are and played Mario and Zelda-like games as youngsters. When I was home from college I would watch them play, and I could definitely see their problem solving skills improve during game play.
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Originally posted by crowMAW
When I was home from college I would watch them play, and I could definitely see their problem solving skills improve during game play.
Another good point.
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Rip,
I think you may be in a minor state of denial.
Average 3 hours a week?
How many posts do you have?
Aces High is not a game?
Isn't a console just a pretty computer?
Does it matter what screen you are sitting in front of?
Just food for thought. Good luck raisn the young uns. I hear it only gets harder!
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A good friend of mine is a psychiatrist who ran an adolescent program for many years. He truly believes that what is missing these days from kids lives is the eschatology (his word) of the sand lot. You went out there to play with your buds. You messed with somebody and they trashed you or maybe you trashed them. Then they came back with their buddies and trashed you worse, etc. The point being that you learned how to function in a group and that cause and effect works and can hurt. He pointed out that due to our fear of pervs we don't let our kids go outside and free play with their buds and their buds buds like we used to. Kids sit for hours watching increasingly realistic violence on TV and in video games that has no consequence. They can hack and maim and destroy all they want. Further, this solitary play erodes their ability to socialize and at the same time inures them to violence. I don't know beans but it makes sense to me.
I also read a book called The Sibling Society. The point the author made was that most societies revere their aged as a source of wisdom. When the poop hit the fan you went and asked the old folks if they had seen it happen before and learned from their mistakes. He made the point that we don't function that way anymore. The western mind sees life as being linear not a cycle. "Naaaaaah! That's histooooooory!" He further pointed out that somebody figured out awhile ago that you can sell anything to someone if you can appeal to them before the age of reason. So...think about the TV in your living room and how many shows have hip and cool kids and clueless adults. The TV tells your kid your an idiot and then pushes useless crap that they "have to have" in order to be cool during the commercials. He concluded by noting that recent generation look to their peers not their elders for feedback and suggested that TV may play a role.
Once again, I don't know beans but alot of this makes sense to me. I have 18 month old twin boys and it is fully my intention to do just what you have done Rip, so !
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Why did you visciously murder all those people seattle strangler?
"I did it because my daddy didnt buy me a PS2 when I was seven, oh daddy damn you, whyyyyy!"
:D
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Cousin got a Commodore 64 when he was about 9 or 10 years old. Now he is working for Nokia and can buy every frigging XBox he ever wants.
Playing Nintendo doesn't teach programming.
Anyway it looks like Rip is spending lots of time with his kids and IMHO that's what being the parent is.
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Ripsnort, I dont wanna tell you how to raise your children, but I believe you are making a mistake here.
Since you are not from the Nintendo generation you may not understand the appeal of video games. The lack of this hallmark activity may someday even harm your children in the future in a few ways. Dont deny them of technology that can potentially be good.
Just because your son is actually afraid to ask you for these video games, doesnt mean he is not itching to have one. For him it may be the Red Ryder BB Gun :-P
Though I dont have one now, I was raised with video game consoles. Some of the games were dumb (Mortal Kombat, etc) but since I wasnt a dumb kid, I simply went for the better games (Final Fantasy saga, Metroid, Zelda, etc)
You have absolutely no idea how much a well designed video game can stimulate the imagination of a child. Because of the choices a role playing game gives you freedom with, it can be more stimulating than a book or a movie.
Well designed video games can really help a childs hand-eye coordination too.
Everything in excess is bad of course, just like TV can be, even books!
And of course there are mature games that children should not have in the first place, but video game boxes have ratings just like movies.
In short, try to open your mind a bit, dont deny your children one of the great activities of the new generation. Let them have a console and a few good games. If you wanna know which games are actually good for them (there are some even better designed than Aces High) just ask around here.
And simply limit their video game time just like you limit TV time or play time. Watch them, sit and play with them. You have no idea how much fun I used to have playing sport games with my father on a rainy day. Its one of my fondest memories.
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Parents have to set limits. A “bad parent” would not pay attention to, or care about, what their kids do.
I know that there are many games out there that are too violent for kids. (Probably some games are too sexual as well, not sure since I’ve only played flight sims) It’s clearly harmful to let kids play the worst of games that are out there.
It would also be unwise to let your kids play even the best educational games 9 hours a day.
Some parents don’t need to be concerned about their kids and computers, their kids just don’t show enough interest. Most parents, however, need to make two decisions when it comes to this matter: what computer activities are appropriate, and how much time is reasonable, for MY child.
Most people really do not make the best parenting decisions. So if you want to be a great parent, the last thing that you need to do is poll the general population. If you think that you’re a better parent that the average Joe, then trust your gut.
If you are looking for a way to rationalize (or criticize) your decision by looking only at the reasoning behind other parents’ thoughts on the issue, then a thread like this can be of value. But, don’t give in to peer pressure or public opinion, just clarify your thinking. Your kids are way too important.
My thoughts;
Can kids have plenty of fun playing educational games? Sure.
Can kids also learn while playing educational games? Sure.
Should kids get everything they want? No.
Can you possibly give your kids everything they want? No.
Does playing video games promote childhood obesity? Probably.
Does playing video games promote violence? Probably.
Does playing video games promote poor social skills? Probably.
* Does playing video games promote poor eyesight ? Probably.
Does playing video games promote laziness? Probably.
Will kids who don’t get to play video game turn out any worse than kids who do? Probably not.
* I just attended a seminar on recognizing various eyesight problems in children/students. It was presented by an ophthalmologist with 20 years of experience. She said that children of the Gameboy/computer generation have been developing nearsightedness at younger and younger ages. Most often the kids that need glasses at age 5, 4, and even 3 spend a heck of a lot of time playing video games. Again, this is an issue of moderation. She recommends no more than 30 minutes a day of “tube time”(any kind) for little ones.
Trust your instincts Ripsnort.
eskimo
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Somebody’s daddy didn’t teach humility very well.
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Originally posted by Creamo
Somebody’s daddy didn’t teach humility very well.
Hows this for irony?
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I have not read this whole thread so I do not know the consensus. I do own a Gamecube and many games and our kids are allowed to play most of them. (They aren't even allowed to be in the room when I play Medal Of Honor though, and they can't touch my Madden 2003.) For our kids, it doesn't have to be 24/7 learning about something, they are allowed to be kids and play just for play's sake...within reason. It does not and cannot consist of a majority of their time. It really does not rot your brain and it does teach you problem solving (whether it's how to enter a secret room or how you can find a way to pass the faster car on the track) and is great for hand-eye coordination and is just simply fun. There is nothing wrong with a smiling happy kid. It can help keep your kids off the street and at home where you know what is going on, as opposed to escaping the home because the kids aren't allowed to have fun there. I don't see the big deal here. Cartoons didn't rot my brain nor did Mattell's hand-held football and I don't think Xbox will either. School work gets done, Gamecube is available for the kids and they are involved in sports such as soccer and I'm sure others in the future as they get older.
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Originally posted by Saurdaukar
Hows this for irony?
LOL! That's a great one Saur... not laughing at you... laughing with you.
Creamo is a insert explitive here.
MiniD
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Actually there are lots of games for X-Box already published for PC too, and running A LOT better and looking A LOT nicer in a good PC. In the other hand, Nintendo and Sony games are rarely ported to PC.
Ohh, but Madden 2003 just doesn't look the same on a computer as it does with component hook-ups on my big screen HDTV! And Gamecube allows for four-player play and computers aren't very good for that. The consoles do have their benefits.
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
My house rules:
He has his computer, with many learning games (he's top in his 1st grade class for reading, writing, I might add) and a few simulators, but no "games" to speak of.
Any other "bad" parents out there?
A bad father? No. A tad hypocritical? Yes.
It's the old 'Do as I say and not as I do' line we've all heard from our parents at one time or another.
You mentioned that your son plays AH once in awhile, hate to tell you but there is really no difference between being fragged by a someone with a BFG in Quake then being shot down by someone in a P-51 in AH. A game by any other name is still a game.
Ack-Ack
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Originally posted by Tumor
I agree except for one thing... IMO "Do as I say, not as I do" is perfectly acceptable in the parent/child relationship. IE: I have earned the right to walk my walk... this is a point I regularly make clear to my children.... this does not mean if my kid goes out mowing lawns for a summer and buys his own playstation, he gets to sit around the house for days on end playing games. He is the child, I am the parent... what I say goes, no argument. I've got one who turns 18 next month... rules are modified on his birthday to a great degree, however they will be followed or his path will lead out the front door. Everything is relative when it comes to raising kids.
No disagreement here. My point is that if you tell your kids to do one thing, all the while you're doing another, respect is not earned that way. If you want your kids to walk your talk, it'll work out better if they see/hear their parents also walk the talk. Don't want your kids to swear? You shouldn't either.
Don't want your kids to do drugs? You shouldn't either.
Don't want your kids to play video games? You shouldn't either.
The best leadership is by example.
BTW please don't take my examples above as the way you are (I'd doubt it very much) as they're just for examples sake.
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I can tell you are a complete ignorant when it comes to video games.
Whatever, do what you want with your kids.
I'm glad I wasnt raised by people like you.
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Father of 9,8 and 6-yr old boys here
I think playing AH and saying "no video games" is hypocrisy. I think your intentions are good. I am on the "everything in moderation" side. These things can get right out of hand. I sometimes go on "computer fasts" where I don't even log on for my email for two weeks, just to remind myself of what else I can do besides computers.
My kids have their computer time rationed, and I have to approve of whatever they are doing. In violent games we sit down and talk about what the violence means in the context. They understand what is on the screen is not real life, so we focus on the logistics, problem solving, and social skills facets of these games (many online games are co-operative)
On the whole, though, "no video games" may be a good policy, just hard to justify if you play AH
Good luck with whatever you decide !
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4 kids here, 24 to 14.
I am certainly not an expert, but I have made enough mistakes to know what works and what doesn't.
It isn't the rules you make, its the fact that you make rules. Your kids will remember the interactions they had with you a lot more than the substance of the rules you lay down.
The opposite of love is not hate, it is indifference. As long as you care and pay attention things will probably work out well.
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Originally posted by Animal
I can tell you are a complete ignorant when it comes to video games.
Whatever, do what you want with your kids.
I'm glad I wasnt raised by people like you.
Animal wasn't beaten enough as a child.
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Originally posted by Airhead
Animal wasn't beaten enough as a child.
I have also found that a Gameboy upside the head works wonders.
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Rip, I think you are doing very good (manual activity, participation, WTG), but I guess you can relax a bit the rule, as a lot of posters said, you can permit the Devil to enter your house but with a firm time limit and an "approval veto" by you on the game.
Dont let them play too much and with wrong games, chose always games that force the use of the brain, or that simulate the physics of the real world (aka the sims).
About the RPG games, I dont understand why you oppose, there's a lot of good stuff around, with a complex interaction and a deep "parallel reality".
Just for a try, give a look to "Morrowind", I am exploring it now, and make my jaw fall everytime I realize the number of quests, the good complexity of the social structure, and the cure in creating the world. (Every house have his own objects distribution and a large variety of structures).
Moderation it's the key.
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No children here and so I wouldn't presume to tell you how you are doing with yours. But good luck.
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Originally posted by Kanth
No children here and so I wouldn't presume to tell you how you are doing with yours. But good luck.
Wasn't asking what I should do...was asking if there are other parents that felt the same way I do about the game counsels. But good luck! ;)
Animal, I'm very glad I didn't have to raise you as well! :)
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Moderation. Worked for me - had a console, the basic rules were that I got all my work done and that it wasn't a sunny day outside.
I know people who *are* addicted though. However I think it's crummy to say your neighbor's kids are fat because they play video games.
Also, if you did get your kid an xbox or ps2, and limited him to a couple hours a week on it, would you also restrict the 40 hours of posting on fan message boards too? :p
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Originally posted by moose
Also, if you did get your kid an xbox or ps2, and limited him to a couple hours a week on it, would you also restrict the 40 hours of posting on fan message boards too? :p
Just because your brain doesn't allow you to multi-task while at work doesn't mean others cannot.
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Oh, I thot this thread had to do with whether or not the parent who denies their children 'console' games is a good or bad parent.
my blunder.
good luck with your list. :)
Originally posted by Ripsnort
Wasn't asking what I should do...was asking if there are other parents that felt the same way I do about the game counsels. But good luck! ;)
Animal, I'm very glad I didn't have to raise you as well! :)
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Just because your brain doesn't allow you to multi-task while at work doesn't mean others cannot.
lol, oh man...Saurdtard can't help but clue in now...
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Creamo, OTOH, was beaten way too often as a child. ;)
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Of course not. Why would a parent beat their children?
Never had that, never came close. I was too afraid of diddlying up or more so, the ultimate fear of disappointing my parents.
Course back then, playing Candyland or the other “Fantasy” games weren’t on the Drippy syllabus taboo list. When I first played electronic "Games" Pong, I stayed at my friends house and refused to leave.
I know, I know, it wasn't the Nazi eradication aerial combat history lesson game of choice, but fukin aye we loved it. Then Atari came out.
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Creamo is proof that *some discipline* should be used when raising children! :eek: Bet your parents are proud of you today, eh Creamo? ;)
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Alright, its about time you all know the truth.
I am Creamo's father, and you better believe that I am damn proud of him.
His mother is a frigid, lifeless lay, however.
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Am I a Bad Parent?
Yes.
Discussing parenting prowess in denying your children the entertainment of video games on a video game bbs surely makes you a bad parent.
If you feel you need some sort of affirmation from a bunch of pretend pilot freaks, then yeah you are probably doing them harm.
...and I thought Gordo was Creamo's mom.
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I have decided to have my son drive up and beat the stuffing out of rip...
lazs
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Bet your parents are proud of you today, eh Creamo?
Sure they are. Why shouldn't they be?
Gordo? Lance?
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Yes, my son?
Children's brains are more at danger of rotting while in church than than while playing video games.
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Originally posted by lazs2
I have decided to have my son drive up and beat the stuffing out of rip...
lazs
After you two beat up a MLB Firstbase Coach? ;)
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First of all I have no kids so take what I'm saying with a grain of salt...
Several of my best friends growing up had to come to my house to play any of the latest cool games, I didn't have them all but I did have a good selection.
All my other friends’ parents were very strict with them about playing games and TV. My parents didn't bother me too much about games but they sure didn't play them with me. Being an only child games were a way for me to be creative once I went beyond Lego’s. My parents bought me my first computer (Commodore 64) I still credit may parents to this day for peaking my interest in computers and now I make a decent living designing/building networks (Network Engineer).
When I was 12 I told my mom "who knows I might make money building/designing/playing games someday". Mom and I often joke about me telling her that. I’m still hoping someday I can develop/produce a computer game and possibly even make a living at it.
I do not think games have hurt me in anyway, I feel I wouldn't be the same person I am today if it wasn't for the time I spent playing games in my youth.
I still play 20 hours a week.
Games have definitely become more violent these days and I think parents need to know what their kids are playing.
I personally believe TV is much more harmful for kids than computer/console games.
If I ever become a parent my kid(s) will be allowed to play games, supervised, and I will play them with them. A good friend of mine has a wife and 3 boys and they ALL play online games together.
Just for the record I was not a “nerd” growing up (my wife might argue this now) I played for the State, Region, High School, Club and even a few years on the US National tour team (soccer). I’ve played soccer in many countries.
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Rip,
Playing AH and denying your children access to video games is not hypocrisy. Not only are they distractive but addictive.
Have you ever seen children so addicted by video games that they were oblivious to all else? Of course you have. Have you seen children that were so enthralled by their nintendos or play stations that they refused to share them with friends or siblings? Dang tootin' you have. Is there something unhealthy about a child sitting in front of a computer for 8 or 9 hours a day? You'd better believe it.
I've run into these same situations with my own sons. Both are now in college, and have outgrown some of these habits. Yet the addiction remains. There are times when the computer "calls" to them. Both are capable of scoring 3.5 or better in nearly every course they take, but the time they have wasted playing games, alone or with their friends, keeps them hovering around the 3.0 level. That doesn't seem like much to them, but when it comes time to apply for a high-paying job, it makes for a less than impressive transcript to add to their resume.
You can't ban a child permanently from contact with these games, but you are right to limit their exposure to them. They need to get out of the house, play football or baseball or tag or cowboys and Native Americans or hunt or fish or make trips to the library. I have seen too many kids who have only one or two interests or hobbies in life because of their fascination with the one-eyed monster.
Regards, Shuckins
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Rip, I'm right there with you on the fence.
On one hand, i think it is a HUGE problem that entertainment for kids today is video games and 'hot stuff'. And kids aren't really kids anymore - they're tiny immature adults. Being cool and wearing the right clothes is as important to a 7-9 year old today as it was to a 13-14 year old when I was a teenager - and that is less than 15 years ago.
They're growing fat. More noticeably is an apparent contradiction - they want to be small adults, but on the other hand the instant fix of video games and poor parenting means that they crave Instant Gratification to an even larger degree than my generation did. And with career and persoanl life being the paramount concern (the hip way) for people/parents, the parents compensate with their lack of engagement by buying a plethora of things that can keep the kid occupied while the parents are out 'realizing themselves'.
I ran around playing war, climbing trees, building tree huts. Never cared about my clothes which frequently had grass and dirt on 'em. Always had a bruise or a cut somewhere. Lots of sport - tennis, soccer, badminton.
Today, it's Counter Strike and what was previously a teenage fixation on clothes and belonging to a particular group. Pre-teens talking about 'images'.
But that's development - every new generation of kids is the worst :). However, from a pure physical point of view, it ain't healthy to play computer games. From a mental POV, they aren't mature to deal with the race for clothes and popularity at that age - that should be triggered by puberty.
Rip, I personally do not believe you should outright ban it. Have a friend who doesn't even let her kids watch TV. Total bans are ok if you can expect 100% respect and understanding of your decision. If you can't, resentment will grow. Some of the stuff my parents (father in particular) did has left some deep patches of resentment in me. My personal experience has told me that too stern a father is just as bad as too lenient a one - if not worse.
I mean, I got problems with authority figures. At the same time I have this need to placate everyone - to meet everyones expectations. And in my mind what I have to live up to is much much more than what people really expect of me. And then there's a counter reaction on that. Not wanting to please anyone - growing hatred yadda yadda yadda.
What I'm saying; if you are too stern, your son will end up flying German planes, having a huge arse, and wearing pink g-strings with metal studs on the inside. And revealing far too personal things on a public BBS just because the possibility of similar consequences exist.
From what I've learned about you on this BBS, I gather you're a good, caring parent that'll brainwash your kid in a generally positive manner (brainwash is just a synonym for 'to raise' :D). (that's the 'be nice to people everyone must like you' side). On the other hand, your incessant unrealistic demands and your attempts to realize YOUR goals through your kid, essentially living through him are barbaric and you're a total amazinhunk who should be shot with the wide rounds side of a square watermelon. You can guess what side that is.
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Rips
Guess ya playin outside with him too, go fishing and all that old fashioned stuff little boys love. :)
Regards Blitz
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Animal, I'm very glad I didn't have to raise you as well! :) [/B]
Thats ok.
It was a task that required parents of a higher level of intellect, in order for me as a child to not feel superior to my caretakers and growing bitter, turning into a Goth or something similar.
Thats why the higher power did not choose you ;)
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Rip, the answer is easy.
NEVER let them have an XBox. Microsoft is eeeevil!! Also, it has less power then low end PCs these days.
If, let them have a GameCube.
What do they do besides playing with their learning software on PCs? If nothing else really, consider buying them glasses for that task, long hours of screen work are bad for the eyes.
What else do they do? Don't say "reading", there's not a big difference to playing those kind of games that are usually played just once (as books are usually read just once) e.g. adventures.
What else? Sports? Do they play instruments? Playing something they can create stuff with (e.g. Lego (oh wait, these days the pieces don't offer many options), but there's surely something else on the market, or model building, or whatever)?
OTOH, if you let them have AH accounts thats surely enough entertainment ;)
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I have seen too many kids who have only one or two interests or hobbies in life because of their fascination with the one-eyed monster. -shuckins
Uhm... say again??
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Read 'noodle' Puke :D
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See how dirty and perverted you guys are?! I was REFERRING to the computer screen!
In my neck of the woods what YOU were referring to was called the one-eyed pet.
Sakes! Is that all you big city boys THINK ABOUT? Ya'll need some serious counseling about your preeversions!
Concerned, Shuckins
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Originally posted by Animal
Thats ok.
It was a task that required parents of a higher level of intellect, in order for me as a child to not feel superior to my caretakers and growing bitter, turning into a Goth or something similar.
Thats why the higher power did not choose you ;)
Oh I agree! You certainly do lack common sense...I'll take a parent with common sense anyday over one with intellect. ;)
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Of course your a bad parent.
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Originally posted by davidpt40
Of course your a bad parent.
I'll do it for you, MT:
"Its YOU'RE, as in 'You are' "
:D
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Oh I agree! You certainly do lack common sense...I'll take a parent with common sense anyday over one with intellect. ;)
Your kids are not allowed to have or play video games BUT they sure can play Aces High because You like that one.
Sure, thats some great common sense Rip.
Aces High is as dumb, as violent, and as time consuming as most video games. And I hope you squelch Channel 1 for them, or it can get downright absurd.
You just dont have the common sense to choose the right games, so you ban consoles altogether.
Well, at least its better than letting them play Grand Theft Auto 3 all day without supervision.
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Actually, I think console games are more addicting, Animal. My son has a collection of WW2 books (written for youngsters) as a result of flight simulators...would they have that for, say, Frogger? ;) I'm sure that he could probably tell someone more about specifications of WW2 aircraft than you could. Come to think of it, I'm certain of it.
But if it makes you feel better at criticizing my parental habits, go for it dude! Sounds like you need alittle mental "lift" in your life. ;)
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Its not that I dont respect your methods and beliefs as a parent - your arguement about video games and kids is sensible, its just that its not consistent. The fact that you post it on a video game forum is ironic.
And there is no 'lift' in telling you that I see a glaring contradiction in your conviction, how can I get a lift from trying to put sense on someone who is so close minded.
You didnt make this post for discussion like one would tend to believe in this discussion board, thats out of the question. You either made it as some form of enlightenment for others, or for some way of reassuring yourself that you are doing the right thing.
Rip, sometimes "BECAUSE I SAY SO" will not be enough to your children, even though they shut their mouth for fear of reprisal - kids keep thinking about it, and trying to work out the logic behind it (thats why they can be so inquisitive)
I'm not saying that you should have a bunch of self serving, spoiled brats playing Mario and drinking coke all day while you try to explain to them like adults why you dont agree.
But sometimes "Because I say so" is a good way to raise followers, not leaders and invididuals.
Think about it.
Or, you can just believe that I'm attacking you.
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I'm sure that he could probably tell someone more about specifications of WW2 aircraft than you could. Come to think of it, I'm certain of it.
Maybe so, who cares about specifications for obsolete aircraft. Thats useless data.
I'm a pilot, and a student physicist, I could not only teach you how to fly in real life, but I could also teach you why the plane flies and all the underlying forces that make it that way.
One of the ways I learned all this was spawned by the curiosity for the physics engines in old space games and first person shooters.
Aces High is not the only game you can learn stuff from.
So there really is nothing that makes AH more aceptable than other games, other than you liking it.
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Well, this is coming from a 15 year old Gamer, Programmer, Modeler, Musician, Artist(sorta) and really interested in tech stuff :D
I've learned an incredible amount from games, like Age Of Empires, and Empire Earth, which have gotten me incredibly interested in medieval history!
And, skills such as programming, and game developing are very good to have, u can make a lotta money doing that stuff!
I love historic games, and making historically accurate games, games like AH, EE etc. (though aoe and ee have alotta un historically accurate things, they are better than most!).
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Tell him that if he can demonstrate an ollie over a curb - then you will buy him Tony Hawk :)
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When I was growing up "...Because I SAID SO!" was always a good enough answer for me. It was brief and to the point and EASILY understood.
What's more, that argument is still relevant today.
You da man Rip.
Regards, Shuckins
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It must suck to your son. He askes for a vid game console only to be whipped by daddys ME109 leather belt! LOL
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Ripsnort,
I'm totally with Animal on this one and I just don't get this thread. Console games and computer games are actually the exact same thing...both are interactive games written in code and displayed using pixels. The actual games can vary but in fact many games are ported to both systems. But to say one is more addicting than another is ludicrous...because of the size and shape of its CPU case?? As I write this my two kids are laughing and actually getting along while playing "Mario's House Party" on our Gamecube system (which is rare that they get along...wait, maybe these aren't my kids but aliens impersonating my children!) Now I personally think it's a really stupid game, but that's because it's written for a younger audience. On the other hand, I think Aces High is really for an adult audience, especially with the language and tone of conversation I see occuring on ALL channels and just by the very nature of the subject matter. I think you aren't seeing the forest for the trees or something here. But maybe that's not what you are trying to do. The biggest difference between console and computer is that a console can allow up to four-players at a time, which is a lot of fun and can do a lot to enhance a child's interactive and people's skills which are very valuable throughout life.
Though I only briefly met you at the con, you seem like a very respectible person and it's good to see you have your kids' best interest in your heart. Kids are kids and they need to be able to play and have a good time and smile and laugh too. It's tough being a kid and sometimes they just need a fun break.
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Rip, I swear, yah must have some inner need to get raped.
Bend over...
but don't expect a reach-around.
Somebody noted the important thing is to have rules and limits.
The fact that your kids will realize that there are two standards for acceptable behavior ain't gonna help your parental authority later on.
In your shoes I'd certainly have a proscribed list of games.. but I wouldn't exclude the system.
say.. did you drop your keys again?
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Didn't read the 'whole' thread but allowing the kids to play video games is ok in my book. I have well behaved kids. They get their chores and homework done before they can play PS2. They don't play at all on the nights they have Karate. They play outside with the neighborhood kids alot, basketball, football, etc...
As long as they get good grades and behave I don't have a problem with it. If they start not turning in homework, etc... the first thing to go is their game 'privleges'. They are 9 and 12 yrs old and are good kids. I play with them on PS2 sometimes myself and they love it.
Like Skuzzy said, moderation is the key.
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Just curious Rip,your 7 yr old not being able to play video games at home..What sorta things interest him?..Hobbies etc..Does he have the "Aeroplane" gene?:)
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"If you feel you need some sort of affirmation from a bunch of pretend pilot freaks, then yeah you are probably doing them harm"
man three days i tried to think of how to say that. nailed it you did
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Well.... as a parent and a BB lurker... I can truthfully say that it is best to just let the kids do whatever they like... pretty much "freerange childcare" .... That's allways best.. I let my kids do whatever they felt like doing but I did make one rule....
I told them that if they ever carpeted their garage I would hunt them down and kill them with my bare hands... That's all a caring parent can do for a child really..
lazs
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LOL :D