Aces High Bulletin Board

General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: 28sweep on February 03, 2003, 07:04:14 AM

Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: 28sweep on February 03, 2003, 07:04:14 AM: I work for a very, very large manufacturing/engineering company and my company has recently announced that the majority of software development work will now be contracted to India. We have been doing some of that for a while-but now we are shifting the MAJORITY of this work to India. As a result-we are in the process of laying-off a lot talented programmers. Russia is very similar in this respect. Low wages + a lot of talented people not working means that Oleg can have his pick of the best programmers and hire them at ¼ (or less) the wages HiTech must pay. In fact- I have heard you can often find Phd’s in Moscow driving cabs. If he decided to directly compete with HiTech- then I don’t see how HiTech could compete……….Somebody more familiar with this business can enlighten me???
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Animal on February 03, 2003, 07:08:36 AM: lol
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: ra on February 03, 2003, 07:25:58 AM: Remeber the Y2K hype where everyone thought there was going to be a huge shortage of IT professionals for the forseeable future? Now you can find good programmers working at Walmart. I feel sorry for kids who decided to major in Computer Science in the late 90's thinking they would have a safe carreer, only to find that 3rd world competition makes them nearly unemployable.

ra
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: UserName on February 03, 2003, 07:26:48 AM: (http://www.x-plane.org/users/vonmanstein/hehad.jpg)

That's what some Il-2 fanboi's will have you believe.

:D

Credit to some guy on the SimHQ forum.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Mini D on February 03, 2003, 07:52:45 AM: "If" Oleg Maddox wanted to do a mmp? "IF"?

An MMP version of Il-2 was just around the corner after the game's initial release. It was to be "no problem" and the server "had already been tested".

:rolleyes:

MiniD
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Hortlund on February 03, 2003, 08:47:28 AM: Well, the simple answer is "no one could really compete". While this might make all the fanbois here nervous, and distressed. You have to remember that HTC has what? 5-7 employees? With how many doing the programming?

Oleg has what? A staff of 30-something experienced programmers, he can hire twice that number if he wants. As someone said, the salaries in Russia are a joke, you can find people working for cabbage for crying out loud.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Tuomio on February 03, 2003, 09:05:17 AM: Let the most competent win, thats all i care.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Saurdaukar on February 03, 2003, 09:10:14 AM: Quote
Originally posted by Tuomio
Let the most competent win, thats all i care.

Obviously not an American. Why let the most qualified do the job when you can meet a quota?
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: AKIron on February 03, 2003, 09:14:28 AM: Competition is the American way.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: 28sweep on February 03, 2003, 11:17:27 AM: I think HiTech's should do either two things:

1) OutSource development of AHII to India. For the price of 2 new developers in the US he could have 20 working in India. Like for example-Microsoft;while they sleep in Seattle- hundreds of developers are working on a project in India. They pass-it off at the start of the Seattle work day and work is done on a project 24hrs/day.

2) Let the community get more involved with models etc..I think Oleg as struck a good balance by having everything submitted and checked before being incorporated into the game.

Anyway-I've noticed that Software business can be crule and unforgiving. Many companies have declared Programming to be a Commodity- to be outsourced to the lowest bidder.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Hristo on February 03, 2003, 01:22:59 PM: Quote
Originally posted by 28sweep
I think HiTech's should do either two things:

1) OutSource development of AHII to India.

No way ! This would make Indian planes in AH uber, while Pakistani iron would simply suck. No way, I tell you !
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: 28sweep on February 03, 2003, 01:25:49 PM: There are no Indian Planes..Just lots of Cows and Tigers that eat people.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: ra on February 03, 2003, 01:36:13 PM: Cows eat people in India? Perk em!
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Hortlund on February 03, 2003, 01:43:58 PM: Suddenly everything falls into place...

so..they are not really worshipping the cows...they are food for the cows, that explains so much.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Hristo on February 03, 2003, 01:47:29 PM: Hmm, I always thought cobras were responsible for most deaths in India.
Title: IL MMP
Post by: GtoRA2 on February 03, 2003, 01:50:34 PM: I played the boxed game... I give it 5 stars for looks and 1 for playability.

The patch you have to download does not work right.

It just didn't seem as good as AH, other then eye candy.

Not to mention the threads here about this oleg guy thinking the everything Russian was way better then everything from everywhere else...

I would try it but I doubt I would like it.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Hristo on February 03, 2003, 01:57:54 PM: GtoRA2, you hijacker !
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Pongo on February 03, 2003, 02:04:08 PM: Hristo...lol
The only corner that AH could compete would be in Game design. Since we are talking about game...That is a big advantage.
Not financing the game himself he would be limited in what the suits wanted him to build. HT and Pyro built the game they would want and that they deemed we would want.
Both these are huge advantages.
But if Oleg just wanted to swipe the AH game play and pay someone to watch the servers for him. It would be a hell of a game to beat if your customers have 2ghz class machines and all broad band to run it on.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: lazs2 on February 03, 2003, 02:20:55 PM: "Hmm, I always thought cobras were responsible for most deaths in India."

that's because they don't drive well there. It's not the cars fault.
lazs
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: 28sweep on February 03, 2003, 02:21:34 PM: Hey Animal..Go count your Coconuts and Shake you Bon-Bon..
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Saurdaukar on February 03, 2003, 02:43:42 PM: Quote
Originally posted by lazs2
"Hmm, I always thought cobras were responsible for most deaths in India."

that's because they don't drive well there. It's not the cars fault.
lazs

:D

Lazs - take the following test to determine whether or not youre a car nut.

1.)

Q: If someone states "My engine is missing."

Do you respond:

A.) What the hell are you talking about?

B.) Where did it go?

C.) Where did you lose it? Call the police.

D.) Did you check the reference mark sensors? How about the air/fuel ratio? It smells a bit rich to me.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Skuzzy on February 03, 2003, 03:26:52 PM: Quote
Originally posted by Saurdaukar
:D

Lazs - take the following test to determine whether or not youre a car nut.

1.)

Q: If someone states "My engine is missing."

Check Little Big Horn. :D
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Octavius on February 03, 2003, 03:37:10 PM: rofl! a hijack has been hijacked and hijacked again! this thread rules
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: john9001 on February 03, 2003, 04:13:33 PM: whats wrong with driving a cab ?
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Karnak on February 03, 2003, 05:36:53 PM: Kurt Tank went to India in 1955 and developed their fighter, the HF-24 Marut.
(http://cargolade.free.fr/hf24marut.jpg)

We can clearly see by this that Indian programmers would be biased in favor of Kurt Tank designed aircraft.;)
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: funkedup on February 03, 2003, 05:54:42 PM: So this whole thing is just a big LW conspiracy. Oleg = Kurt Tank?
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Angus on February 04, 2003, 04:37:32 AM: Well, the competition is already on, all countries could participate. Still, good old HTC are the best.
However it makes me wonder whether it would not be a good idea for HTC to use indian (or whateve, just cheap) contractors for jobs like art (planes, terrains etc) while keeping the development (flight model and other stuff that HTC do BEST) in their own hands.
After all, Olegs cheap lot does not beat AH, hehe.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: 28sweep on February 04, 2003, 06:54:49 AM: Most companys have declared programming to be a commodity. The real value is the underlying business process behind the code. So your right-out-source the labor intensive stuff like art, terrains, code etc.. The model data, customer -service etc. is the end of the business that matters and HT and the staff could control......Imagine a 100 Indian programmers at .25 cents / hour laboring away. We could have every plane that flew in WWII in a year.......
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Saurdaukar on February 04, 2003, 01:02:38 PM: Quote
Originally posted by Octavius
rofl! a hijack has been hijacked and hijacked again! this thread rules

Thank you, thank you. :D
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: LePaul on February 04, 2003, 03:11:38 PM: Maybe HiTech already has the some of the work done in India.

Or maybe I'm just trying to give him an out to blame that Indian fella the rap for the bad spelling :p
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: ra on February 04, 2003, 03:17:24 PM: Indians have to be good spellers just to get their last names right.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Saurdaukar on February 04, 2003, 03:31:46 PM: Quote
Originally posted by ra
Indians have to be good spellers just to get their last names right.

And we need a periodic table of the elements to read them.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Rude on February 04, 2003, 03:39:22 PM: If Oleg could pull it off, he would have pulled it off.

20 programmers at bargain prices doth not make good code.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: devious on February 04, 2003, 04:21:19 PM: You can`t just say, here we go I do the planning, you underpaid Indians (from India) do the work. There`s MUCH more to project coordination than just saying "program me something like this-and-that".

You really can`t decide who`ll produce the better product. My 2 cent are on HTC, b/c programming a MMOFS, or any game, is less a function of "dumb", ie, ordered programming than an ART. HTC are PRETTY good at that. Just watch the "quality" of M$ products, and you`ll know why Linus/x still buttshrecks them in all categories...
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: Mark Luper on February 04, 2003, 10:25:28 PM: You guys DO know that there is only one GAME programmer at HTC don't you? Not meaning to slight Ronnie in any way with that statement.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: funkedup on February 05, 2003, 01:04:00 AM: HT will outsource himself.
Title: If Oleg Maddox Wanted to Do a MMP-Could HiTech Compete (Not a Troll)?
Post by: 28sweep on February 05, 2003, 09:15:17 AM: I just read a very old interview w/ HiTech and read that. Amazing that one person does all of that.....