Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Hangtime on July 25, 2000, 06:00:00 PM
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Ok.. just to recap on a clean piece of paper.. (that other thread takes 10 min to upload now (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif))
I blew it. I got our plane counts wrong and RTB'd.. and the ponies were suckered into a unclean merge. After the fight started, the opposition chopped up the ponies. The rank and file LW pilots as a group did one hell of a job.. and they deserve a thumbs up for executing their briefed mission with out fuss and with great teamwork. They deserve a SALUTE fer a job well done; as do the allied pilots..
The leadership on both sides tho.. well; I'm sure you have all suffered enuff with the finger pointing and such; (I behaved as an obnoxious child; and was pretty much an insufferable bellybutton afterwards) suffice to say that IMHO the tactics that Hristo employed were not in keeping with the spirit and intent of the ROE, and he planed and executed a two section merge that allowed a rear group to enter the fight without ever performing a 'merge'. Further; due to the usual 'fog of war' one two many FW's got into the fight and the results at best would indicate a refly was in order.
We've all since agreed that the merge concept for large groups is flawed and that a new ROE is required to address it.. but that don't change what happened THEN.
A refly on the spot was refused by Hristo, despite willingness to do so from the rank and file on both sides with the pilots remaining in the arena.
What followed on the BBS was a series of very sharp exchanges; toes got tromped on; feelings were hurt; sensibilities offended. Fom my part; I have (and do now) offer my apologies to all.. except Hristo.
In fact; to Hristo I offered a challenge.. since I was in fact never in the fight; and I was the 11th pony.. one of two that turned back and landed to insure the Allies did not bring to the fight more than the agreed upon 10 planes. Incensed yet again by the continuious bragging and arrogance displayed by Hristo after the fact I posted in part this:
Hristo; I challenge YOU; mano y mano to refly this little match we just had.. just you and me. Nobody else. After all, pond scum; it's me you want; just as much as I want you. No wingies to hide behind. No rhetoric to involve others in. Nothin to prove here other than our lasting hatred and disgust. You were good enuff to lead 10 men to the last match. Now; lets just see you bring yer arrogant bellybutton right on over to ME.
Further, I demand satisfaction for trashing my associate Allied and LW pilots good names and reps with yer bullcrap boasts. Honor demands it. And, lest there be no mistake about hidden agendas.. I want yer head on the end of my spear; pronto. Plain enuff? Just you and me, soccer boy, yer a5 vs my pony. Lets see whatcha got in the cockpit to back up all that stinking superior drivel yer spouting. Lets see you engage my PLANE and not your KEYBOARD.
So.. to pick up a time honored phrase and polish it for reconsumption; Pick up the gauntlet; or get lost. You wanna demonstrate to these other honorable gentlemen (a cadre we no longer have rights to claim membership in) that you have your own set of balls; you'll pick up that gauntlet and meet me with that A5 without bullcrap sidesteps, dodges or delays.
Oh.. one other thing... did I mention yer lower than cat crap?
Hang
Now where I come from; if somebody slapped me in the chops with that challenge I'da been glad to get a chance at him with a baseball bat vs a freakin Tank. Not so with this guy.. his answer:
You were the first to have insulted me. Things did not go as you planned and you took it too hard. I bragged to tease you a bit. But when you called me pond scum etc. friendly part was over. And the hypocrisy ? Where are P 51 films ? What do they hide ? Accusing us of same things you too did ?
If Luftwaffe lost The Rumble, maybe I would take it so hard too. I don’t know. Much was at stake here. Personal pride and ego among the first for me. Yes, I admit it, after what I have said before the fight, I could not live with possible defeat.
However, my intention was not to cheat. And we did not cheat. 11th pilot was pure coincidence.
Now watch the moment when “Fight’s on” was announced. Zoom into the map. See how many 190s merged. See how many P 51s merged. And you still have the nerve to come here and call for RoE merge busting by LW side ? You hypocrite ! There are still 6 P 51s who haven’t merged whan “Fights on” was announced (not counting 2 RTBing) !! Just like 6 190s. Equal number !
If you have fairness and honesty, why haven’t you already posted film by some of P 51 pilots. Are you hiding something ?
Hang, you have clearly won the RoE fight on both fights. You seem to be winning the arguments on this board. But by no means you have won the walk the walk part. You have lost both times. Face it.
Another challenge ? Have many more challenges have you got there ? How many times do I have to pick that gauntlet, Hang ? Until mergediver wins ?
This little pond scum proved it already. In G-10. Next time 190 pilots beat the P 51 pilots. No, I won’t take the challenge now. I will do it when it suits me. Meanwhile, enjoy your defeat. Besides, I don’t fight ghosts .
And you call me big mouth ?
Over and out.
Ok.. so he won't fight. I'll draw my own conclusions from that.. but I'll also add a few more swift kicks for Hristo here, since here on the BBS is the only place this guys gonna make a stand.
So; the following for Hristo the Braggart:
Pony films are in the hands of the refs. Jigster has also made his available via email in the previous thread; and links to CJ's are in the previous thread. And yah know what.. there's nothin to hide.. and you know it. Another cheap bullcrap dodge Hristo.. your films were more than enuff to prove the point on your two section merge; it's intent, the revelation that you had an unauthorised interloper in your midst, and your refusal to eject him.
As far as "ROE fights go" there was no 'fight'.. and gettin you to actually DO something to move the discussions forward was akin to shoveling guano in a thunderstorm. Yah played obstructionist every step of the way.. and never lifted a finger to secure the arena; it's setup; the scheduling or assit in orgainising the event. In short.. you did not even want the fight you proposed. When faced with a fair fight; you stacked the deck.
Finally; I am no 'ghost' I ain't dead; you or your crew never saw me in that fight; I was on the ground. I ain't had my 'second' fight. I propose again; pond scum; lets see yer a5 vs my pony. Lets see you back up those boasts with your skill in the same damn venue; but with just you and me. Whatsamatta soccer boy; you scared of 'ghosts' that can fly?
And yah; you'll wind up throwin yer back out pickin up that gauntlet or prove yerself to be the gutless cat turd I think you are by refusing to; cause I'll smack yah with it as many times as it takes to get what I came for.. and that's you in my sights.
You want 'allied vs luftwaffe adversity'?? Well; how am I doin; soccer boy??
Hang
Note; apologies in ADVANCE this time to any who may be offended or just plain tired of this.. (excluding Hristo.. whom I intend to haunt) For the rest of you; I want 10% of the popcorn and beer concession to go to the Old Pilots home in Florida. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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LOL Hey Hang has the friggin cat come out of hiding yet (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
BigJim
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Yup.. Hairball has in fact just proudly dropped another turd with hristo's genetic code imprinted upon it. I can tell by the smell. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Hang
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I'll chuck in my 2 cents since I had nothing whatsoever to do with this rumble.
A formal duel like this implies that certain rules will pertain, and in the case of an aircombat duel the rules mostly apply to the merge. Without a clean merge it's not a duel, so the merge must be carefully controlled before 'fight on' is called.
Here are some ideas for future rumbles:
1) each side has one referee who will lead his side to the merge.
2) the 2 refs will be in RW contact, 1 on 1.
3) each side will form up on its ref and fly in V formation(s) BEHIND him, with each pilot staying within 1000 yards of the ref, and NO HIGHER than the ref.
4) the refs will fly on autopilot as much as possible to make it easier for the flights to follow.
5) the refs will lead their flights to the duelling sector from opposite headings, each flight beginning from at least 1 sector away.
6) when the refs see the dots of the other flights, they will turn on gun cam to record the merge.
7) refs lead their flights past each other until ALL planes have passed on both sides. Refs watch their own flights to make sure nobody jumps the gun.
8) when each ref agrees over RW that their own flight has maintained formation during the merge, stayed within 1000 yards of the ref, and stayed at the correct altitude, one ref will anounce FIGHT ON over channel 1. The refs can delay calling 'fight on' for as long as it takes to get jumpy players back in line, during which time the refs will continue leading their flights away from each other, still on opposite headings.
Afer 'fight on' is called it is a rumble and the refs have no roll (maybe they should alt-f4 at this point). The refs' films of the merge can be used later to determine if the merge was fair.
I don't think in a duel that either side should be able to split into completly separate groups, as that negates the merge, which negates the duel. I know it's a lot of steps, but it is really pretty easy, the tough part is waiting for the 'fight on' call right after the merge.
ra
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"KISS" Live it and breathe it cos its the best way forward.
All these proposals for ROE as long as your arm with "dont do this" and "Must do that" surely everybody by now has seen its a recipe for disaster.
It seems a long time ago now when i proposed the ladder applied the "KISS" rule for the very reason to cut out on the sort of havoc this Rumble has produced.
Personally i am not aware of any disputes on the ladder ? Guess i could have missed one tho.
I think the best way as already mentioned elsewhere is play it for real, either circle your base at set alt's until fight called on then anything including all combinations of flights and use of etc is allowed, or the start on runway when go is called option.
I would even allow refueling at 1 set base for each and i mean refueling on the pad not new aircraft. If anybody is willing to accept the need to refuel in short order then hey let him get low and slow (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I suppose there is always the possibility this scenario may be too real for some of you tho and may not be what your looking for.
But it would allow use of tactics and pilot skills to exploit your aircraft the way it was supposed to be flown.
For example who gives a rats bellybutton if your enemy climbs or flies faster ? Its up to you to develop tactics that should be able to overcome that. Do you send out wing pairs to hunt and harrass the enemy trying to split them apart for a big hit ? or do you just do the Big Wing thing and pulverise em, or are you really actually just looking for the same old FFA type game with an enforced ROE thats gonna get blown to (exscuse me Hang ) Cat Crap ? the choice is yours.
PS Hang, you do not actually have a lot to be proud of on this BBS over the last few days as you have readily admitted, but i sure do admire you for pulling YOURSELF outa the fight to even it up. That musta been a reet bustard of a choice to make.
And of course for having the balls to openly admit you were wrong and apologise to all those that needed it.
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Imagine how all the poor little kittys must feel, reading this. Lets bring it up a notch,OK.
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Hang,
When I get back in town and we are both online, I volunteer to take you up on the offer to fly A5s vs P51s and can GUARAN-FUGIN-TEE that it will be just for fun. Rude, Thunder and I did it in the TA one evening just for a change of pace and I can probably offer just as good a fite in an A5 as Hristo can.
And you can bet that if you shoot me down, there will be no hard feelings (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Im a little easier to get along with than Hristo is. My bet is that you wont ever get him in a willing 1 v 1 battle if he can help it. Doesnt have the honor for it. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
-Ding
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Hang..
I bust my nuttz laughin every time Hristo post that LW has the best pilots.
Fact is,everyone knows this is not true,or we would all be reading this BB in German (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Nuff said (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/cool.gif)
Dog out........
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Hey Hang, ya know I'm usually a comic in this Forum, and we have "met" in the air a few times, but I gotta tell ya this is gettin' outta hand, IT'S JUST A GAME, how can HONOR be in anyway slighted in a game?
This thread and the other like it is sorta like that CREAMO/RAM thingie, which I usually skip past every chance I get.
Come On guys Lighten up.
HRISTO, I don't know ya at all, never flown against ya or yakked at ya online, but I hope your willing to extend a hand to Hangtime and end this.
HANGTIME, I've read your posts, and yakked at ya online, I know your a fairly easy going guy, and I hope your willing to extend a hand to Hristo and put an end to this as well.
<S> to both of ya
Now for something completely different..... (http://pages.hotbot.com/games/davekirk/images/Logos.jpg)
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CyberPilots have bigger Joysticks
BANDITS ON MY SIX!!!! (http://members.xoom.com/_XMCM/rowgue/goose2.ra)
<< MILENKO >> (http://pages.hotbot.com/games/davekirk/milenko.html)
ACES HIGH ASSASSINS Website (http://www.cybrtyme.com/personal/hblair/mainpage.htm)
WB/AH ASSASSINS Website (http://members.xoom.com/rowgue/assassins.html)
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Originally posted by Dingy:
Hang,
When I get back in town and we are both online, I volunteer to take you up on the offer to fly A5s vs P51s and can GUARAN-FUGIN-TEE that it will be just for fun. Rude, Thunder and I did it in the TA one evening just for a change of pace and I can probably offer just as good a fite in an A5 as Hristo can.
And you can bet that if you shoot me down, there will be no hard feelings (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Im a little easier to get along with than Hristo is. My bet is that you wont ever get him in a willing 1 v 1 battle if he can help it. Doesnt have the honor for it. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
-Ding
You must be ghosting or sumptin cause I NEVER see ya (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Dweeb.
- Jig
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Nothing smells worse then cat crap. Well, maybe cat barf but thats streching it.
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Originally posted by Jigster:
You must be ghosting or sumptin cause I NEVER see ya (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Combination of things....
Work (I'm typing this in a hotel as we speak)
Needed an AH Break
Other Games (Deus Ex Rocked) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I'll be back soon (I hope) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
-Ding
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Dingy.. yer right; we will have a ball.. flyin this sim when it's 'fer fun' is an absolute blast.. and I'm here to assure one and all; that any time yah let any other spin into it; then it becomes a whole lot less fun. >>points at self as example<<
Wardog.. thats bound to become one of the best quotes ever engendered on this BBS Fact is, everyone knows 'LW is better' is not true, or we would all be reading this BB in German
ROFMAO! Good one. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Milenko.. some of the best fights I've had; I've had with you. And the Assasins are tuff customers inna fight, one and most especially all. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
As far as "how can honor be slighted in a game" goes.. Well; I see it like this:
There's times when yah fly fer the fun of the furball.. and times when you fly for the honor of yer squad or your teamates. Every time you choose between running and fighting fer yer squaddies burns a bit of honor into your soul. I hope. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) This; to me, is what makes this game diffrent from quakebirds. As an example; I know you to be; by your actions, an honorable pilot. And yer flying here.. not at quakebirds. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
For some sim pilots there may come a time when they decide to fly for vanity.. not honor. Vanity is a treacherous evil thing in a AH fighter pilot. Vanity precludes honor.. Vain pilots are honorable when convienient, and do what vanity demands; honor be damned.
Interestingly enuff; in most cases, flying with honor and flying for fun co-exist quite happily. The exception is when you feel your honor; or the honor of your mates has been tarnished, you are bound by that honor to correct that wrong; and to be in that fight can be not so fun.
The diffrence between a vain and honorable pilot is simple. The vain pilot is afraid to lose; thus afraid to fight. An honorable pilot is not afraid of losing; he's afraid of not puttin up a damn good fight.
Far and away the majority of souls I've met here fly with honor.. and some just for fun. They all have my friendship and respect. I love this sim. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
But, there are a few here who do not fly with honor.. or for fun. They fly for Vanity.. and to fly with or against them; you do so at your peril; for regardless of the outcome; the expericence will tarnish your fun or your honor.
Hang
[This message has been edited by Hangtime (edited 07-25-2000).]
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I don't think I've admitted my culpability in my role as a Ref in the last event... so I'll *kinda* do that now. The reason I won't jump into the toejam with both feet is because.... well... Refs have egos TOO dammit (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Now - as far as Mathman goes... he's out of the discussion. Like I said before, there was direct and *constant* communication between us, and he did exactly as I directed... and I salute him for that.
Mathman communicated to me that the LW were split into two groups. Problem. I knew this from the outset. On the other side though, Hangtime directed his flyers to roll staggered (ie... Jim roll.... ok now John roll... ok now Frank roll.... etc.)Again, a problem. It was brought up that this was for FPS reasons. I've witnessed plenty of launches and well.. I wont waste space by entertaining that idea.
HAD I joined the Luftwaffe and Allied private BBS where they discussed tactics, perhaps we coulda nipped this in the bud. But I chose to stay completely out of that to avoid any kind of conflict or claims of bias etc. My job was to watch and to make the call. Btw Hang, I also missed this "roll" order because I didn't join your *squad* channel where these orders were given... for exactly the same reasons stated above. I just witnessed the effect.
Now what we got on one side is two tightly formed, distinct groups, versus one one spread out trail. BOTH of them are equally merge blowing afaic. Picture 10 planes spread train-like single file, d300 apart. For all intents and purposes, it's the same thing.
Now here is why I told Mathman to go ahead and call "fight on" when he saw the main bodies of the two flights pass eachother.
I could not be there to witness the merge myself... I was in Hang's plane, and he pulled out of the fight. Culpable for that reason? Should I have called fight off 'till we could ensure both Refs were in the air? Yeah, it turns out that probably wouldn't have been a bad idea. But... just as easily I would have let it all happen just the same. Who knows.
Secondly, my mental picture was of a merge that was on one side split, and on another side daisy chained. I got the impression that there was not even the inclination to meet in the middle as one force. I thought the way the merge shaped up was *intended*... perhaps even expected strategy. Because of that 'fog', I probably shoulda called fight "off" before the merge. It just seemed so... so... planned... by both sides. Calling it off would almost open me up to accusations of exposing the two side's strategy to eachother. It clearly looked like there was strategy on both side's part. However, I should have kept to the letter of the ROE and called foul to *both* sides before the merge took place. My fault again.
Thirdly... I think everyone knows the huge task involved in getting everyone sorted, balanced, and rolling at the same time. Everyone did their level headed best to ensure a simple 10v10, but look how easily *that* simple notion got messed up. We finally launched at about 20 minutes after the hour. There was a snapshot tourney coming up in just 40 minutes now. I swear to God this innevitability was like a cloud that effected every desicion I made, from balancing the sides, to calling a halt to the registration (even though we probably could have gone with 13v13 or more).... right through to letting that merge happen as it did. This again was my fault. Had I fully internalized what was at stake for you guys, I would have not allowed that to be an issue... It turns out the stakes for this Rumble would make calling the Rumble off for another weekend justifiable.
In the end, I sincerely apologize for a pile of decisions that, end over end, stacked up to the chaos that ensued.
It's funny... I woulda thunk that by now I'd have outgrown it...but there it is... KISS rocks! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Nash.. absolutely no apology needed; for neither you or Math did a damn thing wrong. Fault rests with me.. If I had culled to 10 planes earlier; I woulda been in the lead A/C at the merge (and so would you) and I would have seen the two LW section merge and called for a go-around..
For some damn reason I cannot fathom I had the number '12' in my head as the number upped by the LW; with two crashed on takeoff. My squaddies informed me they had upped 10; and I queried on common to be sure.. you know the rest. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Oooops. fog of war again. Yer right.. the best ROE is the one thats simplest. So far; best one I've heard so far is uppin the planes and have them orbit their field at 15k till all are present and at alt; then barkin fights on.
Kinda hard to top that one fer simplicity. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Hey nash.. yah know; I occurs to me that not only did I miss one heluva fight.. and that by extension; so did you. Damn man.. sorry about that; too. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif) Hey! If turdboy gives me that fight he owes me; yah wanna be the GIB and keep me honest?
Hang
[This message has been edited by Hangtime (edited 07-25-2000).]
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Cheers (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
"Hey nash.. yah know; I occurs to me that not only did I miss one heluva fight.. but so did you. Damn man.. sorry about that; too. :/"
Ohh... There'll be more. Bank on it (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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The best pilots are always Luftwaffe.
P 51 pilots are just bigmouths. Somehow they never learn from lost fights, they always want more (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
Maybe we even duel sometimes, Hang. But right now I don't duel hypocrite scum like you. Have a nice day.
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Stoickov
JG54 "Grünherz"
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This thread and the other like it is sorta like that CREAMO/RAM thingie, which I usually skip past every chance I get.
Come On guys Lighten up.
HRISTO, I don't know ya at all, never flown against ya or yakked at ya online, but I hope your willing to extend a hand to Hangtime and end this.
HANGTIME, I've read your posts, and yakked at ya online, I know your a fairly easy going guy, and I hope your willing to extend a hand to Hristo and put an end to this as well.
yepp u BOTH are good pilots.
<S>
Maik
<JG54 Grünherz>
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OK children, settle down (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
FWIW I simply cannot understand Hangtime's consistent challenges to Hristo as a result of the rumble.
Hang, haven't you ALREADY duelled Hristo? Your P51 -v- his 109 I seem to recall. I also seem to recall Hristo beat you 3:2. So what are you trying to achieve in goading him into another duel?
And as for allegations of ROE breaking, well, I wasn't there. My only knowledge of what took place comes from the numerous threads on the topic posted after the rumble. But I gotta laugh when I see Hangtime complaining about ROE violations.
Hangtime, I watched your films of the duels against Hristo. 10k merge, wasn't it? Now I've only been flying AW, WB and AH for about 7 years, but in all that time I understood a 10k merge as being "you climb to 10k, maintain that alt until the merge".
But not you Hang .... you seemed to think that it was fine to climb to 15k, so long as you dived to 10k just prior to the merge.
That, my friend, is cheating - plain and simple. You deliberately broke a long-established rule of H2H fights in order to get an advantage you weren't entitled to. And you still lost 3:2 !
So why are you challenging Hristo this time around? Trying to make it a clean sweep and lose all 5 fights next time? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Now I've got my issues with Hristo as well - IMHO he should not have been quite so enthusiatic in his bragging after the event. It does nothing to bring us closer as a community when individual egos get in the way.
So, both of you, grow up or pack your bags. This is NOT the kind of example we want to be showing the new guys just joining AH. You both have a responsibility to this game, and to the community. Put that responsibility before your individual egos next time.
Here endeth the rant (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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C.O. Phoenix Squadron
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/phoenix
Aces High Training Corps
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If its any conselation Hang, Hristo wont duel me either (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Regards.
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AH : Maniac
WB : -nr-1-
(http://www.rsaf.org/osf/images/osf_inga.gif)
http://www.rsaf.org/osf/ (http://www.rsaf.org/osf/)
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Thanks Jekyll! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I was once under the impression that Hristo and Hang were adults. I guess ya both fooled me!!
Another funny part is that they drag a bunch of other muttonheads in with it. Time to grow up people. No wonder the youths of this world are crap. Look at the mentality they have to look up to.
I read these post to see how far stupidity will take them this time. Looks like they are going all the way!!
Grow up or I'll whip both of your butts in the arena! Won't that be embarrassing!
Try to have a nice day!! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
PS What is this mano on mano thing???? Either one of you are acting like men!
Please reword: Spoiled kido on spoiled kido!
[This message has been edited by Swager (edited 07-26-2000).]
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Whats the problem...
Why don't you guys just duel using the Ladder ROE's.
Best 3 of 5. Hang picks the plane on 2 fights, Hristo picks the plane on 2 fights, and you guys flip who picks the plane for the last fight.
To me this is the way to sort out the best *pilot*, not the best pilot in plane type as Hangs/Hristos last duel was.
Cobra
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Ya know, sometimes I'm just plain ashamed to admit that while the quality of flying in this sim is on the rise, Style seems ta be in rapaid decline.
Hangtime yer one of the best pony drivers I've ever seen, you want honor? fine, let me explain the concept of honor. Honor is thought and deed, a committment to preserving the image of one's name. Thus, honor would not waste time issuing a challenge that would not be accepted. Relent.
Hristo, You make me very ashamed of my German heritage, so let me explain something simple to you, Not all Germans were Hermann Goering, If you want to be an insufferable braggart, fine, by all means, but do it as you, not in the name of "Der Duestche Volk"
I am not impressed. To all, I have repeatedly stressed that as a "community"
we have come to a very difficult period. Do we continue to evolve into the flying Manson family? or do we start to develope and enforce some standards of conduct, before a standard is developed and enforced for us.
(note; to all who decry that ever happening, I suggest you check CNN)
What are we doing here? it's not the result of the "rumble" I'm talking about, it's the simple fact that you cannot go 10 minutes in this sim,or 3 posts on this board, without it turnig into some kind of Lord of the flies romp thru bad attitudes,language, and manners. If we are all in fact, grown ups, we should all be horrifyed by the behavior around here, yet for the most part, we say, "Oh that's just so and so, he's always like that." Well if he is, always like that, don't you think it high time he got told to grow up?
P.S. Most of the dialogue herein was not directed at specific individuals, where it was I have so indicated by use of their name,
which should be a simple enough direction to most adults, ergo, I accept any flames from the so named as my due, the rest of yas can comment on subject matter,but beyond that, would be really lame.
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pzvg- "5 years and I still can't shoot"
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pzvg is the first to post the real deal here. (OK, I havent read ALL the posts on this subject, so sorry if others have too.) On at least 3 occasions I have had a searing essay on maturity and dignity typed up, only to realize that it would probably fall on deaf ears, on both sides, so I deleted it each time. Thanks pzvg for stating it so succinctly. I will suffice to summarize. Hristo, national PRIDE is one thing, but national ARROGANCE is a discredit to the very thing you claim to be proud of. Truthfully, none of it applies to AH, which is simply a simulation, a game, a fantasy world. Whose pilots WERE the best in WW2 is so open for interpretation and analysis as to be totally pointless to argue. Whose pilots ARE the best in AH is just as open, though maybe more easily proven. But the only way to prove this would be to have ALL the LW pilots vs. ALL the Allied pilots in a huge slugfest all at once, and even this would only prove who had the best opportunities and to a certain degree who had the best luck, on that particular day. Even in real life, luck played a huge part in things.
Hang, your obsession with this issue, and with this opponent, is at the very least unhealthy, and definitely a bit ridiculous. Though your flying abilities are beyond question, you have dashed the respect I had for you as a fellow pilot with your continuous tantrum-like ranting posts. Whatever valid points you have are lost in your insistence on trash talking, name calling, and general "nyah-nyah-nyah" behavior over this issue. To BOTH of you I say it simply, in the crude, somewhat obnoxious terms that seem to be the order of the day;
Shut the Hell Up, Grow the Hell Up, and Fly Your Damn Planes.
Anything else is just intellectual masturbation. Please don't be a Pee-Wee Herman and do this in public.. keep it to yourselves. Hey, there is a novel idea. Spare the board all the infantile bickering, exchange email addresses, keep your B.S. to yourselves, and above all else JUST FLY!!! (Or if that isn't enough, fly in to a neutral airport, meet in the parking lot, and beat the crap outta each other, or see who can piss the farthest, or whatever it would take to satisfy your mutual need to be "Da Man". (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) )
This issue has degraded to an obvious public display of how impulsive and obnoxious two people can be. The fact that there is an audience to hear it only makes the participants more eager to rant and rave. Spare us all please.
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Skorpyon
~900th Bloody Jaguars~
"Feel the Sting......"
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<---- takes his pale and shovel"I'm leaving this sandbox" the sand is too gritty. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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Skorpyon! Cool! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Ouch!
Point taken.
Thanks Skorp; Swager and PZVG and the resta yah fer the well placed boot.
I'da been able to see it commin too; if my head wasn't so far up my ass.
Damn.
Hang
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just an observation...
have you noticed most of the real pilots fly Allied? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Originally posted by Wardog:
Hang..
I bust my nuttz laughin every time Hristo post that LW has the best pilots.
Fact is,everyone knows this is not true,or we would all be reading this BB in German (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Nuff said (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/cool.gif)
Dog out........
Heh! That's the only post I've seen yet funny enough to make me post in one of these threads!
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Fatty
Fat Drunk Bastards (http://fdb.50megs.com)
"Never before in the field of human conflict was so little owed to so few that weighed and drank so much."
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I think we've heard enough from the peanut gallery too.
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Thing that puzzles me is that my jokes are understood as serious statements. You really think I ment all things I said there ? Grow up yourself (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
However, my posts were serious after insults started going around.
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Stoickov
JG54 "Grünherz"
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Ever heard of a "German sense of humour"? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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I ain't touchin that one...
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Ever heard of a "German sense of humour"?
Err, as a matter of fact ..... no (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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C.O. Phoenix Squadron
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/phoenix
Aces High Training Corps
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Hristo, your initial comments may have been jokingly made, but your later ones were definitely serious, through your own admission. These were the comments I was addressing.. the childish, finger pointing, name calling, chest puffing, "I can piss farther than you" type comments that were made by both sides. If you were not mature enough to realize that, even when very clearly pointed out to you, then growing up is the least of your concerns. One thing I must comment on... one very loud party to this whole silliness has already (finally) realized how out of control it really was, and admitted his part without further pursuing the ridiculousness. Only one is left thinking he did nothing wrong. Who really needs to grow up? (A rhetorical question, for I am sure the answer is already obvious to all.) Oh, and Citabria... put the deep sea rig and tackle away... no more smelly fish to catch here. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Skorpyon
~900th Bloody Jaguars~
"Feel the Sting......"
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This is about a game....right?
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)